UpTone Audio EtherREGEN audiophile switch
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 13 ก.พ. 2020
- Once it was discovered that ethernet switches do have impact on the sound quality, many manufacturers jumped on the bandwagon. UpTone chose another type of transport playing another song…
Manufacturer:
uptoneaudio.com/products/ethe...
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www.metawave.org/
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Thank you Hans for another excellent video. Question I have, since the UpTone is not available due to supplier issues, and they are considering to build a new version with cheaper components, I am considering a SoTM as I do not want to wait much longer. Wondering if you could advise if a SoTM with an evox-caps , eabs and Silver-wire upgrade would not come close or would not even be better as the Uptone.
I don't know. I have only the standard version.
You mentioned a new switch ‘on the horizon’ - is that the newly announced Chord/English Electric network switch which was announced at the Bristol HiFi show? Hope you will get a sample to review.
No comment 😯
Hi Hans, you didn't mention whether there was an improvement in signal quality with the etherregen in front of your mytek brooklyn bridge. Was it as significant a difference as with the auralic? I thoroughly enjoy your channel, thank you for sharing. B
Yes it was.
Thanks!
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Is there an audiophile version of the TCP/IP or Ethernet protocol ?
No, and there is no need for it.
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel kind of like there being no need for the "audiophile" switch.
I didn´t quite catch what you said on using the etherREGEN with the Aries G2... Did the sound improve to any degree? Auralic recommends using WiFi and not cable-connection to G2...
Please switch on CC (Subtitles) if you have difficulties understanding what I say.
Hi Hans
Did you try the EtherRegen connected to external clock like Mutec Ref-10?
What is its performance comparing to internal clock ?
No, I didn’t
Hans, have you ever tried to connect this switch to the USBridge Signature? I am curious to see what improvement it can make to a budget streamer?
I busy enough as it is. No time to test unlikely combinations. Sorry.
if the sound from the DAC is different there must be a change in the data. that is not possible because of checksum. did you do a measurment for this "change of sound" - or was it only hearing...?
It's funny how people can't believe there is a sound improvement (you're not alone but your reaction was more courteous than most😀). The sound improvement is so obvious (when compared to a € 40 consumer grade switch) that, if you would have heard is, your question would have been formulated quite differently.
No, the data did not change for the reason you mentioned. But the signal IS changed in a way that is irrelevant for Banks, the tax authorities and other users of general computer technology: minute timing changes due to leakage currents and noise in the signal. It's this timing variance that causes jitter and that is audible. Uptone names phase noise, Common mode noise is mentioned by others. I am tech journalist and reviewer, no scientist. Whenever I find more than one source to confirm information that explains why I hear what I hear, I'll pass I on to my viewers. Unfortunately there is a group of people that rather believe theory in stead of practice and that debit criticism without even checking the practice. To avoid endless discussions on why and how I could be wrong: I will only discuss this further with people that listened to one of the audiophile switches I reviewed on a descent stereo setup. Please don't take this personal.
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel a DAC takes the data from a buffer. everything in the buffer is 0101000001010 and not audible. jitter, dithering, etc. is in the DAC "black box" and that process can not be controlled by the swith. but that is the process where the sound "is made". so if you realy can hear sound differences (which might be true) i gues that magic box does something to de digital information. what would be interesting if somebody with the right equipment would actualy would check blocks of data bits generated by the etherregen and compare them with the original data bits.
Wrong again and typically the view of a IT professional. Buffers are noisy and vary the power lines depending on how hard they have to work. That noise and the aforementioned common mode noise change the reference value that decide whether there is a transition or not. This changes the timing of the signal and thus causes jitter. But I have had this discussion many times. Listen first and then come back for I will not convince you with a discussion here.
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel I will test the device on the high end in munich.
@@AndrejPetef it's really impressive how people change its way of thinking depending the topic they are discussing about. If you are in bar and say "this Beer is good" no one would say "did you do a double blind test to say that"?
