American Eagle .38 Special LRN Ballistic Test - 2", 3", and 4" Barrels + Taurus 856 Accuracy Test
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 ธ.ค. 2022
- Testing out the American Eagle 158 gr lead round nose .38 Special ammo in a 10" Clear Ballistics test as well as some accuracy tests with my Taurus 856, Taurus 605 and S&W 686. Always appreciative of any channel help :) www.patreon.com/user?u=5828221
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I believe it was me you mentioned as the LEO that used the lead round nose twice in the ‘70s. I don’t know if it matters but when it “worked” I was using my issued 4” Colt Official Police and in the latter, when it was marginal, I was armed w/my issued 2” Colt Detective Special. FWIW I never had a chance to aim, and both OIS happened after dark so I wouldn’t have been able to see those old sights anyway. Thx for taking the time to read the comments & thx for another informative video.
Does that cause you to believe the 4 inch is inherently more effective and the 2 is not? Or strictly coincidence?
My husband says once again, I feel fine carrying 158gr standard pressure swc in my 442. Different ammo, but basically the same concept. Manageable recoil, and respectable accuracy. Thank you for the test, and stay safe.
It’s good to refresh people’s memories (or enlighten some) about a cartridge that has been around well over a hundred years or so. There are certainly effective modern loads in a number of calibers but in my simple view of the world the 38 Special in a snub nose revolver gives reliable and predictable performance in a wide variety of scenarios. I’m a big fan of Buffalo Bore ammo so in my 2.25” SP101, I generally carry two of their 150 grain, hard cast wad cutters up first followed by three of their 158 gr +P semi-wad cutters. Great comparison.
Yes, I too use the Buffalo Bore 158 grain, low flash, recoil in my sp101 3" 357 mag and love it.
I am old school and I carry a J frame loaded with 158 grain lrn. Every police officer in the country carried that load from the 1920s to the 1970sand it worked for them. Like you said you could do worse.
Barney had one so it had to have been good. Colt Police so he needed to load at about 11 O'clock position lol
Beats a sharp stick or a rock anyday.
Boy, does this bring back memories. I used to shoot 100-200 of these AE 158 grn lead every weekend for a few years. 2 of my shooting buddies and I used to enjoy shooting 100 yards with it, at clay targets set up on the sand bank back stop. (so about 103 yards) I probably have about 5K through my 6 inch 686 Classic Hunter with these loads. And yes, I got so I could hit those clays, standing, two handed, single action, about 3 out of every 6 shots. Tossed dirt on them for the other 3 shots. Taught me trigger control and follow through for precision shooting, like nothing else ever did. When I first started I often missed the sand bank. lol Good times.
A lot of things have been slayed with the 158 gr LRN!
It looks like most of the time it tumbles and leaves a decent damage path. Nice test, thanks for sharing!
Thanks for this. I got notes:
a.) “Some people” want you to take your gloves off in sub-freezing temperatures? Maybe, invite them out to your range to demonstrate? (Those three are all ‘defensive’ handguns; if you cannot shoot them WITH gloves, then they are not functioning-as-intended, period.)
b.) My little guns all shoot more accurately with heavier (larger) bullets. My favorite range load is my “Gun Sam Load”: a 148 grain hard cast lead wadcutter over 3.5 grains of Titegroup. I load those in .357 cases so they do not foul my chambers. Those Chrono’d for me at 706 out of a 2.625” barrel.
c.) I really like the red dots showing point-of-impact on the steel target. Those are very useful; thank you.
d.) You are now doing ALL of my ammo testing for me. I’m so ashamed of free-loading, I finally signed up for Patreon. Spend my pittance wisely, my friend.
Thanks a lot! My old true Gun Sam load is a load that I found by accident when I first started handloading and have not found a better .38 Special+P load. Any primer will work, but basically the load is a 125 gr XTP over 5.0 gr of Titegroup. I haven't hand loaded much all this year, but I have seen primers again at my local store so I might start again.
@@GunSam I got primers. I got Titegroup. If I can find those bullets, I’ll try that load. Thanks.
