CORRECTIONS: The 'boosted sergeant' stratagem ALSO grants an extra wound (as well as +1 attack and +1 weapon skill). Quite a fun little option for 1CP! - The Tanhausers bones relic is much better than I said, it reduces the damage suffered TO ONE, not gives damage -1. Pretty spectacular as a boost to durability on something like a bike chaplain or a captain with 6W plus
Hes gonna make quite the pocket captain in crusade games. Using terminator honors battle trait and weapon enhance his sword and you have a 5w 6a sgt base.
Just one comment: At least in the other reviews, Tannhausers bones reduce every damage TO 1, not BY 1. Means if your character is hit by a knight with that D6 sword, he just takes 1 wound. Or shot by a dark lance or... Thats sounds like a very good relic to me.
It's comical how strong that can be. Just shove that on a primaris chaplain on bike, and suddenly you have a character that will always tank an entire round of combat from the Shard of the Nightbringer. Combine that with the Litany of Divine Protection, and now he's taking an average of *1-2 wounds from Ghazghkull Thraka.* If he's a Master of Sanctity and citing Oath of Glory, He'll easily kill Ghazzy before ghazzy kills him. That's just silly.
@@themos9751 except the nightbringer drain life ignores damage reduction abilities as well. if you check the core book FAQ they added a rare rules of ignoring wounds and rules that prevent models ignoring wounds. part of what it says is that "it loses a number of wounds equal to the Damage characteristic of that attack" which shows that the rule applies against damage reduction as well.
@@judjementine I just checked that to verify and I see nothing in that FAQ saying that it ignores -1 damage. -1 damage is applied to the characteristic before damage is applied, so the model is not ignoring or negating wounds (and therefore the rule can’t be ignored) and it is instead changing the characteristic of the nightbringer’s attack. The damage characteristic of the attack is changed to 1, and the model will take that much damage. The primaris chaplain on bike will survive 6 attacks from the nightbringer at 1 damage
Blade Guard Sargent, Champion of the feast for +1 attack, wound, and to hit. The relic sword that's S+3 AP -3 and D 3. With the AP -1 and -2 being treated as AP0. The True warlord of the Army.
That`s impossible since the Sword of Judgement can only be given to charackters I guess? Also you `d have to give the Icon of Heinmann to another member of the bladeguard since you can`t wear 2 Relics on one model. I think it works better with an Assaultintercessorseargent with a powerhammer so he gets an additional attack and still hits on 3+. When Grimaldus is in range 10 Assaultintercessors are better then the bladeguard I think
On one hand I'm happy to see that the powercreep seems to have slowed down, on the other having most of the BT specific units be "less competitive than the SM base stuff" is prerty lame. Also having the land raider crusader be mostly ignored is sad. Giving it the abillity to carry crusaders or sword breathren would have been smart.
gw doesn't do smart most of the time just look at the out of stock on the website there probably don't understand why things are selling like they are now.
@@cullenkerr6556 Yeah, but in the worst way possible. Being forced to max special weapons is just... so bad on every level. It totally remove ANY choice from the player and makes the dice rolling game a slog since now you have to deal with a bunch of different weapon profiles every time you attack.
As a salamander play im livid that they get more melta and flamer love than us. That relic is amazing, the blast flamers strat is a nice cheap alt to flamecraft on non gravis units, and they can put meltas on primaris tanks. I just feel so cheated
Salamanders have been getting fucked over for so long. First it was Blood Angels getting hand flamers and meltas exclusively, then this. Its such a shame
The Oath of Glory sounds nice actually. I'd love to see how it matches up with Mantra of Strength against different targets, with and without the Benediction of Fury.
This seems pretty strong, there are ways to make them exceptionally durable by mixing and matching upgrades, vows, relics. Plus they have the all important tools to get into melee, clear objectives and the durability to hold them. With the amount of customization in the book, and the amount of units available to SM, im sure some tasty interactions will come out of the woodwork very soon.
Black Templars aren't known for being durable. They're known for 1-man challenges, like Ser knights and traditional samurai. They completely missed the mark with this Codex.
@@WardenOfTerra I guess you dont need to make them tough if the fluff is important to you, but do agree its problematic when the buffs for lastability seem the most competitive on paper.
I’m really looking forward to taking Helbrecht into battle, though I can see possibilities with the marshal / castellan instead. I’m not sure how I feel about Grimaldus with the way the rules changed to him. With the 5+ invuln vow I am trying to think out how it would be fun to sneak a vehicle in the list and have something different. The sword brothers disappointed me a little bit. Was hoping they could all take the load outs instead of the mixed. I’ll still give them a shot.
@@sgtalgiz6432 I hope so as they are really cool, but a 5+ invun and 3+ save is not great compared to bladeguard :/ bladeguard has dmg 2 swords.. also core like swordbretheren
I do agree, like ya you don’t gain any cover…. But the downside is far more safe than having to charge the closest unengaged unit. There is no point in taking the other options than 5++
Plenty of reasons, but the main one, is that it is entirely dependent on your army composition. If your army is built around Vanguard Veterans, Bladeguard Veterans, and Assault Terminators (which is probably a bunch of very good units for BT, and the core of most BT armies), then you are giving up the ability to get cover, in exchange of nothing. Even if you add a couple redemptors, you need to value how much a 5++ to your dreads is worth compared to losing cover to your 1+ or 2+ save troops.
