The Roads to a March Q&A
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Beau of The Fifth Column main channel: / beauofthefifthcolumn
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The most concise yet comprehensive take on gonzo journalism I've ever seen. And yes Beau, It makes total sense.
“I never said he was (taking ibogaine), I said there was a rumor in Milwaukeee that he was. Which was true, and I started the rumor in Milwaukee. If you read that carefully, I’m a very accurate journalist.” Hunter S. Thompson talking about Richard Nixon
Milwaukee is kind of like Forrest Gump, we just pop up in a lot of interesting situations ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
My girlfriend used to fill in polls as a side gig when she was super poor, but it was mostly about consumer products. The pay was lousy but it helped her not starve.
I used to do this too when I was super broke. That kind of thing is heavily marketed in places where moms go to look for ways to look for a way to make money from home ao they can stay with their kids.
@@silentisland7633Yep, there are several TH-camrs who specialize in gig survey work.
I do YouGov surveys and get "points" to redeem for gift cards, so a round about payment method.
@@silentisland7633 My wife was doing that for a bit, but after spending 40 minutes on a poll she quit it. This happened multiple times over the course of a two weeks.These polls intentionally string you along, get your data, and then will disqualify you and they won't have to pay you. But they already have most of the data. It's a scam. I think she put like two weeks into these companies and made thirty bucks total.
I tried when I was resly poor, but I'd spend 10 minutes and get rejected so often, I gave up. My opinions are worth money but they disagreed. ;)
That lightbulb moment when you discovered people are paid to take surveys..... Yes, it's a thing, and selection bias is a concern. Fortunately, it's easy to spot once you know the organizations that do it.
I love the "When you aren't the target" video because it's a great way to explain to people who are never the target (usually Straight, White, Christian, Cisgender Males) why the rest of us have to take precautions and trust our Spidey Senses. They don't engage in predatory behavior themselves, and their presence usually discourages potential predators, so they just don't see it. I'm glad the Bird Story link is above, and I hope everyone views it! Thanks for all you do!
As of this decade, I do see women as "prey" for all kinds of things.
I guess I now understand why (mostly) men are called "war hawks" because of the role of predators in battle.
We can improve.
I had been thinking of that video for weeks, but couldn’t think of the title! I’m so glad someone wrote in about it.
I realise that it is a very sensible and grown-up term of art with genuine use, but I can't help but read it as 'Gonzo journalism' and think of A Muppet Christmas Carol. Which, of course, also features the insertion of an unlikely figure into the sidelines of dramatic events in order to make them relatable for the kids.
Surveys are only as good as the variety of people contacted and, most important, the wording of the questions.
The importance of the question is also true in testing. IQ tests were notorious for bias that sometimes resulted from bad questions. To the question "where does milk come from," the answer "from a cow" is obvious from a country kid, but it is quite possible that the more likely answers from a city kid would be from a store, from a bottle or from a mother. When I was young I never saw breast feeding of a baby, but some kids who have would likely put that first. I was on a committee making and vetting university tests and the number of sometimes very subtle problems was amazing. Recognizing that there are intelligences rather than a single intelligence, as well as cultural differences, some of the problems have been addressed.
It is interesting to look at the data behind the polls. Never just look at the headline reports, try to find the data used to make those headline reports.
@@JMM33RanMA I've always hated the ambiguity of the questions on those tests. It's frustrating as all hell to try and determine which of several right answers is the one they want.
There's an entire branch of mathematics dedicated to designing surveys. It's part of what's called "research design". Google it, it's cool.
@@pattyofurniture My university didn't use the GRE for admission to my program, they used the Miller Analogies Test. I finished quickly and thought I had failed, but had actually done fairly well. Your right about frustration, not to mention pressure. One of the issues is that some people choose a correct answer then double think and switch to an incorrect answer.
If you aren't familiar with the MA Test, it is 100% analogies like: Marilyn Monroe is to movies as is to a meal.
A steak B vegetables C gravy D pie.
You might be able to make a case for all except B, though a vegetarian might disagree. It is all opinion, but there is a deeper component, they say, so you compare each 2 answers and choose the stronger one. The test taking trick is to eliminate the first and last [or the two least obvious] and then if you can't decide you have a 50% chance. It doesn't always work, I actually taught a class in test taking, and most students improved scores on the TOEFL, some by 30% or more.