Hans, What are you’re thoughts on alleged sonic upgrades possible with pairing The EtherRegen with OCXO clocks like the AfterDark Project ClayX Giesemann OCXO 10MHz Reference Master Clock?
In Roon Labs Community June 3. I read a thread referring to Audiophile Style (thread 14 about using an AfterDark clock with the ER)
(Audiophilestyle Edition 75 ohm / Emperor Signature version)
I have no experience with it so I don’t have thoughts on it. Sorry.
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel OK Does that mean you’re not interested looking into this?
Don’t know yet
Great review Hans as usual. I really enjoy your content, keep it up! I noticed the B side of the switch is only 100Mbps. Can’t see why they went this way since most modern switches are 1000Mbps. Do you see this as a bottleneck in the network, and make the device not as future-proof ( who knows what’s in the pipeline for audio streaming....). Thanks.
The reason is that 100Mbps components produced a cleaner signal and thus sound better. It is often in digital audio that having 'just enough' performance sounds better than 'high performance'. The more power, the more electric noise. And 100 Mbps is far more than needed for even 384kHz/24 bit audio. Developments will not go in the direction of higher sampling rates but even when they do, even a four times higher sampling rate could be served.
Would you recommend connecting the NAS and ISP router each to the A ports - or connecting the NAS to the router and from there a single connection to the A port?
Connect them both to the A ports
Hans you where talking about a new audiophile switch coming out soon.
Will it be in the price range of the UpTone Audio EtherREGEN?
No, 3 times more
That should help the decision making process.
I have a Mytek Manhattan II with the network card and DAC has 75 ohm word clock out, was wondering which network the DAC should go on, and also whether the Mytek could serve as external clock to the Ether Regen or if thats a bad idea compared to buying an after dark or similar external clock, I have a NUC running ROCK as one of my sources, also aurender using usb and Oppo on SPDIF all have network inputs. Currently have a consumer grade gigabit switch and considering an Ether Regen
I really can't say.
So did you feel the the use of the Uptone Ethergen switch makes a perceivable difference to SQ while using the Auralic Aries G2?
Did you watch the video?
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel I did but your small segment where you talk about the SQ of the Switch along with the G2 and I quote" It did improve the SQ of the Aries so much"- thats all you say. Its not clear if by" so much" you mean "Somewhat, so so" or "very much". For viewers anxious to assess the quality of these expensive pieces of equipment we crave unambiguous evaluations .and statements by professional reviewers
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel I understand that you heard improvements with the G2 but did you manage to compare against the G2 on Wi-Fi as I understand the Wi-Fi on G2 is really good. I also read elsewhere that the Wi-Fi is better than wired with a ER in place, or a treats as good.
What are your thoughts on this. I have a G1 but wondering what to do next.
Would it make sense to insert an EtherREGEN between the router and my Innuos Zenith Mk.3, when I'm not using, or otherwise needing to use, any network switch at the moment? (My other wired network devices (TV and Youview box) are similarly connected directly to the router.)
I have not tried it in combination with the Zenith but I am almost sure it will improve the sound quality.
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel Well, you weren't wrong. Not really knowing what to expect, my system evidently benefits from it. I'm now appreciating a new level of resolution - and rediscovering my music collection...again. Dank u!
Have you compared the wifi intake on the Auralic Aries G2 with the wired ethernet? Wifi should provide excellent galvanic supervision. The creator of the Aries G2 recommends use of the wifi intake at 5Ghz.
I have answered this several times: it depends on the quality of the switch and how occupied the ether is where you are.
I didn’t wire my house and went Wifi Airplay is my way of streaming will wifi be a quality degradation? I use AirPort Extreme and Apple TV 4K
I'm working on an answer in a video.
Hi Hans thanks for the reply also if u can make a 3 part video on rew miniDSP mic how to use for home
Not getting a easy to follow resource on the net and I am a niewbie
I think this is the one I will get, As I use the Vega g2 along with Aries g2
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The only thing that could ameliorate audio on networks is QoS.
