The son isn’t a literal embodiment of the dark side, he is a metaphorical embodiment. He’s just a mortal who consumed from a force nexus albeit still far more powerful than any Sith in legends.
@@jasonmillsom2981 The fandom is toxic because they've been trolled by George Lucas and now by Disney for decades until their bitterness became a part of the community. You can be mad at them for being this way, but you can only blame those who keep ruining Star Wars, and yes, even George has had his hand in ruining Star Wars.
See, this is why Dave Filoni is the only person part of Lucasfilm that I trust with the Star Wars IP. If I hear Dave Filoni is working on a Star Wars related project, I’ll feel a bit of relief.
He did the voice for Starkiller in "The Force Unleashed" games, he also did the voice for The Emperor in "The Force Unleashed" and also voiced the Emperor in an episode of "Star Wars Rebels" in the episode called "Empire Day" where you can hear his voice being played through speakers in the background. He also did the voice for Darth Maul in the Clone Wars and Rebels TV shows.
Revan: "You're the physical manifestation of the dark side itself and you still need me to tell you what to do. This kind of shit is why I went back to being a Grey Jedi."
@@dylandarnell3657 grey jedi aren't a thing you moron. You're either light or dark. There's nothing in canon that even explores what the concept even is.
I kinda agree with Lucas. While Revan and Bane are indeed powerful, I doubt they would be on the right level to command the very incarnation of the Dark Side, especially considering Revan was redeemed in the end. I'd have personally had Darth Nihilus instead talking to him. Darth Nihilus is a wound in the Force, so he would have the right status to command The Son. Maybe even have The Son wear his mask. Revan, maybe he could have made it in the show too, but definetly not commanding The Son. I'd rather have had Revan try to guide Anakin closer to his actual role, not just focusing on the Light Side like the Jedi of the time do, but on bringing balance to the Force. It would suit Revan's role, Revan did use the Light Side and Dark Side in tandem a lot.
I would like to see Valkorion commanding son. He lived thousand years and have got great exprerince manipulating others. Furthermore it would be easier to explain how can he communicate with son.
Your statement is a little dumb. When Revan was nerfed, so was Nihlus. He wasn't a wound in the force at this point in the EU. And before he was nerfed, both Revan and Bane were far more powerful than Nihlus was, and could destroy him easily. Bane, according to Sidious, is the most powerful Sith to have ever lived.
I actually agree with George here. Putting Revan and Bane in there would have been pure fan service and it would have come at the expense of continuity and what was already established.
Plus it makes absolutely no sense here This is the equivalent of Satan bowing to Anton LaVey begging him why me Like... it’s just not right as a concept. Why is the Son bowing and seemingly serving Sith Lords? It would be just as offputting seeing the Daughter bow to Qui Gon. These are gods, Palpatine said so himself. Thematically this is all off, regardless of whether or not it’s Bane and Revan
Its true. Even in the old eu material the only way you had Sith force ghosts was basically their spirit being tethered to some physical object in the real world. Weather its a tablet, talisman, a holocron or even a sarcophagus
Have to say, I agree. Much as I like Revan and Bane, this scene doesn't make much sense in the context that you have two Sith Lords (one of who was redeemed) berating the living embodiment of the Dark Side. Shouldn't it be the other way around? Or the Son using these Sith Lords to sway Anakin. On the other hand, hasn't Darth Bane always been canon, as the origin point of the Rule of Two? He's not brought up a lot, but him founding the current line of Sith Lords has pretty much been canon from the start.
yeah bane ends up showing up in clone wars anyways, just not in his orbalisk armor. revan is yet to be properly canonized but his name was in the behind the scenes of tros apparently
No one follows the rule of two tbh, Dooku, Ventress , Maul , Palpatine , Mauls brother, Grevious on weekends , and possibly Jar Jar, all existed at the same point of time.
TBH I'm actually glad they took it out. It doesn't make sense to have two Dark Lords basically telling the Son who is basically one of the Gods of the force what to do. It's iffy. I get he is trying to submerse himself into the Dark Side, but is he basically embodied in it. NOW if Revan was talking to Anakin, THAT would be epic
TK4037 Revan was canonically male (canon as in the game's own canon that is, before anyone jumps down my throat). The main character in the sequel was officially female. ✌️
Jedi fallen to the Sith, redeemed himself and then went off to hunt down the Emperor by himself. Depending on how you view it though, he was never really Sith, or Jedi, he knew he had to fall in order to defeat the Emperor. But if you follow the SWTOR story his soul basically split into two different entities after being captured and tortured by Vitiate (The Emperor at that time), one was dark the other light. If it sounds dumb that would be because it is. Completely butchered Revan's story and went against everything he was. I recommend the KOTOR games and then the books, disregard SWTORs fuck up, technically none of it is canon so you can believe what you want.
This is why he should've been in charge of the new trilogy. Not only does he have an extremely deep understanding of the EU/legends and the fan base but he cares deeply about the IP and understands the rules of it and that even the smallest scene can change the way the entire IP works.
@@andreiefectivuatafac1966 which for the most part I agree with but that being said there are some diamonds in the rough in the EU that are loved by the fan base and make a more colorful, three dimensional IP. Feloni made great use of a lot of them in Clone Wars, Rebels, and The Mandelorian but didn't overly rely on them to the point where you have to have read 5 novelizations, 17 comic books, the backs of three series of collectable trading cards, and 100% completed an obscure floppy disk PC game from 1992 just to follow the plot of one episode.
His dark side spirit was so powerful he resurrected himself... pretty sure by the time revan actually died both his light side and dark side split from him and his light side went to the force while his dark side lived on in some other way. Sooo technically his dark spirit could be the ancient sith lord.
@@Slim2Flo At the end of Shadow of Revan, he was made whole again. Recently, Revan’s ghost showed up to help the player character kill the Emperor (of that time period). So we are actually down to one Revan and he finally found peace enough to become one with Force.
@@lllxxxxx He actually got a good send off in that game. He and all the other people the Emperor betrayed, manipulated, and murdered showed up as ghosts and cut the Emperor out of the Force like a parasite. He aged to dust and Revan finally got his lasting victory and became one with the Force.
It’s comforting to know that these characters aren’t being forgotten and even to this day are being considered for new media. How awesome would a Revan show or movie be?👍👍👍
Ofc. we would love to see the Old Republic (finally something new for the movies instead of the same bs about Skywalkers over and over again while completely cancelling Luke - yeah thats basically Disney in a nutshell) possibly even a whole trilogy of it but we (fans) are too afraid that Disney would butcher it with social politics. Just imagine Revan being race swapped and Bastille becoming the main character...Yeah as ridiculous as it sounds - It would be very possible to happen, sadly.
He also voices Maul in clone wars and rebels. He's also had live acting roles, playing Aiden the vampire in syfys Being Human, and Mr. Hyde in Once upon a Time.
Wait What? Aren't the father, son, & daughter supposed to be ancient mystical beings of the force? Looks like this scene should be the other way around.
Yes this is what I thought. Totally opposite. There is no sense. Father, Daughter and Son are Celestial. Far more powerful than Bane and Revan and older. There was a Mother too, which was mortal but become Abeloth. I hope George figure that and removed Bane and Revan
bane was always canon. He is mentioned in the novelization of Ep 1 The Phantom Menace as being the founder of the rule of two. Drew Karpshyn's bane trilogy was based off of this, and told the full story of bane in the old EU, but originally Lucas created bane in the planning of episode 1. While it didn't make it into the movie, the novelizations of the movies have always been true canon.
There's rumours disney want to make another prequel trilogy (before the phantom menace) I'm hoping we will see bane and revan or plaguis in those films
Jamie MacMillan if it isn't dark, it best not be done. The Old Republic is known for being gritty and dark, more so than any of the movies. It's what I love most about it, and since Disney hasn't made any movies before The Phantom Menace, I personally consider everything in the Old Republic era still canon, since nothing has overwritten it; yet.
Bad Badger yeah, I get that mindset. Personally I see no reason why Disney couldn't allow it to be dark whilst keeping it a 12A rating (sorry don't know the American equivalent) The people that made Dark Tower pulled it off (and unlike many I enjoyed that movie) and the same goes for the woman in black. If they can get a director to study how movies like the two mentioned stayed dark whilst being child friendly enough that kids can go so long as they're with their parents I see no reason why Disney can't pull it off
Even as a massive fan of Revan, I agree that this scene didn't belong. Watching this felt more as if the writers/producers had just plucked 2 random sith from the EU and dropped them in. Although having joined the dark side, Revan was never really interested in being as "Evil" as he seems in this scene, caring little about the overall success of the dark side and simply using it as a means to an end. His goal of destroying the Jedi order wasn't done out of serving the dark side, but because he saw the order as evil in itself, similar to how Anakin came to believe the order was broken. Furthermore, the CANON ending of KOTOR has Revan returning to the light side of the force, so having him depicted here as a sith is a little confusing. Just my two cents on this scene.