I don't like such tests, because many people don't know how to approach them. They are used because they seem to test problem solving and judgement.
A line that stuck with me from a poetry class: you owe the truth nothing, you owe the poem everything.
Oh, yes, that philosophy has served me well. That and, to paraphrase Eliot, “Good poets borrow, great poets steal.” Are you still writing?
@@chezmoi42 not since I had kids, they're about to get launch and I'm kinda rediscovering myself though.
@@StephenNuchia It's a great way to do that. We retired in France in '92, and some years after I lost my husband in '03, I started writing to keep my English from going rusty.
I had the great good fortune to fall into a workshop site called Poetry Free-for-all in '09; it's been so helpful to have an international community for support and critique. I highly recommend it.
It's time to decide whether to participate in NaPo (National Poetry Writing Month) again this year.
You make more sense than the Bible, so I watch you religiously. Thank you beau.
💯
to be fair, it's not that hard to make more sense than the bible
@@WhichDoctor1 Very easy in fact.
Hallelujah
God help us if that's not the truth😊
Do a whole video on gonzo journalism. I’d love that! And it would be great as a jumping off place for media discussions.
I get the feeling a whole vid on it was imminent almost as soon as he read it.
A political science 101 course.
@@jodycarter7308 Me too, but I thought I’d do some encouraging. 😉
@@anamericaninamericavotesblue That’s All Beau’s videos.
@@susanbradleyskov9179 So, true.☺️
I'm quite impressed that a Navy submarine commander can get pulled over for DUI. Submarines are notorious for being able to elude pursuers. Guy must have been really drunk.
plus, how many cops own subs?
@@vforwombat9915right, don’t they usually prefer donuts? 🍩>🥖
@@BC25citizen groan. Good but groan 🥴
@@bunyipdragon9499 🤗sorry. Sometimes I can’t help myself.
@@BC25citizen 💜
"We CAN stop here, this is Beau country!"
13:25 This happened miles from my work place. My siblings graduated there. Half hour from the the Killers of the Flower Moon, half hour from Black Wall Street.
New century. Same hate.
😥
Hunter S Thompson was....a lot of not good things, but his obituary for Nixon is one of the greatest pieces of American writing ever produced.
Yeah. Here's an excerpt: "Spiro Agnew was … a flat-out, knee-crawling thug with the morals of a weasel on speed. But he was Nixon's vice president for five years, and he only resigned when he was caught red-handed taking cash bribes across his desk in the White House.… Agnew was the Joey Buttafuoco of the Nixon administration, and Hoover was its Caligula. They were brutal, brain-damaged degenerates worse than any hit man out of _The Godfather_ , yet they were the men Richard Nixon trusted most. Together they defined his presidency.
Nixon will be remembered as a classic case of a smart man shitting in his own nest. But he also shit in our nests, and that was the crime that history will burn on his memory like a brand. By disgracing and degrading the Presidency of the United States, by fleeing the White House like a diseased cur, Richard Nixon broke the heart of the American Dream."
There was also a documented crisis in which his wife, while holding onto their infant child, calmly asks him for the gun he showing around, He was high as a kite. She got the gun. There was another prson in the room, but I don't remember how he/she was part of the crazy. He may have been a great artist and writer (very, VERY good) But he was also an asshole and self-destructive.
I am a retired teacher. I guess the trauma I saw every year in my classrooms figured into my thinking.. If the infant was near me. I would desperately find a way to call 911 and then testify!
@@rebeccacamacho-sobczak4282 yep, he was definitely not a good person. He assaulted E Jean Carroll too.
The wonderful thing about Beau is that he is intensely not Gonzo… he has a broad spectrum of followers because he does not attempt to trigger reactions… he mentors with attentiveness and care.
Two really important qualities 💙
Well said.
He still does, we're all just not used to people doing it for something positive.
I disagree. Beau uses Gonzo journalism BRILLIANTLY to explain things on his channels all the time. They sound like regular stories but those stories make a much bigger point. I LOVE Beau for these stories. They make things so much clearer than an objective explanation.
there are many subtle ways to Trigger or evoke a reaction . Beau is the Zen Gonzo.