@@pecosjane If I recall right, this is that very load with the .38 Special+P th-cam.com/video/5SZpHL8JWH4/w-d-xo.html
@@GunSam Interesting. Thank you. Short version: Performance not so outstanding that it outweighs the downside of carrying hand loads in a CCW revolver. I still intend to load a box or two. I need consistent accurate range ammunition, and I’m a bit tired of scrubbing lead out of my guns, hands, clothes… Thanks for posting the link.
Paul Harrell has a good video on this round using his "meat target." He calls it something like "your grandpa's ammo." That old school slow movin slug just crashes thru everything. It's mostly what I carry in those S&W airweights. At first I thought had to have that fancy, expensive Hornady or Sig +p stuff to be dangerous. You know in that Skynyrd song, Saturday night special, big Jim had to be shooting 158s. Good video
Now that is PROPER old skool ammo!
This was an interesting comparison video. I appreciate your efforts to provide these videos. Hope you have a wonderful Christmas and a happy new year.
Thank you, same to you
The most astonishing thing to me about this and some of your similar videos is that you don't get over penetration with LRN. It's widely believed that LRN bullets over penetrate, and another person's video suggests they do, but you keep getting darn near perfect penetration with these rounds. This is an important fact.
Excellent video yet again 💥. It's helping me to decide between the 605 and 856. Liking the 605 more and more,
Really enjoy your videos , seem like you make your videos for the everyday guy and really i appreciate that . Keep up the great job, and MERRY CHRISTMAS to you and your family.
Thanks for making this video. I got a Taurus 605 and carry 38 special ammo.
Excellent videos with great content, hope you keep going!
Thanks for the video
I routinely shoot flat-nose lead 38 special standard-pressure ammo in my 5-inch Smith & Wesson. I have been very satisfied with its performance for target, self-protection, and home-protection.
Head shot at 75 feet from a 2" snub is not bad at all & especially from Taurus. That shows what a good shooter you are, Thanks Sam.
Thanks. Sometimes Taurus does make an accurate gun. For instance I had a couple model 94 .22 LR 4" revolvers, transfer bars broke but before that I was hitting a bbq gas tank from 200 yards shot after shot. Got a Ruger single six sometime around that same time, I could not do that, not even close with that 4.7" or whatever it was Ruger barrel.
I also have a Taurus 605 and it is a good shooter. Consistently can shoot 2 and 3 inch groups at 25 yards on paper.
Oddly enough, this particular ammo is always in stock at my hometown supermarket. Once my supply of Winchester Super-X 148 gr wadcutters is gone, I plan on using American Eagle 158 gr LRN for range and carry in my 856 3", 642 and 442. Simplicity and for my needs, more than adequate.
With no overpenetration and tendency to tumble its way batter than fmj of any other caliber.
Your supermarket sells ammo?
HECK NO! JUST SAY NO TO RNL for DEFENSE. JIM CIRILLO WAS VEHEMENTLY Against RNL I just Read Tales of a Stakeout Squad it was Amazing book Get it! th-cam.com/video/9UCncaieIec/w-d-xo.html MY LE FRIEND who just passed One of his many OIS was w/ RNL crap hear how bad it was! ALSO, many reports any angles on Skull shots it often skipped around skull you thought they were dead and bullet went around the head on outside of skull. Also, sucks balls barrier penetration. WADCUTTERS are acceptable....RNL IS NOT! SAM-Ellifritz data was probably good, Marshalls has been destroyed probably all made up (selling Corbon) RII was still believed back then etc..
@@timrobinson6573 Yup. Small town in Kansas.
@@DanTheWolfman If I change my location and habits outside the home, I'll switch back to wadcutters. But where I live, when and where I venture out, carrying a sharp stick is probably overkill.
Good info Sam. I like a 38 special, I've had all kinds over the years sold and traded. Right now I have a Rock Island 206, I like the old detective style, shoots good enough for self defense . Easy to handle and carry I like it better than my 9mm. Carry on !!
