Mrs Pesarini 32:08 adds that there was an "imposition of the language" So, you want to be considered italian but you don't want the italians ask you to speak italian? Tell me..what has happened to the Italians who went abroad in other countries, were they required to speak the local language or they were not? Doesn't this happen in every country? What do you pretend? Moving here and be free to speak your own language without being requested to learn our language? And maybe, after a while deciding you which language should be spoken here? One of the three ladies says that " italian is used as the weapon to question the italianess" Ok, quote one country in the world where it is not required to know the language of the place if you move there. Quote me one single guy on the entire universe who can define himself/ herself as belonging to whatsoever nationality without knowing the language. Without having the deeply emotional, psychological and also cognitive need to know the language which he/she feels to belong to. (Even Jhumpa Lahiri needed to learn the language before becoming Italian.) How many german people can define themselves german without knowing the language? How many chinese can define themselves chinese without knowing the language? How many americans can define themselves as american without knowing American-english? Can you please describe to me, what happens usually when a foreigner doesn't want to learn the language of the place he decided to move in? Do you know what usually happens to italians when their pronunciation is less than perfect? What are we talking about? Are you serious? The unmissably shrewd Mrs Gasparini goes on telling that 31:24 she knows "from other people" telling her that it was forbidden to them speaking their mother language" or that " 31:26 Some people told me there were physical punishments if you spoke your mother language". And this should be the ultimate historical criterion to validate a notion? Is this your way of studying other people's history..? Collecting hearsays? Are you kidding me? At 32:34 Mr. Tamburri suddendly wakes up and remembers that "Italians went to some horrible thing in this country" just because they were requested to learn the language, and to adopt a different life style ( even religion) but unfortunately, after a while he falls again in the same mistake when he says: 34:11 "arbitrary category about what it means to be Italians" 😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳 Very funny! Please explain to me who is entitled to tell an american who is he/she...other people? Should we ask some russian? Or maybe should we ask chinese people who could explain finally, to americans, who they "really" are? You would answer, and I'm sure about that, whatever they could say "that it is much more complicated than that." Am I wrong? Why should we italians answer in a different way? Let me please give you some little suggestions: For italians the so-called Guido-culture A) is not a "culture" B) is not italian The mob "culture" is maybe italian-american, NOT italian because we hate Mafia, we do not celebrate it. E, per carità di Patria, shall we do not add anything else, ok? Everybody who defines it a "culture" insults judges as Giovanni Falcone, Paolo Borsellino and hundreds of people among the Italian police, Carabinieri and MAGISTRATES who WERE KILLED by Mafia. And you also insulte people as judge Nicola Gratteri who still fights nowaday MAFIA IS NOT ITALIAN FOLKLORE, OK? I learned recently that in Germany in England or other places there are something called as Mafia-Musik, Mafia romance, and Mafia cooking. In Spain and Germany they even had the shameless wickedness to open some "mafia-restaurants" mixing some photos from " the Godfather" with those portraiting Giovanni Falcone and Paolo Borsellino. We Italians are absolutely HORRIFIED by all these supposedly creative "cultural" products. First of all because it insults the same idea of culture which WE invented from the old latin "cultus" past participle of colere ( meaning to "cultivate") Second of all because not knowing that the word mafia can't even stay in the same sentence with culture reveals the lowest cultural level possible of the people who says this. It is like saying that the "yakuza" phenomenon defines the japanese culture, or that Germans are ontologically nazis. Or that All americans think that injecting bleach is a scientific notion. So, considering, what do usually foreign people are able to understand about italian culture which is REALLY HUGE ( even for us Italians to discover it all) can you please explain to me, if you can, why the hell should I allow anybody in the world to tell me that Mafia "culture"is "italian culture"? Going further in this ridiculous and manipulative tale Mrs Gasperini says that usually her "students" when in they are in Florence, search for "gelato, pizza, arte Dante" ( just quoting these things as the epitome of italian culture speaks volumes about the level of cultural knowledge of this "teacher") and that they usually experience "36:42 racism homophobia sexism" or 37:57 police brutality and racial violence in Italy...( 😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳) While in other countries.......😇😇😇😇😇 ( shall we compare the statistics?) But...if all these people think this about Italy and Italians why do they send them here? Why does is she, or her collegues in any way interested in italian culture, if these are cultural habits as these three diversely smart women continuously suggest during all the talk? At 38:22 "we are different" I could not agree more.Luckily, I would add. At 37:26 "a number of shocking fascist monuments completely decontextualized". It is simply really unconceivable to think like this in Italy. Following this idea, Talebans did the right thing destroying the Buddhas of Bamiyan in Afganisthan or ISIS destroying the Palmira site and many other sites. Following this bestiality, up to the 99% of the world cultural heritage should be destroyed because it was made during undemocratic regimes. For us Italians, this is really a cultural "blasphemy". So, when 38:36 she says italian publishing is so resistant to publish this kind of book by non-white italians" this doesn't surprise me at all because nobody in Italy would want to publish such BS. Publishers would loose all their credibility. It is obvious. And it doesn't have anything to do with the obligation of following a "fascist literary canon" at all. Nor that these people are black, not at all. This is, one more time, insulting. The fact is that as "a rose is a rose is a rose" a BS is a BS. is a BS. Period. 