Gonzo without all the Flim Flam,
For Gonzo, in Bill Murray's "Where the Buffalo Roam" he describes "the Doomed" to Nixon in a washroom. I always felt that was a very Gonzo moment.
Everyday here in Ukraine is a Gonzo day and it's often true...from start to finish. We may have to write a book for a fundraiser!🎉
Happy Pi day!
🥧
3:29 Gonzo is also a muppet… that’s probably the best definition of the word “gonzo”
"A side gig?!?"
It's so rare to see naive Beau. That was quite enjoyable!
And I am so looking forward to what he finds on his investigations of that rabbit hole. I giggled cause I think there is going to be some interesting shenanigans found there. 🤓😂
I love the blue screen that Beau got on the "side gig polling" thing... Yea, you can go to certain websites and they'll pay you a small amount for taking polls. I mean if memory serves is is a pretty small amount of money... but yea... it's VERY MUCH a thing.
Also my husband wants to make a D&D reference about the gonzo journalists thing... "It's the difference between an investigator and a bard" with the gonzo being the bard clearly XD
On surveys :
As a member of a generation often derided for answering a landline from an unrecognized number .
I have been the VICTIM of more political surveys than I care to admit , or even remember !
They typically begin with a couple of innocuous questions before they get to the meat of what they are looking for . AT WHICH POINT the question , multiple -choice answer combinations , become SO OBVIOUSLY SLANTED ,
that it is almost impossible to counter their desired results .
I am sure some surveys are trying to accurately gauge public opinions ,
But from my experience , I wouldn't line bottom of a birdcage with their results .
FYI. Infomercial audiences are paid. It was a test question in college advertising class.
Gonzo: Entertaining fables, based on true events, with a moral at the end.
Happy Pi Day to team Beau and Internet People. 😊
howdy Beau peeps 💙🐪
When I was a kid...like pre school age and kindergarten age, my grandmother took me to the local pool a lot in the summer.
One time I was horsing around with some other kids shouting "Help! Help! Help!" but just in play, not meaning it.
A lifeguard called me over and told me not to say the word "Help" unless I meant it or someone might think I really was in trouble.
Being half-Italian as well as a smart ass I said "Ok, I'll say 'Aiuto!' instead, which is Italian for 'Help.'"
The lifeguard told me "Nom don't do that either, if anyone else knows Italian they could also think you needed help."
I said "Oh, ok." And that was the end of it.
When I got out of the pool and went back to where my grandmother was lounging she asked me what the lifeguard wanted when she called me over.
I reiterated the story to her pretty much as stated above.
A few days later we were at a family gathering and I overheard my grandmother telling this story, only the way she told it was:
"We were at the pool the other day and (OP) was playing with some kids and shouting 'Help!' But just in play. A lifeguard called him over and told him not to say that unless he really meant it or someone might think he really needed help. (OP) agreed to stop saying 'Help!' but then he started saying 'Aiuto!' instead which is Italian for 'help'.
An Italian lifeguard jumped in and saved him."
This was on par for how my grandmother recounted events.
Holy shit! I just learned my grandmother was a gonzo journalist!
Thanks for the Gonzo Journalism definition.
.. so it's a bit like: "Don't let the facts get in the way of telling a good story."
You have the patience of a saint
I had never heard of "gonzo reporting" before. Thanks to the person asking about it!
I love the look you had after you read the question about the pier.
Agreed, Gonzo journalism deserves it's own video.
And to think all this time I was under the impression that Gonzo journalism was reporting done by a bird-like Muppet.
I sometimes wonder if the muppet wasn't inspired by Hunter S Thompson.
with lady chickens in the wings... 😏
@@johnsteiner3417did gonzo smoke a cigar?
i'm remembering no, but i might be off on that.
also, no fishing hat.
beat me to it.
The Muppets need to have at least one movie where they cast Gonzo as a reporter... a little "if you know, you know" moment.
👋
Thanks Beau and crew 😊.
You are not that animal's prey....I could use that for helping some testosterone siblings understand intimidation and bullying. Thanks !
So Twain was our first gonzo journalist?
No wonder he was my favorite author growing up…actually, he still is.
“Letters From Earth” is wonderful……
"incredibly likely" is a down play, yet this pier is still totally worth it. corruption is a unfortunate factor...get it done.
