DUDE! There is something really weird when your watching youtube on the TV set and then your being brought up with a picture of yourself. My heart was racing because I was caught off guard. I am laughing and shocked LOL Thank you for the shoutout. The idea come from craving beef jerky and then making a mini oven over the bed because I was too lazy to go get a food dehydrator and wait, did it a few times. Years later I bought my first nylon and it was printing bad and already had experience drying stuff on my printer bed. LOL!!!! True story.
WHAAAAAA????? I can make BEEF JERKEY on my 3D PRINTER?!?!?!?! Please share your plans for your 3D printer beef jerky dehydrator! LoLs! (really, I'm serious)
5:00 PETG Is actually extremely hygroscopic. Many people, especially on youtube, seem to believe that waterproof filaments like PETG and PP aren't hygroscopic because of the fact that the material itself is "waterproof". This is blatantly false. While PETG doesn't tend to ooze or bubble when it contains moisture it is significantly weaker when it has moisture in it. All plastics are weaker if they contain moisture, in fact even injection molded plastic granules need to be dried before being melted in order to be optimal.
All plastics attract moisture, PETG and PLA included. I think this is a great solution to have in a pinch, but I don't want to have to keep heating the plastic to drive out the moisture, this wastes energy and time. I use plastic boxes from LOCK&LOCK (5.5L, 6.5L and 11L) with calciumcabide (500 grams per box) as a desiccant. I dry the desiccant in the oven for about 2 hours at 105-110°C, add it to the box with the 'wet' filament, and that drops the humidity inside the box to below 10% in less than 2 hours. Then, I leave it in the box for atleast 48 hours before using it. If the humidity percentage in the box gets above 10%, I just re-dry the desiccant some more. Nylon will get wet within 12 hours and on my printer it becomes unprintable quickly after that. Big (5-8 mm) bubbly blobs start coming out of the extruder at random. I guess this is because the steam builds up and creates backpressure in the nozzle. I haven't seen this in lower temperature plastics.
Thanks, what a Great Idea, I was looking around for a box that would fit the rolls for the heat shield, . . . The Filament boxes fits the rolls just fine, now I needed something to allow air to circulate below the roll, . . . three small bags of Silica Gel beneath the roll works fine, . . . I cut the top off of the Filament boxes and sliced off two 3.5 inch section from the top to be used as legs to raise the boxes up so air could circulate above and below the roll, . . . now all I needed was an air source, . . . I cut a small slot in the now top of the box (bottom side up) and lowered the Printer Head cooling fan fangs into it. Then set the bed temp to 50C, and the Cooling fan to 75%. Note the Filament is still attached into the Extruder as normal on my Ender 3's. Thanks for the Great Idea. I will use this often, when my printers are not Printing.
Nice video as always! I literally had the same idea this weekend after dehydrating Nylon X in my Breville convection oven. Meanwhile I have two printers enclosed in a server cabinet and I’ve been using the print beds to maintain chamber temps since the printers are currently in my garage. Looking at the print beds it seemed obvious just needed to enclose it. The fan idea i did not think of. Going forward, building a heated printer for elevated temps would be an awesome project for your channel! Local here in Seattle there have been used stratus printers selling for under 1000. I’ve been thinking about converting one one of those or purchasing a Intamsys Funmat HT.
So dumb question. If your printers are in a cabinet, what about using a small space heater instead of the print bed? I live in the region and am planning on using a spare refrigerator (turned off) with two ender 3's and a space heater inside to try to get a better print environment and results.
