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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 22 พ.ค. 2024
- The world of Termina presented in the Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask is vastly different than other known parallel worlds of Hyrule. Was Termina real? Or was the events of Majora's Mask all a dream? Stick with us as Andy relays evidence suggesting that Majora's Mask was a dream in this Legend of Zelda theory.
Special thanks to @NebulAce1 for the outstanding thumbnail!
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Timestamps:
0:00 Why Majora's Mask was a dream - intro
1:12 Hyrule Historia and Encyclopedia disclaimers
3:41 The Happy Mask Salesman and Skull Kid
4:46 The allegory of the Skull Kid and loneliness
11:36 Termina is a parallel world and a dream world?
13:47 Terminian and Hylian counterparts
15:35 Why Majora's Mask can't be real
19:34 How Majora's Mask was Link's dream
Huge thanks to RwanLink for granting me permission to use clips of one of his animations in this video. Check out his channel: / rwanlink
Footage used:
Nintendo
ZorZelda
Gamescapes
RwanLink - A Mother's Love
Noclip
Music used in this video by:
Nintendo
Fanart credits to:
Tacoyaki and Aoki on Pixiv - เกม
![ตั๋วเมีย (ຕົວະເມຍ) - SOMBATH.97 Ft. YOUD SALAVAN [ Official music video ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/GV6qHagpp50/mqdefault.jpg)
You forget that the Lost Woods clearly has portals like the short cut to Zora's domain and Goron City. The Lost Woods are know for their warped space. So, it makes sense that the Lost Woods can connect to other places. There's also the possibility that the Lost Woods created Termina out of either Link or Skull kids' mind reconciling the dream theory and the parallel world, and giving an explanation of how Link kept his equipment at the End.
Because he dream too at the end. ALL THIS GAME a Dream! XD
Yeah I’ve never been into the “it’s a dream” or “he’s dead” theory simply for this reason alone.
ooh! good one!
I'm not sure that it being " _all_ in Link's mind" really makes sense, the fact that Termina has more technologically advanced stuff like motorized boats, instant cameras, automatons, music speakers, a giant water purification facility, all technology that didn't exist, either because it was lost, or had yet to be invented when The Hero of Time was a child. stuff that either hadn't existed for hundreds of years, or wouldn't be invented for hundreds of years. and what of Tingle, a character who was never seen by the Hero of Time but still has both Terminian and Hylian counterparts.
Yeah, I feel the same. Whenever Termina is a dream/Purgatory is thrown around as an idea, I'm always left asking for an explanation for the stuff that was invented in Termina and seen later. I never thought the hero bow was a strong contender for this, but things like Tingle not being in the timeline before this game along with Zubora and Gabora the blacksmiths. It's also telling of making facts fit your point when another Goron being called link is strong proof, but a bow the hero of time never used, but existing in Hyrule is weak proof.
In dreams people are imaginative and not EVERYTHING is directly from memories. Clearly people and things within dreams are derived from memories and our knowledge, but also a large part is from imagination. So the fact that some characters that aren't counterparts to hyrule exist also isn't evidence against the case.
@@Zeldom Sorry to say that misses the point of the above comment, which was that characters and items that show up in the Zelda Timeline's future and The OOT iteration of Link has never met or incapable of foreseeing are seen in Termina. I.e Tingle. Not really sure you could say he imagination tingle into existences. If you saying there is magic involved in creating and effecting Links mind, I could see that.
@@UnusualBox "characters and items that show up in the Zelda Timeline's future and The OOT iteration of Link has never met or incapable of foreseeing are seen in Termina. I.e Tingle.
*Not really sure you could say he imagination tingle into existences* " That argument falls a little flat since Tingle *was* imagined into existence by the creator of the character. It's far from impossible to imagine something that does not exist, else fiction couldn't exist in the sense that it does. Anyways, that's just my two cents.
@@robertwindshade7629
Just to clear my point up,. It was not that he couldn't have dreamed up characters, that's all understandable, but he perfectly created a dream version of a character that exists in the canon, that OOT link never knew,. As in if he had dreamed Tingle up, it is very unlikely he could have done so to perfectly match someone he never met.
Sorry if my point wasn't clear before.
That being said if you going to throw out points like this because the game is fictional, you may as well do that with everything said in this Theory, It could all be Skullkid's dream with the same logic.
Although i am not a fan of the theory itself and disagree with the thought that termina is a second coholint, I really like the video and the passion.
Even as a non-believer in this theory, I might have another point for it.
One of the biggest sidequest is the Tragic of Anju and Kafei... if termina really is a creation of and in links mind it would be plausable that one of the most complex problems is that of an adult trapped in a childs body...
Because this is links fate after ocarina of time.
He might have started as a child in a mans body, but after all the things he saw in the future... all the war, pain and fighting... he changed... he matured.
And so at the end of a a game when zelda sent him back he trapped him in a body he no longer fitted... to live a childhood he can not get back because his mind is no longer that of a kid.
So kafai might represent this struggle of link feeling trapped in a body that is no longer his real self... hiding what lays behind the visible surface.
That is a great point. I do still consider him a child once sent to the child timeline (not an adult in a child's body), but you're totally correct. Even though he is a 9 or 10 year old in a 16 or 17 year old body he still has the young mind which develops and matures as he has the experiences from OoT. When he's a child again, he must be very mature for a 10 year old.
"Time Travel!... I see this as an absolute win." - Hulk
Exactly for Kafei and anju !!
As a non-believer in this theory you bring a pretty perfect explanation for it :D
Great comment mate!
@@GodlikeIridium
Well... thanks a lot for that. ^^
But that's a great thing the zelda community is mostly really awesome... even if you don't agree with someones interpretation or conclusion, that doesn't mean one of them has to be wrong.
I myself brought some pretty weird ideas to the table... and even if people couldn't agree with me, many of them really tried to see and understand where I was coming from and stayed open minded.
You can say I try to return this favour as much and often as I can. ^^
On the point that termina could be like a second coholint is that each timeline would have a dream game, in the fallen timeline we have Link's Awakening, in the Child timeline we have Majora's Mask, and in the Adult timeline we have Phantom Hourglass
At the end of Ocarina of Time,I couldn't believe Navi left Link just like that. It was a sad moment and I wonder what would have happened if Navi stayed. The fairies from Majora feel like totally new fairies.
I know... it was so sad
The "Five stages of grief" actually strengthens your theory !
I do disagree with some parts of the stages of grief/death theory, especially since different characters behave differently even in the same regions so only a certain character shows 1 stage in each region. But yeah for the most part many of mat pat's arguments showing that Termina may not be real is valid for this one.
Even if the link is dead theory is cool and all. It's sadly not how it is.
The dead theory is already been proven wrong a long time ao2
I always theorized that MM is taking place during the 7 year hibernation of Links Body in the Sacred Realm would explain Malone and Romanie and her sister and the disappearance of Navi during his hibernation and possibly Tatl and Tale are Navi split in two. While Skull Kid is a Link as well but split. And this is the sacred realm testing Link to weld the Master Sword
Now that's one I haven't though of before. Interesting.
No, it happens after Link is sent back in time after defeating Ganon. He doesn’t pull the Master Sword, creating an alternate timeline where Ganon doesn’t invade the Sacred Realm.
Holy shit this one makes the most sense!
There's a lot of solid arguments in here. It's easy to dis-associate emotion from a silent protagonist but I always felt that Links character is, ironically well fleshed out. In Ocarina of time you get the sense of his accomplishments and his sacrifices. Particularly at the end when, as you state in this, Zelda reverses that timeline leaving Link and Navi as the only ones who remember. The rest of the characters that Link 'saved' are gifted the opportunity to be blissfully unaware of what, who or why and how. I always felt bad for Link, but acutely aware of his heroism and noble morality at the end of the game. Even as a kid. They did a great job of portraying his story. MM being a manifestation of his turmoil and struggles with the memories left behind from ocarina of time makes a lot of sense. It felt very trippy playing MM. I didn't like that people in the game kept bringing up hints or suggestions that they were aware of links past in OOT. I don't think I got it then. But this kind of explains why they seemingly have insight into Link. It's Links inner struggle as he trys to repair himself, with the various characters he encountered in OOT helping him re-discover himself.
Thank you! I personally like the dream theory because I think it allows for Link to have more character development and provides more insight into his emotions which is difficult to see due to the N64 technology.
Well done! I still think the "evidence" still points towards MM being real real. Nevertheless your effort in the vid is amazing!
Thanks! I totally respect the belief that MM was real and I think that it works really well in the fan animations
It is real, the hyrule historia explicitly states that Termina exists as a parallel world and as such Nintendo confirmed that Termina and the world it’s set in actually exists that is to say that it wasn’t a dream or a transition to the afterlife as others have suggested.
The theory is interesting but I generally accept what Nintendo has to say about their own IPs as fact or at very least it is the final word for the time being.