This looks like a codex with fluff out the max, but I don't see anything that makes them super meta breaking, which is... good? Basically waiting to see if blempars players are happy or not EDIT: oh wait the 5++ is for vehicles too nvm that's flippin' awesome
Good review, I much appreciate getting a heads up on how my boys are going to fair moving forward. As someone who ran firstborn black tide I'm sad to see my crusaders get a points increase and losing out on Frontline commander/ The Emperors will which really cuts down on the mobility of my infantry. The vows are a nice replacement for knights of sigismund that offer some flexibility for reasonable trade offs. The ++5 and mini Transhuman seems really useful, and might encourage me to take a LRC or some venerable dreadnaughts.
Well I'm sold. Been eyeing a second army and wanted to go SM. Edit: also heads up, I may be wrong but I think Paragon of Fury currently written doesn't have a cap on the +1S and they don't go away. Will probably get FAQ'd but currently if I'm correct you can keep charging and hulking out.
Even though it would definitely be more effective to gear up a sergeant with a MC weapon and Champion of the feast, I think it might be interesting to put the witchseeker bolts on an Eliminator Sergeant for maximum psyker deletion. But just... man, seeing Helbrecht really just shows off the disparity between codices at the start of 9th to codices now. Just comparing him to Commander Dante, who contends for best HQ in BA lists: What Dante has over Helbrecht-- Jump pack (12" move, fly, DFA) 1 command point if warlord (never worthwhile due to subpar WLT and dies a lot) -1 to hit (DMoS) What Helbrecht has over Dante-- larger aura (larger base) slightly cheaper (160pts vs 165pts) +2 wounds immensely better gun (relic combi-storm-melta vs a normal inferno pistol) significantly better melee (Helbrecht's fantastic sword vs what is essentially a relic blade) More useful warlord trait if warlord +1 strength buff to core as valuable as an extra 6" movement is, its just really hard to see what part of Helbrecht's datasheet justifies him being 5pts cheaper with all those advantages other than "he's the new shiny model we want people to buy"
Very nice relics. Relic bearer stuff on the other hand feels a bit like a miss, I just don't like that the buff it gives doesn't affect the whole squad. But nevertheless I wanna see these guys get into slugfests with Orks.
Frontline commander while nerfed it kinda respected the Fluff a little better. "Black Templars commanders usually lead trough example, being the first one to charge into the fray" So what i get is that the Frontline Commander needs to charge first so the rest of the troops get the bonus.
"Bombastic Delivery" for 2 CP is _literally_ the epitome of "if you say something with enough confidence people will believe it no matter how nuts it is"
So, um 40 T4 wounds, cannot wound on better than a 3+ with 4+ as a stratagem, 3+ armour save for most of the squad, 5++ invulnerable save, 5+++ FNP via a Chaplain, 5+ against mortals? With a Chapter Master nearby for re-rolls? What's next, Custodes come out with 3+ invulnerable saves?
Maybe - have to see how cheesy folks can make bricks of these. Off the top of my head the notion of a small core of 3 or 4 power fists and a Sergeant with a relic weapon of some kind and +1WS +1W +1A with that fight-last grenade is going to be pretty unfun to deal with. Blast is efficient but you're expecting the scouts to die anyway.
GW: it’s official lore that some BT crusades don’t approve of Primaris, and so don’t have them, and also official lore that some crusades haven’t even been contacted by Guilliman’s Torchbearers, so fully firstborn BT armies are not uncommon. Also GW: We only have an entry for a Primaris Emperor’s Champion in the new book, so no firstborns get the call from the Emperor anymore. Also there are no firstborn Sword Brethren anymore. If you use veteran squads as Sword Brethren, they don’t get the Vow-sworn Bladesmen rule.
I think the Secondary involving a Chaplain and flipping objectives is a trap, it actually seems outright trash. You really need to go Second for it to work at all, otherwise your opponent just takes you off it and you score zero. But in 5 obj missions it's not great whether you go first or second. Say you go second, opponent takes the middle T1 and you take it off them... but you score nothing because they didn't hold it at the start of the round. Now you hold it at the start of the round, so you can't score it next turn either. You have to literally let your opponent get a 15 primary to score 4VP on a Secondary, or you have to take their backfield Objective. Butnas soon as you do that you can't do the back again unless you let them retake it and hold it for a turn. If you go first you can take the middle T1, they take you off so now they hold it at the start of the round and you can score it... except they have a whole turn to take you back off it before you score it. Way too difficult for a Secondary that possibly maxes at 12, even if you didn't need to have a Chaplain on the objective.
Tanhausers Bones + 1Cp "For the Emperor's honor" sounds like a great combination to prevent Melee murder machines to delete your squads. Especially Vanguards Vet/ Bladeguards against "Fight Last" Drukhari characters
Not in the least a competitive player. But to me the most interesting thing out of the Vows and strategems is being able to use uphold the honor of the emperor to slap invuls on vehicles. Or use a landraider to drop in things that are immediately able to charge. Though incredibly expensive to do something like this so you have to hope it turns out.
@@charlesmartinez5869 No worries. I thought I'd missed something and got excited. It seems stupid that the Primaris Apothecary can't have any weapon upgrades.
The design of the Crusader squad datasheet feels a bit daft. Why create a frankenstein mess of a squad with 3 different statlines and wargear loadouts? I think Crusader squads should be a unique BT upgrade or special rule applied to standalone Neophyte or Intercessor squads, with the Sword Brethren acting as the Sergeant unit for both squad types.
I've got a really SICK idea of putting a shitload of assault terminators in a Landraider Crusader along with a Chaplain. I'd really like to use Grimaldus for this as his rules are OP for this use, but hes primarus and idk if the servitors need to fit in the tank...
