Justine Bateman: Your Age is Being Weaponized
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 ต.ค. 2023
- Justine Bateman (writer, director, producer, author) joins us to address society’s fears about aging especially when it comes to females, how she unpacks her irrational fears in order to get to the root problem, and concerns about the implementation of artificial intelligence into film and television projects. She breaks down the nuances of wearing makeup, differences between society’s views toward aging between men and women, and her foolproof method for combating fears rooted in our physical insecurities. Mayim breaks down choice feminism and Justine shares what our fears of being an outlier may be rooted in and why she thinks mainstream audiences are one step away from accepting generative A.I.
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NOTE: This episode was recorded before the Israel-Hamas conflict. Our hope is that MBB can be a positive distraction from what's going on in the world.
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Theme Song Written, Produced, and Performed by Ed Robertson. Mixed by Kenny Luong.
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In the 90s when I was a teen, I went to a Stone Temple Pilots concert at The Greek with friends. We had seats right next to Justine Bateman. We recognized her of course, but as Hollywood kids we knew to be cool & not bother her. Part way through the concert some drunk guys started invading our space. Justine shoved the main guy away from us & told him to get lost. Then she asked if we were okay & encouraged us to not take shit from guys. Justine Bateman is a B^d^ss Feminist Hero! 🙌🤩
Love this story!
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She's a real person.
Potentially terrible advice. I know it is all in vogue to say girl power and girls can do anything men can but the harsh reality is that if you talk shit to the WRONG guy, he could beat the crap out of you or worse and there would be NOTHING you could do about it.
As a dark skinned black woman I have been invisible for a long time. I thrive in my invisibility and men seem to be taken aback when they compliment me and I take it in stride and do not melt.
Self love and respect is the best love. Doing my shadow works has been nothing but rewarding for me internally and externally.
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As a 61 year old blond haired blue eyed woman I never “ grieved” once I became invisible.
It was embarrassing to get undeserved attention in my youth.
I recently got a puppy and my looks matter not an iota to her. I get far more pleasure from our interactions than I ever got in my youth!
@@user-bw2zt5jd9u good for you.
@msthang5366. You're invisible but you get compliments from men? How does that make sense?. Nobody experiences invisibility like the average man.
Its interesting as society becomes more accepting and diverse, fat acceptance and all that, there is an epidemic of women getting plastic surgery. Breasts, butts, facelifts, botox, lips, etc. Many women in entertainment have unrealistic bodies because of plastic surgery. All this feminist enlightenment has not delivered what it promised, women are worse off now than in conservative times, Not to mention sex work like Onlyfans is normalized for young women these days. I dont think thats what the original feminists envisioned.
I’ve been thinking of this topic lately. There is such a difference in culture between the US and the UK. The US won’t let women age. You can see this in Judy Dench vs Jane Fonda. Both lovely actresses, but two different cultural expectations. Kudos to Justine for speaking out on this.
It is an illusion that there is a difference. You compare an actress chosen for her beauty with a character actress. Trust me I live in Europe. As a woman over 35 you are invisible.
First off all people age naturally differently, even when they were young there was a great difference between JUDY DENCH and JANE FONDA,JANE Inherited good Gene's, the FONDAS AGED Well, Jane said she did eye and brow lifts, but remember she was also a fitness trainer, so her body is in good shape , it's the same when you compare WHITE PEOPLE TO BLACK PEOPLE who are the same age, I am sorry to SAY WHITE PEOPLE age in dog years,compared to black people, So it's all about GENETICS, the way you live eat, exercise your state of mind, not everyone is into plastic surgery, I have AUNTS,older than Justine and they look way younger than her , but then they are BLACK with beautiful unwrinkled skin. We live in the Caribbean.
Best friend lives in UK. Actually works for injection specialist. Lines of clients out the door. What’s true is that it’s much more accessible money wise in The States for people to get “done”
Jane Fonda has has a lot more plastic surgery eye and brow lifts, by her own admission.
@@denise3679 Well, money well spent, it was not over done, because her face moves , I watched her on her Netflix series and she looks damn good and not freaky. Even so, that's what your money's for, you will have all that money, and look like SH*T, NO.
It's only Envious, MOCKING PRETENDERS, will say otherwise.
I really appreciate Justine Bateman. She seems so centered. She even fends off Mayim's attempts at jokey self deprecation to get to her more serious point. I want to be like Justine and feel COMFORTABLE instead of wanting to joke or feel weird.
But you do realize that when people joke around, it's to make OTHERS feel comfortable? It would have been super awkward for Justine if Mayim was super serious.
@@abcdefg-oj5wn Usually I would agree with you as a possibility, but I sensed Mayim is very challenged by this subject by the fact that she laughed at inappropriate moments as compared to her stated intention to hear Justine's important points. Clearly Justine doesn't need to be made to feel comfortable, she's already super comfortable in her skin.
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@@abcdefg-oj5wnNot always. Joking around can be motivated by many different things. Mayim has never hidden her struggles with self esteem. Often self depreciation is an indication of low self esteem.
This feels like something Mayim would write, not a dude named "Anthony". Also my phone has been suggesting weird emojis at weird times ❤
It’s amazing how differently I’m treated at 60 than at even 55…I’m suddenly spoken to like I’m an old dear. I’m afraid to go out without bail money because I am at the point that I will punch the next person who speaks to me like I’m 4
😂😂😂 always carry bail money😂
😂😂😂
Hey, be glad they speak to you sweetly instead of like you're disgusting.
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I've also started noticing this at 60 and find it disconcerting and oddly comforting.
What I've found as an aging man is that the older I get the more invisible I become. The phases of aging are the same as grief... Both end with acceptance.
Totally agree! At age 78, I am still a viable man, but am finding I have become more invisible to my peers, and the younger adults around me. They no longer care what I want or think in most cases. I have a daughter who understands that and treats me still as her dad and mentor, and a son who does not understand that and treats me like an outsider.
I am 70 and totally agree. I just feel like I'm fading into the background. And I think it's much worse for females. We are a culture that worships youth and just kind of want old folks to be quiet and get out of the way.
The corollary to being invisible at our age is the unhelpful epithet 'boomer' where, somehow, we've come to be blamed for everything. So we're both disenfranchised and pariahs.