41:05 Mrs Moise reveals at the end the real reason of this editorial movement when she says that they are "asking white italian to "leave the space" in literature, in politics and so on." To "leave the space"?....🤔🤔🤔🤔 To.....you? 😳 Why do you want your "own" cultural space and you don't say that you want to contribute to the italian culture which has grown here milliennia BEFORE you came here? Why the hell should we LEAVE you Space ? I AM my history, I AM my roots. Who are you? Mrs Camilla Hawtorne adds that they don't want " to write a nice sympathetic narrative to absolve you white italians" Well, sorry to disappont Mrs Hawtorne, but she or whoever else cannot absolve anybody. Only God can absolve. And you people are NOT God. Get over it. We italians have our own faults, as all human beings, but it is not up to you to judge and least of all to " absolve" us. ( Who would absolve UTU people...?) Considering that you people pretend to have the freedom to put whatsoever meaning you prefer in the word "italian" otherwise you would consider me as "racist", I will respond you that it is not enough drinking a " caffè" or eating a "pizza" or being able to pronounce correctly "la dolce vita" to define yourself as "italians". And from people whose brain is unable to process nothing more complex than the well known "pizza-pasta-mamma-mafia" common places, an evident bullying and stereotyping propaganda rhetoric, I'm not going to let be taught ANYTHING about my country and MY culture. PS: I have not heard one single positive thing about Italy mentioned by these self-styled "Italians" Not a single thing.
Bravissimi/e! You did an excellent job of combining the issues addressed in the Calandra event and the interviews with the authors and translator. i hope we are able to see more of this kind of work . soon.
Just my two cents worth but I think the migrant crisis (people from Africa flooding into Italy who have no right or claim to Italian heritage and many are not even escaping war therefore not refugees, as they claim, but opportunists) has complicated matters. Most arrive without papers so there's no way to know who they really are (their embassies are not particularly helpful plus migrants have been known to lie about their country of origin) or why they are really on our shores. I think if it weren't for the overwhelming flood of migrants (which has been going on since the 90s) it would be easier for those of African descent who have a legitimate claim to Italian-ness. Although they are spoken of but not represented in this video, those with no Italian blood but who have legally lived their whole life in Italy and are, therefore, culturally Italian are in a terrible situation as they find themselves in limbo and I genuinely feel for them. The unfortunate reality is that if you grant citizenship based on ius soli then it becomes a system open for abuse and Italy already has so many problems and issues so is concerned about inviting more problems (which it doesn't need: the country is already at breaking point). As far as I'm aware, outside of N&S America very few countries grant citizenship based on ius soli therefore why point fingers at Italy as particularly racist based on this point? The EU has not helped Italy much in dealing with the migrant situation and America should just shut up because it's the political instability it helped to create in these African countries in the first place that is what lies at the root of the migrant crisis (some are legitimately fleeing war/persecution and others are just hopping on the band wagon and lying about where they are from as their ticket into Europe. Unfortunately without documents it can be impossible to know who is legitimate and who is not). Also, as Americans (with vast open spaces and plenty of land) you can sit and judge but it seems you're expecting Italy, in the span of a few decades, to achieve a certain type of racial policy that you have taken centuries to develop. How about you look closer to home at how you treat Mexicans. Now what if all of a sudden thousands started crossing the border every day (smuggled in by criminal gangs) with no papers. I can see you granting them citizenship just because they think they're entitled to it. Not. It would be chaos and I seriously doubt the matter would be dealt with in half the humane manner in which Italy has handled its migrant crisis. How does this relate to black Italians (who are both genetically and culturally Italian)? Unfortunately they are innocent casualties caught up in a much wider chaotic context. In this video we hear different individuals each with a unique background who have had to battle with issues of identity. Some of these issues came about simply because they were a minority (in the past there weren't many black people in Italy), others because of rigid laws (there are many unfair laws in Italy and white Italians are no strangers to legislation that adversely affects their lives either), others due to the fruit of ignorance/lack of awareness rather than outright racism. Had Italy not experienced the migrant crisis (and all the problems it has caused) I believe that in time things would have gradually improved for these people. Awareness would gradually have been raised and Italians would have become more educated on the subject. Unfortunately, I feel that the illegal migrant and human trafficking from Africa in recent years has hijacked the conversation. I appreciate that black Italians have been present in Italy since the early 1900s (Americans shoosh because you had Jim Crow at the time) and that many Italian laws are relics from the fascist period (in reality not just those pertaining to race) that all Italians are subject to. Should laws be updated? Yes. In Italy? Oh dear that's a conversation for another day (if you know anything about how slowly the legal system moves in Italy you'll know what I mean). Red tape and absurd and overly complicated legislation are the bane of most Italians' life not just for black Italians. It doesn't mean I don't hear you or sympathize or that I won't do whatever I can in my power (if I have any) to facilitate conversations, awareness and, hopefully, eventually, change.
