Breaking Down Rapid-Onset Gender Dysphoria
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ก.ค. 2024
- We're here today to break down everything that is wrong with rapid-onset gender dysphoria as a term, and with the research that started the irreversible damage the concept of ROGD has caused.
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/ @jammidodger - บันเทิง
"Why do transgender kids hang around other transgender kids and why don't they want to be around family members who wish transgender people didn't exist? Let's do this by asking unsupportive parents."
"We surveyed 150 priests and have concluded that the world is run on divine intervention"
@@user-mv5zt8qd9l "We used the Bible, Spider-Man comics, and World of Warcraft to prove the existence of God, Spider-Man, and Sylvanas Windrunner."
it’s because they only seek to confirm what they already believe - the children are too suggestible, therefore their reports will be unreliable so there’s no point in talking to them
"Are parents so out of touch? No. It's the children who are wrong."
This research study gives big "Why do women do this? We asked a man!" energy
*renames study* "According to transphobic parents, trans children avoid telling transphobic parents about being trans for as long as possible and don't like talking to people that insult them." ... yeah, that seems better
According to all known laws of aviation...
@@xXMindSoulXxThere is no way a bee should be able to fly... 😂
in a nutshell
@@bonbonsucree6670 Its wings are too small to get
its fat little body off the ground.
Excellent re-titling. You won the internet (yesterday).
Asking non supportive parents about their trans kids has strong "what's the deal with women? We asked 10 men" vibes
"We asked 100 single men." **asks a question about women**
"Should women be allowed to vote? We asked 10 conservative men who happen to know some women"
"What type of men do women like? We asked incels on Reddit, and the results will shock you!"
Read: The Myth of “Reliable Research” in Pediatric Gender Medicine: A critical evaluation of the Dutch Studies-and research that has followed for a criticism on the method of treatment that Jammidodger underwent
@@maanvis81 What does that have to do with his comment?
The myth of ROGD makes me so mad, because I read The Gender Dysphoria Bible (to help understand my gf better) and after reading it I was more secure in my cisgender identity than ever before.
Learning about dysphoria does not turn someone trans. It just makes them recognize it in themselves if it already exists, and makes them more understanding of the people who do experience it.
If learning about something made you that thing I would've turned into a spider back in first grade.
@@tjenadonn6158I would be an iPad DAW for music production…
@@tjenadonn6158and I would have squashed you with my shoe 😤😈😈
Jk 🥹🥺🥺
Honestly if an outside observer who hasn't read it saw how quickly my whole life changed when that website made me throw off my denial and realize who I was "magically turns you trans" would probably seem like a logical conclusion.
If anything, society tries to force you to be straight and cisgender, and popular media bombards you with heteronormativity. So if things really worked that way, then 100% of people would be cishet.
The amount of cringe when someone says "rapid-onset gender dysphoria" is insane, but it isn't as bad as when you're trying to come out as trans or nonbinary and the reaction to that being "Oh? since when? Is this a sudden, new thing? You never had gender dysphoria before!" Like WHAT????
Yeah, like for some reason people expect that you don't experience something until you tell them? 🤨
Rapid onset? Nah, mines chronic
I always ask when they realize. I always want to understand someone's experience to know if it's like mine and could help me
Even if it was rapid, what about it being rapid makes it not gender dysphoria. In the same way that there are multiples types of diabetes or hepatitis, there can be multiple types of gender dysphoria. And like with diabetes, the treatment can still be the same until it’s proven to not be effective for the alternate type. So even if RIGD is real, gender affirming care would still be the goto treatment for it. Thinking otherwise is a flat out denial of the scientific process.
@@wrmsnicketthey really just want some reason to dismiss their transness, logic be damned
Parents would rather believe in some magic change instead of accepting that they were unsupportive and clueless. The most judgemental ones rarely turn that judgement on themselves.
Because that would admit that you were wrong and people usually don't like that thought. That's why changing attitudes is so difficult... 😕
@@lurch789That's not what DID means
being judgmental, in and of itself, is usually a defensive mechanism: deep down they KNOW...
"My kid was supposed to be a perfect obedient clone of me, and I did everything in my power to force them. How could this possibly have gone wrong?"
Truth
After my little sister's coming out as a trans girl, me starting to watch trans youtubers and making trans friends I suddenly became... just as much of a cis person as I've always been while never even questioning my gender. How does this social contagion thing work again?
If you become trans through trans folk, how did those people become trans? It implies that even if rogd is real, someone was trans at the beginning. So being trans exists. I just.
The social contagion thing is sourced up of made up lies used to stir up hatred, I've known this for years now it's just that it's more mainstream and widespread more than ever unfortunately ;/ Especially the people who still believe it changes cis people to be "not cis"
@robertmarshall2502 because we decided to stop demonising them at every turn. The exact same thing happened when we stopped villifying those with mental illness, left-handed people, and other LGBT identities.
People tend to be more open about themselves when we stop stigmatising them. This isn't a difficult concept.
@@robertmarshall2502oh my god dude you clearly don't have a job
@@robertmarshall2502 I can't find any reliable sources on the transgender population count in third gender societies nor in sex workers. In socities where homosexuality is a taboo, for example(china), children are expected and are pressured into meeting the expectations of their parents. And the fact that many anti lgbtq+ education centers existing in china. Also the social attitude for left handedness changed overtime opposed to how transgender issues popped into the media in 2015.
It felt sudden and out of the blue when my son told me he was a boy at age 18. However, when I looked back and noticed clues in my memories, it wasn’t sudden at all.
I realized he had waited until his father was completely out of the picture until he came out. I’m glad he did, and I’m happy he felt safe to do so with me.
It's so heartwarming to see such supportive parents. I'm glad he has you. ❤
@@cuesee.psyche Thank you! There are days when I feel like I’m doing it wrong, but validation like this makes me happy cry.
@@moonraevyn6006 I think it's importan to have an open communication with your son. Sometimes we might make mistakes while having a good will so open communication and openess to learning help in such cases.
Sering there's a learning curve is what's so common in hearing supportive parents' reactions. There's been a malicious political retraction of support for children and in many cases adults too, that it's good to read your support. I'm sorry your child had to wait and wish them and you the best! 🏳️⚧️
I'm so happy for your son
my statistics teacher showed us this study to show us how to not gather data or conduct a study, so yeah, I think it's definitely pretty stupid and wrong
That’s a hilariously well done way to teach about research. I may need to see if I can get into that lesson just to see what you mean. XD
My lecturer taught us how not to conduct a research based on the study that started anti vax movement. I love it when they do it on such examples that people still like to use as a proof.
Your stats teacher is based, and I think more teachers should use infamous bunk/debunked/disavowed studies to illustrate key concepts more often! Maybe fewer people would try to then invoke those studies later on, one hopes.
@@dinosaysrawrOff topic, why are "bunk" and "debunked" synonyms? Sounds like they should be opposites
@@ninjoshday They aren’t synonymous, though. Bunk is an adjective that means nonsense, and debunk is a verb that means exposing the nonsense.
Scientifically, this paper was such an idiotic flop. It took every standard of research to make a study valid and did the complete opposite. It gives the same energy as doctors studying heart attacks in women using male subjects.
I'm shocked at the "methodology." In my discipline, you don't ever introduce your own argument unless and until you've shown that no intuitive or previously argued explanation accounts for the phenomenon in question. Here, the authors don't even have a solid time-line (rapid? Says the caregivers?) (And was the distance between family members caused by peers, by disclosure, or by caregiver response?). If you can't say when Y began, you can't claim it came after X, let alone that X caused Y AND did so "rapidly."
Reminds me of that MMR vaccine "study" that didn't actually prove a connection with autism
More like studying heart attacks in dogs by only asking people who have seen people have heartattacks
It's not only a really poor study, but such a catastrophic failure of peer review.
Jamie pointed out that Littman was informed of the failures when presenting preliminary results and did not correct accordingly, so they can't even say "it seemed reasonable at the time". The peer reviewers had no excuse for not sending the paper back to Littman with a "Basically re-write the entire thing because it's beyond terrible".
Sure peer review doesn't catch everything, and post-publication review is also part of the scientific process; but this one really should not have made it that far.
@@WombatMan64 yeah the fact that this somehow wasn't caught. It's literally red flags all the way, honestly kind of concerning in its own right
"Women are being upset about not being allowed to have an abortion. We have assembled this diverse council of rich white old men to discuss why that might be the case!" Literally same energy
Exact same.
None of those properties would stop a person from understanding.
You're just being bigoted, yourself.
(How about "misogynists", or at least "conservatives". You know, something actually connected to the topic at hand, at least distantly.)
