3rd is by far the best, then 2nd and 1st. There was something not quite right about the 1st. Like, the dissonance was a lot more jarring than I was accustomed to. With the 3rd, there was still dissonance, but it sounded much "purer"
did not like certain chords in the 1st tuning, because they sounded out of tune to my ear others sounded relative well. the 3rd tuning was not bad at all... but the 2nd tuning sounded the best to my ears. wonderful video as as always
My favorite was actually the 1st i could tell that the notes seemed "smoother" and the 2nd much "harsher". I even guessed that the 2nd was the equal temperament from the beginning just by this fact alone.
When option 2 sounded, I seemed to feel brighter and warmer sounds, it seemed to me that the ascending and descending notes in the melody are exactly in their places and that is how they should sound. Harmoniously like in demonstrations of alternative tunings, and I thought, perhaps this is the very unique tuning. But it turned out to be equal temperament =) The third option seemed to me very similar to the first, and also a little less harmonious than the second. Looks like I'm deaf =)
Nah, you're very likely just used to equal temperament. For me it's kinda a home tuning simply because I have perfect pitch and the notes just sound off simply because I had some music training. But at the same time, I'm also used to hearing a note as a pretty large range, so I kinda like listening to various tunings, even though they mess with my brain. A lot 😁
When I got to the 2nd version all the notes sounded “right” to me, I felt he was hitting the “right” notes, and the emotion of the music sounded more true and correct. I guess I’m accustomed to equal tempered tuning. I was hoping it was just intonation, but alas it was not. None of the others sounded bad to me, but I preferred the first over the third tuning. Very very subtle differences. Can you identify the tunings by ear? My ears are trained to play guitar, and know when my guitar is out of tune, i.e.; deviating from equal tempered tuning. The closer to equal tempered the better it sounds to me. Not to say the ear cannot be retrained, or become accustomed to alternate tunings. Thanks Tolgahan for bringing awareness to tunings. I did some major studying to finally understand them because of your videos. It was a major gap in my knowledge. I tried to listen for deeper resonances in the bass chords, but ultimately listened to the top notes, as higher pitches “read” faster, and are more identifiable. The first tuning seemed to have good chordal resonances. I think maybe it would also be interesting to compare how the tunings diverge from pure just intonation, instead of equal temperament.
Thanks John! I can understand the difference between 1st and 2nd but it is so hard to notice it between 2nd and 3rd. Have you tried the Renaissance one: th-cam.com/video/DjyNgzjNzyM/w-d-xo.html
Microtonal Guitar - Tolgahan Çoğulu Thanks for the Renaissance link, I listened a few times, and again the 2nd tuning (equal temperament) sounded “correct” to me. I could not distinguish much difference between 1 and 3, other than slightly different “flavor.” They did not sound bad or out of tune to me at all. But when I heard 2 I could tell that the tuning was nailed. I’m happy that my ear is not totally tone deaf, and I can identify at least one tuning. It’s interesting that some tunings can deviate so far from equal temperament, and yet still sound so good. It seems to me equal temperament is best for single note solos, and other variants are best for chords. I play a tiny bit of harmonica, and some are tuned in this fashion, either for chords or single note soloing. What I like, though is how good the completely non-12 tone ET Turkish music sounds. It’s taken me all these years to barely get a grasp of 12 tone systems, to move beyond that is another lifetime of learning. Music is fascinating.
I agree it would be very useful to also have the diff from 12TET. I preferred 2 on the blind listen, and maybe 3 on second revealed listen. 1 never sounded good. The high pedals in the second half sounded flat. I wonder what just intonation would sound like. Also, I LOVE THIS CHANNEL!
If you've been playing the guitar a lot, the sound of the instrument will be slightly different in different tunings due to the way the overtones interact differently.
I'll abstain from giving away which number it was, but I was absolutely blown away by the tuning arrived at by Bradley Lehman. The fact that it sounds that good should be testament enough to the veracity of his theory. Aside from that, I am once again astounded by how easy it is for me to pick out equal temperament.
Brilliant work, thanks. I hope you are continuing with your efforts. The annotations in the video show differences in tunings to the nearest whole integer cent. But many temperament recipes are actually more precisely expressed as simple fractions of the Pythagorean comma (e.g., the Bach 1722 (Lehman 2005) is, from F to E# around the circle of fifths, five -1/6 PC 5ths, three pure 5ths, three -1/12 PC 5ths, and one +1/12 PC “5th” (actually a diminished 6th from A# to F)). And a “1/12th PC” is ≈1.955 cents, if not rounded to 2.000. I apologize for sounding overly academic …). I’m curious: is the guitar tuned rounded to the nearest cent in these temperament demonstrations, or to decimal cents, perhaps even to a thousandth of a cent? It would be nice to know for sure. Thanks for your excellent work. Brilliant.
The 1st had nice resonation or harmonics but the lead voice sounded off, the 2nd had a very pure leading tone but you lost some of the underlying richness. I liked the third tuning best--the lead sounded in tune but it produced a lot of background harmonics.
I like 1 the most and 3 the least. Compared to 2 and 3, 1 had significantly less of a noticeable background fuzziness to it. And I also liked how spicy the diminished chords sounded in 1. As with the other experiment though, I thought all three of them sounded good.
My second video in this series. There seems to be a lot more agreement on this than on the 1st experiment. I also really liked #3. Yes, 12TET sounds "right", but I think we agree that's because we're used to it. Isn't the whole point of "well-tempered" that it's NOT the standard tuning of the day? And I just bet that JSB invented this tuning himself, and made that little design as a puzzle. He was after all a member of a club that studied the mathematics of music, and they must have loved these little puzzles and clues.
I liked all 3; they all have their own compromises. But this piece is chosen so that it doesn't stress the unequal temperaments, so that is not unexpected, given that I have dual optima (able to hear the difference between pure thirds and 12EDO thirds, but like both of them).
With the first listen through without the tunings being shown, I felt quite certain that the 1st one was what I preferred. The 2nd and 3rd tunings felt too constrained, and didn't have enough resonance for my liking. However, with the second listening when the tunings were revealed, the 1st tuning sounded a bit off. This second time, though, I still felt the 2nd tuning was constrained, but it also felt more hollow than the 1st and 3rd tunings. As such, I ended up ending with the 3rd tuning as my preferred, then the 1st as the middle preferred, and the 2nd as my least preferred. This was very interesting. Thank you!
Thanks a lot! If you wanna try one last one, try the Microtonal Renaissance exp :)
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My first and very quick reaction was to like #1 (Quarter Comma Meantone). I didn't go back through them again because I knew full well that I would just go around in circles (ad infinitum).
