Ironically enough in the alternate universe in the Adventure Time comics, the elementals were cosmic beings that seeked to destroy Ooo except for the ice elemental which ultimately sacrificed themselves for the salvation of Ooo and the erasure of their fellow elementals. The ice elementals or at least the ones we know of, all have a running gig where they think differently from the other elementals and I like how in the comic, the ice elemental was selfless unlike Patience and Evergreen.
Well if magic is born/fueled by madness and sadness, then perhaps a great cataclysm like the mushroom war simply caused a lot of madness and sadness... (As any post apocalyptic anything tends to imply, desperation breads madness, and loss is a known cause of sadness.)
I think it's waay more likely that magic affects the mind of the user consuming them in madness and the depression of the over-knowledge of their existence.
Logic dictates that the extreme levels of rational thought in killing and horrors of the fly during WW1 is what killed all they mythological beings and why we cannot prove any of them to exist.
Dark theory : There is only so much magic, and everyone gets a tiny bit. When the bomb wiped out so many, there was plenty of magic for the remaining peoples.
And in the farmworld timeline, I K froze the world. That might have made the few survivors pretty sad and despondent, but there's not Lovecraftian horror and loss of sanity. Creating magic requires people have both, and you need to have both to wield it.
That concept is one of the grossest things I've ever pictured (I have a thing about hair, okay?) yet it's still one of the funniest jokes in the series to me. Go figure.
Well objects of higher mass and lower volume will have a higher density water has a mass of 1g/cm(cubed) while ice has a density of 0.93 g/cm(cubed) ,however for Patience to freeze herself the ice egg can not have been majorly hollow requiring her to leave the minimal space to be preserved not to mention the added mass of the boat which slightly raises the volume makes it slightly more believable,perhaps she just changed the density of the uce
Better yet, she is by definition magical, she shoots fucking jelly beans from her hands there no fucking science that lets you do that. She dated a fucking vampire a magical creature, who’s dad was a primeval super monster from before time began, and later try’s to fight a literal god of chaos, who’s disciple she previously fought with the power of friendship, PB magic is definitely not science, where the hell have you been?
@@Lh0000 marceline could be explained cause she is another race, if today there was a bat with human features we wouldn't call him magic. The Jelly beans can also be explained because its one of the 4 elements, its basically fire/water/air/earth in their universe, we could call her candy bender. The literal god of chaos, yeah about that idk, I guess he is a god so it kinda makes sense for him to have some level of omnipotency.
I always thought it was implied the Mushroom Bomb of Adventure Time was made from the catalyst comet which contained the lich. So not only did it go full nuclear but it also spread mutagenic magical energy. Kinda showing what PB says that magic and advanced technology are the same. Nuclear bomb material, magical comet containing death incarnate.
Pendleton Ward was actually asked about Finn and Jake's magic from when they were training under that frog wizard and he said their powers were all contained in the training robes, and the robes were destroyed. So that's at least why they don't have that magic anymore.
@FMJackal If I'm not mistaken, it was only much later in the series that Fin could do some minor magic. The fact that Finn learned some magic was because he's older and experienced sadness.
Theory: all magic is derived from golb which is why it drives everyone who uses it insane to some degree. Magic is channeled through some medium to give it some degree of separation from golb and make it safer to use, which is why all wizards are themed around some element or idea except for magic man who wielded the closest thing to pure magic and thus was exceptionally crazy. The crown should also wield pure magic which is why it also makes people extra crazy but it was corrupted by its first wish to make whoever uses it into a copy of the original ice elemental. After the mushroom war the litch who was a scholar of golb was released into the world which might have increased people's access to magic. Finn and Jake lost their magic powers because they had both been given their powers from outside sources, in season one that power came from the school they joined so they lost their power when they quit in season two their powers might have been stolen from the ice king who in his desire to make ice ninja into a thing had created a way for others to copy his power for a time. Then they would've lost their powers when the ice king got bord with the idea.
This is also makes sense when you consider that the Lich calls himself “The Last Scholar of Golb”. This could be interpreted as since he wants to destroy all life, he will be the last person alive to ever use magic.
I do like this although I’m not entirely sure how it translates to entities less bound to the universe like Prismo or the Cosmic Owl. One could maybe argue the owl isn’t magical but I really doubt prismo has any direct connection to Golb
@@frimi8593one answer could be that since killing a wish master is a cosmic crime prismo's existence seems built into the nature of the multiverse itself so perhaps he draws from a separate power source. In evidence of this consider that Prismo's wish powers could not retrieve Betty from Golb but the ice crown's wish magic could fuse Betty with Golb, suggesting that prismo's wishes are not derived from wish magic. Perhaps even Prismo isn't magical at all but instead in some way controls and influences causality and time from his position outside the reach of all time, save that time relevant to his own perception. It is also possible that since Prismo is the dream of a host, it is the host that actually practices and uses all the magic needed to grant wishes and therefore suffers the consequences of using such magic. While prismo himself remains the same since he is merely commanding another to actually grant the wishes. Consider how old man prismo sleeps in a relm of darkness and monsters, perhaps such shadows were not placed there to protect the old man but instead are the result of magic warping the area around him as he practices it in his dream. Consider also how old man prismo wasn't at all freaked out by the presence of the Litch before it killed him, even going so far as to wonder if the Litch was his son, suggesting that perhaps he felt some kinship with the scholar of Golb, perhaps as a result of having been immersed in Golb's power for so many thousands of years as he practiced his wish magic.
@@emptank that is a good answer. I think that could work. Although I will it also makes sense that prismo can’t retrieve margles in the case that he is using magic derived from golb
So what I’m hearing is that in the show’s canon, Magic is a scientific concept that was harshly stigmatized because dabbling in it often lead to cognitive decline. Then, a sequence of events called the mushroom wars, lead to the wide spread normalization of magic use. I’m coming to some conclusions here. Something to do with magic and mushrooms 🤔
@@zenzonerzz4789 no, it's not really. Science can't explain many unexplainable things and most likely won't. There are more to it, maybe not necessarily "magic" so to say but not really science either. I guess it's subjective
@@killakil7644 you know there once was a time where lighting was unexplainable. We figured it out though, same with Black Holes, among other things. People used to think lighting was caused by magic gods, but science figured it out
the magic is actually quite consistent, in the the two cases you mentioned Finn and Jake just simply borrowed magic from Bufo and Ice King respectively, and to me its workings are quite simple, magic in AT is inherently linked to defiance of reality (most commonly found in madness), thus a time in which the majority of sapient beings are logic-driven diminishes its power, my guess is that the reason why the crown is still extremely powerful regardless its because its wish magic which the elementals stressed it so powerful it can threaten reality itself also I think your theory about the bomb that spawned the Lich having portions of a catalyst comet is semi-confirmed, remember the comet that killed the dinosaurs was green and had horn-shaped flames, it heavily implies this is how the Lich originally arrived Earth
I find it interesting that the "mushroom bomb" is never specified as nuclear, which might suggest that the bomb itself was a utilisation of magic power in a non-magic world.
Yeah it could be nuclear but let’s be honest here, we know full well that this is a cartoon, so the idea of some large force (a government, some evil genius with great magic powers, one of the main characters at a different point in the timeline, etc...) creating a bomb that explodes with radiating destruction magic, is not implausible. Adventure time is a preposterous show with magical and ridiculous things everywhere, we don’t know how far magic can go in the land of Ooo. We don’t even know what the fundamental laws of magic in that world are, but it’s entirely possible that a release of magic, of that magnitude, could have imbued magic into the world when combined with the catalyst comet or perhaps by itself. This show left more questions unanswered than answered by the end.
From what I understand the mushroom war is that time's version of the catalyst comet. The same way Finn used to be a butterfly, the comet was a nuke bomb once.
I think the the ice was a metaphor for that world being a colder or harsher place and the nuke bomb was the alternative to the comet because its a more realistic possibility in peoples minds
Seeing alot of these theories and alot of the re visited locations and how dark the series can get it really makes me want a elder scrolls/fallout like rpg in the adventure time universe
I loved how he used the song "Sis Puella Magica" to talk about magic, and it works because in adventure, the same as in Puella Magi, the magic is also tragic.
There was a role playing game in the 90's called Rifts that had a similar situation. A nuclear war killed off most of the population, and magic had returned. IIRC the life energy from all those people dying energized dormant ley lines, opening up inter-dimensional rifts and bringing in strange creatures and technologies.
@@elijahfyffe5176 Haha, no, it's way more convoluted than that. In FMA 2003, the souls of those that died in our world powered alchemy in the Elric brother's world. Honestly, it was a pretty cool twist, though, in a vacuum, it sounds kind of dumb.