Wow. I’m so glad to have come across this; I’m part Siciliano on my mothers side (Messina e Ramacca). Her grandmothers father was from Mauritania. My father was half Afro-Portugues; For me, it’s a real eye opening, yet comforting experience to have viewed this. Orgoglioso di essere Siciliano ♥️
@@timfool No; Actually, Mauritania “abolished” slavery (or rather, made slavery in the country illegal) in 1981, but it wasn’t criminalized and people were still being held in captivity as slaves. But that’s not anything related to the topic of the video.
Excellent. Thank you very much for this very interesting, informative video.
Mrs Pesarini 32:08 adds that there was an "imposition of the language"
So, you want to be considered italian but you don't want the italians ask you to speak italian?
Tell me..what has happened to the Italians who went abroad in other countries, were they required to speak the local language or they were not?
Doesn't this happen in every country?
What do you pretend? Moving here and be free to speak your own language without being requested to learn our language?
And maybe, after a while deciding you which language should be spoken here?
One of the three ladies says that " italian is used as the weapon to question the italianess"
Ok, quote one country in the world where it is not required to know the language of the place if you move there.
Quote me one single guy on the entire universe who can define himself/ herself as belonging to whatsoever nationality without knowing the language.
Without having the deeply emotional, psychological and also cognitive need to know the language which he/she feels to belong to.
(Even Jhumpa Lahiri needed to learn the language before becoming Italian.)
How many german people can define themselves german without knowing the language?
How many chinese can define themselves chinese without knowing the language?
How many americans can define themselves as american without knowing American-english?
Can you please describe to me, what happens usually when a foreigner doesn't want to learn the language of the place he decided to move in?
Do you know what usually happens to italians when their pronunciation is less than perfect?
What are we talking about? Are you serious?
The unmissably shrewd Mrs Gasparini goes on telling that 31:24 she knows "from other people" telling her that it was forbidden to them speaking their mother language" or that " 31:26 Some people told me there were physical punishments if you spoke your mother language".
And this should be the ultimate historical criterion to validate a notion?
Is this your way of studying other people's history..? Collecting hearsays?
Are you kidding me?
At 32:34 Mr. Tamburri suddendly wakes up and remembers that "Italians went to some horrible thing in this country" just because they were requested to learn the language, and to adopt a different life style ( even religion)
but unfortunately, after a while he falls again in the same mistake when he says: 34:11 "arbitrary category about what it means to be Italians" 😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳
Very funny! Please explain to me who is entitled to tell an american who is he/she...other people?
Should we ask some russian?
Or maybe should we ask chinese people who could explain finally, to americans, who they "really" are?
You would answer, and I'm sure about that, whatever they could say "that it is much more complicated than that."
Am I wrong?
Why should we italians answer in a different way?
Let me please give you some little suggestions: For italians the so-called Guido-culture
A) is not a "culture"
B) is not italian
The mob "culture" is maybe italian-american, NOT italian because we hate Mafia, we do not celebrate it.
E, per carità di Patria, shall we do not add anything else, ok?
Everybody who defines it a "culture" insults judges as Giovanni Falcone, Paolo Borsellino and hundreds of people among the Italian police, Carabinieri and MAGISTRATES who WERE KILLED by Mafia. And you also insulte people as judge Nicola Gratteri who still fights nowaday
MAFIA IS NOT ITALIAN FOLKLORE, OK?
I learned recently that in Germany in England or other places there are something called as Mafia-Musik, Mafia romance, and Mafia cooking.