This is sad to hear.
@@Robutube1
I agree, but I stubbornly wear the title "Boomer" with pride.
I loved this talk with JB. I'm 64 and like a lot of aging women, I have been noticing & practicing to accept my face changes as I grow older. One thing that helped me in a positive way was hearing my sibblings say that out of the four of us, my face reminds them the most of our Grandmother...whom everyone Loved & Admired. My Face is becoming her Face and in a way, we get to see her again. This makes me want to take care that I keep my face as is.
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Love this!
❤️ What a beautiful sentiment.
Lucky for you. I am the one who has our Grandma's face, and she was a bit of a self-centered meanie. I don't think I have her personality though. Thank God.
@@christinemarie6976 Well, one can look at it this way: your grandma was a bit of a self-centered meanie, right? Now, your face is morphing into Grandma 2.0 - a more kind and cool upgrade. :)
I'm so lucky. I discovered Jane Goodall as a pre-teen. I realized how free she was bc she prioritized the content of her brain and heart. I have never thought off shaving as a must. I don't pluck or shave or care. I'm a nurse. I'm not interested in looking the part. I AM the part.
I loved this interview… !!I’m 60 years old, and my 94 year old mother, who just passed away on 10-5-23, always told me that Scars and Wrinkles are Earned…and through your lifetime, you will get plenty of both if you are Lucky!
It just means you’ve lived a full life! So be proud of them and show them off! 😊
I love you more Mama! 😇
Condolences on the passing of your dear, wise Mother.
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Sounds like your mom was a beautiful woman.
Beautiful ❤ thank you to your Mother!
Thank you for sharing such wonderful wisdom
Rest in peace to mama ❤
Ageism in the workplace is absolutely 100% real. It’s interesting to hear discussions about aging from people who don’t have to struggle financially. I was laid off at 54 and it took 2 years for me to find a job. Many employers didn’t even bother to reply to my resume or application because they could see that I was over 50. There is an unfair assumption that older employees have less to offer. I lost everything trying to survive for 2 years as a single person. So if people are concerned about looking and feeling healthier, it’s reasonable. If Looking youthful lets People that I still have something to bring to the table, then so be it. It is what it is. That culture won’t change in my lifetime. This conversation needs to include how much harder it is for women, especially single women. 36:11 It’s not just pressure for men.
Amen. Single. Never famous. Poor. No family. Exactly. Not only ageism but , like what was stated, all this illusion people have created too to compete with. Most don't know reality. I'm turning 60. I'm told I look much younger, I hope this keeps being a reality for me, because if not, I'm really in trouble. I agree with how ridiculous plastic surgery is, with these " movie stars" primarily, they end up looking all the same etc.... also, yes, the 1970's ,I feel, people looked more attractive! Because they all looked different. It's not only they feel older people don't have as much to offer, they know we can't ' grow' with the job, they know we will be dealing with health issues( fact of aging ), they know we will be out of place alongside younger people, making the environment uncomfortable for both sides.
Wake up people , live your life to the fullest, have the confidence when you look in that mirror, THERE IS ONLY ONE OPPINION THAT'S IMPORTANT, YOURS, once you are happy with yourself,regardless to if you color your hair or not, WHO CARES, always remember, EVERYONE GETS TO BE YOUNG, NOT EVERYONE GETS TO BE OLD, how I see it it's a blessing.
Thank you. This is correct even here in Aus. A job in an office from lower mid up to senior manager in any type of industry with any collaberative interaction with int or ext parties are nowhere near this acceptance.being physically acceptable in your presentation is the only way to sustain your place or gain employment . Its a shame sure,but if they see you as an old dear,they wont see u as the right fit for the team. Shout out to those who take a stand or risk,but my mortgage,my bills,my health costs and that food i need to eat will all be gone in 4 weeks if i lose a job. Cant deal with poverty and its not an exaggeration
Justine needs her own podcast as well. She has a wonderful perspective that I would love to listen to about a lot of additional topics.
Omg yes I would love to listen to Justine’s Podcast
I second that emotion!
I liked what Bateman said about "a lot of unique faces growing up in the 70s" - I really agree. we grew up seeing people on tv and film who had no plastic surgery, and also pre-MTV, so all our great top 40 singers were not necessarily attractive by present day standards. Barry Manilow, Elton John, Jim Croce, Janis Ian, you did not have to be a human Barbie to be a famous singer. Thanks for this great interview! Favorite line, "Oh, this is what a cool person's arm looks like". Amen, sister!
I experienced age discrimination when I was unemployed. Even with all my education and over 30 years of job skills and experience, I was too old to get hired. I was lucky to have a company take a chance since they were known to hire more mature workers. I have been working there for two years now.
What company is known to hire more mature workers? Thank you.
When companies use age these days ,it's because you are not up to date with technology as a younger person will be,depending on the company that's the major problem, the World is moving at a rapid pace where that is concerned, Let's face it, that's the way it is , and remember you too were once young and enjoyed all the benefits of being young. Part of aging gracefully, is acceptance, it's not always how you look , accept, that to each his own,some will dye their hair, some will do Botox, some will do plastic surgery, some will remain young at heart, The key is, do what ever makes you happy, it's your life , you have earned the right to do whatever you please, and the clock is ticking.
Bull! Millions of older adults are brilliant regarding their technology skills. In addition they bring a wealth of experience to the table. Younger adults are dealing with maturity, child care issues to caring for their parents etc. This shouldn't be brought to work place. Yes emergency time off when absolutely needed.
@patriciajones6771 you are distributing ageism in these comments. By making a blanket statement about an entire generation and their skill set or lack thereof, you are practicing extreme bias.
@@patriciajones6771 How can you assume that this woman did not keep up with technology? I'm in my early 50s and I defy you to name a program used by my industry that I am not thoroughly familiar with and skilled in. The real problem is that younger people are now moving up to executive level and, like you, that generation has been raised with the misconception that maturity equals inept. How would you prefer those over 50 support themselves? Shall we hike up your taxes so us "old folks" can just retire early and take a long-earned 30+ year vacay?
At nearly 70, I can say that it's been a relief for the last 15-20 years not to worry about the gaze of others.