OK so I listened again and it is number 3 for me, in number 2 I find that the high E string sound a little "out" every now and again and it's close to perfect on number 3, in both versions the other 5 strings sound in-tune and have kind of a homogenous resonant tonality which is very pleasing. Of course this is my subjective perspective. Thanks again for your incredible work.
Its interesting that you've included a common 16-17th century tuning. I'm definitely not an expert, but I've heard that right after those times musicians were pushing for a crisper, higher tone and that idea continued to cause several tuning problems throughout Europe right up to the 20th century. So much so that a standard orchestral tuning for the concert A was written right into the Treaty of Versailles that ended World War I, and then promptly ignored. I think you can hear the slightly crisper high notes in the 19th century tuning that is still common today.
@@microtonalguitar Link to Treaty of Versailles: www.loc.gov/item/lltreaties-ustbv002/ From there (page 179), article (22) "Convention of November 16 and 19, 1885, regarding the establishment of a concert pitch."
excellent work, both tuning and playing. It´s the first time I hear the Bradley Lehman I had read about, so the drawing theory makes indeed sense. Both 1st and 3rd make the middle tone melody much more haunting - Bravo and thank you for putting this out!
3, 2, and then 1 for me. But it was really hard compared to the first Bach video. I had to listen 4x instead of twice to decide. In a way I wish I could blend 1 and 2 and meet somewhere in the middle. It was hard to put one in front of the other between those two.
I liked the third one the best! :) The entrance of the F against the D minor chord sounds a hair too high to me in the first tuning, and that's the only major difference I noticed. Love these videos!
Hi, Did you perhaps measure the positions for 12-TET, but use a tuner to position the frets for the other temperaments? Most of the notes should be vertically aligned in meantone. I assume they're a bit wiggly due to guitar setup/intonation? But if I'm correct, they should be wiggly for 12-TET as well. Same for the Bradley Lehman temperament. At the 7th fret it should be: E-B pure A-E 1/6 flat D-A 1/6 flat G-D 1/6 flat B-F♯ pure E-B pure And at the 5th fret I expected to see: E-A 1/6 sharp A-D 1/6 sharp D-G 1/6 sharp G-C 1/6 sharp B-E pure E-A 1/6 sharp But your frets don't appear to be vertically aligned like that. I also notice that in meantone you seem to have a mixture of G♯ and A♭ (e.g. bottom E string vs top E string, 4th fret)? Many thanks!
So I have watched a lot of these videos, and by the end I feel really stupid. I see comments saying "wow these sound super out of tune!" and whatever, but since the first video they all sounded fine to me. Every single one. When I got to this video I decided to close my eyes and listen to see if I could pick which one was 12 tone temperament, and I was confident it was the one it was, and I got it right. That being said, none of the others sounded wrong to me. If you played the guitar in any of the turnings you have played in ANY video I would not think it was out of tune at all. Am I just stupid? Help please.
No, you aren't: for the most part, it's about *psychoacoustics* (something most people here seem to ignore) plus *enculturation* (familiarity) ... Regarding the former (psychoacoustics), it's very similar to this other issue: reproduction fidelity... I still remember discussions about lossless music format vs. 320 kbps, yet both are indistinguishable for most people: look for this BBC paper named "A subjective evaluation of high bitrate coding of music" (which is easy to read, just 13 pages long). Another one titled "How Different Are Our Perceptions of Equal-Tempered and Microtonal Intervals? A Behavioural and EEG Survey" deals with the latter (enculturation).
Anyways, don't worry: having or not such a fine-grain level of perception doesn't diminish the understanding and enjoyment of music, in the same way that reproduction fidelity doesn't... It's worth reading this piece from a now defunct site, titled "Is the fidelity of reproduction directly related to one's ability to experience the art of music?". Fortunately, it was preserved in the following webpage archive: you will find it joining "archive" + ".is" + "/R7Ya6".
Great video! I actually really liked the first one, it sounded "happier", I guess it was more consonant? The second one sounded saddest, not sure about the third
The 1st string particularly I found terribly flat with the first tuning. So my choose would be 2 and 3 pretty much tied for first place and 1 quite some distance behind.
Hi, Came here from the 1st experiment. To be honest, the 1st one felt the warmest to me. It could hear more distance in the open consonances but it felt like it carried the harmonic movement in a way that was subtle and more “comforting”. (I have perfect pitch, so this is the best way I can describe the feeling of the colors I heard). The 3rd tuning felt like a more expansive space. The shape of the harmonics felt more lateral and far reaching (sorry, I know this probably sounds crazy😅). The 1st felt like a morning indoors. The 3rd felt like stepping out into the back yard to feel the sun for the first time that day. With the equal temperament, the imagery is not the same for me, because I’m so used to it. It just felt ‘familiar’ but I didn’t know why 🤷🏾♂️ Thanks for sharing and sorry for the long read
ive listened to this a bunch of times now and i just realized that the second one is mean't to even out the resonance to give a more smoothed out volume between the various chords, which would be superior for performance purposes if your playing in a church that amplifies certain resonances more then others maybe, idk...just a thought
The first one. Since I listened to the microtonal unequal system, equal 12 tone never sounded good to me. It feels too discrete to my ears. Whereas a microtonal system sounds more natural, connects better and kinda flows, and everything sounds so harmonious. My favorite tuning system would be the Tanbur tuning, probably that of Ozan Yarman 36 or 72.
I actually like to think I have a good ear and the first rendition was harmonically perfect sounding although it is not what our ears are used to. the second stanza was great as well and thats when the difference stood out as it would not have if not for hearing the first microtonal version. I would love an electric guitar with this fret configuration. Thank You again for another brilliant example.T-
Funny enough I really liked the first tuning, thought the second tuning was "way off" on the sharper notes and felt that the 3rd tuning, while very light and harmonious, felt very boring and without the punch the other two had, specially on the lower pitched notes.
