You can use REW and a umik1 to set a more accurate crossover point than guessing. Your room setup and configuration can have an effect on how your speakers play and using REW can help to visualize what response you are getting.
Yep...always 80 if you are not measuring. You are guessing anyway might as well guess safely. I get huge dips at 40 and still pretty bad dips at 60 and my speakers are rated to 40 and my room is partially treated and carpet. My sides and backs don't start to clean up until 90 and look best at 100 and 120. I just wish REW could do Atmos, but it can't so I just set them at 100 even tho they are rated to 80
Just setting up my system now, this information is so valuable! I always used to set the crossover at the bottom of the front speakers' range, around 80hz, but this makes so much more sense!! Thanks for the clear and easy to understand explanation!!
THX Kyle, good to get a reminder every now and then of what we set and forget... "Our ears are always right" and we should learn to trust them more often. Peace.
My Boston satellites are rated 150hz and i have them at 80hz. So stupid i was following some random videos. Now seeing yours i am able to get an idea of what it has to be set. Will set them at 160 or above and see how it sounds. Thank you so much for helping many in getting the settings for their speakers.
Best explanation I have ever heard that's what people need to hear look what the frequency their speaker are and set it to 50 or 20 above so it rolls 👍👍👍👍👍
Finally Finally Finally someone explained it the Right way! Great video very easy to understand very well spoken. This is by far the best video out there on crossover Hz. Just saved a bunch of people a ton of money not blowing their speakers. 👍👍
I think the most significant attribute will be the SPL level that suits your preferences. I am typically happy under 70db and there is not one speaker that is at any risk of damage regardless of frequencies.
THX crossover setting of 80 hz is still best I think even with tower speakers with mid drivers (if you have a sub). It keeps your towers playing the freqs that they are better at reproducing and likewise with the subs. Yes your towers might be able to produce down to 30hz as a manufacturer spec, but wouldnt you want to be passing those lower freqs off to your sub anyways as the sub will sound much better at even 50hz than any towers playing the same freq unless they have their own integrated subs.
Many thanks Kpaceguy for a different way of explaining to understand the crossover and it is very helpful when you put overlay figures on the screen for even a more better understanding on the scale of Hz to KHz 👏👍👊✊ UK
My Pioneer Elite options are 50HZ, 80Hz, or 100hz and all are global. So I have to set it to 80. I have a problem with brand loyalty so I stick with Pioneer. I don't know why Pioneer sticks with this and doesn't give us more flexibility with crossover selection.
I run my elac unifi at 60.80 hz sounds great but 60 gives my fronts a little more thump in the drivers. More importantly after audessey i have a 10db null in my subs 82 hz so using my fronts to handle the null more and have subs go from 60 down.
Great video. You explained it very well. I do have just some additional info to share for others in my experience. Although I have 3-way center and surrounds, I have linear 2x SVS PB-1000 pros and I’ve set my crossovers to 80-110hz depending on the speaker. These surround/center speakers are rated down to 38Hz +/- 3dB, but no way do they put out at 40, 50, 65 or even 90Hz what a good linear subwoofer will do. Let alone a pair of them. The proof is in the listening. I ran 60-80Hz crossovers for 2 years prior to watching a video that had me raise the crossover. The experience went from 8/10 to 10/10. That said I do NOT recommend this for cheap nonlinear subwoofers. It will sound boomy/voice will get into the subs etc. Thank you for your video. Love sharing this hobby with likeminded individuals.
My bolkshelfes speakers have minimum frequencies of 40hz, so I did several tests with a frequency of 60 to 90hz, I found that the speakers behave better at 70hz.
I used to do this also...10 - 15 over the rating. But once a bought a umik-1 and started using REW, 80Hz made much more sense if you are guessing. No matter what your speakers rate if you have a good sub you really want it to do all the heavy lifting. Once i started using REW and measuring I saw that below 80 it pretty much was always worse. My front stage loves 80, but my sides are flatter at 120 and my rears are flatter at 100 and all my speakers are towers rated to 40. It was eye opening. And now I know there is no answer if your are not measuring... only guessing. If you can't measure then just go with 80. Buy a $100 mic to throw on a laptop and do some sweeps so you can see your response change when you move the xover. I will never setup my HT again without using REW, a mic, and a miniDSP. miniDSP is a whole other story. WHAT A DIFFERENCE IT MADE.
What exact equipment do I need to do it this way Jerry? I am new here and want to get things set up right. Guessing gives me anxiety man I wanna know for real 😂
I made some adjustments last night since it was late for me to test the crossover. I must say that simple adjustment make a big difference. I am hearing audio I haven't heard before.
I have never heard of anyone else say that the crossover is to protect your speaker from low frequencies. Okay, there is a reason, but it is to protect the tweeters from a weak amp. If the amp is weak and doesn't have enough power, then it can clip which is what damages tweeters. Woofers are hard to damage. Woofers are what pulls power, so if you send less power to the woofers, and instead use the separate amp in your subs, then the AV receiver has more power available for the higher frequencies. This all goes under the category of bass management.
Great video! After playing with all the settings manually, I let the software in my 10 year-old Pioneer THX receiver calibrate everything and set the crossover points. Every now and again I'll revisit and tweak it manually to see if I can improve it but I always end up going back to what the software does. I'll soon be upgrading to a more contemporary receiver with hopefully DIRAC built in and I'm excited to see how that will change things.
Excellent video. Just got a new Integra AVR. Not in love with it yet but could be my settings. Replacing a 12 yr old AVR that didn't have individual cross for each speaker. I have van reading about this and yesterday i was messing with the Hz settings and it did sound fuller and more detailed with lower cross and sub at 120. I have Paradigm Premier 700F fronts.45-25, 600C Center 60-25 and DT Mythos 6 surrounds 60-30.
Problem is, my receiver does not allow individual crossover settings - it wasn't cheap at $1000 either. So the THX recommended standard of 80 hz is prbably the best setting to support my floorstanding fronts and bookshelf/center surrounds which have a recommended crossover range of 60-80 and 80-100 respectively.
I know you did this video 2 years ago I’m just seeing it now and I a want to think you this video I’m setting up my dedicated home theater and did not know how to set this up also thank you for the subwoofer video that helped
Thank you so much. This was a huge help. I have 2 polk psw10 subwoofers. Sounds great for movies but I'm not happy with how they perform with music? I hope you have a suggestion. The listening area is large. So I'm not sure if the 50 watt rms is enough or is it because it's a ported sub. I was thinking about a klipsh 12 inch 400 watt sub
I’ve got RSL CG5’s. They are rated to 50hz and I have the crossover set at 60hz. I use both speaker level and LFE connections for my sub and it’s crossover at about 80hz.
Liked. At first watching this video I was shaking my head at a lot of what you said. Then half way through the video you finally said what I wanted to hear and where you should have started 😂. That lower rating is not necessarily where the speakers get damaged, its just where they no longer maintain apparent volume for the power given without distortion out of spec. Below this does not mean they will be damaged, but equally important is that above this does not mean they will sound good. 80-Hz is a great crossover “starting point” for most people, but its not where you should stay with exploring options. Just because my speakers go to 40hz does not mean the sub doesn’t do 60-Hz better. The other variable you miss the point here is whats on the other end? What’s the subs range and where does it sound good? Do start at 80Hz. Do adjust it based on you speaker’s rating. Do adjust to what sounds great for your seating position (sub performance is spatially variable). And do it at a volume above your normal listening volume.
It really just depends. 80hz was the THX standard because they did a lot of research and it showed most people preferred it there. 80hz gave extra punch to the lower bass notes since both sources were playing it often leading to constructive interference. 80hz and it's surrounding octave are super important for bass guitar and the kick drum. Adding extra emphasis to it allowed for music genres where it wasn't present or was removed considerably through poor mastering (80's hair metal comes to mind). This is also why sub manufacturers always advised to place it in a corner. The corner maybe a decent place depending on your room, but often between the 2 speakers is best for time alignment.
