X Games Is Testing AI For Scoring
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.พ. 2025
- This clip was taken from a "We'll Do It Live" stream for our Channel Members on Jan 30, 2025
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This might be one the most evil things to be introduced into skating. Do you want a computer judging your personal expression?
Even human judging is flawed and more biased. At least AI would be consistent but it does have its own problems
I don't blame Kelly feeling a bit personally attacked by AI judging but let's be real here, the SLS scoring is all over the place and is the biggest complaint from anybody who watches it regularly, the lack of transparency can be infuriating at times
The commentary these days is Malto trying to comprehend every other score
That's the point, it keeps discussion and passion in the sport. If you use AI it loses that feel, and just becomes another spreadsheet.
@@TheStowAway594 Literally fans of every sport claim this. They all claim bad ref/judges decisions are part of the sport. Why would you want your favorite athletes to be cheated out of victories? Not saying AI would do a better job, but I don't get the argument why you would need to argue over decisions?
@@benitofranklyn4237Not what he said. And he's right the human element is the ONLY thing that makes skateboarding appealing for most... otherwise who tf cares, this ain't figure skating and never was supposed to be
No it makes the sport senseless, these guys seriously under estimating what AI and how it could be for all judge scoring sports
Are all the episodes for members only now? Just curious. Don’t remember hearing an announcement
You know what I like better than Artificial Intelligence? Intelligence.
human computation is better than artificial computation?
@@Dismal626theoretically yes but in practice no
Whats going on with the channel??
Im glad my AI gf dont judge me
Oh she does. She just hasn’t found the right time to tell you yet.
Bruh
Well she would only score your skating, not your personality.
Man.. live shows now behind a pay wall ? Screw that, supported this for a long time, sent it to friends, likes every video even ones I didn't watch, never skipped ads etc. Unsubbing.
Did I miss some announcement that they moved the Live Show to members only now the last two weeks?
The 9 club is now elitist
How so? Not that I disagree, I'm just curious about your reasoning.
I was a snowboard judge for several years. It's so complicated, trying to make objective decisions with all the variables. Things you guys didn't mention are amplitude, not only how high but also how far the rider goes, on the pipe, how up the transition or how flat they land, if the arms are waiving in the air, if the board lands and slides some to complete the rotation, if the body of the rider is already all turned somehow even before the rider takes off... and so on. I always thought part of all professional athletes responsibilities would be to judge the other competitors, period. In the absence of that I believe AI would def be helpful to track air height and length, grabs and other things that are hard to observe specially on those faster rotations. It could also be a great tool to generate instant replays and compare riders quickly enough. The judging discussions are endless and will continue to be as long as there are judged sports out there and the athletes have room for personal expression. Like we say, if you don't like the judging enter a race next time. Cheers guys.
"I always thought part of all professional athletes responsibilities would be to judge the other competitors" Do you mean the judges should be (former) athletes?
@@benitofranklyn4237 not exactly. I always thought the ideal was having the competing athletes to judges themselves, as hard as that would be and far from realistic for various reasons. We used to run judging clinics open to athletes and coaches so they would be on the same page as the judges.
😂😂😂😂😂
@ Well most professional athletes already do this, even in sports where there are no judges. They rewatch and judge their own performances.
I agree with this comment. It’s not like only AI will do judging but mixed with actual judges this can make judging more precise.
its not that they should use machine learning to do the judging, but it can help better inform a judge with more information. It would be like if kelly knew exactly how much pop the skater got when comparing runs and can factor that information.
2025 has already sucked so bad, please drop some Nine Club episodes or Live or something. Hawk v Wolf is done, need some people talking skateboarding a.s.a.p.
What happened to the hawk and wolf ?
@@mathewmaldonado9135They've ended it. Last ep was with Rodney and Andy. Though they did a live show at the Comedy Store in L.A this week, which was the actual last show.
Gifted hater patreon
I hear people say Ellis messed that up somehow. What happened?
@benitofranklyn4237 dude messes everything up so not surprised. Think he got red- pilled after getting sober and Tony wasn't gonna suffer that garbage...
Miss the show. Cant wait for the next ep
I really liked professor Kelly’s argument against AI 😂 - actually spot on.
We learned nothing from Terminator 2
There is a real human and social cost to relying more and more on AI and LLMs. Promo videos like this never acknowledge those costs, and make it sound as if humans are the problem and AI is the solution. Is a future where human achievements are judged by a lifeless series of increasingly complex algorithms preferable to imperfect humans using their brains to evaluate other human beings' bodies? I prefer judges that are imperfect rather to lines of code.