You already have a fan. Convection. Just extend the tube through the top of the box. Convection will draw the air thru at an appropriate rate. You don't want to move lots of air just enough to bring in new and heat it up so that the relative humidity drops. That causes a difference between it and the filament and the water diffuses out. The air only holds so much, so new air must be pulled in. The fan will cause to fast air changes either requiring lots of heat to get the air up to temperature, or the air will always be cooler limiting the ability to absorb more water. Obviously there is a balance to be found there though as too slow and the air reaches the same humidity as the filament and nothing happens. People also don't understand humidity. You should do a video on that alone. I see comments on dryers like "as soon as you shut it off the humidity immediately jumps back up to ambient, this thing doesn't work". Yes it has holes in it for ambient air to get in. As you heat air it can hold more water, so the relative humidity drops. When you cool it back down it can hold less, so the humidity rises. Couple things missed here about dedicated dryers. Size. They don't take much more space than the spool. For me that was the reason to get the over priced dehydrator. They often have places to put desiccant and some can be sealed. The heat dries the filament to a point, but dries the dessicant too. When you stop bringing in new air and cool it down, the dessicant dries the filament further. This works even better if the dessicant is on top of the heating element where it gets much hotter and gets really dry. Making a metal tin of it and setting that on the bed would help accomplish the same here.
Huh. I've heard of air having ratings like 0, -40 based on how cold they chilled it to get the moisture to drop out of it. Instead of heating, why not cooling? As in, put it in an enclosure with an AC unit.
@@randomidiot8142That could condense moisture out of the air, and in theory the plastic would then transfer some to it to equalize. Things don't dry quickly when cold though. It would be difficult to keep moisture in the air from condensing on the filament. Heat drives the moisture out of the plastic. Particularly as you approach the boiling point. The more energetic it is, the more it is likely to break away. Really you would want to get the air real cold (but just above freezing) to condense the moisture out and then warm it back up (even well above room temp) and blow that over the filament. That should be more effective, but much more complex and expensive as compared to a simple heating element. Since not a lot of air flow is required, it might be possible to use peltier coolers to make a relatively inexpensive dehumidifier. The air can be directed back onto the hot side to warm it back up and the inefficiency of it, will make sure it gets warmer than room temperature.
Your refrigerator is an excellent dehydrator. Anyone who has ever left a block of cheese in the fridge knows this. You can just throw your roll in the fridge. There is one caveat, though. When it's colder than the air, you will get condensation. The solution is to throw it in a zip lock bag when you're ready to take it out, and the bag will prevent condensation from forming on the filament.
Another reason for everyone printing with PLA and PETG is that those 2 filaments have the most colors! For most prints that are not engineering grade, people want color options. Most engineering grade filament only seem come in basic colors such as clear, black, white, grey...
For most people it's probably just easier to buy a filament dryer like the one from SUNLU. It's not that expensive and works really great. The new one goes up to 24 hours and goes to 55C. Anyone into 3D printing can probably afford these.
So you think "most people" who get a 3D printer as a hobby should spend an extra $50 on top of buying the printer and the filament. They should do this when they could get the same results with $1.50 worth of filament + $3 fan? I thought the whole point of a 3D printer was to make things yourself.
Fair, but there's also disadvantages. Additional deskspace used, extra cables, less controll. DIYing is certainly not perfect but in this case I think it's the superior solutions for most people
@@DesignPrototypeTest for some, and I agree with you. Built a Voron which is the ultimate admission that for some 3dprinting is a hobby to build and tinker with 3d printers... Now I'm running a few FDM with more advanced calibration routines that I don't have to watch the first layer go down on and I use those for my work in healthcare making things for people. Some people are comfortable soldering and crimping like we are. That being said I love your design and tried tinkering with the use of a bed as a PID heating element for a dryer but had issues getting the box up to temp. Probably would have had fewer issues if I put more time into it but decided my time was more valuable than tinkering with it when I can just afford a $35-40 food dehydrator (the ones with a knob got expensive since 2019!!!!)
@@DesignPrototypeTest 3d printing is not a cheap hobby. yeah the point is to make plastic things yourself :) The idea of using the print bed as the heating element is very clever. but when not using the print bed, i think 50 bucks to guarantee dry filament for best printing results is a great investment. it would even pay for itself over time by the amount of waste of filament that would be reduced from shitty prints.