Our obsession in our youth of how we appear to others is a distraction from being who we really are. I would suggest to young women not to fear aging. It's wonderful on many levels. Yes, difficult on others. But definitely a mixed bag, like every other phase of our lives.
At 54 now I really am tired of having to look pretty lol I have better things to do lol
I’m a little surprised that you are the first person to share this point of view. I’m right with you on this; when I got into my 50’s is maybe when I started realizing that the pressure was off in terms of all the things I’ve had to deal with in terms of being objectified by men in a society that seems to be going backwards on this rather than forwards. I’m in the category of being relieved of the pressure and sense of protectiveness about myself because now I can be free to be the real, authentic me, instead of spending so much energy in defensive positions. ❤
I feel both relief and grief…no one cares what I look like, but no one cares what I look like… I also realize it’s all in my head a reflection of my self perception.
my belief is nobody ever really cares about how someone looks. Most people are more concerned about themselves. This is just human nature and like Justine mentions about survival in tribes back when it was a thing lol But now it is about money and status. Really it is all silly when you think about it. Just live your life in a meaningful way that is about inner growth, creativity and being with the ones you love and that love you@@stevieray7203
I too was greatly relieved when the male attention stopped.
One of my favourite actresses - Frances McDormand once said in an interview…..
“ … There is no desire to be an adult. Adulthood is not a goal. It's not seen as a gift. Something happened culturally: no one is allowed to age past 45 - satorically, cosmetically, attitudinally.
Everybody dresses like a teenager. Everybody dyes their hair. Everybody is concerned with smooth skin.
Getting older and adjusting to all the things that biologically happen to you is not easy to do and is a constant struggle and adjustment.
You are someone who , beneath the white hair, has a card catalog of valuable information …”
Yuck!! Let this go in one ear and right out the other!! 🤢
My aging appearance was weaponized by only one person: my narcissistic husband. I’m now 61 and ridding myself of him and his emotionally abusive self after 35 yrs. The damage he did was extensive, but through therapy, is being removed and replaced with something much better: not getting revenge, not putting myself above him but, living a peaceful life with my adult children, friends and volunteering at my church.
Wow, as a 63 year old woman, this is the podcast that I didn't know I needed. Me and my cool-looking face.
Blossom and Mallory! Grew up watching you both! My fave tv women! The 2 most real, intelligent, and beautiful women in Hollywood. Important message of acceptance, strength, and having "faith" in a higher power that you will be ok. You rock!
It's refreshing to see two strong female stars reveal that they have fears and doubts just like the majority of us. They're correct also in that youthfulness and beauty have been shoved down our throats for way to long.
You nailed the exact problem with this society…. People are conditioned that “stars” are perfect and lead perfect lives… which is pure utter nonsense!
The last time I saw Justine was at our 10 year reunion from that high school in Woodland Hills. I am not saying this to insult her in any way. The girls at that reunion were dressed to the nines, with one exception. Justine had on a dress that hung down straight. I got a glance at it, as she was at the table behind mine, and knew it was her. At 28 years old she wasn't concerned what people thought of what she wore, not that it was bad or ugly, just a different level from the other girls. She has carried that on into her later life and good for her.
I would have been wearing pants lol (I'm female).
I will be 65 in just a few months. There's such a peace and joy that I had no idea would come my way. It's hard to explain but there are so many things that I used to worry about that have just basically disappeared. Hard to explain but I am more confident, strong and full of faith than ever. Getting old (not counting some of the physical pain) has been great. 😅
The “ attracting others due to youth or in rare cases, beauty is of the ego”.
Do you need to be considered beautiful to enjoy hobbies or your pets?
@@user-bw2zt5jd9u
Exactly!!! I just want to enjoy my life! I don’t need to look young to enjoy my hobbies or my friends and family! 😂
I am a retired Nurse, who used to work for a Cosmetic Surgery practice. it made me sad that both young woman and even older ladies would spend thousands of dollars trying to get the perfect body. I can remember one young woman , who was beautiful and spent 10K on an unnecessary surgery still trying to get the perfect body. I kept thinking that if the young woman and had invested that money instead, their life would have been so much better.
Social Media has such an influence and sets unachievable standards of beauty for most woman. For me, I earned every wrinkle and line on my face and wear it as a badge of honor.
I'm a nurse, too and that's one job I would never even consider. I want nothing to do with that industry. I work in pediatrics.
I don't know why they are pussyfooting around it, just say it: people think looking old is ugly. I do not think that but I had to make the decision to work on the way I thought about being old and looking old. I started in my 50's and now that I am 60 I see the beauty in being and looking natural and yes, old, showing my age. Justine is great and I totally get where she's coming from. meanwhile every comment that Mayim makes just shows the age difference between them and Justine was so patient with Mayim's interruptions.The bottom line is it shouldn't matter if you have jowls hanging down or lines on your neck, that's the whole point! I really enjoyed this.
As a 59 year old female bartender I get men saying to me, I bet you were hot when you were young, and the men saying this think that statement is a compliment..... smh
th-cam.com/video/0QxqV-L5clM/w-d-xo.html 😂
Do you have a comeback?
@@SamStone1964 "Too bad *you're* never going to be hot."
The greatest superpower we can have as a woman is to not take a man's criticism of our appearance personally.
I’m 57 and changing my mindset about aging. Conversations like this validate me.
For me, the last several years (I'm a 45yo woman), I don't wear a bra, I don't wear makeup or wear scented things, I don't shave my legs and rarely shave my armpits. As long as I'm hygienic, match, clothes are clean and fit properly, I'm ok.
I see teens putting on a full face with contouring... When I was a kid, only professional actors or models did that.
I like my gray hair. I earned this huge concentration line between my eyebrows, crow's feet, emerging jowels, saggy & crape paper skin.
I'm cool with being a Crone. I'm more focused on inner development.
I'm 44, male, but was "handsome"/pretty boy type as a kid. The difference is palpable. You go from being a center of attention to a kind of background character. BUT, it's also kind of nice to not have that pressure on you. The kind youth have. And I agree: back in the "emo" days, girls would wear jeans, a thrift store t shirt, a studded belt, and that was it. Maybe some light make up/lip stick. I can't imagine what modern girls have to go through, internally, with this Instagram nonsense. Everyone was much more relaxed about looks 20 years ago. Also, tons of face-to-face hanging out. So you could see everyone was flawed and "normal", even at 20. I think the social media PLUS the isolation drives younger folks nuts.
