Wow!!! This was mind-blowing. There are so many disparate elements that you put into context here. You guys are, hands down, THE BEST Asoiaf theorists out there! The connections you drew between Al-Andalos, the Moors, the Rhone and their parallels in the books... Brilliant. I'd connected the Rhone with the Rhoyne, the Andals with Al-Andalos but the connections seemed so arbitrary until I saw this... Amazing work you guys!
Can I just say this about that, Indira Varma's scream when Oberyn died was absolutely the best scream ever captured on film. I know, off topic but every time I think of anything Martell is comes to mind.
Now that I think about Doran, what the f*** was he thinking sending Quintyn to Essos and Oberyn to King's Landing? Even Tyrion questioned his senses. If he sent the impressive, adventurous and brave Oberyn to Dany and her dragons under some pretext of him visiting Essos for fun, and sending Quentyn to King's Landing, I think the Meereen arc wouldn't have been as horribly boring. And Quentyn is more suited for the small council without getting himself burned by dragonfire, as is Oberyn more suited for fire and blood.
Redzak Ts true that's why Order thinks Doran may commit kinslaying or wants to get rid of his older children to seat Trystane on the throne. Just like Cercei hating Tyrion for being Valonqar, Arianne was obsessed with Quentyn when Trystane was the real danger to her birth right
Redzak Ts also is it just me but how come trystane personality is never talked about we actually don't know what type of person he is the only thing we get on him is from a knight who slept with the heir to dorne when she should've been harding his ward
This was AWESOME! And LOL. Having just finished the books, for show-only consumers, I guarantee you they know nothing of Dorne and certainly Doran Martel is absolutely “confusing“.
What i like about this channel is bringing up the improtance of the order of the greenhand. Nobody else talks about this except for aegon roasted them and not much else. I bet when winds of winrer comes out and we get more of the greenhand. Everyone will look dumb for not talking about them more. Its all azor azai and where jon or dany will end up. George said they make up 10 percent of thr story. Thats at least 90 percent of the story missing
Technically, the Valyrians were most likely same as the Rhoynar when it came to equilibrium rights as Dark Sister was confirmed to forged specifically for a woman
As I read through the World of Ice and Fire, there was so much that made no sense, but I figured the details had been muddled and changed over the years. This puts a very fine point on a lot of things that made no sense about Nymeria and Doran.
I've been waiting so long for a video about the other great schemer in asoiaf, and you guys didn't disappoint. The best asoiaf channel on youtube. It is known
Great stuff. Now looking at the pictures of Doran, i keep picturing Darth Sidius sitting in his emperor's throne on the Death Star lol. Thanks a lot guys
Doran Martell still reminds me of Baron Harkonnen from Dune. Less crazy, but just as intelligent. He’s very fond of sacrificing anyone, including family, to achieve his ends. I would imagine that he has plans A-Z and contingency plans innumerable.
Been waiting for this video ever since you mentioned it in your Arianne winds of winter !!!!! SO happy you guys are finally doing it!!!! Thank you so much.
Holy shit! You guys are the buddha to the ASOIAF. Every time I watch one of your videos I'm so enlightened!!! You two don't get near the credit or celebration that you deserve. You have the most unique and original content! Cant wait to see the future of these Doran videos............ but hey I want you to know that I'm ESPECIALLY- looking forward to the WHY LYANNA STARK SUCKS series! hahaha! Thanks for all your hard work guys!
I always felt that Doran was somewhat creepy, but I didn’t anticipate it being this bad. The connection to Norvos through his wife (even if they don’t seem to get along that well) and Areo Hotah (that was raised/trained by those freakish priests) worries me further. That place is just as scary as Doran is. So happy he’s not my dad
It might be worth pointing out that there is another much more direct symmetry/connection between Mors and Doran if we take Mors' name at face value - "death", in latin. So if Doran Martell means "The Stranger's Hammer of the Waters", then Mors Martell would be "Death's Hammer of the Waters". It's a very obvious, straightforward way to equate the two, but it doesn't jump out at you unless you're looking for it in their names.
This was great! What a treat to watch and listen to on a cold and wet day. I love how you both take the "facts" as written and place them into context, coming to the conclusion that they don't add up and what is known to be the "truth" is not necessarily so and often meant to hide what the truth really is. Thanks, again! With the videos with Quinn from "Ideas..." and this one 2018 is off to a fantastic start. Much needed considering that season 8 starts in 2019. Your channel and few others bring light during the Long Night. ~ Guido
Brilliant, the name Andalucía is from the name of the Vandals tribe of German people and it means to wander around. Also there is a connection to Ēostre. The dawn wender. Look at her wand looks like house Martell crest to me. Goddess of the dawn.
Jim Mozart It's all about what happens in the end as far as stopping/defeating the Others. That's the end game. Jon and D any are crucial to that end, Jon especially. His is the song of Ice and Fire.
awesome, Awesome, AWESOME video guys! Really enjoyed this one💕. Kinda makes me glad Sarella, I mean Alleras, is stashed away at the Citadel. At least one of Oberyn's daughters escaped good ol' uncle Doran. It's a sad state of affairs when the Citadel is a safer place for you than your family's home😂.
thanks Ashley...I still have reservations as to whether Alleras=Sarella...a girl her age shouldn't be able to pass as a man among a bunch of presumably observant and smart guys, and the girls in all the local taverns shouldn't all be attracted to her...the rest of it makes sense to me but those two factors give me great pause
One of the things that swayed me into thinking Alleras is a woman is Sam noting that Alleras "touched him lightly" with "a slim brown hand". That sounds like how one could describe a woman without outright confirming the gender. And prior to that, Pate thinks of Alleras "The Sphinx looks slight, but there's strength in those slim arms". Pate also notes Alleras's smiles to be soft. Again, all of this seems like ways to subtly describe a woman without saying it's a woman. This also tells me that people do notice the signs of Alleras being a female, but because nobody is expecting a girl to infiltrate their order, they just write the signs off. Just my two cents🤓.