The catalyst comet could be a, cleansing agent, like the reapers in mass effect, killing off life every 1000 years and allowing new life to form, how it forms is a mystery as it could be the entity inside using its own abilities to create life, or even natural ways
The problem is that the comets create important beings, like Finn being a reincarnation of the blue comet, the lich was the green comet, Jake was (maybe?) The yellow comet. So it can't be a cleanse
New theory after Fionna and Cake: Betty (now as Golb, a being outside of time itself) is the one who created the catalyst comets, or at least the blue comet that eventually became Finn. This explains why the comets only target Earth and could be her way to make sure Simon stays safe and the events that lead up to this remain the way they are.
@@jasdanvm3845 I don't know if it's an exact quote, but "Marcy's Super Secret Scrapbook" explores that concept and explains magic. The universe of AT is emergent from collective consciousness, (it was created when the infinite primordial monsters that preceded existence, by pure chance, agreed upon the nature of reality) meaning your perception of the world and yourself is what defines the world and yourself. You paradoxically maintain your existence via experiencing it. Therefore, because the universe and all physical laws emerge from the mind, magic is the ability to influence reality by changing your perception of reality: i.e. imagination. This actually fits in quite nicely with Betty's MMS theory, as sanity would probably get in the way of perceiving reality so incorrectly that it literally changes to match your belief. The book also explains that magic became stronger after the Mushroom War because our dimension's "elasticity" increased, a concept also briefly explained. I don't think it's clarified if the bomb caused the magic to return or if the blue comet did.
@@michaelhenry3234 kinda reminds me of how in the elder scrolls games there is a concept called amaranth. To cut it short it means that the entire universe of the games is just a dream of one entity. The godhead. If you realise that you are basicly not real yet persist on your own identity you achieve amaranth making you a god.
@@michaelhenry3234 | At first I thought that idea was dumb when I read the quote, but wow the way you explained that was so good it just makes sense for magic as a concept, and even as a possibility for Adventure Time.
I know this is head canon, but I always took the Lich's catalyst comet as being part of the mushroom bomb. Like researchers found the impact crater, dug it up, turned it into a bomb, and that's what gave the Lich his true form.
Well it was stated that Finn and Jake lost their magic powers because their robes were destroyed and they forgot the ice spells because they didn't have enough tine to remember them.
I personally like to think that the reason the mushroom bomb "brought" magic into the world was because Magic was always an inherent force in the world, but that it's also a finite resource. The Earth became non-magical because there were simply too many living beings around trying to use it, so nobody could really have it. When the Mushroom Bomb went off, it wiped out a vast portion of all the living things on the planet, freeing up tons of Magic for people to use again.
I remember when flame King broke the fourth wall by saying that the flame princess could become good, but she would have a penalty to experience points for acting out of alignment
I have a theory about the cause of magic in Ooo, We saw that the elementals didnt have strong power during the civilization times hinting that there is not enough chaos, sadness, madness. But when the nuclear bomb happened chaos, sadness and madness happened and magic started to exponentially grow again
Honestly I think the answer is right in Betty’s observation. Magic appears alongside Madness and Sadness. The Mushroom War caused untold devastation long after it was over. During the fear and insanity of the time many beings awakened to their Magical Potential and became wizards. Magic in the wrong hands can cause massive changes to the world and it probably did which could go long ways to explaining why the world of Adventure Time is so magical.
Mustachioed Bear yes, they have some ressemblance... but I got the feeling that the creature was from other dimension... (and the series probably will still talk more about other dimensions, after that lichjake hand went to the multiverse... i also think that beladona, the creature that dampened all magic on one episose, is from other dimension)
Maybe there were less magic users in modern times, and medieval times and such, and they were seen as evil and persecuted (like "witches" in medieval times), so now that basically everyone except magic people had died on earth and history kind of restarted, without the past assumptions about how those who used magic were evil, the magic users could finally use their powers as they wished.
@@ColeTanaka Belief in witches and witchcraft was seen as silly and ignorant for most of the middle ages and ironically began to grow mainstream during the Renaissance
@@ColeTanaka You are more likey to get in trouble for believing in witches than being an accused as a witch yourself You know since no greater power than God
I know this might be a bit of a tangent but I think "them hungry looking rainbows" is a reference to Rainicorns as we know they have a taste for humans. So does this mean Rainicorns aren't native to the crystal dimension and are in fact mutations or simply that they regularly left it to hunt humans? Regardless of the answer I think this means they probably had a part in the extinction of humans (not counting the islanders) I just thought this could be a bit interesting as I haven't seen anyone else bring this up
The episode with the robes weren’t them learning magic. It was told at the end they weren’t doing any magic, the robes were channeling magic from the frog wizard. They weren’t Wizards, they were Warlocks.
Everybody has already said this but the Finn comet missed Earth in the Farmworld universe due to the world being frozen over after Simon's death. That's why there's no crater that we know of.
Finn wasn't literally the comet, and he didn't come from it, he was that comet in a past life. As long as the comet still existed, Finn will still exist, regardless of whether the comet hit Earth or not
All of the episodes, for the most part, contained a lot of deep thought and introspections into themselves though. It was later in the series that they started throwing it in one's face.
Welll… you need to have your breaking point nearby and you have to figure out how you’re gonna connect to a source of magic, as of you connected to the direct source of magic you’d go crazy beyond help
I believe something about The Lich is inherently magic, as he said he's the Last Scholar of Golb, meaning he's likely one of the Monsters that existed LONG before everything ever existed, so I believe he somehow created the Mushroom Bomb, or perhaps influenced it, so it would cause him to start existing within Ooo's world
I like to combine the ideas from D&D and GURPS when thinking about Adventure Times magic. More than one system or source of magic can co-exist. And the reason the pre-mushroom war world was a a low-magic world is too un-explained for me to hold an opinion on.
I think that the lore doesn't have to be messed up by Finn and Jake's use of magic the first and second season because in both episodes they wear things that aren't part of their typical attire: the robes and the ninja headbands. Maybe these items could grant the person who wears them limited magical ability and, with instruction (whether from a teacher or a book), non magical beings can learn to unlock the magic in those special items. Obviously it isn't as potent as like the ice crown, but I think the theory can still hold..
Lauren Bennett I think it was established in an interview somewhere (I haven't got the source) that confirms half of your suspicions. It was explained that the robes themselves held the magic abilities, so once they were removed, the magic went with the robe. As for the ice ninja jazz, Finn and Jake lost those abilities simply because they stopped practicing.
Corey Auringer So they addressed both instances in the interview and provided those separate explanations for the magic use? I still like my theory because it seems more unified to me :P .. but if the creators provided a different answer than of course they're right 👌🏼
I wonder if the show will end with Jake becoming another cosmic entity and leaves into space to bring change to the next planet. The creature that bit Joshua looks like it's from the same species as the comet creature Finn talked to in space. This could be how cosmic beings are born. In son of mars when Lincoln tells Jake he'll be ejected out into space as cosmic dust Jake says he's "way into that stuff" Jakes croak dream in space could be representative of Jake shedding his dog form. This would explain why Lich/Jake develops powers so quickly in Farmworld. It would bring the story full circle as Finn was a comet in a past life.
of course, what pb says about magic isn't necessarily true in oo just because she says it. i know she usually know what's up because of her smarts and covert information network, but in this case, as a person with a scientific world view, she is biased, apt to dismiss magic or frame it scientifically. though i will admit hers is a fair criticism
luciferangelica I feel like she probably didn’t hold that view by the end either, after she discovered her elemental candy powers. I could be wrong though
With Jessie Moynahan leaving AT, I guess MM's story is fairly wrapped up. I'm sure he'll have his own ep soon though. Wanna know how he works his way up to being King of Mars.
I like princess bubblegum's explanation period it's like how in full metal alchemist alchemy isn't Magic but science period performed by those who understand the elemental and chemical make up of the things they're interacting with
In many asian lores there is a finite amount of cycling power throughout the world and more people pulling from the mana pool means less people can use mana effectively
Dose anyone remember when Finn was trying to kill Banana Man when he put some leafs on the head of an arrow and set it on fire by putting his hands near it? While listing off facts about Finn The Adventure time Encyclopedia which is from the prospective of Hunson Abadeer states "unlike other humans, Finn has the uncanny ability to make fire with his bare hands" maybe Finn can proform at least low level magic but just barely ever dose. As someone who's role model is Billy and has the example of the Enchiridion it would make sense that he never used magic. The Enchiridion was also made into a real book and it makes sure to differentiate wizard and heros as very different things. Finns path is the hero, not the Wizard so he takes the advice from the book that have to do with being a hero. The Enchiridion also emphasize swordplay as if it is the heros destined weapon, even going as far to say that swords "embody all the things that a righteous hero must bee" so maybe those are some reasons that Finn could probably use magic but chooses not too.