Thanks for the advice I was running a 80Hz X over on everything my fronts are Paradigm founder series a pair of 100 F and C 90 they can go down to 40Hz so I put them to 60Hz my rear surrounds and atmos modules I kept 80Hz subs Paradigm Defiance X 12's I kept at 100 Hz probably going to tweak some more to find spot on
My opinion: get a good set budget. Don’t allow yourself to mismatch speakers. Whether you mismatch companies. Or just speaker size/model. It keeps the sound whole and controlled. That’s why we have subwoofers. It’s my opinion you should always have a even number of subwoofers. Never 1, never 3, never 5... get speakers that can hit 80hz or 100hz comfortably. Sometimes size is something we have to consider. But the overall sound will be very good and very rounded because every speaker is the same exact size and same model/brand. That way when sound effects travel from speaker to speaker it sounds composed and neutral.
Its a contentious subject for sure and there isn't a single straight forward answer, your ears will be the best decider but I wanted to pick up on one thing you mentioned that I don't think is right. Your main speakers, whatever they may be, are designed to emit sound over a wide range of frequencies. Expensive ones do high end and low end really well, cheaper ones are more a jack of all trades master of none. Sub woofers have one job, emit low frequency sound and they are designed to do that well. If you have an average speaker setup, you want that subwoofer handling the low frequency sounds, because invariably they will do it better than your mains. Your contention that you look at your mains frequency specs and set the crossover at somewhere just above that is not allowing the subwoofer do the job it should do and trying to use your mains as somehow emitting low frequency sounds as well as your subwoofer. I contend that's not often the case and you want your low frequency sounds to be handled by the best driver in your system that can emit them so setting your crossover somewhere between 80Hz to 120Hz is more likely to do that. I'd also contend that with a typical subwoofer having its own powered amplifier and not taking away your AV receiver/mains amplifier wattage, you are allowing more power for the rest of the frequencies above the crossover, theoretically giving cleaner sound. I am sure there will be other opinions, but I wanted to give an alternative view to the one presented.
I have Klipsch speakers but I can't set the crossover on each speakers because I have my receiver connected to tv using a digital optical cord so my receiver set to 80 on its own by doing the calibration but when I get a tv that supports earc than I could do that.
Thanks for this. I’m really struggling with my new equipment crossover points and sub as well. Has an LFE setting plus the different frequencies. Searching for that subwoofer video now. 😢
don't forget speakers have internal crossovers too and alot of manufacturs cheap out on them as it costs money to build a good crossover like 500 in just parts so they go to chineese parts alot to keep costs down
Alot of speakers are held back by these crossovers like Sony has a really cheap speaker that the woofers and theaters are amazing but they went extremely cheap on the crossover and once that is upgraded it sounds like a $2000 bookshelf not $150 anymore. How much of a difference it can make depends on the drivers used in your speaker along with how the speaker was braced ect. The rule is what the speaker is sold for it has to cost 1/5th to make.
Is it okay to set my FL and FR floor standing speakers (Focals Aria Evo X No.3) as Large with no Subs only in 2 channel playback settings (Marantz or Denon)? By the way, great video on explaining crossover settings. The info was very helpful and UNDERSTANDABLE. Thanks!!
@kennethcoulter791 i appreciate it. Yes If you have no sub it'll automatically set your speakers to large which is fine. Just turn the bass down if you find it too much for your speakers.
My Polk speakers have the following detail. Could you please explain what the differences are? Ie what is the difference between overall frequency response and the frequency response. Which value should I use when setting frequency response in my avr. I have Reserve r700 speakers Overall frequency response 45 Hz-50 kHz 50 Hz-50 kHz 36 Hz-50 kHz Frequency response (-3 dB limits) 65 Hz-38 kHz
@jimcar53 Overall, frequency response is the response you can expect to get inside a room because of them room. The frequency response is actually what the speaker is comfortable playing at any given time. The overall frequency says that it can play down to 45hz but not that loud.
Audyssey sets my speakers to 40Hz, but they sound progressively more clear (especially voices) as I approach 100Hz. This is where mine are set and sound best in conjunction with my two subwoofers.
I Have SVS Prime Satellites I Have Crossed At 90HZ Along With The SVS Prime Central Channel. I Had The Satellites Crossed At 100HZ But They Sound Better At 90HZ.
@everyday_life1991 I Have Since Changed To Prime Bookshelfs For My Front Left & Right Which Are At 80HZ Now. The Prime Satellites Are At 100HZ I Have Those For The Surround Back.
80hr is good starting point. I have klipsch towers r620,center r52,surround r51 and subwoofer 120 i find increasing the crossover between 80hr and 120hr is better for bass in the subwoofer when i set up ypao in my receiver it set my crossover to 40hr which left the bass in the subwoofer dead so increasing to 90hr brought my sub back to life.You want your sub to handle most of the bass thats whats its for unless you dont have a subwoofer then lower it to 40hr and set speakers to large.
I have done it another way. All speakers in LARGE, subs in LFE+MAIN, turn Audyssey off, manual eq everything where I make the rolloff slope. MiniDSP for housecurve (6db from 100hz). This gives me a much better impact, and it also sounds clearer.
@@shaunmeredith652 I have not been able to make all speaker small seting, sound good, until 2 days ago, when I rebuildt my room for the 100th time 🙈🙈🙈 Now, I have one seting with LCR in large (no lfe+main), and one where I cut LCR and surround back (all towers with dual 12 or dual 10" and 300 watts), at 60 hz, the rest at 90hz. Both sound great and measure great. LCR large, sounds slightly more coherent, and is better for music than the seting all small. 😊
I have monitor audio bronze50 main speakers with a Frequency Response: 40-30k Hz (±3dB). Do you mean trying setting it at 60? Also have a svs 1000 classic sub. So how do I hook that up to my receiver? Seen one other video you made about the LFE so I tried that. But you say it's mostly for tv/movies? So, to add music to that I should hook it up otherwise? Is there a middle way? Great videos by the way!
60hz is a great starting point. As far as your sub you won't be able to use it with that reveiver because it doesn't have the form of connection you need. you can use LFE for music, too. IT'll still send bass over.
My Def Techs BP 2000s can go to 15 hz -30 kHz.. so I can set them at maybe 40 hz or 50 hz? The thing is sometimes if I set them to low the room gets too boomy and things start to vibrate in the room.. maybe I should add bass traps and isolators on the bottom of the def techs ?
Yes you have the right idea. If you're using dedicated subwoofers along side the bp2000s it can be hard to tame the bass. Something you'll have to try and play with in your free time.
The most important thing is that bass sounds continuous. For that use a spectral analyzer. And make sure that, from a higher to a lower bass frequency, once the volume goes down it doesn't go up again. Otherwise that gap will sound like a void.
80hz sounds the most accurate imo. When I go to a cinema, 80hz sounds more like what it does at the cinema. When you start tinkering with the sounds, the sound sounds fake and also causes distirtion in bass. Curious to know your thoughts
I'm talking relative to the sound cinema produces. It sounds more like that sounds like. I've experimented over months and years and when playing with the crossovers, it just sounds like sounds I'm not supposed to hear. I'm talking about from more of a movie experience
What cross over should I set on my Yamaha Subwoofer NS SW300, frequency response is 20-160 HZ. I’m using a pair of Triangle Borea 09 speaker with Onkyo RX TZ50.
I'm planning to go Las Vegas for CES 2025. Last time i went like 26 years ago there was a very nice Home Theater display, saw Krell amps and Sunfire $10,000 Subwoofer. I will try to Organize an event for all of us TH-cam Home Theater guys.
@@Kpaceguy Okay I never heard of that show but New to this thing. Las Vegas is always central or easiest for everyone to go (All States) flying or driving. And people like going there on Vacation trips.
@@Kpaceguy Hopefully next year. I was in San Diego those days or the whole week. It's actually our Rental house that was not rented out few years but rental prices very high we will be renting it out by September.
Any subwoofer that has voices coming through it hasn't been set properly. There should never ever be undertones of voices booming from the one sub in a surround sound rig. 100 maybe a tiny bit low but I would have to be looking at mine to be certain. I'm thinking 110-115 but you could be absolutely on the mark so I'm not making any guarantees lol. But other than the exact number I have to completely agree with the statement.