@@fuzzydunlop7928 he would choose it because if i remember the one that HATE THE SAND is not the mastermind but the pawn that the master used to do his dirty work, Doran's characteristic in form and in mind is more similar to the master then to the Sand Hating Pawn LMAO
Have you looked at the theory which says that Marwyn the Mage is actually a Martell? Marwyn appearance: has a thick neck and a strong jaw. He is short and squat with enormous hands, a thick chest and a hard ale-belly. Quentyn appearance: is short-legged and stocky, thickly built, with a plain face, brown hair, brown eyes, and stubble on his cheeks. He has a high forehead, broad nose, and square jaw. Then there's the name structure similarities: QuentYn Martell, TrYstane Martell, OberYn Martell, LeWYn Martell....MarWYn.
The Rhoynar did have Water Wizards, right? If they could control the tides and storms as well as the rivers then the pirates might well have feared them.
You two keep raising the bar for ASOIAF content! Your channel is so good compared to most others that it's addictive. I already want my fix again! More please! The Hammer of the Waters... WOW! :-)
Actually, thanks for providing the video to make a map of her journey bc WTF went through her head? Was she drunk or on drugs, or the (as you would put it) the lying POS Andalls and their grey rats are hiding more than we know?
we think her story is a lie because its hard to imagine someone who wasn't mentally challenged/insane doing what she claims to have done, and she didn't seem to be either when she arrived in Dorne
You 2 uncovered a lie that's so tangled up it makes my head spin, but I like it. I feel like Sherlock Holmes or House. You 2 introduced a puzzle I need to solve. Will there be a part 2 of the profile of Doran?
We’re going to do a Why Lyanna Sucks video first but there’s at least one more Doran video coming behind it, which, knowing us, probably means there will end up being 3-4 more
I cannot even explain how gleefully I've been waiting for a series on Doran. Right up until he sent his heir to treat with the party of a boy nobody seems to believe is actually Aegon, I still believed that D was some kind of quiet, cyvasse-playing mastermind. Even when poor Quentyn was burnt to a crisp, I was still buying the viper-and-grass bit. But Arianne is the last person in Dorne who could be trusted to accurately assess a situation and follow a proscribed course of action based on that assessment.. That is, unless his plan is for her to marry Aegon whether he is real or not, which I guess is possible. Still, the Martell situation is beyond weird and I am glad you're digging into it.
Ok that was not a good place to stop!!! Aghhhf I need the next one. I keep wanting to hear people's opinions on Doran because nothing about him makes sense, so I need to know what you guys think!!! This is amazing! You guys made Saturday better!
Been looking forward to this since the live stream with Robert. Now I can’t wait for the next one. So good. I really love your work and it has expanded my knowledge on this series so much. Thank you!
I could understand why he wanted his siblings gone but why his own children?, someones has to succed after him, unless he ends up being inmortal or something, a person once told me that Doran actually wants little Trystane to be his heir, considering he is the only child Doran seems to actually protect but why would he want his two eldest children dead?, is it that they are not truly his?
I open youtube to see one of your old videos and i found this. So happy when i see new videos here. Thanks for the great work, it really brings that much depth to the reading. Best wishes from brasil
I love where this is going. As for Doran's name, you just made this guy from a very interesting character to a very creepy one. Doran: "Το δώρο του Ξένου/Θανάτου", translated to "The gift of the Stranger/Death"
Just so fucking awesome how you guys always come up with new exciting theories, and not just rehash old ones that everybody and their mom already have heard 500 times, keep up the great work ! You guys are so fucking awesome !
The Order of the Green Hand haha hell yeah he did, never thought that I would here such words from an American, I mean it's wasn't even a game in the Dutch league but for the cup. It's like your an Englishman born on the wrong end of the ocean lol
It’s hard work trying to follow European football over here but I can’t help myself. I follow American sports too but I fell in love with soccer the first time my foot touched a ball when I was 3 and we can finally get all the games over here. I drive m’lady crazy with all the games at like 6-7 in the morning and I’m out in the living room yelling at the tv but for some reason she loves me anyways
One of my favorite parts about having this channel is the fact that I get to talk to Europeans because aside from a few friends of mine that I grew up playing with, there’s no one else around here that I can talk to about this stuff
The Order of the Green Hand hahahah, believe me I know the struggles, I myself am a big MMA fan and try to watch as much as I can but it's mostly in America so it's starts at 4 AM here.. But there's just something beautiful about watching sports live. Which other teams do you like next to Man Utd ?
Katharina U. Almawt or mut also means death in Arabic, and Mete means death in Turkish. Mete Han was the founder of Hunnic empire and his name means King of Death...
Katharina U. Mors, mawta, Mete are all starting with M and means death in Three different languages so it's interesting George chose the name Mors. And do look up Mete Han he is interesting, and important in our history.
After my 5th watch.. to make sure I absorbed as much as I could.. I've got to pledge my swords to the Order all over again. Man, y'all are the best. Hands down.