Have you heard the interview with Elijah Dickens lawyer? He said Elijah was using Blazer fmj range ammo in a Glock 19 when he took out that mass shooter. He said Elijah had no formal training and almost never went to the range but did a lot of dry fire practice. The lawyer said he watched the video of the event and Elijah fired four rounds from 40 yards, two from 20 yards and four from 20 feet. The lawyer sounds like a gun guy.
the fmj part I hadn't heard. You listened to CarryTrainer yesterday?
@@DanTheWolfman The fmj part came from the lawyers Facebook post, nthe interview. Sorry I should have mentioned that.
No, I haven't heard of that channel until now.
@@timrobinson6573 what I predicted in my Realistic Drill vid is closer to how it went down to info he gave yesterday if true
Thanks. Always a good and interesting video. Thanks for sharing and Merry Christmas. Take care.
Merry Christmas
Feel Better. Merry Christmas. Another excellent vid.
Thanks. I feel quite well and have ever since I got and recovered from Covid in October, but my voice has completely changed. I sound a lot different, I have to talk at a higher pitch to be heard so it's weird.
Thanks for sharing shots of lead round nose. Not bad.
Nice shooting Sam. Glad you got a 3 in barrel revolver regardless of shooting high and left you're able put some data together. That 605 is doing well for you. Thanks for all you do. Happy Holidays to you and your family as well as your viewers. 🎄🎊🎉. ♠️🎩🎱🎯🇺🇲🏁🇺🇦🔱🌻💮🏵️🌸🌼🏴☠️🏹
Thanks.
Good testing very informative and thanks for sharing!
Thanks
Another great video. Merry Christmas to you and your family.
Thank you, Merry Christmas
Nice to see old style ammo.
Merry Christmas, Sam! 👍👍
Great video, Merry Christmas!...
Merry Christmas
Compared to the .380's and .32's used in other countries in the 70's rnl isn't bad.
Good information. Not terrible results. Thanks
Thank you for this test.
I just went through a box of this at the range a couple of mornings ago. It seems to be readily available around here. I got fairly good accuracy with a S&W model 37 2" and a 4" GP100
You have awesome videos!
Hello there...
I dig knowing there's someone else out there who enjoys revolvers as much as I do. We're few and far between. My daily carry is a Taurus 605. And laugh if you want, you won't be the first, sometimes I carry a Colt 1860 army pietta replica with a 3" barrel. I'm just more comfortable with a revolver.
Thanks for the video.
Lead round nose? Revolvers? I don't know if I can bear so much hi-tech in one sitting. lol That was the most common load before like 1960 and as I recall, it worked. Soft lead tends to rivet in actual defensive use- clothing, bone, muscle, lung.... etc. hmm weird - Federal must be using hard cast bullets... As always, I enjoy your vids and the topics. Which is why I'm a sub and back here watching again Merry Christmas!
It was the "1986 Miami Shootout" that doomed the .38 Special 158 grain revolver load. Wikipedia has a nice summary of the event. The "1970 Newhall Incident" is another good read demonstrating how real-life failures lead to improvements in firearms technology. My CCW trainer always stressed one caveat: Newhall and Miami were COPS; I'm not a police officer so my needs are different. Mr. Gun Sam makes this distinction from time to time.
So in other words ,what Are you trying to say,?,?,?. The 38 round nose is good enough for self defence or not?
Thanks for this video which is very relevant for me. I have two 38 snub-noses and a good supply of 38 ammo, and am likely to buy a 4 inch 357 soon - probably a GP100 - to share the 38 ammo most of the time.
Sam you know your videos are awesome right?? lol the best!!!
Great to see testing with revolvers vs velocity vs barrel lengths. I Summer carry a SW 638 (shrouded hammer) 38 special airweight with 1 7/8 barrel 158 gr (standard pressure) because the best CCW is the one you have on you. I did try +p and it kicked like a mule.
Happy new year
Love your testing methods. Merry Christmas.
Great video !! Thank - You !
148 grain full wadcutters in the LCR and 158 grain SWC in a speed strip. I feel fine with that.
