thankyou for your great presentation, it's pretty clear to be understood. I have a question here, in the video you said that there are positive and negative in this discourse, how do we define them as such? And how about the abnormalities cases, can they be analysed too in this DA? Thankyou and have a great day!
positive stereotypes designate desirable behaviors that one sex is encouraged to display more than the other, while negative stereotypes designate undesirable behaviors that one sex should avoid more than the other. These negative stereotypes often involve characteristics that are undesirable in either sex, but are permitted in one sex, while being proscribed for the other. Now let's move on to the abnormalities cases (lgbtq+), yes! it can be analyzed in discourse analysis, since we have a lot of approach like homophobic discourse, coming out discourse etc etc. Which the implication is that we are not merely considering homophobic language, but also the production of metaphors. Ex: the shift in the meaning of the word "gay". In the past, gay meant feelings of romantic and / or sexual attraction or behavior between individuals of the same sex or gender. But in this decade the word 'gay' has a 'pathetic' meaning. Meanings like this are often used among young people. This shift in meaning may occur because the interpretation of someone who has the same-sex desire is a sad person. It shows inventing a new 'positive' term. Am I made myself clear, zeni?
Great presentation! A big thanks to the presenters. I have one question Whether the use of language can lead to gender discrimination between men and women? Thank you
yes the use of language can lead to discrimination, especially when using degrading language. however, usually the language used can have both positive and negative meanings from where we see the meaning of the language
Enggal Pangestu (18-039) Thank you presenters Great video overall. However, i have a question. Do terms about women or men become derogative because of culture or are they usually derogative by nature? In the video an example of the term cougar was presented and there are different perspectives to define the word. Is this due to the influence of culture? or what do you think?
Thank you for the presenter.. well done✨ Since the 1990s, men and women use language in different setting even for socialization. Why they use language differently? (Please explain and give an example)
People gradually learn how to use language in specific social situations and develop communicative competence. Therefore, language and social norms are dynamic and interconnected. As people use language in respect to these norms, it plays a vital role in manifesting and sustaining social standards and can be a tool for reproducing power relations and gender oppression. Simply said, the differences language use by men and women are due to difference socio-cultural upbringing, boys and girls grow up different ways with different ways of communicating and behaving. For example, Elaborate use of taboo words. The men swear more than women and use more taboo words are widespread. Other example that show the difference degrees between men and women is the way women get addressed by Miss, Mrs., or Ms., while Men are only addressed by Mr., which is a term that shows their gender, not marital status. Unlike men, women's relationships can affect their social status, and they can be judged and qualified based on it. Have I made myself clear?
Yes ma'am there is a word that refer to cougar in Bahasa Indonesia. It is tante, because usually young men called them tante. In this terms Tante usually have a good job, rich, pretty and they are looking for a young men.
Nazila Laila Syifa S. (18-035) What an interesting presentation, thank you presenters! I wonder, what discourses are emerging in a context of workplace when women are in power?
Thank you for the good question, we think the language used by women is the same as that used by men in the workplace when women are in a higher position. Is it clear Syifa?
yes, there has been a growing number of female leaders in the workplace. I think the texts addressing this issue have been positive, more people no longer see women less powerful
Very clear presentation group 3, well done. I wonder, What is gender hierarchy is and is there any ways about how to make/ determine it (in the analysis)? Thank you very much
Gender hierarchy seeks to explain not only why men hold a superior position to women but how each group influences the other. It is differentially ranked and evaluated according to a standard of masculine norms and behavior. The rank which appear in the analysis is based on a feminist critical discourse analyst, 1. young men appear to be placed at the top because they are viewed as physically desirable but also the ones who have the agency to pursue others. 2. Cougars, while framed as attractive, are somewhat further down the hierarchy because they must work at being desirable by following fashions and even then, become objects of desire rather than the more active participants. 3. older men are at the bottom of the hierarchy, being constructed as unacceptable partners. The higher the level position, the more they become superior, and vice versa.