There is a polling firm in Canada focus primarily on national politics and policy, who offer $5 per survey. Respondents have the options to accept, refuse or have it donated to a registered charity.
Well Mornin' Beaupeeps😊
I think that about 90% of journalism today is gonzo. That's why everyone loves Beau.
Sending out hugs, love, and spoons to anyone who wants them! 🤗💙🥄🥄🥄
I almost forgot Pi Day! 🥧
💙 thanks! I could use a spoon or two these days.
So gonzo journalism is basically like a factual morality play.
Hi Beau: Right after high school a friend & I were paid to do a survey about a large airport in our small town. For 2 weeks we sat at the
airport bar for a while, then went around asking a couple of people their opinions. Then we faked the rest of the paperwork and went out to party. This was 1970 or so.
Happy pi!
🥰 🥧
The translate to English added by TH-cam is the clincher punchline, to convert this comment to true humor.
@@randallthomas5207 what did it translate to? I don't see it.
@@Ubotit_Unaymit humor. The AI, doesn’t recognize Pi as English.
@@randallthomas5207 Oh, I got you. To be fair, it isn't. Lol
Hunter S. Thompson came to U of F while I was in the journalism school there in the mid 1970s. He gave a public talk outdoors one evening, and was supposed to speak to a journalism class the next day. Instead, we got a call saying that he had to cancel because he was “really high.” True? Image building? I have no idea. Funny, though.
I have a friend who used to go do those paid polls after work about once a week in the mid 2000s. Sometimes it was a movie. Sometimes it was a poll. Never asked him a lot of detail about it but thought it was a good side gig for him.
The vast majority of paid survey work will be from consumer product companies. Anything, from any pollster you've heard of, on a paid site is going to be a pilot survey to test if they have sufficient power for a survey experiment, spelling mistakes, or other random adjustments. It would not be used in the data analysis or published as use able data.
That's not necessarily the case. Pew Research has a recent article on opt-in online polling and the inaccuracy it engenders in certain (mostly young) demographics.
Thanks Team Beau! Beau Knows!!! 🇺🇸🦅🇺🇦
I read Thompson's book on the Hell's Angels when I was a kid.... and had a ball. He loved the danger and being in the story. I have to admit I think he was honest, but.. who knows? Nice QnA, Sir.
Happy PI day everyone!
Thanks for such an informative and thoughtful video.
All hail the Algorithm
Happy PI day!
Good morning Beau and internet folks.
Thank you Team Beau and to the questioners.
"Finish the f*cking story!"
Hunter S.Thompson, fear and lothing in Las Vegas
Re: Gonzo. I would have added it can open a window into the "emotion" within an event or issue, While gonzo made HST (in)famous, he was also a damn fine straight reporter. For the curious, the book "The Great Shark Hunt" provides great examples of HST doing both.
I used to fill out paid surveys as a "beer money" thing (the rewards could be claimed as any number of gift cards) but it was almost exclusively consumer product research ("have you heard of X company", "how likely would you be to recommend company Y to friends/family", etc)
Howdy and good morning!
Howdy, & good evening from Australia 👍
That was a neat story and analogy. I kind of had that experience while walking my dog yesterday when a hawk flew over. My dog is 60 Lbs and I thought to myself, NO WORRIES you are big enough to not be a target.
Howdy
Hey Beau, the second thing about Hunter S. Thompson is that it's fun to read and thereby sucks you in and acts like the proverbial sugar that helps the medicine go down. The amazing thing about Hunter's stories is that you could laugh your ass off the whole way, and then walk away pissed for the reason he wanted, and at the person he wished. I would've given my life (probably literally LOL) to have been there for the conversations with Johnny Depp.
Beautiful definition and a great story with great lessons! Hunter would be proud! Thompson, not Biden!
👋 morning all
"Beau, we can't stop here... this is bat country!" 🦇👀
Yay Beau!!!
@beau THANK YOU! I’ve never understood Gonzo Journalism and this was a great length of example and explanation for my attention span.
Hey Beau, I used to do those surveys door to door. Asking the questions.
So - there's two ways of polling - focus groups and questionnaires - going door to door in the field or via phone call. I was a door to door person.