Good video and good points I would like to see more on the .327 Federal my go to gun for the in .38 special is model 10 S&W in 4" tapered barrel very accurate
Great test. 👍🇺🇸
Thank you
That stinks that you have one that's off kilter. It reminds me of how my 3.8" 10 mm from Springfield is spot on but the 4.5" is drastically higher point of impact.
They both have awesome groups but they definitely don't hit in the same place. Great video! Grandma/Grandma ammo will whoop yur butt just enough!!
Thanks. I figure it has to be the gun. I swear the barrel looks like it cants to the left off the frame to be honest. I'll probably make a front sight lol, it's pinned so it would be easy.
Good shooting in cold weather. Do u find that your gloved finger fits into the trigger guard fast enough for CC defensive action? Thanks for posting the revolver comparison!
Thanks, there was no wind today so it was pretty easy to shoot today. I have tried a lot of gloves and most won't work, the thin Underarmor ones are the only ones that work. The problem though with most any glove is that with revolvers, they tend to get stuck a tad in the trigger on the reset, which isn't a thing with autos. As far as fitting into trigger guard and having enough speed, yes it's just as fast as no gloves, but most winter gloves don't work that well.
Another informative video! I really like the "hit markers" on the steel. Sometimes, even though you can hear it, it's hard to tell where it impacted. Have you done any testing with 158 gr SWCs?? When I was growing up, that was what the PDs carried. Just curious...
yep
Good shooting
Good info.
Fixed sights are often not fixed in the right spot. Trying different ammo can fix this. You can also fix it with handloads using different powder and bullets. The sights can be modified also.
I think all fixed sight revolvers should have a dovetailed front sight. You can then adjust the windage by moving the sight in the dovetail. Elevation can be changed by adding a different sight or filing the top of the sight. This should be done for the load you want to use.
The sight in this can be exchanged but not by dovetail. So for shooting high he needs a higher front sight but for shooting left he couldnt do much.
@@Gieszkanne A Strong Vise and a Large Hammer are appropriate for windage adjustments on Taurus revolvers. (Not appropriate for Smith & Wesson, Colt, or Ruger.)
I can tell by the way it shoots that load changes wouldn't fix it. Like with my 686, it shoots left with this ammo, shoots fine with others, plus with hand load playing I have never really seen load changes change the windage much with any handload I have done in various guns, rather the consistent point of aim groups will get tighter, then looser, then tighter and so on, but rarely or never have I seen a "better" load change grab the whole group and pull it right several inches. I have shot a few types in this 856 as well as my other one that was a 3" and they shoot exactly the same more or less, high left consistently. Almost like the barrel is bent.
@@GunSam Sell this gun and live happily ever after :)
@@GunSam Try shooting it one handed in the classic target shooter's stance.
A lighter bullet generally hits lower on the target. By varying the power charge you may be able to get what you want.
A lot of things can effect a revolver's point of impact. Ask any revolversmith.
Good video - you never know about guns with fixed and pinned sights. A barrel or a pinned sight even slightly off can make a big difference in accuracy.
Thanks. I'll have to mess around in amateur gunsmithing a bit lol
Thanks for this evaluation and comparison. I want that 856 to be a good gun. Wish it lived up to that.
My first LE agency we supplied our own revolvers and ammunition. Most carried Model 19s and Remington .357 Magnum SJHP. A few years later I transferred to another agency who issued the 4" Model 66 and Remington .38+P Lead Round Nose, which I had ZERO confidence in. I carried CCI/Speer Lawman .357 Magnum SJHP in violation to our P&P. We were later issued that same CCI cartridge in .38+P and carried it for the next 15 years until we all converted to semiautomatic pistols.
The .38 LHP is about 50% better than the LRN. The 125 .357 Mag is about 100% better, so I get it.
@@GunSam I remember a loading of a semi wadcutter hollow point. There was a copper jacket that was not visible once it was loaded into the casing, but it contacted the rifling. It was 140 or 147 grains. It was loaded for me as .357 Magnum by another deputy. It was stout. Apparently it faded from favor. This was 1975.