Lutfian H. (18-37) Great presentation!! I want to ask, in discourse, you'll find that there are more derogatory terms for women than men, what do you think caused that? And in the future do you think we can dismantle these stereotypes against women using these various discourse analysis approaches? Thank you
@@susanawidyastuti4982 Thank you ma'am. My essay for the research methodology class is actually similar to this, regarding how femininity is portrayed in a literary work
Thank You Lutfian for the question! Let me answer your question. Because in a few decades, men have mastered all sectors of life so that the language used tends to be biased. Men are expected to be strong and aggressive, women are expected to be docile and deferential, and so the language that men and women use, or have used against them, is often subtly biased along gender lines, even if we don’t overtly notice it. social, cultural, and political aspects influence why in recent times language aimed at women tends to be derogatory. It is likely that in the future stereotypes about women will be better because there are already many women who are more independent and can do the same things as men. In addition, language and gender always change from time to time, there are shifting in meanings in describing gender-related conditions due to changes in their nature. Am I made myself clear?
Ananda Felin (18_22) Good job presenters. I wanna ask a question. Nowadays, society judges people by the languange or words and the intonation they used to say words(languahe). For example, someone who likes to cursing, people will judge she/he bad person etc, a man who used intonation like woman, society will judge he is 'kemayu' What is opinon about this case?
in this case, we cannot control the views of other people towards the language we use, other than that we should instill the thought that we shouldn't judge people based solely on the language they use, even though it's not easy
This is an interesting question. I think there are several logical and fair reasons for this. We shouldn’t judge people for the way they talk and judge them based on the language they speak, their dialect, their accent, or the vocabulary they use cause we have different kinds of people different languages different job roles or different expertise in so many fields which cannot be judged only relying on speaking. Everyone has their own style❤️✨
Apri Rohmanto/18211141008 What an epic presentation, thank you presenters! Among those theories of gender in discourse that had been explained in the slide, what do you think the most convincing or get more attention by the communities? Thank you!
Thank you Apri for the question! I'm sorry that this answer will tend to be biased because it uses my personal opinion. I think all theories are convincing, depending on how we formulate problems, collect data, and infer results and findings. Because each theory has a different object (scope) of research. However if we talk about theory that gets the most attention, I think it is the theory by Robin Lakoff, which stated at her book "Women's Place". Because Lakoff's argument at that time was quite controversial (sampling that was too general), however, her work is credited with turning language and gender into major debates in linguistics and other disciplines, so that the study of discourse and gender have gained interest. In addition, her work is also known for its attention to class, power, and social justice in addition to gender.
Riznadia Fitria Mellani / 18211141017 Great presentation! Good job, presenters! I want to ask a question about masculinity & feminity. There is much discussion about toxic masculinity & toxic feminity. What I want to ask is, is there a "positive masculinity / positive feminity"? and according to you, what are the examples / shapes like ? Thank you☺️
yes, we think there is positive masculinity and feminism. men can express what they feel, for example crying and women can work and be placed in high positions like men.
Aulia Putri (18211141010) What an exellent presentation! The materials are easy to understand. I have a question here, could you give the example of the use of language in the classroom according to Jane Sunderland's theory (Gendered Discourse)?
Thank you Aulia for the response. I'm sorry cause it will be long-answer Sunderland's finding gendered discourse in classroom for example is the picture of teacher at all levels of education talking more to male than female students. In so far, male students sometimes tended to be asked not only more questions, but also more challenging questions, and to be praised and encouraged more, same male students received better attention. This wasn't seen as bias favouritism, but rather as result of male students either being perceived as needing this attention (it can be as a forms of disciplinary). Moreover, in analyzing the use of language, boys’ use of sexist language and stereotypes is rarely challenged by other boys and sometimes it's seen as normal. example: Bob: Hello it’s me again. I’m in control. Rick: Yep. big gay In every all-male group the term ‘gay’ was used frequently in a negative and gratuitous manner to defame other boys and to regulate group membership. Here, as typically, the use of the term did not denote homosexuality, but was used to disempower Bob. The designation ‘gay’ was never explicitly challenged; only through ‘appropriate’ behaviour could heterosexual conformity be proved.
