Nice video, I am some months behind you as I just got my cremina and am very much still learning. So videos like this have been really useful. We've definitely experienced our share of stalled/clogged shots that require us to turn off the machine, depressurize with the steam wand, and start over. Pretty interesting to see your very light 'fingertip pressure' tamping as it possibly correlates to clogging. I see advice in so many places about 15# or 33# etc tamping pressure but I too have had better results with a lighter tamp. I also haven't been able to grind as fine as I'd like to on our new Niche Zero without clogging. We are well out of the 'espresso' range according to the grinder (10-20 setting) and are currently at 30. I know you talk about possibly needing to go coarser in this video but I think we are maybe so coarse that we are leaving flavor on the table. My next experiment will probably be a finer grind, but with a light tamp + a very long bloom/preinfusion as I've never let it go as long as you discuss in this video. Just got our bottomless portafilter and temperature strips today (but still need to attach one).
Another thought on tamping/pressure/clogging. I wonder if you have tried adding a filter paper to the bottom of your basket? I've seen it discussed a few places, and just saw this very nerdy writeup about it: coffeeadastra.com/2021/04/04/how-a-paper-filter-below-an-espresso-puck-affects-hydraulic-resistance/
That’s a very interesting experience. For me, light tamping works best. I don’t have a niche so I can’t compare. But I just let it preinfuse for a while and it seems to fix a lot.
@@coffeewitharthur426 Right on. I tried today with a finer grind (20 on the Niche) and let it do a long preinfuse until I saw '4 drips' as I've seen you do in some of your dialing in videos. I then eased on for a bit and then did a full pull. Easily my best shot on this machine yet. Thanks for the videos.
Great videos Arthur! I really appreciate you taking the time to go into detail what you’re doing and how that is changing the flavor, as dialing in coffee can be difficult and frustrating. I’m looking to buy a Cremina soon and I’ve got a question for you. I notice that in your original Cremina review, you had the pressure piston kit installed, while in this video, it’s not installed. I’ve seen some reviewers say it’s an important purchase with the Cremina, and others say it’s not necessary. The piston kit isn’t cheap… do you think it’s a necessary addition?
hey matthew! thanks for your message. im sorry i just saw this now (busy at work) actually this is going to be the next video i do. short answer: I think it is absolutely necessary in the beginning. Why i think its necessary: because you get acclimated to what X-bar pressure feels like. I thought i was hitting 9 bar when i was doing close to 12-13 after putting on the pressure gauge. Theres nothing else that can really tell you what pressure youre at. (i will tell you though, that once you go over 9 bars of pressure you will start to tip over the machine if youre pulling down on only the lever) why do i say only in the beginning, 1. because you develop the muscle memory for it, you can kind of know what kind of pressure youre pulling. 2. flow rate is more important in my experience. i found that i was looking at the pressure gauge trying to get to a specific pressure level, and in the meantime i was getting way too high flow rates and it was messing my shots up. so i decided to take it off and go by feel (but i couldnt have done that without installing it) and actually, for future videos i put it back on so you guys can see what pressures im pulling (since you cant see the force in my arm)
Thanks for asking! For water temp, yes. ButThats the brew head temperature. Not the water temperature. I cant know the temperature of the water so I go by grouphead temp. The cooler the group head, the more it cools down the water
thanks! The preinfusion is about 1-1.5 bars. the infusion of the pull? im not too sure but i used to have the pressure gauge on it and it felt around 6-7 bar. the machine starts to tip over at 9 bar if you dont hold both handles
It’s 85 on my temperature strip. The water itself is a lot hotter I just don’t know how to measure it, so I’m going by what I can measure. The higher the temperature of the grouphead, the less the water will cool down.
@Marco Mathies that’s a nice thing to consider. I think I can get a proxy for the temp using the group head. To me, i dont need to know the absolute temperature as long as I know it corresponds to the group head temperature.
oh yeah the pavonis idle around .8 or .9 for me. they are a little bit lower than the cremina but it makes a big difference. you can always take off the base and adjust the PID to make it a bit hotter.
@@coffeewitharthur426 i already did it , many times🤣 One thing i don't like is that the lever now (1.0 bar) is heavier to set it up, but push much more water in the head
Great video. One question however: why did you say you needed to purge some beans when you only changed the grinder setting between the two shots? You were using the same beans,…so I’m just wondering why the need to “purge”?
hey man! thanks for the question. some grounds are retained in the grinder, so if you just change to the new setting and then grind, you'll get a mix of some old grounds with new grounds. the grind setting will be uneven and will not be ideal so to make sure i have all the same grind-size, i purge some in between. for the JX pro its about .5-1gm
@@coffeewitharthur426 I know, I did, very interesting stuff. I was more thinking about the "pull the lever up to horizontal, before inserting the filter at all, and then pull (to avoid breaking the puck)" or experiments with Fellini pulls for longer yields.
Many errors in the video. Deeper basket/ narrower basket requires a coarser grind rather than finer. Also 49mm is not wider than 58mm but rather deeper. Such long PI can in no way give you a good shot
Nice video, I am some months behind you as I just got my cremina and am very much still learning. So videos like this have been really useful. We've definitely experienced our share of stalled/clogged shots that require us to turn off the machine, depressurize with the steam wand, and start over. Pretty interesting to see your very light 'fingertip pressure' tamping as it possibly correlates to clogging. I see advice in so many places about 15# or 33# etc tamping pressure but I too have had better results with a lighter tamp.