With my 856 defender I ditched the ameiglo sight and ordered a plain sight from Taurus. Shoots great now, before I was having issues with lining up and it was shooting high due to wanting to center the dot. In order to hit point of aim the front dot has to be half covered in the trench. After two boxes of trying to get use to it I said hell with it. Got the new sight, painted it red and installed. Now it shoots as good as my other Taurus revolvers.
@@AK-ky3ou For what ever reason mine wasn't in the box, it was only 12 bucks so I didn't sweat it.
Your groups are better than any of mine!😀
All I can say brother, is you keep the naysayers quiet. Most of them could not shoot anyway never let it bother you. Or shake you up. If I could I would invite them down to your range on mine wallet. And we could see what they can really do. Keep up the good work great video very informative and Merry Christmas brother. The Lord be with you
They would first need to get my conditions and start out with a 94 degree body temp before I leave the house lol. My meds do that, it's painful out there but I enjoy it. Merry Christmas.
Good stuff. I've always liked this round for 38, I use it as a cheap woods ammo alot in my rossi 16 inch lever gun. I've always been curious how it would do in gel in a 16 inch gun. Always been a fan of 158 grain lrn.
Friend Your a GREAT shot , your 6yrd target; I think is outstanding with all the different size barrels. I am most impressed with the shortest 1.5" being just as good as the 3" . I've always thought that the realy short barrel didn't have much of a chance at the FBI standard 21ft rule , very impressive ! I've been practicing at 30' for a while now with two Glocks , the slim line 43x has 3.42" barrel and the model 45 has a 4.25" barrel . I'm gett'n +/- 3" to 4" groups at a quick pace with only about four shots on the bull's eye and the other eleven around it third or fourth ring . I'm looking for combat exceptible margin of error (least that's what I'm call'n it) but, while I'm say'n Freeze or I'll shoot a ring around you , You'll be say'n Freeze or I'll shoot ur f ing ear off ! 🤣😂🤣😂🤣 OMG to funny ! Seriously your a great shot Buddy 🤠 I can barely hit the red side of a barn , I should have took up horse shoe's or something. 😆
a shoot a 642 alot and this has been my favorite ammo. it stinks and is super smokey. i love it
I do not feel comfortable carrying LRN. Back in the 90's, I worked for an armored car co. A competitor had one of their guards held up. The guard shot the bad guy in the chest with a 158 gr LRN. right through the heart.The bad guy took the gun away from him & shot him 5 times in the chest. Both died eventually. They were fatal wounds, but not incapacitating wounds.
Yeah I wouldn't want to carry it either. I used to mess around in the woods with stuff like this, shot a desktop PC, just the shell with no circuitry, and the bullets were inside it. A 9mm would have went through probably 5 PC's, 10 metal walls. The .38 was one side. I was thinking, well that's pathetic lol
We used to qualify with that load out to 75 yards. They shot well from our Smith &Wesoon model 65s. We weren't allowed magnum loads. That was from 2000 until 2007, when I left the prison for a better paying job after a got my MS degree finished.
The round famous for deflection on windshields and bones.
yep
This is one of my favorite rounds accurate in certain guns and easy to handle but I must acknowledge that FBI barrier protocol especially the automotive barriers more or less ended the use of non-jacketed ammo even in a +p hollow point configuration and other calibers then 38 special. FMJ round nose in this weight is extremely difficult to find for some reason I believe Armscor and Fiocchi are the only companies loading it might make an interesting comparison but Hornady's production standard pressure loading of a 158 gr XTP might be the best option as a standard pressure loading even though it doesn't expand.
Nice review like always. I have shot 50 rounds of this federal American eagle lrn through My Revolver and they group like 12 inches under point of aim. If I were to aim Center Mass My bullets would be hitting the pelvic girdle. And I only hit Center Mass once I aimed 6 inches above the head on a cardboard Target. So I will not be buying any more of these.
I don't know what it is but I believe in this ol' round . Dad (a Cop) carried this load through the 60s' & 70s' with lethal results . I know of (3) for sure that dad terminated with this round . The 25% "One Shot Stop" potential is definitely alarming , yet so many have succumbed to this marginal round that there's gotta be something about it . THANKS Gun Sam for another excellent video !