The more I listen to your microtonal guitar the more I fall in love with it. I believe it was debussy that introduced the augmented chord to the general public and most people who are attuned to baroque or standard classic pre romantic find his use of whole tone scales offensive until something clicks in them and like a light bulb being turned on they see the colour it brings to music. but any modern classical musician today or any jazz musician would feel as though they were missing part of there language if they did no have access to augmented chords which came from whole tone scales. first romantic then on to jazz the whole tone and augmented progressed then it is found pop songs like the beatles oh darling. I can see microtonal guitars have a long way ahead of them and this is the first time I have ever seen a fret board like that. I dream of an ibanez with one on it or a prs :) microtonal metal would be huge (if it isn't already and being an old fart now I have totally missed it) this time sitting through microtonal bach was not as abrasive and I found all tunings enjoyable. though I think the question of which sounds better is in error. bach is 12 tone not microtonal. I often play bach with out the timing that "he" (probably some one else) has written (a lot of bachs original music had no timing and it was the classical timings to me they may sound the way I think they should but should I show them played as such to another long time student of bach they would get upset. although I can defend my playing by saying bach did not always notate his work with timing he always used the 12 tone system to my knowledge. this fact does not subtract from the music one bit. I have come across keyboard players from western music playing with microtonal but a classical guitar :) I wonder what a stretched 5 on the augmented chord would sound like or squashed 7 on a diminished :) the thing about baroque music is that it has very strict rules no parallel 3rds and 4ths no augmented chords or tri tones. with microtonal tuning I get the feeling it is much like romantic or jazz where the tension and release of tension through dissonance and resolution is its calling. bach and baroque music is a little to stiff for that I think. still again I found this very enjoyable and over time I shall view all of your videos that you have on this instrument. I think if you have come up with this your self (again this is not my area of expertise so I don't know) then you have done the music world a great service. just found this looking at your channel in the up next :) th-cam.com/video/35ZTvwQG-oA/w-d-xo.html 22 edo divides electric :) you have shown me a new world thankyou.
I used the words classical snobs to say that someone wrote some of bachs timings into his modern sheet. youtube found offence and deleted it. I would seem the machine has an idea of what it thinks bach should be. Hi ghost hope your being good and great to meet you here on such a wonderful channel.
That 1st one had some great contrast and depth to it for the low notes... The second tuning made the high note sound better but the low notes were not done Justice...
I don't know, maybe because I've lived all my life under the "12-tet regime" but 2nd tuning still sounded better to my ears. 3rd came close but there was still something off with it. In the 1st tuning the major third sounded definitely flat.
First one felt like it was stronger, deeper, the highest notes didnt hit me as hard and I felt like the bass was stronger. The second one was a bit too sharp in a general way, high notes weren't my favorite. The third one is just the perfect equilibrium, even tho I still prefer the first but maybe it's just me who has listened to lots of Bach works for organ and other baroque works that are usually tuned to that, while also enjoying the second one a lot too. Anyway, amazing work, any way to buy these kind of guitars?
I am not sure about the demonstrations .. in 1 and 3 somehow the chords of G major or G7 sound not as good as I expect. I think the fifth G-D is much too narrow, indicating that the G was too high or the D was too low. Still, interesting to hear the 'good' intonated chords in contrast to ET
1st tuning sounds a little flat on some notes , second tuning sound really nice, third sounds the best to me. 😋, great videos. The fact that normal guitars are always out of tune has always drove me crazy, this is the best sounding guitar either way
I liked #1 and #3, but that is because, as a musician and composer (by hobby not trade), I know what equal temperament sounds like. You can always tell equal temperament from other temperments by listening for the leading tone and the fourth of the scale. They create an awful, wandering, buzz. Well-tempered and justly tempered tritones are often sweeter and tighter, or wider (depending on inversion and context), then equal-tempered tritones. They facilitate a better pull back to the tonic. Equal tempered tritones split the octave as an arithmetic mean and are extremely ambiguous by comparison. Read W.A. Mathieu's book "Harmonic Experience" if you want to go down the rabbit hole about the subjects of equal temperment and just intonation. It's a good read if you are looking to expand your music into new territory.
Thanks! You are right about the leading tone and fourth in 12TET. Allaudin's book was one of the first books I've read about microtonality. Do you know that i am so lucky because he composed me a 3-movement suite: th-cam.com/video/6YR6XgJcmw0/w-d-xo.html
@@microtonalguitar i just played this again while i was getting dressed (with my phone) and the cat laid on top of my phone. animals can sense divinity
first tuning sounded strange, but not in a bad way, i know something is off, but sounds very beautiful, altough strange second tuning sounds really "classic", like it was the way it was supposed to sound third tuning was the most shocking to me, like, i can clearly hear some frequencies "clashing" but in a really beautiful way, creating like a chorus effect or something, i dunno this experiment, unlike the previous one, has no "wrong sounding" tunings, all are clearly different, but beautiful in its own way
Firstly, I'm by no means an educated musician, but here's my 2 cents: 2nd one is the one that sounds most 'correct' to me, but it's a little boring. All the tones can be expected and thus lose character. 1st one is the one I enjoyed the most, it felt as though the contrasts were more exaggerated between each note, yet maintained a nice, warm harmony within the chords. 3rd one was interesting, but I still preferred the 2nd one over it. It felt 'empty' or 'covered' to me somehow? Kind of as if the notes wanted to 'pop out' more but couldn't. I reckon each tuning has its perks and sounds better than the others within different songs. I first watched your microtonal videos a few years ago. There's something refreshing about coming back to it every now and then to listening to different sound groupings. Thanks for your work, good luck!
While I liked the 3rd the best, I agree with what you said about the notes wanting to do more. I was hoping for an even better version, but it probably requires different notes, not just a different tuning.
I appricieted the first tuning just when i opened the video! I didn't like the second tuning. The third tuning sounds well too but not like the first one (in my opinion). Thank you for the interesting video!
Ok, here I prefer the first tuning because it seems to resonate well with harmonics and the dim chords sound just right, the second tuning sounds flat on dim chords and slightly sharper on some chords, I think I noticed it most on minor chords giving that crisp, twangy sound. I assumed that it was equal temperament. The third tuning sounds balanced, clean but little harmonic resonance, sounds slightly muffled. Interesting effect, though!
#1 sounded out of tune to me. #2 and #3 both sounded reasonably “in tune” to me, but #2 sounded calmer, while #3 sounded electrified or agitated. I prefer #2 for this one. I find this interesting because there are some contexts in which 12-TET doesn’t sound good at all and others in which it sounds great.
None of them really sounded like the key of C, although the meantone was fairly close. Equal is of course boring and flat, and Lehman is too weak a temperament for Bach IMO. Though I'm used to the Young temperament, which does have a pure third in the key of C, though I also play on a modified meantone on organ. For what it's worth, the key of C probably isn't the best for comparing temperaments. E minor is the key where I notice huge differences between temperaments in organ music (Bach knew how to use it effectively!), and Bb minor also brings out the differences, with stronger both consonants and stronger dissonances than equal temperament. Generally speaking, for well tempered, the more accidentals are furthest from having pure intervals, and are somewhat difficult to use effectively, the keys with few accidentals are very pure sounding, and the ones in the middle are the most colorful, drawing from both directions.
3-2-1. Before unblinding: 2 seems the crispest and most regular, so I guess is the equal I'm used to; 3 sounds more interesting and harmonious in places; 1 seems somewhat odd.