I nurse seniors and just so you know, if you do not wear a bra, you stretch ligments in your breasts and as you get older your boobs will hang in your waistband. Seriously, I help a braless wearing elderly woman pull up her pants after using toilet and catch her breasts in her pant waistband. Wear a bra!!
I am 53 now, but years ago I decided that I wanted to grow old gratefully because there wasn't going to be anything graceful about it. Yes, I can determine where this line of thinking stems from. I watched my mom battle obesity and all the related health issues, which masked the symptoms of MS and rendered traditional treatments useless. I have been chronically obese my entire life and I'm finally getting a handle on my weight. AND accepting the fact that I look like a melted candle! But when I picture it, it's one of those cool ones from the 70s with all the colorful drips. A beautiful blobby mess! I stopped dyeing my hair in my 30s, and finally figured out in my 40s that I didn't need to shave my pits or legs (never shaved the lady parts). This improved my health greatly as I was prone to irritation and ingrown hairs (tmi). I'm not much of a daredevil, but an imaginary life goal I have is to see if I can get my arm wings flappy enough to take flight!
Ohhh dear
😂
I agree with most of this but ohhh myyyy
Don't think I could go too long without grooming the eh
Bikini zone 😂😂😂😂👙
I love this so much! As someone who also struggles with obesity, you just made my day! I totally remember those groovy candles. I like to think that if I could ever lose weight, I'd accept all the loose skin with gratitude because it would come with better health, but I'm not totally sure it wouldn't be something else to make me dislike myself.
I liked Justine Bateman on Family Ties and I like her even more now. She is so down to earth. She is also so correct. Aging is a part of life and it is cool .
What an amazing discussion. I could have listened to another hour. I was 34 when my 'then boyfriend' bought me a black tube of Olay and told me I needed it for my '11' lines between my eyebrows. I had never heard the phrase '11' lines and had never even noticed I had them. Now, 24 years later, my 11 is way deeper but I don't care. I'm just happy to be above ground, as many women aren't given the privilege of growing older.
Well im an identical twin and instead of the 11, i have a 1 and its deeper than 11s lol ughhhh
What a jerk
I hope you dumped him in that instant.
@@mexicanspec You would really dump a man because he bought you a tube of OLAY? 😄 how I see it he is interested in how you look and was willing to buy something to help, that's HONESTY, what if he said nothing and instead go out there and look for a younger woman, we all should have partners who want us to look our best, it goes both ways. To me it's not what you do , it's how you do it.
Not the buying of the Olay but this "and told me I needed it for my '11' lines between my eyebrows" If he doesn't accept her at the young age with a few lines what future do you think they have together?@@patriciajones6771
This episode was absolutely fantastic. It not only spoke to women, but to us men as well. It has taken me 78 years (well, maybe 60) to get to the point of saying "f**k it about how other people see me. I am totally either bald or have a white fringe, saggy jowls, fleshy neck, and a "dad bod!" Who cares??Nobody!! They accept me as I look. My kids and grandkids love me just the way I am and that's all that matters. My late wife was overweight throughout our 38 yr marriage, fought it all the time, dieted constantly, without success and died way too young. By not giving a damn about how others perceive me, I just relax and go about my life. You talked about plastic surgery being almost forced on people in the movie industry. I cried when Jennifer Grey got a nose job. She maybe did it to get more roles, but to me she was just beautiful the way she was. Just wanted to add that!!
Why did you ever care what people thought of how you looked?
@@mexicanspec I feel like you didn’t listen to this show. We care because we want to fit in. We all go through it.
Yes I understood the premise, but that was never the case with me. If that was you I am sorry you went through that. I have always been a leader, not a follower.@@GrayWithMe
Male vanity I suppose, but more it was just how people judged how I lived my life, or how I maybe perceived that I was being judged. Now, it makes no difference to me what people think. @@mexicanspec
At 18 I was driving a 1963 Cadillac Hearse. I never cared what people thought. Maybe I was lucky.@@jimflack3196
I am 57 now. My mother passed away 2 years ago, she was 92. I look in tbe mirror and see my mother when I wS a child. People tell me I look like her. She was beautiful when she was young and aged well like wine. Embrace your age.❤
Justine is such an inspiration for all women in being authentically yourself with no apologies 💗☺️🦋
I am 10 minutes in and have already heard such profound things I say about myself daily. The more I listened the more. I take from this. I will share this will my 21 and 16 year old daughters
Justine Bateman is so rad! I read both her books, we need more voices and perspectives like hers. I really hope she keeps talking and writing about these topics and inspiring more people to think differently. Rock on, Justine!
I'm 43, and my Mom keeps mentioning to me dying my hair to cover grey hair. I don't want to. I'm good with it. I also stopped wearing makeup after having a skin cancer procedure on my face in the Spring. I just don't anymore. Moisturize and SPF baby. All the women in my family have dyed their hair forever. I'm good with growing older. It's a privilege denied by many.
I'm 49 and color my hair. I would like to stop doing but for some crazy reason I'm worried about looking 10 years older. I applaud you for making a great choice to stay natural.
I don't know why people have to bother you about it. It's your prerogative. You're not hurting anyone. You're not obligated to do what your mother says. She should just be happy that you survived skin cancer.
Well, I think colouring your hair is not a big deal. I like colouring my hair. It is just a small thing I do for myself, like others who paint their nails regualrily. So things just make you feel good, so why not?
These two women give off such mental quickness and intelligence. Well thought out stuff.
51:39 Justine: "People just say things... more diarrhea comes out of people's mouths than out their asses." EXACTLY
Justine, you are my f-ing HERO!!!!! I don’t wear makeup. I can go to a public pool even if my legs are not shaved. But ignoring the comments and looks is exhausting. Not budging though! I will forever defend my right to look natural
I think graying, wrinkling, etc. is a personal preference. What I hate more than people saying we have to do everything possible to look young are people who think we shouldn’t do anything at all. I believe in aging in my best way possible, my best health, my best mind, my best body. But it’s my personal choice. It has zero to do with pleasing others or trying to meet unrealistic beauty standards.