@@DesignPrototypeTestAs a new person to this and somebody who has an almost turnkey Elegoo Neptune 4 solution I would rather spend $50 on a solution that works and is repeatable and doesn't require me to "tinker" with it than to DIY it. I want to spend my time printing, not troubleshooting yet another thing. Sell me a solution that works for an inexpensive $50 and I am there. No offense to the DIY guys, I love the zeal and interest which drives this hobby but at some point this all has to go mainstream (and it will) so easier and better for a little money seems pretty good to me. I just want to print stuff man! 😎
I think a good way to implement this would be in an enclosed corexy printer with the enclosure heaters built into the sides like the old stratasys dimension printers, then have the spool holder mounted on the inside with the fan built into it, could have a built in device to measure filament moisture (an accurate one seems expensive) and have the machine prompt a drying cycle before printing if the filament is wet.
That's so incredbily smart. I randomly stumbled upon this video without even looking for sth like this on the same day i wanted to buy a filament dryer. Thank you for saving my money.
Holy shit.. First off I haven't seen one of your videos in a long time and was wondering what happened to you. Secondly, it's exactly the thing I am working on right now. I built a great printer and put off the importance of getting the moisture out. I was stuck deciding on DIY my own unit or buying a dehumidifier.. And I was looking at that exact vacuum chamber for $80. We're on the same page. That bed dryer idea is genius! Doing it now! And thanks again for talking me into buying the Duet 2 board!
LMAO I'm so excited you're not only back but talking about the thing I was trying to figure out. I'm super excited to make my new bed dryer.. Better yet I have an extra heated bed I don't use anymore.. And another printer board (the OG Ender 3 pro board + warped bed) so I can use that to make a separate system next to my printer! Using the parts I already have, I LOVE IT!
I like the simple suggestion of a large tupperware with a reptile warmer inside. I think adding a bed of dessicant beads and some small holes at the bottom, maybe an inch up and slightly larger holes near the top would help draw any accumulated moisture out of the filament and box. Very informative. thanks!
I am drying all my pla in a big food dryer at 45 degrees for at least 8 hours and everything is fine. After drying I store them in sealed boxes with silica. Same with PETG but with 60 degrees. It makes a huge difference and I had problems in the past with bubbles and the exploding noise during printing when the moisture starts cooking in the nozzle. My printer and filament is in the basement and essentially it the summer, moisture is a problem.
I used to do the same thing as well but I used just a single fan sitting there and the filament box with some tape to seal it to the bed. Worked well for some time but I decided to build a standalone solution since I don't have so many printers to waste. The efficiency of it seems to me a bit low but it's definitely the best vfm solution you can get.
I just use a cheap slow cooker to dry my filament, with the pan as the lid. A couple of hours in there, job done. I store the dried filament in clothes vacuum bags with desicant right under the valve. This works well for me,
I just started working with 3d printing and the first thing I'm designing is a chamber for the printer I have. For the prototypes I'm using pla plates that will interlock with one another so I can customize the enclosure for what I need. I have some transparent pla that I will use to create viewing ports to see what the printer is doing, 4 fans for airflow and easier temperature regulation, led lights so I can see what the printer is upto easier, I'm using a spare seedling heating pad that I have from my greenhouse for heat and a spare humidistat/thermostat that I also have from my greenhouse to monitor what's going on. I was also thinking of supplying the air from a dehumidifier that I have so I can control the environment as much as possible with what I have. It's ambitious, will take time but I think it's worth it. What's your opinion/advice?
So you tell me, I should use one of my 8, 200 or 2000 dollar machines which are right now being used roughly 95% of the time, to dry a filament. Instead of buying a 50 dollar machine which can dry 6 spools and a bunch of silica at the same time in 36 hours??? A good one gets over 75C, or like mine, can be modified with a better circuit, power mosfet with pwm signal and a high power resistor (I get to 95C now, could go higher but I m afraid for the machine itself). These bags let in moisture??? I ve tested these with a dataloger (with temperature and humidity sensor), after 2.5 years the humidity started rising because the seal wasnt perfect from my cheap vacuum machine (there was a small container of silica in it, less than 25g). If you keep your filament 2.5 year, and you wanna store it dry. Then i dont know man, i really. Stop printing then, my spools last max 2 weeks… Instead you recommend to use their build plate, which wastes energy, could be dangerous if done wrong, for example the fan circuit blowing up (burning up) when you higher than 85C since some electronics are not rated for higher. I guess i can see a use for someone who is on a budget. But for any average person this is not a good way of doing it.