My question is why the Lich’s catalyst comet caused an extinction level event on the earth, whereas Finn’s catalyst comet disappeared 1/16 or so of the planet’s mass, and also does not appear to have severly damaged the rest of the planet’s surface? If anyone’s willing to shoot some theory out about this I’d appreciate it!
Maybe it has something to do with Finns helpful and heroic nature that made his comet not destroy too much of the world but still make a significant impact, and since the Lich is pure evil and wants to end life maybe his comet did essentially exactly what the lich wanted to do before he was reborn as the lich.
I'm impressed with how much lore this guy conjured up about this show, I've been watching this show for years and never even thought about this kinda stuff
In the alternate universe, whenever the world freezes over, Marceline mentions how it shifted the Earth out of place (Or something along those lines) and then it shows a comet flying past and narrowly missing the Earth. I feel this was most likely the catalyst comet and it never impacted with the Earth in the alternate universe cause it missed.
I just thought - if Jake turned into the Lich in the Farmworld Timeline, that means somebody needs to be behind the real Lich too. You think we'll ever get to explore that persons background? I mean, Sweet Pie seems to know a lot of stuff subconsciously.
The more Mad/Sad the world gets the more magical it becomes. The same as the wizards. The more ordered the world becomes and as it also heals/forgets the wounds of the past, the mushroom war, it slowly becomes less magical. Late but here for a great show like adventure time.
there's a really neat theory that says jake is the over-god of the multiverse. like, prismo's job is to keep the multiverse from donking itself up with all the magic and wishes going around the place. prismo also said his powers were being weakened by the wish-world where jake gets lichified. we even know that jake manifests prismo through a dream. and considering how many times he's created time loops for the sake of creating something, it can be easily assumed jake/prismo did the same thing for themselves. and with that assumption made, we can then assume that magic has always existed in the adventure time universe, but was fully activated when the war happened
Cool! Have you thought about the possibility of Magic being Programming? like, writing code? both have been heavily implied to be connected by the appearance of magic artifacts (specially the crown with all its circuitry) and the entire episode of A Glitch is a Glitch is an allusion to this. Magic could be the ability to play with the code of reality itself, to alter the physical forms and properties of things and creatures through reprogramming, by editing the information that dictates how they look like and what they're capable of.
Perhaps adept magic users opted to streamline the creation of spells and magical artifacts by applying their magic in a similar manner to computer programming.
So my thoughts are that the comet has most impact based on the implication that the lich was a catalyst comet (there was a comet with the single horn that the lich is known for) at the same time I don't think the lich was born from the mushroom war based on sweet peas "before there was everything there was nothing, and before that there were monsters" bit. My theory is that the lich and magic are in a weird way one and the same which is why farm world finns world 'where the lich never existed' is a world without magic. But it'd explain why the lichs 'birth' and the birth of a magic world would synch up with the mushroom war and the catalyst comet, if we assume that the two happened at fairly consistent times
@5:10 The way I understand it, the Lich's soul was somehow INSIDE the original mushroom bomb, maybe similar to how Finn's soul was inside the comet once before he became a butterfly. This gives me the idea that maybe the people who created the bomb knew that, despite the world being "non magic" there were elements of magic that they could harness as a weapon through their technology, and somehow put the Lich's soul into their bomb (which he probably wanted anyway). I'm assuming this because when Finn wishes "I wish the Lich never even ever existed" in Prismo's wish room, it alters time simply by freezing the bomb over and not allowing it to explode.
i still think that the lich is the creature from the green comet that was used for making the bomb for a war like a super weapon or something. like the catalist comet it was meant to bring a change to the planet, but a destructive one.
I think Magic in AT is a metafor to ART and The relationship artists have to it. The madness and melancholy elements are both known elements to The life of Painters such as Van Gogh and Goya, and to acting methods such as The Stanislavski who bring real emotional baggage to roles. Marina Abramovich also Said that ART is The right place to broken people as It is presented in The show.
My biggest theory is the Mushroom Bomb IS the Catalyst comet that becomes The Lich, maybe modern humans found it, frozen by the ice crown and utilized its destructive power as a nuke, so in Farmworld it got frozen for a second time
Adventure Time took a deep lore dive since i stopped watching apparently. I love that show so much; it inspired my art and the things i create on a daily basis. Thank you for giving me an excuse to go back and learn about the show i used to love
Elk! You missed two big things! 1st is Beladona (if I recall the namd correctly), the monster that when released caused all Magic to be suppressed (its when ice king gets his old self back, and brings betty from the past). this monster might appear again? maybe he was responsible for the low magic eras. 2nd: the martians (lincoln or grob, I cant recall completelly) said something, at some episode, that the comet missed one visit (and was late for the more recent one)... so I think he didn't came at all in the period of the mushroom war.
I was thinking the same thing. Bela Noche is a being of pure anti magic so it would make sense that there would be fluctuations in magical power throughout the ages corresponding to Bela Noches strength.
I'd lean more towards the idea of the bonb is made from the comet from the past and the new one helped spring magic into action. We know there were people looking into ancient artifacts (Like Simon). The comet might have been discovered. If someone found the ice crown, then it's likely someone found the comet. Also, Farm World might have had magic already, but shunned for some reason.
"this means those with tragic pasts are more likely to be drawn to magic, and those who chase after it while content may have their lives spiral out of control." This might sound kinda crazy or awesome depending on what type of person you are. But As a life long creative and weirdo. I see this MnS magic theory as basically a metaphor for creativity, which operates via very similar madness/sadness rules they laid out. Creativity is often an outlet for people with troubles that prefer introverted escapism to "projecting" their problems onto others. Having also observed hundreds of creatives, of different disciplines, in my days as an average young book artist, bad animator, toy graffiti writer and Journeyman street artist and established studio artist, during the past 15 years it rings true to my experiences and interactions. I don't think Magic being a loose metaphor for creativity is that weird considering the shows creators are all extremely creative people who all will have tackled with the unique snares of the power of creating. And likely most of there friends are also creatives and strange folk. And it would but that uncommon running into people who fall into the "darkside" of creativity dancing with the madness. It is easy to become seduced by inspiration when exploring ideas, characters and world building. The more disconnected from your body and journey into your mind can easily provide more original and inspiring ideas/magic. But is fickled and difficult beast to tangle with. But the more you are prone the emotional and physical instability. But the harder the reality come down is. They are extreme nature highs and lows. Some get there via drugs, coffee, mental exhaustion or emotional trauma. But i tend to get there via focusing more on my ideas and projects than my physical needs. There is an easy creative state know as the "the flow" and trying to hold onto this state too longer or at the wrong time can access the wild uncontrollable creative magic that can destroy its welder. The effects on the user mood can change their perception of their subjective reality threaten your world via straining perceived Objective reality you share with others close to you. I think of it a lot like using Kaio Ken or Sasukes curse seal; A powerful tool of burning tomorrows energy to crush todays task with x4 productivity, but at a harsh cost to your well being. The side effects are often not worth it though. Limitations of having a body. lol. Through discipline and training you can learn to access a lot of the originality and creativity without going deep in the madness trap and rather just briefy dance with it and leave to with what you need while staying healthy. If you don't take care of yourself via eating regularly/well, exercising/going outside and by socialising in a relaxed way with RL friends your magic/creativity can turn dark. I wouldnt be surprised if the Ice King was informed by Pendleton Wards anxiety and distorted self image after going too deep into a creative introvert zone. It can be hard to explain to normies what you are going through in these times since there many common experiences to reference. Artists are the ones who can visit the madness, find some magic and bring it back for the rest of us Half blood and muggles to enjoy. It is probably the weirdest skill there is. Imagination. This may sound like i am projecting a lot of my own perception onto this and maybe/probably I am. But if you have read much Discworld, which is probably one of the purest more expansive expressions of creativity, you may be familiar with the themes explored by characters existing in a fictional world that works via fictional logic but where all logical extremes are explored and ideas have their own magical power that transcends our logic but strong ideas from our world echo in tropes or slip in via dimensional rifts as ethereal influences and entities. At its best creativity is a smoothing, and cathartic process. Not unlike productive meditation that can salve a mind beset with troubles. Depending on if you bring relaxed or ambitious energy to the practice It is probably for the best if you can't relate. But if you can take care of yourself sweet dreamers.
Alternate theory: Consensus Reality. Consensus Reality is the idea that the universe functions the way it does because enough people believe that is how it is supposed to function. If you were to convince enough people to believe a certain way, you could alter how the universe functions Before the war the population would have been able to keep the laws of the universe fairly static. Afterwards, however, the vast majority of survivors would either be aware that magic exists, and thus, be better equipped to survive, or entirely unaware of the universe's laws, making Consensus Reality favor those who use magic.