The Rohan* people used water magic and the dragon lord wanted to wipe that stuff out... the meisters didn't want to give anything about that subject up...Nymeria had to know how to use that magic because that's how they got all the ships down the river and how they survived the exodus
Yeah!!!!! I have been waiting for this video for sooo long! You guys are amazing and have literally changed my perception of GoT ASOFAI for the colossally better
You guys had me at Why Catelyn Sucks, I thought I was the only one who thought she is a morally bankrupt character. I have been loving your book analyses and explanations. It is all that is holding me together till Winds of Winter is released
Dude what?! I did not see that coming at all. More Doran coverage please! I really want to see where this whole false history conspiracy goes in the upcoming books.
we really struggled with figuring out where to cut this one off...we like to end our videos with a BANG and try to find a place where we can do that that makes sense with regards to where we are going with it in the next video
I tell you what, after surviving "The Deeper Dorne" I wasn't sure if I'd be up for more, but you guys as usual bring it and make it awesome!!! (PS loving the new art/images!) I'm sure you came across it in your research, but just to also add that "mors" means death in Latin (I might be a Classics nerd ahem!). Don't get me wrong, I think you guys are 100% right about the Moors connection, but it is interesting...is every big deal Martell named "death"...? And not to put my tin foil too out there, but it is interesting that Nymeria's travels are very Dido-ish, no? And if we follow that famous Phoenician thread, you basically end up at Jezebel (actually a relative of Dido's), who was famous for throwing out Yahweh (out the window? oh dear) and pushing for idolatry (Baal, it's always Baal)...and you guys have already talked a lot about the "whose religion is right"/blasphemy theme that runs through ASOIAF. And J is also famous for her tussles with the prophet Elijah...the male form of Elia. Jezebel is also one of those misconstrued-by-history, painted-with-an-unfair-brush types...another theme you've been exploring. I mean who is more (traditional stereotype) Jezebel than Melisandre (throw out your gods and follow mine, seductress, etc)???? Anyway, it's just half a crackpot thought, but thought I'd share. :)
Okay let's talk about how after Elia's death Daynes avoided Martells? Ashara was lady in waiting for Elia but Allyria is nowhere near Arianne ? And she is engaged to a Lightning Lord not to Quentyn ? And Edric is with Beric too not with Doran/Oberyn ?
Michael Fabrey yeah aren't they supposed to have bad relationship? Maybe Lord Dayne's wife was from a house near the Stormlands but what is the chance for that? We know nothing about her, we don't even know who Edric's father is and why although he was oldest he didn't have any heir until 287 AC since Edric seen to be of age with Sansa?
Not sure if you guys have already answered this but do you prescribe to the theory that Aerys and Rhaella's children were poisoned possibly by Pycelle or by order of the Archmaesters themselves? If so can you make a video or can someone direct me to their video if they have already done this?
it's not impossible...it seems that throughout the years Targaryens have had trouble going full term with babies, resulting in quite a few lost children...most notably, Maegor's countless attempts to produce an heir
we definitely talk about them doing things like that in the Maegor the Cruel Lies of the Andals video...and I think that's the video we talk about how creepy it is that maesters are faceless men-level poisoners
Thanks for the response! Love the analysis of history, I think it really sheds light on how negatively the Targaryens have been portrayed throughout history. It's a shame that the fanbase largely takes the most obivous narrative as fact.
Wait a second...the whole every name has a meaning thing....George's love of symbolism..could this stretch to film as well? Doran is always eating oranges, and they've become a trope of approaching death in TV/film after The Godfather I....you guys are once again definitely on to something!
If anyone is still around 500 years from now, I bet they will be dissecting these books the same way we do the work of Shakespeare and Lewis Carroll today. Except they will be saying that GRRM was waaay better. Love your channel
Lyanna sucks? Not much is known about her she like sixteen years and all we know is she was crown by rhaegar and died in childbirths she’s is willful and hot temper like Arya but I don’t think that makes her a terrible person
Has Ryan not seen this channels MO?? The opposite and the contrasting contrary to every other GOT out there that churns out the same stuff ALL the time. Right here, in the OFTGH, they give us what we NEED... clean, fresh eyes to a extensive and layer filled story. I say, BRING ON the Lyanna hate!! (Although, Catlyn still wins the trophy..... for now.... ) :P ;)
I know this channel I lov it they have like the best theories out there I have swallowed every theroy they given cause they got evidence to back it up but lyanna hate I don’t know perhaps season 7 has damage them down to their core the death of little finger too impactful on them but I knowing them they will have fact and evidence to back up also watch it b come a 5 part series
What if she didn't have be an army but was an extremely powerful master of death magic. That explains why people mostly just left her alone because they were afraid of her.
sorry...we struggled to figure out where to cut it off and we thought that really grabbing people's attention with the name breakdown at the end made sense with where we are going next
I’ve been thinking about this for so long! When he sent his people on those missions it’s just strange... the way he’s chair bound like bran is interesting.
The way i see it Nymeria had thousands of ships with tens of thousands of people on her exodus. The pirates of basilisk islands had perhaps 10000 men or less and they were divided (there was no pirate king then if a remember correcly). So the pirates weren't really able to conquer the ryoinish with one swell swoop, there were most likely a series of raids by the pirates(especially when the ryoinish were scattered across the coast of Sothoryos and easy pickings most of the time), and sometimes the ryoinish managed to beat them back, but mostly the pirates won. So the ryoinish were losing at the moment but there was just that many of the ryonish and pirates would have had some losses, so the pirates made an offer, which Nymeria refused and than decided to leave. I think it was at the same time when Nymeria found out that people who settled Yeen had just vanished, and coupled with the offer by the pirates she decided that it was time to move on. And it's most likely that she wasn't able to leave completely unscathed but as there was so many of them they managed to break through and escape. But now that i think about there is one odd thing about all of this. Gogossos was a Valyrian colony, it was conquered by the valyrians from the ghiscary thousands of years ago. So why would or how could Nymeria just go there if she decided to escape the reach of Valyria in the first place, it would be like deciding to settle near Myr or Pentos or even Volantis. Gogossos was just a penal colony but still it was place of sorcerers and quite some power, and i don't think the pirates would have bothered them. Actually, would there have been pirates there in the first place if Gogossos is so near to the basilisk islands, the Valyrians might have just wiped them out simply because they don't not like pirates near their colonies. In any case it's an odd choice for Nymeria to go there.
if I don't see Bran use the Hammer of the Waters to cut off the others - or whoever, honestly - I'm gonna be so disappointed :c Moat Caitlin always stuck with me that it's an important place, one that they will return to. And how NEAT would it be for shit to be going south, figuratively and literally, and Bran feels he has no way to help and then blam FLOOODDSSS. or the crannogmen help maybe. I'd just like to see them again
"Andalusia" comes from "Al-Andalus", which is Arabic for "Place/Land of the Vandals", who were in control of the Iberian peninsula at the time of the Umayyad conquest - & who lived like typical savages before said Arabs civilized Al-Andalus while the rest of Europe was dealing with a whole litany of problems.... "Andal" is clearly GRRM's version of 'Vandal', & since the modern usage of the word stems from their famous "vandalism" of Rome; I went "uh oh" as soon as I first came across this name in the books because GRRM was clearly pinning a big red flag on this particular race of Westerosii.....