In Spain and Germany they even had the shameless wickedness to open some "mafia-restaurants" mixing some photos from " the Godfather" with those portraiting Giovanni Falcone and Paolo Borsellino.
We Italians are absolutely HORRIFIED by all these supposedly creative "cultural" products.
First of all because it insults the same idea of culture which WE invented from the old latin "cultus" past participle of colere ( meaning to "cultivate")
Second of all because not knowing that the word mafia can't even stay in the same sentence with culture reveals the lowest cultural level possible of the people who says this.
It is like saying that the "yakuza" phenomenon defines the japanese culture,
or that Germans are ontologically nazis.
Or that All americans think that injecting bleach is a scientific notion.
So, considering, what do usually foreign people are able to understand about italian culture which is REALLY HUGE ( even for us Italians to discover it all) can you please explain to me, if you can, why the hell should I allow anybody in the world to tell me that Mafia "culture"is "italian culture"?
Going further in this ridiculous and manipulative tale Mrs Gasperini says that usually her "students" when in they are in Florence, search for "gelato, pizza, arte Dante" ( just quoting these things as the epitome of italian culture speaks volumes about the level of cultural knowledge of this "teacher") and that they usually experience "36:42 racism homophobia sexism" or 37:57 police brutality and racial violence in Italy...( 😳😳😳😳😳😳😳😳)
While in other countries.......😇😇😇😇😇 ( shall we compare the statistics?)
But...if all these people think this about Italy and Italians why do they send them here?
Why does is she, or her collegues in any way interested in italian culture, if these are cultural habits as these three diversely smart women continuously suggest during all the talk?
At 38:22 "we are different" I could not agree more.Luckily, I would add.
At 37:26 "a number of shocking fascist monuments completely decontextualized".
It is simply really unconceivable to think like this in Italy.
Following this idea, Talebans did the right thing destroying the Buddhas of Bamiyan in Afganisthan or ISIS destroying the Palmira site and many other sites.
Following this bestiality, up to the 99% of the world cultural heritage should be destroyed because it was made during undemocratic regimes.
For us Italians, this is really a cultural "blasphemy".
So, when 38:36 she says italian publishing is so resistant to publish this kind of book by non-white italians" this doesn't surprise me at all because nobody in Italy would want to publish such BS.
Publishers would loose all their credibility. It is obvious. And it doesn't have anything to do with the obligation of following a "fascist literary canon" at all. Nor that these people are black, not at all.
This is, one more time, insulting.
The fact is that as "a rose is a rose is a rose" a BS is a BS. is a BS. Period.
41:05 Mrs Moise reveals at the end the real reason of this editorial movement when she says that they are "asking white italian to "leave the space" in literature, in politics and so on."
To "leave the space"?....🤔🤔🤔🤔
To.....you? 😳
Why do you want your "own" cultural space and you don't say that you want to contribute to the italian culture which has grown here milliennia BEFORE you came here?
Why the hell should we LEAVE you Space ?
I AM my history, I AM my roots.
Who are you?
Mrs Camilla Hawtorne adds that they don't want " to write a nice sympathetic narrative to absolve you white italians"
Well, sorry to disappont Mrs Hawtorne, but she or whoever else cannot absolve anybody.
Only God can absolve.
And you people are NOT God.
Get over it.
We italians have our own faults, as all human beings, but it is not up to you to judge and least of all to " absolve" us. ( Who would absolve UTU people...?)
Considering that you people pretend to have the freedom to put whatsoever meaning you prefer in the word "italian" otherwise you would consider me as "racist", I will respond you that it is not enough drinking a " caffè" or eating a "pizza" or being able to pronounce correctly "la dolce vita" to define yourself as "italians".
And from people whose brain is unable to process nothing more complex than the well known "pizza-pasta-mamma-mafia" common places, an evident bullying and stereotyping propaganda rhetoric,
I'm not going to let be taught ANYTHING about my country and MY culture.
PS: I have not heard one single positive thing about Italy mentioned by these self-styled "Italians"
Not a single thing.
Bravissimi/e! You did an excellent job of combining the issues addressed in the Calandra event and the interviews with the authors and translator. i hope we are able to see more of this kind of work . soon.
This is amazing work! Thank you all for telling these important stories!
An important story is that blacks don't belong in Italy. Blacks belong with their own kind
11:29-11:31 Ethiopian partial origin?.