Great presentation all! However i want to ask something, in the ppt it is stated that women and men have different speech like women's is flowery but these days i found that that thing is increased and some women who cursing is normal, what do you think about that, does social changes make it happen or is there any other reasons which make it like that? Thank you Rahmitha 18211141007
Thank you Rahmitha for the question, we think the relationship between language and gender will always change due to social influences and other factors that affect women's language today
Good illustrations! I would like to ask what men's perspectives or perceptions that they could dominate gender discourse in the past? And could you give me examples? Thank you. - Nurul Aulia Devi (18211141006)
Because in a few decades, men have mastered all sectors of life. Men are expected to be strong and independent. And that men can do anything rather than women. Example : stereotype that men have to work and earn money while women stay at home, men can do some hard works like hunting and etc while women tends to do the simple or kemayu? doing households, teaching children etc. is it clear?
@@lovelymoon5187 that makes sense! So men have dominated the gender discourse because they were thinking that they managed to do all things (ofc there is society influences) including language to use. That's great, thanks.
Ahmad Imam Mursyid (18-043)
Thank you presenters, Nice presentation
Good job presenters! ✨
Good presentation! Thank you presenters for the detail explanation. The illustration is great as well 📝
Interesting presentasion. Thank you, presenters. The materials are well-delivered. Congratulations
Interesting! Well done, presenters👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
Great job presenters! Thank youu
What an interesting topic, thanks for the presentation fellas! 😄
Well done, presenters! Thank you for delivering this complex materials become interesting!
Great presentation! Good job, presenters!
Good job on this well-made presentation. It's such an interesting topic. Thank you presenters 👍
Its great and interesting presentation! good job presenters✨
The presenter provide an interesting presentation and explain the topic well. Over all they did a good job with the presentation
Very clear presentation group 3, well done!
Such a great presentation! Thank you presenters!
Good presentation! Thank you for the presenters who give us the details explanation 😊
thankyou for your great presentation, it's pretty clear to be understood.
I have a question here, in the video you said that there are positive and negative in this discourse, how do we define them as such? And how about the abnormalities cases, can they be analysed too in this DA?
Thankyou and have a great day!
positive stereotypes designate desirable behaviors that one sex is encouraged to display more than the other, while negative stereotypes designate undesirable behaviors that one sex should avoid more than the other. These negative stereotypes often involve characteristics that are undesirable in either sex, but are permitted in one sex, while being proscribed for the other.
Now let's move on to the abnormalities cases (lgbtq+), yes! it can be analyzed in discourse analysis, since we have a lot of approach like homophobic discourse, coming out discourse etc etc. Which the implication is that we are not merely considering homophobic language, but also the production of metaphors.
Ex:
the shift in the meaning of the word "gay". In the past, gay meant feelings of romantic and / or sexual attraction or behavior between individuals of the same sex or gender. But in this decade the word 'gay' has a 'pathetic' meaning. Meanings like this are often used among young people. This shift in meaning may occur because the interpretation of someone who has the same-sex desire is a sad person. It shows inventing a new 'positive' term.
Am I made myself clear, zeni?
@@NanaNana-xj2wk Aa… that's very clear Lukluk! Thankyou for your explanations n also providing the examples. (*˘︶˘*).｡.:*♡
Great presentation! A big thanks to the presenters.
I have one question
Whether the use of language can lead to gender discrimination between men and women?
Thank you
yes the use of language can lead to discrimination, especially when using degrading language. however, usually the language used can have both positive and negative meanings from where we see the meaning of the language
Enggal Pangestu (18-039)
Thank you presenters
Great video overall. However, i have a question. Do terms about women or men become derogative because of culture or are they usually derogative by nature?
In the video an example of the term cougar was presented and there are different perspectives to define the word. Is this due to the influence of culture? or what do you think?
Great explanation, thank you presenters!
Well done presenters! It's a great presentation💫
Thank you for the presenter.. well done✨
Since the 1990s, men and women use language in different setting even for socialization.