6:35 I think she kept her army in check, the Valyrians saw they were peaceful and were allowed to pass unchallenged. 8:10 greyscale mayhaps? She could have had an epidemic and threatened to intentionally spread it to the pirates if they boarded? An army of people who are used to fighting on boats may have given the pirates pause, but disease would be a greater threat. Or perhaps she said she was a great wizard and made her people were immortal, then demonstrated by failing to cut off the arm of a person where the greyscale had calcified. That would have frightened the worst pirates. Doran's name also translates to Wanderer and Exile. Perhaps he would have been more at home on the Ryonar, he did go to The Sorrows when he was young. Maybe he's so melancholy and quiet because he realizes everyone and everything dies, from his family to his kingdom, and he suspects he will be the last to go again.
Are we sure Catelyn isn't secretly a Martell? I'm seeing a lot of similarities here... -disregard for children -love to plan -clearly adept at reading situations and yet -consistently ignores what they gained from the situation and make a random, counterproductive decision -seemingly detached from real human emotions -goal oriented THEY'RE LIKE THE SAME PERSON.
Mrs. Morbid honestly I am afraid Doran is going to cause the death of his whole family and sabotage Aegon's cause and I will turn into a banshee to poses George
allyria stark 😂😂😂 I wonder if that's his plan all along...he's truly chosen a side - but won't tell anyone - and is using the guise of him being Careful Ol' Doran to screw the progress of the opposition? Or he's hoping Loose Arianne might seduce Aegon. I mean, Targs keep it all in the fam, and Arianne thinks below the belt enough. Aegon's her type.
Mrs. Morbid truly like Aegon is the only person after Oberyn and Ned to care about Elia and her children, he promised to avenge them, and good uncle Doran is skeptical. If Oberyn was alive Aegon will already conquer Westeros
"You are a weak man. Weak men will never rule Dorne again." I' m starting to hate the show.
Dorn's plot looks a lot like the Last Jedi movie, political correctness and female favoritism ruined it.
Is it any surprise that Kathleen Kennedy gave them a Star Wars trilogy of their own?
Nithin K Hydrose not no mo. Not no mo
Spoken like a weak man
Wow!!! This was mind-blowing. There are so many disparate elements that you put into context here.
You guys are, hands down, THE BEST Asoiaf theorists out there!
The connections you drew between Al-Andalos, the Moors, the Rhone and their parallels in the books... Brilliant.
I'd connected the Rhone with the Rhoyne, the Andals with Al-Andalos but the connections seemed so arbitrary until I saw this... Amazing work you guys!
Thank you for covering Doran Martell. His storyline is one of my favorite and strangest in the books
I like that Doran gets the Skull as a gift. The gift of death.
Can I just say this about that, Indira Varma's scream when Oberyn died was absolutely the best scream ever captured on film. I know, off topic but every time I think of anything Martell is comes to mind.
Now that I think about Doran, what the f*** was he thinking sending Quintyn to Essos and Oberyn to King's Landing? Even Tyrion questioned his senses. If he sent the impressive, adventurous and brave Oberyn to Dany and her dragons under some pretext of him visiting Essos for fun, and sending Quentyn to King's Landing, I think the Meereen arc wouldn't have been as horribly boring. And Quentyn is more suited for the small council without getting himself burned by dragonfire, as is Oberyn more suited for fire and blood.
Redzak Ts true that's why Order thinks Doran may commit kinslaying or wants to get rid of his older children to seat Trystane on the throne. Just like Cercei hating Tyrion for being Valonqar, Arianne was obsessed with Quentyn when Trystane was the real danger to her birth right
Redzak Ts also is it just me but how come trystane personality is never talked about we actually don't know what type of person he is the only thing we get on him is from a knight who slept with the heir to dorne when she should've been harding his ward
I mean this is the only guy the machavelli of westeros has ever spoke highly off...oh shit
This was AWESOME!
And LOL. Having just finished the books, for show-only consumers, I guarantee you they know nothing of Dorne and certainly Doran Martel is absolutely “confusing“.
Maybe Aerys was right when he said the dornish betrayed him...
Aerys went mad with visions of the truth
Once again, the Order has saved me from boredom. Thank you.
Shawn Shaw they do have impeccable timing.
Note that "Mors" also is the Latin word for death which kind of gives Mors and Doran the same name.
What i like about this channel is bringing up the improtance of the order of the greenhand. Nobody else talks about this except for aegon roasted them and not much else. I bet when winds of winrer comes out and we get more of the greenhand. Everyone will look dumb for not talking about them more. Its all azor azai and where jon or dany will end up. George said they make up 10 percent of thr story. Thats at least 90 percent of the story missing
Technically, the Valyrians were most likely same as the Rhoynar when it came to equilibrium rights as Dark Sister was confirmed to forged specifically for a woman
Probably not since Aegon was king not Visenya.
@@Kunumbah1 that could have possibly just been agreed upon by all 3 of them, and they were all essentially like co-monarchs as well.
As I read through the World of Ice and Fire, there was so much that made no sense, but I figured the details had been muddled and changed over the years. This puts a very fine point on a lot of things that made no sense about Nymeria and Doran.