Werid question but im new to the hobby, when you say "all black templar units" is that specfically any unit from this codex or can I run assault intercessors or bladeguard veterans and still get vows in a Black templars detachment?
It means units with the Black Templar keyword. Intercessors and all other vanilla space marine units have as a keyword, that you replace with your choice of chapter. Bottom line, you can run your bladeguard as black templars and they will get the benefits of being black templars (vows, relics etc) when in the black templar detachments.
Question, in the video it says the Sword Brethren are not led by anybody specific. But in the box it says you can build a Castilian. So does the Castilian lead the Sword Brethren or are they all considered the same?
i've heard a few people say talk about the suffer unlean vow in that way. I think rules as intended you are still allowed to charge the same target, Would a unit count as engaged until the fight phase actually begins and you do pile in? needs an FAQ really
Is that normal that there is no campaign content? No new intention, no new requisition, no campaign relic??? Every other space marines codex supplement have some isn't it?
I haven’t watch the full video yet. But does anyone know if the Neophytes and Initiates can only be played using black Templars or can they be used in other space marines armies?
Both crusader squads and sword bretheren are bad. Another GW super failure. Black Templars will be very strong, maybe one of the most competitive chapters but they won't be touching any of their new unique units. The rule team really needs a reshuffling of leadership. Also YET ANOTHER KIT WITH 1 OF EACH WEAPONS. At least you can run extra power swords...
Yeah... its a huge shame ngl, the the problem isnt that these units are really bad, but rather than some unit are stupidly op. A standard SM competitive list looks like a clownshow that has almost nothing to do with bringing some base marines.
When attacked you may choose to whom the attacks are allocated, note that once a model in a unit is damaged it must destroyed before other models may take damage. So you can use the servitors to tank a few powerful hits and keep grimaldus alive
To gothic to convert into custodes tho....so I won't be picking any up. Thanks for the vid! It's still nice to know all of this in case I ever have to destroy them! Mwahahah 😂
I think there has been a mistake on the weapon profiles for the crusader squad. On the datasheet it preassigned the autobolt rifles to the initiates as their base kit which can be replaced with an astartes chainsword/bolt pistol combo, so wouldn't that make them free?
Paragon of Fury's MW on charge is by model ? That might not be to bad Auspex, I can get alot of 25mm bases within 1" of a big Ol' 40mm. Even a decent count of 32mms. Are there any BT characters with bases larger than 40mm?
Extra note on Devout Push: it's low-key Fire and Fade now. With good positioning you can use it to move shooting units in and out of obscuring, and do impulsor shennanigans with something like Hellblasters to disembark after the Impulsor moves, shoot, and re-embark at the start of Fight Phase.
@@bennystetten7088 if you can it will be FAQed. they made sure not to let Armageddon have it in 8th and i doubt they'd want anyone to have it in 9th. especially space marine army, and doubly so for a melee focused one like black templars
Completely irrelevant but does anyone feel like miniature galleries are a lot smaller than older codeces? Am I just mad? I never get as stoked looking at them as I used to. Perhaps just excitable youth.
I've been reading old codexes and the old photo sections were way better. Lots of cool conversions and personal armies. Of course we have Insta etc to see great models now so I guess they save the space
If I'm using uphold the the honor of the emperor vow, are the wound rolls of 1-2 auto fails or can my opponent reroll still wound rolls of 1 (with plague weapons)?
It's once per phase, not once per battlr round. If there's a stratagem that can be used in different phases there's nothing stopping you from using it multiple times in the same turn.
+1S and +1A are the real benefits, re-roll charges is just a bonus. The +1S often takes a relic weapon past key break points e.g. going from S7 to S8 or S5 to S6 etc. It's usually only good when combo'd with something else like Teeth of Terra or Benediction of Fury.
One question… does this mean the first born Emperors Champion is no longer usable? Would be a shame as I have a themed first born army, and never feel comfortable using Primaris data sheets in place of first born models.
Multi Melta should've been option for Impulsor too. No reason not to (it fits pintle Ironhail mount), especially since Combat Patrol box pack both Impulsor and upgrade sprue. Very underwhelmed by big flamer costing 10 points. Always puzzled by freakish "box compliant" weapon options for SwordBros.
I'm actually quite annoyed by this for a number of reasons. Firstly why is a second founding subfaction getting a codex before all the primary faction books are out? Secondly they remove legion-sized squads from Thousand Sons and Death Guard but leave them for Black Templars? Yes part of the squad is weaker than the rest but 20 bodies is 20 bodies when it comes to manipulating movement, who is in range of what buffs, obsec, zoning off deep strike, blocking charges etc. Also, give my Salamanders their schtick back! It's most unfair that I cannot glue multimelta's to everything with tracks nor give my dudes Primaris combi-flamers.
Huh, has the firstborn emperor's champion gone into legends in that case? Also has the Castellan mini been confirmed as a firstborn or primaris based on the weapon options?
Sigismunds seal on vanguard vets seems really good. They're fast enough to comfortably get into combat with any enemy unit you choose and with storm shields they're durable enough to get there too
if one were to have a 10 man assault intercessor squad and combat squad them while having sigisumunds seal, would both units still be able to have reroll hits and wounds againt the selected enemy unit?
One group of 5 will have the rerolls and the other will not. You must choose when you combat squad them. This is the same as terminators squads with teleport homers, incursors with haywire mines, etc.
