The Most Controversial Race of 2024 - Road Bike TT Nationals
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 20 พ.ค. 2024
- The results are still pending an enquiry into the Winner's Bike (no spoilers), I predicted issues but share my opinion on the results and if they should stand as they are.
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I knew this vid would incite a lot of comments and I want to share my thoughts on the race 1 month later and knowing there’s an enquiry into George’s bike going on;
1. I’m happy with the result, as the one with the ‘most to gain’ I don’t wish to gain anything as I believe George’s bike was within the rules laid out on the day. “Spirit of” isn’t a rule and if we go down a “spirit of” direction than an awful lot of riders (myself included) should be dq’d for bottles out the back and padding on the handlebars.
2. Definition of a road bike; I have a Specialized Shiv at home, it has a UCI sticker with a code that ends TT. There is nothing in the UCI rule book that states I have to use that bike solely in TT’s (I checked this with a UCI Commissaire), if I put drop bars on it and it’s within the UCI’s geometry limitations then it can be used in the Tour de France. George’s handlebars were also UCI legal as they are Speeco’s new model. My argument there is how do we classify a road bike for this event if the bike that won could be used in a road race (minus the bottles out back of the saddle)… Ultimately though it's worth saying that these are the CTT's rules and not the UCI's.
3. Resting forearms, I was holding onto the brakes with my little finger and digits, as were an awful lot of riders, if you look at images of the UAE riders riding on the front in the Giro D’Italia at the moment, a lot of them are adopting similar positions to us in the Road bike Nationals with resting wrists and forearms on the handlebar. Going back to my argument above about the bike, if the position can be used in UCI sanctioned road races, when/how does this not become a road bike event.
4. My opinion is that rules need to be refined and clarified for next year but the results from this year should stand as is. The CTT is a predominantly volunteer run event and with the introduction of more precise rules we then need more volunteers or paid commissaires, which means higher costs which will need to be reflected in entry fees. I believe the CTT’s machine orientated rule book being somewhat more relaxed than the UCI’s has been helpful to the racing’s popularity and longevity.
5. For those that assume I lodged the complaint against George, I did not, I don’t believe George deserves a DQ. My company Thighs Club Coaching Coaches George, and George is also a coach for us. James and I helped George for this event he was targeting and we were in awe of the effort put in to maximise performance, we’re also helping him build a defence. George spent months building his machine, I cobbled mine together the night before and I’m proud of my result as a result.
6. CTT introduced the road bike category to reduce the intimidation and arms race factor around time trialling and its worked numbers are up and those new people are predominantly on road bikes. I guess the question is around the merit of actually having a Road Bike Nationals.
7. Those calling for Merckx style rules and regs, look how that worked out for the Hour Record and the sheer number of people queuing up to take on Eddy’s distance on a steel machine with metal wheels etc… (insert sarcasm). When the rules allowed modern machinery, the floodgates opened for riders taking on the hour, I know as I was one of them…twice.
8. I’m aware the tan sidewall Conti’s have a higher CRR than the black ones, but tan sidewalls look better 😉
All the dinosaurs saying its against the spirit of TT is bemusing. Have you ever been to a CTT? Its TOTALLY about the kooky gains, setups, hacks, thinking outside the box but within the rules. Road bike category doesn’t change that. Stop crying and start thinking. Its not about the TT frame - minor watts in that vs a modern UCI legal road bike (with new longer chord shapes). Its the body position and body mechanics that enable it. Thats why there is a road bike cat, so you can with a few tweaks change it back to a normal setup and still do the club run on a Sunday, then hit a TT on a Wednesday without needing a whole new bike.
Couldn’t agree more.
Would love to see him show up to a group ride on that Argon lol
Who cares, TTs are boring. Spend a fortune to ride a bit faster against a guy who is faster on a cheaper bike.
They should just stick to regular road racing rules. Allowing for exceptions just goes against what they're trying to do (make TT racing accessible without a massive budget), as you wouldn't be competitive unless you bought some relatively expensive and single use aero upgrades for your road (TT) bike.