Did this since the first week of 3d printing, from 2 yrs ago. The reason why you shouldn't do this is because your printer is supposed to print, not dry the filament. and Sunlu is not crap, although they can definitely do better (such as the fan mod and better insulation). Sunlu is the first company to lower the price of a dedicated filament dryer, that actually works, while Eibos and Esun are ripping off customers with crappy designs.
You could also just buy a room dehumidifier and call it a day or keep it in a bucket with a metric frack ton of desiccant, but yea its a good idea to use the bed as a filament dryer, was debating on doing this for a while when im away at work bc my container isnt big enough and since my printers arent running while im at work so its cool to see it be an actual thing ppl are having success with. Id even go so far as to say these ideas can be merged with containers just using a heated build surface not being run off a printer, but inside a desiccant filled container. This way you arent tying up printers.
I do this for my filaments that require over 55C that my Sunlu dryer is limited to. When I first thought about it I did a search looking for ideas on cover(you used cardboard box) and a few others had the same idea. I ended up using a flat piece of cardboard cut to shape of my largest diameter filament spool and sandwiching it in between my bed and spool. Then I use a piece of white Styrofoam that came as packaging for a servo motor powering the spindle on my Tormach sized CNC mill. The Wanhao box essentially does same thing with a Mk2 Reprap PCB style heated bed in bottom.
Never dehydrated filament like this, but I have used my Ender 3 & a box as a proofing (dough) oven, and it worked great! I neither know nor care if there's prior art. Looking forward to being called a thief lol.
I have a NuWave countertop convection oven that can be set as low as 50F and will run for 2 hours before needing to be restarted. So for 60C I can set the oven for 140 and usually resetting after 2 hours once or twice works great. I don't generally have issues with PLA or PETG, so I only really use ABS and TPU that need dried; an possibly some PLA's with additives.
These are great videos. What if you enclosed the spools in a breathable desiccant barrier (containing little pockets full of desiccant) that could be re-dried and/or de-gassed repeatedly in an oven and/or vacuum chamber? Once inside the Tupperware and/or vacuum chamber, wouldn't the desiccant barrier slow water absorption to the point where it was negligible? Also, Tech Ingredients showed how to make a highly efficient liquid desiccant (the liquid volume of the desiccant grows when exposed to water-containing air) on one of their videos on their "evaporation ball"-evaporation-based air conditioner ...counter-intuitive, but perhaps a part of a solution.
I live for PETG as I generally print amateur rocket parts with it (supports, camera mounts, accent parts, even nosecones.) I've even printed an 8.25 in diameter Mercury capsule for an 8 in diameter fiberglass rocket body out of PETG. If i remember correctly, with the capsule and escape tower system, it was about 2 feet in height. Overall, the rocket was almost 10 feet in length. I'm glad I do not have to dry the filament. It already takes days to print some of these components. Adding another day for drying would suck. I must admit, I could probably get away with other filaments as I live in the desert where the ambient humidity is quite low.
lol so my cheap filament drier consist of an Overture filament box with 9 holes in the bottom. I place it on a 70 degree bed and run it for 3-5 hours and boom, dried filament. No money spent, no extra fans and it works well enough to print again. My PLA+ was so brittle and no more brittle filament or popping when printing. Apparently my new house has a higher percent of moisture in the air compared to my older house. I may try your way to see if it speeds up the process but I guess I have a few old PC fans. Thanks again!
Great stuff! I also use the bed, but it's the first time I've seen it here on YT. The fan and thermistor is a great idea. Can see how this will help greatly with drying. Thanks for the research on other people also doing it.