The third one really opened up the piece and let it sing. It sounds transcendental and airy. I expected it to be 5-limit just to be honest. Very interesting concept to decipher the ornaments, my sceptical reason finds it too esoteric and arbitrary to be true, but my ear finds it just right. I don't know if those ornaments really mean that, but the result is surprisingly good. Equal temperament sounded good too, but I suppose because we're indoctrinated with it. It is an utilitarian concept - sacrifices are made for all keys to sound equally good (or bad). ET builds a ceiling for musical expression - you don't get the ugly side, but also you can't reach the sublime. But this is not how nature intended it, judging by the overtone series.
Hi Tolgahan, I'm new to this microtone and temperament stuff, you do such great work in this matter, if you haven't already, might you make a video actually showing us how True Temperament guitars differ from Equal Temperament, a comparison? I just got an email from them telling me that True Temperament differs from Equal Temperament in such a way, in cents... A 0 A# -4 B -1 C +2 C# -4 D +2 D# -4 E -2 F 0 F# -4 G +4 G# -4 The email also said that the open strings are offset from Equal Temperament by this much, which confused me a bit, considering the information above... E -2 A 0 D +2 G +4 B -1 e -1 On the other hand, you supply microfrets for people, right? Maybe I can just get some from you and try it out myself, but I guess I would then need a tuner that can display cents, right? How would I get the microfrets from you?
1: wowzie those 3rds tho....they're perfect(although the 5ths sound slightly off tune(or maybe they aren't?idk)) 2: It sounds "normal" 3: nice :p it's like mixture of 1 and 2 and it sounds neutral
First one definitely sounded off! Could tell easily after a few bars. Second tuning sounded "right" to my ears and I knew that was standard tuning immediately. 3rd wasn't quite as "bad" as the first one but 2nd def sounded best to me still.
As I heard the first temperament, i knew it was way too consonant to be equal temperament. It produces more volume as well. The third is quite good, more similar to equal than the first, therefore more versatile. Every temperament has its own benefits and disavantages. I personally think that most popular musics on guitar doens't use equal temperament advantages and has all of its disavantages, downgrading the music as a whole.
Amatör olarak müzikle ilgilenen birisi olarak en çok hoşuma giden 1. oldu. Sonrasında 3. akord olduğunu söyleyebilirim. 2. akordda ise bazı akorlardaki tiz notaları nedense biraz kulağımı tırmaladı. Birinci akord bana daha dinlendirici geldi.
1st one is somewhat profound and balanced but the note B sounds too out of tune for me. The 2nd one, though somewhat bright, keeps some color in each chord, it's my favorite. The 3rd one brings to some very interesting color dimension but there also, some chords (G major, C major 1st inversion) are just too out of tune for me.
3rd sounds the best. 1st is the worst, but I think the 1st would sound good on other songs. It's just that on this song specifically, a real peaceful sounding C major chord is needed, and the third tuning is the only one that does a passable job of that IMO.
I thought 1st one feels like very primitive sound. It sounds like folk songs rather than bach. 2nd one is definitely regular tuning, I noticed that very first second it played. But I couldn't distinguish 2nd and 3rd. Maybe 3rd one is sounds better than 2nd. :)
![Tolgahan Çoğulu & Sinan Cem Eroğlu - Kara Toprak [ Microtonal Guitar Duo © 2015 Kalan Müzik ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/bJsUqzQndQE/mqdefault.jpg)
3rd is by far the best, then 2nd and 1st.
There was something not quite right about the 1st. Like, the dissonance was a lot more jarring than I was accustomed to. With the 3rd, there was still dissonance, but it sounded much "purer"
Vrixton Phillips Thanks! Very interesting.
The third is romantic, not baroque. Boring for me. But our contemporary ears are only used to that. What a pity...
Agree. The flat 5ths sounded nasty on the 1st one.
did not like certain chords in the 1st tuning, because they sounded out of tune to my ear others sounded relative well. the 3rd tuning was not bad at all... but the 2nd tuning sounded the best to my ears. wonderful video as as always
metasublime Thanks!
First tuning 0:15
Second tuning 1:27
Third tuning 2:39
wow I am way too acustomed to the sound of equal temperament!
Either that, or they had something right for the last 200+ years...
#2 sounds best to me.
These are so great! #1 was my favorite by far, but #3 was really nice too. 3 had a really round, warm sound to it.
loved the Bradley Lehmann tuning! very sweet and first time i even heard about that one
My favorite was actually the 1st i could tell that the notes seemed "smoother" and the 2nd much "harsher". I even guessed that the 2nd was the equal temperament from the beginning just by this fact alone.
When option 2 sounded, I seemed to feel brighter and warmer sounds, it seemed to me that the ascending and descending notes in the melody are exactly in their places and that is how they should sound. Harmoniously like in demonstrations of alternative tunings, and I thought, perhaps this is the very unique tuning. But it turned out to be equal temperament =) The third option seemed to me very similar to the first, and also a little less harmonious than the second. Looks like I'm deaf =)
Strangely enough, my sentiments exactly 🙂
Nah, you're very likely just used to equal temperament. For me it's kinda a home tuning simply because I have perfect pitch and the notes just sound off simply because I had some music training. But at the same time, I'm also used to hearing a note as a pretty large range, so I kinda like listening to various tunings, even though they mess with my brain. A lot 😁
When I got to the 2nd version all the notes sounded “right” to me, I felt he was hitting the “right” notes, and the emotion of the music sounded more true and correct.
I guess I’m accustomed to equal tempered tuning.
I was hoping it was just intonation, but alas it was not.
None of the others sounded bad to me, but I preferred the first over the third tuning.
Very very subtle differences.
Can you identify the tunings by ear?
My ears are trained to play guitar, and know when my guitar is out of tune, i.e.; deviating from equal tempered tuning. The closer to equal tempered the better it sounds to me.
Not to say the ear cannot be retrained, or become accustomed to alternate tunings.
Thanks Tolgahan for bringing awareness to tunings. I did some major studying to finally understand them because of your videos. It was a major gap in my knowledge.
I tried to listen for deeper resonances in the bass chords, but ultimately listened to the top notes, as higher pitches “read” faster, and are more identifiable.
The first tuning seemed to have good chordal resonances.
I think maybe it would also be interesting to compare how the tunings diverge from pure just intonation, instead of equal temperament.
Thanks John! I can understand the difference between 1st and 2nd but it is so hard to notice it between 2nd and 3rd. Have you tried the Renaissance one: th-cam.com/video/DjyNgzjNzyM/w-d-xo.html
Microtonal Guitar - Tolgahan Çoğulu
Thanks for the Renaissance link, I listened a few times, and again the 2nd tuning (equal temperament) sounded “correct” to me.
I could not distinguish much difference between 1 and 3, other than slightly different “flavor.” They did not sound bad or out of tune to me at all.