Huge respect for you in defending your position and for adopting a truly fair approach to the "controversy". Your statement that "you got beaten fair and square" is one that far too few competitors are willing to state. I agree with you in that I believe the result should stand as it does not appear (from what you showed and stated) that the winner had a technical violation of the rules, thus a DQ would be entirely unfair at this point.
I enter the road bike category on my mtb.
Chapeau sir. I really appreciate how real you keep it and the support you provide for the grass-roots of the sport.
Thanks for sharing the appreciation at the Awards Ceremony Alex.
Really liked the way you put the video together - eye opening to see the process, and all in all very absorbing 👍
Ban;
Padding on handlebars
Bottles out the back
Bikes sold by the manufacturers as either tt or triathlon
Disk wheels
Over 80mm rim width
Positions are too complicated and resource heavy to manage, so they’re fair game
Brilliant Alex, well done & good luck with the events. Fully enjoy that & really looking forward to seeing more.
People decide to make a road bike TT category to strengthen a shrinking sport. Mostly to reduce the idiotic cost of TT bikes and the related aero equipment. Result, same story repeats itself, just on a slightly different bike. Folks just can't help but out spend each other...
And turn it into an Elite event, putting off beginner racers...idiots
Stock bike only tt
This happens also no matter the class and restriction of motorsport. Often the more restricted and 'stock' a class is the more expensive it gets as people are trying to push every tolerance.
You and others seem to be suggesting that a large proportion of the field in each RB event is going to great lengths (and at significant cost) to reduce their CdA. That's not the case and not the main purpose of the class's existence. It's futile to look at a handful of bikes in one event and make sweeping statements about the UK TT scene in general.
The RB class was created to revive a popular discipline that has seen numbers dwindling for some time. There are ongoing discussions about CTT's machine rules but participation has improved and almost all RB riders are people turning up on their main/best/only bike and pedalling hard.
Hopefully the outcome of this will be some sensible tweaks to the rules. However, what we need most is for more people to turn up and ride TTs on road bikes and help keep the lively, friendly and welcoming scene we know.
@Chloe-ei9iw what is a stock bike? You mean one bought from a shop that has the wrong stem length, handlebar width, seat, bar tape and the tyres are crap?
No-one rides a stock bike.
Great video Alex, especially the presentations bit, I wasn't expecting to see that. I was only speaking to George about the probability of the video coming soon on Saturday and lo and behold!
Hopefully see you next year for the National 25.
Nice one Alex. And fair dos for your comments about George, especially given the inappropriate flak he and the bike have received since. Great video.
I coach George and George is a coach for Thighs Club Coaching. We’ve been helping him put together his case to defend his title. I enjoy these races and I enjoy seeing people put a lot of work in and achieving success. George created his bike IMO within the rules over 6 months. I put mine together the night before at 10pm. I don’t appreciate the accusatory assumption.
We never used lights back in the day
Congrats on your medal.
If the bike passed scrutineering on the day and everyone was happy at the start of the race then as long as there was no illegal puppy paws position during the race then there can be no contest as to whether it was a valid win or not. The rules can be changed after a race no problems but changing the rules for a race after the race has been run can't be on.
BTW 6.5C is about 20C colder than I consider an acceptable temperature to ride in.
4:33 According to Bicycle Rolling Resistance's tests, the tanwall GP 5000s are slower.
What one loses in CRR more than gains in aesthetics 😜
And it gives you an excuse! 😆
That white and blue Ribble looks insane!