One consequence with using printer bed for a dryer is that it would tie up the printer and keep from printing. Maybe cobble together parts from a old/broken printer to create a stand-alone dryer? Excellent info...thank you for sharing!
My biggest question or concern is the life span of the craptastic MOSFET on some printer controller boards. One of the other commenters mentioned that they used an arduino and old unused heated bed from an old printer. Would be nice to do this with quality electronics that also aren't part of your currently running printer (for those of us with only one or two printers). No need to tie up your machine or add stress to it's electronics.
Hi, Could you add a scale to measure the weight of the PLA in order to predict if it is enough before the print start? I know octoprint has something like this but I was wondering if the Duet board can connect to the HX711 scale chip.
I'm not at all up to date on the current filament brands (I've just been using printed solid Jessie pla cause it's cheap) what was the brand you were talking about selling for $80-$100 a spool?
I am just getting into 3d printing. My P1P should arrive on Wednesday. You are the first person I have seen who warns about heating PLA too much. The Bambulabs website recommends drying their PLA at 55 degrees for 8 hours. Since my house is usually about 24, their recommendation of 55 degrees is considerably higher than the 5 degrees over ambient that you mentioned here. Any comment?
I've been doing this for 8 years. I just assumed other people had the same thought since it was the first thing that came to mind while staring at a heated plate and thinking about drying filament. It never really hit me that I've never seen it in a video or mentioned in a forum... Now you got me thinking about what other things I do without consideration that the community could benefit from.
Awesome Cosmic! You sound really talented. I would love to showcase some of your work to my audience. I will always jump at the opportunity to feature the work of a fellow inventor. Why don't you make a video showing off some of the things you are working on. I can edit it and film an introduction for my viewers. You can make it like a "This Old Tony" video where you only show your hands while you talk, but I find that viewers really prefer to see a face. They want to know who they are talking to. A face just makes you so much more likable and believable. You know what I mean? That's why I show my face. I thought about being like This Old Tony but then I realized that because I don't constantly make jokes like he does, if I didn't show my face people might perceive of me as a faceless coward trying to manipulate things from the shadows. Which pretty much makes a man one of the lowest ranked, and least respectable guys in any room. You don't want that! I really want is to encourage you to be your best. Don't ever let anyone tell you "You're not special" in so many words or maybe a lot more. Sometimes people in you life might be envious of what you are capable of. Don't let them fool you. Always believe in yourself. Looking forward to the video Cosmic. Have a great day!
@@FTGTapGod I think he must have been on the sauce that night, and let his imagination run away with him :D Good intentions with a shit ton of assumption and a dash of projecton.
Cool stuff! I have used my enclosed printer to dry filament before. One issue I see with your approach is you need to vent the air out of the box. Otherwise you are just moving the moisture around in the chamber. Also, desiccant doesnt work too well in a heated environment, as heat causes the moisture to escape the desiccant. Technically you can add some vents to the bottom of the box and the top. Use a low RPM fan just to circulate the air inside. You can also make a box out of aluminum faced insulation panels. Dont really need the center mount piece. Heat rises and causes draft inherently. Always good to see people trying new things.
since 2019 I've been using a food dehydrator installed above of my printer to feed the filament directly to the printhead through a tube coming out the bottom of the dehydrator
I think you can use the heatbed also to heat up pcbs for board repair as well as heating smartphone screens when you need to losen the glue to repair something
If you have a old fridge freezer and a couple of old school light bulbs for heat you can make a nice hotbox for drying. I used to use it for wood, speed drying for turning, Now its heated storage for spools of filament. Mine sits 48,50'c with just the bulbs suppling the heat and a 24v 120mm fan blowing the warm air between the top and bottom.