Why they use language differently? (Please explain and give an example)
People gradually learn how to use language in specific social situations and develop communicative competence. Therefore, language and social norms are dynamic and interconnected. As people use language in respect to these norms, it plays a vital role in manifesting and sustaining social standards and can be a tool for reproducing power relations and gender oppression. Simply said, the differences language use by men and women are due to difference socio-cultural upbringing, boys and girls grow up different ways with different ways of communicating and behaving.
For example, Elaborate use of taboo words. The men swear more than women and use more taboo words are widespread. Other example that show the difference degrees between men and women is the way women get addressed by Miss, Mrs., or Ms., while Men are only addressed by Mr., which is a term that shows their gender, not marital status. Unlike men, women's relationships can affect their social status, and they can be judged and qualified based on it.
Have I made myself clear?
Super clear! Thank you, presenter🙇♀️
Rizkiana A. (18-031)
Nice presentation and animation, good job to all presenters
Thanks presenters. In Bahasa Indonesia, what word would people use to refer to cougar?
Yes ma'am there is a word that refer to cougar in Bahasa Indonesia. It is tante, because usually young men called them tante. In this terms Tante usually have a good job, rich, pretty and they are looking for a young men.
Nazila Laila Syifa S. (18-035)
What an interesting presentation, thank you presenters!
I wonder, what discourses are emerging in a context of workplace when women are in power?
Thank you for the good question, we think the language used by women is the same as that used by men in the workplace when women are in a higher position. Is it clear Syifa?
yes, there has been a growing number of female leaders in the workplace. I think the texts addressing this issue have been positive, more people no longer see women less powerful
Very clear presentation group 3, well done.
I wonder, What is gender hierarchy is and is there any ways about how to make/ determine it (in the analysis)?
Thank you very much
Gender hierarchy seeks to explain not only why men hold a superior position to women but how each group influences the other.
It is differentially ranked and evaluated according to a standard of masculine norms and behavior.
The rank which appear in the analysis is based on a feminist critical discourse analyst,
1. young men appear to be placed at the top because they are viewed as physically desirable but also the ones who have the agency to pursue others.
2. Cougars, while framed as attractive, are somewhat further down the hierarchy because they must work at being desirable by following fashions and even then, become objects of desire rather than the more active participants.
3. older men are at the bottom of the hierarchy, being constructed as unacceptable partners.
The higher the level position, the more they become superior, and vice versa.
@@adelliadinda1760 aa.. Understood, thank you
Lutfian H. (18-37)
Great presentation!! I want to ask, in discourse, you'll find that there are more derogatory terms for women than men, what do you think caused that? And in the future do you think we can dismantle these stereotypes against women using these various discourse analysis approaches? Thank you
this is interesting and can be a topic for your skripsi.
@@susanawidyastuti4982 Thank you ma'am. My essay for the research methodology class is actually similar to this, regarding how femininity is portrayed in a literary work
Thank You Lutfian for the question!
Let me answer your question. Because in a few decades, men have mastered all sectors of life so that the language used tends to be biased. Men are expected to be strong and aggressive, women are expected to be docile and deferential, and so the language that men and women use, or have used against them, is often subtly biased along gender lines, even if we don’t overtly notice it. social, cultural, and political aspects influence why in recent times language aimed at women tends to be derogatory. It is likely that in the future stereotypes about women will be better because there are already many women who are more independent and can do the same things as men. In addition, language and gender always change from time to time, there are shifting in meanings in describing gender-related conditions due to changes in their nature.
Am I made myself clear?
@@NanaNana-xj2wk Crystal. Thank you for the answer!
Ananda Felin (18_22)
Good job presenters. I wanna ask a question.
Nowadays, society judges people by the languange or words and the intonation they used to say words(languahe). For example, someone who likes to cursing, people will judge she/he bad person etc, a man who used intonation like woman, society will judge he is 'kemayu'
What is opinon about this case?
in this case, we cannot control the views of other people towards the language we use, other than that we should instill the thought that we shouldn't judge people based solely on the language they use, even though it's not easy
This is an interesting question. I think there are several logical and fair reasons for this.