So - door to door. We got given Census maps, several blocks that were numbered. We were given the start point of the block, then walked the block, keeping the houses on our right side. Each house we noted response - yes, no, nobody home. If nobody was home, we could go back an additional 2 times before we could strike the house off.
We also had specific targets. The main survey I did quizzed 10 people - 5 males, 5 females, and we also had to try to get different age ranges as well.
Focus groups can be paid. In my experience - it's not much - mebbe $50 for your time, often paid in the form of a gift card to be spent at a particular store. I'm on the list for a couple of such companies who work on a points system - you get points by doing surveys, and so many points gets you a $40 Coles gift card (I'm in Australia). So does that colour my answers to a survey? No, not really.
One thing you DO need to be concerned about when it comes to focus groups tho is "group think", as outlined by Solomon Asch in his study on the phenomenon. Group Think occurs when you have dominant individuals in the group with strong ideas that other members of the group adopt but yet don't adopt - if that makes sense. Group Think is a good way to really describe MAGA.
I think a video about gonzo journalism is a great idea. The thing about people being paid too take surveys was a surprise to me as well. It would explain a lot about polls becoming less accurate. Could you please do a video on exit polling and why the right wants to get rid of them?
I literally have had 4 copies of the Great Shark Hunt by Thompson, "liberated " since I first read it in college. If you want to understand the troubles in South America today, read some of his essays of his travels there 60+ years ago. The story of using the slums of a major city there (sorry, my latest copy has been liberated to tell you which) used as a driving range tells you of our attitude for the poor in those countries then and now.
Thanks for addressing the Gonzo journalism and hawk story. I spent more than half of my life since college working overseas so this is one of the things I missed. I would describe Gonzo journalism alone as propaganda, but with the hawk story it is more like Aesop's fables. It is still a bit dangerous if constructed for malicious purposes. As a matter of fact one of the problems with the Red Cap Gang is that they believe everything without question, including stories constructed out of warped facts and totally malicious fiction.
I never heard of gonzo but the images came to mind from childhood of Aesops Fables cartoons, so glad you mentioned them here.
I also thought of Aesop during Beau's discussion.
In the old Doonesbury comics, Hunter S Thompson appeared as "Uncle Duke".
A birthday Q&A for me! Yay!
Happy birthday!
Happy Birthday!
Happy Pi day!
Happy Birthday 🎉
the order of questions is also important in a survey.
I saw the coroner's finding on Bix and thought, " Oh Hell no." Thank you.
Really ought to be called Aesop journalism as it's about turning real life into fables.
I can relate to the survey question. I take them too to earn a little extra money for Christmas. The company I take them with is Ipsos.
The nation of Gonzo is "where the Buffalo Roam"!😂!
Hey Beau I loved the Gonzo journalism explanation ❤. I’ve watched a couple documentaries about Hunter S Thompson, an extremely interesting individual 💥 But still never got the “ based on a true story “ kinda thing. That was fun. A follow up would be Amazing if you have time
☮️FREE PALESTINE
👋🌎✌️
Keep doing great work! And Happy Pi Day!
I used to do surveys as a side gig as well but it was all about products I buy type of thing.
Sago Beau thanks again.
This reminded me of the difference between truth, Truth, and truthiness. Seems like Gonzo journalism goes for truthiness.
Thank you for the commentary.
Thank you for your videos.
I was surprised to see Dems vote to ban TickTock and I am 68 - so I suspect the young folks are gonna be unhappy.
There are so many more important things for the Dems in the House to work on. But hey maybe this is how they got the Republicans to pass a budget.
Who knows in these crazy days.
…I doubt most are even aware once the new owners take over…and that’s the REAL objective. It’s the international poker table, wherein only the ultra wealthy get a hand dealt.
They're not voting to ban it. That's literally not in the bill.
They're pushing to have TikTok sold so that the Chinese government doesn't control it and use it to push pro-China, anti-American propaganda.
The issue is, if some American billionaire buys it... it will still likely be full of anti-American propaganda and racism.
It isn't a ban and it is very likely the young folks will never see any difference. However it is nice to see them learning the political process. Hope we can bottle that.
It keeps exposing how similar the democrat party is to Republicans behind closed doors. It's bad for business when you are shown to say one thing, yet do the opposite and especially when it goes directly against the wishes of your base. Many young people were shocked that we sent so many bombs to an active genocide, breaking our own laws against sending weapons when aid is being blocked. Stories like that haven't seemed to pop up on TH-cam for example.