I also haven't been able to grind as fine as I'd like to on our new Niche Zero without clogging. We are well out of the 'espresso' range according to the grinder (10-20 setting) and are currently at 30. I know you talk about possibly needing to go coarser in this video but I think we are maybe so coarse that we are leaving flavor on the table. My next experiment will probably be a finer grind, but with a light tamp + a very long bloom/preinfusion as I've never let it go as long as you discuss in this video.
Just got our bottomless portafilter and temperature strips today (but still need to attach one).
Another thought on tamping/pressure/clogging. I wonder if you have tried adding a filter paper to the bottom of your basket? I've seen it discussed a few places, and just saw this very nerdy writeup about it: coffeeadastra.com/2021/04/04/how-a-paper-filter-below-an-espresso-puck-affects-hydraulic-resistance/
That’s a very interesting experience. For me, light tamping works best. I don’t have a niche so I can’t compare. But I just let it preinfuse for a while and it seems to fix a lot.
@@coffeewitharthur426 Right on. I tried today with a finer grind (20 on the Niche) and let it do a long preinfuse until I saw '4 drips' as I've seen you do in some of your dialing in videos. I then eased on for a bit and then did a full pull. Easily my best shot on this machine yet. Thanks for the videos.
I’m glad it helped. This is just the beginning of amazing coffee :)
Great videos Arthur! I really appreciate you taking the time to go into detail what you’re doing and how that is changing the flavor, as dialing in coffee can be difficult and frustrating.
I’m looking to buy a Cremina soon and I’ve got a question for you. I notice that in your original Cremina review, you had the pressure piston kit installed, while in this video, it’s not installed. I’ve seen some reviewers say it’s an important purchase with the Cremina, and others say it’s not necessary. The piston kit isn’t cheap… do you think it’s a necessary addition?
hey matthew! thanks for your message. im sorry i just saw this now (busy at work)
actually this is going to be the next video i do.
short answer:
I think it is absolutely necessary in the beginning.
Why i think its necessary:
because you get acclimated to what X-bar pressure feels like. I thought i was hitting 9 bar when i was doing close to 12-13 after putting on the pressure gauge.
Theres nothing else that can really tell you what pressure youre at. (i will tell you though, that once you go over 9 bars of pressure you will start to tip over the machine if youre pulling down on only the lever)
why do i say only in the beginning,
1. because you develop the muscle memory for it, you can kind of know what kind of pressure youre pulling.
2. flow rate is more important in my experience. i found that i was looking at the pressure gauge trying to get to a specific pressure level, and in the meantime i was getting way too high flow rates and it was messing my shots up.
so i decided to take it off and go by feel (but i couldnt have done that without installing it)
and actually, for future videos i put it back on so you guys can see what pressures im pulling (since you cant see the force in my arm)
Hello, thanks for your video.
Isn't 85 C very low for a light roast?
Thanks for asking! For water temp, yes. ButThats the brew head temperature. Not the water temperature.
I cant know the temperature of the water so I go by grouphead temp. The cooler the group head, the more it cools down the water
great video, do you happen to know what pressure that is at during the pre-infusion? Thanks.
thanks!
The preinfusion is about 1-1.5 bars. the infusion of the pull? im not too sure but i used to have the pressure gauge on it and it felt around 6-7 bar. the machine starts to tip over at 9 bar if you dont hold both handles
Why such low temperature (85°C)? I have never tried below 90. Shouldn't higher temp mean higher extraction?
It’s 85 on my temperature strip. The water itself is a lot hotter I just don’t know how to measure it, so I’m going by what I can measure.
The higher the temperature of the grouphead, the less the water will cool down.
@Marco Mathies that’s a nice thing to consider. I think I can get a proxy for the temp using the group head. To me, i dont need to know the absolute temperature as long as I know it corresponds to the group head temperature.
Happy new year my friend
Is it possible to know the boiler pressure that you had in this video?
its 1.1 bar
oh yeah the pavonis idle around .8 or .9 for me. they are a little bit lower than the cremina but it makes a big difference. you can always take off the base and adjust the PID to make it a bit hotter.
@@coffeewitharthur426 i already did it , many times🤣
One thing i don't like is that the lever now (1.0 bar) is heavier to set it up, but push much more water in the head
Great video. One question however: why did you say you needed to purge some beans when you only changed the grinder setting between the two shots? You were using the same beans,…so I’m just wondering why the need to “purge”?
hey man! thanks for the question.
some grounds are retained in the grinder, so if you just change to the new setting and then grind, you'll get a mix of some old grounds with new grounds. the grind setting will be uneven and will not be ideal
so to make sure i have all the same grind-size, i purge some in between. for the JX pro its about .5-1gm
@@coffeewitharthur426 ah. Gotcha. That totally makes sense.
love the look of that machine. hate the price :D
i know. buy once cry once
@@coffeewitharthur426 then smile a lot hopefully 😊
Everyday :) I’ve never experienced a machine bringing me so much joy before
Have the way you pull a shot changed significantly since you made this video?
Sometimes I pull a 3 bar preinfusion for darker beans. You can watch my latest video about it
@@coffeewitharthur426 I know, I did, very interesting stuff. I was more thinking about the "pull the lever up to horizontal, before inserting the filter at all, and then pull (to avoid breaking the puck)" or experiments with Fellini pulls for longer yields.
@@KarstenLangPedersen oh I see no haven’t noticed any difference between raising the lever first or not.
Many errors in the video.
Deeper basket/ narrower basket requires a coarser grind rather than finer. Also 49mm is not wider than 58mm but rather deeper. Such long PI can in no way give you a good shot