@@andrewtetz2198 A parallel world or a dream world.A parallel world could be a dream world
@@x-rax716 I must respectfully disagree, a dream world does not exist beyond the subconscious and I in no way believe that a parallel world which physically exists in a separate reality has much in common with a dream world which has no physical existence and are in simple terms of concept far from being the same the primary difference being that only one while possibly fantastical in nature can be quantified as reality while the other is purely fantasy.
Also if it was a dream I think Nintendo would have plainly said that is was.
@@andrewtetz2198hyrule Historia says that everything in it needn't be true since the book is a collection of rumours and other stuff happen in hyrule brought together into one book.
Is not a dream, is a parallel world to Hyrule and this is confirmed by Eiji Aonuma.
I addressed this in the video and gave my counterargument. A dream world by definition is a parallel world. If you haven't watched that far into the video I recommend you do so then please ask questions if you have any more questions after that.
I believe i watched this video long time ago or was a similar to this but a dream world is on the head, a parallel world is a world that cannot see from each other or touch from each other but at the same time exist, the song of healing from Majora's Mask is found in Twilight Princess era, a remix one xD
@@Zeldom Yep, because you clearly know more about the game than someone personally involved in the series. Not like you're desperate to prove your fan theory or anything. A theory that happens to be one of the laziest concepts ever, right behind 'they were dead the whole time'.
@@Zeldom thart not how parallr uvnris work paralel uvnri not dreams ther real places mtuvlvu rules say they are zleda runs of them
@@ssjgotenks2009 almost had a stroke reading your comment
I always thought of termina to be some kind of a “feywild” version of hyrule. In DnD, the feywild is a more surreal and magic heavy counterpart to the material plain, which is often accessed by travelers on accident by wandering though strange gateways in forests. The opening scene of MM always felt strange...as if link was not just going into a forest, but into some new dimension entirely. Love the video!
Actually that drawing in the beginning is Romani, not Malon. It was inspired by that scene in MM if you go talking to Romani on the Night of the Second Day before helping Cremia. Romani then suggests that Link will live with them, and she will lend him her bed.
I know, the full drawing also has Cremia in it but that was cut out. They are counterparts though so I figured the imagery still gave the idea :)
@@Zeldom so... I uh... would like the link to said picture... for specific and very important purposes...
Edit: Bet brothers I found it now it's time to use it for funny purposes.
@@MattSumGuy well I'm nine so it works
I really like this thought process. I have few ideas that could or could not help .
* in oot, Navi had to find link at the beginning. In MM, two fairies found " Skull kid".
* in oot, link had to say bye to his childhood friends because they were sages. " Skull kid"had to say goodbye to giant friends.
* there were 2 times where Link and " skull kid " had dreams of their past, so a dream inside a dream?
*happy masked salesman in oot had him delivering masks to different people. Which the masks were helping people.
* Zelda and seria's songs.
* I think the kids playing in the moon might have been a sign that Link missed out on a normal childhood.
Hopefully all these words and letters slapped together make sense.
Also good points. I'll revisit this theory in future videos so I may include some of those points :)
It was forest magic, being a lost kid trying to resist turning into a skull kid. Link was battling himself. The stump drawing was him being as Link and how he came to terms with his half as a skull kid.
I had a similar theory to this for a long time.
The familiar faces are memories of the people who he met outside of the more important people. The unfamiliar characters are parts of Link’s psyche that he is trying to pull together. In the beginning of the game, Link actually got knocked out when he fell off of a spooked Epona and the last thought that was going through his head was to find Navi.
That seems to work well.
it nto dream dont you knwo how aprlal ucvnris work it able to have poeoip who look liek others that you knwo look it up even pomkem game udenrstnas this so way cant you
@@ssjgotenks2009 You're gonna have to translate that, I don't understand, but anyways Luna has a good point
I think it's a Dream of sorts but a Magical Dream that is more then just in Link's head. I think what the Encyclopedia says is perfect valid, but that once Link is pulled into Temrina his memories also begin to influence it. Again very similar to Link's Awakening where it's the Windfish's dream first but everything in ti taken form ALttP is drawn from Link's subconscious with Marin perhaps also being formed from ancestral memories of Malon.
I think there is a partial truth to Matt Pat's theory too at leas thematically, mainly the part about the game following the stages of grief. I agree with the theory that Navi died at the end of OoT and so Majora's Mask is about Link accepting that and choosing to return to Hyrule at the end.
I also think Matt Pat was on to something with his death theory, but Link being dead just didn't line up with the Hero's Shade narrative.
Also I didn't know this at the time, but I think Link's Awakening is after the oracle series, and I believe Malon makes an appearance in one of them so Marin could be that Link's memories of Malon from the Oracle games since it's the same Link.
it no drwam they wood sisa dit dream the onyl pooepl who wan tit o be dream re poole jsut dotn wna cotn that as as paur tif cnaon wil to bad it is canon
I am still also going to gold on to the feeling that the Stalfos Warrior who teaches Link sword techs in TP is the same Link from Ocarina and Majora. I think Link in his old age, purposefully went into the Lost Woods fully knowing that he would become a Stalfos.
He did this because in his own life, his glory and masterful experience of swordsmanship was doomed to never be recognized or put to a meaningful use since he was sent back in time by Zelda and saved Termina but to anyone outside that world nobody would tell tales of him.
Becoming undead he could live long enough for the reincarnation of himself to be born into the world, so that he could hand the torch to that person and aid them, finally giving the closure and satisfaction he wanted.
Link wanted to be a hero. Eventhough he always was, he didnt feel like one. Helping his reincarnation was a way for his spirit to finally find rest, maybe not unlike the rest he gave to the residents of Termina.
I like this, except I don't think it was intentional. He says in TP that he has regrets. But suppose it was on purpose. In parallel with my MaLink ship, he may have gone off to to aid in the war/catastrophe that occurred between TP and OoT and may have been mortally wounded. Maybe these regrets were him wishing he had ignored his heroic urge and stayed isolated with Malon and his child. Somehow he could have taken gotten to the lost woods to turn himself into a stalfos so he could one day ease his regrets through passing on his wisdom to his descendants. Still doesn't explain why he didn't go teach his own son and waited until TP Link, but hey it's just a speculation
Really cool observations and explanations for why Majora’s Mask could be in the same category as Super Mario Bros. 2!
Thanks! I never actually played Super Mario Bros. 2. I didn't even think Mario games had that kind of storytelling since usually none of the Mario games are connected
@@Zeldom Paper Mario.
@@MarshallTheArtist The Thousand Year Door is perhaps my favorite non-Zelda game
I think he confused the plot of MM with Link's Awakening.
The only thing I can find wrong with this being a dream is Link from OOT and MM is the Hero Shade in TP and if you look closely the sword and shield the the Hero Shade has are the same ones that he had at the end of MM.
Pretty goated theory, the fact that people forget link after he uses the song of time and goes back in time 3 days is another representation of people forgetting him after the events of oot
Breath of the wild has the goron kings face and sons face therefore its a historic land mark of a real event
Yes Darunia, his son Link the Goron, and even Darmani the 3rd are there behind Daruk. I think Darunia and Link the Goron were an actual image, but Darmani died in MM and doesn't have any known journeys to Hyrule so how could he have a memorial statue in a parallel world thousands of years later if Termina was real? I think that in botw was more of an easter egg than anything
@@Zeldom link travels back to hyrule and has a mask that is literally darmanis face
There are a couple of problems I have with Termina being the product of Link's mind. Termina is decades, if not centuries more technologically advanced than Hyrule, containing devices such as instant cameras, motorized vehicles, advanced telescopes, and mechanical clocks. These are things that Link has never seen and would have no frame of reference for. Also, Link encounters Tingle in Termina. At this point, OoT Link has never seen Tingle before. However, Tingle appears in later games in the franchise, proving that he is a real person and not a product of Link's imagination. So this would mean that Link dreamed up a person who, by sheer coincidence, had a real life counterpart that Link had never even heard of before which is extremely implausible. Also, in the final cutscene, Link is equipped with the gilded sword and mirror shield which he acquired in Termina. If Termina was all a dream, then those items shouldn't exist.
Fair point. All other appeances of Tingle are from entire timelines though (Wind Waker and Oracle of Ages) so do those really count? He does appear in FSA which occurs well after TP which is in the same timeline as MM, though I personally question Nintendo's choice to make the four sword series canon. However Tingle was a real person well before Majora's Mask because he appeared in Minish Cap. Just because Link has never seen Tingle before does not mean that people can not have a dream that contains the character. According to the philosopher David Hume, we can have unique ideas based on an amalgamation of previous impressions, meaning that we dreams can contain people we have never seen before. It's not highly unlikely, and people dream of people they've never met before all the time. I also literally just finished a philosophy course with a professor who teaches several philosophy courses and psychology, and before becoming a teacher worked as a psychologist and dream analyst for 10 years. I asked him about this in class because I was curious from these kinds of comments and the professor claims that what I mentioned with Hume is still a widely accepted idea today.
That's why I get riled up when people try to bring Tingle into "debunking" the dream theories, since the logic there is very flawed.
Towards the end of the video I addressed that Link carries the mirror shield and gilded sword (if the player had it) away on Epona, so if you haven't watched that do it. Basically I support why I think that was still part of the dream and go further into it there.