I've been waiting so long for a video about the other great schemer in asoiaf, and you guys didn't disappoint. The best asoiaf channel on youtube. It is known
thank you so much
Great stuff. Now looking at the pictures of Doran, i keep picturing Darth Sidius sitting in his emperor's throne on the Death Star lol. Thanks a lot guys
coming soon...we're going to do a quick Why Lyanna Sucks video first but Doran II will hopefully be online next monday
Doran Martell still reminds me of Baron Harkonnen from Dune. Less crazy, but just as intelligent. He’s very fond of sacrificing anyone, including family, to achieve his ends. I would imagine that he has plans A-Z and contingency plans innumerable.
Been waiting for this video ever since you mentioned it in your Arianne winds of winter !!!!! SO happy you guys are finally doing it!!!! Thank you so much.
Holy shit! You guys are the buddha to the ASOIAF. Every time I watch one of your videos I'm so enlightened!!! You two don't get near the credit or celebration that you deserve. You have the most unique and original content! Cant wait to see the future of these Doran videos............ but hey I want you to know that I'm ESPECIALLY- looking forward to the WHY LYANNA STARK SUCKS series! hahaha! Thanks for all your hard work guys!
I always felt that Doran was somewhat creepy, but I didn’t anticipate it being this bad. The connection to Norvos through his wife (even if they don’t seem to get along that well) and Areo Hotah (that was raised/trained by those freakish priests) worries me further. That place is just as scary as Doran is.
So happy he’s not my dad
Great cliff hanger! And much to ponder. Hurry up with part 2!
It might be worth pointing out that there is another much more direct symmetry/connection between Mors and Doran if we take Mors' name at face value - "death", in latin.
So if Doran Martell means "The Stranger's Hammer of the Waters", then Mors Martell would be "Death's Hammer of the Waters". It's a very obvious, straightforward way to equate the two, but it doesn't jump out at you unless you're looking for it in their names.
This was great! What a treat to watch and listen to on a cold and wet day. I love how you both take the "facts" as written and place them into context, coming to the conclusion that they don't add up and what is known to be the "truth" is not necessarily so and often meant to hide what the truth really is. Thanks, again! With the videos with Quinn from "Ideas..." and this one 2018 is off to a fantastic start. Much needed considering that season 8 starts in 2019. Your channel and few others bring light during the Long Night. ~ Guido
Brilliant, the name Andalucía is from the name of the Vandals tribe of German people and it means to wander around. Also there is a connection to Ēostre. The dawn wender. Look at her wand looks like house Martell crest to me. Goddess of the dawn.
At last someone realizes what a man of mystery Doran is.
Yay! I’ve been waiting for this! Greenhand does the best Ice and Fire videos!
Part 2 better come quickly that's all I'm saying!
we'll try...we're going to do a quick Why Lyanna Sucks video first though...we're hoping to have it online on Valentines Day
Excellent as always, this is why your channel is my favourite ASOIAF one. Can't wait for part 2!
Loved the video especially the connection of nymeros martell being water hammer! Very well produced as always
Wow that ending about the Hammer of the Waters.....well done
thank you
Wow its so obvious the way you present the evidence, why didn't I see it.
Really looking forward to the next installment this ones brilliant.
Jim Mozart It's all about what happens in the end as far as stopping/defeating the Others. That's the end game. Jon and D any are crucial to that end, Jon especially. His is the song of Ice and Fire.
Kathy C are you talking about the show ?
awesome, Awesome, AWESOME video guys! Really enjoyed this one💕. Kinda makes me glad Sarella, I mean Alleras, is stashed away at the Citadel. At least one of Oberyn's daughters escaped good ol' uncle Doran. It's a sad state of affairs when the Citadel is a safer place for you than your family's home😂.
thanks Ashley...I still have reservations as to whether Alleras=Sarella...a girl her age shouldn't be able to pass as a man among a bunch of presumably observant and smart guys, and the girls in all the local taverns shouldn't all be attracted to her...the rest of it makes sense to me but those two factors give me great pause
One of the things that swayed me into thinking Alleras is a woman is Sam noting that Alleras "touched him lightly" with "a slim brown hand". That sounds like how one could describe a woman without outright confirming the gender. And prior to that, Pate thinks of Alleras "The Sphinx looks slight, but there's strength in those slim arms". Pate also notes Alleras's smiles to be soft. Again, all of this seems like ways to subtly describe a woman without saying it's a woman. This also tells me that people do notice the signs of Alleras being a female, but because nobody is expecting a girl to infiltrate their order, they just write the signs off. Just my two cents🤓.
Doran is a Sith Lord
Mordrik Stone full fill your destiny Arianne
He is, man. I’m still reeling from this video.
Hella lol
Impossible - he would never have chosen a location with SO MUCH SAND.
@@fuzzydunlop7928 he would choose it because if i remember the one that HATE THE SAND is not the mastermind but the pawn that the master used to do his dirty work, Doran's characteristic in form and in mind is more similar to the master then to the Sand Hating Pawn LMAO
I have been WAITING for this. Super interested to what you have to say. Doran is truly an enigma to me. Very excited, let's go.
Been waiting for this since you mentioned it in the live stream and OMG! Can't wait for the next part!
You were as long as I remember a high quality video channel, but you managed to increase your quality even more.
Have you looked at the theory which says that Marwyn the Mage is actually a Martell? Marwyn appearance: has a thick neck and a strong jaw. He is short and squat with enormous hands, a thick chest and a hard ale-belly. Quentyn appearance: is short-legged and stocky, thickly built, with a plain face, brown hair, brown eyes, and stubble on his cheeks. He has a high forehead, broad nose, and square jaw.
Then there's the name structure similarities: QuentYn Martell, TrYstane Martell, OberYn Martell, LeWYn Martell....MarWYn.
The Rhoynar did have Water Wizards, right? If they could control the tides and storms as well as the rivers then the pirates might well have feared them.
Hmm good point!