Absolutely not the same thing in the slightest.
@@theuncalledfor ah yes, talking about conservatives not wanting anyone to have bodily autonomy "must" make them bigoted instead, when the conservatives are the ones taking away our rights actively. There have been hundreds upon hundreds of new anti - LGBTQ laws targeted at trans people and anti-bodily autonomy laws directed at anyone with a uterus, and somehow that doesn't make THEM ( conservatives)the bigoted ones?
@@madelainechiba2875 it is 100% the same thing.
" What do women want? We asked old white conservative men that aren't women to awnser that question for us since we don't want to actually ask women!" Same energy.
The fact the initial research consisted of getting parent reports and not the kids' accounts of their experiences is a huge limitation. Of course a parent who didn't understand what their kid was going through would claim that their kid "became" trans "all of a sudden."
It's well beyond a limitation. The author literally can't show, and there's significant reason to disbelieve it, that the hypothesized cause even preceded the hypothesized effect. Did dysphoria kick in before or after the kid joined this friend group? We don't get that info. But X cannot cause Y if it happened after Y! Thus, there is not even a causal claim worthy of evaluation.
@@valerielevasseur8674 yup, we don't get to hear about the kid's experiences, nor do we hear how parents feel about their children. all the study gave itself to work with was transphobic parents whining about how bad it is they have trans children
Besides, to parents it's not as though they'd see the change since it's an internal one.
'My tom boy daughter suddenly came out as trans! They must have been infected by the gay agenda!'
Or maybe he was expressing masculine traits and is now only able to come out that they're old enough to understand the concepts, properly put a term to the experience and feels safe of independent enough to do so.
The biases of asking the kids will be much the same. The kids will say I've always known just because that's what they're encouraged to say. Asking biased people has issues.
@@ribbonsofnight No, I would not expect that at all in the hands of even a moderately capable researcher. For one thing, have you not already found that when you ask trans people about their experience, you hear a variety of different stories, from the aforementioned always knowing to a slow dawning and so on?
Second, in a study about what it feels like to be [Group X], asking members of [Group X] how it feels is the only potentially unbiased starting point. One can of course insert biases from there, say, by only asking the very wealthy or the very Edmontonian, but one always has the option of good methodology.
Third, there are ways of designing an interview (far preferable to surveys!) that get a better picture of a scenario than the point-blank question. I did a lot of fieldwork around the world and never once asked a subject my research question. Say I wanted to know about the presence of state authorities in a certain West African country, and I've got myself out to a market in a minor town. The last thing I'd do is ask a market vendor "Hey, so what's YOUR experience of the state?" No, I asked if they came back to the same spot every day, if the same people were there, what happened if someone took their spot, and so on until we're dancing around the edges of their perception of security forces. One could very easily do the same in this situation.
Fourth, if young people said what they were encouraged to say and felt what they were encouraged to feel, they'd be identifying as cisgender.
As a scientist, the way this “study” is set up is incredibly ridiculous and irritating, but it’s even more infuriating to see that it was able to get through the process and get published in the first place. Who reviewed this?!?
Doesn't seem like anybody reviewed it from what I can find. Not one expert can be named. I'd like to know how it got through the process myself!
@alice1374 Peer reviews are confidential so it wouldn't be expected for anyone to come forward, but damn that would be interesting. I would not accept this "research" design from a first year undergrad. The methodological errors are so freaking basic. I want the tea from Reviewer #2, which is always the savage one. I bet #2 was the hero we never knew we'd need and tried to stop this from happening. The journal, or at minimum the editor who greenlit this shite, should be excommunicated from the academe for the alleged methodology alone. For the calculated cruelty we'll have to devise a new punishment.
That was my thought as well. Some people did not do their peer review jobs.
Your last question is inherently linked to the apology from PLOS ONE, as they should have caught and required the corrections right from the start, never publishing the original version at all.
Probably other transphobes
My therapist has described (and by described I mean listed real, possible reasons) ROGD as “I didn’t know how to express it dysphoria” or “I didn’t know it was a thing dysphoria” or “I didn’t feel safe telling you dysphoria”
I love her so much, you’re the best
The way my mom described her experience of it after I came out to her was "I could tell something was burning you up inside, but I couldn't put my finger on what it was." From my perspective it was "If I ignore this hard enough it will go away and I can live in relative safety as a feminine gay man."
My mom's beyond accepting by the way. Like any decent parent she hated seeing me suffer and loves seeing me thrive now that I'm free to be her daughter.
It is also something, that affects the parents as "I can't accept that I did actually have no clue who my child really is dysphoria"....
@@tjenadonn6158 Yeah, if you don’t know it’s okay, or are afraid, it can feel like that. If you shove it far enough away, you won’t feel it.
I’m glad you have a supportive mother btw! Mine took a little while but she’s come around and recently said she’d use my preferred name
@@hannajung7512 totally, for the parents it can seem out of nowhere, especially if they’ve spent time being vocal about their hate towards trans kids. Then, once their kids turn out trans, it’s easier to say they were “brainwashed” than to say “I was harassing a group my child is a part of,”
That...really helps put my situation into a more understandable perspective.
Granted, my mother was surprised when I came out and said she didn't wasn't aware of any signs of me being a transgender man.
She was also supportive and said it didn't matter if she noticed or not, she doesn't have an inside track into my brain. She was upset that she hadn't noticed anything because maybe then she could've helped me through sooner. I came out when I was 32 and by that point was a PRO at masking as a woman.
My dad's reaction was, "I just want you to be happy. But I will fuck up out of habit, so heads up on that."
My brother's reaction, "Oh my God, you make WAY more sense as a gay dude!"
I love my family.
Sounds like you have a wonderful family.
Your brother’s reaction is so real lol
ROGD is not a reason to dismiss someone being trans, that's the biggest misconception in the world! it's just that the Dutch Approach , ie, the affirmative model, was NOT INTENDED for sudden onset gender dysphoria, only for Early onset gender dysphoria. So the method of treatment that is available might not work! That's why people are doing research into ROGD, because they want to provide the right treatment. People with ROGD might still be just as valid and just as much transgender, but the immediate affirmative treatment model isn't suited for those people. Just ask Annelou de Vries and Thomas Steensma, they will admit this which I'm saying here right now.
Masking as a woman? That's also the case with women with autism...If you read 'but you don't look autistic at all' by Bianca Toeps you might find some things that you recognize, and help you deal with the masking.
@@maanvis81 I came out when I was 32 years old. Not exactly "rapid onset." More like "took a long time to figure myself out because I didn't have the language to describe it and then repressed it for another decade."
I wouldn’t have met the childhood dysphoria guidelines either, but that’s because i live in a small, heavily wooded town and my parents raised me like a genderless forest goblin. There weren’t male or female roles- I grew up baking and cleaning and wielding axes and chainsaws and driving trucks. No gender, only goblin mode!
Goblin mode!! This comment is a work of art
My dad actively encouraged me not to be “girly” so I didn’t know just how much I hated being girly
This should be a t-shirt "no gender, only goblin mode"
@@normalhuman9878 absorbed misogyny
Tbf a lot of the world is pretty ‘genderless’. When you see this topic online it’s often a lot of very privileged upper middle class whites whining about stuff they read in a textbook lol
My parents are pretty quick to blame rogd in a sense. They assume I'm trans because I always played male roles in plays.
Edit: to clarify, I came out and my mom was like "are you sure you're actually transgender?? I think this is all those years of playing male roles rubbing off on you" and just dismissed it.
Edit 2: didn't expect this to blow up, guess this is what happens when you comment early 💀
BRO WHAT OMFG
Excuse me.. WHAT.
I don’t mean to laugh but that is as hilarious as it is sad and stupid lol
@@SarastistheSerpent yeah fr lol
Ah yes...those darn plays...turning my kid trans >:(
I can get behind ROGD as a concept, but it's like ADHD, the name is how it's observed. I didn't know I was trans until puberty, so I would meet the "criteria" for ROGD. It would appear that I decided to go and become trans, but in reality I was always trans but no secondary sex characteristics were present to cause dysphoria.
So figuring out you're trans when you finally feel distinctly not at home in your body is valid.
Oh my god I totally get what you mean! I didn't experience any noticeable dysphoria until my secondary sex characteristics became a lot more noticeable!
True
literally same
same here! except I honestly BELIEVED I was experiencing ROGD myself and it was 'just a phase' so I didn't bring it up till I was in college. I discovered notes in my phone and messages and photos from 2014 of myself mentioning these things and I remembered telling myself once I was no longer in my teens and I was more secure in my life I'd finally come out. then lo and behold, it still just came out of nowhere... I shouldve just bit the bullet earlier on, you literally can't win against this mindset.