Glad you like it 😏😏
Completely agree with everything Alex said in the video, as well the comment he made in the comment section. With the rules that are in place, George absolutely deserves the win. Clearly trained very hard to get the position right and still be able to put power out while in it. I will just say, as someone who has done a lot of TT's, i stopped doing them a few years ago due to being constantly spanked by people who can afford to drop £10,000+ on TT kit, i simply cant do that. So when i saw that CTT were introducing road bike category i was really looking forward to getting back into the sport in a class, in machinery at least, that had more of a level playing field. However seeing what is happening to the road bike class already, it seems quite disheartening to see a similar thing starting to happen again. However, I'm not blaming the athletes, its the fault of whoever is making the rules. Until Rules are put in place to stop people turning up on all sorts of ridiculous positions and bikes that aren't at all what people actually are riding on the road, then people will continue to do so. Essentially what i'd love to see is, TT's being what they are meant to be. Who is truly the fittest person on the day. Not who can twist themselves into an unrealistic position on a TT bike with some road bike whacked onto it. Or who can spend the most amount of money. Please know i haven't written this in anger, just voicing an opinion of someone who loves the sport! Keep up the great content Alex, only getting better & better.
Being able to hold position seems to make a huge difference. I did a double weekend and really struggled the 2nd day and it was noticable in comparison to other riders that also rode both events who put in similar times in both events while I was a minute slower on the 2nd day. Fair play to Mr Fox, he has dialed his equipment and position and must have worked hard to be able hold it. It is tough to know the line of the 'Spirit' of the event in creating a category where someone can just turn up with their road race bike as it would be set for a road race (though to he fair I think George raced a crit on a similar bike last year).
really good vlog brings up interesting questions about the road bike category tt's
Woah woah woah!! You're in my neck of the woods lets not be suprised we have a hill in the fens!! I mean it is the fly over the A1 but that still counts!!
I thinks there’s much to be congratulated about this, Alex. But in particular your grace and humility in accepting being beaten on the day. And giving each of the winners thier time in the limelight. Well done for another entertaining episode.
Impressive performance and developing that position within the rules as they stand of course. BUT, I don't think you can call that a road bike, and the purpose is surely to make the category accessible.
If somebody rocked up to the 100km Saturday social ride on that bike (rear TT bottles, a TT frame, and praying mantis drop bars), are you saying people wouldn't bat an eyelid?
Thats a brutal course. Done lots of circuits onbthat course and its tough even on a perfect warm evening
Well done George. Holding that position and the effort that went in to getting ready for this. Class comments Alex!
I rode time trails on road bike and low profile a win is a win
When I started TTs in the 80s I'm sure Cayn Theakston rode to some of our local events with a spare set of 32 spokes with silk tubs fixed either side of his front wheel. Swap out, ride event (winning some!) and then ride home. Seemed perfectly normal. Riders will always optimise their kit whatever the category and whatever their means. Live with it.
Do people want banded categories based on cost of bike and clothing next?
Cayn had a lock and chain wrapped round the seat post at his first race apparently.
Do the aero speedplay bodies work with the Powrlink ZERO spindles I wonder? Potential aero PM hack if you need one 😅
According to bicycle Rolling Resistance the all black GP5000S TR are measurably faster than the tan ones.
Do you believe everything you read on the internet
@Chloe-ei9iw I believe in the scientific method. What have bicycle rolling resistance got to gain my saying that conti's black sidewall produce faster rolling GP5000's than the tan? It is data from the likes of bicycle rolling resistance & Aerocoach that has made the GP5000's a popular racing choice and they seem to be fairly consistent results across the different testing sites - silverstone now has facilities & Ineos did some work but both are unlikely to publish data. The tan & Black sidewalls are notably different in feel, so not unexpected that the sidewalls behave differently, much like the difference between the AS model which has a noticably stiffer / thicker side wall & the TT's which go the other way and are noticably thinner.
@@morrisizing BRR tanwall haters confirmed, should have done the testing yourself acording to chloe.
@@Chloe-ei9iwVulcanized tires that aren’t completely black have little to no “carbon black” in the sidewalls. Carbon black not only makes tires faster, but also more durable and more airtight.
The purple brake looks sweet two pot as well, that's epic also for the fluid does water come first for racing also hill climb when!?
Good job bro 😎
Not many juniors, but that's hardly surprising.
Sadly, the cost of technology, which makes so much difference to times, even in the road bike category, is killing the sport at grass roots level.