I always assumed the magic mad-sadness could be a two way street. The bomb made the survivors mad and sad thus making their connection to magic greater.
Flaming Frostbite244 in the moment of the episode where Farmworld Finn is introduced, and Farmworld Marceline says the Earth was frozen for 400 'boring' years, a comet flies by the iced encased earth. It's believed the Earth being Frozen threw the comet off course...
0:12 Nah I always thought that the elementals and the lumps even jake where all corrupted monsters made by the lich but eventually evolved into what we see in adventure time now
I wonder how much the catalyst comets influenced magic in that world, it seems that magic was really strong in the past with the elementals ( or maybe it was just the magic of the elementals ) but with the passage of time they were becoming weaker and would disappear until the mushroom war “ ignited the flame back “ so to speak, it’s weird that the elementals magic themselves were disappearing because they represent the príncipes of life in that universe
The mushroom bomb destroyed the authority that existed in the before times, plunging the world into chaos. This bomb also killed many peoples' loved ones and left people in an uncomfortable and stressful post-apocalyptic scenario. The mushroom bomb infused the world with great madness and great sadness.
To add to it: Honestly I think the answer is right in Betty’s observation. Magic appears alongside Madness and Sadness. The Mushroom War caused untold devastation long after it was over. During the fear and insanity of the time many beings awakened to their Magical Potential and became wizards. Magic in the wrong hands can cause massive changes to the world and it probably did which could go long ways to explaining why the world of Adventure Time is so magical not just the existence of Magic users
Cmon it’s literally called the catalyst comet. Less energy needed fir the reaction to occur. Like the power of magic is a constant but when the comet rolls around it requirs less energy fir people to use the power of magic. Explaing the boom of magic when the comet does show up... i think
My theory on magic: Magic has always existed in the multiverse, but come and goes on Earth, and the mushroom bomb was made of the green catalyst comet, and that is what caused the earth to change, as those comets change the world whenever they hit.
Magic, madness, sadness Magic can cause madness, and madness can cause sadness, and in reverse, sadness creates madness, and madness creates magic, so they're on a continuum, or a path. Magic users can sometimes be happy, but from what I've seen, they achieve at best a Bodhaic happiness, or their happiness is something like being tickled by the magic flowing through them. I think this might be the system. Not 100% on how the catalyst comet fits in but from the way it seems to be regarded with fear, it might just as well be an Apocalypse Asteroid, so maybe catalyzing large change creates sadness for a lot of people.
In the Farmworld dimension, the comet never hit. The show literally shows the audience that through the short scene that you used a picture of! You can see the comet coming close, but missing Earth.
![[2000] Encuestas sobre Labastida en Xochimilco](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/M_xkkxHzkPE/mqdefault.jpg)
Did you ever notice how the ice elemental were always crazy about preserving themself and did not care that the element would continue on
No Channel das cold
And fire always says at least our elements will survive
Ice presserve things, so it have sense :v7
Time is the fire in which we all burn.
Ironically enough in the alternate universe in the Adventure Time comics, the elementals were cosmic beings that seeked to destroy Ooo except for the ice elemental which ultimately sacrificed themselves for the salvation of Ooo and the erasure of their fellow elementals. The ice elementals or at least the ones we know of, all have a running gig where they think differently from the other elementals and I like how in the comic, the ice elemental was selfless unlike Patience and Evergreen.
"Before the series end,"
That was harsh to hear, I already miss it
**CRYING**
@@14thbattlegroupcommander maybe by next summer....
😂 LOL
Ruby Rembiszewski *coughs that there’s only bmo*
@@akrlglg coughs more episodes are coming out soon!
Well if magic is born/fueled by madness and sadness, then perhaps a great cataclysm like the mushroom war simply caused a lot of madness and sadness... (As any post apocalyptic anything tends to imply, desperation breads madness, and loss is a known cause of sadness.)
Minnion you've got a valid point
Did you say loss?
| | |
| | | _
I think it's waay more likely that magic affects the mind of the user consuming them in madness and the depression of the over-knowledge of their existence.
Minnion 269th like!
Logic dictates that the extreme levels of rational thought in killing and horrors of the fly during WW1 is what killed all they mythological beings and why we cannot prove any of them to exist.
Dark theory : There is only so much magic, and everyone gets a tiny bit. When the bomb wiped out so many, there was plenty of magic for the remaining peoples.
That would probably explain why in farmworld theres very little magic since the logically thinking human population would be in the millions.
Good idea
Time to bomb Russia so I can make sandwiches using my mind
Well kind of, I suggest you read the at chronology by JAGM
and to think this is a cartoon for kids. frickin love it
I like to think that it's because the bomb caused so much sadness and madness, and that sadness and madness made magic stronger.
Best theory I've heard
That would make sense, especially considering how strong Betty was when she became magical, same with Magic man.
And in the farmworld timeline, I K froze the world. That might have made the few survivors pretty sad and despondent, but there's not Lovecraftian horror and loss of sanity. Creating magic requires people have both, and you need to have both to wield it.
"He turned all the water into hair, and we were so thirsty we drink it, then we all went bald."
*Scribbles a picture of what Glob said*
That concept is one of the grossest things I've ever pictured (I have a thing about hair, okay?) yet it's still one of the funniest jokes in the series to me. Go figure.
Remember when golb had hair? Yup. He went bald because of it lol
Reminds me of a different episode. The girl eating her own hair infinite. Was that the virus episode?
I read it while hearing it
@@Wawagirl17 Can't beat the time he threw the martians under the bus.
Maybe the reason Finn and Jake can't use the magic they learned is because they don't have enough sadness/madness.
Person302
It's because the robes were the catalysts for their magic.
It’s because they were just supposed to be jokes for the episode and not a long term plot point
This can’t be the case. Finn alone would easily have enough sadness due to his absent/awful father figure to at least retain basic magic.
LiterallyTheLamest but he isnt crazy he lacks madness
LiterallyTheLamest and yeah, as his story progresses he does go through a lot of suffering
No only did Patience freeze herself, she made ice sink.
And it was hollow
i guess if it's like salty and briney enough it could? still full of air though yeah
Well objects of higher mass and lower volume will have a higher density water has a mass of 1g/cm(cubed) while ice has a density of 0.93 g/cm(cubed) ,however for Patience to freeze herself the ice egg can not have been majorly hollow requiring her to leave the minimal space to be preserved not to mention the added mass of the boat which slightly raises the volume makes it slightly more believable,perhaps she just changed the density of the uce
Could’ve been thick ice
didn't aang do that as well
"Hopefully we'll find out before the series ends"
guess we'll never know
Lol I was thinking that aswell
That's part of the mistery of the series.
You know lore lore lore but never entirely explained. It has always been like this
Well you know theres more on HBO now or whatever
@@tangerinetech5300 this was posted a year ago bro
@@brandonisthetrivium1 yes I'm aware. I didn't know I wasn't aloud to share that there's new adventure time because of that.
I like how PB literally sponsors a wizard battle royale, and then in a later season doesn't believe magic is real an actively tries to disprove it.
Better yet, she is by definition magical, she shoots fucking jelly beans from her hands there no fucking science that lets you do that. She dated a fucking vampire a magical creature, who’s dad was a primeval super monster from before time began, and later try’s to fight a literal god of chaos, who’s disciple she previously fought with the power of friendship, PB magic is definitely not science, where the hell have you been?
@@Lh0000 the jelly bean shooting is the most useless thing ever
@@Lh0000 marceline could be explained cause she is another race, if today there was a bat with human features we wouldn't call him magic. The Jelly beans can also be explained because its one of the 4 elements, its basically fire/water/air/earth in their universe, we could call her candy bender. The literal god of chaos, yeah about that idk, I guess he is a god so it kinda makes sense for him to have some level of omnipotency.
Only thegGood neighbor policy and diplomacy with a fellow kingdom.
@@Vi3Voide I highly disagree
I always thought it was implied the Mushroom Bomb of Adventure Time was made from the catalyst comet which contained the lich. So not only did it go full nuclear but it also spread mutagenic magical energy.
Kinda showing what PB says that magic and advanced technology are the same. Nuclear bomb material, magical comet containing death incarnate.
... What if heavy elements were the remains of the last comet.
True.
Pendleton Ward was actually asked about Finn and Jake's magic from when they were training under that frog wizard and he said their powers were all contained in the training robes, and the robes were destroyed. So that's at least why they don't have that magic anymore.