What do you think about Paragon of Fury Warlord Trait and +1 to Strength? Are the +1 cumulative? Because it does not say that this dies down after the fight or is otherwise ended. So the model would get +1 again on the already improved strength value.
Yeah there's no special connection between Black Templars and lightning claws... the fact that Shrike is the only Primaris Raven Guard model with lightning claws is silly. I assume the only reason BT have them is because the old Sword Brethren box has one model with them. Seems like Primaris Black Templars have become the faction with all the firstborn ranged and melee options now that characters can take combi-weapons too. It's a strange development.
Nice video! Im coming back to my really old space marine army and I decided to turn them into Black Templars. I got a question about their rules, I saw somewhere that Black Templars dont have Devastators, instead they get to put Heavy Weapons into standard Squads, is that how it works?
the last real black templars book came out years ago. i think they deserve some love after like 10 years or more. in that time all or most of the first founding chapters got many little books so i think it is fair.
??? The vanilla chapters are flavorless and boring. BT has always been like another blood angels or space wolves etc. just look at the past. BT always had these units… they just resculpted
CORRECTIONS: The 'boosted sergeant' stratagem ALSO grants an extra wound (as well as +1 attack and +1 weapon skill). Quite a fun little option for 1CP!
- The Tanhausers bones relic is much better than I said, it reduces the damage suffered TO ONE, not gives damage -1. Pretty spectacular as a boost to durability on something like a bike chaplain or a captain with 6W plus
Thats nice!
With the Relic sword for S+3 AP -3 and D 3, and the wargear that treats AP -1 and -2 as 0. Turns him into an absolute unit!
Hes gonna make quite the pocket captain in crusade games. Using terminator honors battle trait and weapon enhance his sword and you have a 5w 6a sgt base.
Does the Emperors Will have any restrictions on what unit it can be used for?
That is noice! For 1 CP
Just one comment: At least in the other reviews, Tannhausers bones reduce every damage TO 1, not BY 1. Means if your character is hit by a knight with that D6 sword, he just takes 1 wound. Or shot by a dark lance or...
Thats sounds like a very good relic to me.
Good catch, thanks for letting me know - I've updated th the correction comment above :) certainly seems like a really good defensive relic!
It's comical how strong that can be. Just shove that on a primaris chaplain on bike, and suddenly you have a character that will always tank an entire round of combat from the Shard of the Nightbringer. Combine that with the Litany of Divine Protection, and now he's taking an average of *1-2 wounds from Ghazghkull Thraka.*
If he's a Master of Sanctity and citing Oath of Glory, He'll easily kill Ghazzy before ghazzy kills him. That's just silly.
Dude uses a lascannon just to shave with
@@themos9751 except the nightbringer drain life ignores damage reduction abilities as well. if you check the core book FAQ they added a rare rules of ignoring wounds and rules that prevent models ignoring wounds. part of what it says is that "it loses a number of wounds equal to the Damage characteristic of that attack" which shows that the rule applies against damage reduction as well.
@@judjementine I just checked that to verify and I see nothing in that FAQ saying that it ignores -1 damage. -1 damage is applied to the characteristic before damage is applied, so the model is not ignoring or negating wounds (and therefore the rule can’t be ignored) and it is instead changing the characteristic of the nightbringer’s attack. The damage characteristic of the attack is changed to 1, and the model will take that much damage.
The primaris chaplain on bike will survive 6 attacks from the nightbringer at 1 damage
Blade Guard Sargent, Champion of the feast for +1 attack, wound, and to hit. The relic sword that's S+3 AP -3 and D 3. With the AP -1 and -2 being treated as AP0. The True warlord of the Army.
@Donkey that would probably be better but the Blade Guard are more fluffy.
That`s impossible since the Sword of Judgement can only be given to charackters I guess? Also you `d have to give the Icon of Heinmann to another member of the bladeguard since you can`t wear 2 Relics on one model. I think it works better with an Assaultintercessorseargent with a powerhammer so he gets an additional attack and still hits on 3+. When Grimaldus is in range 10 Assaultintercessors are better then the bladeguard I think
^^of course the Terminator is even better
@Donkey No not at all, thy are crusading knights in space, so models that look like actually knights would fit more than Terminators.
@@luxferre5546 There was a way to give sergeants relics.
On one hand I'm happy to see that the powercreep seems to have slowed down, on the other having most of the BT specific units be "less competitive than the SM base stuff" is prerty lame.
Also having the land raider crusader be mostly ignored is sad.
Giving it the abillity to carry crusaders or sword breathren would have been smart.
gw doesn't do smart most of the time just look at the out of stock on the website there probably don't understand why things are selling like they are now.
At least Nephilim made the Crusade squads more viable
@@cullenkerr6556 Yeah, but in the worst way possible. Being forced to max special weapons is just... so bad on every level.
It totally remove ANY choice from the player and makes the dice rolling game a slog since now you have to deal with a bunch of different weapon profiles every time you attack.
As a salamander play im livid that they get more melta and flamer love than us. That relic is amazing, the blast flamers strat is a nice cheap alt to flamecraft on non gravis units, and they can put meltas on primaris tanks. I just feel so cheated
Don't get me started on the pyreblasters
You guys should have backed up Grimaldus better on Armageddon ;)
Salamanders have been getting fucked over for so long. First it was Blood Angels getting hand flamers and meltas exclusively, then this. Its such a shame
@@brundy9300 as a BA player, it feels pretty great, ngl
Hopefully if we get a new supplement, we can have some new toys ourselves. One can only hope.