@@Zeldom people can create new people they've never met before in dreams, but its pretty unlikely and even more so if the person you create is an exact copy of a person that actually exists. i mean the chance is still there, but i would say its negligible. also if we start saying some games are dreams then you have to allow every game, group of games, and even the entire series to also be applicable to dream theory. i mean if you say MM is a dream then why cant BOTW? or SW? or maybe the entire series except BOTW is a dream that link had loosely based off his knowledge of hyrule from 100 years ago while he was in the shrine of resurrection? i think thats the main reason most fandoms dont like dream theory in general, it discounts all the lore and is an unstoppable theory that can explain everything through it being a dream where anything and everything can happen
@@Wither_Strike I get what you're saying and this entire theory concept of Termina is interesting in all ways but if it is possible, then it can be proof, but it isn't proven or disproven, but leaves it still a possibility
I love this theory, I’ve always interpreted it as the scull kid made termina to play with link and it was all game to him like he said when giving the Fierce Deity mask to link. Good vs Evil, but this is an interesting take on it to
That's also a pretty cool interpretation. I love how the game is mysterious and ambiguous enough that we can all have different takes. This theory wasn't meant to be a serious rock-solid theory, but rather just a unique idea.
Absolutely phenomenal. I had this hunch since I replayed about 5 years ago. The Heart Shaped spiked mask aspect of Majora always made me think about "A spiked and harmful / chaotic emotinal state".
Like, Link was battiling with a Lesser Mind vs a Higher Mind, he still was a kid after all.
I think you're half right. This is the best argument I've seen in favor of it being a dream (Masked Nintendo Bandit also did an interesting video where he argues both sides.) BUT I'm unconvinced that 'all a dream' implies 'not real' in the Zelda Unvierse. And I'm not sure, either, that dreams only have one dreamer.
In Link's Awakening, both Link and the Wind Fish are asleep and both wake up at the end. It appears that the wind fish's dream created the world of Koholint Island (he does have to wake it up by playing the ballad after all) but some things seem to have been effected by Link's presence (like, before the adventure part starts.) For example, Marin apparently looks enough like Zelda that Link momentarily mistakes one for the other. So it almost seems like the dream worlds can be based on the minds of multiple dreamers.
Also in Link's awakening, Marin appears to manage to LEAVE Koholint Island if you get 100% completion. So it would seem that either the world is real in some sense, or you can leave it and become real. So maybe the dreams don't occur just in your head but in some kind of pocket dimension created by the dreams of powerful creatures (which would fulfill the instruction book's requirement of 'parallel world')
And then there's the matter of the ending. Now, it would possibly be effected by the exact order of things, but it seems that Link leaves before the festival but that it goes on without him. In Link's Awakening, when they wake up we watch the island fade out of existence. Now, there is the shot of Mikau(link?) playing with the Indigogos during the festival, so maybe he hadn't left yet (although, it seems like we see him leave first, so it doesn't exactly make sense. I've wondered if the implication is somehow that he prevented Mikau's death by saving the world, but that's speculation too.) So its possible that Termina disappears but we just never see it, but then the decision not to show it itself seems like a strange choice if it's supposed to be a dream.
So what if Termina exists because Majora is dreaming, sealed away somwhere? But what we see in the mask is only a piece of it (horcrux style) or a channel to tap into its power or something. The world carries on as normal when not affected by new dreamers, but when they (such as Link) arrive they can retroactively change things. Perhaps , for example, there are two farm sisters because tha'ts just the way things are, but they look like Malon because of Link's memories. And at the end, Link wakes up because his work is done but the world remains because somewhere the rest of Majora is still waiting.
Thanks. MNB is actually what inspired me to make this theory. When I discussed Aonuma's quote and the definition of a parallel world this is what I was trying to get at, but I think you just explained it better. I didn't know much about Link's Awakening (it's one of the few I haven't played yet) but I've learned much more about it since and I totally agree. Either are possible speculations, but then again we will never know for sure unless Nintendo official makes a MM sequel or gives direct information, which Aonuma will never do.
This is an excellent theory! But as a Zelda lore theorist myself, I shall both debunk you, and explain my own personal theory. Although I do concede the POSSIBILITY it could've been a dream. My theory is a bit more likely. Also apologies, my comments are quite long.
Let's start with your argument of people knowing Link is on an adventure. The Skull kid, Happy Mask Salesman, and Gaebora. Gaebora is actually Raaru, who stalked Link throughout his child adventure insuring he took the route of the hero. Presumably following that he went to Termina where he granted Link some of his power. The Skull Kid literally robs you and sees all of your stuff at the very beginning, so him knowing Link is an adventurer is not a problem at all. The Skull Kid's comparison to Link is how they bonded. Fairies do just wander the earth so it is totally a possibility the event in the log actually occurred. And lastly the Happy Mask Salesman INTRODUCES himself by saying he has been following you. And presumably from Hyrule too considering the man himself. I'll explain why I think the Happy Mask Salesman is such a strange individual later. (and the world is just far too complex for a dream. Plus Link can read in Termina. So at the very least he is not asleep. Words in dreams can't be deciphered as it is a part of the brain that is resting.)
I'll just cut to the chase though. Termina is the kingdom west of Hyrule. The reason it is so modern is all of the races in Termina worked together to create a stronger society of sorts and more freely using magic. Termina is connected to Hyrule just as places like the lost woods is connected to Zora's Domain and Death Mountain. But the main reason I know its west of Hyrule is the Breath of the Wild map. The western side is basically if you stick the OoT map and MM map next to each other you get inexplicably close to the Botw map. In the unseen map, it is likely the lost woods actually wrap entirely under the whole of Hyrule, and when it gets close to Lake Hylia, it turns into a swampy like terrain that would make Woodfall. In the Northwest is an icy mountain tundra, much like Snowhead. And one of the cabins could be the Blacksmith's old shack. The area between is the area of most interest. Ikana Canyon. Or in Botw its the plateaus north of the desert in the southwest. Essentially between Twilight Princess and Botw, Hyrule expanded in both directions. Just not far enough for Clock Town and Great Bay.
This theory also explains the repeated races in both kingdoms. They share a continent and therefore the same creatures. There's more Zoras in Great Bay because it is so much more hospitable to Zoras. There's more Gorons on Death Mountain for the same reason. Plus in Botw, there is a large statue of Darmani on Death Mountain along with Darunia and Daruk. So it's safe to say the Gorons on Snowhead migrated back and kept the tale of Darmani alive. As for the Hylians and Termanians, well again they just share continents and therefore, people look alike. Not the same, but alike. There's just as many new faces as similar ones. And considering Malon, Cremia, and Romani, my assumption is they could be Ordanian or could even share a bloodline. Hence the same song passed down.
Now for the Happy Mask Salesman. After minor success in Hyrule, he likely traveled to Termina. Specifically Stone Tower Temple. That is where I believe Majora's Mask resided. And he wore the mask and got corrupted by it much like Skull Kid. But resisted. I believe that had quite the impression on Majora, as in the moon purgatory, all the children are the Happy Mask Salesman. But his incredibly bizarre behavior likely has to do with his travels in Ikana and wearing the mask. Stone Tower is the place Majora was used for hexing rituals after all. And that leads to the freak known as Majora.
Termina was once blessed just as Hyrule was with a Triforce as Din, Nayru, and Farore passed through the area on their mission of creation. And like Hyrule, there are 3 candidates to have the blessings of the gods. Fierce Deity (courage), the Goddess of Time (wisdom) (which I'll call Ciana to reference the similar goddess in Hyrule Warriors, Cia and Lana, even if they are unrelated), and Majora. (power)
Unlike in Hyrule the gifts were all misused in some shape or form and the triforce was revoked, and the giants came from on high to fill the role. (which can be assumed is why they left the Skull Kid.) Ciana misused the triforce of wisdom by giving people too many gifts of time, hence the carnival of time to when she once blessed everyone...a bit too much. Now she can only overstep for the Ocarina of Time, which has far more abusive power in Termina alone. Fierce Deity became obsessed with his power. Seeing himself as a god, he became battle hungry and slaughtered many to show how brave he was and was sealed away. And lastly Majora herself. Queen of Stone Tower flat rejected her gift claiming she could one up the gods with her own rituals and magic. And I assume the Garo are her ex-followers since they refuse to leave a corpse. Most likely so their bodies aren't used after they die. And the Garo no longer there form the interlopers of Twilight Princess. Stone Tower even has a statue flipping off the gods, and block statues licking their junk where a triforce is. She was also sealed away but much more messily which is why her mask is of her chest/boobs. Which she happened to be quite full of judging by the large carving of them in the stone tower hub. But the botched sealing is how she retained her power, had a vendetta on the land and turned into an insane freak of nature.
I respect your theory but the one I came up with just makes far too much sense. And because of the Darmani statue, we may not even be done with Termina in this series. Triforce wielders tend to be unreasonably powerful and resilient and may have other methods beyond our understanding to return.
