BEST Core Troops!? Archers Review & Deep Dive! | Empire | Warhammer The Old World
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I like the idea of having 1-2 small units of Archers with scout, harassing the flanks and backfield. Fire and Flee archers skirmishing ahead of the main force combined with Knights awaiting in the backfield... Lore accurate Talabeclander woodsmen at work!
You don't really need the "fire and flee". Their shots will do absolutely nothing anyway. Just flee and save the points for something that can actually make a difference damage-wise.
Enjoying these unit deep dives, but her is something to be aware of from the FAQ:
"Q: Can a unit that deploys using the Scouts special rule make a
Vanguard move?
A: No."
So not quite as much movement shenanigans as they appear to have,I'd still want some in an army though I think🙂
Love this! I'm literally changing my army lists every time you make a video
It always comes down to the ... archer and his... wood? Hm...
You do some great content.
Your vidoes on the guards in 40k are awesome, but I never suspected you to be somebody interested in the old world.
Personally I’m happy that you are, sonce you really get your morivation to the people and it just feels great to watch you talk about strategies
Loving the paint scheme!
Time to play a Stirland themed army with only Archers
What do you think about a 45pt captain with 25pt Dragon Bow upgrade joining a unit of archers. S6 AP-2 Multiple Wounds (2) suddenly those tough war machines start to pay attention. Unit gets 1 extra leadership and immune to panic. Unfortunately the captain wouldn't gain the scout and vanguard right ? at least as far as i can see in the rules.
Have you thought about doing higher-level faction first takes? What looks good, what’s going to struggle, tips and tricks and the like. To complement these unit deep dives.
Coming soon!
@@MordianGlory Yay!
Nice yellow Archers!!
They are good as screeners for your more squishy infantry and redirecters for frenzied/impetous troops. But you can't rely on them for anything else and shouldn't overdo it.
Max 2 units in the army, maybe 1 scouts, no fire and flee, as cheap as possible.
Wish models weren't out of stock
Can you fire and flee as a detachment reaction? no down side. shoot em, let you big block deal with the melee.
What do you think about Empire army compared to others in TOW?
Alright, someone needs to calculate the minimum squad size required to consistently deal 1-2 wounds per volley, and then find the cost of that squad + scout + fire and flee. You now have a plug and play light skirmish unit with tricks! 90points for 10 isn't too bad really.
Edit: I could see taking an entire battle line of these guys!! Scout + Vanguard + Skirmishers has insane potential!!!!!!!!!!!!
It really doesn't. You'd be wasting your points on units that can barely cause a wound and will melt away at the mere notion of melee.
They're screening chaff. And for that job alone, they're excellent.
Also if you scout you can't vanguard
@@Emanon... Thank you Mr Genius for explaining to me, exactly what I already knew.
"They're screening chaff. And for that job alone, they're excellent."
Yes. Yes they are. This is what makes me excited. You use them as your line. And fill your elites and heavies with the killing units. These guys then act as total bastards, and fuck with your opponents deployment and movement.
@@jamesespinosa690
No need to be obnoxious.
You wrote that you wanted an entire battle line of scout skirmishers that would be very bad at both shooting and melee. By definition, that makes using them as "not chaff", which they're ill suited for.
Do whatever the hell you want, but don't be surprised when you'll be slaughtered for being a "Mr Genius".
Always helpful love it never can get enough of you
Having used 2 units of 10 Archers with Fire&Flee and Scouts upgrades in all my 3 TOW games so far, I have to concede, they do look good on paper and in theory. But in practice and depending on the job, they either lack bodies and/or Punch compared to other armies scouts and skirmishers. Let me explain briefly : WarMachine Hunters - what exactly can 5 or 10 S3 Warbows hitting usually on 5s if not 6ses do against a T7 Warmachine ? Right: only blocking it's path of shooting for one turn...IF there's enough space to put 5 or 10 Archers in skirmish-formation 12" away in fron of them. Other than that...nothing. They cannot charge in the first turn either.