My thoughts, exactly
You two keep raising the bar for ASOIAF content! Your channel is so good compared to most others that it's addictive. I already want my fix again! More please! The Hammer of the Waters... WOW! :-)
Wow, I like how I get goosebumps from your videos. The ending is shocking!
Wow, 11 minutes into the video and I agree with you: Nymeria's actions makes no sense.
every time we look at her story I feel like my head is going to explode
Actually, thanks for providing the video to make a map of her journey bc WTF went through her head? Was she drunk or on drugs, or the (as you would put it) the lying POS Andalls and their grey rats are hiding more than we know?
we think her story is a lie because its hard to imagine someone who wasn't mentally challenged/insane doing what she claims to have done, and she didn't seem to be either when she arrived in Dorne
You 2 uncovered a lie that's so tangled up it makes my head spin, but I like it. I feel like Sherlock Holmes or House. You 2 introduced a puzzle I need to solve. Will there be a part 2 of the profile of Doran?
We’re going to do a Why Lyanna Sucks video first but there’s at least one more Doran video coming behind it, which, knowing us, probably means there will end up being 3-4 more
Notice how the irl Charles Martell is named "the hammer" as well, and the Martells settle where the hammer of dorne is.....
I cannot even explain how gleefully I've been waiting for a series on Doran. Right up until he sent his heir to treat with the party of a boy nobody seems to believe is actually Aegon, I still believed that D was some kind of quiet, cyvasse-playing mastermind. Even when poor Quentyn was burnt to a crisp, I was still buying the viper-and-grass bit. But Arianne is the last person in Dorne who could be trusted to accurately assess a situation and follow a proscribed course of action based on that assessment.. That is, unless his plan is for her to marry Aegon whether he is real or not, which I guess is possible. Still, the Martell situation is beyond weird and I am glad you're digging into it.
Ok that was not a good place to stop!!! Aghhhf I need the next one. I keep wanting to hear people's opinions on Doran because nothing about him makes sense, so I need to know what you guys think!!! This is amazing! You guys made Saturday better!
Great video. I completely missed the Charles the Hammer reference in the book. Keep up the great work.
Some Green Hand before a huge meeting... hell yeah!! Let's do this!!!
Been looking forward to this since the live stream with Robert. Now I can’t wait for the next one. So good. I really love your work and it has expanded my knowledge on this series so much. Thank you!
I could understand why he wanted his siblings gone but why his own children?, someones has to succed after him, unless he ends up being inmortal or something, a person once told me that Doran actually wants little Trystane to be his heir, considering he is the only child Doran seems to actually protect but why would he want his two eldest children dead?, is it that they are not truly his?
xWickedWitchOfTheWestx survival of the fittest only the strong will inherit after all he is a sith lord
@@wolfsbanealphas617unlimited POWER!!!! 😅
I open youtube to see one of your old videos and i found this. So happy when i see new videos here. Thanks for the great work, it really brings that much depth to the reading. Best wishes from brasil
I love where this is going.
As for Doran's name, you just made this guy from a very interesting character to a very creepy one.
Doran: "Το δώρο του Ξένου/Θανάτου", translated to "The gift of the Stranger/Death"
The fact that Doran's mother doesn't even have a name yet in the books implies that George is ready to bite Us in the ass again
Just so fucking awesome how you guys always come up with new exciting theories, and not just rehash old ones that everybody and their mom already have heard 500 times, keep up the great work ! You guys are so fucking awesome !
thanks Emre...our boy RVP scored a screamer the other day
The Order of the Green Hand haha hell yeah he did, never thought that I would here such words from an American, I mean it's wasn't even a game in the Dutch league but for the cup. It's like your an Englishman born on the wrong end of the ocean lol
It’s hard work trying to follow European football over here but I can’t help myself. I follow American sports too but I fell in love with soccer the first time my foot touched a ball when I was 3 and we can finally get all the games over here. I drive m’lady crazy with all the games at like 6-7 in the morning and I’m out in the living room yelling at the tv but for some reason she loves me anyways
One of my favorite parts about having this channel is the fact that I get to talk to Europeans because aside from a few friends of mine that I grew up playing with, there’s no one else around here that I can talk to about this stuff
The Order of the Green Hand hahahah, believe me I know the struggles, I myself am a big MMA fan and try to watch as much as I can but it's mostly in America so it's starts at 4 AM here.. But there's just something beautiful about watching sports live.
Which other teams do you like next to Man Utd ?
Hmmmm Mors also means 'death' in latin.
Telling names with a martinesque twist. You make me start my own research haha
Katharina U. Almawt or mut also means death in Arabic, and Mete means death in Turkish. Mete Han was the founder of Hunnic empire and his name means King of Death...
allyria stark الموت؟
Are you referring to another person in the book? I will look up Mete Han, i like history :)
Katharina U. Mors, mawta, Mete are all starting with M and means death in Three different languages so it's interesting George chose the name Mors. And do look up Mete Han he is interesting, and important in our history.
The Order of the Green Hand struck finally! Was eagerly waiting for this video... Kudos!
After my 5th watch.. to make sure I absorbed as much as I could.. I've got to pledge my swords to the Order all over again. Man, y'all are the best. Hands down.
Thanks Gamer...we humbly accept your sword and oath
I swear it by ice and fire..
You guys are producing the best vids
This was awesome, definitely looking forward to more of this series.
Love the content, happy to see you are growing.
The Rohan* people used water magic and the dragon lord wanted to wipe that stuff out... the meisters didn't want to give anything about that subject up...Nymeria had to know how to use that magic because that's how they got all the ships down the river and how they survived the exodus
Been waiting for this video! Cant wait to hear what you guys have to say about Doran! He seems to be up to no good.
Yeah!!!!! I have been waiting for this video for sooo long! You guys are amazing and have literally changed my perception of GoT ASOFAI for the colossally better
thank you so much
Charles Martel's nickname was also The Hammer
Grrm has defo built doran martell up to be a huge player
Way to drop the mic man.