I don't think Termina's complexity debunks the possibility that it's a dream, in fact I think in some ways it actually helps it too. If you look into dream analysis, dreams are far more complex than people give them credit for and all the bizarre new aspects that don't match any other place in the lore could easily be explained if it's built by a hybrid of reality and imagination.
I do love the points you made here. If you don't mind I would like to screenshot this comment and reference it in a future video when I revisit this topic.
@@Zeldom absolutely! I love analyzing this series so if you ever see my essay comments, feel free to reference as you see fit.
i love this theory! Bravo! However, I do have my personal interpretations to some of the things you talked about. For instance, i don't think Skull Kid is an allegory for Link, but rather that there is a parallel between the two. Thus, Link is helping Skull Kid heal from his loneliness, as he did with other spirits with the song of healing, because he feels the same pain Skull Kid does. One of the reasons is that Skull Kid did exist, and was enough of a friend to Link for him to guard the Temple of Time in TP
Good points. One thing though is that the Skull Kid in TP being the same one is just a theory (one of the stronger ones, but still). Great thoughts
In MM, Skull kid in the beginning right before taking the Ocarina of time says "Its this guy". Link and this Skull Kid have met before in OOT. It's the one you play Saria's song to.
Yo you're so underrated this is a really good theory it actually makes sense you got a new sub looking forward to seeing more of these type of vids 😁
I appreciate it!
Creator shot the "Link is Dead" and "All a Dream" theories down a long time ago. Termina is a world that is in-between worlds. Termina means terminal as in a place of coming and going. (like an airport terminal. Not the other kind referring to being dead...)
I really don't think that Termina is part of Lorule. There's some possible symbolism from the stone tower, but that's speculation. There's plenty of other valid reasons to prove Termina is not Lorule.
@@Zeldom I didn't say Lorule. There are multiple realms connected like the Sacred Realm, Lorule, Termina, the Twili Realm, etc... All are separate alternate realms that exist in alternate dimensional spaces connected in some way or another. Termina would be like a stopover existing in the space between these places.
I was skeptical at the title, but wow the evidence is very strong. The connection that Link drew on his house/the stump at the end of MM was solid. Great work! Changes how I look at MM.
Glad I could exceed expectations and give a new light to MM!
Its crazy that the Hero of Time is still such an interesting and talked about character after all these years
Developer: "It's not a dream"
Some TH-camrs: "Let me explain to you why the developer is wrong"
Dude I love your videos, binging like crazy haha keep it up
I believe the world created by Majora is more about exploiting the Skull Kids grief. However I believe the world in the moon was all that Majora could create with Skull Kids memories so it pulled in Link and his memories of Hyrule to build Termina.
I like that someone is talking about link like a person with thoughts and feelings. Although the game makes him appear very robotic, and he doesnt speak, I like to think that he does have relationships with the characters he interacts with and does face inner turmoil.
If this theory was true there are a very interesting things that could make it more convincing. Theres no focus at all on the triforce in MM which would make sense if it's just his dream and is about him and his inner strife. Also if that was true the fierce deity could be the representation of the heroic side of link, while majora is the embodiment of his loss and struggle. The happy mask salesman playing the role he plays also makes sense because as a child he would most likely appear creepy and upsetting, and although he is a hero hes still a child. So that creepiness could be manifesting in his dream.
Interesting theory! Keep em coming :)
Yes I think its important to give insight on Link's emotions. If a have 1 complaint with the N64 games it's the lack of emotional expression shown on the characters faces, but that's due to lack of technology, not the game's fault. I think the 3D remakes gave a little bit more, but still.
I also like all of your insights too for the theory.
I always thought it was a dream because the expression on the Moon's face looked similar to Ganondorf's when the sages imprisoned him
Lol mind = blown :)
bro termina is real and do you remember darmani in goron village yeah he died and then it appears that his statue in botw in goron city as a memory of darmani being a hero in goron village in termina and that means termina is real
The fact that Majora's mask is on the wall in Link's house in a link between worlds proves that MM probably did happen. The mask in his house is most likely a fake or lost it's power, but it means the mask is not just from a dream, it was real even in the fallen hero timeline.
Actually one thing I quite like about this theory is how it parallels with the main game play gimmick of time travel. Each time you loop back, everyone forgets you, and the deeds you've done are undone; only you know what you went through. It very much reflects one he was going through prior to the dream.
I still think it wasn't actually a dream, I think people read too much into things sometimes, but this is still a nice interpretation.
Great video man!
Appreciate it!
I feel like the inside of the moon looks like that because your in the moons thoughts or dreams and it wants to be like the sun (more happy and more liked) but it is forced to fall down and it’s angry that it has to be like that
But good theory I personally like that it’s real more but I do like and believe this one a fair amount
I think an entire theory about the moon could be made from the sun/moon symbolism across Termina and especially clocktown
I love this so much! it lines up a lot with my Adult Timeline is a Dream Theory too! Great work dude!
Thank you :)
The way i see it it's like Termina is Zelda's Silent Hill. The world itself and the creatures you meet reshape in accordance with your mind. There is a "Real" Termina with its own history and people but during the events of MM it is twisted thanks to the Mask's powers and the conscience of Link and Skull Kid (and possibly the Mask Salesman).
So in a weird way, Termina is Silent Hill?
Like how Alessa's fears, hatred, and sorrows transform the Land of Silenced Spirits into Silent Hill and it's Fod World...
I agree that MM is about introspection (Link's introspection), but at the end of TP we find out that Link died with many regrets(maybe more than we can see). For me the theory of MM = Purgatory still strong. In TP the adult regrets or the hero/warrior's regrets "heal", while in MM the neglected child, that stolen childhood "heal" through a carnival, fireworks, funny masks, hugs and the recognition from others ("little hero", "one of my favourite customers", "Thank you... you were pretty cool", etc)
I also have a theory that based on the game being entirely represented around masks that all have special powers, do not in OoT, excluding the Mask of Truth, which also helps because maybe he can bring up something like "If the Mask of Truth can have powers, maybe any and every mask can have some kind of use and power" and that all of those masks that return from OoT (Mask of Truth, Zora, Goron, Bunny Hood, Keaton) have power in this one making it way more up to par with being a dream because how can a Bunny Hood make you specifically run faster in MM and not in OoT? I just think it's bizarre
After watching, I sadly agree and applaud you for your explanation.
Although I detest ‘it was all just a dream’ driven stories, I love majoras mask, and now agree that it was probably just that.
Awesome vid dude🍻
Thank you! I'm glad I could give a new perspective. Even if it doesn't change people's mind that's perfectly fine. I just want to do a good job explaining the argument for the dream's possibility
14:25 I love that the beggar in OOT is now a banker in MM 😆
The beginning of MM is very similar to Alice in wonderland: the protagonist follows a white rabbit (the skull kid), then arrives into the wood, falling into a hole reaching another world. So the vision or the dream as origin of the travel to Termina is an interesting hypothesis, and we could accept it as a narrative expedient useful to explain the world of MM (as a copy of the world of OoT) and introduce the player to the game. But truly Termina is an alternative dimension to the world of Hyrule, so they are both real in the same manner, and what is left in the first world here finds a resolution, in this new world. The problem of loneliness belongs to Link as to the Skull Kid (who's a sort of alter ego of the protagonist) and to the other characters (Kafei and Anju, also Tatl remains alone, just think to the histories behind the three masks: everybody with his own story repeats the felling of Link). That's why there's no princess to save: the effort and the quest of MM is focus on the mercy and giving help to the other people.
The more we analyze MM even 20 years after the more beautiful it becomes. Idk if it was intentional or not, but regardless the game is pure art
@@Zeldom the value and the beauty of MM is the sense of ancient and lost cultures and civilisation. So it's not an usual fable. You can notice it in the architectures of the game, the mysterious geometric decorations of the wall of the citadel, all the dungeons of Ikana share this atmosphere (the giant architecture of royal palace, the vertigo of the temple, also in the graveyard the underground theatre's really great). You can find something similar somewhere in Oot (especially the ruined forest temple, a sort of western version of the Jungle of the book's central American temple), the masterpieces of this genre are Ico, Shadow of the colossus and his sequel. It's also interesting the lower flour of the pyramid of Mario 64.