We shouldn’t judge people for the way they talk and judge them based on the language they speak, their dialect, their accent, or the vocabulary they use cause we have different kinds of people different languages different job roles or different expertise in so many fields which cannot be judged only relying on speaking. Everyone has their own style❤️✨
Apri Rohmanto/18211141008
What an epic presentation, thank you presenters!
Among those theories of gender in discourse that had been explained in the slide, what do you think the most convincing or get more attention by the communities? Thank you!
Thank you Apri for the question!
I'm sorry that this answer will tend to be biased because it uses my personal opinion. I think all theories are convincing, depending on how we formulate problems, collect data, and infer results and findings. Because each theory has a different object (scope) of research. However if we talk about theory that gets the most attention, I think it is the theory by Robin Lakoff, which stated at her book "Women's Place". Because Lakoff's argument at that time was quite controversial (sampling that was too general), however, her work is credited with turning language and gender into major debates in linguistics and other disciplines, so that the study of discourse and gender have gained interest. In addition, her work is also known for its attention to class, power, and social justice in addition to gender.
@@NanaNana-xj2wk exellent answer, thank you luklukkk
Riznadia Fitria Mellani / 18211141017
Great presentation! Good job, presenters! I want to ask a question about masculinity & feminity. There is much discussion about toxic masculinity & toxic feminity. What I want to ask is, is there a "positive masculinity / positive feminity"? and according to you, what are the examples / shapes like ? Thank you☺️
yes, we think there is positive masculinity and feminism. men can express what they feel, for example crying and women can work and be placed in high positions like men.
Aulia Putri (18211141010)
What an exellent presentation! The materials are easy to understand.
I have a question here, could you give the example of the use of language in the classroom according to Jane Sunderland's theory (Gendered Discourse)?
Thank you Aulia for the response. I'm sorry cause it will be long-answer
Sunderland's finding gendered discourse in classroom for example is the picture of teacher at all levels of education talking more to male than female students. In so far, male students sometimes tended to be asked not only more questions, but also more challenging questions, and to be praised and encouraged more, same male students received better attention. This wasn't seen as bias favouritism, but rather as result of male students either being perceived as needing this attention (it can be as a forms of disciplinary). Moreover, in analyzing the use of language, boys’ use of sexist language and stereotypes is rarely challenged by other boys and sometimes it's seen as normal.
example:
Bob: Hello it’s me again. I’m in control.
Rick: Yep. big gay
In every all-male group the term ‘gay’ was used frequently in a negative and gratuitous manner to defame other boys and to regulate group membership. Here, as typically, the use of the term did not denote homosexuality, but was used to disempower Bob. The designation ‘gay’ was never explicitly challenged; only through ‘appropriate’ behaviour could heterosexual conformity be proved.
@@NanaNana-xj2wk Aah understood, it's clear enough. Thank you for answering my question lukluk🥰
Great presentation all! However i want to ask something, in the ppt it is stated that women and men have different speech like women's is flowery but these days i found that that thing is increased and some women who cursing is normal, what do you think about that, does social changes make it happen or is there any other reasons which make it like that? Thank you
Rahmitha 18211141007
Thank you Rahmitha for the question, we think the relationship between language and gender will always change due to social influences and other factors that affect women's language today
@@ramadhani1851 thank you dhani for the answer 👍
Thanks presenter! I would love to know the context of gender discourse when it comes to Transgender. To be honest, It keep bugging me for ages.
Thank you for your question.
We are so sorry, actually we're still looking for the word when it comes to transgender.
Good illustrations! I would like to ask what men's perspectives or perceptions that they could dominate gender discourse in the past? And could you give me examples? Thank you.
- Nurul Aulia Devi (18211141006)
Because in a few decades, men have mastered all sectors of life. Men are expected to be strong and independent. And that men can do anything rather than women.
Example : stereotype that men have to work and earn money while women stay at home, men can do some hard works like hunting and etc while women tends to do the simple or kemayu? doing households, teaching children etc. is it clear?
@@lovelymoon5187 that makes sense! So men have dominated the gender discourse because they were thinking that they managed to do all things (ofc there is society influences) including language to use. That's great, thanks.
Good presentation! The presenters explain this topic very well. Thankyou!!