@@jellsies so in theory a "rapid onset" could be due to how rapidly secondary sex characteristics develop? Because the person is fine with the 'sexless' body of childhood (where name, clothing, and hairstyle alone can make girls and boys indistinguishable), but not with having a body with visibly sexed characteristics?
It makes me furious to think how much damage this highly unprofessional study has done!
You could say... irreversible damage xD
Indeed, I share that rage.
@@xXMindSoulXx good one there xD
@@robertmarshall2502 they aren't flawed and they literally did the exact same as this study. Only looking at the ones that fulfill their beliefs so they can ignore what actually happens.
@@xXMindSoulXx*insert that one thing they do with drums*
I told my parents that I was trans when I was 16. They dismissed it and apparently(?) forgot about it entirely, because when I brought it back up again at the age of 23, they acted like it was some rapid thing I'd never expressed before. Ya know. Despite having *literally told them* six years prior. These people have blinders on and don't see what they don't wanna see.
And you just know that many of those kids asked probing questions like:
"How did you feel about Caitlyn Jenner coming out?"
And then staying silent about their own transness if the response was overly hostile.
Yeah I was in the same boat. Since I was like 14 I've been giving my parents "i'm trans" hints, some subtle and some insanely obvious (like covering my face with makeup so it looks like I have a beard for every occasion we celebrated at home). I came out one day, they completely forgot about it though. When I was 20 and about to move out, I came out AGAIN, and my mom said that "there were no signs"... Because I guess having my entire wardrobe filled with men's clothing and cutting my own hair really short at home cause the hairdressers make my hair "too girly"... Yeah, every kid does all those things consistently for years amirite🙄
Yeah I'm in the same boat right now. I came out to everyone in my family a few years ago and the just forgot about it like, idk, I just made it up or something.
I try to get my mother to talk about it with me but whenever I tey she jus dismisses it like it's some wild fantasy.
I don't get how they can just forge something so important that I told them? But also, they really don't want to see anything outside of their norm, and god forbid if something is.
Littman clearly took some ideas from Andrew Wakefield (the vaccine-autism guy) on how to do studies.
💯this-
As well as Tyrone Hayes, aka the "chemicals in the water turning the frogs gay" guy whose study Alex Jones popularized.
To me it has "false memory syndrome" "research" vibes in that the only discernible characteristic leading to a term being coined is parent denial, but that's one heck of a lucrative characteristic.
That's where my mind went too
@@FrozEnbyWolf150Oh no. you just triggered my memory. Now that alex jones remix is playing in my head on repeat
I spent a year and a half fighting myself about being non binary. I thought it was me wanting to be different/special because I would have known if I was trans before I was in my 30's. But it all came down to living in a smaller city where I didn't have the words to say how I felt wrong in my feminine body and meeting not only trans women but also someone who is non binary and having that, "That was an option the whole time?!" moment.
That's so relatable. I've always felt that something was off when people called me my AGAB but I didn't know there was the word that described my experience and that I wasn't the only one feeling like that.
Same here, only I am in my 50's. The first time I heard the word Nonbinary, I was living in Portland Oregon. I was in my 3rd marriage and I had always assumed I was just an androgynous person who was pansexual. The gender piece of my coming out was after a lot of depression and struggle with internalized transphobia.
I didn't hate other trans/non-binary people. I hated just me. Unfortunately I taught my child to respond the same way to themselves. Not with words, I was always supportive, but via my own self abuse.
It's a lot of baggage but I am working on it. My hope for all of you is that you can live out who you are, in a way I couldn't at your age. I still have time but it's getting late, you know...
Same here. I'm 41 and NB AFAB. I always knew something was "off" about me growing up, but back then, there were no words for it. It took till my late twenties to finally go "fuck it, I need to Google how I'm feeling so I can finally have answers!" Back then, "androgen" seemed like it fit because the internet was still fresh and not much info was out there on various gender identities. A friend of mine had recently come out as trans, so perhaps I was motivated by her bravery. Oddly enough, at the time I felt like knowing my label was enough for me and I didn't mind people thinking I was a woman. Maybe it's because it was sporadic. However, when my fiance and I finally moved in together, that's when the gender dysphoria started to really set in. I absolutely couldn't stand hearing him call me feminine things multiple times a day. I inwardly cringed and thought I could just live with it if it meant keeping him. But it got to be too much.
I sat him down in our apartment hours after I'd had my therapy appointment where I came out to my then-therapist, who asked me if I could live a lie and be okay with it. That helped me make my decision. In a full blown panic attack where I was sobbing uncontrollably, I came out to him. He said he'd had his suspicions for years and was very accepting. We're still together and he's still getting used to using my preferred pronouns and not calling me anything feminine. He slips up, but he's trying.
LGBTQIA kids today are extremely lucky to have so many great resources at their disposal. Even if they don't have supportive parents, they're still far from alone, and that's important.
Same here as well. I had no childhood narrative, and assumed being trans meant a strong desire to be the opposite gender, which was not the case. Even when I found out about nonbinary genders, I assumed it was something that had to be "diagnosed" by a professional. After all, I'd been in therapy for most of my life, and nobody ever caught it. Nor does it help that I had internalized a lot of transmedicalism, e.g. transphobia coming from privileged binary trans people against nonbinary people. When I started questioning, my mind was at war with itself because of this, and I was convinced I was the only person capable of faking it for attention. I felt like I was appropriating the experiences of others, therefore I wasn't good enough to associate with the trans community.
In the end, I needed to hear from a nonbinary friend that it was okay for me to identify as such if it brought me peace of mind. It was like I needed permission to be myself.
Omg, same! I still question it sometimes, especially when I'm correcting people who misgender me (like waiters and retail staff) and feel bad about inconveniencing them.
My mom bought into ROGD in the early 2000s. I took a human sexuality class at the community college. We did the BEM Sex Roll inventory. She thought that because I checked off a bunch of the "female" traits and therefore was influenced to think that I am trans. I have late onset gender dysphoria. So I didn't start to realize that I was trans until after puberty. Funny how a process that masculinizes the body would trigger gender dysphoria in an AMAB trans person. I am also autistic. An autism therapist told me that an autistic person's mental maturity is 10 years behind their chronological age. That seems to track. That might also explain why I had late onset GD. Not to mention that trans wasn't as widely known about as it is now. The internet was a huge help in figuring things out. I started by looking at stuff on crossdressing. That eventually lead to me discovering the term transsexual. Reading up on that helped me understand what I was feeling. So no that human sexuality class had bugger all to do with me being trans.
My mom was initially not supportive. But she did a 180. 5.5 years ago she took me to the hospital to get bottom surgery and helped out with aftercare. My mom turned 80 recently. She was raised catholic in Mexico. So being a boomer is no excuse for being a bigot. My dad who passec away in his 80s in December always used my chosen name. She sometimes got the pronouns wrong. But he always referred to me as Jen.
Always nice to see supportive parents even if they aren't initially supportive, it's the learning that counts here.
that's so cool! good to hear your parents were good to you in the end
Hmm. I've never heard that thing about autism and mental maturity. How were they defining mental maturity?
I'm not denying what your therapist said. I really am just curious. I can think of some things from my own experience that would fit that description. There are specific milestones in social behavior that most people hit at very specific ages. For example, 10-13 being marked by a sudden and vast increase in awareness of and concern about how other people see you. Experimentation, trying on various identities to figure out what fits. Picking role models to emulate. All of these things, which typically begin in early preteen and teenage years, I've only begun to experience in my early twenties. So at least in regard to those milestone social behaviors, I am about a decade behind. But in other measures of maturity, not so. I've always been judged to be vastly more mature than my peers. Because maturity is a complex and multifaceted concept, and I'd like to know which part of it autistic people are supposedly a decade behind on. Social milestones, I can see because my own experience biases me to agree. The rest, I would need harder evidence.
The whole thing about maturity and autism is bullshit. There are different kinds of maturity and all people have levels of each. I'm autistic, but I'm certainly not a child as a 23 year old. I work jobs taking care of others in the disability community. I cook, clean, help others with emotional regulation and decision making, etc.
Just because our senses and hobbies are uncommon doesn't make us younger than we are. That myth just infantilizes us.
Also, how did they quantify that? Is an autistic 10 y.o. as mature as a 0 year old? It's so illogical.
The reason why it seems so illogical is that it is. There is absolutely nothing in the scientific literature that supports that, it seems to be the therapist's personal idea.