Yet in a later episode Finn started a fire by rubbing his hands together and acted like it was normal
SselluosS of the TaroT not lazy but more like ignorance that they'd think we'd forget
@FMJackal If I'm not mistaken, it was only much later in the series that Fin could do some minor magic. The fact that Finn learned some magic was because he's older and experienced sadness.
TaroT the Terrible its not lazy they just wanted a fun magic one off and continuity wasn’t even a thing in the show yet
@@noxure What episode did Finn do that?
Theory: all magic is derived from golb which is why it drives everyone who uses it insane to some degree. Magic is channeled through some medium to give it some degree of separation from golb and make it safer to use, which is why all wizards are themed around some element or idea except for magic man who wielded the closest thing to pure magic and thus was exceptionally crazy. The crown should also wield pure magic which is why it also makes people extra crazy but it was corrupted by its first wish to make whoever uses it into a copy of the original ice elemental.
After the mushroom war the litch who was a scholar of golb was released into the world which might have increased people's access to magic.
Finn and Jake lost their magic powers because they had both been given their powers from outside sources, in season one that power came from the school they joined so they lost their power when they quit in season two their powers might have been stolen from the ice king who in his desire to make ice ninja into a thing had created a way for others to copy his power for a time. Then they would've lost their powers when the ice king got bord with the idea.
This is also makes sense when you consider that the Lich calls himself “The Last Scholar of Golb”. This could be interpreted as since he wants to destroy all life, he will be the last person alive to ever use magic.
I do like this although I’m not entirely sure how it translates to entities less bound to the universe like Prismo or the Cosmic Owl. One could maybe argue the owl isn’t magical but I really doubt prismo has any direct connection to Golb
@@frimi8593one answer could be that since killing a wish master is a cosmic crime prismo's existence seems built into the nature of the multiverse itself so perhaps he draws from a separate power source. In evidence of this consider that Prismo's wish powers could not retrieve Betty from Golb but the ice crown's wish magic could fuse Betty with Golb, suggesting that prismo's wishes are not derived from wish magic. Perhaps even Prismo isn't magical at all but instead in some way controls and influences causality and time from his position outside the reach of all time, save that time relevant to his own perception.
It is also possible that since Prismo is the dream of a host, it is the host that actually practices and uses all the magic needed to grant wishes and therefore suffers the consequences of using such magic. While prismo himself remains the same since he is merely commanding another to actually grant the wishes. Consider how old man prismo sleeps in a relm of darkness and monsters, perhaps such shadows were not placed there to protect the old man but instead are the result of magic warping the area around him as he practices it in his dream. Consider also how old man prismo wasn't at all freaked out by the presence of the Litch before it killed him, even going so far as to wonder if the Litch was his son, suggesting that perhaps he felt some kinship with the scholar of Golb, perhaps as a result of having been immersed in Golb's power for so many thousands of years as he practiced his wish magic.
@@emptank that is a good answer. I think that could work. Although I will it also makes sense that prismo can’t retrieve margles in the case that he is using magic derived from golb
What about coconteppi
So what I’m hearing is that in the show’s canon, Magic is a scientific concept that was harshly stigmatized because dabbling in it often lead to cognitive decline. Then, a sequence of events called the mushroom wars, lead to the wide spread normalization of magic use. I’m coming to some conclusions here. Something to do with magic and mushrooms 🤔
I love this concept
So you haven't watched the show?
WoAh HoW hIgH wErE tHe WrItErS wHeN tHeY mAdE tHiS?
The whole series really is like a trip lmao
Well, tbh many still relate mushrooms to magic in a modern world. If you know what I mean 😂
"Magic is just science I haven't figured out yet" - Tony Stark
Isn't that common sence?
That's actually a rip Arthur C Clarkes infamous quote "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
That's just in Marvel. Not every universe follows the same rules
@@zenzonerzz4789 no, it's not really. Science can't explain many unexplainable things and most likely won't. There are more to it, maybe not necessarily "magic" so to say but not really science either. I guess it's subjective
@@killakil7644 you know there once was a time where lighting was unexplainable. We figured it out though, same with Black Holes, among other things. People used to think lighting was caused by magic gods, but science figured it out
the magic is actually quite consistent, in the the two cases you mentioned Finn and Jake just simply borrowed magic from Bufo and Ice King respectively, and to me its workings are quite simple, magic in AT is inherently linked to defiance of reality (most commonly found in madness), thus a time in which the majority of sapient beings are logic-driven diminishes its power, my guess is that the reason why the crown is still extremely powerful regardless its because its wish magic which the elementals stressed it so powerful it can threaten reality itself
also I think your theory about the bomb that spawned the Lich having portions of a catalyst comet is semi-confirmed, remember the comet that killed the dinosaurs was green and had horn-shaped flames, it heavily implies this is how the Lich originally arrived Earth
I thought the Lich arrived via the mushroom bomb.
the lich is a re-incarnation of the green comet, like finn being the re-incarnation of the blue comet
Tonatiub that's a great point!
I find it interesting that the "mushroom bomb" is never specified as nuclear, which might suggest that the bomb itself was a utilisation of magic power in a non-magic world.
Mushroom referring to a mushroom cloud, so nuclear or similar is implied.
Yeah it could be nuclear but let’s be honest here, we know full well that this is a cartoon, so the idea of some large force (a government, some evil genius with great magic powers, one of the main characters at a different point in the timeline, etc...) creating a bomb that explodes with radiating destruction magic, is not implausible. Adventure time is a preposterous show with magical and ridiculous things everywhere, we don’t know how far magic can go in the land of Ooo. We don’t even know what the fundamental laws of magic in that world are, but it’s entirely possible that a release of magic, of that magnitude, could have imbued magic into the world when combined with the catalyst comet or perhaps by itself. This show left more questions unanswered than answered by the end.
There probably needed to be some involved in order to cause the extent of destruction that it did
You mean a evil nuclear magic.
It's described at one point by Prismo as "The Mutagenic Bomb" so maybe not nuclear but a magic based bioweapon or something?
From what I understand the mushroom war is that time's version of the catalyst comet. The same way Finn used to be a butterfly, the comet was a nuke bomb once.
bluePachyderm Why would the comet be different?
The only difference between both worlds is that one got frozen the other one did not.
@@Chronically_ChiII what a small difference...
Ever heard about the butterfly effect?
I think the the ice was a metaphor for that world being a colder or harsher place and the nuke bomb was the alternative to the comet because its a more realistic possibility in peoples minds
Mind blown
Seeing alot of these theories and alot of the re visited locations and how dark the series can get it really makes me want a elder scrolls/fallout like rpg in the adventure time universe
yeh
I loved how he used the song "Sis Puella Magica" to talk about magic, and it works because in adventure, the same as in Puella Magi, the magic is also tragic.
There was a role playing game in the 90's called Rifts that had a similar situation. A nuclear war killed off most of the population, and magic had returned. IIRC the life energy from all those people dying energized dormant ley lines, opening up inter-dimensional rifts and bringing in strange creatures and technologies.
Brastius reminds me of the Shannara series
What an interesting game. I must bring it back to life
Damn, that sounds like an interesting concept. Hopefully a similar game with a similar concept will be made sometime in the near future.
Isn't that how Fullmetal Alchemist's 2003 series worked? The atom bomb allowed the use of alchemy
@@elijahfyffe5176 Haha, no, it's way more convoluted than that. In FMA 2003, the souls of those that died in our world powered alchemy in the Elric brother's world. Honestly, it was a pretty cool twist, though, in a vacuum, it sounds kind of dumb.
The catalyst comet could be a, cleansing agent, like the reapers in mass effect, killing off life every 1000 years and allowing new life to form, how it forms is a mystery as it could be the entity inside using its own abilities to create life, or even natural ways
The problem is that the comets create important beings, like Finn being a reincarnation of the blue comet, the lich was the green comet, Jake was (maybe?) The yellow comet. So it can't be a cleanse
New theory after Fionna and Cake: Betty (now as Golb, a being outside of time itself) is the one who created the catalyst comets, or at least the blue comet that eventually became Finn. This explains why the comets only target Earth and could be her way to make sure Simon stays safe and the events that lead up to this remain the way they are.
"The very structure of realities are held by the perception of it's inhabitants"
Where does this come from?
Well if that were true wouldent crazy people be a threat to our reality hmmm. KILL THE MANIACS
@@jasdanvm3845 I don't know if it's an exact quote, but "Marcy's Super Secret Scrapbook" explores that concept and explains magic. The universe of AT is emergent from collective consciousness, (it was created when the infinite primordial monsters that preceded existence, by pure chance, agreed upon the nature of reality) meaning your perception of the world and yourself is what defines the world and yourself. You paradoxically maintain your existence via experiencing it. Therefore, because the universe and all physical laws emerge from the mind, magic is the ability to influence reality by changing your perception of reality: i.e. imagination. This actually fits in quite nicely with Betty's MMS theory, as sanity would probably get in the way of perceiving reality so incorrectly that it literally changes to match your belief.