I don't know how the sport can be saved, but introducing a road bike category and then allowing riders to spend relatively large amounts of cash, to make their "road" bikes faster than those who cannot afford to spend such sums is, and I hate to say it, mechanical doping.
Technical developments on the top riders' bikes (including incredibly expensive clothing and helmets) are absolutely fascinating, but things have now become so ridiculous that there now needs to be a specific category for "normal" road bikes.
We don't have to go back to the Eddy Merckx era here, but there must be some kind of solution to this equipment arms race that threatens to end the sport.
It's not even necessarily just the equipment either, you have guys going to the wind tunnel spending around £500 - £1000 for a session and the Silverstone tunnel provides loads of helmets and suits for you to test. So not only do most people have to overcome the cost of gear, but they also have no idea if the gear they have is even any good on them. Recent data showed like 90 seconds between the fastest and slowest of some of the WT road helmets at 40kph - but road bike TTs are regularly faster than that, so even bigger differences up for grabs. Now when you factor in differences between suits, wheels, frames and overshoes too...
@@BevandEdMusic I agree. You just know that if riders with pots of money were compelled to ride a standard bike then they'd try and buy a competitive advantage through helmets, custom skin suits, etc.
Tbh, I think things have gone too far, and TT sport is probably irrecoverable now.
Really noob question, are roundabouts pot luck with cars? Or do they get closed off or course don’t go around them?
Pot luck, but all courses are subjected to traffic flow tests so it’s quite unlucky to be held up. In this particular race you had to navigate 16 roundabouts total and I reckon I lost 3-4s in total on them for cars with one impeded roundabout.
@AlexDowsettOfficial Same here I got stuck up waiting for 2 cars to go round one of the round abouts during this event so lost about 45 seconds to a minute
Potluck so don't race in Milton Keynes or you might have a cow.
Other one is, how do organisers handle occasional drafting when a car is in front.
@@SteveNinetyski always funny to see some riders doing 300w and going almost 30mph cus they're on a busy fast road drafting cars the whole way.
that blue and white ribble is an insane build🔥🦚
thank 😐👍
I think that is pretty stock in terms of handlebars and frame
@@joneinarmattiasvisser6113 it’s a custom paint job and has a peacock on it. shame it’s so heavy
btw non-cotton tan tyres like gp5000 have higher rolling resistance than their regular black versions
And red bikes are faster
The fact you said you ‘didn’t know how I feel about my bike set-up’ says it all.
“When in Rome” 😂 your videos crack me up man.
So many rules for road bike TT makes it hardly feel 'welcoming'
If you're riding a 'normal' road bike you'll be well within the rules. The rules are only there to stop the discipline losing all meaning and basically becoming another TT bike-lite category
Which is exactly what it is!
@@gregspeakie4635 Except it hasn't stopped that, because look at the bike that won!
I think the issue is actually the lack of rules to be honest. They’re vague and open to interpretation. Problem is in a predominantly volunteer run event more rules means more people/processes to enforce them, means higher costs/higher entry fees etc. I think they should give George the win and then clarify the rules further for next year.
@@AlexDowsettOfficial Not sure I agree. You don't need more rules, everybody knows what a road bike is and it's fairly easy to look at a bike and go "yep, that's a road bike". TT bikes are quite clearly not in the spirit of the rules, even if they're within the letter of them and allowing them to be in the rules will only discourage new riders into the sport IMO. I can't find any reference online to the E119 without the word "tri" after it and it's not even in the "Road" category of Argon18's website, ergo not a road bike regardless of what bars are attached to it.
Blimey there where never any of that back in my day helmets disc wheels allowed up to you at the end of the day its your fitness
well deserved award Alex
I respect the effort George put in within the rules, as you have graciously said he won - simplez really it should be awarded as a win because it is..Good on you Alex
The idea behind having a road bike category was to allow riders of all abilities to enter. having raced road bike TT's it is now turning into another arms race much the same as the TT bike races. Limitations should be brought in to allow a level playing field but at the same time, allow for technology.