Exactly! If I want to colour my hair, wear make up, or shave - I do so because it makes me feel good. It is not conforming to want to be your best! The key is MODERATION in all things. Goodness, going to bed with prickly leg hairs would drive me crazy. I have no shame either in moisturizes on my face and neck. There is nothing wrong with selfcare as long as it is not an obession and it brings you more confidence! A happy, healthy medium is normal ladies!
i'm 46. i've definitely been feeling less attractive and freaking out bc of aging. and feeling like what am i doing wrong that i don't look 34 anymore and it feels like failure. i'd like to embrace aging, bc i'm fighting it and feeling bad over it. and after two marriages feeling life is just over for me... might as well stay in bed. get a rocking chair and give up. i feel like society is telling me my good days are over. i'm definitely struggling with midlife and who i am now and where do i fit in now?
i really appreciate this conversation. i really appreciate Mayim especially bc she looks like me and my friends at our age. And still has a voice and demands respect and acknowledgement. And Justine really said some deep thoughts I needed to hear. This was a very affirming episode as a middle aged woman. Especially the part about trusting that things are going to work out.
Society is just a bunch of individuals whose opinions are none of your business :)
@@endlessnameless6494 So you're saying people value Justin Bieber's opinion (pretty boy) over Denzel Washington's opinion (mature competent man)?
What an amazing conversation! I love the realness.. real talk! I am about Justine's age. How refreshing to hear this. I am embracing my "unusual look" and the freedom I have felt since I let it go is amazing. My hairdresser years back told me, when I said I was going to quit coloring and embrace my silver, "shh that's bad for business. Why would you want to do that, you'll look old and like a hippy." YES, that's the point. Not necessarily to age myself but to be myself. I look like a hippy? Fan-freaking-tastic! I never returned to her chair after that. PS, my God given silver is what people pay big bucks for now. I encourage people to go for it, and see what surprise God has for you.
Hooray for Justine!! We need more of this very clear thinking and attitude! Loved this convo!!!!
thank you Mayim for being your authentic self and having so many amazing people on your podcast to inspire us with their stories 💗🙏☺️
I'm 65 this year. I look 65. I feel so free, never freer in my life! I am enough and wonderful as I am. Anyone I would have to impress isn't worth it.
She still looks stunning and her intelligence makes her even more attractive.❤
@@mollieanne Uhmmm if you bothered reading the rest of the comment I was quite clear. Get over yourself. Part of the video was about her appearance and aging naturally.
No, she isn't stunning. And, that is perfectly OK. That's the whole point. We age and won't always be stunning.
@@MartiMarc That's how you see it but personally I have seen many old women that I perceive as stunning. Not saying Justine is an old woman but just saying that even old women can be stunning to those of us that can see it.
@macbethbee I know she's older but I think she's beautiful too...but it's her naturalness and confidence.
@@MartiMarcI think stunning is in the eye of the beholder. And she is ❤
The conversation today when you were discussing a certain look, how the plastic surgery ends up looking the same reminds me of one of my favorite Twilight Zone episodes, Number 12 looks just like you... It wasn't just the fact that everyone shared the same faces, that they underwent a certain change in their personality, their "you-ness" during their surgical procedures. I adore your show and I always turn your topics over and over in my brain a long time after I watch the show. Keep digging, keep sending words out into the ether. WE are here listening.
I’m the same age as Justine, to be honest the first thing I thought during the intro before the interview began was “Wow she looks old!” I feel bad now, I have to say that if she was just a librarian or a checker at the grocery store, I wouldn’t of thought that, but she was a movie star and I think the public thinks movie stars always look good and take care of their skin it’s a movie star thing I think that there’s no other way around it I wasn’t born to think faces are pretty or ugly, but I think movie stars are always shown from young pictures of them to older pictures of them and people in their head critique them …. Have they aged well? and based on movie star pictures, I think that the public would say she “did not age well” and that’s a sad thing, but as a regular person if I saw her walking down the street I wouldn’t think twice about how old or young she was or anything like that I would just think she’s a regular lady walking down the street just like me.
My first thought was that she looks like a totally cool bad ass.
Here’s my bottom line: if you have a healthy body that functions the way it supposed to thank your lucky stars. Leave it alone! Be grateful for what you have the end.
I respect Justine choice about beauty it's okay to age gracefully 😊 hopefully she's inspired others
I work as a scientist - a field in which women typically aren't judged much by looks. However, I have noticed that since passing 50, people look right through me. I fear I will have to retire before I want to because no one values me anymore. It's a very sad place in which to live everyday. Justine is super smart - she has some very profound insights about the fear of aging.
Why would you need to retire early?
if you speak deliberately and competently people WILL value you.
They are too afraid of being judged not to.
I’ve adored all & everyone of my wrinkles, face lines & my Justine-like “cool arms”. But even more after watching these naturally beautiful beyond-any-stupid-standard advocates of natural aging women to whom I identify myself so, so much! You rock, ladies! 💜
I appreciate their realness. Not buying into shallowness of entertainment world. Staying natural & true. Go girls!😊
Such a fantastic episode and I truly love how Justine kept Mayim from going into negative self talk. I adore both even more so now than when I was growing up, and having recently turned 50, I appreciate the topic of aging gratefully and gracefully.
I'd love a sub-series on self image and acceptance featuring people like Valerie Bertinelli, Paulina Porizkova, Pamela Anderson, Jamie Lee Curtis, and others, who've opened up in recent years about their journeys on the topic, as well as additional struggles around grief, abuse, societal pressures, etc.
Justine Bateman is An Icon! And She Was on one of my favorite TV shows Sitcom's of All Time!! 👍😊👌 Hey Malerie! Lol 😆✌🖖✌🎃🍁🎃
Age IS weaponized. I feel TERRIBLE for young women. I can’t imagine the fear of aging and equating it with ugly. It’s constant.
A very down to earth interview.