The book also explains that magic became stronger after the Mushroom War because our dimension's "elasticity" increased, a concept also briefly explained. I don't think it's clarified if the bomb caused the magic to return or if the blue comet did.
@@michaelhenry3234 kinda reminds me of how in the elder scrolls games there is a concept called amaranth. To cut it short it means that the entire universe of the games is just a dream of one entity. The godhead. If you realise that you are basicly not real yet persist on your own identity you achieve amaranth making you a god.
@@michaelhenry3234 | At first I thought that idea was dumb when I read the quote, but wow the way you explained that was so good it just makes sense for magic as a concept, and even as a possibility for Adventure Time.
I know this is head canon, but I always took the Lich's catalyst comet as being part of the mushroom bomb. Like researchers found the impact crater, dug it up, turned it into a bomb, and that's what gave the Lich his true form.
I just realized the hungry looking rainbow are rainicorns
And the favourite food of Rainicorns is human flesh.
@@wendycarter7506 0_0 really?!
@@LuneKidYT
Yes, you find that out when they meet Lady Rainicorn's parents
oh wow...
.....rewatching adventure time and your comment made me realize that he was talking about ranicorns.
Well it was stated that Finn and Jake lost their magic powers because their robes were destroyed and they forgot the ice spells because they didn't have enough tine to remember them.
RetroMonkeySage 😆
p
So in other words just a forced plot decision cause they didnt actually want finn and jake to have all those powers
@@BraveCat9927 exactly!
And that's why it's called...
adventure time! ~~~
I personally like to think that the reason the mushroom bomb "brought" magic into the world was because Magic was always an inherent force in the world, but that it's also a finite resource. The Earth became non-magical because there were simply too many living beings around trying to use it, so nobody could really have it.
When the Mushroom Bomb went off, it wiped out a vast portion of all the living things on the planet, freeing up tons of Magic for people to use again.
Off topic, but the madoka magica music fits so well in the video my god
The magic in this is takes deep roots in D&D. A lot of this series pays homage to it actually.
Oh look a gold piece
I remember when flame King broke the fourth wall by saying that the flame princess could become good, but she would have a penalty to experience points for acting out of alignment
@@zstrebler1234 that's not breaking the fourth wall, that's just a joke
I really like that joke
Not to mention a *wild* amount of Homestuck references...
If magic is madness and sadness then why aren’t I the most powerful magic user ever hmmm
Star vs the forces of evil much?
Your not nearly as sad or mad as your like to be
Or maybe you are so sad and mad you killed your own magic...
You're not on ooo
Your car is still alive
I have a theory about the cause of magic in Ooo, We saw that the elementals didnt have strong power during the civilization times hinting that there is not enough chaos, sadness, madness. But when the nuclear bomb happened chaos, sadness and madness happened and magic started to exponentially grow again
Honestly I think the answer is right in Betty’s observation. Magic appears alongside Madness and Sadness. The Mushroom War caused untold devastation long after it was over. During the fear and insanity of the time many beings awakened to their Magical Potential and became wizards. Magic in the wrong hands can cause massive changes to the world and it probably did which could go long ways to explaining why the world of Adventure Time is so magical.
The thing that gave jake his powers and the thing that came out of the comet do look somewhat simular
Mustachioed Bear what episode is that what season as well?
I was thinking the same thing
Coral Blue Number 5 Semi Gloss Lipstick yeah if it's a new episode I wanna watch it
Paul Jason Grajo season 6 episodes 16 and 43
Mustachioed Bear yes, they have some ressemblance... but I got the feeling that the creature was from other dimension... (and the series probably will still talk more about other dimensions, after that lichjake hand went to the multiverse... i also think that beladona, the creature that dampened all magic on one episose, is from other dimension)
"he turned all the water into hair
and we all got so thirsty we drank it
and when we drank it we went bald"
comedy fucking gold right there
Since things in AT tend to be metaphorical I always assumed that the bomb itself was the catalyst comet, the "agent of change" that time around.
Kaliyuga
Maybe there were less magic users in modern times, and medieval times and such, and they were seen as evil and persecuted (like "witches" in medieval times), so now that basically everyone except magic people had died on earth and history kind of restarted, without the past assumptions about how those who used magic were evil, the magic users could finally use their powers as they wished.
I was thinking the same thing. Witchcraft seems to have been a taboo and it would make sense that any who openly use magic were killed
@@ColeTanaka Belief in witches and witchcraft was seen as silly and ignorant for most of the middle ages and ironically began to grow mainstream during the Renaissance
@@ColeTanaka
You are more likey to get in trouble for believing in witches than being an accused as a witch yourself
You know since no greater power than God
I know this might be a bit of a tangent but I think "them hungry looking rainbows" is a reference to Rainicorns as we know they have a taste for humans. So does this mean Rainicorns aren't native to the crystal dimension and are in fact mutations or simply that they regularly left it to hunt humans? Regardless of the answer I think this means they probably had a part in the extinction of humans (not counting the islanders)
I just thought this could be a bit interesting as I haven't seen anyone else bring this up
"If one is not careful, they can drown in the deep."
Me: "Don't worry, Lumpy is on life guard duty."
Remember when magic in AT was a norm and magecraft was just an episode where Fin & Jake became top class wizards in a singel day?
Yes...?
The episode with the robes weren’t them learning magic. It was told at the end they weren’t doing any magic, the robes were channeling magic from the frog wizard.
They weren’t Wizards, they were Warlocks.
“Hopefully we’ll find out before the series ends”
😩 The best shows are the ones that end while they are good.
Everybody has already said this but the Finn comet missed Earth in the Farmworld universe due to the world being frozen over after Simon's death. That's why there's no crater that we know of.
But wait... why is Finn still existing in farm world, Finn never hit the Earth???
Finn wasn't literally the comet, and he didn't come from it, he was that comet in a past life. As long as the comet still existed, Finn will still exist, regardless of whether the comet hit Earth or not
+Tia Blue what if farm world is Steven universe, that would mean Finn created Steven Universe, that would be a Crazy Theory 😱
ty for this comments shitty answer i couldnt find something like this.
@@JoseGonzalez-tz8df i fucking hate 9 year olds like you
I love this video and also that you used Madoka music in your video about magic. Amazing.
Was just coming down into the comments when I noticed it.
Does the creator of this vid like madoka magica? Cause its honestly my favorite series
i just thought of where have i heard this music before!
I started to cry when I heard it XD
What's more magical than your own *SOUL?*
This show is deep. I remember when episodes were just funny and weird
MandoPrime1138 I remember when cartoons were shallow but INCREDIBLE and a little dirty🖤 I grew up on Ren and Stimpy, Doug and Rocko’s Modern Life.
@@seitanicmechaincmama8948 Ren and stimpy was a let down when I found out the artist is a cho mo
All of the episodes, for the most part, contained a lot of deep thought and introspections into themselves though. It was later in the series that they started throwing it in one's face.
“To be adept in magic you must show signs of sadness and madness”
Maybe I am wizard
Yeah maybe if opened a book and studied ? I,m just kidding seek not the heart of darkness
All wizards are mad/sad
But
Not all mad/sad people are wizards
Teenagers be like
Welll… you need to have your breaking point nearby and you have to figure out how you’re gonna connect to a source of magic, as of you connected to the direct source of magic you’d go crazy beyond help
I believe something about The Lich is inherently magic, as he said he's the Last Scholar of Golb, meaning he's likely one of the Monsters that existed LONG before everything ever existed, so I believe he somehow created the Mushroom Bomb, or perhaps influenced it, so it would cause him to start existing within Ooo's world
I like to combine the ideas from D&D and GURPS when thinking about Adventure Times magic. More than one system or source of magic can co-exist. And the reason the pre-mushroom war world was a a low-magic world is too un-explained for me to hold an opinion on.
Could the comet hit the bomb, causing a double event?
That would've been crazy!
+Jarro Blade
The last two catalyst comets where stopped by Orgalorg, preventing the double event.
Henry Baehr like the bomb being the comet but in a different form, like how Fin is?
holy schmop good idea, maybe thats how the next era began
actually orgalorg became Gunter waaay before any war happened.
I think that the lore doesn't have to be messed up by Finn and Jake's use of magic the first and second season because in both episodes they wear things that aren't part of their typical attire: the robes and the ninja headbands. Maybe these items could grant the person who wears them limited magical ability and, with instruction (whether from a teacher or a book), non magical beings can learn to unlock the magic in those special items. Obviously it isn't as potent as like the ice crown, but I think the theory can still hold..