Eh, the fan service would have been great, but I agree that this scene doesn't work. As powerful as Darth Bane and Revan are, I am pretty sure that The Son is supposed to be the darkside personified, so having them talk down to him feels...weird.
The Celestials were defeated by "mere mortals" that wielded the Dark Side of the Force. The Celestials may have been instruments of the Force, imbued with great power, but they were no masters of its power. Revan and Bane studied and refined their control. Whereas the Son is truly like an overgrown child.
The Son was the personification of the dark side. His connection to the Force existed on a level beyond the domain of any Sith and Jedi. Revan and Bane are no match.
Khalil Mason The celestials were only defeated by the chosen one, and only because he briefly tapped into his full potential. Revan and Malek have nothing on that. It’s not even a competition.
But man, Revan is my dude. SWTOR Showed his death, so having him here would kinda be awkward. He is now a being of the force, beyond the fight between light and dark, so technically he'd just be like: "Well, the Jedi have good Morals, but the sith have good plans..."
Griffin Long shame how George didn't care enough to keep continuity with episodes 6 and 3, Leia remembering her mother even though she died in childbirth...
"Do you remember your mother, your real mother?" Luke knows shes adopted, and its assumed she knows aswell, otherwise why didn't Leia question Luke on that?
True... but let's be honest, here, Revan WOULDN'T be commanding the Son to do horrible acts to ensure Skywalker was under the control of the Dark Side, not after all he's been through. Darth Bane would, but it doesn't fit into the hierarchy of the Force. What power would Bane have to command he who is practically the Dark Side *incarnate*?
Revan is as much a Sith as Luke Skywalker is. The entire reason he became Darth Revan was to destroy the Sith and save the Republic. He didn't even change his name, he just threw DARTH onto the beginning when he "fell" because that way he'd look legit. You wanna know why he wrote the Rule of Two? Because it's a lot easier to kill two angry Sith then 11 bajillion angry Sith. Revan was a master of the long game (which makes sense once you learn who his master was). The problem I have with this scene is that he's clearly full-on Sith here. How does one kill the Sith by murdering the physical embodiment of the Light Side, who is also Palutena from Kid Icarus?
"Darth Revan" "Uber-evil" Wat. Revan was the only sith lord I know of to turn away from the dark side entirely. Giving him this role kinda ruins everything that made Revan so great and reduces him to just another boring sith. Even Traya would jave been a better option. O.o
@@troller8680 I mean... In the comics he came back and aided the jedi outcast (I always forget what the fuck the canon name for KotOR II's MC was). They may not have been jedi proper, but there are plenty of "grey jedi" who weren't dark side, even a few who used dark side powers but resisted being consumed.
Having Darth Bane and Darth Reven above the Son never made sense anyway. The Father, Son, and Daughter were Celestials...essentially gods in the Star Wars universe. It makes no sense to have two mortal Sith Lords as being a god's mentor. If anything, they would have been students of the Son, so removing the scene was, as mentioned, absolutely the right thing to do.
CHEESE BURGER FREDDY That was my point. As depicted in the storyboard layout, he was behaving as their apprentice. Since as a "god" he should be above them, I agreed with removing it from the show.
then again that happens in swtor which isnt canon... and i think IF they bring revan back somehow it will be similar to thrawns return that his story gets somewhat reshaped from what it originally was
Yeah, some people said Holocrons would be better. Revan can remain canonically Light Side, but his Dark Side holocron can influence his successors and it also navigates past having to have them be able to be force ghosts.
Swtor was canon before Disney took over though. And part of the KOTOR saga in the form of Malachor V was confirmed canon in Rebels, so the rest of it could possibly be as well.
This just doesn't make sense no matter what game or book is or isn't canon Bioware might bastardize and mistreat his character time and again, but to their credit there is no stopping point at any part of the series where Revan was pure dark side, and them making him just yet another morally black saturday morning cartoon villain like he was in the original backstory of KOTOR would defeat the point of even including him It would be like if Disney brought back Darth Vader in the new trilogy and had him urge Kylo to kill some younglings or something, it would be nothing more than nonsensical plothole-filled fan service
Technically incorrect. Lucas determined what was and was not Canon until Disney took it over, and he himself said he didn't consider anything canon other than the movies. So even though people complained about Disney "Making everything else not canon", technically they never were. They could just be seen as alternate timelines.
But the issue with Revan is that because he was a blank slate MC from the KOTOR games. He's kind of a pick your own path character, he's whole identity was based on the players' choices.
Yeah, and that's why it was kind of a letdown how they potrayed him in SWTOR for some, but for me at least it worked for the most part, until they totally ruined him in Shadow Of Revan, and if they did this, they would just make things worse.
@@justnoel4088 honestly I think the canon star wars is all fucked up because they are to afraid to explore the old republic, there are only movies and tv shows set during the clone wars and empire vs rebels and then that awful era where rey sue is running around and that's about it
@@0Stalk0 lol just stop talking as I’m completely right here as Filoni DOES care about it as he’s just as much as any other Star Wars fan does but as one of the makers of it, he has to decide and consider considerably on what can stay and what can’t as they expanded universe had too many stories in them that obviously can’t all be canon at all. This should extremely obvious, back off with your nonsense as this “yOu cAnT bE sErIoUs” just makes you look really bad here.
@@Gadget-Walkmen Dave felony doesn't care about the EU,why else would he retcon nearly half of them with his own ideas???,also I'm sorry but i did not understand a single thing you said
@@annieandelsieofarendelle3294 what was? This sequence? No this is the ACTUAL force ghost of Darth Revan actually talking to someone. And that’s the whole problem of the scene and why it was taken out as sith can’t come back as force ghosts.
I wish I had been in that room with George Lucas. I could so easily explain why Revan should have been brought into canon. Now, I would have restructured the scene to involve Revan interacting with Anakin and discussing balance in the Force rather than having a Darth Revan incarnation arise with Bane to speak to the Son. Bane was used later near the end of the cartoon, anyway, so a version of him is canon. I would have loved to explain how Revan could have tried to steer Anakin in the direction of balance between light and dark, only to have Anakin's inner turmoil boil over and destroy anything that could have been. I would have tied the legend of the Chosen One directly to Revan's story, mostly having Revan state how close he came to being the Chosen One, but how it was ultimately not his destiny. He would warn Anakin not to make similar mistakes, that emperors have a way of twisting your perceptions and making you do terrible things. Revan would teach Anakin how to resist, and it would stem from a place of love. Only through love could Anakin bring balance to the Force. He would forget the lesson as if the experience had been a distant dream, but it would be the case that the love Anakin had for his son overwhelmed the Emperor's control over him.
I agree with leaving this out. The Son is supposed to be an avatar; a physical manifestation of the Dark Side itself. However, I do like the idea of ancient Sith Lords making an appearance. Ever since we saw Darth Krayt in the EU seek the wisdom of Darth Andeddu, Darth Bane and Darth Nihilus via their holocrons. It'd be cool to see this in Star Wars Theory's Vader series; Vader meditating and, seeking knowledge that he knows Sidious is keeping from him, listens to the holocrons of Darths Bane, Revan, Nihilus, Malgus and Plagueis; all standing around him in a circle as he focuses on regaining his power.
It actually does make sense. Remember, the dark side itself is a natural part of the force. It is the Sith, consumed by the dark side, who forcibly manipulate it and disrupt the balance in the force. A true Jedi like Luke is supposed to follow the will of the Force, i.e the balance of light and dark. So for these Sith lords to be influencing the Son like this and essentially disrupting the Balance the Mortis Gods represent is spot on. The Son is not inherently evil, he represents the natural parts of the dark side and how the Sith can manipulate and let it consume them.
Even as a villain, Darth Revan (pre K.O.T.O.R.1) was only a villain so he can destroy and rebuild and make the Republic stronger to face a greater evil. Always good in heart but was very grey, my belief at least on the character.
Dave Filoni should’ve made and directed the sequels. He’s a true Star Wars fan that knows what he’s doing and knows how to direct and come up with stories.
@@fynnoleianson8802 Yes he did . In the Rise of Skywalker Encyclopedia book, it was revealed that the Final Order Fleet had different regions named after Sith Lords . Sith Lords like : Ajunta Paal, Andeddu, Darth Tenebrous and Darth Revan .
I actually do understand why they took this out, because even though it looks cool and does make some sense with the Daughter having the Father as like her light side master and Revan and Bane being like the dark side masters to the Brother, it goes against the thought of Sith can't become force ghosts because to become one you have to be totally calm and at peace with yourself and those in your life at one time or another and that goes against how the Sith work.
they could have gotten rid of Bane and save him for season 6 while Revan could have been kept but appear as Jedi Force Ghost to Anakin and tell him that he is the Chosen One and that love is the key to defeating the Sith since it was his love Luke that made Vader kill Sidious
Well when we look at the old republic, there are sith force ghost like Kallig and Darth Marr (You can count Valkorion as well but his case is different he just got a new body everytime he died).