Does these switches have QoS?
I presume you are a network specialist. You might want to consider what I said in this video: th-cam.com/video/sDiHFYHKij4/w-d-xo.htmlsi=EfWVJTCfEF6UZazv&t=363 and then try it for yourself on a Audiofile stereo setup....
When is your new video on the new switch going to be uploaded?
As soon as I get it...
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel is it the S100?
My EtherREGEN becomes even better with burn-in...
I have read that a "better" Ethernet cable can improve the S.Q. if used on the "B" port of the ER.
But it is very difficult to find serious advice: have you tried different cables on the "B" port of the ER, and what is your conclusion ?
I have not made comparisons between ethernet cables. I use a top line AudioQuest one.
Would it make sense to use an audiophile switch like this to feed into an allo usb bridge?
Yes, but it depends on your situation whether that is the best way to spend your money. It might offer clear improvement but if the following equipment is limited in quality, the improvement will be less than when used with very good equipment. Anyhow, It is money well spent for if you upgrade the rest of your equipment, the starting point is already top notch.
Now this configuration makes good sense to me. Should improve the quality of a computer used for audio as well as music servers. Or at the least, provide a consistently high quality signal to a music server.
Would you use a SOtM isolator or optical cable between Regan and Modum/Router ?
I havent tried so I can't say for sure. But it seems overkill to me.
Thank you Hans for encouraging me to invest in the bleeding edge of digital music reproduction. After listening to my etherregen now for a day or so, I can report a major upgrade in soundstage layering, less so in width and depth, but still improved. More 3D soundstage. The transient decay can be beautiful- more reverb. A reduction in harshness and brittleness to the point of satisfaction. More ease. The bass is tastier, with more texture and color.
Enjoy the music!
as someone who works as a network engineer - i can tell you that there is no possible way for an ethernet switch to affect the sound quality in such a way, unless the recieving device was designed in such a poor way to violate the ethernet specification, which mandates electric isolation between the internal circuitry and ethernet cable. I need not to get into the technical nitty gritty for two reasons:
- if it would be possible for an ethernet switch to introduce such a imperfection, why would we only see these imperfections in audio, not in any of the other transactions we perform over ethernet networks, such as online banking, changing a bank transfer from $100 to $200, is a much smaller change than affecting an audio signal in a way percievable to the human ear, and yet, i've never heard of such a case.
- Professional audio (in concerts, recording studios, etc) has been using Dante and other similar technologies for years with much higher requirements, with much higher budgets, yet, they always use standard off the shelf network switches.
Had an EtherRegen since November, the 1st batch, and definite improvement can be heard and have been in my system (Naim NDS/555DR in a Roon system, Sim Audio Moon amplification, B&W 805 Signature). Improvements also heard by friends not aware of what or whether any changes had been made. There was a month of burn in, as well, where things did further improvement. Replaced an unmanaged Cisco 5-port Gigabit switch, and had a Netgear GS105e before that.
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You’re always so informative and educational. I’m pondering getting either the etherregen or the ultracap 1.2. Currently have PS AUDIO DSD and an innuos zen mk3. Also using Matrix USB to I2s to the DSD. Which one would you say provide a bigger difference - the Etherregen or the LPS 1.2 on the Matrix? Appreciate any thoughts you might have.
I don't have hands on experience with the PS Audio so I can't say for sure. But I think the EtherRegen would be the best choice.
Usama, I have a similar setup as you...PS DSD SR + Matrix usb to i2s...did you end up going with one of these regen units and if so what do you think about performance in your setup?
@@CaptainCrunch823 I did get the Etherregen and it did make a noticeable impact. I wouldn’t say overly dramatic improvement but it did seem to clean things up a bit, hence a bit more serial and add a touch more clarity. It’s here to stay. I also played around with different Ethernet cables including several different Audioquest ones, and eventually settled on a Ansuz cable, which made a very clear difference.