She could be Eritrean or Somali, she could also be Ethiopian but it is less likely, Ethiopia was occupied by the Italians for a few years, before WW2
Just my two cents worth but I think the migrant crisis (people from Africa flooding into Italy who have no right or claim to Italian heritage and many are not even escaping war therefore not refugees, as they claim, but opportunists) has complicated matters. Most arrive without papers so there's no way to know who they really are (their embassies are not particularly helpful plus migrants have been known to lie about their country of origin) or why they are really on our shores. I think if it weren't for the overwhelming flood of migrants (which has been going on since the 90s) it would be easier for those of African descent who have a legitimate claim to Italian-ness.
Although they are spoken of but not represented in this video, those with no Italian blood but who have legally lived their whole life in Italy and are, therefore, culturally Italian are in a terrible situation as they find themselves in limbo and I genuinely feel for them. The unfortunate reality is that if you grant citizenship based on ius soli then it becomes a system open for abuse and Italy already has so many problems and issues so is concerned about inviting more problems (which it doesn't need: the country is already at breaking point). As far as I'm aware, outside of N&S America very few countries grant citizenship based on ius soli therefore why point fingers at Italy as particularly racist based on this point? The EU has not helped Italy much in dealing with the migrant situation and America should just shut up because it's the political instability it helped to create in these African countries in the first place that is what lies at the root of the migrant crisis (some are legitimately fleeing war/persecution and others are just hopping on the band wagon and lying about where they are from as their ticket into Europe. Unfortunately without documents it can be impossible to know who is legitimate and who is not).
Also, as Americans (with vast open spaces and plenty of land) you can sit and judge but it seems you're expecting Italy, in the span of a few decades, to achieve a certain type of racial policy that you have taken centuries to develop. How about you look closer to home at how you treat Mexicans. Now what if all of a sudden thousands started crossing the border every day (smuggled in by criminal gangs) with no papers. I can see you granting them citizenship just because they think they're entitled to it. Not. It would be chaos and I seriously doubt the matter would be dealt with in half the humane manner in which Italy has handled its migrant crisis.
How does this relate to black Italians (who are both genetically and culturally Italian)? Unfortunately they are innocent casualties caught up in a much wider chaotic context. In this video we hear different individuals each with a unique background who have had to battle with issues of identity. Some of these issues came about simply because they were a minority (in the past there weren't many black people in Italy), others because of rigid laws (there are many unfair laws in Italy and white Italians are no strangers to legislation that adversely affects their lives either), others due to the fruit of ignorance/lack of awareness rather than outright racism. Had Italy not experienced the migrant crisis (and all the problems it has caused) I believe that in time things would have gradually improved for these people. Awareness would gradually have been raised and Italians would have become more educated on the subject. Unfortunately, I feel that the illegal migrant and human trafficking from Africa in recent years has hijacked the conversation. I appreciate that black Italians have been present in Italy since the early 1900s (Americans shoosh because you had Jim Crow at the time) and that many Italian laws are relics from the fascist period (in reality not just those pertaining to race) that all Italians are subject to. Should laws be updated? Yes. In Italy? Oh dear that's a conversation for another day (if you know anything about how slowly the legal system moves in Italy you'll know what I mean). Red tape and absurd and overly complicated legislation are the bane of most Italians' life not just for black Italians. It doesn't mean I don't hear you or sympathize or that I won't do whatever I can in my power (if I have any) to facilitate conversations, awareness and, hopefully, eventually, change.
Thank you beautiful black women.
You're welcome dusty old brown man
what beautiful women, proud of them, proud to be Italian American and to listen to such brilliant black Italian women - I think this is so cool
Yes, because no one's ever seen a black person in Europe. 🙄🙄
I really appreciate your I information on this very NICE input... thanks again ✌️
Thanks again ✌️
Important and timely conversation
Crybaby blacks need to go back to Africa
Wow. I’m so glad to have come across this; I’m part Siciliano on my mothers side (Messina e Ramacca). Her grandmothers father was from Mauritania. My father was half Afro-Portugues; For me, it’s a real eye opening, yet comforting experience to have viewed this. Orgoglioso di essere Siciliano ♥️
Mauritania, aren't they the last country to ban slavery in 1994??
@@timfool No; Actually, Mauritania “abolished” slavery (or rather, made slavery in the country illegal) in 1981, but it wasn’t criminalized and people were still being held in captivity as slaves. But that’s not anything related to the topic of the video.
Italy is not Africa
L🤡L They're talking about their Life experience being part Italian, Sherlock 🕵️ Not Yours! 🤯
marco pomilio
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻 😉
Ma che cazzo c'entra
@@WiiNV 🤣 🤣 🤣 🤣
Are you an idiot?
Outside of the virtue signaling United States does anyone care where someone is from or the color of their skin? Most do not care in the USA tbh.