When I read the 'rule' about forearms I knew there'd be trouble
For next year, the tan wall 5000s are slower than the black tires
I still think the road bike rules need looking at,don't agree with the 90mm wheels for a start. Interesting riders where mainly on the brake hoods for the ride i need to try that.
All the road pros are on the hoods now that puppy paws are banned. Wind tunnel testing apparently shows you want a 90 degree bend at the elbows.
I thought the black GP5000 rolls faster than the tan wall ones.
Is entry on the BC website?
CTT
Keep it simple and measurable.
Uncovered ears, rim depth, spoke count. Bar width maybe.
It would be amusing to go trad, round frame tubes and 1970s depth wheel rims but you'd alienate a lot of people 😂
I have run an event for pre 1990 bikes, was fun and not particularly serious. Oldest bike was 1890, not aero.....
My rules would be
Cowhorn handlebars, flares, 19mm tyres and dynamo lights.... shame I can't get on the CTT committee.
Was Hutch trolling you with his gold coat? 😅
What an aero haircut! :)))))
I don't get the rules regarding ears must be showing and no viser. Well: the new poc helmet is a road helmet, it is marked as such amd used as such. It has a visor and covered ears (partially). Why tf
You would like to hope that at this level of racing, a closed circuit would be used to truly provide an equal playing field. Acess to one is no doubt difficult or even available. Seems from some comments a lot got hindered
It would be nice, but costs of the use of circuits are high, part of the charm of CTT events is that open roads means the sport exists and races are super abundant
That 5 o’clock shadow must’ve cost you 30seconds?…
Is a TT bike with road drop bars worth 41 seconds over that S-Works build on a 22 mile course? You bet your ass it is, and George knows that damn well.
That's why he used it. TT bikes are far more aggressive than any Cervelo S5 or S-Works Tarmac/Allez will ever be.
You were the true winner of that.
I disagree
@@AlexDowsettOfficialwell you’re a true sporting gentleman you would say that but at the end of the day George (he is an amazing athlete) was using a set of drop handlebars that are over £800 with extended reach on the tops handlebars that allow you to rest your lower upon allowing you to adopt a TT bike position. This goes against the whole making the sport more accessible thing. As you said at the start of your video the sport isn’t exactly flowing in popularity at the moment this bullsh*t isn’t helping. Don’t even get me started on the TT frame.
Decent result!
Regarding the rules, it seems like it’s a road bike frame TT race.
As someone who doesn’t have a road bike (but just likes your content), I would expect a road bike TT to be completed on a bike the rider would be happy to do a long ride on.
So if there’s any disputes with bike set up, a 100km+ ride using that set up should settle it.
Obvs wouldn’t happen, but would certainly make it more inclusive, wouldn’t it?
They can all do 100 km on those bikes.
@@alexanderhardy971fair comment.
My suggestion was more towards proving the use of the bike on the road over a sustained period, than the actual value.
Perhaps there needs to be a sub clause that you can’t take pain relief for up to 24 hours after…them hoods don’t look comfortable, and a monster chainring would soon lose its edge
I think they just need to define the dimensions of what a regular road drop bar can be, or copy britishcycling's road bike regulations (same as UCIs) since the idea was that you could do a TT on the same bike that you could do a crit/road race on, but with his bike it is not BC/UCI legal so he wouldn't be allowed to do a road race or at least he would be at risk of disqualification if anyone noticed it.
@albr4 his bike is bc legal. Bars are comfortable and chainring is fine if you live on flat ground. I managed a 58 tooth 1x with 80 watts less than George.
@@bobmckenzie394 I use a TT frame with road handlebars year round and have done 150 mile rides on it, the geometry really isn't that different and frankly this is all a fuss about nothing.
A spec bike the same for all riders (apart from size) would be an interesting TT category if what they are doing is to make it a pure human performance category. Same for the hour record . They should have a rental fleet for people to attempt it on. I dont see this really saving a lot of people money. Money will never be taken out of the equation. People will spend 12000 on a "Road" bike.