When I was 8, I discovered the meaning of the word "lesbian" from popular media. I immediately declared myself a lesbian... and I was right, and still right nearly 20 years on. Children and young people discovering that they are transgender from popular media, social media or real life friends is no different and nothing shocking.
It's so rapid it took me 20 years to finally come out.
It took me 2 years, but keep in mind that I live in Tokyo and was a teenager.
That's what baffles me about my family. I've been telling them that I didn't want it to be the case for almost 10 years due to various fears and that I've tried to convince myself that this is just a phase and I'm just a tomboy. They still act like I've just decided to follow a trend because I want to be cool and special.
It took me 23 years since I tried coming out when I was 8
@@exdetransitionerso, how well is this going?
@@themikaylashow9374the fact you were thinking about this stuff and not just having a good time is very sad, under no circumstances shout a child that young be deeply thinking about who they’re.
I'm 66, transitioned between age 44 to 47, and my estranged family is still convinced that I was brainwashed into believing I'm a trans woman. Gay and lesbian friends I've had since elementary school publicly outed me during transition to shame me into stopping, ending what in some cases were 40-year relationships. This insanity hurts children while also reinforcing a virulent, intellectually dishonest bigotry harming trans people of all ages.
Exactly! Because there was so little information about it, and a massive amount of stigma surrounding it, many people didn't even know or accept that they were transgender until later in life. Media and education about being transgender just brings awareness and clarity to the feelings that someone already has; it doesn't force people to be transgender. I have countless cis friends who are wholly confident in their genders even after being in my mostly queer friend group.
I'm so sorry that happened to you, sister. I'm about a decade younger than you, so I can't use my "Internet Uncle-Gay" moniker here. 😁 But as a cis gay man, I will say that what your gay & lesbian friends did to you is, in my opinion, sh1tty. And I would call those gay former-friends, to their faces, "Sh1tty, Sh1tty, ". Because after what they did to you, _that's what they are in my book._
I'm 54, have been trans since age seven but transitioned late, and have likewise found people from my generation to be some of the worst when it comes to gender identity. At best they try to be accepting and tolerant, but you can still see their discomfort. At worst they deny trans identities, and pushback in the form of disingenuous questioning on being trans. Discovering people my age had enormous hang-ups about trans people was disappointing, especially given so many of them considered themselves progressive. In hindsight, it validates my childhood fear of disclosing my trans identity, and the kind of reception I would have received from those I considered close friends and family.
@@kimbalfour I'm sorry to hear that sister.
I'm your age, but cis and gay. When I came out 31 years ago, I was in grad-school in Boulder, CO. Place has a reputation for being suuuuper-progressive … in _theory._
But I always found that when the Theory planted itself on the living-room sofa and went, “Hi There,” people changed their tune in the opposite direction _real fast._ 😠
And they wonder why we tend to not trust cisgender people and prefer other transgender people
Is it possible that it should be called “rapid onset parental awareness dysphoria” ?
Yeah, lol. In my experience, the parents are so spooked that they immediately go on the defense and try to tell the trans kid they're confused or must have just come up with being trans out of the blue
EOSPS: Early-Onset Shitty Parenting Syndrome.
"you never showed any signs"
"I wasn't allowed to show any signs"
Yep. Especially given that so many trans kids devote huge amounts of energy hiding the fact they're trans. When I came out as trans as an adult, I asked my parents if they picked up on my being trans, if they saw any signs. A firm no was the response I received. And I just thought, wow, ok, I must have been very good at masking and disguising my gender identity.
@@genericcatgirl”must just be a trend”
I'm the trans FtM son of a woman who is buying more and more books that are transphobic as heck. I don't feel safe in this house, even more when I came out at 14 hoping to get support and I did, just for my mother to take it away from me as soon as she started reading that kind of anti-trans content. Now I'm 18 and I can't wait to have enough money to live on my own, and start hrt (she won't let me go to the doctor unless I live far away from her).
But hey, I won't let her put me down so easily, I'm a fighter and I know who I am and what I want.
That sounds awful, i hope it gets better for you, dude. Stay safe
My mother does the same stuff, she told me I should watch this awesome, informative, totally unbiased channel called "PragerU" 😂
@@fledgeking Oh no 😂 Sounds like she needs to take a step back and look at the facts. A majority of their content is biased and unreliable. Add on the fact it's from a Conservative standpoint and that's a recipe for disaster
Good on you for being yourself even with so much opposition from your mom. I hope that someday she'll see that you know who you are and will come around
@@fledgekingThat would be funny if it wasn't so disturbing
Having a science Ph.D. and having published postdoc research, my view of this research is that it’s ridiculously bad. No-one should even form a hypothesis without carefully planned data collection and analysis to statistically separate factors. It should not have been published in any form.
Agree. I don't think I'd have needed my A level in statistics in order to tell you that their recruitment tactics are so blatantly one-sided.
it's shockingly irresponsible, I'd like to know who the reviewers were...
yeah total pseudoscience. The only way to gain knowledge is to challenge the biases, not try to confirm them.
"But it was peer reviewed! By me, myself, and I!"
--Shrier the Liar
Having no college degrees nor real-world experience as a scientist of any kind, even I could tell you that this study is a load of bullcrap
I'm cis-het, and there's plenty I didn't tell my parents at that age, even though they were largely supportive. The idea that parents know everything about their children is ridiculous.
Jamie, I'm a cis woman not at all related to this issue who has found your videos. Just today I had a conversation with a colleague, like myself a mom to small kids who was worried about trans brain washing children. She's a good person but just doesn't understand and is afraid. I feel like I did the best I could to make her understand, and so much of it is thanks to you. I hope one day the world is a safer place for everyone. Kudos
HiHo! Internet Uncle-Gay 🏳🌈 here with a suggestion. Ask your colleague this: "So, do you think being gay is contagious? Do you think gay men and lesbians have been 'brainwashed' into not being heterosexuals?" Then see what the answer is.
A good question in situations like that: “It sounds like you are afraid of having a trans (or LGB+) child. What specifically are you afraid of?”
That kind of question, what the parent is actually afraid of, can help them identify the real problem: negative social effects, which can’t be fixed by trying to change a child, only by trying to change society, and supporting the child.
It’s one of the ways a dear friend helped my Catholic MIL really think through her reaction to my BIL coming out as gay as a teen. She was afraid he’d never be able to get married, would get rejected by family or friends, etc.
She eventually realized the problem wasn’t her son: it was other people’s lack of support for him. She ended up becoming one of his biggest supporters.
I read that as "worried about TRAINS brainwashing children" and I was so confused 😆
@@OdinsSage I was brainwashed by trains as a kid... choo choo
@@ninjoshday
The USA is a country that is tragically deprived of choo.
I agree, social media didn't make me transgender, but it allowed me to figure out myself. Later, I gathered in group of trans girls that also were in closet in middle school. They have been invaluable help in behaving authentcally.
Social media gave you what you wanted.
And finally you surrounded yourself with people who had the same ideologies as you.
This is social contagion.
@@pirulino396 Nope
7:50. My whole friend group is coming to realize we are all LGBTQ+ and neurodivergent, being DXed/ coming out at different parts of life. We didn't know these things about ourselves or each other, but we all came together on our own. It just happens
i’m pretty sure this phenomenon happens because
A) neurodivergent people tend to act different in social situations than neurotypicals unless they mask, which can be draining
B) a lot of neurotypicals might find this off-putting, so the neurodivergent kids tend to form friendships with themselves much easier
C) most neurodivergent people are also not straight and/or not cis.
I’m neurodivergent as well and some of my friends are LGBTQ. Like you and Jamie said, it just makes sense. I don’t know how to explain it but I guess people who are different are better at accepting other people who are different.
I'm neurodivergent and nb and when I was struggling with my mental health and identity my friend were there to support me. Most of my friends are LGBTQ in some way, and I'm pretty sure some of them are Neuro as well, heck my bf has ADHD (I think? I can't remember what he told me exactly lol) so yeah this is pretty accurate.
@wren_. As a neurodiverse bi person I emphatically agree with most of what you wrote. We do tend to seek each other out more and more now that we can, because it's just easier, more relaxed, and less judgmental.
Except I'd like to add some nuance to your fourth point: I do believe a high percentage of LGBTQ+ people are neurodiverse, and neurodiversity seems especially common in the nonbinary and trans communities compared to cis groups.
However, that doesn't necessarily mean that the reverse is also true. While I can believe the percentage of people being LGBTQ+ may be higher in neurodiverse communities, I don't think it's true that almost every neurodiverse person is LGBTQ+.
Birds of a feather instinctively flock together!