Tbh I never set crossover as I don’t understand all the numbers and just no clue about it I just think well the sub is for the bass and I turn bass down on all the other speakers. I given up trying to understand it. Tbh I am not very smart. I have been into home cinema since the 90’s and I still don’t get it. Although your video has helped a bit I got mordant short mezzo range I will try out what you said when I get home tomorrow and see what I think. Another thing I should mention is I feel for me when I bought these speakers new. I don’t want to spend all that and drain the bass from my good speakers. My front left and right are mezzo 8’s. I bought Polk xt90 for Atmos as the mezzo speaker range didn’t have a dedicated Atmos speaker. I have them up on ceiling and they sound good but not overly impressed. But I have klipsch r41sa sitting in box ready to put up to replace those Polk ones when I get back home tomorrow. Hopefully I will prefer these ones if not wasted my money 😂 but my am receiver is Sony str dn 1080. I only bought this one about a year ago new on sale richer sounds. So it’s still relatively new for me. I bought it in place of my previous Sony which didn’t have Atmos or dts x. Not sure about the Polk ones I feel maybe I went too Budgety on those but then maybe that subtly is perfect for the Atmos. The klipsch ones are two way speakers and a lower wattage. So not sure what to think about all that. But one thing I am thinking the two way speaker klipch ones have to be better than the Polk xt90 which is only 1. Heard that klipsch can be bright I am wanting to hear them. But tbh from what I have heard with this polks (I could hear them and they actually sounded alright) but I suppose I am wanting better than alright but don’t have a huge budget. Sadly what I paid for the polk xt90 and those klipsch ones if I had combined the money I would have been able to buy something better. Also I got only two Atmos channels on that receiver so I can’t use both pairs of these speakers which I think would have been a damn good idea. Btw I should mention I had to turn up the treble and bass on those Polk ones as well as turning up the level for those channels to maximum to actually hear them right. Not happy I had to do that but it definitely improved when i turned up levels full for height/atmos
i just noticed how you have your rear heights mounted on the ceiling. Do you have to have a special custom mounting bracket to do that? I could get an extra set of Klipsch RP500SAs and do that if it's feasible. That would get me a 7.2.4 system. As it is I only have front heights now as my seat is against the back wall (less than a foot away, in any case). I'll probably redo my xos as I have them now all set to 80 Hz.
Not only that, but you can put unnecessary strain on your A/V Receiver if you set the bass too low on the crossover. Using your Cantons as an example, they're capable of going down to 30hz, but if you have a typical $500 A/V Receiver, it will be putting alot of strain pumping out those lower freq's at high volume. (Of course, i'm sure you personally have an Amp/Rec capable of handling high volume with ease....I however do not in my system....) : )
Well depends also on the senstivity of your speakers, some quite sensitive ones are really not that power hungry so it would be hard to overload your receiver with high gain. And that's where the real damage comes from - overloaded receiver cause clipping = constant high current and that will damage them. Not those frequencies !
He didn't even mentioned that. Lower frecuencies eats lots of power, and 95% of users only have an AVR managing all speakers. You can have a tower speakers rated at 30hz, but even if you have a monster of AVR (mine is denon x6400h 2500/3000€), the power rated is just for 2 speakers, so they can't just handle a 7, 9 or 11 speakers full range at reference level. If you have only an AVR without extra amp for your frontal speakers, don't do this test at low sound level, do it a bit higher level you usually listen films (if you usually set the audio at - 15db, do this test at - 10db) otherwise you could have a surprise about how muddy your sistem sounds when you rise the sound level Watching a film.
Lower bass does use more power but ohms rise ALOT as well. So a lot of times your 8 ohm speakers are showing 9, 10 ,11 ohms or more as frequencies play. Very rarely are you at your speakers ohm ratings meaning the amplifier has an easier time than you think
But yeah great video. One of the best explanations I’ve seen on TH-cam. I think crossover is just as much if not more for better sound. Most people wilI not play to the levels that damage their speakers before they damage their ears imo. In any case both are importsnt. I have Bowers and Wilkins 608 s3, a bowers and Wilkins 608 sub, and a marantz cinema 70. I have it set to 60Hz for the crossover because it sounded best. I’m glad to see it fits your recommendation too. 2.1 System Speakers response (where response is flat) is 52Hz - 28kHz (40Hz-33kHz range). Sub response is 32Hz - 140Hz -- Will watch more of your videos and thank you for sharing what you learned
Given what you love for music & home theater you should switch career doing install and setup home theater for people or even have your own company running it. My B&W 700 series frequency response is 46Hz - 28kHz ±3dB with a crossover at 80Hz. For sound clarity, should we pump that up or leave it at this standard frequency?
I have crossover settings for the speakers and the bass separately. What should the bass crossover be set for if my speakers should be at 80 and 250 hz?
@@Kpaceguy oh really? So my lowest speakers go down to 60hz so I’m setting their crossover at 80 so the bass should be at 100? Or at 80 like how I set the speaker?
So, I have a 5.1 set of Eltax. The standing fronts are 45-20.000. I have An Eltax subwoofer. You advice to put the crossover at 60, to start? I like to feel bass and bass drum in my stomach. I use Legend from Bonfire and Tambu from Toto as my reference albums by Deezer. Thanks for your explanation. 👍👍
The one thing I am puzzled by when looking at specs is the whole free field and in-room thing. I have a speaker that says 45hz free field and then 35hz in room......so, which is it?
Your room has an effect on bass. So your speakers capabilities are enhanced. I would still go with 45hz just because your speakers won't really play usable bass that low
@@Kpaceguy Yeah, I figured it meant something like the acoustics change due to surfaces it hits "in room" I already set the crossover at 60hz either way. Thanks
Say there are speakers with a 130~150-20kHz range and is crossed over at 150Hz. Would the subwoofer extract deep tones of dialogue that shouldn’t be there or would it act as a normal subwoofer but more localized when crossovered at 150Hz?
I have some 20 year old Klipsch RF-7 speakers in a 5.1 system. I am looking to upgrade my old RSW 15 sub and have been researching both the REL 1510 and a pair of Rythmik E 15 or F 15. My room is 18 x 18 and 8 ft high. This would be strictly home theater, although I am more interested in hearing music in movies sound as good as my listening room rather than the rattle of most subwoofers. I would be interested in your suggestions.
I have a pair of Klipsch R-41SA for my two front height speakers. The frequency response says 4,237 Hz. My Denon crossover settings are from 40Hz-250Hz. What should I set it to?
Should i leave my speaker crossover at 100hz and large after having calibration done as it has set at this ? And my speakers have built in subwoofers so is it better to stay large ? I have the subwoofer sb1000 and have the phase to 180 in my 5.1 system
I have my speakers set to large, double bass and crossover at 80 so I dont limit the subwoofer. If I set the crossover to 50 the subwoofer will cut off at 50 gets?
My Yamaha receiver allows only one crossover setting for all speakers. My fronts go much lower than surrounds, but I have to use a higher crossover than ideal for the fronts. The YPAO suggests using "large" for the fronts but they only go down to about 50Hz, so will I blow them if they are used as large, or is there a protection within the speakers themselves for low frequencies? There must be some form of protection, or they would blow pretty easily, right? And if it depends on volume, then what volume is critical?
HI I have a Wharfdeale Diamond 12C and the frequency response is 90hz - 20khz.So at what frequency should I set my croosover ?Thank you for your videos very interesthing.
It's a bit funny reading all the threads on AVS Forum for setting LFE 80 HZ or 120 HZ, almost like a debate on how to cook a burger or bbq... Few guys admit 120 HZ is the setting but then they said they put it at 80HZ and their SVS subwoofer sounded better. 5% of movie content is 80-120 HZ i heard and for the 20 HZ and Under I don't know but guessing very few movie scenes are.
@@Kpaceguy thanks a lot will try this out. I was confused about it as I would have thought the “from” number would be lower than the “to” number. But thanks again!
I'm not completely familiar with that model of speaker but I think anything between a 60-80hz crossover would be best. They probably don't play much under 65 herts or so
What would you suggest for a pair of Focal Sopra #3 but with 6x line array SVS Ultra 16 sealed subs. The subs are at 18 to 70 / 50 to 150 / 100 to 300. Speakers are at 50 to 30000. Any suggestions?
I found out on my Onkyo Receiver that i can turn off the LFE crossover, but I can not turn off the Subwoofer crossover just adjust 40-180 HZ. So if using the Dual RCA cables (not LFE) should i put Onkyo receiver at 80 HZ and OSD Trevoce subwoofer crossover at 60 HZ ? I heard using both is bad too.