Kudos to George for making the decision not to go through with this, and much respect to Dave Filoni and the rest of the writing team for understanding that it isn't about what the fans think would be cool to see, its about the greater concept of the Force and staying true to what George Lucas vision of that is.
As much as i love those characters im glad they where cut especially revan i fell like the redeeming of his character really excludes him as someone who would be that deeply embedded in the dark side
"He who controls Skywalker, controls everything" *looks at sequel trilogy realizing that, that "he" is actually palpatine who's been controlling anakin since episode 1 to 6 and now kylo*
He being Palpatine makes Palpatine honestly so badass. He had Anakin, Luke, Han and Leia dead and he was basically a Sithari God in TROS. He just had to bust a nut sometime in the past and have his granddaughter kill him.
This scene gives so much character to the Son. It explains why they kept saying the son had fallen to the dark side, he wasn't always a darksider. The Daughter says his nature is selfish, which is probably true. I can imgaine the Daughter embracing the light, as it goes with her selfless nature and the Son driven by the desire to fulfill the idea of them as opposites, seeking out an artifact of the dark side to allow him to commune with some of the most power sith lords that have existed (he could have been doing this for hundreds of years biding his time. Although I think Nilihus should have replaced Revan). And with the new world between worlds, the Son could have been using this power to speak with them before they died, removing George's problem. That's the part that's canon in my heart. Because a god of the dark side, would be the most mortal.
I personally think that would be cool is that revan existed in a sort of dual existence like a dual personality. He has his dark side and his light aside version. And occasionally combining into one. He could be talking to Anakin. And even guide others. It be cool
Yeah if sith found a way to immortalize themselves in the force it would kind of defeat the whole purpose of them. Why would they constantly be on a power hungry quest to dominate the galaxy and become immortal if they already figured out how to do it millennia ago. They could use dark side magic to leave behind recordings and shades that would essentially be glorified holograms.
sorry for late reply, but Revan was actually a sith lord at some point before the KOTOR game so it could actually make sense. He and Malak worked for Vitiate, but I guess you know that. My point is that he himself was under the influence of the dark side and actually comitted a series of atrocities against the Old Republic. And as you probably know, he did redeem himself by killing Malak. So saying he wasn`t supposed to be a sith lord is partially right and partially wrong. He was named Darth Revan for a reason and I think he was one, if not the only one, to actually go back to the light side of the force after being a sith. Most of what I wrote is basic knowledge about his character, but my point is that it isnt entirely wrong to cast him as a sith. With that being said, I kinda agreed that this scene didnt make sense. But for me it is only because it shouldnt be this scene that introduces viewers for Revan and Bane, that would have to be animated series or even movies instead. I have probably wrote something wrong here because it has been years since I last read the novels and played the games.
It's not that a Sith wouldn't want to, it's that they can't. To be a Sith you have to essentially be an atheist while to be a Jedi requires you to be, in effect, a Christian
This is exactly how the top brass should discuss and enforce canon! Yeah, it’s cool, yeah we want it, but it doesn’t fit so we go without for the greater good.
My biggest problem with that would have been: Why the hell is the Son taking orders from Bane and Revan? He's the literal physical manifestation of the Dark Side of the Force. He's so far above every Sith that has ever lived that it would be like if Zeus was taking orders from a slave or something. Like it just doesn't make any sense. I would love to see Bane appear before Sidious and talk about the Rule of Two. And I would love to see Revan try to guide Anakin to bring balance to the Force.
I think it's less about power and more about knowledge, skills, and ability. The Son was powerful and old, but has been isolated on Mortis his whole life. Another way to look at it is that Average Joe has a gun and knows how to pull the trigger and load it, but a soldier is a trained expert with it.
I would personally be opposed to this because Darth Revan's story is much more interesting as a redemption arc than a dull "Oh, I was bad? Kay, I'll be bad again" storyline. When it's played as an unwitting redemption and then deciding to stay on the Light Side to work with the friends/crew you've helped and rise above your dark and regretful past...it's really cool and it was my favorite plot point in anything Star Wars.
Y'know I do get why they removed Revan.... but gods dammit that was all we needed! One scene with him and everything KOTOR set up would have been safe from Disney's wrath! Just one!
He wore that cage when he was recording himself in the holocron but of course it doesn't make sense for him to still be wearing it since its not the holocron. Not unless the holocron is connected to Altar of Mortis since both of them are special objects that are forged by the force so they would be connect. Another thing to support this theory is that Revan became a Jedi again and it doesn't make any sense to appear as the Dark lord of the Sith at all. So only the recording of his holocron that went by the Darth title and these two replicates of Darth Raven and Bane are merely the gatekeepers of the holocrons.
I thought he didn't complete the holocron till after his accident where he lost the armour to much rage and incomplete knowledge on how to make one , I could be wrong been a few years since I read them but I have read all 3 twice so far
Even as a huge Revan fan, this was ultimately the right call by George. Why would the son, the face and incarnation of the dark side, be crying and doing the bidding of two sith lords? It doesn’t make sense, even though it would’ve been awesome seeing revan and bane canonized.
They ruined Revan in the book Star Wars The Old Republic: Revan! They made him into a whiny, weak little bitch. To preserve my love for Revan I just pretend that book never existed.
_̸̲̅-̸̲̅*̸̲̅S̷A̷M̷U̷R̷A̷I̷ 2̷2̷*̸̲̅-̸̲̅_̸̲̅ The scene makes perfect sense. Revan was a Sith Lord before the start of KOTOR regardless of whether you redeemed him or not. Revan recorded himself in holocrons in the Darth Bane books and having his evil force ghost remain isn't much of a stretch with all the knowledge he had of Sith rituals.
the son is like a force god much more powerful than revan or bane so why are they ordering him around. and revan went back to the light side so it makes no sense
Infamous Void because lucas had already given Dark horse the permission for Darth Banes story which was 2 years before the video game came out. Soon as the game was out the changed the storyline. Darth Bane was his real name, he created the rule of 2 and passed his name to his successor. He recreated the sith order. Then kotor came out and they made it as if the name Darth was passed down to high ranking or powerfull sith. Bane was named after Darth addendu as an honor. Only the sith'ari carried it which was bane. The game changed alot of the sith history because fans kept glorifying Revan. Only few whom read those dark horse books jedi vs sith know. But now u cant find that story. But if you look up the date of releases for both you will notice the difference, they made banes trilogy and added that he found revans holocron. Fan boy crap.
Well in the time that transcured SOLO Moul stilled alive before the season 3 of Rebels, appart the time lapse of TCW to Rebels. meanwhile, specifique Revan (becouse Bane still cannon), was redeemed in Knights of the old republic, so see it like a Ghost of the Dark Side doesn't fit very well
I personally would have Revan to appear in Canon, but not in this way. It just doesn't make sense. The Son is the literal embodiment of the Dark Side, so it makes no sense that any Sith Lord, however strong, would be looking down upon The Son and teaching him of the Dark Side. I mean, he (The Son) IS the Dark Side. Literally. Bane is already in Canon, so he could have been left out of the episode. Instead, Revan should have been on Mortis giving Anakin some words on balance between the Light and the Dark, as per his own philosophy. I mean, future Ahsoka and Qui Gon Jinn were both on Mortis so why not Revan too? Dammit Lucas. Don't deny Revan in Canon again next time!
Actually The Son would have been alive before Darth Revan and Darth Bane. The Son is a Celestial that existed before the Sith. He is also the very personification of the Dark side. Glad they took it out, it would have not made any sense.
Why not simply have them as holocrons? Feels like that would make more sense, especially since Revan turned good, and the holocron could have been made before that happened. So no need to retcon.
@@vonderfaak6357 but he's right how would the Sith Holocron get there? nothing else on the planet was from the outside universe. Did you even watch the episode?
Well Revan is canon again, at least we’re halfway there 😂 awesome to see that they were both originally gonna appear in TCW though, and it makes total sense why the scene was cut
The only problem I have with this is that Bane is in the void, he wouldn't be able to communicate with the son. Unless of course he's using holocrons than it would be possible. EDIT: Bane destroyed Revan's holocron so he couldn't be using them to communicate.
yeaboi55 In the book Dynasty of Evil, Bane explains that holocrons are either operated by the gatekeeper, or by the Sith's actual spirit. In the case of the Andeddu holocron, it was a gatekeeper. And for his own holocron, it was also a gatekeeper - he had to make an artificial image of himself in his orbalisk armor to safeguard against Jedi discovery. And like you said, Bane's spirit is trapped in the void forever.