George Fox raced on a TT bike lol
TT Frame with Dropbar or TT Bike with Extensions?
@@bababaanarama depends what you define a drop bar as, I wouldn't call them standard drop bars but also not TT bars, they're a hybrid. It's a new type of bar with long reach which allows you to rest your elbows in the same way as a TT bar while still having normal shifters and a drop section. I also saw he had foam elbow pads but I'm not sure he used it in competition because that would 100% be against the rules.
@@bababaanaramalooks like it was the Argon 18 TT/tri frame with drop bars. Dunno what the rules are.
Despite what Alex has said in the pinned comment, for me this completely goes against the entire point/spirit of having a separate road bike category.
@@albr4the gravel bars ?
Short and simple as you said. The rules are what they are and George did everything within the rules. Don’t criticize him. Criticize the rules if anything.
George is as much a victim here as anyone. I've had minimal contact with him but he has always come across as a really nice person as well as being a strong cyclist. I believe that he has raced within what he thinks the rules are, and his opinion of how to interpret the rules are probably better than mine. My view is that road bike TTs should be just that: equipment that you are allowed to use in a road race. Let's get more people doing TTs and make them accessible and let the cyclists power, decision and ability to execute a pacing plan dictate the winner rather than how close to the edge of the rulebook they can go.
Last w/e George in a 25, already having caught the eventual winner, was a DNF as he stopped to check on another rider who had come off.
After watching the video and reading your comment, i thought that this complaint was probably spiteful and a shame. Then i went and looked at a picture of the bike. Thats a triathlon bike with a road handlebar grafted on. Its a frankenbike.
I understand the comments about “spirit” not being rules, but that bike takes the piss.
As per the rules creator;
“The concept i had was essentially ‘do a crit on friday, sportive on saturday and a TT on sunday, all on the same bike”
Clearly cant take the title away from him this year, but that set up should be outlawed in some way in future. The whole point of the road bike tt as you describe was to encourage participation by lowering the barrier to entry, but look at the extent someone will go to just to ‘win’.
How does that victory even feel good? He clearly put out incredible power, why overshadow it so much by riding frankenbike and clearly taking advantage of an organisation that wanted fewer rules and easier access.
What are you on about? You could 100% do a crit and a sportive on that bike. The differences between that frame and an aero road frame are minuscule, the main difference being the seat tube angle. But even 'standard' road frames have variation in seat tube angle, so I'm not sure why that frame is so obviously wrong? As far as I see it, it's the shape of a road bike, it has drop bars, it's fair game. Also, many in the field are and have been using old rim bike TT frames with road bars on for years, so it's been pervasive for some time and not an issue either.
@@BevandEdMusic i didnt actually say you couldnt do a crit or sportive on that bike. But lets be honest, you wouldnt. A 160k sportive on that thing would be horrific.
Im not saying that there hasnt been tt bikes and road handlebars used in the past, but i think that that set up takes the piss and should be banned going forward. Nothing changes for this result.
@@tommibwoi I use a TT frame with road bars and have done 150 mile rides - the geometry differences are just not that big a deal. The only real way it differs to a road bike is like a 4 degree difference in seat tube angle... Is that really enough to make it not a road bike?!
Now I could see a case for those bars being banned because to me they facilitate a more TT like position than your standard road bar.
If you have a bespoke bike, what’s the point? Merckx TT rules would be better if that’s the goal. That’s a road bike with shallow depth wheels if anyone is unfamiliar.
Disqualified for pairing that helmet with that get up.
I raced that day, it was awful conditions. Not sure I agree about nice course for a rb tt, that was the worst rb course I've ridden, should be more technical.
George just needs to be awarded the champs, he broke no rule. Those getting upset about 'spirit', well thats spirit not rules. If anything, the spirit of TT is to develop an aero position and use ingenuity based on the rules. Both of which George did, he should be applauded not treated like this.
The course had changed twice from more technical course
@@david131092 and the A1 was the third best course?