Style is soul and AI doesn’t have soul.
But neither does flawed and biased judging. Not arguing for AI but both have issues
Judging has stripped the creativity right out of the sport of snowboarding . I love to snowboard , fucking hate watching the competitive side of it now.
How do we get to watch the live show now ?
become a member i guess
@ if that’s the case please someone at the Nine Club please let us know
The judges should EARN their place as a judge. I thought this was the way, no?
respect is earned and compulsory
Have any of the judges ever even skated in contests? Isn’t kelly one of the judges?
Don’t worry, Kelly we won’t let AI take your job
It's not a we thing. The owners of the league are going to decide.
@ oh thanks for the clarification to my joke
@ I'm sorry, it's impossible to read sarcasm. I thought this was one of these complacent comments.
I'd like to see AI robots replace the skateboarders, then the skating will be perfect, no need for style or individuality
I get that it is a sarcastic joke, but don't worry it will take some time until robots are nearly this good. I dread the moment every sport just becomes who has the better robots or better programming. But if you take chess as an example people still rather watch real people play it even though computers are much better at it.
@ that's a great point. still I wonder if we'll ever see a robot tre flip el toro
@ As a a fan of sci-fi I absolutely wonder that. As far as robotics are now, end results are still based on testing and field experiments. Even if they build a thing that just throws a football or baseball, no person or program is good enough to just calculate everything. They have to build it and then adjust speed, arch, distance, height etc. I'm not sure if humanoid robots will ever be a thing, so far it's more practical to build a robot that just does one task. Factory robots are just one arm that does the screwing, cutting or welding. Self driving cars just have a board computer and not an actual robot doing the driving. The most fun time would be the era when robots are similar in skill to humans and there would be a humans vs robots league of every sport.
@@benitofranklyn4237 Real people invented chess BRO
@ Yes every game/sport was invented by real people. What's your point?
Did Mike Mo come up with this lol? Iykyk
Maybe the best approach would be to use both human and AI judges and allow for some kind of review and comparison between scores, maybe average both judging types for a score? Not sure but its intriguing, I like the idea that AI judges (assuming no bugs or cheating) are completely impartial.
Having AI judge sports could certainly eliminate some aspects of cheatng, but it could also introduce new ways of cheating. Preprogramming winners or setting up the softwares judging criteria to favor a certain skaters "style," or certain tricks for instance. This topic has made me realize that no matter what we do, there are always gonna be people with such little integrity that they will do anything to win.
If this is about potentially cheating, maybe forcing judges to explain their reasoning on their scores could help, holding them accountable essentially. If its about reducing errors or mistakes in judging there seems to be simple solutions to that problem.
The way I understand AI, is that it learns from us, so I thnk it could detect and understand style at least from what I have read about AI but I fully admit I could be totally wrong here. The only way to really know for sure is to try it out.... we can debate it forever but until its put into practice we are all just guessing.
At absolute most, the AI score should count as just one judge score. Ideally, it would just be a score that only the judges see to reference/consider. If the AI gets too much influence over scores it will start to influence skaters runs, making for a robotic, highest point reward type of run. I could see that turning skateboarding into something as clinical as gymnastics. I also fear it would ruin the younger generations of skaters who might lose the sense that their own personal opinion of whats better matters. Kids will grow up thinking the AI score of a skaters run matters more than what they find personally appealing. Not to mention the arguments it would cause if contestants see the AI score differ from the human judges. Even if AI could learn to judge style, I don't get why we would want to remove the human element from our sport/art. Skateboarding should be an escape from computers, a way to keep us grounded in reality; that reality being that people are not perfect and that opinions vary as part of the human condition. Keep AI out of skateboarding.
It ousted a bad manager
Well if the AI "works" it would just make it fair for the athletes. Everybody already does highest reward runs. And the way how much falling ruins the whole run already took all the fun out of it. The human element should be the skater not the judges. If the AI is advanced enough it can judge individuality and style even better than humans who follow trends, their own preferences and can straight up just like or dislike a skater and always score them too high or too low. But I actually don't see any league giving up the power they gain by deciding who gets to judge. I think this is more of a marketing thing by the x games.
they are going to run this app behind the scenes every x games for years until one year it scores 98% similar to the human judges and the corporate suits will say fuck it
You want a computer deciding nines? No, of course not.
Its already arbitrary and biased. The whole thing is already biased for tricks on the big stair/big rail
when crob talks about snowboarding being a good fit for this experiment i think he's right. at least for now. the scale of the physics in snowboarding are probably more predictable. things are smoothed out over jumps that are 50ft long themselves.
who cares about using it for judging. what if you could set up a tripod and you had an ai coach.