I think the deeper issue is the fear of death. We are afraid of running out of time
That’s interesting about the hooded eyes. My 76-yr-old mother-in-law legitimately needs this as this impeeds her ability to drive / to see, & of course, insurance won’t pick any of that up. And that’s a MEDICAL need.
I know it’s very different that the hooded eye convo here, but we need to get realistic about what’s an actual need vs a want.
Medicare paid for my father’s hooded eye surgery as it impeded his vision.
Justine was, frankly, an absolute jerk when it came to that part of the conversation. Her dismissal/disdain was totally uncalled for. Yes, it's a real thing, not just "an excuse to get insurance to pay for it." Honestly, that came across as deeply ignorant. What she talks about is important, but she also frequently seems to take things a bit too far, and she doesn't want to hear anyone else's point of view if it does not align with hers 100%.
That’s usually the reason it does cover it. She might have Medicare advantage that avoids covering anything but all the ladies that I knew that had it done had Medicare pay for it. Funny how this hooded eyes seeing issue hasn’t seemed to affect men. Every single woman my age had it done …none of their husbands did.
Great episode although I do think some of the things people fear actually do come true- especially in the Hollywood world. It's not an irrational fear to think you won't be hired for a certain acting job if you look a certain way or look older- that actually does happen sadly. People DO lose jobs due to looks unfortunately. As a teen I WAS not invited to some events because I didn't have the same jeans that certain kids had that were popular. The trick is to move past it and say "well why would I want to be friends with someone who discriminated based on clothes?" Not easy to do at 13.
I'm so happy you guys are talking. I'm 44 (and from the Valley!) and balling my eyes out losing a bit of hair due to hormones. Younger generations are SO obsessed with perfection due to social media - I need to hear my Gen X gals talking about this intelligently. Thank you both for leaning into your intellects and critical thinking. I don't do botox or dye hair or any of that, either. I'd rather invest my money in trips and learning and musical gear.
When my hair started falling out, I wouldn’t go out of the house. I tried Rogaine and Nioxon treatments, nothing helped. I saw a dermatologist, my hair loss was from getting older, crazy diets I was on my entire life starting at age 9, and weight-loss surgery. My hair is very thin on top and around the forehead. I now don’t let the loss of hair affect leaving the house. I’ve given up trying to grow hair where it chooses not to grow.
I’m very happy about this episode. I’ve been scared to death all my life about aging + being alone in my later years. My mother always told me that when you get old you wind up sitting alone in the corner + that no one will wanna bother with me when I’m old. So I feared getting old since age 24. What did I learn? That when you’re in fear about something that may happen later in life, you’re not in the present time. I’m learning how to enjoy every day God blesses me with. I survived an emotional trauma that went on for 17 years (a random guy ruined my marriage as I refused to have dinner with him so he threatened to lie + say we’ve been involved for two years to my husband). I learned that my marriage wasn’t as solid as I thought since my husband (thirteen years older) never stood by me. I’ve dealt with many years of verbal abuse. Now I’m 59 + I’m making it my mission to enjoy every day I’m blessed with. I never had children + now I’m single. At age 59. It’s scary. My sister married older men for $ and as a result she became very selfish + greedy. I’m not as financially stable as she is but yet I give my all. Her daughter, my beautiful niece, has been staying with me until her apartment is ready + the thought to charge her rent never crossed my mind, even though she’s charged my father for staying with her for two weeks, she charged my parents for three months for staying before relocating to Florida $14k + was gonna charge more. The bills she paid in her condo had to be paid regardless of who’s living there. She claims that if she won the lottery, she wouldn’t give any of us a red penny. Yet she expects us to do for her. My mother + I never say anything to her because we’re afraid of losing her. I think that by us defending ourselves she will drop us. If that’s the case, is it even a relationship? Of course not. We give + give to my sister + children (all grown) yet my sister treats us poorly. I’ve given gifts for Christmas + birthdays to my own financial detriment - she expected it + never validated us. My niece is following in her footsteps. It’s very tense. Tonight’s her last night here + I won’t even be invited to help her move tomorrow. I’ve accepted our fate - the reality is that there’s nothing there between myself + my sister. How sad is it that $ is more important than your own family members? It’s important to stay true to yourself. If you’re unhappy, you can’t help anyone else.
Sounds like your sister and niece may be high on the narcissism spectrum.
"Do you have humans??" Is she kidding? Also when you grow up with excellent role models its hard to relate to the conversation.
A senior broadcast journalist on a national news channel in Canada was let go from her position because she let her hair grey naturally. She is a model of grace, professionalism, experience, depth, and beauty as she ages. Disgraceful.
Perhaps women viewers could boycott the station by not “tuning in”.
This is a wonderful talk, thank you to both Mayim and Justine! Everything discussed is full of valuable insight!
The statement cautioning against opting out when faced with something unique about ourselves reminds me of something I heard Arnold Schwarzenegger talk about. When he was starting out as an actor, he was coached extensively in numerous lessons with a multitude of professionals to get rid of his accent. And while he made some progress he was never able to fully get rid of his accent.
The thing is, his unique voice became an asset as was part of how he landed his big roles as Conan the Barbarian and The Terminator.
When I was in my 20s, I recall a male teacher looked at my face and told me I couldn't be an actress because I didn't have the right look. I was shocked, hurt, and angry all in a flash. What a terrible thing to say to a twenty-something young woman aspiring to follow her dream! I knew he was talking about the shape of my nose because I'd been teased enough times about my sorta aquiline nose.
I shot back at the man, "Meryl Streep!"
He grudgingly said, "Well...yeah okay, but you're no Meryl Streep."
"Not yet", I muttered. But it the damage was done. Encounters like that chipped away at my confidence.
It is so valuable to know our fears, know our buttons, and work on becoming bullet proof!
Great episode! Justine's attitude about the aging body is so cool...... but I've always had to have that attitude because I haven't and most likely will never have the money to have plastic surgery lol I'm 53 and here's just a little pic of my llife...... I'm having small talk about our age with lady at a check out.... She says she was from the class of 1995 and I said, "I'm 88" and then she says "Wow! You don't look 88!" LOL Oh well, every line was well earned! ;)
Love this interview.I am 66 years old and happy this is changing for the coming generations. I especially resonate on the uncomfortable clothing!