But when I heard 2 I could tell that the tuning was nailed. I’m happy that my ear is not totally tone deaf, and I can identify at least one tuning.
It’s interesting that some tunings can deviate so far from equal temperament, and yet still sound so good.
It seems to me equal temperament is best for single note solos, and other variants are best for chords.
I play a tiny bit of harmonica, and some are tuned in this fashion, either for chords or single note soloing.
What I like, though is how good the completely non-12 tone ET Turkish music sounds.
It’s taken me all these years to barely get a grasp of 12 tone systems, to move beyond that is another lifetime of learning. Music is fascinating.
Thanks John! Keep in touch!
I agree it would be very useful to also have the diff from 12TET.
I preferred 2 on the blind listen, and maybe 3 on second revealed listen. 1 never sounded good. The high pedals in the second half sounded flat. I wonder what just intonation would sound like.
Also, I LOVE THIS CHANNEL!
If you've been playing the guitar a lot, the sound of the instrument will be slightly different in different tunings due to the way the overtones interact differently.
I'll abstain from giving away which number it was, but I was absolutely blown away by the tuning arrived at by Bradley Lehman. The fact that it sounds that good should be testament enough to the veracity of his theory. Aside from that, I am once again astounded by how easy it is for me to pick out equal temperament.
Sadly Lehman turned the source diagram upside down and got his tuning wrong, conflicting with the patterns of most historic tunings :-(
Brilliant work, thanks. I hope you are continuing with your efforts.
The annotations in the video show differences in tunings to the nearest whole integer cent. But many temperament recipes are actually more precisely expressed as simple fractions of the Pythagorean comma (e.g., the Bach 1722 (Lehman 2005) is, from F to E# around the circle of fifths, five -1/6 PC 5ths, three pure 5ths, three -1/12 PC 5ths, and one +1/12 PC “5th” (actually a diminished 6th from A# to F)). And a “1/12th PC” is ≈1.955 cents, if not rounded to 2.000. I apologize for sounding overly academic …).
I’m curious: is the guitar tuned rounded to the nearest cent in these temperament demonstrations, or to decimal cents, perhaps even to a thousandth of a cent? It would be nice to know for sure.
Thanks for your excellent work. Brilliant.
Thanks for your comment. I measured the cents on Clear Tune and rounded to the nearest cent.
The 3rd without doubt!
The 1st had nice resonation or harmonics but the lead voice sounded off, the 2nd had a very pure leading tone but you lost some of the underlying richness. I liked the third tuning best--the lead sounded in tune but it produced a lot of background harmonics.
Very interesting. Thanks!
I found the diminished chords sounded awful in the 1st one, that flat 5th really stuck right out with a lot of vibration
I like 1 the most and 3 the least. Compared to 2 and 3, 1 had significantly less of a noticeable background fuzziness to it. And I also liked how spicy the diminished chords sounded in 1. As with the other experiment though, I thought all three of them sounded good.
My second video in this series. There seems to be a lot more agreement on this than on the 1st experiment. I also really liked #3. Yes, 12TET sounds "right", but I think we agree that's because we're used to it. Isn't the whole point of "well-tempered" that it's NOT the standard tuning of the day? And I just bet that JSB invented this tuning himself, and made that little design as a puzzle. He was after all a member of a club that studied the mathematics of music, and they must have loved these little puzzles and clues.
Thanks!
The third option, and then the second. Perhaps a 5-limit tuning would be better here.
I liked all 3; they all have their own compromises. But this piece is chosen so that it doesn't stress the unequal temperaments, so that is not unexpected, given that I have dual optima (able to hear the difference between pure thirds and 12EDO thirds, but like both of them).
I like 3rd one most! Thank you for the nice video as always!
With the first listen through without the tunings being shown, I felt quite certain that the 1st one was what I preferred. The 2nd and 3rd tunings felt too constrained, and didn't have enough resonance for my liking. However, with the second listening when the tunings were revealed, the 1st tuning sounded a bit off. This second time, though, I still felt the 2nd tuning was constrained, but it also felt more hollow than the 1st and 3rd tunings. As such, I ended up ending with the 3rd tuning as my preferred, then the 1st as the middle preferred, and the 2nd as my least preferred. This was very interesting. Thank you!
Thanks a lot! If you wanna try one last one, try the Microtonal Renaissance exp :)
My first and very quick reaction was to like #1 (Quarter Comma Meantone). I didn't go back through them again because I knew full well that I would just go around in circles (ad infinitum).
OK so I listened again and it is number 3 for me, in number 2 I find that the high E string sound a little "out" every now and again and it's close to perfect on number 3, in both versions the other 5 strings sound in-tune and have kind of a homogenous resonant tonality which is very pleasing. Of course this is my subjective perspective. Thanks again for your incredible work.
bjornagain2020 I like Lehman tuning as well despite the subtle difference. If you like this format, you can also try Renaissance experiment 😀
Its interesting that you've included a common 16-17th century tuning. I'm definitely not an expert, but I've heard that right after those times musicians were pushing for a crisper, higher tone and that idea continued to cause several tuning problems throughout Europe right up to the 20th century. So much so that a standard orchestral tuning for the concert A was written right into the Treaty of Versailles that ended World War I, and then promptly ignored. I think you can hear the slightly crisper high notes in the 19th century tuning that is still common today.
JobsSharp i didn’t know about the versailles stuff. Give me more details please.
@@microtonalguitar Link to Treaty of Versailles:
www.loc.gov/item/lltreaties-ustbv002/
From there (page 179), article (22) "Convention of November 16 and 19, 1885, regarding the establishment of a concert pitch."
it seems to me that in the third variant all notes sound together, one, unity.
Мне кажется, что в третьем варианте все ноты звучат вместе, едино.
Макс Егоров Thanks, very interesting.
1,3,2..la primera suena hermoso!.
Gracias
excellent work, both tuning and playing. It´s the first time I hear the Bradley Lehman I had read about, so the drawing theory makes indeed sense. Both 1st and 3rd make the middle tone melody much more haunting - Bravo and thank you for putting this out!
and yes, the equal temperament is really boring in comparison
Glad to hear that! Have you tried the Renaissance experiment?
listening now... my comment there :)
3, 2, and then 1 for me. But it was really hard compared to the first Bach video. I had to listen 4x instead of twice to decide. In a way I wish I could blend 1 and 2 and meet somewhere in the middle. It was hard to put one in front of the other between those two.
I liked the third one the best! :) The entrance of the F against the D minor chord sounds a hair too high to me in the first tuning, and that's the only major difference I noticed. Love these videos!
Thanks Stephen, cheers.