I still have never understood how the book Irreversible damage is still allowed to be sold! I think that The T in LGBT is a far better book about Trans people and their experiences rather than using a bogus study! Thank you for your services Jamie and I've got my snacks and Hot Chocolate ready
because banning it would be censorship. Not generally against it, just saying that actually banning the sale whole cloth would be censorship, which is not allowed in the EU, USA and probably Canada, Australia, UK and others.
At best it could be lable "adult content" which would mean it had to be sold among porn and hard chore horror books, or the publisher could decide to no longer sell it because of the reputation.
@@hannajung7512you’re absolutely right that they shouldn’t be able to ban it, but annoyingly the USA in particular is very versatile with what they consider to be censorship. if you’ve seen the lgbt and racial pride book bans for children in states like Florida, for example, it’s easy to see that if authorities weren’t set in their bigoted ways, they would absolutely get away with making this book less available for the public.
No book should ever be banned but the ones that try to pass off a message or ideology as scientifically proven when it's actually not should be forced to have something like a sticker or big print on the cover that informs possible readers that what they're looking at is made up fiction, not scientific literature. Should be the case for this book, for many newspapers and magazines, conspiracy theory books, for any crazy self-published study that's not been properly peer reviewed, etc. Kids are not the only ones capable of being indoctrinated, there's way too many adults that will blindly believe anything printed on paper is 100% true
Because of free speech
@@chrisbfreelance nuh uh
So, you just came out? My that was rapid! I'm being snide, but I didn't know until my daughter came out to me, but that doesn't mean she hadn't been trans since childhood. I'm proud of her.
💖
The language around rapid onset gender dysphoria sounds eerily similar to the words of people who swear their children suddenly became autistic...
jokes on them. I am both
@@Salvadork87 I feel that. Amazing how quick your perspective changes when you suddenly learn about something that explains a massive amount of your life experience.
@@robertmarshall2502 Lots of autistic people are trans. Do you have a problem with that?
@@robertmarshall2502 You mean the five times likelihood? That 1 in 200 autistic people turn up trans instead of 1 in 1000? Probably that autistics are more likely to question social norms, and seek what makes them feel right and happy with less regard for judgement by others.
That's my take anyway, the evidence is shallow right now for why they're linked. In my experience the autistic community in general questions things about their experiences more than other people and are thus more inclined to seek out explanations. Autistics are also more likely to already be interacting with mental health professionals, which makes getting diagnosis with anything beyond autism more likely too, notably ADHD.
Having autism does not mean you cant be trans. The two are correlated, for sure, possibly as autism involves a differed understanding of paticular social contructs and gender is indeed socially constructed. This is just my own understanding, though. The atricles I read on Tavistock seemed to imply that one could either be trans OR autistic OR mentally ill OR have a body dysmorphic disorder. The case is far more complex.
Having appointments with a gender clinic and medically transitioning as a transsexual person is a long and complex individual journey. Globally gender clinics take varied approaches to medical transition and many times these can be imperfect, and so we should take steps to ensure proper affirming care is accessible to those who need it. This can only be done with time, and effortful research.
im not quite a scientist, nor a writer just some random autistic trans person, so I'm not sure why you asked me, but hope this was interesting enough of an essay for you Robert.
I’m still so happy for you that you released your book. I’ve been wanting to do the same for years but I’ve been scared to do so because of fascism.
All the more reason you should do it, to push back against all the fash propaganda that's saturating popular media. If you let them scare you into silence, they've won. And yes, consider using a penname and changing the names of real people and places.
Study recruitment: "So do you hate your children?"
Final paper: "Why are all the children isolating themselves???"
None of my “friends” were supportive of me as a queer trans person and they all thought it was a trend
I'm so sorry I hope you have/ do find supportive people who accept and love you ❤
@@aoifer6586 thank you very much 😊
I'm so sorry that your "friends" reacted that way. Sending a supportive mom hug.🤗
@@rnmommypants4216 thank you for the hug
I hope you find better friends. ❤
At my university, there is a Tabletop and Role-playing Games Society - basically, nerdy games society. It is disproportionately LGBT+, especially trans. Does that mean D&D turns people trans? No. Does it indicate that tabletop games make a good environment for people to feel safe, and be who they want to be? Yes.
Different environments don't create trans people. It's just that some environments are safer and more accepting than others.
My mom assumes I'm not transgender and it's just a "trend" maybe I should show her this
Yes do it. (As long as you can assure she won't take it out on you)
If it’s safe, please do it. A lot of transphobia is based on lies that can be easily disproven, if someone is willing to listen.
As you should if it's safe to do so!
i hate when people say their identities/sexualities are just a "trend" like.. no it isnt?? also, yes. show it to her.
Yeah, my dad was very resistant to anything that contradicts anti-trans beliefs. He even made excuses on right-wing forums.
While my mom doesn‘t really care what gender I have (nonbinary) she deliberately deadnames me to this day, because SHE IS TOO PROUD ABOUT CHOOSING IT WHEN I WAS BORN!!!
I don’t understand parents treating a name as if it’s a gift. Sometimes they get it wrong. My cisgender brother hates his name, so we only ever use his nickname - it’s not hard!
Have you stopped responding when she uses the wrong name?
I would. And then when she got upset about it I would simply say "Oh, I figured you were talking to someone else or yourself since that's not my name."
@@cathleenc6943 No because I had a hard time re-bonding with my mother. However, since I already live alone, I usually cut off contact for a while, if I get too much of her, while still thinking about a way to explain this to her in a rational manner (because rational is what she gets best) and hoping it won’t be one of those topics where she just naturally seems to disagree with me.
l think some parents have problems with their kids gaining their own autonomy.
@@Him_He_Me many do.
I came out 2013/14 . I was actually referred to a trans support group after talking with a crisis worker explaining my situation. I am not sure if the rogd thing was a thing then but some str8t people I knew were questioning my gender dysphoria and asked “ why did you wait so long “ ( born 1966 ) . I honestly thought I was mentally unstable or something my whole life but when I realized I was not crazy and there was hrt and transitioning I just jumped at the opportunity.
Funny how people say that they don’t care or the mind your own business turned on a dime and started attacking me with their heteronormativity.
Sorry to hear about those struggles. And as much sorry the current times show how malicious liars and haters are. I've seen a lot change since the first bathroom bill out of North Carolina in early 2016.
I saw the horrors grow and know the ongoing damage. I'm grateful to see some states and cities enacting laws dnd rulings to be sanctuary cities and states. It's not enough and too little too late.
We're seeing our right to peacefully protest get stripped away as well. The fascist police state has become a tool of conservative theological politics.
@@RickNelsonMn Yeah ;/ I do hope pride doesn't get targeted although it wouldn't surprise me if it did as through it, it's always been a protest
Yep. Tolerant "in theory", but as soon as The Theory sits itself down on the living-room sofa and goes, “Hi There. 👋”, they change their tune really drastically really fast.
"Should child abuse be allowed? We surveyed 100 child-abusing parents to find out!"
The absolute hysteria around this paper reminds me so much of the Andrew Wakefield MMR paper. It caused so much damage to parents’ trust in doctors and even caused measles to make a comeback after it was so close to being fully eradicated. It just goes to show how important scientific literacy is in society because clearly some journals don’t properly vet what they publish. Also because retractions or corrections rarely get as much media coverage as the original papers, meaning so many people still end up believing that the original papers are still valid when it’s been proven that they’re not.
I was just about to comment this myself. It's also incredible how both of these papers' subjects consisted of carefully selected parents with bad opinions that already agreed with the paper's pre-determined conclusion- as if that's how proper objective science is supposed to work. There are an uncanny number of similarities, from the brand new fake "disease/diagnosis" to the papers being modified/retracted, but people continuing to cling to them and/or not even knowing they've been changed/retracted, to the obviously improper motives for creating the papers in the first place. This type of fake science has happened before and will probably happen again.
Although I'm cis and not nearly as qualified, this pertains to my field of study as well. Trans and gender variant people were a particular focus of mine while studying both psychology and neuroscience. I'm also the parent of a trans kid and a large number of my friends are trans.
Watching this study be so expertly ripped apart with sources and perfect explanations brought me great joy.
If that brings you great joy, Cass Eris has a 14-part TH-cam series where she rips apart the entire "Irreversible Damage" book, line by line.
At least my parents will never be able to play the "but this is so sudden" card. They started out homophobic and transphobic, but seeing me (very much closeted) suffering through the years changed that. They were the ones who put 2 and 2 together and started asking me whether I felt like I should have been born the opposite gender, and if I felt the need to transition. They still didn't like it, but the alternative (me suffering) was worse.