I wish there were more people like Justine in the world. She sees right through the bullshit of the industry. Just be yourself and screw everyone else!
Gosh! One of your best episodes, Mayim! This felt laid back, but the messages were so impactful. Justine is very present, mindful, and eloquent. I had no idea she was an author, but I’ll seek out her work.
One thing that wasn't mentioned was weight. I have several "invisible illnesses" combined with medications that all cause weight gain. I've also survived cancer twice and so much more. Yet weight seems to be the one thing people are judgmental about... especially fellow Caucasians. Thoughts? (Besides don't worry about what others think)
Tell them to f+ck off and dress cool and be cool.
Great episode. Justine was right when she said fear and faith can’t live in the same space. And, truth be told - sometimes I push my own buttons and I’m working on correcting that. Peace.❤
Actually she was recommending faith to fix your fear but is that what you should base your faith on?
Please please more. More women talking to other women. Not about fashion or men or their own celebrity. Grounded supportive conversation
I love when Justine says that each time we overcome the judgement of others, we are creating an opportunity to Become. Become bold, unique, strong, impervious. Ultimately, to become more of who we truly are.
34 and I feel all of this.. the US culture around beauty, is toxic... my boss when I was 19, she was 24 getting botox.... I don't wear make up, and I don't own a mirror... because I spent soo much time being obsessed with beauty. Being grateful for the function of our bodies, is more important than "beauuuuty".
I am reading all these comments, and I Am wondering how some of these women seem just to accept doing nothing to at least ,keep your self vibrant and fashionable, You don't need PLASTIC SURGERY TO look good,You can exercise, you can watch what you eat, wear nice comfortable clothes, you can get a nice haircut, even if you are gray, it have young women who bleach their hair white, You can get Sun Blocks, and moisturizers for your skin, You have one life, one you, just like a garden , you have to take care of yourselves, I live in the Caribbean, a d I can tell you, you can age gracefully, and look damn good, EVERYTHING NEEDS MENTAINANCE , YOUR CARS, YOUR HOMES, AND YOU.
@@patriciajones6771 Well said and thank you. I think Justine early on in the interview mentioned briefly about makeup and jewelry is fine if it's more about your style and not done because of insecurity. I love what you posted.
I am so proud that I lived long enough to have grey hairs, granny arms, and wrinkles. Too many things could have taken me out. I do not wish people a "Happy Birthday". I congratulate them for making it to the next year with a "You made it! Keep that up!"
OK, but we all die eventually, and it isn't a failure. We are mortal. And that's OK. We can't "keep it up" forever!
Im 62 and felt the conversation in my core. I would never have plastic surgery, but I can use the hell out of lotions..... Just the day to day things that older women experience day to day needs to talked about more. more often than not, we are embarrassed by the changes because we are not aware that they happen to everyone. Simply because no-one talks about it. Thank you for being that person.
So so very beautiful and looks like a normal person, like a real life person! Family Ties was such a good show.
I am 46. I have been coloring my gray hair since I was in my early 20’s because I was ashamed at getting older. The grays terrified me. I am now forcing myself to grow out my gray hair. Yes. Forcing. I am forcing myself to accept who I am. And it is HARD. The things people (usually women) say to me about my gray hair sucks the oxygen out of me sometimes. So rude. I’ve heard “you were so pretty though. Why are you letting yourself go”. So my gray hair is an F U to that culture. I can’t stop time but I can stop pretending I can be 20 forever.
Those comments say so much about that person.
The transitional phase may be a bit awkward, but once the grays are all out and you get a good cut, you'll be rockin'
Why is it people connect Gray hair with being old, I had a brother who was Grey in his twenties, he looked great had all the ladies, but life is so strange, he did not live to get old, he died at 35, from Pancreatic Cancer. THEN there was the Actor RICHARD GERE, he looked magnificent with gray hair. I have seen women with Grey hair who look fantastic, and fashionable. So I don't necessarily connect it with being old.
The irony is that there’s young 20somethings out there coloring their hair gray. So gray hair is okay if you’re 21? Lol it makes no sense.
Anyone who says your natural hair color (that happens to be gray) is the same thing as "letting yourself go" is automatically dismissed.
TERRIFIC EPISODE! 👏🏻👏🏻How I’ve enjoyed the clever convo between these two articulate, intelligent and funny women about one of the hidden Mental Health diseases of our western culture: the necessity to look Forever Young and the perverted use of plastic surgery as a drug to overcome irrational fears.
Queen Justine ❤ (with queen Mayim). Yes, it sure is. Can’t wait to listen.
Turned 60yo this year and the awareness of the 'invisibility' of older women is real and shocking. When I transitioned at 59 to a male passing FTM non binary the sudden difference in treatment by society when my beard grew in was/is sad and disgusting. All of a sudden I had 20-30 yo women flirt with me and sales clerks see me.
Are you older male or older female or older they?? I actually don’t get your comment. Not been ignorant but unsure who they were flirting with and if invisible in what “chosen” gender
But now you can see these young women are playing their tribal role, to be accepted by a 'provider' so they can be safe and belong. It's weird I know.
Wow that really proves it. Sad and enraging to hear as a female. Maybe I'll just transition myself - probably a bad joke but better than being freaking invisible and totally disrespected. No wonder my mom gets such crap treatment in every avenue of her life.
The way I am spoken to! As if I’ve lost all my marbles or I’m 4. People don’t even realize they talk that way.
@@darnitthelma4247 Hi, no problem, technically I am an older cis female who is a FTM who has had hormone therapy that allows me to present as male with a beard in the world.
Omg! Justine Bateman's thoughts around self talk sound a lot like my mom's! So neat. Such wisdom.
The conversation at 50:58 really hit me. Mayim was expected to change her face to look better in their lighting setting-up, there was no conversation about changing the lighting/make-up/glasses to solve the 'problem'.