A Repulsor with 3+/5++ helps with its survivability issue. But I think it's still more efficient to take a Redemptor Dreadnought instead.
The Oath of Glory sounds nice actually. I'd love to see how it matches up with Mantra of Strength against different targets, with and without the Benediction of Fury.
I'm sure this codex is like christmas for BT players, glad you get full codex status now 👍🏻
This seems pretty strong, there are ways to make them exceptionally durable by mixing and matching upgrades, vows, relics. Plus they have the all important tools to get into melee, clear objectives and the durability to hold them. With the amount of customization in the book, and the amount of units available to SM, im sure some tasty interactions will come out of the woodwork very soon.
Black Templars aren't known for being durable. They're known for 1-man challenges, like Ser knights and traditional samurai. They completely missed the mark with this Codex.
@@WardenOfTerra I guess you dont need to make them tough if the fluff is important to you, but do agree its problematic when the buffs for lastability seem the most competitive on paper.
For KHORNE! err.. I mean FOR THE EMPEROR.
I find it funny that primaris sword brethren exist but actual firstborn sword brethren don’t exist minus the one in the crusader squad.
I’m really looking forward to taking Helbrecht into battle, though I can see possibilities with the marshal / castellan instead. I’m not sure how I feel about Grimaldus with the way the rules changed to him.
With the 5+ invuln vow I am trying to think out how it would be fun to sneak a vehicle in the list and have something different.
The sword brothers disappointed me a little bit. Was hoping they could all take the load outs instead of the mixed. I’ll still give them a shot.
Vanguard veteran - 2A.
F***** servitor - 2A
Neophyte - 2A.
Be a combatant of many battles, you still cant fight better than a servitor or rookie BT.
Sounds silly 😄
Rip sword brethren squad. GW really need to stop doing box load outs and just let us kit bash and have fun
I guess the sword brethren weapons aren't master crafted.. so inferior to bladeguard 2dmg swords eh?
They ignore the Vows malus and are "BASE" units. They are not dead units.
@@sgtalgiz6432 I hope so as they are really cool, but a 5+ invun and 3+ save is not great compared to bladeguard :/ bladeguard has dmg 2 swords.. also core like swordbretheren
why not just take a 5+ invuln on everything?
You look across the table and see no AP or lots of AP-1. At that point I might be tempted to buff my attack rather than tank my defense
@@timunderbakke8756 the advantage to picking after seeing your opponents army i guess.
I do agree, like ya you don’t gain any cover…. But the downside is far more safe than having to charge the closest unengaged unit. There is no point in taking the other options than 5++
Plenty of reasons, but the main one, is that it is entirely dependent on your army composition. If your army is built around Vanguard Veterans, Bladeguard Veterans, and Assault Terminators (which is probably a bunch of very good units for BT, and the core of most BT armies), then you are giving up the ability to get cover, in exchange of nothing.
Even if you add a couple redemptors, you need to value how much a 5++ to your dreads is worth compared to losing cover to your 1+ or 2+ save troops.
This looks like a codex with fluff out the max, but I don't see anything that makes them super meta breaking, which is... good? Basically waiting to see if blempars players are happy or not
EDIT: oh wait the 5++ is for vehicles too nvm that's flippin' awesome
I can say that we are very happy! Pretty solid looking book! 😁
Good review, I much appreciate getting a heads up on how my boys are going to fair moving forward. As someone who ran firstborn black tide I'm sad to see my crusaders get a points increase and losing out on Frontline commander/ The Emperors will which really cuts down on the mobility of my infantry. The vows are a nice replacement for knights of sigismund that offer some flexibility for reasonable trade offs. The ++5 and mini Transhuman seems really useful, and might encourage me to take a LRC or some venerable dreadnaughts.
Well I'm sold. Been eyeing a second army and wanted to go SM.
Edit: also heads up, I may be wrong but I think Paragon of Fury currently written doesn't have a cap on the +1S and they don't go away. Will probably get FAQ'd but currently if I'm correct you can keep charging and hulking out.
Even though it would definitely be more effective to gear up a sergeant with a MC weapon and Champion of the feast, I think it might be interesting to put the witchseeker bolts on an Eliminator Sergeant for maximum psyker deletion.
But just... man, seeing Helbrecht really just shows off the disparity between codices at the start of 9th to codices now. Just comparing him to Commander Dante, who contends for best HQ in BA lists:
What Dante has over Helbrecht--
Jump pack (12" move, fly, DFA)
1 command point if warlord (never worthwhile due to subpar WLT and dies a lot)
-1 to hit (DMoS)
What Helbrecht has over Dante--
larger aura (larger base)
slightly cheaper (160pts vs 165pts)
+2 wounds
immensely better gun (relic combi-storm-melta vs a normal inferno pistol)
significantly better melee (Helbrecht's fantastic sword vs what is essentially a relic blade)
More useful warlord trait if warlord
+1 strength buff to core
as valuable as an extra 6" movement is, its just really hard to see what part of Helbrecht's datasheet justifies him being 5pts cheaper with all those advantages other than "he's the new shiny model we want people to buy"
Very nice relics. Relic bearer stuff on the other hand feels a bit like a miss, I just don't like that the buff it gives doesn't affect the whole squad. But nevertheless I wanna see these guys get into slugfests with Orks.
Frontline commander while nerfed it kinda respected the Fluff a little better.
"Black Templars commanders usually lead trough example, being the first one to charge into the fray"
So what i get is that the Frontline Commander needs to charge first so the rest of the troops get the bonus.