Darth Bane and Darth Reven need to be cannon. The are both very great Sith. Bane made his own holocrom. Reven was instrumental in Kotor 1 and 2. Lucas should have kept the sceen. Remember The Story of Darth Plagueis The Wise. "Darth Plagueis" was a Dark Lord of the Sith so powerful and so wise, he could use the Force to influence the midi-chlorians to create life. So Lucas pulled the sceen which would have brought more to the story of the dark side. My thoughts.
Member Berries definitely. These two are insane. He operates on another level of existance than those two, he could've just closed their lightsabers and i'm pretty sure that his Force abilities would outmatch them in basically every way considering that he is literally on another level, you know, because he is a creature that can quote "manipulate The Force like no other'
Luissv72 Here's a quick summary of Bane for you: www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/2okc1i/respect_darth_bane/ They have sources there in the annotations of quotes as well, it's all legit. Also a note: Anakin in his current state of when he fights the son would get raped by Bane and Revan. So they'd definitely be able to beat the son
Klaw Schafer I hope you're joking. How is bane and revan stronger? The son force power is 6 times of eu grand master luke sky walked. Grand ,after like sky walker would absolute shit on both bane and revan. Fact
3:40 I love how seriously George takes the Force. Yes it's fictional, but within that fictional universe there are rules that the creator of that universe establishes and those rules should be followed. He did his best to make sure his overall view of the force was consistent. Disney doesn't understand this obviously because now a Jedi like Rey can be super powerful with no training and their explanation for it is because the Force "awakened" in her or because "the force is female." Those are just excuses for lazy writing.
vargen1414 Except nothing in Star Wars lore says that midichlorians behave like mitochondria. Midichlorians are organelles but that doesn't mean they are mitochondria. Besides even if they did behave like mitochondria, that is only talking about how they are passed on to offspring. The fact that men still would have midichlorians means the force would still be gender neutral. Also, do you really think that's what the people who made or wore the shirts were thinking about when they did so?
![Star Wars: The Clone Wars - Yoda & Darth Bane's ghost [1080p]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/mdSw1LqpU_s/mqdefault.jpg)
![Star Wars: The Clone Wars - Yoda & Darth Bane's ghost [1080p]](/img/tr.png)
![PASULOL รามเกียรติ์ ตอนที่ 4 นนทกพบรัก [Ramakien Ep.4: Nonthok in love]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/tMUQgmZzf_A/mqdefault.jpg)
Darth Revan and Darth Bane standing above the son T posing menacingly
The Son *sobs in fear*
@Trump the son is the embodiment of the dark side ofc it should be him
They've asserted dominance
Right? Lmao. Revan wouldn’t even be a dark force ghost.
The son isn’t a literal embodiment of the dark side, he is a metaphorical embodiment. He’s just a mortal who consumed from a force nexus albeit still far more powerful than any Sith in legends.
He's just standing there.... MENACINGLY!!
This close to having Darth Revan canon!
exactly
obi-wan kenobi does george even control anything at this point
If revan was canon then vitiate/valkorion would also have had to be canon. Then pretty much all of the old republic would have become canon.
we're this close to the verge of greatness
Jarls Terra yep it would have been awesome
Dave Filoni: *doesn't bring Revan back to Canon in other form or scene*
the Entire Fandom: We were on the verge of greatness. We were this close.
To be fair the fandom is kinda toxic for me, but in this case they are right
Well, at least the Jedi Crusaders are canon. So, there's hope!
@@jasonmillsom2981 The fandom is toxic because they've been trolled by George Lucas and now by Disney for decades until their bitterness became a part of the community. You can be mad at them for being this way, but you can only blame those who keep ruining Star Wars, and yes, even George has had his hand in ruining Star Wars.
At least we got a scene of Jar Jar making out with his girlfriend (why Dave Filoni, whyy)
Disney just made him cannon
I love how much reverence Filoni has for Lucas
The master and the apprentice.
Always 2, there are, a Master and an Apprentice
No more, no less
Like I have been saying
Lucas: Yoda
Filoni: Luke
See, this is why Dave Filoni is the only person part of Lucasfilm that I trust with the Star Wars IP. If I hear Dave Filoni is working on a Star Wars related project, I’ll feel a bit of relief.
I'm more amazed at The Son's voice actor. So much emotion in that scene!
Benito 7 Sam Witwer is an awesome va!
He's got some experience in the Star Wars department too!
I believe he played starkiller
He did the voice for Starkiller in "The Force Unleashed" games, he also did the voice for The Emperor in "The Force Unleashed" and also voiced the Emperor in an episode of "Star Wars Rebels" in the episode called "Empire Day" where you can hear his voice being played through speakers in the background. He also did the voice for Darth Maul in the Clone Wars and Rebels TV shows.
I like this guy. Dark lord of the sith, the Son of Mordis, the EMPEROR!
Revan: "You're the physical manifestation of the dark side itself and you still need me to tell you what to do. This kind of shit is why I went back to being a Grey Jedi."
😂😂
and that's why the idea sucks
Grey jedi aren't a thing
@@KingShibe They are if your canon isn't stupid.
@@dylandarnell3657 grey jedi aren't a thing you moron. You're either light or dark. There's nothing in canon that even explores what the concept even is.
I kinda agree with Lucas. While Revan and Bane are indeed powerful, I doubt they would be on the right level to command the very incarnation of the Dark Side, especially considering Revan was redeemed in the end. I'd have personally had Darth Nihilus instead talking to him. Darth Nihilus is a wound in the Force, so he would have the right status to command The Son. Maybe even have The Son wear his mask. Revan, maybe he could have made it in the show too, but definetly not commanding The Son. I'd rather have had Revan try to guide Anakin closer to his actual role, not just focusing on the Light Side like the Jedi of the time do, but on bringing balance to the Force. It would suit Revan's role, Revan did use the Light Side and Dark Side in tandem a lot.
I would like to see Valkorion commanding son.
He lived thousand years and have got great exprerince manipulating others.
Furthermore it would be easier to explain how can he communicate with son.
LMFAO Nihilus would get laughed at by The Son. Literally no Sith Lord in existence has the "status" to command The Son.
@Mandalorian Patriot True that true that lol
Your statement is a little dumb. When Revan was nerfed, so was Nihlus. He wasn't a wound in the force at this point in the EU. And before he was nerfed, both Revan and Bane were far more powerful than Nihlus was, and could destroy him easily. Bane, according to Sidious, is the most powerful Sith to have ever lived.
@@SomeGuy-qh6rw How was Revan nerfed? He scales in power to a planet drainer
I actually agree with George here.
Putting Revan and Bane in there would have been pure fan service and it would have come at the expense of continuity and what was already established.
Hmmm reminds me of what Disney did with the Sequel Trilogy...
@@dooglive922 same except one realized that they should ask for George's opinion and realized not to go through with it
Plus it makes absolutely no sense here
This is the equivalent of Satan bowing to Anton LaVey begging him why me
Like... it’s just not right as a concept. Why is the Son bowing and seemingly serving Sith Lords? It would be just as offputting seeing the Daughter bow to Qui Gon.
These are gods, Palpatine said so himself. Thematically this is all off, regardless of whether or not it’s Bane and Revan
This comment age well.
Its true. Even in the old eu material the only way you had Sith force ghosts was basically their spirit being tethered to some physical object in the real world. Weather its a tablet, talisman, a holocron or even a sarcophagus
Have to say, I agree. Much as I like Revan and Bane, this scene doesn't make much sense in the context that you have two Sith Lords (one of who was redeemed) berating the living embodiment of the Dark Side. Shouldn't it be the other way around? Or the Son using these Sith Lords to sway Anakin.
On the other hand, hasn't Darth Bane always been canon, as the origin point of the Rule of Two? He's not brought up a lot, but him founding the current line of Sith Lords has pretty much been canon from the start.
Exactly
yeah bane ends up showing up in clone wars anyways, just not in his orbalisk armor. revan is yet to be properly canonized but his name was in the behind the scenes of tros apparently
@@methuselahh_ Isn’t Revan already canonized through The Old Republic and upcoming KOTOR remake?
Yes he is finally canon. His story will be slightly different but he’s back.
No one follows the rule of two tbh, Dooku, Ventress , Maul , Palpatine , Mauls brother, Grevious on weekends , and possibly Jar Jar, all existed at the same point of time.
TBH I'm actually glad they took it out. It doesn't make sense to have two Dark Lords basically telling the Son who is basically one of the Gods of the force what to do. It's iffy. I get he is trying to submerse himself into the Dark Side, but is he basically embodied in it. NOW if Revan was talking to Anakin, THAT would be epic
yes, he could have explained balance to him. Correct me if I'm wrong but he was a Sith Lord and a Jedi Master yes?