I believe that the 25% figure that he stated was in regards to the 22LR CCI Stinger, a 32gr hollow point. The 38 Spl. 158gr LRN was rated at 50%. That load was commonly referred to as the “widow maker” in law enforcement circles. It earned that moniker due to its failure to stop felons from killing cops. It’s not a load I would trust. Almost any other load in 38 Spl. would be better, including the target wadcutter. Your dad must have been good with his gun as bullet placement is the most important factor of all.
@@Dennisthemenace40 I don't think my dad had much choice in the matter , that ol' round was regulation and he had 3 mouths to feed . But , like they say , "you use what you've got" . I agree with you , there are definitely better rounds one can / should use in the .38 special . However , in the event that the 158gr rnl is all you can get , it's good to know that someone before you managed to use it effectively . Thanks for taking the time to reply , I always like to hear other's perspective . Alex
my favorite squirrel and bunny load from my Henry big boy.
These are some of the most accurate loads in my 856
I am trying to find an article with pictures from the 1960s where an escaping inmate was shot 6 times with 158gr LRN ammo and they all zipped right through. There were a couple limb shots and stomach shots, but one did hit him in the upper chest but it failed to stop him from escaping. They showed pictures and gave an extremely detailed breakdown of the events and gun and ammo used. They had the guy just standing there so they could take detailed photos. I hope I can find it. I have carried those 158gr LRN. I'm sure they will do the job, it's just like with anything else you have to hit something critical to stop them. Better aim for the brain or spine or hope shock kicks in.
I believe it. I suspect this might be why a lot of current shootings with 9mm is the same way, but with non expanding hollow points. Narrow hollow cavities and real world conditions are much more difficult to get a hollow point to expand.
*than in gel
I would be wearing gloves too lol! shoot it's 13* here feels like 1*F brrr! That round is fun to shoot, easy on the hands and pretty accurate! Merry Christmas!
Merry Christmas. It's Six degrees here now, -22 wind chill.
Brrrrr!! ☃ Bet it was really bad last night! We're not use to that kinda cold here in central Arkansas! Have a good one! ☮
@@Nutty.357 Yeah here in MI this happens a lot. For down there that is super cold
I had to file the top and side of the sight on my 856 (2") to get it to hit point of aim. Thankfully it has interchangeable sights. I picked up some spares in case I change carry ammo and need to adjust the sight again.
I would prefer this load over a non-expanding hollow point. The damage looked better that some "defensive" ammo. Less recoil and less overpenetration is never a bad thing. Old school works.
I usually use lrn in my single actions and fmj in my double actions.
Request for another ammo test. I have seen some handgun ammo labeled as TUI or tumble upon impact. A comparison between that and some HP's might be interesting.
Not as big a difference as I thought there would be. Buddy you are a great shot,👀 outstanding groups ! 😎
Might work if you dump a whole cylinder in a attacker , dont expect one to stop unless you get a CNS shot.
Yeah, and the soft smooth lead is perfect for causing glances off skulls, clipping past vitals without damage and all of that. Difficult for it to do well. I plan on giving the 856 to my 72 year old mom when i'm done testing with it a bit, along with a box of 110+P Critical Defense.
@@GunSam I carry those in 40 , 1180 from my 226 in 165 , those are good.Hornady started skimping and not nickle plating them blaming supply chain.Really I will switch to 155gr Underwood xtp and get more energy and maybe 1300.
SNOW!!! Run Away 🏃♂️ 🏃♀️ 🏃♂️ 🏃♀️ 🏃♂️
Bro you really like revolvers, thank you for your contributions to the gun community offering your experience and tests for all of us gather more knowledge.
ok so i think the barrel lenght might not change much accuracy might not be the main cause of that but also the the distance between sights front and rear
Interesting to see that some seem to close the permanent wound channel almost completely and others do quite some damage (4:55) with the fibre board and the 2'' with just clear gel (6:30).k
If I remember correctly from those by the inch tests, there is quite the velocity drop around 3''. Would be nice to see a percentile with more rounds how often that happens from each barrel length. All just about stability?