@@qwerty261 it wasn’t on the a1 but the great north road - I have been told it was because of the low traffic count
@@david131092 fair enough on the road name. Nevertheless, purely choosing this course because of low traffic was a bad choice. I'm sure there are many courses of minor A or B roads which have a lower traffic count locally that could have been used as the third choice. Anyway just give George his win and let's move on from this shambles all round.
Hutchinson absolute legend too.
I think they should just follow the UCI (CTT already has the no resting forearms rule), but the officials should determine whether the riders are using their forearms/elbows to support their weight - e.g someone sticking foam padding onto the tops for your elbows would be an easy DQ or if the back half of their forearm is resting on the bars. The UCI banned the speeco bars with the extremely long reach because it was obvious that they're designed to support your forearms, CTT should follow this. Whats the point of having a road bike category if you allow riders to have elbow pads and sit in a near identical position to a TT bike just with a slightly wider stance? By allowing this it means that someone could literally just put a drop section on the end of some custom TT extensions with some road shifters and then claim they're drop bars. I know the CTT takes pride in allowing riders to use whatever equipment but they need some dimension regulations for road drop bars such as "minimum distance between levers 28cm, maximum reach 100mm"
The Speeco bars now aren't banned by the UCI. They only banned the mk1's with the channelled top but the mk2 have the same reach forearm support and are legal.
@@bdyer4606 yeah they've just recreated the same thing but slightly different to get around the ban, no doubt if anyone used it in a race again the uci will ban the new ones too.
Only one complaint. Peterborough is not in the South East 🤣
Would love to see time trials on straight road bikes, no corners cut. I hate what TT has become. Just race a road bike.
George prob would have that TT on any bike really as he is rapid
When I first heard about this I thought it was a great idea. Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't the idea of a road bike-only category to try and level the playing field and make TTing a bit more accessible? I don't see any point in this if riders are going to adapt their bikes to the point that they no longer resemble what the average road rider uses nor can afford.
Kind regards,
A boring bastard
Valid points, as you pointed out the category was created to encourage anyone with a bike to give a time trial a go, so focusing on the entry to the sport. Subsequently I think the introduction of a national championships may have been the biggest error in it all.
@@AlexDowsettOfficial I’m not sure if having a nationals for the road bike category is necessarily a problem in it self. I agree that the category could function as an entry point for beginner racers. However, racing experience and a whopping FTP don’t necessarily grant you access to fast equipment either. There just isn’t enough money in the sport for every strong rider to be sponsored.
Now I’m not trying to advocate for the road bike category to be some sympathetic “for those who can’t afford a TT bike - category”, not at all. It’s a fact in an equipment based sport that someone’s performance is always going to be influenced to varying degrees by what bike they ride. It’s unlikely that someone would be able to win the national road race on even a £1000 bike but that hasn’t caused BC to open up a separate road category for “cheap bikes”. But with Time Trialing there does seem to be a sad futility about the fact that without using /riding X,Y and Z you’re just not even gonna get close no matter what your legs are like.
As admirable as it’s inception may be, the road bike category was always going to be susceptible to abuse. It defeats the object if the guys who are contesting the national TT title on their proper TT bikes also show up to smash the road bike category. Relying on anyone to compete in “the spirit” of the event is never going to work and is about as effective as relying on riders “common sense” in a Nat B road race. These abstract concepts just melt into thin air once people get a sniff of winning something.
I’d say don’t remove the national champs event but just have a serious rethink about what constitutes a road bike, as the differences between a pimped out road bike and a mid range bike are becoming so astronomical, that the term “road bike” itself no longer symbolises a level playing field.
@@conorwilliams234 I think there are a couple of things to look at, like how many 'crazy' bikes are there at this event and then also what people are seeing at the regular weekend events? From what I've seen/heard George was the only rider with a weird setup (and personally I have no issue with the frame anyway). And from what I've heard and seen myself, participation is up at TTs round the country with the road bike category being a big part of that, and by and large the riders entering that are all on standard road machines. So this is a bit of a storm in a teacup, there's one rider who has been known to go to the extremes who has pushed it a bit, so seems a bit silly to be so gloomy about the whole thing as it's otherwise done what it was meant to do!