+Luke Stavish
Yeah, he/she is a Grey Jedi.
TK4037 Revan was canonically male (canon as in the game's own canon that is, before anyone jumps down my throat). The main character in the sequel was officially female. ✌️
Although Pablo from LucasFilm debunked the grey Jedi thing.
Jedi fallen to the Sith, redeemed himself and then went off to hunt down the Emperor by himself. Depending on how you view it though, he was never really Sith, or Jedi, he knew he had to fall in order to defeat the Emperor. But if you follow the SWTOR story his soul basically split into two different entities after being captured and tortured by Vitiate (The Emperor at that time), one was dark the other light.
If it sounds dumb that would be because it is. Completely butchered Revan's story and went against everything he was. I recommend the KOTOR games and then the books, disregard SWTORs fuck up, technically none of it is canon so you can believe what you want.
This is why he should've been in charge of the new trilogy. Not only does he have an extremely deep understanding of the EU/legends and the fan base but he cares deeply about the IP and understands the rules of it and that even the smallest scene can change the way the entire IP works.
Filoni said multiple times that he (and George) think the EU is just fan fiction......
@@andreiefectivuatafac1966 which for the most part I agree with but that being said there are some diamonds in the rough in the EU that are loved by the fan base and make a more colorful, three dimensional IP. Feloni made great use of a lot of them in Clone Wars, Rebels, and The Mandelorian but didn't overly rely on them to the point where you have to have read 5 novelizations, 17 comic books, the backs of three series of collectable trading cards, and 100% completed an obscure floppy disk PC game from 1992 just to follow the plot of one episode.
@@WallyHays yes, i know
@@WallyHays but remember, Filoni retconned 80% of the EU with The Clone Wars
@@andreiefectivuatafac1966 not 80% of EU , but most of 2003-2005 clone wars multi media project.
I'm kinda glad they didn't do it, cos Revan wasn't a Sith Lord after the events of KOTOR
Kind of. What happened was he had two versions of him, Darth version and light version. Like Darth Vader
He hated the sith in swotr
His dark side spirit was so powerful he resurrected himself... pretty sure by the time revan actually died both his light side and dark side split from him and his light side went to the force while his dark side lived on in some other way. Sooo technically his dark spirit could be the ancient sith lord.
@@Slim2Flo At the end of Shadow of Revan, he was made whole again. Recently, Revan’s ghost showed up to help the player character kill the Emperor (of that time period). So we are actually down to one Revan and he finally found peace enough to become one with Force.
@@lllxxxxx He actually got a good send off in that game. He and all the other people the Emperor betrayed, manipulated, and murdered showed up as ghosts and cut the Emperor out of the Force like a parasite. He aged to dust and Revan finally got his lasting victory and became one with the Force.
It’s comforting to know that these characters aren’t being forgotten and even to this day are being considered for new media. How awesome would a Revan show or movie be?👍👍👍
All I want is a KOTOR remaster. No changes except graphics.
@@zacharyrollick6169 same
they should make a KOTOR show where they spend 3-6 episodes on each planet
@@NatalieN500we need a whole saga with 9 films
Ofc. we would love to see the Old Republic (finally something new for the movies instead of the same bs about Skywalkers over and over again while completely cancelling Luke - yeah thats basically Disney in a nutshell) possibly even a whole trilogy of it but we (fans) are too afraid that Disney would butcher it with social politics.
Just imagine Revan being race swapped and Bastille becoming the main character...Yeah as ridiculous as it sounds - It would be very possible to happen, sadly.
This is the same guy who voices Maul, Sam Witwer. Such an amazing job voicing broken people driven insane.
The son's voice actor sounds a bit like Galen Marek/Starkiller here
Klaw Schafer i'm pretty sure it's the same guy
Because it's him :D
Sam Witwer
VperVendetta1992 No wonder the voice acting was so damn good!
He also voices Maul in clone wars and rebels. He's also had live acting roles, playing Aiden the vampire in syfys Being Human, and Mr. Hyde in Once upon a Time.
Klaw Schafer C U S H E I S
Wait What? Aren't the father, son, & daughter supposed to be ancient mystical beings of the force? Looks like this scene should be the other way around.
Yes this is what I thought. Totally opposite. There is no sense. Father, Daughter and Son are Celestial. Far more powerful than Bane and Revan and older. There was a Mother too, which was mortal but become Abeloth. I hope George figure that and removed Bane and Revan
The father had a throwaway line about how they came to the planet, and its strength in the force warped the family.
Sensei Veggito they may be mystical beings of the force, but sometimes the sheep can overtake the shepherd
Exactly why I dislike this scene.
You're right. That's why it was never aired. lol Doesn't make any damn sense.
I understand but I am saddened about it becaose if they made it into the show that wold mean that Disney could not leave them out of new canon
bane was always canon. He is mentioned in the novelization of Ep 1 The Phantom Menace as being the founder of the rule of two. Drew Karpshyn's bane trilogy was based off of this, and told the full story of bane in the old EU, but originally Lucas created bane in the planning of episode 1. While it didn't make it into the movie, the novelizations of the movies have always been true canon.
There's rumours disney want to make another prequel trilogy (before the phantom menace) I'm hoping we will see bane and revan or plaguis in those films
Jamie MacMillan if it isn't dark, it best not be done. The Old Republic is known for being gritty and dark, more so than any of the movies. It's what I love most about it, and since Disney hasn't made any movies before The Phantom Menace, I personally consider everything in the Old Republic era still canon, since nothing has overwritten it; yet.
Bad Badger yeah, I get that mindset. Personally I see no reason why Disney couldn't allow it to be dark whilst keeping it a 12A rating (sorry don't know the American equivalent) The people that made Dark Tower pulled it off (and unlike many I enjoyed that movie) and the same goes for the woman in black. If they can get a director to study how movies like the two mentioned stayed dark whilst being child friendly enough that kids can go so long as they're with their parents I see no reason why Disney can't pull it off
Hello there my dear kenobi
Even as a massive fan of Revan, I agree that this scene didn't belong. Watching this felt more as if the writers/producers had just plucked 2 random sith from the EU and dropped them in.
Although having joined the dark side, Revan was never really interested in being as "Evil" as he seems in this scene, caring little about the overall success of the dark side and simply using it as a means to an end. His goal of destroying the Jedi order wasn't done out of serving the dark side, but because he saw the order as evil in itself, similar to how Anakin came to believe the order was broken.
Furthermore, the CANON ending of KOTOR has Revan returning to the light side of the force, so having him depicted here as a sith is a little confusing.
Just my two cents on this scene.
Sam Witwer is a treasure and his voice acting here is proof
Eh, the fan service would have been great, but I agree that this scene doesn't work. As powerful as Darth Bane and Revan are, I am pretty sure that The Son is supposed to be the darkside personified, so having them talk down to him feels...weird.
Both Revan and Bane are far FAR more powerful than the son.
FelixAJS 02 That isn’t possible, the son is basically the Darkside and he’s a celestial. They are mere mortals.
The Celestials were defeated by "mere mortals" that wielded the Dark Side of the Force. The Celestials may have been instruments of the Force, imbued with great power, but they were no masters of its power. Revan and Bane studied and refined their control. Whereas the Son is truly like an overgrown child.
The Son was the personification of the dark side. His connection to the Force existed on a level beyond the domain of any Sith and Jedi. Revan and Bane are no match.
Khalil Mason The celestials were only defeated by the chosen one, and only because he briefly tapped into his full potential. Revan and Malek have nothing on that. It’s not even a competition.
It's great that George cared enough to tell them to take it out. This just couldn't have happened, it wouldn't have made sense.
but sadly revan is not canon
But man, Revan is my dude.
SWTOR Showed his death, so having him here would kinda be awkward. He is now a being of the force, beyond the fight between light and dark, so technically he'd just be like: "Well, the Jedi have good Morals, but the sith have good plans..."
Griffin Long shame how George didn't care enough to keep continuity with episodes 6 and 3, Leia remembering her mother even though she died in childbirth...
Leia remembered her adoptive mother.
"Do you remember your mother, your real mother?" Luke knows shes adopted, and its assumed she knows aswell, otherwise why didn't Leia question Luke on that?
This would of been amazing to see, and to have theses guys in canon.
well darth bane's ghost appears in season 6 so at least he is cannon
+CT 5555 I know but revan is my favourite Star Wars character :(
True... but let's be honest, here, Revan WOULDN'T be commanding the Son to do horrible acts to ensure Skywalker was under the control of the Dark Side, not after all he's been through. Darth Bane would, but it doesn't fit into the hierarchy of the Force. What power would Bane have to command he who is practically the Dark Side *incarnate*?
They are Cannon. If it wasn't they would have either taken down or stopped making expansions to Star Wars the Old Republic.