So beautifull, ty so much
i've not heard of the 3rd before. that one was pretty trippy :O going to look into that. thanks!
seems like a discordian prank yet sounds very interesting. i dig.
Hi,
Did you perhaps measure the positions for 12-TET, but use a tuner to position the frets for the other temperaments? Most of the notes should be vertically aligned in meantone. I assume they're a bit wiggly due to guitar setup/intonation? But if I'm correct, they should be wiggly for 12-TET as well.
Same for the Bradley Lehman temperament. At the 7th fret it should be:
E-B pure
A-E 1/6 flat
D-A 1/6 flat
G-D 1/6 flat
B-F♯ pure
E-B pure
And at the 5th fret I expected to see:
E-A 1/6 sharp
A-D 1/6 sharp
D-G 1/6 sharp
G-C 1/6 sharp
B-E pure
E-A 1/6 sharp
But your frets don't appear to be vertically aligned like that.
I also notice that in meantone you seem to have a mixture of G♯ and A♭ (e.g. bottom E string vs top E string, 4th fret)?
Many thanks!
For the other 2 experiments the 12-edo sounded best to me, for this one I like #3 best. May there is hope after all.😍
So I have watched a lot of these videos, and by the end I feel really stupid. I see comments saying "wow these sound super out of tune!" and whatever, but since the first video they all sounded fine to me. Every single one. When I got to this video I decided to close my eyes and listen to see if I could pick which one was 12 tone temperament, and I was confident it was the one it was, and I got it right. That being said, none of the others sounded wrong to me. If you played the guitar in any of the turnings you have played in ANY video I would not think it was out of tune at all. Am I just stupid? Help please.
No, you aren't: for the most part, it's about *psychoacoustics* (something most people here seem to ignore) plus *enculturation* (familiarity) ... Regarding the former (psychoacoustics), it's very similar to this other issue: reproduction fidelity... I still remember discussions about lossless music format vs. 320 kbps, yet both are indistinguishable for most people: look for this BBC paper named "A subjective evaluation of high bitrate coding of music" (which is easy to read, just 13 pages long). Another one titled "How Different Are Our Perceptions of Equal-Tempered and Microtonal Intervals? A Behavioural and EEG Survey" deals with the latter (enculturation).
Anyways, don't worry: having or not such a fine-grain level of perception doesn't diminish the understanding and enjoyment of music, in the same way that reproduction fidelity doesn't... It's worth reading this piece from a now defunct site, titled "Is the fidelity of reproduction directly related to one's ability to experience the art of music?". Fortunately, it was preserved in the following webpage archive: you will find it joining "archive" + ".is" + "/R7Ya6".
I like the darker mod on '#1 in this context ... I think it is highly depending on the context
I agree! Thanks.
2nd is the best of'em all. Because of its tonal quality in mellowness.
Great video!
I actually really liked the first one, it sounded "happier", I guess it was more consonant? The second one sounded saddest, not sure about the third
The whole video I felt like something was off, then I realised that he was left handed and I hadn't really seen a left hand guitatist up close before.
Funny :)
What a gift this video is. Thank you.
Oddly enough, equal temperament was my least favorite.
Where does the guitar come from? What a brilliant idea.
Thanks! The guitar's story is in my video History of the Microtonal Guitar.
The 1st string particularly I found terribly flat with the first tuning. So my choose would be 2 and 3 pretty much tied for first place and 1 quite some distance behind.
Hi,
Came here from the 1st experiment. To be honest, the 1st one felt the warmest to me. It could hear more distance in the open consonances but it felt like it carried the harmonic movement in a way that was subtle and more “comforting”.
(I have perfect pitch, so this is the best way I can describe the feeling of the colors I heard).
The 3rd tuning felt like a more expansive space. The shape of the harmonics felt more lateral and far reaching (sorry, I know this probably sounds crazy😅).
The 1st felt like a morning indoors. The 3rd felt like stepping out into the back yard to feel the sun for the first time that day.
With the equal temperament, the imagery is not the same for me, because I’m so used to it. It just felt ‘familiar’ but I didn’t know why 🤷🏾♂️
Thanks for sharing and sorry for the long read
Thanks a lot! Great analysis
I like the third one the most, then the first, then the second. I wish all of our guitars could have adjustable frets. Great video as usual!
Ko44cHPM I wish too 😀
ive listened to this a bunch of times now and i just realized that the second one is mean't to even out the resonance to give a more smoothed out volume between the various chords, which would be superior for performance purposes if your playing in a church that amplifies certain resonances more then others maybe, idk...just a thought
I couldn't get it. Do you mean we played the second one softer?
The first one. Since I listened to the microtonal unequal system, equal 12 tone never sounded good to me. It feels too discrete to my ears. Whereas a microtonal system sounds more natural, connects better and kinda flows, and everything sounds so harmonious. My favorite tuning system would be the Tanbur tuning, probably that of Ozan Yarman 36 or 72.
I actually like to think I have a good ear and the first rendition was harmonically perfect sounding although it is not what our ears are used to. the second stanza was great as well and thats when the difference stood out as it would not have if not for hearing the first microtonal version. I would love an electric guitar with this fret configuration. Thank You again for another brilliant example.T-
Thanks for your comment. You can have adjustable microtonal fretboards for electric guitar. Please email me at microtonalguitarist@gmail.com
They are all great.
Ievolovel Thanks! No favourites?
Wow I love these videos! :D
Glad to hear that!
Funny enough I really liked the first tuning, thought the second tuning was "way off" on the sharper notes and felt that the 3rd tuning, while very light and harmonious, felt very boring and without the punch the other two had, specially on the lower pitched notes.
The more I listen to your microtonal guitar the more I fall in love with it.
I believe it was debussy that introduced the augmented chord to the general public and most people who are attuned
to baroque or standard classic pre romantic find his use of whole tone scales offensive until something clicks in them
and like a light bulb being turned on they see the colour it brings to music.
but any modern classical musician today or any jazz musician would feel as though they were missing part of there
language if they did no have access to augmented chords which came from whole tone scales.
first romantic then on to jazz the whole tone and augmented progressed then it is found pop songs like the beatles oh darling.
I can see microtonal guitars have a long way ahead of them and this is the first time I have ever seen a fret board like that.
I dream of an ibanez with one on it or a prs :)
microtonal metal would be huge (if it isn't already and being an old fart now I have totally missed it)
this time sitting through microtonal bach was not as abrasive and I found all tunings enjoyable.
though I think the question of which sounds better is in error.
bach is 12 tone not microtonal.
I often play bach with out the timing that "he" (probably some one else) has written (a lot of bachs original music had no timing and it
was the classical timings
to me they may sound the way I think they should but should I show them played as such to another long time student of
bach they would get upset.
although I can defend my playing by saying bach did not always notate his work with timing he always used the 12 tone
system to my knowledge.
this fact does not subtract from the music one bit.