Last time I said “now I’m gonna pull out my 2” barrel” I ended up with 18 years of child support.
Interesting results. The velocity difference didn't seem to really matter in the gel. I think I'm spotting a trend there, but I'm not taking notes so I don't know. It seems like energy is not the deciding factor. At least so long as you have enough of it. While I prefer modern ammo, that LRN stuff is definitely capable of ruining someone's day. I wonder what it would do to cinder block.
FYI, fixed sights on service revolvers are generally regulated for fifty yards. That's why they shoot high at 25 yds.
This stuff shoots like a dream out of a lever gun. It's even accurate. 2 inches or less at 50 yards out of the 1892. No fliers.
Thanks for the testing, your accuracy and skills should be plenty without having someone else shoot it. My comment on the last video was inconsistent ammo selection.
"Don't know any revolver shooters in my area". That is much too bad. Revolvers are as American as apple pie
I just don't know any handgun shooters except one. He's pretty far away and does not shoot revolvers. Nonetheless I really didn't need to bring in another person, watch them shoot 10" groups at 7 yards.
Great vid Sam, how did these 3 measure with their b/c gap.? affects velocity, no.?
If I recall, all are around the .004" mark. One of the Taurus revolvers was closer to .003" but I can't recall which one, I measured them a week ago or so but didn't write it down, was just like hey these all seem normal.
I carry a 442 and sometimes a Glock 43 but mostly the 442. 100% of all attacks are going to up close and within a yard. You won't need sights, just good hand eye coordination. That's what you work on the range. I use wadcutters. Big wide wound cavity plus if having to defend yourself in court, using a target round sure sounds better to a jury.
Hi Sam, I’m getting a 2” 856 in a few days. I won’t have the opportunity to shoot it for a while but bought a 38 laser cartridge for the mantis. How well do you think bore lasers/ laser trainers correlate with where the bullet actually impacts? I hope mine shoots more like your 605 than your 856.
I have no idea how all those work to be honest.
I ran these through my smith and Wesson 637 and got velocity a lot lower than what he got. My 5 shot average was 640 fps. Did it a second time and my average was 630. But I carry these for self defense and it is hard to beat cost and performance for your money.
Nice comparison. Looks like the 605 should be your carry revolver!
I prefer my LCR .327 Federal Magnum revolver. I shoot it better.
Interesting
Hell I took a file and flattened some of mine because I am aiming for more soft tissue damage at closer range while sacrificing longer range accuracy and penetration. But I feel that the closer range penetration and accuracy wont be as hurt as many might think but I haven't tested it out.
3" barrels aren't so popular but not much of a drop in velocity between it and the 4" suggesting 3" has more in common with 4" than 2"?
From my testing, the .38 Special between 2" 3" and 4" truly is an even split, like you get maybe 800 FPS in a 2", 850 FPS in a 3" and 900 FPS in a 4" with 125 gr ammo. With other calibers this isn't the case, like with .357 Mag a 4" is significantly faster than a 3" and so on.
Decent damage in the gelatine. Even blaze of fire in it can be noticed during one penetration-such energy release isn't characteristic for bullets in 700 fps range
Each barrel length will KEAL!
Whenever this load comes up, I'm reminded of Wambaugh's tales of the Border Alien Robbery Force (that's right, BARF). Their sidearms were .38 revolvers with LRN ammo, and they found it so ineffective that they began carrying multiple guns since they had to shoot so many times to stop someone. It got to the point they would carry 5-6 guns. Makes me wonder what they would've paid for a G21 and a few spare mags.
Penetration was interesting considering that this ammo is usually cited as over penetrating.
That 3 inch must have come from CA. High and left…
in reality for someone recoil shy , living in apartment, in a home with neighbors homes close and all around them this round might be best for them if over penetrtion is a concern . i would prefer a 125 grain lead hollow point 6 _ 8 brinnel hardness factor for good expansion at around 800to 850 fps. 900 if good expansion even better. just my opinion. Papa
not bad.