I wonder how much would change if we started adapting to bodies instead of expecting body's to adapt
This is such an interesting episode with Justine Bateman. I remember her from her days in ''Family Ties". Her brother Jason Bateman is an actor. The conversations that you have in this podcast are really enjoyable. Keep up the great work and much love Mayim! ❤
LOVED this interview and the interaction between you two. Mayim, I am just a fan, admirer of you as a human being and the light you bring to this planet. I wish you could see yourself through my eyes. I would list all the things that are physically beautiful about you, but that would be placing value and emphasis on your external being, of which none of us had any control over. What you exude is humility, compassion, an exemplary way of explaining without being condescending and on and on. These carry a much higher currency. Be kind to yourself. (I have to tell myself that every day).
Interesting conversation 👍 I recently called SAG/AFTRA to see if I could pay membership because I became eligible back in 2008 and I was finally able to move forward. I called the LA office and the woman on the phone was going on and on how it was SUCH A LONG TIME AGO, and how OLD the file was, she said this file is SOOO OLD it had to be stored on microfiche. She said really loud” DO YOU KNOW WHAT MICROFICHE IS??? That’s how old it is, it’s sooo old.” That was before the merger it’s soo old! If they’re not telling you you look old, they’ll go out of their way to make you feel odd or strange for living long enough and I’m not even 50 yet 😂
I felt so alone in my ways before this episode. I don't wear makeup, don't fuss with designer stuff, and haven't dyed my hair in decades. I get compliments on my hair all the time. It's alot of extra work (in my opinion:)) to have the right makeup, the right hair colour, etc.
Justine didn’t sell out her soul and I love her for that. I’m 56 and shine my Light instead of obsessing on looks. Authenticity is the new Beautiful 😍
Coincidentally, I am currently reading Justine’s Face book. It’s extremely eye opening. Really enjoyed this interview and Justine’s wisdom. I concur with everything she said here. I hope she continues to speak out on this topic. The goal of becoming trigger proof is definitely on my list. I’ve been looking for more purpose. Thank you for this.
I love Justine's point about natural faces pulling the audience closer. It's absolutely true. At some point you can't relate to a person that has an appearance that is so unattainable, it makes the film seem more like fantasy.
This message is so important and so good to see another person speaking up on this. Thanks! & PLEASE continue to have CC Close Captions available to those of us who need them to listen/understand. Whether Deaf, HoH, or have Auditory Processing Disorder, or have ASD, &/or more; it's integral to be part of the learning, discussion, awareness, & raising our frequency. Thanks!
and yes, "removed ourselves because of All of Thiss" And yess didn't wanna wear those pants!
thank you so much for being real and speaking all of these things!!!
Justine Bateman is brilliant. As a woman of age who lived a feminist life, I loved her arrogance. Wish all women could accept her mantle of dismissal of plastic surgery. Women are more tortured than ever.
as a 46yo woman, i had a man older than me say he loved me but couldn't get over my weight gain after 40, how i had aged. he got a 30yo girlfriend. it's things like that that have really injured my ability to accept aging. and kinda hate men at the same time. and feel like i don't have the value i had younger.
Miserable men love to take swipes at women's appearances. Our super power is to not take it personally.
Maybe you're saying it's a him problem, not a you problem! I remember a boyfriend telling me that he would be asking me to marry him except for my weight (I was 24, size 14, 5'3"). For a moment, I was almost hurt. Then I decided NO WAY. I chose to be offended that he thought I was in his league. How had he gotten the impression that I would even possibly have ever been receptive to a proposal from _him_? Eeewww!
I encourage you to plagiarize this attitude.You and your worth are not defined by any number: not your weight, your age, your income, the number of children you have or don't have, etc.
Any man who would say that to your face isn't a catch. When a man like that leaves, it's like the trash taking itself out. Be thankful. BTW, take a look at the whole range of married women. They aren't all beautiful, but someone wanted them.
When Justine says "There's this look" she is absolutely correct. It's so ridiculous now and I can pick out which celebs have had work done because they all look like clones.
My favourite compliment from my daughter when she was little ... "Momma, I love the crinkles near your eyes from smiling. You wouldn't be nearly as pretty if they weren't there." I wasn't even 40 at the time so I know they are even deeper now.
Justine and I are the same age. I love her attitude on aging. I love being in midlife. My 50s have been incredible. Best time in life - so far!
This is such an interesting conversation. I am totally invested. Im 42 and I come across as younger, i get carded a lot for alcohol and even sometimes for scissors and spray paint. I've been considering when to stop dyeing my hair (under the dye i have significant grey) but interestingly im finding it hard to let go of the little ego thing of people thinking im younger than I am. I never got appearance-based attention or compliments when I was younger, and now that I do (just occasionally) I'm recognizing that this feeling of being left out due to not being attractive is massively unhealed. No idea what to do with that, but there it is.
Loved, loved, loved this and your podcast! Justine was my ideal when I was a teenager and she still is. I love that this is what a cool, newly 58 year old face looks like. It's scathingly brilliant! And, Mayim, you feel so much like a friend to me after watching your podcasts. Thanks so much for doing them and being you! 😊
Wonderful! Powerful! Also, a good time. Feels great to go deeper in conversation on this topic. More, more, more, please. I wish there were a podcast with Mayim Bialik, Justine Bateman and Julia Louis-Dreyfus with a new guest each week to explore this and other topics. As for me, I am letting my 59 year old light shine. I want those wrinkles to beam with a life well lived. It doesn’t happen everyday, but the more, the better. Conversations like this are awesome. Thanks!
Two favorites from childhood at the same time. The algorithm got something right. ❤
When Mayim mentioned “all-American” looks of the late 80s. I felt that. I did some modeling in my teens and early 20s in the late eighties through the late nineties. Almost universally someone had to comment about my “exotic” “Slavic” or “different” look.
There were moments where I embraced it because I learned to sense when it was a compliment versus someone fetishizing or making a left handed compliment.
Although, now at nearly 50 I stopped caring and accepted my crone status 😂.
I grew up in the 80s watching Justine and Jason and loved them both. Huge crush on him and in awe of how pretty she was. Her attitude is fabulous, along with her intelligence (emotional and otherwise), and it seems like she has a very good yoga/pilates practice based upon her physique, which is so great for the mind/body/spirit combo.
I’m floored by how fiercely intelligent Justine Bateman is. Wow. Brilliant.
"That's what a cool arm looks like" and "That's what a cool face looks like". LOVED THAT PART.
This was an amazing and helpful conversation! Thank you!