One extra theory I personally have within this theory involves the couple, in Majora's Mask the adult male that gets turned into a kid (excuse me, I'm not exactly a "Zelda fan" but I do like the lore so excuse me if I forget names.) And the lady he was supposed to marry. I think the boy is supposed to be Link and the lady is supposed to be Malon. Link is a young boy at the beginning Ocarina and doesn't have a grasp on "love" and meets Malon, and maybe has a little pitter patter in his heart but doesn't really feel anything otherwise. But then, he returns to Lon Lon Ranch in the future, saving Epona and meeting Malon again, feeling more than that little pitter patter and after helping liberate the farm from Ingo and Ganon's control, he stays there and bonds with Malon for a few days, seeing Talon as another father figure alongside his old father, the Great Deku Tree. Link then leaves after helping out around the farm for a while and even becomes closer with Malon, but not quite girlfriend and boyfriend yet. Ocarina continues and Link beats Ganon but is forced back in time, leaving his relationship with Epona, Talon, and more importantly, Malon in the future with the three forever wondering where Link disappeared off to. Then, as the theory in this video goes, Link has a dream that leads him through his adventure in Termina after meeting Epona, Talon, and Malon after coming from Castle Town. Link asks to take Epona, goes to the Lost Woods to find Navi, and falls asleep at that stump. One event in his dream involves an adult male, forced to become a kid and a red haired female who had loved each other, then their iconic mask, the Sun Mask I believe, is representing Epona (the classic thing of riding over the sunset on your horse) and like Link and Malon, we don't see what happens to them at the end. They marry, but we dont know if the male becomes an adult again, in perspective of Link's fears. Link fears that he won't become an adult again and get together with Malon, remember that Link has been a kid throughout this whole thing. His body was older for one point but his mind was still the same, so while he was with Malon, he slowly understood the prospects of love but never knew if Malon loved him back, like the blue haired male didn't know if his loved one, the red haired lady would love him as a young boy. And the aspect of Link being a blue haired male instead of a blonde haired male in this, might go along with him just being a kid and never really wanting to be a Hero. If he didnt have the blood of the hero, if his parents didn't die, what would've happened to Link? What would've been his future?... I think I had more but I think that's enough for now.
I just replayed Oracle of Ages, and noticed something peculiar. In that game, when you free Zed, she tells you that the wielder of courage also possess the ability of oneiromancy. This is expanded on by us using this ability to pass certain obstacles in dungeons.
It was something intresting I noticed but i don't actually know where those games place on the timeline.
I've never seen a theory like this before! I believed that Termina isn't real, but not like how it's stated in this video, but when Link falls down the mysterious hole and basically goes on an acid trip. He even lands on a flower, which just seems symbolic. However, I also like this theory, so I don't know what I believe anymore! :D The drawing on the stump I just assumed was a drawing Skull Kid drew at some point somewhere, and may not have been seen by Link at all, or it may have been seen by him later, since Skull Kid seemed to be from Hyrule as well when he mentions the Lost Woods and a kid playing him music with an Ocarina, as well as the Happy Mask Salesman, who seems to know that Link is on a journey and flat out asks a kid to fetch this deadly item that you wouldn't ask of a child. He also says "shouldn't you be getting home too?", showing that he knows. Very interesting.
Majoras Mask is one of the best Zelda games just because all the mystery around it.
I believe MM are real events that take place in the ‘parallel’ or ‘alternate’ universe of Hyrule, Termina. However this is the best argument I’ve ever seen to the contrary.
I think the key here is the Lost Woods... I believe that this is the portal into ‘alternate universes’. Also though, the premise of the whole thing as you say is Link in search of ‘his old friend’ Navi, he must have been extremely lonely to venture so far out in the Lost Woods, that many never return (hence the name Lost lol). So I agree with your theory in the sense that Links motives may have actually created the kind of world that he would enter to discover a meaning for himself etc, which actually fits in with your dream theory, but without acknowledging that it all took place in Links head. Or, maybe it was destiny that Link would find the answer to his loneliness, by crossing paths with the Skull Kid who was just as lonely as him, except instead of having 0 fairies he was hoarding 2 of them 😂🤷🏻♂️
I always believed that too, great video and theory
Glad you enjoyed it
Hello, good theory and something I haven't thought of yet. It's fun to think of it as a dream now too. But the most important thing I need to ask is what sort of mods are you using? I seriously don't remember the game looking that good as the clips in your video. Or is it a version other than N64? Which is the version I still have and play to this day.
I really enjoy the videos you make. Have you ever thought of exploring the idea of a bigger connection between the mask salesman and majora? With the kids in the moon all looking like younger versions of the salesman there has to be more to why he had the mask other than he was just a collector/merchant for them. That and his line at the end of the game when he says the spirit inside the mask is finally at rest and then he saunters off before disappearing like a dead jedi. I'm curious if his spirit was connected to majora or he could have been the one to wear the mask during the hexing rituals. Him disappearing could be him moving on to the afterlife now at peace knowing his mask is no longer causing pain to others.
Yes I have! It will definitely come in a future video, but with the current production schedule it might be a while before I discuss something like that
I just feel the mask sales man was a member of the illuminati. The mask represents the majority rule (Majora)
Not to mention is revealed in a certain piece of dialogue (I'm drawing a blank on where) that the indigo-gos wrote a certain song whose title you may recognize:
The ballad of the wind fish.
I just think that Termina is actually a location of Lorule. I think that one of the portals to Lorule exists in the Lost Woods and Link happened to cross it in his search for Navi.
The only reason Termina wasnt mentioned as being part of Lorule was because A Link Between Worlds hadn't been conceived yet. The fact that Majora's Mask can be seen in Link's house in that game could be Aonuma try to leave us a subtle nod to that idea.
However it could also just be foreshadowing that Majora's Mask was the next Zelda game that they were going to be making on the 3DS.
But why does have a completely different aesthetic than all of Lorule? Like the sky in Lorule is always gloomy while Termina is the normal bright blue sky. Lorule would then have to also have the same moon if it's part of the same world (but then again we never see the moon in Lorule so who knows for sure)
It could be possible that it is both. That when link fell down the tree the portal created a world based off of links memories creating an alternate reality. either 1. Link fell down the tree or my other theory 2. Link actually found the majoras mask in the beginning of the adventure and it formed termina from Links memories with its own twist on Links perception of hyrule and its people. I do think we can all agree majoras mask is definitely dealing with Link and his journey of self discovery
I really do find this to be a good one that i never thought of and it makes sense. The only thing that gets to me tho is the ending what i believe is that he never fully made peace with himself due to TP part where he's a skelington teacher and doesn't seem like he's at peace. My favorite theory is that skull kid is the same one you give the skull mask to in OOT and the reason why you don't see him as an adult is because the flashback of him and tatle and tale is happening hence y the end scene with him making a not to OOT happens. I think it could be both like that end scene could be skull kid trying to wake link up in the lost woods so thats why the nood happens. I don't care either way i love Majora's Mask. Also ive always thought that MM took place a few years after OOT ending because of links voice change to something that of a teenager in puberty plus the flipa dip dipps
Yeah either way I also love MM. And that's a cool idea that adult link doesn't encounter the skull kid bc MM already happened... or did it with the weird timey wimey stuff?
how do you not have over 1k subs?? you deserve it!
I'm surprised I have this many! I was at less than 30 a month ago
There are Mario enemies in Link’s Awakening and a mask with Mario’s face is in Majora’s Mask
This was all very well thought out, and I wouldn't be surprised at all to learn that this is how the devs prefer to interpret the games events in hindsight. I don't think it was necessarily their original intent, but it definitely fits.
A small nitpick I have on your theory is that you're too hung up on who is parallel to whom when arguing against the parallel worlds interpretation. You use comic book logic, focusing on dimensional counterparts, instead of how a different past created a different present. Which creates "problems" when Ingo and Malon both have "multiple counterparts" in Termina.
I'm not sure if I phrased that well, but I hope you get my meaning.
Personally, I prefer the idea that Termina was simply a distant country from Hyrule. I know that's kinda the least likely theory of all, but there's actually no solid reason it couldn't be so. Just say it's somewhere out west, maybe put another country between them for good measure, and the N64 maps could easily line up.
I do support my own theory, however I definitely agree that it probably wasn't Aonuma's and the other developer's ORIGINAL intent and that if they do support it, it's definitely hindsight like you said.
I think I did try to address how the issues arose with there being multiple counterparts of a character and used Cremia and Romani to explain that, but looking back I think I explained that weird and may have not gotten the idea across as well as I had hoped. I think in the future I'm going to build on to this theory and split it up into mulitple videos by topic such as counterarguments and actual reasons why it could be a dream which may help with cohesiveness.
Personally I don't understand how it could be a distant country like Labrynna or Holodrum, but that's my opinion and I respect the opposite view.
Parallel reality’s . I mean they deal with multiple timelines which could be considered a parallel reality. So there’s the child adult and downfall so why not another
Sorry meant to say it could be another timeline
The entire reason Majora's mask exists is because they wanted something different. It just doesn't fell like they would rehash a plot line from link's awakening. And what about the Darmani statue in Breath of the Wild? I haven't watched the video yet, because I need to do something first and don't want to forget. But I honestly think this theory has some big holes.
Help watch the video first then let me know. Link's Awakening came out 7 years before MM did so I don't see how it's impossible, whether it was intentional by the devs or not.
Darmani is part of the "Mount Rushmore" in the goron village in botw, but I think that's an easter egg. How would a goron who died in Termina during MM and seemingly never travelled to Hyrule have a monument in Hyrule several millennia later?
@@Zeldom link travels back to hyrule, knows darmanis story of being a goron hero and literally has a mask of his face. Its probably also just an easter egg but its pretty easy to see why it could exist there
Definitely earned a subscribe with all of this Majora’s Mask content
Nintendo stated that Termina is a Parallel Universe which exists outside of Hyrule, it’s not a dream nor is Link dead, as some would suggest. “The Adult Timeline’s” Twilight Princess also sort of debunks this theory amongst many other theories similar to this one.