@@Kpaceguy yes I found out it creates a Cascading effect with both Crossovers working at same time. This also made Violent Scary Bass in San Andreas, Earthquake movie.
@@Kpaceguy read many comments on LFE channel at 120 HZ. They said it's like 5% of Movie content and can make subwoofer more Boomy and mask the low frequency. Also can be Directional sounds.
@gtoutdoors1197 yes but you have the ability to set LFE separate from the subwoofer crossover so set your LFE to 120 and set your sub crossover where you'd like
@@Kpaceguy i read that Dolby starts at 80hz and DTS higher. But everyone in the industry says LFE at 120HZ. THX employees, Dolby employees and Movie Studios too. I watch DTS movie too so I will set LFE Crossover in the Onkyo to 120HZ
Here are my speakers, I have them all set at 60Hz with the sub at 120Hz as that is what sounds good to me despite them being able to dig deeper and the sub higher. I find the same statement true in this hobby, just because you can does not mean you should :) Speakers: All Definitive Technology • L/R: BP9060 • Center CS9080 • Surrounds SR9080 • Atmos DI-8r Main Sub: • PSA V1812
THX employee says 80 HZ is their suggestion, But if you are using small speakers made for 100 HZ or higher then change the 80 HZ to 120 or whatever is safe for them.
I have a pair of 805 d3 says it can go down to 34 hz. What crossover would you set I have a asw 500 sub it’s an older but good one. Any feedback is appreciated
@@Kpaceguy tried it at 50 felt like it was missing something put it up to 60 hz the reference measurements didn’t suit me well I run dual subs matching room placement is best it could be I end up having the volume knobs on the sub set a little before halfway and on my receiver level on my Yamaha a780 set to minus 5.5 db I feel I get the best blend of low end with low end definition no sloppy not too weak there it’s a bit above 75 db spl on the spl meter. Probably in reference test toning a reference level 0 db on the know it’s about 84-87 db.
Hey man love you're videos. So i have an older Klipsch center speaker c1 with cross over 100hz to 24k hz should i set it to 120 hz instead of 80hz? Thanks.
@@Kpaceguy thank you man. And i have 3 Klipsch subs. One 8 inch and 2 12 inch set to LFE. And crossover in avr set to 120hz. Should i lower it to 80 or 100 hz or leave it at 120. And gain it about halfway.
Morning, KP... what menu in the receiver adjust crossover...Level db? or EQ db? Only speaker size and distance is my only other setting option? ...I'm slow, but there's nothing that saying this is crossover setting lol
I double check my crossover on my fronts tech Def BP-8040ST 25hz-30khz I had them set at 80hz. Man I have to really make some of adjustments thanks for the lessons, you make it simple. My Def tech CS9040 50hz-40khz. My CO is 60hz. Def Tech 1000 monitors 80hz. My pair of SVS heights at 80hz I my look into those. I have 1. SVS PB1000 pro and Sun fire sub. Since my Marantz SR-5014 use on the same sub setting LEF for both subs.
But do they sound better than your subwoofer? Do they have less distortion than your subwoofer at 80hz. My jamo s803 is f3 of 58hz and based on measurements in REW I figured out 90hz is the spot where my speakers sound fullest. Just because a speaker is rated for a specific frequency doesn't mean it's capable of it. Plus if you don't have dedicated amps you're robbing yourself of power since AVRs only have a finite amount for all speakers and bass is what's using the most so by not offloading power to a subwoofer amp that might have 1000+w amp you're really doing a disservice to yourself.
Hi K, my speakers frequency response is 44Hz-28kHz (±3dB) so what crossover would you recommend? I was advised by SVS to use 60HZ with my PB16. I think the 80HZ is more for protecting the avr but if you use separates for your front soundstage it shouldn’t matter.
Not exactly. The speakers specs are at 1meter only. You just cannot match what a sub can do with its dedicated 350w amp to a speaker with a small driver and say 100w from the avr. This video is unfortunately misguided
Vast majority of the time, I'm going to say YES! YES IT IS!! With few exceptions, (i.e, Full range powered towers , or mini sat limited response satellites on the other end), the ideal setup for inefficient passive loudspeakers is indeed 80hz cross to a powered sub! Of course there's variables and considerations. However it usuall ends up yielding much more efficiency from the system all around. THX Lucas spent 1000's of hours coming up with that, and it works for a reason! Problems only occur with that setting with setup, room acoustics issues, and speaker /seating placement problems. About the end of story there
Great advice there buddy, I'll be changing mine to 60hz to see what they sound like, they're currently at 80hz Have you got a link about the sub crossover when listening to music.
Thanks for the advice. I run my 5.1 system through some old DCM Cinema2 speakers with a MonoPrice Subwoofer. Here are the frequency specs: Cinema2: Frequency Response: 110Hz - 20kHz Subwoofer: Frequency Response: 25 ~ 250 Hz / Lowpass Crossover Adjustable from 50 ~ 150 Hz Currently I have the Crossover for all speakers at 120Hz with the subwoofer LPF for LFE at 120Hz as well. Should I change the crossover for the Cinema2 speakers to 130Hz to be safe? And if so - should I change the subwoofer settings to match?
Crossover is such an interesting thing. Everyone gets heated in the comments but at the end of the day, it depends on every single factor including room and what you listen to. Personally, mine is set to 40hz as I find my kef q series speakers really struggle with bass (despite having a dedicated subwoofer) (technically the bass response is excellent but the small drivers' ability to carry it the 32 feet of my living room less so) I find no appreciable loss in fidelity and the avr gets roasting hot regardless but it's done it for the last decade every day so... meh
You can use REW and a umik1 to set a more accurate crossover point than guessing. Your room setup and configuration can have an effect on how your speakers play and using REW can help to visualize what response you are getting.
Yep...always 80 if you are not measuring. You are guessing anyway might as well guess safely. I get huge dips at 40 and still pretty bad dips at 60 and my speakers are rated to 40 and my room is partially treated and carpet. My sides and backs don't start to clean up until 90 and look best at 100 and 120. I just wish REW could do Atmos, but it can't so I just set them at 100 even tho they are rated to 80
Yes sound advice
Just setting up my system now, this information is so valuable! I always used to set the crossover at the bottom of the front speakers' range, around 80hz, but this makes so much more sense!! Thanks for the clear and easy to understand explanation!!
@@davepicklyk3198 I appreciate it!
Very informative video. Alot of manufacturers do not give this information
OMG YOU MAKE PERFECT SENSE!!! All my bowers and wilkons I lowered fro 80 to 60hz and WOW,, SO MUCH BETTER. THANK YOU!!!
I appreciate it
THX Kyle, good to get a reminder every now and then of what we set and forget...
"Our ears are always right" and we should learn to trust them more often. Peace.
My Boston satellites are rated 150hz and i have them at 80hz. So stupid i was following some random videos.
Now seeing yours i am able to get an idea of what it has to be set. Will set them at 160 or above and see how it sounds.
Thank you so much for helping many in getting the settings for their speakers.
Best explanation I have ever heard that's what people need to hear look what the frequency their speaker are and set it to 50 or 20 above so it rolls 👍👍👍👍👍
Finally Finally Finally someone explained it the Right way! Great video very easy to understand very well spoken. This is by far the best video out there on crossover Hz. Just saved a bunch of people a ton of money not blowing their speakers. 👍👍
I greatly appreciate it
I think the most significant attribute will be the SPL level that suits your preferences. I am typically happy under 70db and there is not one speaker that is at any risk of damage regardless of frequencies.
THX crossover setting of 80 hz is still best I think even with tower speakers with mid drivers (if you have a sub). It keeps your towers playing the freqs that they are better at reproducing and likewise with the subs. Yes your towers might be able to produce down to 30hz as a manufacturer spec, but wouldnt you want to be passing those lower freqs off to your sub anyways as the sub will sound much better at even 50hz than any towers playing the same freq unless they have their own integrated subs.
Many thanks Kpaceguy for a different way of explaining to understand the crossover and it is very helpful when you put overlay figures on the screen for even a more better understanding on the scale of Hz to KHz 👏👍👊✊ UK
By problem my friend
My Pioneer Elite options are 50HZ, 80Hz, or 100hz and all are global. So I have to set it to 80. I have a problem with brand loyalty so I stick with Pioneer. I don't know why Pioneer sticks with this and doesn't give us more flexibility with crossover selection.