"Bombastic Delivery" for 2 CP is _literally_ the epitome of "if you say something with enough confidence people will believe it no matter how nuts it is"
So, um
40 T4 wounds, cannot wound on better than a 3+ with 4+ as a stratagem, 3+ armour save for most of the squad, 5++ invulnerable save, 5+++ FNP via a Chaplain, 5+ against mortals? With a Chapter Master nearby for re-rolls?
What's next, Custodes come out with 3+ invulnerable saves?
Doesn't seem too crazy. It's a big unit that isn't that fast, gets smacked by blasts and needs support. Good but not a must take.
Maybe - have to see how cheesy folks can make bricks of these. Off the top of my head the notion of a small core of 3 or 4 power fists and a Sergeant with a relic weapon of some kind and +1WS +1W +1A with that fight-last grenade is going to be pretty unfun to deal with. Blast is efficient but you're expecting the scouts to die anyway.
GW: it’s official lore that some BT crusades don’t approve of Primaris, and so don’t have them, and also official lore that some crusades haven’t even been contacted by Guilliman’s Torchbearers, so fully firstborn BT armies are not uncommon.
Also GW: We only have an entry for a Primaris Emperor’s Champion in the new book, so no firstborns get the call from the Emperor anymore. Also there are no firstborn Sword Brethren anymore. If you use veteran squads as Sword Brethren, they don’t get the Vow-sworn Bladesmen rule.
Im happy for BT players...
But as a Son of Vulkan. I feel betrayed
Can the multi melta be given to a impulsor as well?
I think the Secondary involving a Chaplain and flipping objectives is a trap, it actually seems outright trash. You really need to go Second for it to work at all, otherwise your opponent just takes you off it and you score zero. But in 5 obj missions it's not great whether you go first or second. Say you go second, opponent takes the middle T1 and you take it off them... but you score nothing because they didn't hold it at the start of the round. Now you hold it at the start of the round, so you can't score it next turn either. You have to literally let your opponent get a 15 primary to score 4VP on a Secondary, or you have to take their backfield Objective. Butnas soon as you do that you can't do the back again unless you let them retake it and hold it for a turn. If you go first you can take the middle T1, they take you off so now they hold it at the start of the round and you can score it... except they have a whole turn to take you back off it before you score it. Way too difficult for a Secondary that possibly maxes at 12, even if you didn't need to have a Chaplain on the objective.
And of course Firstborn crusader squad gets nerfed into oblivion to not overshadow the new toys
Tanhausers Bones + 1Cp "For the Emperor's honor" sounds like a great combination to prevent Melee murder machines to delete your squads. Especially Vanguards Vet/ Bladeguards against "Fight Last" Drukhari characters
The options on the sword bretheren are a JOKE... why make you choose one of each... just make people buy more boxes or whatever...
Its also just a drag to have to have to deal with different weapon profile when comes time to roll.
@@Pers0n97 true, I think bladeguard will be much better, as these guys can’t fly and have no invuln. Welcome house cabinet/shelf👌🏻👌🏻
An al a carte Multimelta on a Gladiator Valiant? Nice!
5++ but no cover LOL that's hardly a negative when most things in the codex have a 3+
Not in the least a competitive player. But to me the most interesting thing out of the Vows and strategems is being able to use uphold the honor of the emperor to slap invuls on vehicles. Or use a landraider to drop in things that are immediately able to charge. Though incredibly expensive to do something like this so you have to hope it turns out.
The Teeth of Terra can also be taken by a Primarus Apothecary, which is pretty funny.
Doesn't the teeth of Terra replace a chainsword, which the primaris apothecary doesn't have?
@@ozymandias3540 You are correct. I conflated it with the old apothecary.
@@charlesmartinez5869 No worries. I thought I'd missed something and got excited. It seems stupid that the Primaris Apothecary can't have any weapon upgrades.
Just the channel I was waiting for this from ;)
Can you tell me more about black templars marshall. Cause i am very excited to see his characteristics!
As a salamander player, I am angry. not at the pyre blaster, but at the multi-melta not being on my gladiator tank. I want to run 6 melta shots!
The design of the Crusader squad datasheet feels a bit daft. Why create a frankenstein mess of a squad with 3 different statlines and wargear loadouts? I think Crusader squads should be a unique BT upgrade or special rule applied to standalone Neophyte or Intercessor squads, with the Sword Brethren acting as the Sergeant unit for both squad types.
Nothing new there, the Crusader squad has always been weird / messy to use with the mixed profiles.
I've got a really SICK idea of putting a shitload of assault terminators in a Landraider Crusader along with a Chaplain. I'd really like to use Grimaldus for this as his rules are OP for this use, but hes primarus and idk if the servitors need to fit in the tank...
Werid question but im new to the hobby, when you say "all black templar units" is that specfically any unit from this codex or can I run assault intercessors or bladeguard veterans and still get vows in a Black templars detachment?
It means units with the Black Templar keyword. Intercessors and all other vanilla space marine units have as a keyword, that you replace with your choice of chapter.
Bottom line, you can run your bladeguard as black templars and they will get the benefits of being black templars (vows, relics etc) when in the black templar detachments.
@@SgtDax awesome, thankyou so much!
Wait…
Can we stack mantra of strength with oaths of glory to make a monstertrous smash chaplain?