Lauren Bennett
I think it was established in an interview somewhere (I haven't got the source) that confirms half of your suspicions. It was explained that the robes themselves held the magic abilities, so once they were removed, the magic went with the robe. As for the ice ninja jazz, Finn and Jake lost those abilities simply because they stopped practicing.
Corey Auringer So they addressed both instances in the interview and provided those separate explanations for the magic use?
I still like my theory because it seems more unified to me :P .. but if the creators provided a different answer than of course they're right 👌🏼
+Corey Auringer I thought they said it was because they don't remember the words for the techniques
Lauren Bennett i also doubt Finn and Jake would like to use ice magic after knowing what happened to Ice King
Love the use of the song: “Sis Puella Magica (Kyubey’s theme version)” one of my favorite songs fr fr :D
Fallout: Elder Scrolls Edition
LOLOL facts
HAAHAHHA
I wonder if the show will end with Jake becoming another cosmic entity and leaves into space to bring change to the next planet.
The creature that bit Joshua looks like it's from the same species as the comet creature Finn talked to in space. This could be how cosmic beings are born.
In son of mars when Lincoln tells Jake he'll be ejected out into space as cosmic dust Jake says he's "way into that stuff"
Jakes croak dream in space could be representative of Jake shedding his dog form.
This would explain why Lich/Jake develops powers so quickly in Farmworld.
It would bring the story full circle as Finn was a comet in a past life.
Maybe I'm over analyzing it, great vid bro, really thought provoking.
+
That actually sounds plausible. Maybe that'll be in the movie Ward is working on.
It already ended I mean finn storyline like him and jake searching for answers is done they will give only randomness until it ends in season nine :(
You're right. if you guys watched the elements mini series jake is not a dog anymore he is the creature that bit joshua ;-; (Spoilers sorry :p)
of course, what pb says about magic isn't necessarily true in oo just because she says it. i know she usually know what's up because of her smarts and covert information network, but in this case, as a person with a scientific world view, she is biased, apt to dismiss magic or frame it scientifically. though i will admit hers is a fair criticism
luciferangelica I feel like she probably didn’t hold that view by the end either, after she discovered her elemental candy powers. I could be wrong though
i miss Magicman.
I'm not coming back...
*EAT IT!*
With Jessie Moynahan leaving AT, I guess MM's story is fairly wrapped up.
I'm sure he'll have his own ep soon though. Wanna know how he works his way up to being King of Mars.
BOSS
I was quoting Magic Man, of course I'm coming back
Animation Contemplation
But i miss crazy ol Magic man. I don't care much about Normal man
Revujo Yeah, I'm not much of a fan of normal man either. Still it'd be interesting to see him take control of Mars.
Magicman is my favorite, and I love the turning water into hair part.
I like princess bubblegum's explanation period it's like how in full metal alchemist alchemy isn't Magic but science period performed by those who understand the elemental and chemical make up of the things they're interacting with
In many asian lores there is a finite amount of cycling power throughout the world and more people pulling from the mana pool means less people can use mana effectively
When everyone else is theorizing and your just happy about The madoka magica music
Fin and Jake CAN use magic, but they don't WANT to and that's just the funniest thing
Yeah, I'll always find it funny how in a book it says Finn can summon fire but in the show he only ever uses it once in the episode with weird al
They aren't depressed so they don't have access to it.
Dose anyone remember when Finn was trying to kill Banana Man when he put some leafs on the head of an arrow and set it on fire by putting his hands near it? While listing off facts about Finn The Adventure time Encyclopedia which is from the prospective of Hunson Abadeer states "unlike other humans, Finn has the uncanny ability to make fire with his bare hands" maybe Finn can proform at least low level magic but just barely ever dose. As someone who's role model is Billy and has the example of the Enchiridion it would make sense that he never used magic. The Enchiridion was also made into a real book and it makes sure to differentiate wizard and heros as very different things. Finns path is the hero, not the Wizard so he takes the advice from the book that have to do with being a hero. The Enchiridion also emphasize swordplay as if it is the heros destined weapon, even going as far to say that swords "embody all the things that a righteous hero must bee" so maybe those are some reasons that Finn could probably use magic but chooses not too.
My question is why the Lich’s catalyst comet caused an extinction level event on the earth, whereas Finn’s catalyst comet disappeared 1/16 or so of the planet’s mass, and also does not appear to have severly damaged the rest of the planet’s surface?
If anyone’s willing to shoot some theory out about this I’d appreciate it!
Maybe it has something to do with Finns helpful and heroic nature that made his comet not destroy too much of the world but still make a significant impact, and since the Lich is pure evil and wants to end life maybe his comet did essentially exactly what the lich wanted to do before he was reborn as the lich.
I'm impressed with how much lore this guy conjured up about this show, I've been watching this show for years and never even thought about this kinda stuff
Excellent use of the Madoka Magica themes!
In the alternate universe, whenever the world freezes over, Marceline mentions how it shifted the Earth out of place (Or something along those lines) and then it shows a comet flying past and narrowly missing the Earth. I feel this was most likely the catalyst comet and it never impacted with the Earth in the alternate universe cause it missed.
I just thought - if Jake turned into the Lich in the Farmworld Timeline, that means somebody needs to be behind the real Lich too. You think we'll ever get to explore that persons background? I mean, Sweet Pie seems to know a lot of stuff subconsciously.
The more Mad/Sad the world gets the more magical it becomes. The same as the wizards. The more ordered the world becomes and as it also heals/forgets the wounds of the past, the mushroom war, it slowly becomes less magical. Late but here for a great show like adventure time.
there's a really neat theory that says jake is the over-god of the multiverse. like, prismo's job is to keep the multiverse from donking itself up with all the magic and wishes going around the place. prismo also said his powers were being weakened by the wish-world where jake gets lichified. we even know that jake manifests prismo through a dream. and considering how many times he's created time loops for the sake of creating something, it can be easily assumed jake/prismo did the same thing for themselves. and with that assumption made, we can then assume that magic has always existed in the adventure time universe, but was fully activated when the war happened
3:36 I agree
Because a long time ago, there were tons of magic users. Then it was the 4 people and they seemed like they weren’t too powerful.
Cool! Have you thought about the possibility of Magic being Programming? like, writing code? both have been heavily implied to be connected by the appearance of magic artifacts (specially the crown with all its circuitry) and the entire episode of A Glitch is a Glitch is an allusion to this. Magic could be the ability to play with the code of reality itself, to alter the physical forms and properties of things and creatures through reprogramming, by editing the information that dictates how they look like and what they're capable of.
AphidKirby reprogramming and Glitching reality as well
Perhaps adept magic users opted to streamline the creation of spells and magical artifacts by applying their magic in a similar manner to computer programming.
So my thoughts are that the comet has most impact based on the implication that the lich was a catalyst comet (there was a comet with the single horn that the lich is known for) at the same time I don't think the lich was born from the mushroom war based on sweet peas "before there was everything there was nothing, and before that there were monsters" bit. My theory is that the lich and magic are in a weird way one and the same which is why farm world finns world 'where the lich never existed' is a world without magic. But it'd explain why the lichs 'birth' and the birth of a magic world would synch up with the mushroom war and the catalyst comet, if we assume that the two happened at fairly consistent times
the Catalyst comet that hit Ooo shortly after the Mushroom Bomb, was the one which contained Finn's essence.
@5:10 The way I understand it, the Lich's soul was somehow INSIDE the original mushroom bomb, maybe similar to how Finn's soul was inside the comet once before he became a butterfly.
This gives me the idea that maybe the people who created the bomb knew that, despite the world being "non magic" there were elements of magic that they could harness as a weapon through their technology, and somehow put the Lich's soul into their bomb (which he probably wanted anyway). I'm assuming this because when Finn wishes "I wish the Lich never even ever existed" in Prismo's wish room, it alters time simply by freezing the bomb over and not allowing it to explode.
6:45 just realized this was from 6 years ago 😢
i still think that the lich is the creature from the green comet that was used for making the bomb for a war like a super weapon or something. like the catalist comet it was meant to bring a change to the planet, but a destructive one.
I think Magic in AT is a metafor to ART and The relationship artists have to it.
The madness and melancholy elements are both known elements to The life of Painters such as Van Gogh and Goya, and to acting methods such as The Stanislavski who bring real emotional baggage to roles.
Marina Abramovich also Said that ART is The right place to broken people as It is presented in The show.