Revan is as much a Sith as Luke Skywalker is. The entire reason he became Darth Revan was to destroy the Sith and save the Republic. He didn't even change his name, he just threw DARTH onto the beginning when he "fell" because that way he'd look legit.
You wanna know why he wrote the Rule of Two? Because it's a lot easier to kill two angry Sith then 11 bajillion angry Sith. Revan was a master of the long game (which makes sense once you learn who his master was). The problem I have with this scene is that he's clearly full-on Sith here. How does one kill the Sith by murdering the physical embodiment of the Light Side, who is also Palutena from Kid Icarus?
The new trilogy you can tell they didn’t go to George to ask what they can do with the force. This is why I love Dave Filoni he actually cares
"Darth Revan"
"Uber-evil"
Wat. Revan was the only sith lord I know of to turn away from the dark side entirely. Giving him this role kinda ruins everything that made Revan so great and reduces him to just another boring sith. Even Traya would jave been a better option. O.o
I believe there was a split and revans dark and light side became 2 separate people
This was Revans evil side, the side that gladly wanted to wipe out all of his enemies in the most ruthless way possible.
@@Theycallmethek3 No, he becomes one person again after the two sides fought.
He didn't turned from the dark side completely. It is kinda his thing, that he does not belong with either side of the Force.
@@troller8680 I mean... In the comics he came back and aided the jedi outcast (I always forget what the fuck the canon name for KotOR II's MC was). They may not have been jedi proper, but there are plenty of "grey jedi" who weren't dark side, even a few who used dark side powers but resisted being consumed.
Having Darth Bane and Darth Reven above the Son never made sense anyway. The Father, Son, and Daughter were Celestials...essentially gods in the Star Wars universe. It makes no sense to have two mortal Sith Lords as being a god's mentor. If anything, they would have been students of the Son, so removing the scene was, as mentioned, absolutely the right thing to do.
David Perryman they aren't above the son he would fuck them both up 10 time's over LOL
CHEESE BURGER FREDDY That was my point. As depicted in the storyboard layout, he was behaving as their apprentice. Since as a "god" he should be above them, I agreed with removing it from the show.
David Perryman Me too man that didn't seem correct to be, Plus he is wayyy older so it wouldn't make sense.
David Perryman that's how fucking cool they are
Eh Revan wasn't mortal, Vitiate performed a Dark Side Ritual on him to make him immortal so he could keep Revan as a prisoner for all time.
I respect this because revans souls combined and the dark side join his light and this makes no sense like Dave said
then again that happens in swtor which isnt canon... and i think IF they bring revan back somehow it will be similar to thrawns return that his story gets somewhat reshaped from what it originally was
Yeah, some people said Holocrons would be better. Revan can remain canonically Light Side, but his Dark Side holocron can influence his successors and it also navigates past having to have them be able to be force ghosts.
Swtor was canon before Disney took over though. And part of the KOTOR saga in the form of Malachor V was confirmed canon in Rebels, so the rest of it could possibly be as well.
This just doesn't make sense no matter what game or book is or isn't canon
Bioware might bastardize and mistreat his character time and again, but to their credit there is no stopping point at any part of the series where Revan was pure dark side, and them making him just yet another morally black saturday morning cartoon villain like he was in the original backstory of KOTOR would defeat the point of even including him
It would be like if Disney brought back Darth Vader in the new trilogy and had him urge Kylo to kill some younglings or something, it would be nothing more than nonsensical plothole-filled fan service
Technically incorrect. Lucas determined what was and was not Canon until Disney took it over, and he himself said he didn't consider anything canon other than the movies. So even though people complained about Disney "Making everything else not canon", technically they never were. They could just be seen as alternate timelines.
I'm glad they took this out, it would butcher Revan's character even more.
at least they would be canon though
But the issue with Revan is that because he was a blank slate MC from the KOTOR games. He's kind of a pick your own path character, he's whole identity was based on the players' choices.
Yeah, and that's why it was kind of a letdown how they potrayed him in SWTOR for some, but for me at least it worked for the most part, until they totally ruined him in Shadow Of Revan, and if they did this, they would just make things worse.
Adrian Ong
You do know Revan is not just from KOTOR right?
@@justnoel4088 honestly I think the canon star wars is all fucked up because they are to afraid to explore the old republic, there are only movies and tv shows set during the clone wars and empire vs rebels and then that awful era where rey sue is running around and that's about it
This just shows how much Dave Filoni knows about and understands of Star Wars
@@VidyaJon he said he doesnt give a sh*t about the EU........
@@andreiefectivuatafac1966 Who? Dave Filoni LOVES the EU and cares DEEPLY about it!
@@Gadget-Walkmen you can't be serious ☠️
@@0Stalk0 lol just stop talking as I’m completely right here as Filoni DOES care about it as he’s just as much as any other Star Wars fan does but as one of the makers of it, he has to decide and consider considerably on what can stay and what can’t as they expanded universe had too many stories in them that obviously can’t all be canon at all. This should extremely obvious, back off with your nonsense as this “yOu cAnT bE sErIoUs” just makes you look really bad here.
@@Gadget-Walkmen Dave felony doesn't care about the EU,why else would he retcon nearly half of them with his own ideas???,also I'm sorry but i did not understand a single thing you said
I think if they did this scene with Anakin would've made more sense.
You mean anakin in the Son's place and the Son in Darth Revan's place? Because Darth Revan can NOT be in this position at all!
@@Gadget-Walkmen Yeah, Anakin in the son’s place
@@annieandelsieofarendelle3294 sure but that’s not the main thing as revan should NOT have been brought back at all here like this.
@@Gadget-Walkmen I thought it was an illusion.
@@annieandelsieofarendelle3294 what was? This sequence? No this is the ACTUAL force ghost of Darth Revan actually talking to someone. And that’s the whole problem of the scene and why it was taken out as sith can’t come back as force ghosts.
I wish I had been in that room with George Lucas. I could so easily explain why Revan should have been brought into canon. Now, I would have restructured the scene to involve Revan interacting with Anakin and discussing balance in the Force rather than having a Darth Revan incarnation arise with Bane to speak to the Son. Bane was used later near the end of the cartoon, anyway, so a version of him is canon. I would have loved to explain how Revan could have tried to steer Anakin in the direction of balance between light and dark, only to have Anakin's inner turmoil boil over and destroy anything that could have been. I would have tied the legend of the Chosen One directly to Revan's story, mostly having Revan state how close he came to being the Chosen One, but how it was ultimately not his destiny. He would warn Anakin not to make similar mistakes, that emperors have a way of twisting your perceptions and making you do terrible things. Revan would teach Anakin how to resist, and it would stem from a place of love. Only through love could Anakin bring balance to the Force. He would forget the lesson as if the experience had been a distant dream, but it would be the case that the love Anakin had for his son overwhelmed the Emperor's control over him.
Academic Arbiter that could have been used in the clone wars it totally fits with the films
Academic Arbiter That's brilliant, man! I would have loved to see that.
Andrew S 👍🏻
Dude, you get it, you seriously get it. Very nice.
boringproduction1 😎
I agree with leaving this out. The Son is supposed to be an avatar; a physical manifestation of the Dark Side itself. However, I do like the idea of ancient Sith Lords making an appearance. Ever since we saw Darth Krayt in the EU seek the wisdom of Darth Andeddu, Darth Bane and Darth Nihilus via their holocrons. It'd be cool to see this in Star Wars Theory's Vader series; Vader meditating and, seeking knowledge that he knows Sidious is keeping from him, listens to the holocrons of Darths Bane, Revan, Nihilus, Malgus and Plagueis; all standing around him in a circle as he focuses on regaining his power.
It actually does make sense. Remember, the dark side itself is a natural part of the force. It is the Sith, consumed by the dark side, who forcibly manipulate it and disrupt the balance in the force. A true Jedi like Luke is supposed to follow the will of the Force, i.e the balance of light and dark. So for these Sith lords to be influencing the Son like this and essentially disrupting the Balance the Mortis Gods represent is spot on. The Son is not inherently evil, he represents the natural parts of the dark side and how the Sith can manipulate and let it consume them.
me loving dave filoni
dave filoni: we were going to bring revan but we decided not to
me: its treason then
Not his fault. And it was the right decision.
@@Gadget-Walkmen ye ik i was joking lol
As much as I would’ve loved to see Darth Revan canon. It wouldn’t make sense for him to be above the son, a literal god
How about a movie with Dave Bautista as Dessel/Bane.
I think he is not tall enough for that
6'6 is pretty fuckin tall
As long as he can be serious for an entire movie and not do the quirky Marvel humor
I don't think he would be the right fit
Tom hardy suits the role of bane for me
Holy crap I knew Sam Witwer was great voice actor, but wow that really shows his talent
Lucas has a good point sometimes. There wouldn't exactly be a point to Revan speaking to The Son, as he was a hero.