You guys had me at Why Catelyn Sucks, I thought I was the only one who thought she is a morally bankrupt character. I have been loving your book analyses and explanations. It is all that is holding me together till Winds of Winter is released
Thank you Dionne
Dude what?! I did not see that coming at all. More Doran coverage please! I really want to see where this whole false history conspiracy goes in the upcoming books.
Jesus Christ that was a cruel cliffhanger ;(
we really struggled with figuring out where to cut this one off...we like to end our videos with a BANG and try to find a place where we can do that that makes sense with regards to where we are going with it in the next video
You always cut it about an hour short everytime :D
Linus quality not quantity.
We can have both
Every time you add a new one to the series I binge again.😆 I love that you guys topics and not afraid to get into it!😎💜💖🔥 Thanks for rocking!
Thank you so much been looking forward to this one.
I tell you what, after surviving "The Deeper Dorne" I wasn't sure if I'd be up for more, but you guys as usual bring it and make it awesome!!! (PS loving the new art/images!) I'm sure you came across it in your research, but just to also add that "mors" means death in Latin (I might be a Classics nerd ahem!). Don't get me wrong, I think you guys are 100% right about the Moors connection, but it is interesting...is every big deal Martell named "death"...?
And not to put my tin foil too out there, but it is interesting that Nymeria's travels are very Dido-ish, no? And if we follow that famous Phoenician thread, you basically end up at Jezebel (actually a relative of Dido's), who was famous for throwing out Yahweh (out the window? oh dear) and pushing for idolatry (Baal, it's always Baal)...and you guys have already talked a lot about the "whose religion is right"/blasphemy theme that runs through ASOIAF. And J is also famous for her tussles with the prophet Elijah...the male form of Elia. Jezebel is also one of those misconstrued-by-history, painted-with-an-unfair-brush types...another theme you've been exploring. I mean who is more (traditional stereotype) Jezebel than Melisandre (throw out your gods and follow mine, seductress, etc)???? Anyway, it's just half a crackpot thought, but thought I'd share. :)
gllyflower on Shitttt son...😧
gllyflower no problem 👌🏾
Thanks for noticing the art Gilly! Lady green hand xxoo
this was a great video please keep up the good work i totally love yours guys video. i really want to know more about this Grand Northern Conspiracy.
Raasina raa Southorn Ambitious are interesting too
Incredible analysis, Your work on this is appreciated!
Okay let's talk about how after Elia's death Daynes avoided Martells? Ashara was lady in waiting for Elia but Allyria is nowhere near Arianne ? And she is engaged to a Lightning Lord not to Quentyn ? And Edric is with Beric too not with Doran/Oberyn ?
allyria stark I'm not the only one! Why a dornish Dayne would squire for a Marcher? Hell nah that's fishy
Michael Fabrey yeah aren't they supposed to have bad relationship? Maybe Lord Dayne's wife was from a house near the Stormlands but what is the chance for that? We know nothing about her, we don't even know who Edric's father is and why although he was oldest he didn't have any heir until 287 AC since Edric seen to be of age with Sansa?
allyria stark winds...of....winter....winds....of....winter. PLEASE RHOLLAR ALMIGHTY GIVE US WINDS OF WINTER *laughs and sobs*
Michael Fabrey George has so much to explain but I think we will have TWOW after TV series end and this year I think he will release Fire and Blood
allyria stark welp....you were right about Fire&Blood and TWOW
Im just flipping through the book trying to continue on your video but im not getting anywhere. You guys are just amazing.
Not sure if you guys have already answered this but do you prescribe to the theory that Aerys and Rhaella's children were poisoned possibly by Pycelle or by order of the Archmaesters themselves? If so can you make a video or can someone direct me to their video if they have already done this?
it's not impossible...it seems that throughout the years Targaryens have had trouble going full term with babies, resulting in quite a few lost children...most notably, Maegor's countless attempts to produce an heir
we definitely talk about them doing things like that in the Maegor the Cruel Lies of the Andals video...and I think that's the video we talk about how creepy it is that maesters are faceless men-level poisoners
Thanks for the response! Love the analysis of history, I think it really sheds light on how negatively the Targaryens have been portrayed throughout history. It's a shame that the fanbase largely takes the most obivous narrative as fact.
The Order of the Green Hand were did the measter come from
Alright I'm hooked. Gotta see where this one goes. Just what is the dornish master plan
Wait a second...the whole every name has a meaning thing....George's love of symbolism..could this stretch to film as well? Doran is always eating oranges, and they've become a trope of approaching death in TV/film after The Godfather I....you guys are once again definitely on to something!
If anyone is still around 500 years from now, I bet they will be dissecting these books the same way we do the work of Shakespeare and Lewis Carroll today. Except they will be saying that GRRM was waaay better. Love your channel
Only if he finishes them, well thats my worry. I hope he does they're so intriguing and the plots intricately entwined. Makes the books fascinating.
@@Queenfloofles hehe that's a good point. 4 years later and still no change... I honestly don't remember writing this comment 🤣
So when did The House Of Black And White infiltrate Sunspear? And more importantly, why?..... is my guess on the content of the next one haha love it.
Yaaay just ocd refreshing for this video since yesterday... 😵 Thanks guys!
literally need the next part of this like ..now.... inject me!!!!!!! lol
Coming soon. But first we’re going to do a quick Why Lyanna Sucks video
Lyanna sucks? Not much is known about her she like sixteen years and all we know is she was crown by rhaegar and died in childbirths she’s is willful and hot temper like Arya but I don’t think that makes her a terrible person
I think we might change your mind Ryan
Has Ryan not seen this channels MO?? The opposite and the contrasting contrary to every other GOT out there that churns out the same stuff ALL the time. Right here, in the OFTGH, they give us what we NEED... clean, fresh eyes to a extensive and layer filled story. I say, BRING ON the Lyanna hate!! (Although, Catlyn still wins the trophy..... for now.... ) :P ;)
I know this channel I lov it they have like the best theories out there I have swallowed every theroy they given cause they got evidence to back it up but lyanna hate I don’t know perhaps season 7 has damage them down to their core the death of little finger too impactful on them but I knowing them they will have fact and evidence to back up also watch it b come a 5 part series
The hammer of the waters..... Made me shiver a bit.