That is not the case. I addressed the official statement given from Aonuma and gave the argument. I'll copy and paste from another similar comment I just replied to:
"That creator was the head director Aonuma who has directed every game since, and I gave his exact quote in this video. He didn't say it was real, he said it feels like a parallel universe, which I gave an argument for in the video that a dream world is a form of parallel universe, such as shown in Link's Awakening, so the dream is still definitely a possibility."
Twilight Princess does have some hints to MM such as the song of healing howling stone, but that definitely isn't enough evidence. The Skull Kid from the game is interpreted to be the same one from MM, but that's actually just speculation and isn't confirmed. I think the case for a sort of dream theory isn't debunked, but rather some people don't accept other interpretations and definitions for terms such as of a parallel world and don't understand the arguments made for it.
I don't think it was a dream, but an alternate mini-universe of sorts in a pocket dimension. The alluding to it in future games supports this.
Some great points here. However, I don’t think it was entirely in Link’s mind. Or I could say, not only his.
My theory (or head-canon) is that Termina was indeed created by Majora’s Mask, but using and culminating the masks own history, mixed with the memories and feelings of all the “real” or “outside” people who became trapped in Termina, the Skull Kid, the Mask Salesman and of course Link himself (and also Epona? Later about that).
For the most part, the Hylian counterparts could have been crated from Skull Kid’s memories: note that in general all skull kids are Hylian kids, who got lost in the Lost Woods; therefore, Skull Kid could have memories about many Hylians, which had counterparts in Termina.
One theory of mine, that Kafei (one of the few OC characters in Termina) was actually the Skull Kid, when he was still a Hylian (with some mix with Skull Kid’s and Link’s feelings and memories). I like to think that Skull Kid was just a kid from Kakariko, a childhood friend of Anju/The Cucco Lady, who he had a crush on: that’s why Anju is Kafei’s bride in Skull Kids dreamland. Of course, adult Anju was compromised of Link’s memories of her from Kakariko (which Skull Kid never got to see), but since there’s no “data” for the adult Kafei, in Termina Kafei became trapped in the body of a child (in the sense that the Skull Kid never grew up, became trapped in the body of a… well skull kid). It is also important to note that in Termina, Kafei was “cursed” personally by the Skull Kid: if Kafei wandered the Lost Woods despite the legends, and became the Skull Kid from his own recklessness, he cursed himself in this sense. Could be some guilt here as well, Kafei/Skull Kid cursed himself, never giving himself the opportunity, to grew up and marry his crush, Anju (could be here something even deeper here, maybe Kafei is everything in Termina, Skull Kid wanted to be in Hylia: fiancé of Anju, the wealthy son of the mayor etc). Also note that, maybe Kafei is the one of the few Terminians, who wears a mask, and we know since OoT, that the Skull Kid loves masks. Kafei also reflects Link’s feelings, since he experiences the same, maybe that’s why they find comradeship early on the side quest.
In my theory Romani Ranch is entirely created by Link’s memories, about Lon-lon Ranch (and maybe Epona’s, the scared little horse created in Majora’s nightmare-land the only place she felt safe, the ranch she was from). Cremia and Romani are clearly from Link’s memories about both adult and child Malon. During OoT, a possible romance between Zelda and Link were emphasized, so I like to think that, based on his initial little-crush on Malon, the experience on Romani Ranch made Link realize, how much he cared about Malon for real, and the time spent on the Ranch showed him, what his life could be on Lon-lon Ranch if he stayed with Malon. Also, since Link’s crush maybe was first sparked by seeing what a smoking hot babe adult Malon became in OoT, if Kafei’s the culmination of both Link’s and Skull kid’s memories, would explain why there’s some romantic feelings between Cremia and Kafei in Termina (which could embody Malon’s crush for Link, based on Links memories, from the time when Link was all about Zelda).
I also may think that Kafei was based on Skull Kid’s, but was heavily influenced by Link’s memories, because the conflict between Kafei and Anju, reflects the semi-romantic dynamic between Link and Saria: Kafei (thinks he) cannot marry Anju, since Anju is an adult, while he is trapped in a child’s body; in reverse, it is implied that Saria had romantic feelings for Link, but she knew she couldn’t be with him, because eventually Link will become an adult, but Saria will be still trapped in the body of a child (hence being a Kokiri). This could not only stem from Skull Kid’s guilt that he doomed himself to never grew up and became with Anju from Kakariko, but also reflect Link’s sorrow, that even if he would want it, he couldn’t be with Saria, thus hurting his friend.
Other characters (especially the transformation masks) may be reflected Link’s memories, feelings and sorrows, just as the OP cleverly pointed out in the video. The dead Deku Scrub at the beginning, may reflect both the dead Great Deku tree and the Deku Tree Sprout. The Deku butler (the father) reflecting Link’s guilt that he couldn’t save his “own father” Great Deku tree died (one major event, that happened regardless the timeline, also the Deku Tree Sprout never appeared in the child timeline). Becoming the Deku Scrub himself, could be desire of him being able to save the Deku Tree, or at least make up for it. (Could the tortured monkey embody the Kokiri, who had to face the consequences of the Great Deku Tree’s death, also foreshadowing the kokiri monkeys in Twilight Princess? Who knows, although I don’t like the idea that the Kokiri evolved into monkeys in the child timeline, I think they either died out, or hiding as Koroks during TP.)
Goron Link, who is the spirit of Darmani, is Link’s guilt that he could not save Darunia in the adult timeline from sacrificing himself against Volvagia (I am on board with the theory that the Six Sages in OoT are the spirits of Link’s dead friends), also the other Goron Link from the stockpot inn (who was kicked out because of Link) is his guilt that he made young Goron Link in the adult timeline an orphan. The tricky part with Darmani being “just a dream” however, is that he has a statue in BoTW Goron City. Also, OoT Link until MM likely never encountered neither a baby nor an elder Goron, therefore these aspects must have come from someone else’s memories (either Majora, the Mask Salesman or least likely the Skull Kid). Other characters could be also previously existing ones, from other’s memories, culminated in Termina. Goron Link could be partly Link’s remaining desire to save Darunia in the adult timeline.
Zora Link, or Mikau, can be Link’s guilt that he could never (nor wanted to) be the husband Princess Ruto wanted or deserved (well luckily TP implies that Ruto found someone in the Child Timeline, hence Queen Rutela is her daughter). Mikau could be from someone else’s memory, but like in the case of Kafei, it is influenced by others, such as Link’s memories and feelings as well. Also, in the adult timeline Zora Domain never became unfrozen while Link was there, thus he could never actually save them. Zora Link could be partly Link’s remaining desire to save the zora in the adult timeline.
What about else? As pointed out by other in the comments, one of the reasons Termina could not be entirely Link’s memories and delusions is the technical advancements can be seen in Termina. Well it cannot be Majora’s, since it was an ancient mask. If we theorize the Kafei is the Skull Kid (being Anju’s childhood friend, which I know is a stretch), then Skull Kid is also older than Link, could never live or see those stuff. One possible explanation is the Mask Salesman. The Mask Salesman has many unique masks (Mario, Elvis, a Ninja Turtle) and some wild magical abilities, implying that he is not really tied to Hyrule, but wandering between different lands, countries, possibly even realms, which may be technically more advanced than Hyrule itself (if you have seen Disenchantment on Netflix, you got the idea). Also, the Mask Salesman is the first became in contact with Majora’s Mask, so it is logical that the world Majora created was not only heavily inspired by Skull Kid’s memories who wore it, but the Mask Salesman’s who found it (and maybe first awaked it from its slumber).
Clocktown itself is nothing can be seen in Hyrule. Could Clocktown be the place where the Mask Salesman grew up? Could be that the equally weird and creepy Tingle comes from his past? The biggest threat is the falling Moon, and inside the moon we can see child versions of the Mask Salesman. Could be the falling Moon the reflection of his guilt, from releasing Majora’s menace to the world? And the moon children partly represent his own loneliness? The man himself is an enigma, who knows, what could come in Termina to life from his mind. Not to mention that Termina is all about masks, which is the main thing of the Mask Salesman. Pretty sure that the majority of those masks are from the Mask Salesman’s memories, some of the many masks he traded in his life.
The last part would be the Masks original birthplace, which could be the Ikana Valley with all the ancient lore behind it, as well as Stone Tower Temple. This itself could be the ancient sanctuary, where the mask was craved and maybe even used: if flip it upside down, the entrance resembles the mask, also the Architecture of Zelda blog has a fascinating analysis about the symbols and iconography of Stone Tower Temple, mocking the Hylian Goddesses. There’s no new mask here, only the mirror shield with a silently screaming face on it. I think, this is not tied to Link, or the Skull Kid, or the Mask Salesman (though he has a mask with the exact same image), but Majora’s itself, it is the part, where Majora’s mask and history was manifested.
Sorry for the 100 pages novel here... but thanks for reading regardless.
idk why, but i just got this thought:
Skull Kid is Link.