@@55beethoven Thanks so much for the extremely helpful feedback!
I currently own an EtherRegen (eR) switch, powered by a Channel Islands Audio VDC-7 LPS, and I’ve been very impressed with their performance. The eR clearly sounds better than a standard switch. However, I recently got the upgrade bug, and I’ve narrowed my choice down to the SOtM sNH-10G switch, with a Teddy Pardo LPS. I enjoy your reviews, so I watched your video from 2 years ago, about the EtherRegen.
At minute 8:32 you state “replacing the SOtM switch for the EtherRegen gave a very clear improvement in sound quality.” However, at minute 11:15 you indicate "the EtherRegen is priced in between the Silent Angel, SOtM and AQ switch, but it clearly performs better than all three.” These statements seem to contradict themselves.
Please clarify these statements and let me know, if in your opinion, which of the two, (SOtM or EtherRegen), sounds better? Thank you.
At 8:32 I stated that both the SOtM and the AQSwitch were better than the Silent Angel. The eR again is better and cheaper than the SOtM and AQSwitch and also cheaper.
I haven't yet dipped my toes in to the sea of audiophile switches yet, but maybe this is the one? Thanks Hans.
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I was waiting for this review thanks.
Hope you like it!
I just added the EtherRegen to my system wired directly to my Innuos Zen Mk III. Wow! I thought I had great sound before and didn't really think I'd hear a difference sufficient to justify the price. I bought it with the ability to return it if I didn't like the performance, so I had no predisposition to imagine I heard an improvement. I had just watched the review on the Audio Science Review TH-cam channel - which said it couldn't possibly affect audio sound positively. I should invite that guy to my house for some extended A-B listening!
This was analogous to focusing an out-of-focus camera. Stunning improvement in clarity and sound stage. I couldn't stop listening. It's addictive.
Thank you Hans! I recently became a Patreon because of your reviews and this was the one I was waiting for. My order has been placed!
Awesome, thank you!
I was sceptical about this switch, until I connected it to my system. The sound quality and sound stage separation has improved. The sound stage using ROON had not always been as focused as streaming direct from TIDAL or QOBUZ. The ROON sound stage has improved considerably. Thank you Hans for your review.
Etheregen - Bridge 2 - PS AUDIO DSD - Prima Luna Evo 400 preamp - 2 X NAD M22 power amps - 2 X REL subs - Bowers and Wilkins 800 D3 speakers.
Enjoy the music.
Mine has elevated the impact in my system to a whole NEW level, and at least with me in my system took more than 30 days to fully shine but it is amazing how much this device can do for your system...
Agreed 100% I found I needed about 200 hours for my ER to fully burn-in.
@@stephenscharf6293 As i writing this i put my PH SR4 19V at 9V and another bump in clarity and body OMG man if you are powering it with the stock is very good but if you have the cache tu put some better LPS you will be rewarded !
I have received mine only 3 days ago, and it is already impressive ! so I can't imagine how good it will be after 200 hours !!
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Hi Hans, thank you for another excellent video. I've been using the EtherREGEN since it first shipped in November 2019, and can attest to the sonic benefits & attributes that it brings to the sound quality from my digital streaming front end (also using an SOtM SMS-200 UltraNeo based on your recommendation). In my setup, I run optical fiber from the router & music server in my bedroom/study, and convert from copper Ethernet to fiber using the Sonore OpticalModule FMC, and then long run of OM-1 spec fiber down to the SFP cage in the ER in my audio rack. I connect to the SMS-200 UltraNeo from the EtherREGEN with a Shunyata Research Sigma Ethernet cable, which is considerably superior-sounding to the cables from other mfrs that I tested in my system. Thank you for evaluating the EtherREGEN and putting up this video.
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I guess it would be cheaper to use an attached storage device connected to your streamer and just get rid of the network storage.
Absolutely. But does it sound as good?
@@TheHansBeekhuyzenChannel Gee I don't know Hans, I was hoping you could tell us.