Thank you for the post exam gift and also your kind words while I was studying.
Wow! Absolutely refreshing to watch a new theory video!
Woot need this like coffee and Green crack.
What if she didn't have be an army but was an extremely powerful master of death magic. That explains why people mostly just left her alone because they were afraid of her.
I like this
Excellent work, guys, I loved it. This poses more questions than it answers, though; surely it's a first part of a series, right?
sorry...we struggled to figure out where to cut it off and we thought that really grabbing people's attention with the name breakdown at the end made sense with where we are going next
Thank you both for your content.
that is actually interesting... waiting for the vid that applies all of those details unto Doran's actions and plans - and Oberyn's history !!
Oh my! A Saturday upload and my new 'Something for the weekend'. Well, tonight once my daddy duties are complete.
I’ve been thinking about this for so long! When he sent his people on those missions it’s just strange... the way he’s chair bound like bran is interesting.
The windswept grass that can't do shit without a Viper to work with
Hasan Wilson well now he has 3 vipers
The way i see it Nymeria had thousands of ships with tens of thousands of people on her exodus. The pirates of basilisk islands had perhaps 10000 men or less and they were divided (there was no pirate king then if a remember correcly). So the pirates weren't really able to conquer the ryoinish with one swell swoop, there were most likely a series of raids by the pirates(especially when the ryoinish were scattered across the coast of Sothoryos and easy pickings most of the time), and sometimes the ryoinish managed to beat them back, but mostly the pirates won. So the ryoinish were losing at the moment but there was just that many of the ryonish and pirates would have had some losses, so the pirates made an offer, which Nymeria refused and than decided to leave. I think it was at the same time when Nymeria found out that people who settled Yeen had just vanished, and coupled with the offer by the pirates she decided that it was time to move on. And it's most likely that she wasn't able to leave completely unscathed but as there was so many of them they managed to break through and escape.
But now that i think about there is one odd thing about all of this. Gogossos was a Valyrian colony, it was conquered by the valyrians from the ghiscary thousands of years ago. So why would or how could Nymeria just go there if she decided to escape the reach of Valyria in the first place, it would be like deciding to settle near Myr or Pentos or even Volantis. Gogossos was just a penal colony but still it was place of sorcerers and quite some power, and i don't think the pirates would have bothered them. Actually, would there have been pirates there in the first place if Gogossos is so near to the basilisk islands, the Valyrians might have just wiped them out simply because they don't not like pirates near their colonies. In any case it's an odd choice for Nymeria to go there.
if I don't see Bran use the Hammer of the Waters to cut off the others - or whoever, honestly - I'm gonna be so disappointed :c
Moat Caitlin always stuck with me that it's an important place, one that they will return to. And how NEAT would it be for shit to be going south, figuratively and literally, and Bran feels he has no way to help and then blam FLOOODDSSS.
or the crannogmen help maybe. I'd just like to see them again
If Aegon had attacked Dorne first, he would've defeated the last of the Rhoynar and steamroll the northern regions afterwards
"Andalusia" comes from "Al-Andalus", which is Arabic for "Place/Land of the Vandals", who were in control of the Iberian peninsula at the time of the Umayyad conquest - & who lived like typical savages before said Arabs civilized Al-Andalus while the rest of Europe was dealing with a whole litany of problems.... "Andal" is clearly GRRM's version of 'Vandal', & since the modern usage of the word stems from their famous "vandalism" of Rome; I went "uh oh" as soon as I first came across this name in the books because GRRM was clearly pinning a big red flag on this particular race of Westerosii.....
So pumped for this ❤️
Brilliant picking Doran, opens the whole story up!!
6:35 I think she kept her army in check, the Valyrians saw they were peaceful and were allowed to pass unchallenged.
8:10 greyscale mayhaps? She could have had an epidemic and threatened to intentionally spread it to the pirates if they boarded? An army of people who are used to fighting on boats may have given the pirates pause, but disease would be a greater threat. Or perhaps she said she was a great wizard and made her people were immortal, then demonstrated by failing to cut off the arm of a person where the greyscale had calcified. That would have frightened the worst pirates.
Doran's name also translates to Wanderer and Exile. Perhaps he would have been more at home on the Ryonar, he did go to The Sorrows when he was young. Maybe he's so melancholy and quiet because he realizes everyone and everything dies, from his family to his kingdom, and he suspects he will be the last to go again.
Are we sure Catelyn isn't secretly a Martell?
I'm seeing a lot of similarities here...
-disregard for children
-love to plan
-clearly adept at reading situations and yet
-consistently ignores what they gained from the situation and make a random, counterproductive decision
-seemingly detached from real human emotions
-goal oriented
THEY'RE LIKE THE SAME PERSON.
Mrs. Morbid they are both Andals so yes they are eerily similar.
allyria stark the parallels are insane. I didn't even notice until this video haha
Mrs. Morbid honestly I am afraid Doran is going to cause the death of his whole family and sabotage Aegon's cause and I will turn into a banshee to poses George
allyria stark 😂😂😂
I wonder if that's his plan all along...he's truly chosen a side - but won't tell anyone - and is using the guise of him being Careful Ol' Doran to screw the progress of the opposition?
Or he's hoping Loose Arianne might seduce Aegon. I mean, Targs keep it all in the fam, and Arianne thinks below the belt enough. Aegon's her type.
Mrs. Morbid truly like Aegon is the only person after Oberyn and Ned to care about Elia and her children, he promised to avenge them, and good uncle Doran is skeptical. If Oberyn was alive Aegon will already conquer Westeros