But, the “Darkness” of Majora, or Majora’s Mask, is actually too a metaphor.
When one deals with Depression and Lonliness, they will use psychological “masks” to distract themselves from their problems.
That’s why Skull Kid here in the game is threatening to destroy Termina. It is the representation of the pains of Lonliness, Depression and Neglect that Link has.
But what helps Link?
Fierce Diety Mask.
Noticed that the Fierce Diety looks a lot like Adult Link and even has the same voice?
I believe that the Fierce Diety mask is representing Link’s strength and hope that will help him overcome his depression and sadness.
It’s also a metaphor of Link “Growing Up” because again. Fierce Diety looks exactly like what Adult Link does, thus Link moving on with his life.
Majora’s Mask(the game), is Link’s own battle against himself and when it says
“Dawn Of A New Day” means Link is looking forward to his life, because while tonight is a painful adventure, tomorrow is a new day.
Really good vid, loved the passion and the ideas behind the theory. I'm going to have to disagree with it however, there are some points you made that don't hold up and ideas both in the vid and in the comment section that require a lot of reaching.
Even if we put aside what Eiji Aonuma said about Termina being a parallel world and whatnot, the only character that seems to have any idea of Link's exploits is the Happy Mask Salesman. The Happy Mask Salesman is not someone I'd use as a point saying that it's all in Link's head because there's strong evidence to believe that he's something else entirely and not what he appears on the outside, i.e. a simple mask salesman. I would also like to point out that Skull Kid recognizing Link is understandable because all he said was, "I recognize your scent, you're the one that taught me that song in the woods." Well, in OoT you can get a heart piece from Skull Kid by playing Saria's song and becoming friends. If that happened before Link drew the Master Sword for the first time, then there's no reason he wouldn't recognize him.
Finally, and I'm not 100% sure on this one because I've only played Twilight Princess once back when it first came out, but I believe it's implied that the Skull Kid there is the same one that was in Termina and knows who you are when you re enter the lost woods. I don't remember if this was stated in Hyrule Historia or something like that, but yes, I'm pretty sure it's the same Skull Kid in Twilight Princess, which also disproves this theory. Either way, it was a fun vid and I enjoyed it.
19:17 the song of healing appears in the howling wolf segments of Twilight princess. Scientifically speaking, Link would of had to of heard it before in order for it to appear in a Dream anyway.
that would also mean that the different masks would also have needed to be seen before. Ruto in a Blue fabric dress also never appears in breath of the wild nor half the instruments appearing in the game (unless just before departing the adult timeline he temporarily enjoyed post-carnum celebrations for the Liberation of Hyrule). the other Zora of different body shapes, big turtle, Almost Sci-fi asthetic of Great bay temple also likely never appeared in Ocarina of time either, unless Link got Abducted saving Romani in termina (maybe a reason for trauma too) or a similar attack occurred in Hyrule at lon lon
scientific implications point at a combination of redundant dreaming for a quick but real event link had done. Ikana Valley also might be an allegory for War since almost everything there is dead or undead except for a few honest survivors who refuge in peace and keep it by all means.
the mirror shield is round and what's the shape of the Hero's shade's Sheild? Round. so perhaps fighting in Termina or the H-G war changed his mind about the sharp shields. Ordon's shields are combination of both being shaped tactically but also rounded. the ordon shield is More or less Beveled but in similar shape to a knight's shield. then again weapon choice is a literal preference when on defense except for a few circumstances. a Seige of lon lon could have taught that lesson to the survivors whom probably took it as a lesson of war not to separate but merge both ideas into an adaptive defense doctrine
perhaps the Repeating of the 3 day cycle was link thinking about what he could have done differently if Termina was in fact real but it traumatized him. Or maybe an allegory for what Link could have done else during probably a really bad battle in the Hyrule-Gerudo war say he fought in the war and become that shining night for Malon the lady of lon lon (trying to make it sound aristocratic since lon lon is the only milk producer in hyrule, free real estate to have a monopoly)
Hey @Zeldom!
I just discovered your channel and this is the third vid I've watched! I really like your work!
Ok, new guy question: I've noticed A LOT of animations that I don't recognize. Now, I've never played any of the DX or 3D or "upgraded" Zelda games and all of the animation I'm referring to looks "modernized".
But is it original???
No, those animations are fan created animations by people like MajorLink and Rwan Link. Also, Zeldom hosts a lot of streams, so I think you can see him there.
@@LinktheCommunistWaifu thanks!
Keep in mind that skull kids are children lost in the forest. Is Link somehow lost? Also the journey he went on in ocarina probably didn’t do good on his mental health. He went from a child to an adult, he had the whole fate of the world on his shoulders. Speaking of going from a child to an adult, ever wonder why the fierce deity looks like adult Link? Maybe he feels powerful when he’s an adult? Maybe Majora represents his regrets for not being remembered, but if he stayed as an adult in that timeline then he would be remembered. Also remember the Hero’s Shade from Twilight Princess is the Hero of Time who mentions having regrets. All of this can support this theory as well as this video.
I love this theory!!! It makes sense. At first thought this game was kinda scary and didnt really want to play. But after this, I wanna go find it and get it!
I thought it was scarier than it actual is until I played it. The story is very deep and has some creepy moments, but it's no bottom of the well/shadow temple from oot...
So this whole time link was hallucinating in his long deep sleep ? Because of the lost woods ?
I like the idea for this theory. But am unsure how much of the supporting evidence given I actually agree with. Points were made about when Link set out on this journey. He could've went and performed the quests needed to retrieve the spiritual stones without accepting the stones themselves. We just know that Link is still young so he could've still been a year or two older than when he started in Ocarina of Time. This would also explain how he has Epona at the beginning of Majora's Mask. He could've set out on the early part of his adventure (and probably would have too) since Ganondorf's evil deeds had already begun before Link ever made it to Zelda the first time. Remember that Ganondorf had to have already sealed Dodongo's Cavern and infected Jabu Jabu around the same time as he approached the Great Deku tree. The idea is that he set everything in motion rather close in time because he was trying to acquire the spiritual stones and open the Door of Time. According to what is being said in this video, in Ocarina of Time, Link must have only been a step behind Ganondorf as he was off doing those evil acts. If this was the case, then the Gorons wouldn't have been already starving when Link arrived in Goron City or Ruto wouldn't have had time to go off and explore inside of Jabu Jabu as he would've only just gotten sick if Link was on Ganondorf's heels during the child portion of Ocarina of Time. So by this logic, even if Ganondorf was defeated upon Link's first trip to the castle (as is implied in child timeline that kicks off with Majora's Mask) then there was still reason for his quest to continue after Ganondorf's defeat in that timeline. Also I should point out that it is never stated that the Link from Twilight Princess is a DESCENDANT of the Hero of Time. No version of Link is ever considered to be a descendant of a previous one. They are reincarnations. Meaning no genetic link need apply. So we don't need young Link and Malon to be doing the nasty before he sets off on his MM adventure. I would also like to know how exactly the "Link is dead" theory was completely debunked. It was always one of my favorite Zelda Theories and I always thought it was pretty solid but if it isn't then I'd like to hear those points as well. Anyway I'm going back to finish this video. I do like what I've heard so far. I enjoy your point of view because even if I don't agree with it entirely, it does open up one's mind to new thought processes and avenues to explore. That's the beauty of the art of storytelling. Unless it is outright stated, then you can fill in the blanks with whatever your imagination can come up with and I, for one, love to discuss hypotheticals at great lengths
What if the "Link is dead" theory elements also applies to this theory? What if Navi left Link to go off and die? This could be for any number of reasons. Maybe time traveling took a toll on the fairy. The Master Sword may have protected Link as it ripped him back and forth through time. But what if that protection didn't extend to his fairy companion? After the adventure, Navi may have wanted to protect her friend from the pain or guilt of her death. Whether or not Link ever knew this or not could be explained away as his mind putting the pieces together. But this "dream" of him going through the quest laid out in Majora's Mask (as in the "Link is dead" theory states each area represents a stage of grief) is his way of coping with the loss of Navi. Which was mentioned in this video but what if it was even further than abandonment but actual grief of loss factored in too?
But I also don't know who actually referenced Link's ordeals in Ocarina of Time. The owl wasn't just some ordinary owl. He could've moved from world to world somehow. The Happy Mask Salesman never mentions the events from the previous game. But yeah. This aspect I didn't follow in the video. I don't recall anyone ever saying anything about the previous game at all
In the Hyrule Historia after Link spends some time with Zelda she gives him the Ocarina of Time again and sends him off to protect it. I don't think that Link would go on the journey to get the spiritual stones since they're trying to prevent the sacred realm from opening again. I totally agree that Link isn't dead. Patpat made a couple of cool points, but at this point TP Link being a descendant of OoT Link is almost factual which would debunk Link dying in MM. I totally agree with your timeline analysis there. I don't quite think it debunks the idea that it's a dream as it's still a valid possibility, but it's stuff I should address when I add on to these later.