That and my 70 year old grandpa, who has heard of trans people maybe twice in his life on TV, asked my mom whether she was sure I wasn't actually her son, when she was complaining about me isolating myself as a result of my dysphoria. That one felt like a punch to the gut, I thought I had this whole 'being a girl' thing down pat lmao.
Grandparents will surprise you. My mother claims to not be transphobic but is super open about the fact that she doesn’t view non binary people as valid and purposefully miss gendered them whenever she gets the chance, including my brothers partner.
However my super catholic grandmother who is also in her 70’s recently learned about my brother’s partner and hasn’t miss gendered them once and even took me aside once after watching me being uncomfortable about my mother’s enby-phobic rant and whispered to me “not everyone understands like you and me do”.
@@rosieg6989 It feels specially nice to see that there are people who just get it and understand it among the older generations.
Both of my grandparents are very catholic as well, and they are both supportive, though my grandpa is more outspoken. I already knew they weren't homophobic because years back they were asking me when was I finally going to invite my non existent boyfriend to have lunch with them. I half jokingly asked if it would be okay to bring my girlfriend instead. Was instantly met with an "of course, we'll be happy to feed her".
They view these things through a spiritual lens. They think trans people are souls that incarnated into the wrong body for no fault of their, which leads them to suffer. They are all for easing that suffering.
Your grandma sounds awesome! Grandparents make for the best allies.
@@rosieg6989
My mother (I’m cis or at least cis-adjacent myself), who is grandmother to five, has said that the Finnish have the right idea when it comes to pronouns and that it would probably be best if we just referred to everyone by gender-neutral pronouns. At least that way we wouldn’t be misgendering anyone. (We had that conversation because she mentioned that a childhood friend of my oldest nephew had come out as trans, and what name he now goes by, and one pronoun-correction prompted the aforementioned statement.)
@@rosieg6989your grandparents sound great!
Mine…not so much.
@@PostBASH Well, maybe not all my grandparents. The other three seem to stay quite when it comes to lgbt, but the grandmother I was talking about has been very supportive both to my brother's partner and to me in relation to my sexuality.
Also I am sorry to here about your own grandparents. That must suck.
My parents think I’m trans because my boyfriend is trans. They also think that I’m just pretending for him.
Boy do I get this… And now even though she identifies as a girl, somehow my parents still blame her for “turning me” trans - simply because when I first met her, I happened to start puberty (meaning that bc of puberty my dysphoria sky-rocketed). I’m tired of this sh!t man, we even broke up 1-ish year ago. Hope your parents acknowledge you for who you are, rather than what. Honestly wishing you the absolute best. Stay strong king
@@danielliammellywood3139you are what you are born as. You cant just decide to change midway through life
@@NoOne-wz2htWhat are you doing in a trans video.
@@mr.x2567 good point actually. I was apparently subscribed and got a notification
@@NoOne-wz2ht And how exactly do you know for a fact that it was a midway-through change, and not something that became more obvious during maturing, but had still been there for all our lives nonetheless? I hope you have some accurate scientific research to back you up, because I sure do.
I'm cis but I'm enjoying this channel so much. It's so nice that young trans people of today have such cool people they can relate to and identify with to look up to. ❤
Imagine having to look for in others what to identify with even if, according to your ideology, it must be an innate characteristic of each individual.
The whole thing is just, of course parents think the dysphoria is rapid, since the comming out is rapid.
As they don't see the clues throughout the years prior, for me I was lucky due to the situation however I know my experience isn't going to be the same for some majority of trans/gender non-conforming people as much as it would be nice to know that society worked in the proper way in all ways it unfortunately doesn't.
On one other side, the one thing that manages to still cause quite severe dysphoria for me currently is knowing how much longer I have to wait on the waiting list to access the well proven and effective treatment and currently going private isn't an option as the funds aren't there just yet - I haven't hit a low point for a couple of months now again however I get the odd feeling it'll strike again soon I just dread when that'll be.
The term ROGD gives me serious vibes of reading the comments section of trans youth news reports and seeing so much transphobia lol
probably because it is one of their biggest "talking points"
This study is as dangerous as the Wakeman MMR-autism study and I’m so pleased you are trying to correct the public record before this does any more harm.
Not sure but she is definitely traveling in similar dangerous mythical circles. Wakeman lost his license over it.
Disgusting groomers
@@robertmarshall2502 i checked out that study you keep mentioning; seems like the Dutch Protocol used an actual cohort of people who experienced gender dysphoria and sought affirmative healthcare, as opposed to the ROGD study, which polled confused parents posting to internet forums about not understand their kids
I have a family member who has bought into this and “irreversible damage”. and it’s infuriating. Not only is it maddening that as someone who studied science, she believes such a crappily conducted study, but as someone who thinks parents are somehow more of an authority on who their teens are than the teens themselves, she’s become the kind of parent she clashed with as a teen herself.
Yeah, though this is more the fact a lot of mainstream media is right-wing and shares tons of misinformation. Almost all right-wing media outlets always have low factuality or at best moderate very few actually have high factuality rates however the majority don't read them. They go to the ones which speak the lies and then it feeds through to where we've got to now.
Damn. Even studying science as well!?! Fuck that lol.
@@ArtsyKnox25 Religion is a very Powerful Drug.
@@John_Weiss Very late reply to this, but she’s not even religious. She’s married to a staunch atheist, and she’s fairly close to that herself. That’s perhaps the wildest part of it.
@@geeky_sasha6813 Wow. Just … wow. Wonder what conspiracy-theory hole she went down…
It's amazing to finally have a video from a trusted professional to be able to send to people instead of having to explain it to them very poorly. I haven't finished the video, but either way, thank you so much!! ❤❤
@@chrisbfreelance did you even watch the video? He's simply relaying the facts.
@@chrisbfreelance He did psychology work on being transgender. He listed multiple respected sources. He cited his work. It’s not an “agenda” if it’s following scientific principles of research.
@@chrisbfreelance He's a scientist. He has a Doctorate in this field. His being transgender brings no more bias or agenda to this than a woman doing a report on gynecological health would be biased.
@@chrisbfreelanceHe has a phd in this field and is listing numerous studies conducted across the world. I think that’s more trustworthy than most bible quoting transphobes.
@@chrisbfreelanceMaybe you should take a look at his works cited. He showed quite a few reputable sources over the course of the video after all
I managed to repeatedly build circles of neurodivergent friends, despite not knowing I had ADHD. People choose people who understand them. Period.
My response to transphobes:
I’m trans and I’m gay.
That just means I’m happy, okay.
Your transphobia has no basis,
So please, get it out of our faces.
10/10 descriptive poetry. I've been moved, brought to tears. I hope to see this in a book one day. You are a master of words, truly😔
If I ever were to write a LGBTQ+ supporting song, I'd hire you lol. That's legitimately good
Bravo fellow trans person 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Trans = gay. There are no "trans" people just as there are no trans cats or trans 50 year olds.
My response to Jamie - you're a chick with hormones
my dad insists I'm trans because of my "online servers friendgroup"
.... as if I've had the same friendgroup since i was 13, which is when dysphoria went from "hmm, something's not right" to "oh FUCK NO"
Tell him that people that like to fish have friends groups that go fishing. Stay strong and safe!
rapid onset gender dysphoria is a really funny way to say "i dont pay any attention to my children and dont care if theyre happy as long as theyre obeying what i want them to do with their lives".
ROGD is the same as a person saying "my ex is a narcissist" without even knowing what is narcissistic personality disorder... as a person who studies psychology, both are the same layman's terms that describes bias and judgement against a person... Also, why do you think your child avoids you and has mental health issues? Must be the social media right and not the mistreatment, rejection and abuse by you...
Love the Santa analogy. I have an A level in statistics, but I don't think I'd have needed that to see the glaring bias and prejudices involved in this study.
Ignore user mv5 they are a homophobic gay basher who thinks it’s ok to make stuff up about people.
Oh hey you’re the person going around telling people they aren’t real men and if they say they are they are invalidating people right ?
❤🧡💛💚💙💜🏳️🌈
Daily reminder; You are valid and amazing just the way you are!
🏳️🌈❤🧡💛💚💙💜
LGBT isn't valid tho
@@NoOne-wz2htneither is your profile pic
@@mr.x2567 id rather that be invalid than my whole identity
@@NoOne-wz2htHomophobia and transphobia aren't valid
@@ninjoshday they are tho.