Found that 60z was best fitting for my L/R (they’re rated to 40), 80hz for the center and rears.
Me 2!!! =D
Wow! Perfectly explained for the layman - I now feel totally educated. Massive thx
Thanks for watching
I run my elac unifi at 60.80 hz sounds great but 60 gives my fronts a little more thump in the drivers. More importantly after audessey i have a 10db null in my subs 82 hz so using my fronts to handle the null more and have subs go from 60 down.
I’m so glad you said it “your ears are your best tool” I’m sorry, a graph can’t tell me nothing, but, my ears hear everything!!
‘
You also said, look at your speakers specs and find the frequency response, make your crossover decision from that, which is what I did!
Great video. You explained it very well. I do have just some additional info to share for others in my experience. Although I have 3-way center and surrounds, I have linear 2x SVS PB-1000 pros and I’ve set my crossovers to 80-110hz depending on the speaker.
These surround/center speakers are rated down to 38Hz +/- 3dB, but no way do they put out at 40, 50, 65 or even 90Hz what a good linear subwoofer will do. Let alone a pair of them.
The proof is in the listening. I ran 60-80Hz crossovers for 2 years prior to watching a video that had me raise the crossover. The experience went from 8/10 to 10/10.
That said I do NOT recommend this for cheap nonlinear subwoofers. It will sound boomy/voice will get into the subs etc. Thank you for your video. Love sharing this hobby with likeminded individuals.
My bolkshelfes speakers have minimum frequencies of 40hz, so I did several tests with a frequency of 60 to 90hz, I found that the speakers behave better at 70hz.
I used to do this also...10 - 15 over the rating. But once a bought a umik-1 and started using REW, 80Hz made much more sense if you are guessing. No matter what your speakers rate if you have a good sub you really want it to do all the heavy lifting. Once i started using REW and measuring I saw that below 80 it pretty much was always worse. My front stage loves 80, but my sides are flatter at 120 and my rears are flatter at 100 and all my speakers are towers rated to 40. It was eye opening. And now I know there is no answer if your are not measuring... only guessing. If you can't measure then just go with 80. Buy a $100 mic to throw on a laptop and do some sweeps so you can see your response change when you move the xover. I will never setup my HT again without using REW, a mic, and a miniDSP. miniDSP is a whole other story. WHAT A DIFFERENCE IT MADE.
What exact equipment do I need to do it this way Jerry? I am new here and want to get things set up right. Guessing gives me anxiety man I wanna know for real 😂
True,what a different when you use audyssey mic included with marantz nr1711,my oberon 3 speakers got new sound,i never heard them so good before
I made some adjustments last night since it was late for me to test the crossover. I must say that simple adjustment make a big difference. I am hearing audio I haven't heard before.
I have never heard of anyone else say that the crossover is to protect your speaker from low frequencies. Okay, there is a reason, but it is to protect the tweeters from a weak amp. If the amp is weak and doesn't have enough power, then it can clip which is what damages tweeters. Woofers are hard to damage. Woofers are what pulls power, so if you send less power to the woofers, and instead use the separate amp in your subs, then the AV receiver has more power available for the higher frequencies. This all goes under the category of bass management.
Great video! After playing with all the settings manually, I let the software in my 10 year-old Pioneer THX receiver calibrate everything and set the crossover points. Every now and again I'll revisit and tweak it manually to see if I can improve it but I always end up going back to what the software does. I'll soon be upgrading to a more contemporary receiver with hopefully DIRAC built in and I'm excited to see how that will change things.
Excellent video. Just got a new Integra AVR. Not in love with it yet but could be my settings. Replacing a 12 yr old AVR that didn't have individual cross for each speaker. I have van reading about this and yesterday i was messing with the Hz settings and it did sound fuller and more detailed with lower cross and sub at 120.
I have Paradigm Premier 700F fronts.45-25, 600C Center 60-25 and DT Mythos 6 surrounds 60-30.
Problem is, my receiver does not allow individual crossover settings - it wasn't cheap at $1000 either. So the THX recommended standard of 80 hz is prbably the best setting to support my floorstanding fronts and bookshelf/center surrounds which have a recommended crossover range of 60-80 and 80-100 respectively.
I know you did this video 2 years ago I’m just seeing it now and I a want to think you this video I’m setting up my dedicated home theater and did not know how to set this up also thank you for the subwoofer video that helped
Thanks for watching
Thank you so much. This was a huge help. I have 2 polk psw10 subwoofers. Sounds great for movies but I'm not happy with how they perform with music? I hope you have a suggestion. The listening area is large. So I'm not sure if the 50 watt rms is enough or is it because it's a ported sub. I was thinking about a klipsh 12 inch 400 watt sub
@@johnquinn8796 They don't have a lot of power. If you want a more accurate and powerful subwoofer, look at svs
I’ve got RSL CG5’s. They are rated to 50hz and I have the crossover set at 60hz. I use both speaker level and LFE connections for my sub and it’s crossover at about 80hz.
Liked. At first watching this video I was shaking my head at a lot of what you said. Then half way through the video you finally said what I wanted to hear and where you should have started 😂. That lower rating is not necessarily where the speakers get damaged, its just where they no longer maintain apparent volume for the power given without distortion out of spec. Below this does not mean they will be damaged, but equally important is that above this does not mean they will sound good. 80-Hz is a great crossover “starting point” for most people, but its not where you should stay with exploring options. Just because my speakers go to 40hz does not mean the sub doesn’t do 60-Hz better.
The other variable you miss the point here is whats on the other end? What’s the subs range and where does it sound good?
Do start at 80Hz. Do adjust it based on you speaker’s rating. Do adjust to what sounds great for your seating position (sub performance is spatially variable). And do it at a volume above your normal listening volume.
It really just depends. 80hz was the THX standard because they did a lot of research and it showed most people preferred it there. 80hz gave extra punch to the lower bass notes since both sources were playing it often leading to constructive interference. 80hz and it's surrounding octave are super important for bass guitar and the kick drum. Adding extra emphasis to it allowed for music genres where it wasn't present or was removed considerably through poor mastering (80's hair metal comes to mind). This is also why sub manufacturers always advised to place it in a corner. The corner maybe a decent place depending on your room, but often between the 2 speakers is best for time alignment.
Thanks for the advice I was running a 80Hz X over on everything my fronts are Paradigm founder series a pair of 100 F and C 90 they can go down to 40Hz so I put them to 60Hz my rear surrounds and atmos modules I kept 80Hz subs Paradigm Defiance X 12's I kept at 100 Hz probably going to tweak some more to find spot on
My opinion: get a good set budget. Don’t allow yourself to mismatch speakers. Whether you mismatch companies. Or just speaker size/model. It keeps the sound whole and controlled. That’s why we have subwoofers. It’s my opinion you should always have a even number of subwoofers. Never 1, never 3, never 5... get speakers that can hit 80hz or 100hz comfortably. Sometimes size is something we have to consider. But the overall sound will be very good and very rounded because every speaker is the same exact size and same model/brand. That way when sound effects travel from speaker to speaker it sounds composed and neutral.
Its a contentious subject for sure and there isn't a single straight forward answer, your ears will be the best decider but I wanted to pick up on one thing you mentioned that I don't think is right. Your main speakers, whatever they may be, are designed to emit sound over a wide range of frequencies. Expensive ones do high end and low end really well, cheaper ones are more a jack of all trades master of none. Sub woofers have one job, emit low frequency sound and they are designed to do that well. If you have an average speaker setup, you want that subwoofer handling the low frequency sounds, because invariably they will do it better than your mains. Your contention that you look at your mains frequency specs and set the crossover at somewhere just above that is not allowing the subwoofer do the job it should do and trying to use your mains as somehow emitting low frequency sounds as well as your subwoofer. I contend that's not often the case and you want your low frequency sounds to be handled by the best driver in your system that can emit them so setting your crossover somewhere between 80Hz to 120Hz is more likely to do that. I'd also contend that with a typical subwoofer having its own powered amplifier and not taking away your AV receiver/mains amplifier wattage, you are allowing more power for the rest of the frequencies above the crossover, theoretically giving cleaner sound. I am sure there will be other opinions, but I wanted to give an alternative view to the one presented.