Fire& Flee: VERY situational and VERY much depending on terrain and enemies deployment.. most people I play know exactly what to do when learning what my archers "could" do.
Hunting other skirmishers: can work..depends on the abilities of those. I managed to regularly charge with my Archers a bunch of Shadowblades. They hat killed 4 of my 10 Archers first in close distance. But the survived their LS Test with exactly 7. Charging more than 3" brought their Ini on par with the DE and, lucky dice, managed to kill 4 out of the five DE while I lost only one Archer..so the remaining 1 DE fled through a forest..later he fled ftom the table.
Other than this event, most attempts of my archers to do something usefull ended in them being wiped out or fleeing from the table...so here we are. It's a lot with several units, not only empire, were rules look interesting when reading but once ob the table they turnout to be quite situational.. like many of such rules in AoS. So I really wonder, how many games the devs played before a rule was allowed for to be included in the game...In general, my personal opinion is, they have tested a: very little and b: not thorougly enough with the big elephant in the room, the comp players...hence all those nasty surprises on certain OP builts, "Line-Hammer" etc. Also they seem not had in mind practicalities like : Oh were do I find this ? Rulebook or Atmybooks ? And if the book is clear, where in there...infact if compared with other editions, given the fact they took 4 years to figure out a game they had published for almost 40 years, I find this more and more dissappointing with every game I play...sorry but that is how I feel , contrary to all the hype out there about a rules almost nobody except some duehard rank&file players talked about anymore just 6 months before..
Yeah, well, you know, that's just like, your opinion, man.
I'm only speaking from experience from fantasy battles(just got the new rulebook yesterday): the ranged skirmishers had a role of dominating terrain and tempting enemy units to charge them and get stuck in said terrain.
If the terrain was not favourable they were good to prevent a free wheel into the flank (as they match the direction of the charging unit). So you will likely lose your skirmishers, but will prevent the enemy unit from hiding it's own flank as effectively.
Depending on the army they could be good as a body guard for a cc character (or wizard). The manoeuvrability gained is incredibly powerful if combined with an additional standard ranked unit, or even a cavalry unit.
Other than this they're extremely good screening units. Also good for squeezing in between units. And the cheeky 'amoeba formation': having a character/monster floating inside a ring of skirmishers that they can charge/shoot through without penalty, but the enemy has to charge/shoot the skirmishers. (Greatly depends on the units involved).
Archers 100P
Cant target war machine crew. You have to shoot vs T5.
😊
So far Empire archers have been the most useless units in my army. BS 3, Str 3 with no AP just leaves them struggling to score any wounds even with large barrages. Volley fire only working for half the second rank means you're still wasting several models unless you operate in a single rank in which case you're paying for volley fire without getting any benefit. State Missile troops just seem to be a straight upgrade due to the S4 and AP they can bring. Ah but what about that mobility? Well yeah, but they lack quick shot so using any movement drops your potential damage output even further. About the only job I might give them is as a cheap 5 unit to try to bait units, but 35 pts for 5 models (more if you want scouts or fire & flee) is still not exactly cheap.
How are you deploying then? Since these guys are meant to be on the flanks and with you do take them with the Scout ability still keep them on the flanks and take pot shots at your opponent's artillery of other rear units. Also take them in sizes of 15 or 20 men units since this will give your opponent something that they will have to deal with. Five man units will not even get my attention since I know that they can't do a thing. Also forget upgrading one to a Marksman since that make that one cost nearly double for no real gain. If his leadership would be 8 then yes but since they are only 7 they will break far to easy.
I have 60 Archers for my Empire army, but I also have 60 Crossbowmen and 120 Handgunners (been collecting for three decades) but I have 100 Spearmen & 100 Swordsmen to back them up.
As for the Fire & Flee I would not take since most of the time you probably will not be able to use it and fleeing means that the unit will end up with their backs to the enemy. Scouts yes Fire & Flee never.
Stop it or I'll end up buying an empire army 😭