The Link is Dead theory falls into the category of "Termina isn't real" theories, but there are very different arguments between them.
I like the theory and it is a definite possibility. 👍👍 I can't remember every point I disagreed with but one thing at the end: We know Link was in some kind of woods, highly likely the lost woods. But him falling down the hole does not nessicary mean thats how he entered Termina. There was a creepy spiral hallway that could have been the portal at the beginning before the windmill or maybe he was already half way there simply by walking/riding. Since Termina has its own lost woods, perhaps Link entered those same woods in Termina to leave Termina at the end of the game also.
Also, there too many important meaningful characters in OOT that are left out of MM as counterparts (like Saria and the Kokiri), and too many new characters from MM for me to consider it a dream of Link's.
But I loved the video, very interesting theory to ponder!
That's true. Falling down the tree wasn't necessarily the changing point and something definitely did happen in the trippy tunnel leading into the clock tower. Regardless though it's still connected leading back to that hole he fell down so it's essentially still a blocked path and he would have needed to know of a different route.
I don't think it was a dream, what I think is that Termina was supposed to be a distorted dimension created from the skull kids memories, however, upon creating it, the power of the Ocarina of Time added Links memories of Hyrule to termina, hence why the very start of termina after link falls down the hole as a Deku Scrub looks like the Forrest that the Skull kid would remember but the rest of Termina is fairly different, it's a combination of Link's and the Skull Kid's memories, distorted by the Majora's Mask.
This is a compelling theory. Well done.
Why thank you :)
I used to think it was real but after this vid im going more towards the dream theory now lol. Great vid!
Glad you enjoyed!
Nintendo even states that Termina is a very real Parallel Universe, not a dream.
While I personally do not hold this view, I think that this is very well-put together. MM is a very vague game that leaves a lot up to interpretation. And, in the end, that's what Zelda is all about, isn't it? These are are all legends that are being passed down through time. Some things are lost to the annals of time, leading us to craft our thoughts on the backstories and context for these games.
Fantastic videos! Excited to continue my journey on catching up with your content.
Your theory makes complete sense to me. The fact that Majora's Mask was Link's dream would explain many parts of the game that don't make logical sense, or at least in terms of Hyrule's logic. One great example would be when like falls down the deep hole in the tree at the beginning of the game. Logically, Link should've died from the fall regardless if the Deku flower was there at the bottom or not.
This is a very compelling theory. The jury's out.
Thanks!
The Hero's Shade has the Gilded Sword and the Mirror shield from Termina. We also know that he died an untimely death, lost an eye in combat and is implied to have been a noted knight. A Hero to Hyrule during a war could be argued to be a legendary hero but that would be a stretch. He could still be a Legendary Hero to the Goron's for having defeated Dongo either again if he went so far back before getting the spiritual stones or just from the first time. Also Link likely had to give intel about what happened in the future Ganondorf tricked him in those might have spread as legends during his lifetime. Not saying the bow isn't from the Link from Skyward Sword just making a point about how the argument that he wasn't a legendary hero is flawed.
My theory is that after link is sent back by Zelda and Navi leaves him what if link himself becomes a skull kid since he’s not a kokiri and all the happenings were a manifestation of either a dream during his time as a skull kid or just his imagination. Perhaps skull kids are plagued with madness due to their circumstances? That would be a sad end for the hero but maybe as a skull kid those two new fairies really were his friends
OoT and MM in general is just really sad for link...
I prefer this theory to the one of Link being dead during MM, but I am not so sure they would reuse the "link is in a dream" plot line so soon after Links Awakening (and the DX rerelease)
Excellent video, good way to earn a sub
Yeah I'm not a supporter of Link being dead in MM either. Idk Link's Awakening was 7 years before this game, but I respect the opposite opinion. Thanks for the sub man, I appreciate it!
From what I understand you seem to not get time travelling and all that right. You said that the skull kid, the happy masks salesman and Kapora Gabora would not know link, if they would not exist outside of time. That is wrong since in oot link met them as a child even before aquiring the master sword.
Watching this video after the Link's loves video, one character stuck out to me the most, Kafei, the man turned child.
He does have similarities to Link, a possible allegory of his relations like the Skullkid is. Because of Kafie circumstances that involves him changing ages, he finds hinself isolated from the woman he's ser to marry. Similary, after the events of OoT Link is seprate from adult Malon. He would reconnect with child Malon and earn her trust to obtain Epona. But he doesn't realise how much he loves her until after his dream. Particularly that scene where he gets a hug from Crimea, the stand in for adult Malon. Who, by the way is in love with Kafei and is sad to see him get married to someone else.
I think there's more get into.
19:37 the dream scribbled on the house was likely a vision, Zelda had similar dreams. the Beast is likely Dodongo.
also to replay boss fights in the 3d Remake in Ocarina, Just sleep in link's bed
so by that trend, repeating the 3 day cycle and fighting the bosses for their masks might actually be a dream. money also carries between cycles if you store it in a bank mimiking what might have occurred in the Real Termina.
Nice video. It's interesting how the idea of masks speaks to the previous game. Was adult Link just a mask the child wore to do battle or is the adult now stuck wearing the child mask?
Thought here
Termina was Link's Transition from Hylian to Stalfos, as seen as the hero's shade. not merely some kind of ghost or wandering angry skeletal warrior, but an actual intelligent being who passes on his knowledge. Termina being a real, yet alternate form of reality could make sense, if that reality is one formed by the influence of the person entering it. And the symbolism all across Majora's mask flooding everything within link's mind, makes both parts of this theory true, that termina is both a product of his mind, and an actual place that was visited.
Another point to look at as to why it would be his transition to stalfos, the trees were lush in the beginning forest scene, but at the end, after the game, when he rides off, they're all dead, leaves fallen, and sunbeams shining through the canopy, whereas the beginning opening scene had a weird fog to it. that could be symbolism of passing into the afterlife.
nothing concrete here, but this video did get me to thinking a bit on that and how this could be connected to the Hero's shade in twilight princess.
Except If Link were to become a Stalfos in Twilight Princess. Twilight Princess Link wouldn't have existed. As he is the Hero of Times descendant.
I had a theory for years that the Mask Majora was real, and knocked Link unconscious in the lost woods, the rest of the game is a dream, and the stump drawing was after he woke up.
Navi left Link so he wouldn't see her die, as once a fairy achieves it's function, it flies upwards and disappears, possibly dying. Link assumed she may have just returned home, so he began looking for her in Kokiri Forest, and later the Lost Woods. Now that his quest is complete, his life is no longer necessary, so he lost his protection and can now become a stalfos if he gets lost in the woods, so he is found by Majora, and is forced into a dream where he grieves the loss of Navi, and comes to terms with her likely death. He then wakes up, and returns to Hyrule before becoming a Stalfos, and starts a family with Malon, becomes a knight, and once he knows his death is near, he returns to the lost woods to become a Stalfos/Shade as a way to preserve his consciousness and pass on his knowledge of combat to the next hero.
I always thought of termina as a real place. But this theory does make you think. It’s very possible That Termina is a world in another dimension with beings that exist say in the 4 th dimension. Link is only able to interact with this beings in his dream.
I love how you use the Spirit Tracks ost
One of the best themes out there.
my personal thoughts on what happens after OoT:
-Link goes back to Zelda and tells her everything
-he physically goes to Termina/dreams about it (whichever one people like to believe)
-Link leaves Lost Woods
-Link revisits Death Mountain and Zora's Domain to remake his friendships with everyone, and solves their problems again, and then lives life like a normal person would
i just put this here cuz i felt like it lol
I always believed the "5 stages of Grief" proof in most "Link is Dead" theories is actually a symbol of Link grieving Navi. It's my own headcanon that fairies die when their life goal is accomplished, and that Navi's was to help Link save Hyrule. She flew away at the end of Ocarina of Time to save him from seing her die.
Absolutely NO PROOF supports that, only that Fairies vanish when they heal you, it was just a little thought experiment
Omg! It’s a loz version of Alice in wonderland!
Link fell down the rabbit hole following the “white rabbit”! XD
I believe mm was not a dream. It was said that link might have drawn the picture in the end credits because skull kid stayed at the festival. BUT link also stayed at the festival! You can see the scene of the indigogos playing at the milk bar AND zora link plays with them.
16:17 maybe link did fight in the hylian Gerudo war. even assisting the Goron Legions (it was the Gerudo and the forces of Darkness Vs a Racial Entaunt consisting of Hylians, Humans, gorons and Zoras along with surviving members of the Sheikah that didn't join the Bongo Bongo insurrection in the civil war)
one point for the link died during or as a Veteran of the H-G war
Also on the dream thing. It is impossible to dream faces you've never seen
That's actually scientifically untrue. In dreams you can imagine faces you've never seen. I'm not going to write an essay to prove that bc that's not my thing, but I've read some before for school so I know they're out there.
Plus I've had personal experience with dreams where that happens so it's definitely possible.
THIS GUY ONLY HAS 2K???? HE SHOULD HAVE MORE THEN 200K
I'd like that :D
Because people are close minded to reality. :(
Amazing video
Thanks!