I have Klipsch speakers but I can't set the crossover on each speakers because I have my receiver connected to tv using a digital optical cord so my receiver set to 80 on its own by doing the calibration but when I get a tv that supports earc than I could do that.
Thanks for this. I’m really struggling with my new equipment crossover points and sub as well. Has an LFE setting plus the different frequencies. Searching for that subwoofer video now. 😢
don't forget speakers have internal crossovers too and alot of manufacturs cheap out on them as it costs money to build a good crossover like 500 in just parts so they go to chineese parts alot to keep costs down
Alot of speakers are held back by these crossovers like Sony has a really cheap speaker that the woofers and theaters are amazing but they went extremely cheap on the crossover and once that is upgraded it sounds like a $2000 bookshelf not $150 anymore. How much of a difference it can make depends on the drivers used in your speaker along with how the speaker was braced ect. The rule is what the speaker is sold for it has to cost 1/5th to make.
Is it okay to set my FL and FR floor standing speakers (Focals Aria Evo X No.3) as Large with no Subs only in 2 channel playback settings (Marantz or Denon)?
By the way, great video on explaining crossover settings.
The info was very helpful and UNDERSTANDABLE. Thanks!!
@kennethcoulter791 i appreciate it. Yes If you have no sub it'll automatically set your speakers to large which is fine. Just turn the bass down if you find it too much for your speakers.
I just subscribed to your channel. Keep up the great work!
My Polk speakers have the following detail. Could you please explain what the differences are? Ie what is the difference between overall frequency response and the frequency response. Which value should I use when setting frequency response in my avr. I have Reserve r700 speakers
Overall frequency response 45 Hz-50 kHz 50 Hz-50 kHz 36 Hz-50 kHz
Frequency response (-3 dB limits) 65 Hz-38 kHz
@jimcar53 Overall, frequency response is the response you can expect to get inside a room because of them room. The frequency response is actually what the speaker is comfortable playing at any given time. The overall frequency says that it can play down to 45hz but not that loud.
Audyssey sets my speakers to 40Hz, but they sound progressively more clear (especially voices) as I approach 100Hz. This is where mine are set and sound best in conjunction with my two subwoofers.
I Have SVS Prime Satellites I Have Crossed At 90HZ Along With The SVS Prime Central Channel. I Had The Satellites Crossed At 100HZ But They Sound Better At 90HZ.
I have them also but the prime says it’s 48hz how does yours sound
@everyday_life1991 I Have Since Changed To Prime Bookshelfs For My Front Left & Right Which Are At 80HZ Now. The Prime Satellites Are At 100HZ I Have Those For The Surround Back.
@@djlive86glad I seen this
@@djlive86are they loud and clear how does it sound
@@everyday_life1991 They Sound Great
80hr is good starting point. I have klipsch towers r620,center r52,surround r51 and subwoofer 120 i find increasing the crossover between 80hr and 120hr is better for bass in the subwoofer when i set up ypao in my receiver it set my crossover to 40hr which left the bass in the subwoofer dead so increasing to 90hr brought my sub back to life.You want your sub to handle most of the bass thats whats its for unless you dont have a subwoofer then lower it to 40hr and set speakers to large.
Does the same rule of thumb apply to the subwoofer?
You want an overlap point so if your mains are at 70 the subs might integrate best at around 80.
@@Roof_Pizza thanks man.
@@Adam9306 no problem.
How can you set your crossover using hardware filters ie capacitors and resistors or coil?
That's beyond my knowledge
So close to 20K subscribers. Only 600 to go. Will KPace make it to 20K before 2022!!??!?!
Sure freakin hope so lol under 500 now
If my Bolkshelfe Acoustics speaker responds to minimum frequencies of 40hz... Is it okay to cut the frequency by 90 or 100hz?
Yes assuming you have a sub to take care of everything else
I have done it another way.
All speakers in LARGE, subs in LFE+MAIN, turn Audyssey off, manual eq everything where I make the rolloff slope. MiniDSP for housecurve (6db from 100hz). This gives me a much better impact, and it also sounds clearer.
small settings wound be best if running a sub .small = bass managment large = no bass mangment
@@shaunmeredith652
I have not been able to make all speaker small seting, sound good, until 2 days ago, when I rebuildt my room for the 100th time 🙈🙈🙈
Now, I have one seting with LCR in large (no lfe+main), and one where I cut LCR and surround back (all towers with dual 12 or dual 10" and 300 watts), at 60 hz, the rest at 90hz. Both sound great and measure great. LCR large, sounds slightly more coherent, and is better for music than the seting all small. 😊
My subjective crossover is set mainly according to how bass and front speaker sound me.
What type of speakers are those black and white ones in your room?
thank you.
Canton vento
@@Kpaceguy thank you, again.🫂
I have monitor audio bronze50 main speakers with a Frequency Response: 40-30k Hz (±3dB). Do you mean trying setting it at 60? Also have a svs 1000 classic sub. So how do I hook that up to my receiver? Seen one other video you made about the LFE so I tried that. But you say it's mostly for tv/movies? So, to add music to that I should hook it up otherwise? Is there a middle way? Great videos by the way!
60hz is a great starting point. As far as your sub you won't be able to use it with that reveiver because it doesn't have the form of connection you need. you can use LFE for music, too. IT'll still send bass over.
My Def Techs BP 2000s can go to 15 hz -30 kHz.. so I can set them at maybe 40 hz or 50 hz? The thing is sometimes if I set them to low the room gets too boomy and things start to vibrate in the room.. maybe I should add bass traps and isolators on the bottom of the def techs ?
Yes you have the right idea. If you're using dedicated subwoofers along side the bp2000s it can be hard to tame the bass. Something you'll have to try and play with in your free time.
The most important thing is that bass sounds continuous.
For that use a spectral analyzer. And make sure that, from a higher to a lower bass frequency, once the volume goes down it doesn't go up again. Otherwise that gap will sound like a void.
80hz sounds the most accurate imo. When I go to a cinema, 80hz sounds more like what it does at the cinema. When you start tinkering with the sounds, the sound sounds fake and also causes distirtion in bass. Curious to know your thoughts
Disagree
Disagree
Disagree
I'm not sure cinemas use 80hz
I'm talking relative to the sound cinema produces. It sounds more like that sounds like. I've experimented over months and years and when playing with the crossovers, it just sounds like sounds I'm not supposed to hear. I'm talking about from more of a movie experience
What cross over should I set on my Yamaha Subwoofer NS SW300, frequency response is 20-160 HZ. I’m using a pair of Triangle Borea 09 speaker with Onkyo RX TZ50.
60-80hz
I'm planning to go Las Vegas for CES 2025. Last time i went like 26 years ago there was a very nice Home Theater display, saw Krell amps and Sunfire $10,000 Subwoofer. I will try to Organize an event for all of us TH-cam Home Theater guys.
That's what Mwave is set out to do. I'll be there this weekend!
@@Kpaceguy Okay I never heard of that show but New to this thing. Las Vegas is always central or easiest for everyone to go (All States) flying or driving. And people like going there on Vacation trips.
@@gtoutdoors1197 check out mwave.com
@@Kpaceguy Hopefully next year. I was in San Diego those days or the whole week. It's actually our Rental house that was not rented out few years but rental prices very high we will be renting it out by September.
The better your sub the higher you can set the crossover. There is a reason most subs have settings beyond 100hz.
Any subwoofer that has voices coming through it hasn't been set properly. There should never ever be undertones of voices booming from the one sub in a surround sound rig. 100 maybe a tiny bit low but I would have to be looking at mine to be certain. I'm thinking 110-115 but you could be absolutely on the mark so I'm not making any guarantees lol. But other than the exact number I have to completely agree with the statement.