7:00 It seems like it would be rare for a cis kid to have MOSTLY trans friends just...statistically speaking, right? Like, if they just met in school or because they share a hobby, the majority of people they encounter at random would not be trans. So, y'know, maybe they already felt like they had something in common...
transphobes: you’re only trans because you hang out with other trans people
me, a complete social recluse: hehe yeah totally
Ong I had 0 trans friends. I made one like a year after I came out bc my acquaintance came out as a trans girl 💀
if something, admitting you're trans to other people leaves you with 0 friends in itself, finding people who are accepting (or respectful at the very least) is like a needle in a haystack and that's why reassurance is so important. if we don't got our own backs nobody will
@@KateWick1997 i wonder if looking out for housing/health care would classify as a real problem
Typical case of social contagion: Just because you spend most of your time indoors doesn't mean you don't seek out social contacts online.
@@pirulino396 I don't think you understand what "contagion" means
Hi Jamie. I wanted to let you and everyone here know that I have told my sisters I might be trans. Haven't seen a therapist yet, but I'm working towards it. My sisters had a few questions, but I was expecting them. Sisters were overall very accepting and supportive.
Good luck
We're all very proud of you, and hope everything works out.
Well done and good luck.
I'm a math teacher and it drives me crazy how many logical fallacies are used when discussing trans issues and "rapid onset gender dysphoria". Like correlation DOES NOT MEAN causation, just because two things go together like "hanging out with other trans kids" and "being trans" does NOT MEAN that hanging out with trans kids causes transness - this is a BASIC principle of statistics, and I don't understand how so many "educated" researchers are getting away with perpetuating this myth. Love you Jamie and as always thanks for bringing awareness to these issues xx
Need a video on Rapid Onset Transphobia/Religious Behaviour
I have a degree in Biology, so when this study was first mentioned, I looked it up and read the abstract. The second I saw that they had asked PARENTS and not the actual trans people they were supposedly studying, I knew it was garbage. I didn't realize just exactly how much of a stinking pile of trash it was until this video. Yikes. Shame on PLoS One for publishing that one at all.
Lab mice can’t tell you if your experimental drug changed their behaviour. For that, you would need to ask the people with specialist knowledge, who have been watching them grow and change from birth.
@@EddGorenstain Most parents aren't psychologists, Eddie. They don't have the specialization required.
THESE parents in particular are actively against transgenderism, refuse to learn about it, and encouraged their own kids to suppress and ignore any sign of transgenderism. So we don't have neutral environmental conditions, which means that the experiment is ruined.
@@dariocarraresi1823 please don't use the term "transgenderism" we prefer if you just said transgender people or being trans! Transgenderism is invalidating and makes it seem like we're some kind of weird, out-of this-planet topic, and that we aren't human.
im a trans man with mildly transphobic parents, im trying to educate them before i ask to go on T next year (at 15 or 16). thank you for this jamie
Good luck!
Good luck dude, my parents came around to it with time and communication - i have been on T for 5 months now or so. I hope all goes well for you :)
I grew up in the 70"s and 80"s. Back then, we had no words but we still had disphoria. I had other friends who were tomboys or androgynous. Decades later, after broken marrages, addiction, attepted self unaliving and deep depression, it turns out we are all on the spectrum and are all still gender non conforming. I am personally back to my Emo, non-binary, Poe reading, pansexual self.
After I chose to stop masking, I realized I had to go retrieve the real me. I thought it would take longer but shadow work and Demonolatry made it a lot easier. I have never been more relieved.
For those of you interested in astrology transits and egg cracking, I came out when Pluto transited my 4th house Mars in Aquarius. Now that Pluto is retrograde in Capricorn again, it's time to bid a last farewell to the old closet forever, so the new better me can transform and evolve.
In the US, the same people who are cool with the lazy “research” and casual “I don’t need to have ever talked to a trans person to know everything I need to know about them” are the same people who dismiss any opinion on gun violence coming from someone who doesn’t know the make and model of a gun used in a shooting, the history of that gun’s manufacture, and how to clean, load, and fire that gun. They also have no sense of self awareness about this.
The concept of ROGD is so dumb. Many parents think it’s rapidly onset because their children don’t feel safe opening up to them in the first place.
It’s the “I didn’t see that coming” when the signs were there but they just weren’t paying attention and/or didn’t provide a safe space for their children.
More like, "Abusive Parents refusing to recognize that they've been abusing their kid."
Because when you go spouting anti-gay crap, your gay son hears, "I hate you," and when you go spouting anti-trans crap, your trans kid hears, "I hate you." And when you do it more than once, they hear _and internalize and believe_ that their parents hate them.
So why would they trust someone who hates them? Why would they open up to someone who hates them? Why would they want anything to do with someone who hates them?
In a nutshell: ROGD is the same as Matt Walsh running a Twitter poll to his audience asking whether trans people are the gender they identify as.
I didn't realize I was trans until much later in life, and didn't come out until I was already older than the majority of trans influencers. I showed no overt signs of gender dysphoria growing up, and I have no childhood memories of feeling like I was trans. It didn't even occur to me to start questioning until a few years ago. Once I did though, everything hit me like a ton of bricks. To outside observers, it would look very much like my gender dysphoria had a rapid onset. My best friend said it took him by surprise that someone he's known for so long suddenly came out as trans, and that's what it felt like to me too.
However, this is because the information and language to describe it was not available when I was growing up. I didn't know what to call it, and neither did any of my therapists. They said I was depressed, and that was that. The signs of dysphoria were certainly there in retrospect. I was diagnosed with depression upon reaching adolescence, right at the onset of puberty. I've had body image issues my whole life, but assumed it was body dysmorphia due to being disabled or overweight. I was fascinated with stories about shapeshifters and often wished I could change into something else, anything other than what I actually was, but I chalked it up to an active imagination. Of course I was a staunch trans ally, due to a friend coming out as transmasc years ago, but I just thought it was the right thing to do. I gravitated towards a lot of trans content creators, including those who would turn out to be trans later on, but I thought this was a coincidence. And when I did research on trans identities for my novel, I assumed the sources had to be wrong because a lot of those traits applied to me, and, "There's no way I'm trans."
There was no rapid onset. There were signs I was conditioned to suppress, deflect from, or explain away as something else. I was lied to, and didn't realize that until I took the initiative to find out more about myself. In a way, I was both the trans child and the unaccepting parent in one.
The sheer amount of anti-intellectualism and psuedo-intellectualism surrounding trans identities and gender dysphoria makes my head hurt. Thank you for this thorough response.
It's that old war again ; Science vs Religion, stagnation vs progress
Thanks for making this video! My family actually accused my husband of turning me trans (I'm genderfuild f-nb) despite the fact that even as a kid I REGULARLY complained about my gender, tried to dress differently, hated being called a girl half the time, as a ten year old lamented that I just wanted to be a "genderless blob," and when I started puberty, I tried to bind my chest with bandages and tape, really badly hurting myself in the process. I did not know anyone who was trans. I did not have access to social media. I did not even know the right terminology to describe myself. So then as an adult when I was ABLE to work things out, my husband supported me and helped me research the different terms and get linked in with a psychologist.
Transphobic parents will not see that they're child has always been trans, no matter how obvious it is.
Stay strong trans friends. We love you
My parents definitely believe this is what I have but they actively ignore all the times I mention the dysphoria I was feeling before puberty and say it's my confirmation bias. I simply dont understand
That just doesn't make sense....
@@Luka_Pelucaa EXACTLY
I don't normally comment on things but I just wanted to give a big thank you to Jamie and other content creators for talking about this study. I am a trans man who naively came out to his parents without realizing how far conservative, Christian thinking can change grown adults from people who knew nothing about trans people to stubbornly ignorant believers of misinformation. It's been hard dealing with the constant dismissal of my autonomy and intelligence in my household. I'm working hard right now to get my college degree and to be completely independent from my parents, but I have a long ways to go before I can leave and build myself the life I want. I look forward to spending more time with the queer community in my personal life and online. Content like this may never be seen by the haters who need it the most, but my favorite content creators, teachers, and friends have raised me to be a much kinder person than I ever would have been if I had stayed in my religion and become the woman I was expected to be. So to all of the queer people who read this, lets all choose to live so we can possibly cross paths in the future.
So sorry you came out at an unsafe time. I'm sure you'll get the life you love soon. Stay strong, King⭐️💜
I'm so, so sorry you're in this situation. I, your Internet [cis] Uncle Gay 🏳🌈 support you.
You're doing the right thing working towards full autonomy and independence. Make an actual plan: make concrete, easy-to-achieve-goals towards your escape and your future. Keep this secret, keep it safe … keep it someplace where nobody but you would be able to find it. Don't trust anyone who knows your family, either. I know it sounds paranoid, but better to stay safe by being secret.