I think allow the frame, ban the bars and ban the stupid bottle cages out back for anything under 100 miles. Keep it simple!
Sadly the sheer amount of rules in itself makes competitive cycling a farce.
Results to be announced in 2034...
Crank lengths ….is the idea behind them changing now ? Used to be longer the legs longer the cranks, but notice Pog is using smaller cranks now…
The legs doesnt have to go that high in compare to longer cranks, so the cycling movement is less limited by the hip flexibility.
More open hip angle allows better power output.
Wait, so has there actually been no official result from the race per the thumbnail?
Unfortunately there is an investigation into George’s bike. So at this moment in time there’s no official result
@@AlexDowsettOfficial I was hoping to see that in the video. I was like so what’s the controversy?
The title means you DO have a problem or weird biking clickbait.
It's quite clearly clickbait - this is TH-cam!
It's all about number 4, just say you failed with the rules as org and do better next year. Being in the unknown for so long is more against the spirit than trying to optimize everything
"enquiry" lol
Hmmm. Very troubled by this category. Absolutely right to bring it in, but it;s stated aim to provide easy cheap unintimidating entry to the sport for the newbie has been competly obliterated by well tuned and (very!) expensive bikes that are not exactly the "man on the street" bike. Ultimately, the top 10-20 would probably be the same riders, maybe even in the same order had bike rules been more stringently specced. Not the winners' issue, they competed within the rules. BUT, the rules suck if you can spend thousands on a converted TT bike to win in a category specifically aimed at selling the myth that you don;t need massive amounts of exensive aero kit to TT.
The RB category that you're so troubled by is not CTT "selling a myth", it is an attempt to improve participation. And the rules don't "suck", they were purposely open-ended. It's farcical that so many people slag off the UCI for sock length rules and other similar restrictions yet CTT's road bike rules aren't strict enough and everyone is supposedly gaming the system.
@@therider4909 So till now I've tried to dispassionately refer to the "aim" of the category (bring new riders in, encourage participation by making entry less intimidating). So how does glory hunting semi-pros on converted time trial bikes, aero'd to the max setting 18min 10s make TTs any less intimidating to the newbie? More likely to turn away yet more novices who feel the spend to be competitive is beyond them or that the riders look so dorky they'd rather not be associated with the sport.
@@lfoster7601 I think you're confusing a single obscure event (which 99% of regular cyclists in the UK wouldn't even have known about without Alex's video) with the purpose of the RB category in UK TTs. This single race, and the noise about George Fox's bike setup, will not deter people around the country from riding time trials, whether they are new to the sport or returning.
I'm willing to bet that the vast majority of negative comments on here are made by people who are not involved in UK TTs and have not even considered participating. They just like to have a dig about someone or something that they decided they don't like. It's ironic that the person staunchly and repeatedly defending George's bike setup is the only person in the whole world who would actually benefit from George being DQ'd. The moaners are just bitching for the hell of it.
Venge, Zipp 808’s. It’ll be yours
I wouldn’t bother with TT on a road bike. Like racing a sport car track on a jeep. It’s a TT. Allow TT bikes. So odd.
They are allowed in TT bike races. This one is a separate, new category for those of us that cannot afford another £xxk for a specialist bike. Boosts participation which is important for GB cycling.
No one wants to win from a DQ. Just ask Andy Schleck.
Lol, road bike TT nationals is a contradiction in it self.
I remember going to a local 10 in Harlech in North Wales. Did 27.40. Barely anyone there bothered to say hello. Got to 24 .20. managed shrug off a few. Fastest man was the nicest by miles. Rest were weird frankly. Chippy or closed. Didn't bother after 7 goes. Decided they were arseholes. I got faster but binned TT's as being too clicky and it simply wasn't worth the effort.
haha exact same experience for me. No conversation whatsoever. One or two nice guys the rest acting like their mouths were sowed shut