Tbh I never set crossover as I don’t understand all the numbers and just no clue about it I just think well the sub is for the bass and I turn bass down on all the other speakers. I given up trying to understand it. Tbh I am not very smart. I have been into home cinema since the 90’s and I still don’t get it. Although your video has helped a bit I got mordant short mezzo range I will try out what you said when I get home tomorrow and see what I think. Another thing I should mention is I feel for me when I bought these speakers new. I don’t want to spend all that and drain the bass from my good speakers. My front left and right are mezzo 8’s. I bought Polk xt90 for Atmos as the mezzo speaker range didn’t have a dedicated Atmos speaker. I have them up on ceiling and they sound good but not overly impressed. But I have klipsch r41sa sitting in box ready to put up to replace those Polk ones when I get back home tomorrow. Hopefully I will prefer these ones if not wasted my money 😂 but my am receiver is Sony str dn 1080. I only bought this one about a year ago new on sale richer sounds. So it’s still relatively new for me. I bought it in place of my previous Sony which didn’t have Atmos or dts x.
Not sure about the Polk ones I feel maybe I went too Budgety on those but then maybe that subtly is perfect for the Atmos. The klipsch ones are two way speakers and a lower wattage. So not sure what to think about all that. But one thing I am thinking the two way speaker klipch ones have to be better than the Polk xt90 which is only 1. Heard that klipsch can be bright I am wanting to hear them. But tbh from what I have heard with this polks (I could hear them and they actually sounded alright) but I suppose I am wanting better than alright but don’t have a huge budget. Sadly what I paid for the polk xt90 and those klipsch ones if I had combined the money I would have been able to buy something better. Also I got only two Atmos channels on that receiver so I can’t use both pairs of these speakers which I think would have been a damn good idea.
Btw I should mention I had to turn up the treble and bass on those Polk ones as well as turning up the level for those channels to maximum to actually hear them right. Not happy I had to do that but it definitely improved when i turned up levels full for height/atmos
i just noticed how you have your rear heights mounted on the ceiling. Do you have to have a special custom mounting bracket to do that? I could get an extra set of Klipsch RP500SAs and do that if it's feasible. That would get me a 7.2.4 system. As it is I only have front heights now as my seat is against the back wall (less than a foot away, in any case). I'll probably redo my xos as I have them now all set to 80 Hz.
They came with the svs prime elevations speakers. It's specific to them
Not only that, but you can put unnecessary strain on your A/V Receiver if you set the bass too low on the crossover. Using your Cantons as an example, they're capable of going down to 30hz, but if you have a typical $500 A/V Receiver, it will be putting alot of strain pumping out those lower freq's at high volume. (Of course, i'm sure you personally have an Amp/Rec capable of handling high volume with ease....I however do not in my system....) : )
But if you use separates you should be fine.
Well depends also on the senstivity of your speakers, some quite sensitive ones are really not that power hungry so it would be hard to overload your receiver with high gain. And that's where the real damage comes from - overloaded receiver cause clipping = constant high current and that will damage them. Not those frequencies !
He didn't even mentioned that.
Lower frecuencies eats lots of power, and 95% of users only have an AVR managing all speakers.
You can have a tower speakers rated at 30hz, but even if you have a monster of AVR (mine is denon x6400h 2500/3000€), the power rated is just for 2 speakers, so they can't just handle a 7, 9 or 11 speakers full range at reference level.
If you have only an AVR without extra amp for your frontal speakers, don't do this test at low sound level, do it a bit higher level you usually listen films (if you usually set the audio at - 15db, do this test at - 10db) otherwise you could have a surprise about how muddy your sistem sounds when you rise the sound level Watching a film.
Lower bass does use more power but ohms rise ALOT as well. So a lot of times your 8 ohm speakers are showing 9, 10 ,11 ohms or more as frequencies play. Very rarely are you at your speakers ohm ratings meaning the amplifier has an easier time than you think
Good video. My speakers list both range and response (where the audio curve is flat). Are you saying 15-20 above the range or the response
But yeah great video. One of the best explanations I’ve seen on TH-cam. I think crossover is just as much if not more for better sound. Most people wilI not play to the levels that damage their speakers before they damage their ears imo. In any case both are importsnt.
I have Bowers and Wilkins 608 s3, a bowers and Wilkins 608 sub, and a marantz cinema 70. I have it set to 60Hz for the crossover because it sounded best. I’m glad to see it fits your recommendation too.
2.1 System
Speakers response (where response is flat) is 52Hz - 28kHz (40Hz-33kHz range).
Sub response is 32Hz - 140Hz
--
Will watch more of your videos and thank you for sharing what you learned
Given what you love for music & home theater you should switch career doing install and setup home theater for people or even have your own company running it. My B&W 700 series frequency response is 46Hz - 28kHz ±3dB with a crossover at 80Hz. For sound clarity, should we pump that up or leave it at this standard frequency?
I personally would have it at 60hz
I have crossover settings for the speakers and the bass separately. What should the bass crossover be set for if my speakers should be at 80 and 250 hz?
Rule of thumb is to set it 20hz higher than the lowest rating
@@Kpaceguy oh really? So my lowest speakers go down to 60hz so I’m setting their crossover at 80 so the bass should be at 100? Or at 80 like how I set the speaker?
@@HunterPhenomMakoy what receiver do you have ?
@@Kpaceguy Denton s540bt
@@HunterPhenomMakoy you can put the bass at whatever you prefer. It still won't play much under what your crossover is set to
So, I have a 5.1 set of Eltax. The standing fronts are 45-20.000. I have An Eltax subwoofer. You advice to put the crossover at 60, to start? I like to feel bass and bass drum in my stomach. I use Legend from Bonfire and Tambu from Toto as my reference albums by Deezer. Thanks for your explanation. 👍👍
The one thing I am puzzled by when looking at specs is the whole free field and in-room thing. I have a speaker that says 45hz free field and then 35hz in room......so, which is it?
Your room has an effect on bass. So your speakers capabilities are enhanced. I would still go with 45hz just because your speakers won't really play usable bass that low
@@Kpaceguy Yeah, I figured it meant something like the acoustics change due to surfaces it hits "in room" I already set the crossover at 60hz either way. Thanks
Can i put 80hz subwoofer crossover in denon AVR X1400H? Is that right and is it handle ?
Say there are speakers with a 130~150-20kHz range and is crossed over at 150Hz. Would the subwoofer extract deep tones of dialogue that shouldn’t be there or would it act as a normal subwoofer but more localized when crossovered at 150Hz?
Yes IF you crossover your subwoofer that high as well
I have some 20 year old Klipsch RF-7 speakers in a 5.1 system. I am looking to upgrade my old RSW 15 sub and have been researching both the REL 1510 and a pair of Rythmik E 15 or F 15. My room is 18 x 18 and 8 ft high. This would be strictly home theater, although I am more interested in hearing music in movies sound as good as my listening room rather than the rattle of most subwoofers. I would be interested in your suggestions.
I have a pair of Klipsch R-41SA for my two front height speakers. The frequency response says 4,237 Hz. My Denon crossover settings are from 40Hz-250Hz. What should I set it to?
4237??
Should i leave my speaker crossover at 100hz and large after having calibration done as it has set at this ? And my speakers have built in subwoofers so is it better to stay large ? I have the subwoofer sb1000 and have the phase to 180 in my 5.1 system
No it should typically be set to small
great video, thanks!
You're welcome!
I have my speakers set to large, double bass and crossover at 80 so I dont limit the subwoofer. If I set the crossover to 50 the subwoofer will cut off at 50 gets?
Yes
My Yamaha receiver allows only one crossover setting for all speakers. My fronts go much lower than surrounds, but I have to use a higher crossover than ideal for the fronts. The YPAO suggests using "large" for the fronts but they only go down to about 50Hz, so will I blow them if they are used as large, or is there a protection within the speakers themselves for low frequencies? There must be some form of protection, or they would blow pretty easily, right? And if it depends on volume, then what volume is critical?
Receivers of old used to have protection but I don't know that to be the case anymore
HI I have a Wharfdeale Diamond 12C and the frequency response is 90hz - 20khz.So at what frequency should I set my croosover ?Thank you for your videos very interesthing.
120
I have Revel concerta f36's. What do you recommend 70htz?
20hz above rated frequency
It's a bit funny reading all the threads on AVS Forum for setting LFE 80 HZ or 120 HZ, almost like a debate on how to cook a burger or bbq... Few guys admit 120 HZ is the setting but then they said they put it at 80HZ and their SVS subwoofer sounded better. 5% of movie content is 80-120 HZ i heard and for the 20 HZ and Under I don't know but guessing very few movie scenes are.