Additionally, you need to grieve. Grief is the emotional response to Loss. And you have suffered a Loss: the loss of your family. I'm so, so, sorry to says this, but they hate you. Your subconscious mind has taken every horrible thing they've said about queer people and replaced, "queer" with _"you"._ That's just how the human mind works. So at a subconscious level at the very minimum, you already believe that they hate you. Which means that your bio-illogical family is not your real family. And you need to face that reality, and let go of any illusions you had that they ever were your family. And yeah, it sucks.
So Grieve. But … do it in a time and in a place where you are *_safe._* Not anywhere or anywhen that it could get back to your bio-illogical family. You can't trust them. And you _need_ to Grieve so that you can _release the pain._ You need to _Sever_ any and all emotional connection you have to your bio-illogical family. You don't need to hate them, you just need to _cease feeling _*_anything_* towards and about them. And you do that by Grieving the loss of what you thought you had, by releasing the Sadness and the Pain.
*_But Again:_* Do that in a place where you (1) Feel Safe; (2) have no risk of your bioillogial family finding out. I recommend a tree in an isolated part of a park or just off of a hiking trail.
You need to Sever your emotional connection to your bioillogical family _so that they cannot hurt you._ If they have no emotional connection, they can't emotionally manipulate you, or rile you up.
Meanwhile, remember this: You _will_ find your Logical Family to replace your BioIllogical one. Queer people did this back in the 1950s, after meeting other queerfolk during World War 2. Queer people did this during the 1970s after Stonewall, when they flocked to the West Village in NYC, the Castro in San Francisco, West Hollywood in LA, Boystown in Chicago, and gayborhoods in many other cities. They did this during the 1990s, back when I came out. I knew some of them [though I'm very lucky in that I have an accepting family].
You are not the first queer person that has needed to do this. You are not alone in needing to do this.
And you _will_ escape from your -family- abusers. Because for us LGBT+ people, survival is our revenge.
And again, even though it's parasocial, I, your Internet [cis] Uncle Gay 🏳🌈 and fellow , support you.
My religion teacher once said "The LGBT are people who wish to be promoted everywhere". I was brave enough to stand up and say "But they just want equality! What's wrong with that?!", and she responded with "They don't want equality, they want to have more rights than straight people, and want to be promoted" and stuff like that. It was cringe and it made me MAD. That's what it's like to mention LGBT to a religion teacher. Idk why she thought that LGBT people are people who want more attention and rights than straight people, like, where did she get that?! It's messed up. Every now and then, I think about what she said.
@@DangerJim-vq5uh Exactly!
She is true!
@@hypercane2023 She is true, she exists, yes. But that doesn't change the fact that she's wrong.
@@DangerJim-vq5uhTrans people are being outlawed in some states so.... no.
@@DangerJim-vq5uh Yeah, hun, just say grs. Your clunky, transphobic language is too much lol and what point are you making here? I was talking about Tennessee banning any dress that doesn't "align with your birth sex" which is fkn crazy. Men could get arrested for wearing kilts if the police mistake it for a skirt or masculine cis women could get arrested for looking too much like a man. Which is insane
The pinned tweet on Littman's profile says: "I think as humans, we are all susceptible to seeking out information that confirms what we want to believe as true and believing that research that confirms our own view is of higher quality than research that challenges it." ... you've got to be f*cking kidding me lmao.
Humans are a shit species then
Wow, is she really that self-unaware?!!
Part of ROGD that makes me mad is like.. yeah, of course, I was okay being a girl, but actually developing made me figure out I am not at all comfortable with the changes that happened. I was miserable from day 1 I noticed my breast buds, and it only got worse. After a certain point, you can no longer hide that discomfort. It looks sudden to onlookers but to me? It's been years in the making.
To quote John Oliver: “it’s like reading a study that found that mail carriers are heartless thieves and murderers who want to get into your home, and then finding out that they exclusively surveyed dogs.”
Or something like that, I don’t remember the exact quote.
This whole thing just reminds me of the Wakefield paper and its effects on the autistic community. We are probably going to have to fight against this ridiculousness for a long time to come, unfortunately. But, thank you for educating all of us with this video!
I was thinking the same thing. This will not go away for a long long time because of stupid people buying into it.
Im cis and I have trans friends. I take the time to listen to trans people and learn about transness. Because I actually understand what it is I have asked myself if I might be trans, if I experience gender dysphoria. I learned that I'm not, I don't, and I'm more secure in my cis-gender identity because of it. It tells you something about a person that they believe you can 'catch' gender dysphoria. They're so afraid to look at themselves and ask questions that they go to great lengths to oppress the people who do. Imagine being so afraid of learning who you are. Imagine being so clueless as to how you experience your own gender it frightens you that other people could experience it differently.
Damn you're smart, i didnt know you had a phd in psychology
that org should rename itself, "Transgenderism Speaks"
They're doing to trans people what Autism Speaks has been doing to autistic people
BYE NOT TRANSGENDERISM SPEAKS
I'm so glad this video was made. This is something that is so important for people to see and understand just how dangerous rogd is and how dangerous transphobia is for people
I tried to tell people in an on line discussion rogd was dissaproved and they simply said I was wrong and lying.
The myth of ROGD is the reason i have to talk to my friends in secret
this video was amazing and I'm so thankful that as a trans boy no one has made this conclusion about me (yet), i genuinely enjoyed watching this video. Thank you so much Jamie.
Also anyone reading this, have a great day, week, month, year, decade and life. You are valid :)
You too, dude. ^-^
I'm not crying, just some dust in my eyes 🥲🥹
I’m so sad that we still need to have this conversation just because of the amount of misinformation being spread about us as trans people.
my dad used "rapid onset gender dysphoria" and the book that one lady (dont remember her name and dont care to) wrote about how trans people are destroying our little girls to convince me im not really trans. 😐 dad of the year award
@tomjohnson1248 you underestimate how much ive thought about this. i understand his point of view and how he just wants me to be sure, but it's my mind and my body. my dad has a tendency to think he knows me better than i know myself. I've thought for years about my discomfort in my body and the language people used to address me, even before i came out. i didn't want this to be true, i wanted anything else. I TRIED anything else. i didnt want to be different, it made me feel ostracized. but i finally came to the conclusion that i would rather be hated and comfortable in my skin than hate myself just to make the people around me comfortable. and, by the way, i dont "think im a trans boy," i KNOW that im nonbinary. so take your arrogance and your nose out of my business, please and thank you.
@tomjohnson1248 also, gender affirming care includes things as simple as a hair cut and new clothes. its not as crazy as youre making it out to be, its life saving care. me personally, i would rather risk my child regretting transitioning than risk them trying or succeeding to kill themselves because i didnt listen to them. one of those things is statistically more likely to happen, and its not the one you think.
"are trans people real? We asked a transphobe!"
Jamie, multiple times: This *completely* destroys any credibility this study may have had and confirms it cannot be used as evidence of anything. BUUUUUT I’m still gonna tell you why ELSE it’s garbage!
Me: 😭 bestie it’s dead, you can stop kicking, please, there’s nothing left
i was actually told multiple times by my therapist when i was a teenager that she didnt think i was transgender because i couldnt answer any of her questions about my gender.. now being an adult i realize how completely logically skewed that is given that i was literally saying that i was confused about my gender and she said "then you must be cis" glad i didnt listen to her
Tried to buy your book yesterday and it was sold out in two different bookshops in Bristol! So happy for you. Looking forward to getting my own copy ❤
ROGD is just wow, people think GD is like an on and off switch
To them it is, obviously, something you're pressured into. Another already influenced person is going to scream at you to change your gender and be trans. People will push at you what they think your gender should be
Wait, it's almost like transphobia! It all makes sense now
How do I turn it off, I can’t figure that part out :((
Instructions unclear I turned off all the lights in my house but I’m still trans
@@Megarah0 LMAOOO this made me chuckle
@@Megarah0Instructions unclear, am now fansexual. It's like pansexuality but I can only get turned on if the bed is rotating.
This study really reminds me of the MMR and autism study from the 80s, with bad methods, extremely speculative results, and baseless conclusions - especially as they have both become prolific in society, harming young people in particular.
Why do trans kids hang with trans kids? Why do Coldplay fans hang with Coldplay fans? Why do horse girls hang with horse girls? Why do stoners hang with stoners?
its very similar to the study done on autism and vaccines, the samples were specifically small groups of autistic children who had been given vaccines, the issue is that other groups were not sampled, so the only evidence collected was specifically in favour of the "research" and study being conducted
Psychologist here doing gender-affirming therapy and this was SO STRONG I might use it for students in class. You clearly rocked your degree (obviously in addition to your own lived experience). Chef's Kiss!