@Donkey oof
Question, in the video it says the Sword Brethren are not led by anybody specific. But in the box it says you can build a Castilian. So does the Castilian lead the Sword Brethren or are they all considered the same?
i've heard a few people say talk about the suffer unlean vow in that way. I think rules as intended you are still allowed to charge the same target, Would a unit count as engaged until the fight phase actually begins and you do pile in? needs an FAQ really
Definitely. Imagine having helbrecht charge in for frontline commander and everyone stays back
Is that normal that there is no campaign content? No new intention, no new requisition, no campaign relic??? Every other space marines codex supplement have some isn't it?
No Pity! No Remorse! No Fear!
For Dorn, Emperor and Sigismund brother!
I haven’t watch the full video yet. But does anyone know if the Neophytes and Initiates can only be played using black Templars or can they be used in other space marines armies?
Crusader squad is BT only yeah
Both crusader squads and sword bretheren are bad. Another GW super failure. Black Templars will be very strong, maybe one of the most competitive chapters but they won't be touching any of their new unique units. The rule team really needs a reshuffling of leadership. Also YET ANOTHER KIT WITH 1 OF EACH WEAPONS. At least you can run extra power swords...
Yeah... its a huge shame ngl, the the problem isnt that these units are really bad, but rather than some unit are stupidly op.
A standard SM competitive list looks like a clownshow that has almost nothing to do with bringing some base marines.
About Grimaldus, if you kill him the servitors go too, but you have to kill them first so how exactly would you kill Grimaldus without killing them?
Yeah this one confused me too
@@ShanePorterR0ot I assume it's to cover weird rules interactions but I'm really curious what that might look like.
When attacked you may choose to whom the attacks are allocated, note that once a model in a unit is damaged it must destroyed before other models may take damage. So you can use the servitors to tank a few powerful hits and keep grimaldus alive
I suppose it’s to cover the possibility that grimaldus blow himself up with his plasma pistol used overcharged.
Celestine has the same wording. And just like other suggested. Prob to block out any cheesy rules interactionq in advance
To gothic to convert into custodes tho....so I won't be picking any up. Thanks for the vid!
It's still nice to know all of this in case I ever have to destroy them! Mwahahah 😂
Correction...I ordered some heads lol 🤣 to use for Ventari...I think they will look good
I think there has been a mistake on the weapon profiles for the crusader squad. On the datasheet it preassigned the autobolt rifles to the initiates as their base kit which can be replaced with an astartes chainsword/bolt pistol combo, so wouldn't that make them free?
Paragon of Fury's MW on charge is by model ? That might not be to bad Auspex, I can get alot of 25mm bases within 1" of a big Ol' 40mm. Even a decent count of 32mms. Are there any BT characters with bases larger than 40mm?
if im not mistaken you get a castellan in your sword brothren unit so dose one need to buy this model or can you just use the one from that unit?
Extra note on Devout Push: it's low-key Fire and Fade now. With good positioning you can use it to move shooting units in and out of obscuring, and do impulsor shennanigans with something like Hellblasters to disembark after the Impulsor moves, shoot, and re-embark at the start of Fight Phase.
I don't think you can re embark a transport after disembarking
@@DanteFantarella you can do it with the New dovout push
@@bennystetten7088 if you can it will be FAQed. they made sure not to let Armageddon have it in 8th and i doubt they'd want anyone to have it in 9th. especially space marine army, and doubly so for a melee focused one like black templars
On a scale of turd T'au to pay-to-win-cuz-you-need-to-compensate-for-something AdMech, where does this supplement put the Black Templars?
Yay! Black Templars! My boys!
"Bombastick Delivery"
*[Slaanesh loved that]*
Completely irrelevant but does anyone feel like miniature galleries are a lot smaller than older codeces? Am I just mad? I never get as stoked looking at them as I used to. Perhaps just excitable youth.
I've been reading old codexes and the old photo sections were way better. Lots of cool conversions and personal armies.
Of course we have Insta etc to see great models now so I guess they save the space
If I'm using uphold the the honor of the emperor vow, are the wound rolls of 1-2 auto fails or can my opponent reroll still wound rolls of 1 (with plague weapons)?
JUST KEY ME STRAP MULTIMELTAS TO MY REPULSORS! PLZ!! cries in promethium discipline
Do Marshals/Castellans get the 'Sword Brethren' keyword?
Looks like that arent event a datasheet, just the standard hq with bonus wargear options.
No multi meltas on repulsor for normal space marines.
*sad salamanders noises*
my ironhands gladiator is sad also
If this level of resiliency is ok for Black Templars, I shudder to think what must be in the 9th ed Iron Hands Supplement.
Why do they get 20 man squads but chaos can't? Like wtf gw? they just decided to switch it up after 10000 years?
Is this codex different from the one in the army box. The one with the different cover art
Whats the rules on using more than one strategem a phase? That legal to do??? I havent played 9th yet as i was playing aos.
You can use as many stratagem as you want so long as you have the points. You can only use the same stratagem once per battle round.
It's once per phase, not once per battlr round. If there's a stratagem that can be used in different phases there's nothing stopping you from using it multiple times in the same turn.
What are the stats of the shotguns?
Not sure why you are so in to the Imperium's sword warlord trait when every BT model can already reroll charges. It's kind of a dud.
+1S and +1A are the real benefits, re-roll charges is just a bonus. The +1S often takes a relic weapon past key break points e.g. going from S7 to S8 or S5 to S6 etc. It's usually only good when combo'd with something else like Teeth of Terra or Benediction of Fury.
I like the idea of vows and passions. Too many things are straight buffs with zero drawbacks.