It can record you and track your progress. machines like this might reduce the barrier of fear when a person is asking can i do this or not?
when you make changes to your diet, or start doing targeted work in the gym to improve your art, your ai coach will help better illuminate the actual progress you're making and what is even possible for you based on data interpretation.
Kelly getting nervous about his job 👀
Yeah you should be as well.. gonna take your job too lol
@@Jay-wk9xj maybe, I have a while longer to worry about it.
Wait til everybody get nervous about their freedoms. haha...ha
It's also gonna be unfair when AI starts competing
How would AI be able to detect a sketchy landing or an unintentional trick? For example, someone lands a noseslide but tried a crook. Interesting though
you know how there's usually one young kid in the comp beating all the older riders even tho they do all their tricks 2 inches off the ground? AI might fix the broken scoring of younger skaters who really have no business competing against full grown adults who have to put effort into each trick. as a 200lb adult skater I don't care about some 7 year old who can do back to back 900s, that's not a real 900.
Style is learned and earned. If you don’t know it when you se it then you shouldn’t be judging. Learn to enjoy and value a sport for all that it is before you start judging it. Some real losers out there, think they know everything
The competitors are all for the machine to take the judges job until robots take theirs lol
I really miss the analog world. The modern world is souless.
If this happens in skateboarding jeff dechesare is going to win the Olympics and street league
Would this be a good or a bad thing iyo?
@@benitofranklyn4237 It would be great for Jeff haha maybe skateboarding needs a shift. Instead of being so focused on style, whoever flips and spins their board the most and does the most challenging trick wins? Idk if this would be good or bad. Just giving an example of how it would switch things up haha
Professional skaters should be judged by those who have professional skateboard experience or else --> Disconnect
iz common sense, no?🤷♂
I'm pretty sure that has been the case so far.
These guys just don’t want to lose their jobs.
skaters should get a challenge to use like in basketball.
Ai could list facts about the performance that judges could use when in doubt.
This nonsense that AI judging will somehow make scoring less subjective is ridiculous. It is another example of the snake oil big AI companies sell to "help" other companies trim their workforces. Any activity that requires judging - skateboarding, ice skating, gymnastics - will ALWAYS be subjective. And if AI is "learning" based on past human judgments, then it will only replicate the subjective nature of those judgments. AI certainly has its place in the world, and in some fields like science and medicine, it's remarkably helpful because it's doing things humans can't do. But judging events. NAW.
AI judging Zeb and other innovative snowboarders and skateboarders will never work
It is very likely that it will work at some point. The program can take all of snowboarding's history, at what rate new tricks have been invented and how hard the execution is in contrast to all the existing tricks.
are they that strapped for money that they cant have qualified judges?
They just want to make more of it and fire.All the employees it's pretty standard monstrous capitalism stuff
Some subjective opinions like style may need to be removed from judging.
If someone does a more complex trick but another kickflip scores higher because it looks cooler... May need to weed this opinion based judging out. No hate, just an opinion.
Gino
POV of the super pipe is wild.
. Guys do not give up your freedoms just because you want a little better judging. Seriously we are going too far!! Just like cell phones were supposed to be for emergencies and look where we are now!?!? if they do this ill never watch skateboarding again. Ai is evil. We dont need it!! Life is fine!!!
i find it quite shallow and pedantic
I think they should start with 2 or 3 AI models, after each run they should discuss with each other if it was a nollie or not, was it mute or mellon, did the athlete have 2 or 3 legs etc. AI can't even count fingers. X-games did just smell some money from an over subsidized industry that struggles with credibility.
Why would anyone not want humans to be part of something that is solely based off of human activity?? What is the benefit of not using the human subjectivity??
Can we just put ai in the trash, as well as drone cam in sports. It's just awfull
How are drone cams bad? Not saying I disagree, just interested in your reasoning.
@benitofranklyn4237 At winter X-games they are overusing them first, but the angle it give is just real bad, we hardly can see the trick, it's just a bad annoying follow cam. It's way worse than just a tripod cam or a boarder follow cam
AI judging is so incredibly stupid.
Why not just make the athletes ai. And save everyone the trip to aspen. Why bother anybody doing anything at all? Nobody gets hurt; companies spend no money but have record profits. Ai will ruinnn this world. Just Sit at home with your vr set on your head drinking brawndo all day and night. Never have a thought ever again.
I doubt.
Gino
Kelly always sounds so dam nervous- stuttering and stammering whilst red-in-the-face! what a kook!
It’s not objective!!!
cantwait4ai9club