My biggest theory is the Mushroom Bomb IS the Catalyst comet that becomes The Lich, maybe modern humans found it, frozen by the ice crown and utilized its destructive power as a nuke, so in Farmworld it got frozen for a second time
Catalyst, in chemistry, any substance that increases the rate of a reaction without itself being consumed.
Adventure Time took a deep lore dive since i stopped watching apparently. I love that show so much; it inspired my art and the things i create on a daily basis. Thank you for giving me an excuse to go back and learn about the show i used to love
Elk! You missed two big things! 1st is Beladona (if I recall the namd correctly), the monster that when released caused all Magic to be suppressed (its when ice king gets his old self back, and brings betty from the past). this monster might appear again? maybe he was responsible for the low magic eras. 2nd: the martians (lincoln or grob, I cant recall completelly) said something, at some episode, that the comet missed one visit (and was late for the more recent one)... so I think he didn't came at all in the period of the mushroom war.
I was thinking the same thing. Bela Noche is a being of pure anti magic so it would make sense that there would be fluctuations in magical power throughout the ages corresponding to Bela Noches strength.
*Sees the video is only 10 minutes.*
There's never enough time to explain madness I guess...
Enough time for add revenue tho
The lore and backstory of this show fascinates me so much, it's crazy.
I want an almanac of every lore and story tidbit of this show.
3:52 One of my favorite funniest jokes on Adventure Time 😂😂
I'd lean more towards the idea of the bonb is made from the comet from the past and the new one helped spring magic into action. We know there were people looking into ancient artifacts (Like Simon). The comet might have been discovered. If someone found the ice crown, then it's likely someone found the comet. Also, Farm World might have had magic already, but shunned for some reason.
"this means those with tragic pasts are more likely to be drawn to magic, and those who chase after it while content may have their lives spiral out of control."
This might sound kinda crazy or awesome depending on what type of person you are.
But As a life long creative and weirdo. I see this MnS magic theory as basically a metaphor for creativity, which operates via very similar madness/sadness rules they laid out.
Creativity is often an outlet for people with troubles that prefer introverted escapism to "projecting" their problems onto others.
Having also observed hundreds of creatives, of different disciplines, in my days as an average young book artist, bad animator, toy graffiti writer and Journeyman street artist and established studio artist, during the past 15 years it rings true to my experiences and interactions.
I don't think Magic being a loose metaphor for creativity is that weird considering the shows creators are all extremely creative people who all will have tackled with the unique snares of the power of creating. And likely most of there friends are also creatives and strange folk. And it would but that uncommon running into people who fall into the "darkside" of creativity dancing with the madness.
It is easy to become seduced by inspiration when exploring ideas, characters and world building.
The more disconnected from your body and journey into your mind can easily provide more original and inspiring ideas/magic. But is fickled and difficult beast to tangle with.
But the more you are prone the emotional and physical instability. But the harder the reality come down is.
They are extreme nature highs and lows.
Some get there via drugs, coffee, mental exhaustion or emotional trauma. But i tend to get there via focusing more on my ideas and projects than my physical needs. There is an easy creative state know as the "the flow" and trying to hold onto this state too longer or at the wrong time can access the wild uncontrollable creative magic that can destroy its welder. The effects on the user mood can change their perception of their subjective reality threaten your world via straining perceived Objective reality you share with others close to you.
I think of it a lot like using Kaio Ken or Sasukes curse seal; A powerful tool of burning tomorrows energy to crush todays task with x4 productivity, but at a harsh cost to your well being.
The side effects are often not worth it though. Limitations of having a body. lol.
Through discipline and training you can learn to access a lot of the originality and creativity without going deep in the madness trap and rather just briefy dance with it and leave to with what you need while staying healthy.
If you don't take care of yourself via eating regularly/well, exercising/going outside and by socialising in a relaxed way with RL friends your magic/creativity can turn dark.
I wouldnt be surprised if the Ice King was informed by Pendleton Wards anxiety and distorted self image after going too deep into a creative introvert zone. It can be hard to explain to normies what you are going through in these times since there many common experiences to reference.
Artists are the ones who can visit the madness, find some magic and bring it back for the rest of us Half blood and muggles to enjoy. It is probably the weirdest skill there is. Imagination.
This may sound like i am projecting a lot of my own perception onto this and maybe/probably I am.
But if you have read much Discworld, which is probably one of the purest more expansive expressions of creativity, you may be familiar with the themes explored by characters existing in a fictional world that works via fictional logic but where all logical extremes are explored and ideas have their own magical power that transcends our logic but strong ideas from our world echo in tropes or slip in via dimensional rifts as ethereal influences and entities.
At its best creativity is a smoothing, and cathartic process. Not unlike productive meditation that can salve a mind beset with troubles. Depending on if you bring relaxed or ambitious energy to the practice
It is probably for the best if you can't relate.
But if you can take care of yourself sweet dreamers.
Noice
I wish you had spaced out your paragraphs more generously.
Adventure Time kinda has Shadowrun magic rules if you ask me
It's a mysterious force which power varies in cycles.
Alternate theory: Consensus Reality.
Consensus Reality is the idea that the universe functions the way it does because enough people believe that is how it is supposed to function. If you were to convince enough people to believe a certain way, you could alter how the universe functions
Before the war the population would have been able to keep the laws of the universe fairly static. Afterwards, however, the vast majority of survivors would either be aware that magic exists, and thus, be better equipped to survive, or entirely unaware of the universe's laws, making Consensus Reality favor those who use magic.
I didn't look at the date until he said I hope we get a answer to this before the series ends. That's when I realized this was 6 years ago
I always assumed the magic mad-sadness could be a two way street. The bomb made the survivors mad and sad thus making their connection to magic greater.
didnt the finn/catalyst commit miss farmworld in the alternative timeline. i could be wrong though
Flaming Frostbite244 in the moment of the episode where Farmworld Finn is introduced, and Farmworld Marceline says the Earth was frozen for 400 'boring' years, a comet flies by the iced encased earth. It's believed the Earth being Frozen threw the comet off course...
0:12 Nah I always thought that the elementals and the lumps even jake where all corrupted monsters made by the lich but eventually evolved into what we see in adventure time now
I wonder how much the catalyst comets influenced magic in that world, it seems that magic was really strong in the past with the elementals ( or maybe it was just the magic of the elementals ) but with the passage of time they were becoming weaker and would disappear until the mushroom war “ ignited the flame back “ so to speak, it’s weird that the elementals magic themselves were disappearing because they represent the príncipes of life in that universe
WHY IS THIS SO SATISFING TO WATCH???
I'm here at least once a month. Anyone else?
Feel you homie
Didn't the catalyst comet miss the earth in the farmworld?
digthehole usmn yes
The 2nd one missed.
The 1st one hit it.
The mushroom bomb destroyed the authority that existed in the before times, plunging the world into chaos. This bomb also killed many peoples' loved ones and left people in an uncomfortable and stressful post-apocalyptic scenario. The mushroom bomb infused the world with great madness and great sadness.
Magic works on sufferage, moon and gloom.
The bombs made so many suffer, that magic became viable.
To add to it: Honestly I think the answer is right in Betty’s observation. Magic appears alongside Madness and Sadness. The Mushroom War caused untold devastation long after it was over. During the fear and insanity of the time many beings awakened to their Magical Potential and became wizards. Magic in the wrong hands can cause massive changes to the world and it probably did which could go long ways to explaining why the world of Adventure Time is so magical not just the existence of Magic users
Wait what the, I heard madoka magica rebellion music in the background. Dude you're a madoka fan? Sick.
Cmon it’s literally called the catalyst comet. Less energy needed fir the reaction to occur. Like the power of magic is a constant but when the comet rolls around it requirs less energy fir people to use the power of magic. Explaing the boom of magic when the comet does show up... i think
My theory on magic: Magic has always existed in the multiverse, but come and goes on Earth, and the mushroom bomb was made of the green catalyst comet, and that is what caused the earth to change, as those comets change the world whenever they hit.
Magic, madness, sadness
Magic can cause madness, and madness can cause sadness, and in reverse, sadness creates madness, and madness creates magic, so they're on a continuum, or a path. Magic users can sometimes be happy, but from what I've seen, they achieve at best a Bodhaic happiness, or their happiness is something like being tickled by the magic flowing through them. I think this might be the system. Not 100% on how the catalyst comet fits in but from the way it seems to be regarded with fear, it might just as well be an Apocalypse Asteroid, so maybe catalyzing large change creates sadness for a lot of people.
In the Farmworld dimension, the comet never hit. The show literally shows the audience that through the short scene that you used a picture of! You can see the comet coming close, but missing Earth.
1:15 - I always thought that they lost their magic abilities because they lost their togas at the end of the episode
I literally just ended Adventure time and I'm loving your videos