Even as a villain, Darth Revan (pre K.O.T.O.R.1) was only a villain so he can destroy and rebuild and make the Republic stronger to face a greater evil.
Always good in heart but was very grey, my belief at least on the character.
Dave Filoni should’ve made and directed the sequels. He’s a true Star Wars fan that knows what he’s doing and knows how to direct and come up with stories.
Darth revan redeemed himself. So it doesn't make sense for him to appear as a ancient with ghost.
He had split personalities
@@LuisContreras-qp4jz they were reunited in swtor still wouldn’t make sense
Yeah true
This would be like a god asking their priests for advice
Oh the Old Republic. The best Star Wars period ...
Dave Filoni: *Doesn’t add Darth Revan to canon*
J.J Abrams: Fine, I’ll do it myself.
@@fynnoleianson8802 Yes he did . In the Rise of Skywalker Encyclopedia book, it was revealed that the Final Order Fleet had different regions named after Sith Lords . Sith Lords like : Ajunta Paal, Andeddu, Darth Tenebrous and Darth Revan .
@@fynnoleianson8802 But he is already Canon .
@@fynnoleianson8802 In a Clone Wars episode, but now he has a new disign
I actually do understand why they took this out, because even though it looks cool and does make some sense with the Daughter having the Father as like her light side master and Revan and Bane being like the dark side masters to the Brother, it goes against the thought of Sith can't become force ghosts because to become one you have to be totally calm and at peace with yourself and those in your life at one time or another and that goes against how the Sith work.
they could have gotten rid of Bane and save him for season 6 while Revan could have been kept but appear as Jedi Force Ghost to Anakin and tell him that he is the Chosen One and that love is the key to defeating the Sith since it was his love Luke that made Vader kill Sidious
zoom zoom103 Ajunta Pall has became one tho
they can in a way.
Darth Marr was a sith lord but he become a force ghost.
Well when we look at the old republic, there are sith force ghost like Kallig and Darth Marr (You can count Valkorion as well but his case is different he just got a new body everytime he died).
“Both of which existed in the EU”
So that’s why both world wars started in Europe
Kudos to George for making the decision not to go through with this, and much respect to Dave Filoni and the rest of the writing team for understanding that it isn't about what the fans think would be cool to see, its about the greater concept of the Force and staying true to what George Lucas vision of that is.
As much as i love those characters im glad they where cut especially revan i fell like the redeeming of his character really excludes him as someone who would be that deeply embedded in the dark side
I think that his dark side and his light side split?
"He who controls Skywalker, controls everything"
*looks at sequel trilogy realizing that, that "he" is actually palpatine who's been controlling anakin since episode 1 to 6 and now kylo*
He being Palpatine makes Palpatine honestly so badass. He had Anakin, Luke, Han and Leia dead and he was basically a Sithari God in TROS. He just had to bust a nut sometime in the past and have his granddaughter kill him.
This scene gives so much character to the Son. It explains why they kept saying the son had fallen to the dark side, he wasn't always a darksider. The Daughter says his nature is selfish, which is probably true. I can imgaine the Daughter embracing the light, as it goes with her selfless nature and the Son driven by the desire to fulfill the idea of them as opposites, seeking out an artifact of the dark side to allow him to commune with some of the most power sith lords that have existed (he could have been doing this for hundreds of years biding his time. Although I think Nilihus should have replaced Revan). And with the new world between worlds, the Son could have been using this power to speak with them before they died, removing George's problem. That's the part that's canon in my heart. Because a god of the dark side, would be the most mortal.
Oh the World between worlds would totally validate this! Shoot you thought of it before they did.
BRING IT BACK THIS SHOW IS THE BEST
this is the closest we can get to
"Starkiller vs. Revan"
well revan will probably be in the next star wars movies (starkiller probably will never be canon tho lul)
*WE WERE THIS CLOSE TO GREATNESS!*
I personally think that would be cool is that revan existed in a sort of dual existence like a dual personality. He has his dark side and his light aside version. And occasionally combining into one. He could be talking to Anakin. And even guide others. It be cool
After the son leaves, Revan turns to Bane: "No wonder I went back to the Light after seeing this idiot."
Kinda glad they pulled it too since I saw the Son as the aspect of the dark side and being older than any of the Sith
This is why we love Filoni. He just gets Star Wars.
“Most evil Sith Lords”
No Emperor Valkorion? I know he turned on the Sith later but so did Revan
Tenebrae
Yeah if sith found a way to immortalize themselves in the force it would kind of defeat the whole purpose of them. Why would they constantly be on a power hungry quest to dominate the galaxy and become immortal if they already figured out how to do it millennia ago. They could use dark side magic to leave behind recordings and shades that would essentially be glorified holograms.
sorry for late reply, but Revan was actually a sith lord at some point before the KOTOR game so it could actually make sense. He and Malak worked for Vitiate, but I guess you know that. My point is that he himself was under the influence of the dark side and actually comitted a series of atrocities against the Old Republic. And as you probably know, he did redeem himself by killing Malak. So saying he wasn`t supposed to be a sith lord is partially right and partially wrong. He was named Darth Revan for a reason and I think he was one, if not the only one, to actually go back to the light side of the force after being a sith. Most of what I wrote is basic knowledge about his character, but my point is that it isnt entirely wrong to cast him as a sith. With that being said, I kinda agreed that this scene didnt make sense. But for me it is only because it shouldnt be this scene that introduces viewers for Revan and Bane, that would have to be animated series or even movies instead. I have probably wrote something wrong here because it has been years since I last read the novels and played the games.
It's not that a Sith wouldn't want to, it's that they can't. To be a Sith you have to essentially be an atheist while to be a Jedi requires you to be, in effect, a Christian
This is exactly how the top brass should discuss and enforce canon! Yeah, it’s cool, yeah we want it, but it doesn’t fit so we go without for the greater good.
That scene with The Son: that performance is amazing!
Sam Witter is a great fucking actor, voice AND live action
My biggest problem with that would have been: Why the hell is the Son taking orders from Bane and Revan? He's the literal physical manifestation of the Dark Side of the Force. He's so far above every Sith that has ever lived that it would be like if Zeus was taking orders from a slave or something. Like it just doesn't make any sense.
I would love to see Bane appear before Sidious and talk about the Rule of Two. And I would love to see Revan try to guide Anakin to bring balance to the Force.
That's why they didn't do it make the scene. Even though it would be cool to see Revan again, they felt like the son should still be all-powerful
I think it's less about power and more about knowledge, skills, and ability. The Son was powerful and old, but has been isolated on Mortis his whole life.
Another way to look at it is that Average Joe has a gun and knows how to pull the trigger and load it, but a soldier is a trained expert with it.
I would personally be opposed to this because Darth Revan's story is much more interesting as a redemption arc than a dull "Oh, I was bad? Kay, I'll be bad again" storyline. When it's played as an unwitting redemption and then deciding to stay on the Light Side to work with the friends/crew you've helped and rise above your dark and regretful past...it's really cool and it was my favorite plot point in anything Star Wars.
Y'know I do get why they removed Revan.... but gods dammit that was all we needed! One scene with him and everything KOTOR set up would have been safe from Disney's wrath! Just one!
Tahkaullus01 You are wrong. Only Revan, the character itself, would have been canon. Nothing else would be canon, not even his back story or KOTOR.
@@Darktrooper99 Yeah. Bane is still canon because of TCW, but none of his stories are.
KOTOR remake is coming.
2 years later... I'm pissed off still.
revan speaking about the chosen one is insane
I understand why it was taken out, but its still very sad
For real.
1:17 I just hear Starkiller... Did Sam voice the Son?
Yep, he did
Why would Darth Bane have had the "cage" on his head? He only wore that for a small portion of his life.
He wore that cage when he was recording himself in the holocron but of course it doesn't make sense for him to still be wearing it since its not the holocron. Not unless the holocron is connected to Altar of Mortis since both of them are special objects that are forged by the force so they would be connect.
Another thing to support this theory is that Revan became a Jedi again and it doesn't make any sense to appear as the Dark lord of the Sith at all. So only the recording of his holocron that went by the Darth title and these two replicates of Darth Raven and Bane are merely the gatekeepers of the holocrons.
it's called Orbalisk Armour (ha..armour..more like a parasite)
he wore that so the orbalisks wont cover his face
I thought he didn't complete the holocron till after his accident where he lost the armour to much rage and incomplete knowledge on how to make one , I could be wrong been a few years since I read them but I have read all 3 twice so far
Yeah where is his "KISS" makeup? They should have had Darth Zannah. In a black two piece!
Even as a huge Revan fan, this was ultimately the right call by George. Why would the son, the face and incarnation of the dark side, be crying and doing the bidding of two sith lords? It doesn’t make sense, even though it would’ve been awesome seeing revan and bane canonized.
i guess it kinda makes sense why they didnt add this because revan fully turned back to the light and became one with the force
I thought he wasn't dark or light o thought he just lied in the middle
the voice of the son is this scene sounds like Star Killer.