One question… does this mean the first born Emperors Champion is no longer usable? Would be a shame as I have a themed first born army, and never feel comfortable using Primaris data sheets in place of first born models.
So because the multi melta replaces the ironhail, you end up paying a net 25 like a land raider? 5 for the stubber and 20 to replace said stubber?
Are the neophyte models any bigger than the old scout ones? (They'll look silly if not!)
Did you get a free review copy of the codex?
Pyroblaster at 10pts..... Its gotta cost more than a flamer would, right?
Multi Melta should've been option for Impulsor too. No reason not to (it fits pintle Ironhail mount), especially since Combat Patrol box pack both Impulsor and upgrade sprue.
Very underwhelmed by big flamer costing 10 points. Always puzzled by freakish "box compliant" weapon options for SwordBros.
Some other places say the Impulsor can take the Multimelta?
I'm actually quite annoyed by this for a number of reasons. Firstly why is a second founding subfaction getting a codex before all the primary faction books are out? Secondly they remove legion-sized squads from Thousand Sons and Death Guard but leave them for Black Templars? Yes part of the squad is weaker than the rest but 20 bodies is 20 bodies when it comes to manipulating movement, who is in range of what buffs, obsec, zoning off deep strike, blocking charges etc. Also, give my Salamanders their schtick back! It's most unfair that I cannot glue multimelta's to everything with tracks nor give my dudes Primaris combi-flamers.
1. Spaaaace Marines.
2. CSM can't have nice things.
3. Salamanders are too nice to be allowed nice things.
WE ARE ALL PRIMARIS NOW FOOLS
Huh, has the firstborn emperor's champion gone into legends in that case? Also has the Castellan mini been confirmed as a firstborn or primaris based on the weapon options?
Nice another hard counter to my GK. And somehow for those BT you made 3 squads and 4 characters .
I wonder how angry it makes them to know that their Chapter Tactic essentially makes them inferior Death Skulls imitators?
For Revered Repositories you forgot to add that the Sword of Judgement is an option you can give a Sargeant. Which is just rad
Sigismunds seal on vanguard vets seems really good. They're fast enough to comfortably get into combat with any enemy unit you choose and with storm shields they're durable enough to get there too
FASTEST MAN ON TH-cam
I'm getting super confused by this and the Codex doesn't seem to say, so: Can Templar's use Psykers?
No, they can't. The limitation appears in the SM codex and this is a supplement to that codex.
Imagine a BT player at a tournament refusing to read the mission briefing before seeing his opponents list^^
if one were to have a 10 man assault intercessor squad and combat squad them while having sigisumunds seal, would both units still be able to have reroll hits and wounds againt the selected enemy unit?
One group of 5 will have the rerolls and the other will not. You must choose when you combat squad them. This is the same as terminators squads with teleport homers, incursors with haywire mines, etc.
I do not understand the rules of the marshal or castalan
What a great breakdown, thanks.
So can Primaries use LRC's
If not I'm just using them as true scale counts as
No. A centurion can fit in a land raider, a Primaris cannot.
Because reasons.
@@frostedbutts4340 ah, counts as true scale it is then.
Thanks!
So were regular Sword Brethren replaced with Primaris Sword Brethren?
They do seem to have vanished
I didn’t even see regular sword brethren in the index astartes pdf but maybe I missed them.
Do we now if there is going to be new supplements for the first founding chapters as well?
early comment let's go
So full review? But does not talk about crusade
Most reviews do not talk about crusade.
What do you think about Paragon of Fury Warlord Trait and +1 to Strength? Are the +1 cumulative? Because it does not say that this dies down after the fight or is otherwise ended. So the model would get +1 again on the already improved strength value.
RAW yeah, that's how it works at the moment. I expect they will change it in the Errata though.
I am a little bit annoyed... actually very much annoyed... that primaris LC are locked to black templars.
Yeah there's no special connection between Black Templars and lightning claws... the fact that Shrike is the only Primaris Raven Guard model with lightning claws is silly. I assume the only reason BT have them is because the old Sword Brethren box has one model with them.
Seems like Primaris Black Templars have become the faction with all the firstborn ranged and melee options now that characters can take combi-weapons too. It's a strange development.
Nice video! Im coming back to my really old space marine army and I decided to turn them into Black Templars. I got a question about their rules, I saw somewhere that Black Templars dont have Devastators, instead they get to put Heavy Weapons into standard Squads, is that how it works?
They have devastators. You can though put a heavy weapon in a crusader squad.
Only thing you dont have is the librarian.
@@Corey91666 I see. Does it have to be a crusader squad? I only have standard tactical squads, this rule doesnt apply to them?
Looks like a decent enough edition.
It's ironic that a non founding chapter get more flavour love that all the others.
the last real black templars book came out years ago. i think they deserve some love after like 10 years or more. in that time all or most of the first founding chapters got many little books so i think it is fair.
@Blood ninja thats.... obviously a lir. What the fuck are you smoking?
@Blood ninja I've been collecting and playing since '95. They weren't developed before the founding chapters.
??? The vanilla chapters are flavorless and boring. BT has always been like another blood angels or space wolves etc. just look at the past. BT always had these units… they just resculpted
This is sanguinius stuff right here.........................................................
Sad for black templar eliminators since most players will be using uphold the honor of the emperor.
Snipers don't seem very Templar style anyway
Does the bombastic delivery stratagem go off in the command phase or is it more like commanding oratory that can be used anytime?
goes off when reciting litanies as the first condition is to autopass the one you are currently attempting.
Lets fucking goooooo!