I have come across keyboard players from western music playing with microtonal but a classical guitar :)
I wonder what a stretched 5 on the augmented chord would sound like
or squashed 7 on a diminished :)
the thing about baroque music is that it has very strict rules no parallel 3rds and 4ths no augmented chords or tri tones.
with microtonal tuning I get the feeling it is much like romantic or jazz where the tension and release of tension through dissonance
and resolution is its calling.
bach and baroque music is a little to stiff for that I think.
still again I found this very enjoyable and over time I shall view all of your videos that you have on this instrument.
I think if you have come up with this your self (again this is not my area of expertise so I don't know) then you have
done the music world a great service.
just found this looking at your channel in the up next :)
th-cam.com/video/35ZTvwQG-oA/w-d-xo.html
22 edo divides electric :)
you have shown me a new world thankyou.
I used the words classical snobs to say that someone wrote some of bachs timings into his modern sheet.
youtube found offence and deleted it.
I would seem the machine has an idea of what it thinks bach should be.
Hi ghost hope your being good and great to meet you here on such a wonderful channel.
That 1st one had some great contrast and depth to it for the low notes... The second tuning made the high note sound better but the low notes were not done Justice...
Thanks! th-cam.com/video/OUoo1FKCs2I/w-d-xo.html
I don't know, maybe because I've lived all my life under the "12-tet regime" but 2nd tuning still sounded better to my ears. 3rd came close but there was still something off with it. In the 1st tuning the major third sounded definitely flat.
Tony Leva Thanks. I like natural flat major 3rds 😀
First one felt like it was stronger, deeper, the highest notes didnt hit me as hard and I felt like the bass was stronger.
The second one was a bit too sharp in a general way, high notes weren't my favorite.
The third one is just the perfect equilibrium, even tho I still prefer the first but maybe it's just me who has listened to lots of Bach works for organ and other baroque works that are usually tuned to that, while also enjoying the second one a lot too.
Anyway, amazing work, any way to buy these kind of guitars?
Thanks for your comment! Please email me at microtonalguitarist@gmail.com for the fretboards.
I am not sure about the demonstrations .. in 1 and 3 somehow the chords of G major or G7 sound not as good as I expect. I think the fifth G-D is much too narrow, indicating that the G was too high or the D was too low.
Still, interesting to hear the 'good' intonated chords in contrast to ET
Thanks
1st tuning sounds a little flat on some notes , second tuning sound really nice, third sounds the best to me. 😋, great videos. The fact that normal guitars are always out of tune has always drove me crazy, this is the best sounding guitar either way
Thanks! Glad to hear that. Cheers from Istanbul.
Oh well, the conditioning has worked. Surprised to find I felt 2 sounded best, but maybe it’s just what I’m most used to hearing..?
epodcam I think so 😀
I liked #1 and #3, but that is because, as a musician and composer (by hobby not trade), I know what equal temperament sounds like. You can always tell equal temperament from other temperments by listening for the leading tone and the fourth of the scale. They create an awful, wandering, buzz. Well-tempered and justly tempered tritones are often sweeter and tighter, or wider (depending on inversion and context), then equal-tempered tritones. They facilitate a better pull back to the tonic. Equal tempered tritones split the octave as an arithmetic mean and are extremely ambiguous by comparison.
Read W.A. Mathieu's book "Harmonic Experience" if you want to go down the rabbit hole about the subjects of equal
temperment and just intonation. It's a good read if you are looking to expand your music into new territory.
Thanks! You are right about the leading tone and fourth in 12TET. Allaudin's book was one of the first books I've read about microtonality. Do you know that i am so lucky because he composed me a 3-movement suite: th-cam.com/video/6YR6XgJcmw0/w-d-xo.html
Awesome! That is too cool! :)
First felt very appropriate. Great videos.
Thanks! Try this one: th-cam.com/video/CDr6refSgg0/w-d-xo.html
the first one is louder naturally because of the resonance, way better. its sad how some of the chords just fall out in the second tuning
Yes, I like the resonance in the meantone.
@@microtonalguitar i just played this again while i was getting dressed (with my phone) and the cat laid on top of my phone. animals can sense divinity
Eric Jorgensen Cats love Bach 😀
first tuning sounded strange, but not in a bad way, i know something is off, but sounds very beautiful, altough strange
second tuning sounds really "classic", like it was the way it was supposed to sound
third tuning was the most shocking to me, like, i can clearly hear some frequencies "clashing" but in a really beautiful way, creating like a chorus effect or something, i dunno
this experiment, unlike the previous one, has no "wrong sounding" tunings, all are clearly different, but beautiful in its own way
Very interesting! Thanks.
Firstly, I'm by no means an educated musician, but here's my 2 cents:
2nd one is the one that sounds most 'correct' to me, but it's a little boring. All the tones can be expected and thus lose character.
1st one is the one I enjoyed the most, it felt as though the contrasts were more exaggerated between each note, yet maintained a nice, warm harmony within the chords.
3rd one was interesting, but I still preferred the 2nd one over it. It felt 'empty' or 'covered' to me somehow? Kind of as if the notes wanted to 'pop out' more but couldn't.
I reckon each tuning has its perks and sounds better than the others within different songs.
I first watched your microtonal videos a few years ago. There's something refreshing about coming back to it every now and then to listening to different sound groupings.
Thanks for your work, good luck!
anvi Thanks a lot! I agree with you.
While I liked the 3rd the best, I agree with what you said about the notes wanting to do more. I was hoping for an even better version, but it probably requires different notes, not just a different tuning.
I like #3 best because the tritone sounds nice
Interesting! Thanks.
I appricieted the first tuning just when i opened the video!
I didn't like the second tuning.
The third tuning sounds well too but not like the first one (in my opinion).
Thank you for the interesting video!
the second one is my favorite
erdal tokat Teşekkürler.
Ok, here I prefer the first tuning because it seems to resonate well with harmonics and the dim chords sound just right, the second tuning sounds flat on dim chords and slightly sharper on some chords, I think I noticed it most on minor chords giving that crisp, twangy sound. I assumed that it was equal temperament. The third tuning sounds balanced, clean but little harmonic resonance, sounds slightly muffled. Interesting effect, though!
Laff Thanks! My favourite too.
2nd one is my favourite
Thanks!
#1 sounded out of tune to me. #2 and #3 both sounded reasonably “in tune” to me, but #2 sounded calmer, while #3 sounded electrified or agitated. I prefer #2 for this one.
I find this interesting because there are some contexts in which 12-TET doesn’t sound good at all and others in which it sounds great.
One!