Yeah it's Sam Witwer. He also voiced Maul in The Clone Wars/Rebels & the Emperor briefly in The Force Unleashed & Rebels.
They would have ruined Revan.
Andrew Marchisio Not in the clone wars show.
+YoshiPlaysMC
They ruined Quinlan Vos and General Grievous in Clone Wars so they can ruin Revan too
They ruined Revan in the book Star Wars The Old Republic: Revan! They made him into a whiny, weak little bitch. To preserve my love for Revan I just pretend that book never existed.
@@BlyUehara37 They didn't ruin Quinlan Vos. They did ruin Grievous though.
@@LordVader1094 Greivous was already ruined by being a weak coward with a smoker's cough in the movie
Why didn't you make revan canon!? He definitely deserves it
_̸̲̅-̸̲̅*̸̲̅S̷A̷M̷U̷R̷A̷I̷ 2̷2̷*̸̲̅-̸̲̅_̸̲̅ The scene makes perfect sense. Revan was a Sith Lord before the start of KOTOR regardless of whether you redeemed him or not. Revan recorded himself in holocrons in the Darth Bane books and having his evil force ghost remain isn't much of a stretch with all the knowledge he had of Sith rituals.
the son is like a force god much more powerful than revan or bane so why are they ordering him around. and revan went back to the light side so it makes no sense
exactly
Infamous Void because lucas had already given Dark horse the permission for Darth Banes story which was 2 years before the video game came out. Soon as the game was out the changed the storyline.
Darth Bane was his real name, he created the rule of 2 and passed his name to his successor. He recreated the sith order. Then kotor came out and they made it as if the name Darth was passed down to high ranking or powerfull sith. Bane was named after Darth addendu as an honor. Only the sith'ari carried it which was bane.
The game changed alot of the sith history because fans kept glorifying Revan. Only few whom read those dark horse books jedi vs sith know. But now u cant find that story. But if you look up the date of releases for both you will notice the difference, they made banes trilogy and added that he found revans holocron. Fan boy crap.
+Darth Alvarado What are you talking about? Nothing was changed of Sith history by KOTOR.
Imagine giving the new movies an ounce of the care these guys gave towards the continuity, in one scene of an animated tv show.
Thank you Dave filloni ! Such a respectfull true fan
Although I actually agree with George Lucas’s point of view, seeing Revan actually acknowledge Anakin as the Chosen One really brightens my day.
At the very least, it means they were all on board with Revan being canon. Revan wasn’t one of the reasons they chose not to.
Who is here after Revan was considered CANON?
Revan was never technically canon, at least not G-canon
@@kislayparashar He was C-canon. Anyways, how is this relevant to that comment?
Darth Revan speaking "Skywalker" is something I didn't know I needed
*Reven is technically in star wars clone wars, proving its the best bit of star wars media currently out*
Clone Wars: We didn't have Darth Revan and Bane because it wouldn't fit in the story.
Solo: Did someone say Darth Maul?
Well in the time that transcured SOLO Moul stilled alive before the season 3 of Rebels, appart the time lapse of TCW to Rebels. meanwhile, specifique Revan (becouse Bane still cannon), was redeemed in Knights of the old republic, so see it like a Ghost of the Dark Side doesn't fit very well
But Revan die a Jedi Knight
Why he would be a Sith Lord after of his dead?
Harloxzz 19 Revan died as a rogue force user, neither jedi nor sith
Revan died as his Dark Side and Light Side found peace and came together.
His Force Ghost then says he needs to do things and disapears.
Disney needs to take Georges input more to save SW.
The voice actor for the son is the same voice actor as starkiller in the the force unleashed
Drew Karpyshyn's influence reaches further than I have ever known.
I wish this scene was finished!!!
I personally would have Revan to appear in Canon, but not in this way. It just doesn't make sense. The Son is the literal embodiment of the Dark Side, so it makes no sense that any Sith Lord, however strong, would be looking down upon The Son and teaching him of the Dark Side. I mean, he (The Son) IS the Dark Side. Literally.
Bane is already in Canon, so he could have been left out of the episode. Instead, Revan should have been on Mortis giving Anakin some words on balance between the Light and the Dark, as per his own philosophy. I mean, future Ahsoka and Qui Gon Jinn were both on Mortis so why not Revan too?
Dammit Lucas. Don't deny Revan in Canon again next time!
Actually The Son would have been alive before Darth Revan and Darth Bane. The Son is a Celestial that existed before the Sith. He is also the very personification of the Dark side. Glad they took it out, it would have not made any sense.
It’s unreal how amazing Sam Witwer is here...
At least revan is canon now, in ROS a final order legion is called revan
What? Seriously?
Why not simply have them as holocrons? Feels like that would make more sense, especially since Revan turned good, and the holocron could have been made before that happened. So no need to retcon.
and how would a Sith Holocron exist on a planet that can appear and disappear at will?
@@mudyao Oh so you're fine with a planet appearing at will, but not a object on it. That's fair if I ever heard of it.
@@vonderfaak6357 but he's right how would the Sith Holocron get there? nothing else on the planet was from the outside universe. Did you even watch the episode?
Good. This scene was ridiculous.
Well Revan is canon again, at least we’re halfway there 😂 awesome to see that they were both originally gonna appear in TCW though, and it makes total sense why the scene was cut
Imagine how close we were to having Darth Revan canon ... damn
The only problem I have with this is that Bane is in the void, he wouldn't be able to communicate with the son. Unless of course he's using holocrons than it would be possible.
EDIT: Bane destroyed Revan's holocron so he couldn't be using them to communicate.
yeaboi55
In the book Dynasty of Evil, Bane explains that holocrons are either operated by the gatekeeper, or by the Sith's actual spirit. In the case of the Andeddu holocron, it was a gatekeeper. And for his own holocron, it was also a gatekeeper - he had to make an artificial image of himself in his orbalisk armor to safeguard against Jedi discovery. And like you said, Bane's spirit is trapped in the void forever.
silent mental aporoach Isn’t Bane in Gotham City?
Darth Bane and Darth Reven need to be cannon. The are both very great Sith. Bane made his own holocrom. Reven was instrumental in Kotor 1 and 2. Lucas should have kept the sceen. Remember The Story of Darth Plagueis The Wise. "Darth Plagueis" was a Dark Lord of the Sith so powerful and so wise, he could use the Force to influence the midi-chlorians to create life. So Lucas pulled the sceen which would have brought more to the story of the dark side. My thoughts.
Bane is canon.
So's Revan
Bane is canon Revan isn't.
I thought Revan was canon because kylo ren is part of the knights of ren
That doesn't make sense
Isn't the son stronger than those two?
No.
Read the EU. They would absolutely rape the son.
Member Berries definitely. These two are insane. He operates on another level of existance than those two, he could've just closed their lightsabers and i'm pretty sure that his Force abilities would outmatch them in basically every way considering that he is literally on another level, you know, because he is a creature that can quote "manipulate The Force like no other'
Luissv72 Here's a quick summary of Bane for you: www.reddit.com/r/respectthreads/comments/2okc1i/respect_darth_bane/
They have sources there in the annotations of quotes as well, it's all legit.
Also a note: Anakin in his current state of when he fights the son would get raped by Bane and Revan. So they'd definitely be able to beat the son
Klaw Schafer I hope you're joking. How is bane and revan stronger? The son force power is 6 times of eu grand master luke sky walked. Grand ,after like sky walker would absolute shit on both bane and revan. Fact
Anyone else want a book about the depth of the force by Lucas and Filoni?
Yeah I would like a book of George Lucas sequel trilogy
I agree with the decision. Take note Disney! Fan service isn’t the best way!
Exactly
3:40 I love how seriously George takes the Force. Yes it's fictional, but within that fictional universe there are rules that the creator of that universe establishes and those rules should be followed. He did his best to make sure his overall view of the force was consistent. Disney doesn't understand this obviously because now a Jedi like Rey can be super powerful with no training and their explanation for it is because the Force "awakened" in her or because "the force is female." Those are just excuses for lazy writing.
The hell are you on about?
Chickpeas Just talking about how great George Lucas was at creating a fictional universe.
@@Rathadude I mean your line about Rey
Chickpeas You mean how she has no training and is super powerful without any explanation?
vargen1414 Except nothing in Star Wars lore says that midichlorians behave like mitochondria. Midichlorians are organelles but that doesn't mean they are mitochondria. Besides even if they did behave like mitochondria, that is only talking about how they are passed on to offspring. The fact that men still would have midichlorians means the force would still be gender neutral. Also, do you really think that's what the people who made or wore the shirts were thinking about when they did so?