I agree with Beau - someone wants to buy the platform. Probably YT/Alphabet. They already use the shorts. *eye rolls*
Great gonzo explanation.
I’ve done paid surveys also in the past, and they’re all for commercial purposes only not for political purposes… Either for testing the potential of product launches or for the review of an actual product itself… And I’ve made well over $4000 over the past five years taking surveys like this
I really appreciate what you do Beau. you offer something that I feel isn't duplicated anywhere else online. I also appreciate how you inform us / update on various events without clickbait titles, or feeding into 'shock value' / discussing heavy topics without sensationalism, as well as delivering them in a manner that is not anxiety inducing. Just all around good content.
There are several services that will gather data for pollsters by paying people to take surveys. They range from political to market research to all kinds of things. I'm sure it does skew results. Good pollsters know how to adjust for that. Getting people who are willing to answer questions free is also a skewed sample. This is why places like 538 study the methodology of every pollster and adjust based on the predictive value their results tend to give. For some, their results tend to skew in one direction or another, so they adjust accordingly. For others, their results are more erratic and so those polls weigh less in their averages.
That's why 538 is MUCH better than Real Clear Politics in terms of averaging polling.
Greetings Sam. Did you know if 538 plans on building a predictive model like they did when Nate Silver was still there? I wonder if it would be as good and if Nate may just build his own model independent of 538.
And yet it's not worth the paper it's printed on.
@@UncleGeno I expect both Nate and 538 to build them. As to the quality, I expect both to be good. There are still people at 538 that worked there when they did so well in 2016 and 2020.
It is important to know what they are and are not good at and not just trust them blindly. They are at their best when they have built a predictive model, as you noted. Before they build that, they are largely doing punditry... which they're terrible at. Silver apologized for that in 2016 when he failed to take Trump seriously in the primaries. Cenk Uyger did much better there. He has his flaws too, but he is good at reading the political winds and predicting how the polls will move from their current locations. That isn't an exact science and nobody is perfect at it, but he's pretty good.
But once their predictive model was built, it showed Trump closing in on Clinton. By a week out, they said Trump would win with one major event that changed the polling and one normal polling error. The Comey statement changed the polling and on election day, they predicted Trump with 30% odds of winning, which is a normal polling error. They listed several possible polling errors. One of them was over performing in the rust belt, which is what happened.
They sharply criticized the models used by NY Times and others that treated each state as an independent event, causing them to give the odds of an upset in several states as much lower than it really was.
It seems like 538 hasn't changed that much. They still do a lot of punditry, but that seems to be mainly so they have something to report to pay the bills. It doesn't seem to get in the way of what they're actually good at. But I could be wrong. It is their first election without Silver.
@@Sam_on_TH-camThanks Sam. I remember everyone just piling on Silver after the 2016 election but his model was 70/30 Clinton and trending to Trump by election day. It wasn't like he guaranteed anything and was far closer to the truth than Nyt and pretty much any other model. Look forward to seeing the new models released. Take care...
@@UncleGeno Yeah, the people saying he was wrong don't know how to do math and didn't listen to their explanations they were giving BEFORE the election of what their predictions actually meant.
The polling rabbit hole sounds interesting. Can’t wait to see what you find
Good morning
"Soak the carpet in ether".🤔
Thank you.
I recommend watching fear and loathing in Las Vegas. It’ll kind of explains who Hunter S Thompson was in addition to being one of the funniest movies I’ve ever seen.
Thanks Beau for all you help us understand.
Oklahoma is an all around terrible place. I lived there 11 months and just driving into it now makes me ill
"Side gig." Many places offer payment in some form for filling out random polls. Has been a thing with online games for over a decade. There are "secret shopper" versions, too.
I take polls as a side gig, usually make 90-120 a month. Everything about the polls are anonymous to who they are for and you get the money regardless. You are told upfront how much you will receive upon completion and you get that regardless of how you answer. Some of the polls you can definitely tell the slant based on the questions but I don't think the money corrupts the data as much as just gets them an active poll base. Usually you get 2-3 dollars per poll, though for a couple I've gotten 15-20.
Further brilliance. Thank you ❤