3nd version
Thanks!
None of them really sounded like the key of C, although the meantone was fairly close. Equal is of course boring and flat, and Lehman is too weak a temperament for Bach IMO.
Though I'm used to the Young temperament, which does have a pure third in the key of C, though I also play on a modified meantone on organ.
For what it's worth, the key of C probably isn't the best for comparing temperaments. E minor is the key where I notice huge differences between temperaments in organ music (Bach knew how to use it effectively!), and Bb minor also brings out the differences, with stronger both consonants and stronger dissonances than equal temperament. Generally speaking, for well tempered, the more accidentals are furthest from having pure intervals, and are somewhat difficult to use effectively, the keys with few accidentals are very pure sounding, and the ones in the middle are the most colorful, drawing from both directions.
Thank you.
First one is my favorite tuning :)
Thanks! My favourite too :)
Yes remaining secret quarter- comma meantone is my favourite tuning also
Yes nee too somehow it feels warm
Same
The G diminished chords sounded awful in the 1st one, but definitely makes sense given that the C# is -24.5 cents adjusted and the G only being -3.5
3-2-1. Before unblinding: 2 seems the crispest and most regular, so I guess is the equal I'm used to; 3 sounds more interesting and harmonious in places; 1 seems somewhat odd.
The third one really opened up the piece and let it sing. It sounds transcendental and airy. I expected it to be 5-limit just to be honest. Very interesting concept to decipher the ornaments, my sceptical reason finds it too esoteric and arbitrary to be true, but my ear finds it just right. I don't know if those ornaments really mean that, but the result is surprisingly good.
Equal temperament sounded good too, but I suppose because we're indoctrinated with it. It is an utilitarian concept - sacrifices are made for all keys to sound equally good (or bad). ET builds a ceiling for musical expression - you don't get the ugly side, but also you can't reach the sublime. But this is not how nature intended it, judging by the overtone series.
Stephen Dedalus I like the Lehman tuning as well. Try the Renaissance experiment
#3 for me on this one
Definitely the first one.
I agree!
Hi Tolgahan, I'm new to this microtone and temperament stuff, you do such great work in this matter, if you haven't already, might you make a video actually showing us how True Temperament guitars differ from Equal Temperament, a comparison? I just got an email from them telling me that True Temperament differs from Equal Temperament in such a way, in cents...
A 0
A# -4
B -1
C +2
C# -4
D +2
D# -4
E -2
F 0
F# -4
G +4
G# -4
The email also said that the open strings are offset from Equal Temperament by this much, which confused me a bit, considering the information above...
E -2
A 0
D +2
G +4
B -1
e -1
On the other hand, you supply microfrets for people, right? Maybe I can just get some from you and try it out myself, but I guess I would then need a tuner that can display cents, right? How would I get the microfrets from you?
they all sounded pretty good, nothing sounded too extreme in any option.
Thanks! Why not :)
1: wowzie those 3rds tho....they're perfect(although the 5ths sound slightly off tune(or maybe they aren't?idk))
2: It sounds "normal"
3: nice :p it's like mixture of 1 and 2 and it sounds neutral
Wow it's quite accurate
Wow, great guesses!
First one definitely sounded off! Could tell easily after a few bars. Second tuning sounded "right" to my ears and I knew that was standard tuning immediately. 3rd wasn't quite as "bad" as the first one but 2nd def sounded best to me still.
Thanks! You are a good 12TET spotter :)
Can we get a microtonal Art of Fugue next? :)
Guitar is not capable of it :( No 4 parts.
Multiple guitars then?
That's it!
Hope to hear it someday :)
Hocam konu dışı olacak ama majör dominant diye akor yok. Dominant7 ya da sadece 7'li akor demek daha doğru olur.
Son Goku Doğru, gözden kaçmış.
#1 > #3 > #2 and I think #2 is even temperament
You are right!
The first one is the best!
The 3rd🙏
Thanks!
3rd one sounded best to me. It had the most balanced sound I think.
I wonder if you've tried baroque tuning 415hz vs. modern 440hz vs. 432hz???
I played in 432Hz, I like it.
As I heard the first temperament, i knew it was way too consonant to be equal temperament. It produces more volume as well. The third is quite good, more similar to equal than the first, therefore more versatile. Every temperament has its own benefits and disavantages. I personally think that most popular musics on guitar doens't use equal temperament advantages and has all of its disavantages, downgrading the music as a whole.
Vitor Bonk Thanks for the choice!
I like number three. Btw what's the name of this piece again?
Amatör olarak müzikle ilgilenen birisi olarak en çok hoşuma giden 1. oldu. Sonrasında 3. akord olduğunu söyleyebilirim. 2. akordda ise bazı akorlardaki tiz notaları nedense biraz kulağımı tırmaladı. Birinci akord bana daha dinlendirici geldi.
Quercus Katılıyorum. 2. Akort sistemi günümüzdeki sistem.
1st one sucks. The d7 chord at 0:49 was obviously out of tune. 3rd and 2nd were close but equal temperament is best for me
Thanks. th-cam.com/video/AQgybkGPETU/w-d-xo.html
Definitely the #3 for me.
Thanks!
This so interesting. I liked the Quarter-comma meantone in the Renaissance experiment the best. But here it sounds totally out of tune to me.
Interesting that it sounds out of tune here.
1st one is somewhat profound and balanced but the note B sounds too out of tune for me.
The 2nd one, though somewhat bright, keeps some color in each chord, it's my favorite.
The 3rd one brings to some very interesting color dimension but there also, some chords (G major, C major 1st inversion) are just too out of tune for me.
12 tone sounded best to me for both videos. Apparently I have a preference that I didn't know about
Thanks!
Leihman Temperation is good
I liked the third than the second. The first had a hesitant quality to it.
Thanks for the selection.
3rd sounds the best. 1st is the worst, but I think the 1st would sound good on other songs. It's just that on this song specifically, a real peaceful sounding C major chord is needed, and the third tuning is the only one that does a passable job of that IMO.
funkalunatic Thanks a lot!
kesinlikle #3 bence..
Teşekkürler.
3 sounded the best compromise to my ear.
2.'si en iyisi.
faitj marjes Teşekkürler.
I thought 1st one feels like very primitive sound. It sounds like folk songs rather than bach. 2nd one is definitely regular tuning, I noticed that very first second it played. But I couldn't distinguish 2nd and 3rd. Maybe 3rd one is sounds better than 2nd. :)
박순원 Interesting that you called the first one folk song-like
I thought the first one is the equal tempered one
I got 1 > 3 > 2. but between 1 and 3 there is little difference. 2 is definately not as nice as the others.
Thanks! I thought 2nd and 3rd would sound similar. Interesting!