Good infos! Thanks
Can i set crossover for front L/R at 60hz and my subs at 120hz or Will they fight each other for who gives bass i dont really understand
You can. They'll just both play the same frequencies between 60 and 120
Btw I checked my speakers frequency response is 35khz - 22khz. Which of these numbers should I add 15 to? Ty
35
@@Kpaceguy thanks a lot will try this out. I was confused about it as I would have thought the “from” number would be lower than the “to” number. But thanks again!
Good morning i am using mk k17s and denon6300h any idea of what the best frequency response is ?
I'm not completely familiar with that model of speaker but I think anything between a 60-80hz crossover would be best. They probably don't play much under 65 herts or so
Mine are at 80Hz except my Atmos speakers are set to 100Hz as that’s their lowest + or - 3db.
What would you suggest for a pair of Focal Sopra #3 but with 6x line array SVS Ultra 16 sealed subs. The subs are at 18 to 70 / 50 to 150 / 100 to 300. Speakers are at 50 to 30000. Any suggestions?
Might not be a bad idea to cross at 80 with a little overlap on the subs
Great info
I found out on my Onkyo Receiver that i can turn off the LFE crossover, but I can not turn off the Subwoofer crossover just adjust 40-180 HZ. So if using the Dual RCA cables (not LFE) should i put Onkyo receiver at 80 HZ and OSD Trevoce subwoofer crossover at 60 HZ ? I heard using both is bad too.
Using both is bad so use one or the other
@@Kpaceguy yes I found out it creates a Cascading effect with both Crossovers working at same time. This also made Violent Scary Bass in San Andreas, Earthquake movie.
@@Kpaceguy read many comments on LFE channel at 120 HZ. They said it's like 5% of Movie content and can make subwoofer more Boomy and mask the low frequency. Also can be Directional sounds.
@gtoutdoors1197 yes but you have the ability to set LFE separate from the subwoofer crossover so set your LFE to 120 and set your sub crossover where you'd like
@@Kpaceguy i read that Dolby starts at 80hz and DTS higher. But everyone in the industry says LFE at 120HZ. THX employees, Dolby employees and Movie Studios too. I watch DTS movie too so I will set LFE Crossover in the Onkyo to 120HZ
Here are my speakers, I have them all set at 60Hz with the sub at 120Hz as that is what sounds good to me despite them being able to dig deeper and the sub higher. I find the same statement true in this hobby, just because you can does not mean you should :)
Speakers: All Definitive Technology
• L/R: BP9060
• Center CS9080
• Surrounds SR9080
• Atmos DI-8r
Main Sub:
• PSA V1812
My Onkyo THX receiver says to use 80 HZ for All Speakers as that's the THX recommendation. I agree that should be 120-150 HZ
THX employee says 80 HZ is their suggestion, But if you are using small speakers made for 100 HZ or higher then change the 80 HZ to 120 or whatever is safe for them.
so my mid range speakers go to 100 hz, would i set them at 125?
Yes
I set mine at 60 hz on my subwoofer and it makes a huge difference. My desktops lowest frequency is 43 hz. Use your ears.
I have a pair of 805 d3 says it can go down to 34 hz. What crossover would you set I have a asw 500 sub it’s an older but good one. Any feedback is appreciated
50hz
@@Kpaceguy tried it at 50 felt like it was missing something put it up to 60 hz the reference measurements didn’t suit me well I run dual subs matching room placement is best it could be I end up having the volume knobs on the sub set a little before halfway and on my receiver level on my Yamaha a780 set to minus 5.5 db I feel I get the best blend of low end with low end definition no sloppy not too weak there it’s a bit above 75 db spl on the spl meter. Probably in reference test toning a reference level 0 db on the know it’s about 84-87 db.
Hey man love you're videos. So i have an older Klipsch center speaker c1 with cross over 100hz to 24k hz should i set it to 120 hz instead of 80hz? Thanks.
yes
@@Kpaceguy thank you man. And i have 3 Klipsch subs. One 8 inch and 2 12 inch set to LFE. And crossover in avr set to 120hz. Should i lower it to 80 or 100 hz or leave it at 120. And gain it about halfway.
@@fierceeagle2003 leave it
Morning, KP... what menu in the receiver adjust crossover...Level db? or EQ db? Only speaker size and distance is my only other setting option?
...I'm slow, but there's nothing that saying this is crossover setting lol
What receiver do you have
Sony STR DH790
@@gbel8985 I'm pretty sure it has it
@@Kpaceguy well, I've redone everything it allows in each menu, I must have done it unbeknownst.
@@gbel8985 it'll say front speaker 80hz, 60hz, 40hz
Rear speakers 80hz, 60hz
Etc.
As long as your speakers aren't set to large
I have 5.1 should i go 7.1? Will they make a big difference in sound?
It will if placed properly
I double check my crossover on my fronts tech Def BP-8040ST 25hz-30khz I had them set at 80hz. Man I have to really make some of adjustments thanks for the lessons, you make it simple. My Def tech CS9040 50hz-40khz. My CO is 60hz. Def Tech 1000 monitors 80hz. My pair of SVS heights at 80hz I my look into those. I have 1. SVS PB1000 pro and Sun fire sub. Since my Marantz SR-5014 use on the same sub setting LEF for both subs.
But do they sound better than your subwoofer? Do they have less distortion than your subwoofer at 80hz. My jamo s803 is f3 of 58hz and based on measurements in REW I figured out 90hz is the spot where my speakers sound fullest. Just because a speaker is rated for a specific frequency doesn't mean it's capable of it. Plus if you don't have dedicated amps you're robbing yourself of power since AVRs only have a finite amount for all speakers and bass is what's using the most so by not offloading power to a subwoofer amp that might have 1000+w amp you're really doing a disservice to yourself.
80hz is soft and deep just the right amount for indoor use. 100hz is a harder and long throw good for outdoor use.
69hz is the crossover to have in your life.
I set my speakers at 90hz I have Krix speakers .
Hi K, my speakers frequency response is 44Hz-28kHz (±3dB) so what crossover would you recommend? I was advised by SVS to use 60HZ with my PB16. I think the 80HZ is more for protecting the avr but if you use separates for your front soundstage it shouldn’t matter.
I would agree with all of that but do what sounds best
Not exactly. The speakers specs are at 1meter only. You just cannot match what a sub can do with its dedicated 350w amp to a speaker with a small driver and say 100w from the avr. This video is unfortunately misguided
Vast majority of the time, I'm going to say YES! YES IT IS!! With few exceptions, (i.e, Full range powered towers , or mini sat limited response satellites on the other end), the ideal setup for inefficient passive loudspeakers is indeed 80hz cross to a powered sub! Of course there's variables and considerations. However it usuall ends up yielding much more efficiency from the system all around. THX Lucas spent 1000's of hours coming up with that, and it works for a reason! Problems only occur with that setting with setup, room acoustics issues, and speaker /seating placement problems. About the end of story there
Great advice there buddy, I'll be changing mine to 60hz to see what they sound like, they're currently at 80hz Have you got a link about the sub crossover when listening to music.
th-cam.com/video/asJW0Aa7p8E/w-d-xo.html
Thanks
No arc settings are great
Thanks for the advice. I run my 5.1 system through some old DCM Cinema2 speakers with a MonoPrice Subwoofer. Here are the frequency specs:
Cinema2: Frequency Response: 110Hz - 20kHz
Subwoofer: Frequency Response: 25 ~ 250 Hz / Lowpass Crossover Adjustable from 50 ~ 150 Hz
Currently I have the Crossover for all speakers at 120Hz with the subwoofer LPF for LFE at 120Hz as well.
Should I change the crossover for the Cinema2 speakers to 130Hz to be safe? And if so - should I change the subwoofer settings to match?
Crossover is such an interesting thing. Everyone gets heated in the comments but at the end of the day, it depends on every single factor including room and what you listen to. Personally, mine is set to 40hz as I find my kef q series speakers really struggle with bass (despite having a dedicated subwoofer) (technically the bass response is excellent but the small drivers' ability to carry it the 32 feet of my living room less so) I find no appreciable loss in fidelity and the avr gets roasting hot regardless but it's done it for the last decade every day so... meh