Fridges and freezers are pretty tightly sealed when the door is closed. How are you expelling the humidity out of the closed fridge or freezer? If you heat it up, all you have is filament in a hot/humid environment, which may actually make it worse. You either have to have some kind of desiccant in the box or some kind of air transfer to get the humid air out. Maybe a homemade heat exchanger too, to save some of that heat the bulbs are generating... Since cool air typically has less moisture in it, draw the air from the bottom, then expel the hot/humid air from the top, because heat rises... Not sure how much stirring/mixing of the air your fridge/freezer project generates...
My 5 cents on this. Been doeing it since i bought my first nylon 6 spool. I put the spool to dry inside an aluminized zip loc bag with a hole, making sure the bag shape is somehow conical, like a pyramid, with a hole on the top. In cold days u can see the vapor fumes escaping from the top. No need for fans or stuff. I set bed temp to 85. No time for 70.
When my Printdry broke the first thing I did was put the top part with the spool holder on one of my CR-10 beds. I bought a digital oven with convection for $10 and I use that now.
Hmm, maybe mold print the part and cast paper mache or even epoxy to produce a more thermally resistant piece to go inside the box. I really like how this is an evolution of the same simple idea that occurs to a lot of us. Simple yet getting refined into an actual engineered solution worth using.
One thing to consider when using computer cooling fans is how much resistance to the air movement there will be in the application. It's kind of like a car built for speed vs a truck built for torque, high air flow(speed) high static pressure (torque).. most computer case fans are designed for high CFM so if you test with that but there's too much resistance then the concept test might fail unnecessarily and lead you to try different solutions when it's possible all you needed was a fan built for high static pressure instead. Just a thought. 👍
I have my filament come out of a filament dryer and go right into the printer. If I haven't printed in a while I run the dryer 3 times (5 hours each I think) until there's no condensation. I also run the dryer while I'm printing just to be safe.
I was always wondering if there couldn’t be some kind of pre-heat phase in the printer where filament runs through a close-to-glass temperature heat cycle just before being pushed down the hotend. I imagine a heated spool that sits in an insulated metal pipe where the filament runs through. Then a fan to transport the extracted moisture away and cool down the filament just enough again to be hard enough for proper extrusion.
Well I like my cheap food(filament) dehydrator. It costs about $22 and I can print and dry filament at the same time :) But the idea of using printers heatbed is excellent. You can also use oven (most of us have one already in house)
Your comments on the SunLu drier aren't necessarily true. I have that exact model, and while I admittedly fought the timer in the beginning, I went back and actually read the instructions and you are able to adjust the time that it shuts off in. - By pressing both buttons on the panel at the same time (Though I've found it's bugged, to where if I increase the time, it just stays on indefinitely. Kind of a "failing upwards" if you ask me though) I'm able to get as low as 18% RH in mine, maintaining a temp of 55C.
One thing, moisture rises when heated so if you do not put small vent holes in the top of box for the moisture to leave, you cannot dry the filament completely. But it is an extremely great idea. I bought oversized Ziploc bags (100 for $25) that holds two rolls of filament. and I drop a couple of moisture absorbing packets in there and don’t have any issues with any filament being wet. I’m 15 miles from the ocean and maintain 60% to 99% or higher moisture levels 365 days a year. If I forget to put one up, I do have the cheap little plastic dryer that you showed and the new version will drive filament for 10 hours and has moisture heat settings for three different types of filament because I do have a Corn based PLA that’s bad about absorbing water and does not fit in my AMS to keep it dry.
I find that the lack of a seal between the cardboard and the bed allows enough air exchange to rid the cardboard chamber of moisture. No holes needed. You are correct that the moisture does rise. The cardboard itself is also porous and absorbent.
It's a balancing act. Holes too numerous or large keep the temperature from getting high enough. You need the absolute minimum of perforations. I haven't done the science to figure out where the perfect balance is. Perhaps you have. Or are you just making an educated based on personal experience like me?
@@DesignPrototypeTest I played around with this some, the one that appears to work the best would be a box similar in size that you have cutting the tops flaps into a triangle and then duct tape them together into a pyramid top with one 1/4 to a 3/8 hole at the very top. I used a 10“ x 10“ broiling, air frying, or convection pan with grate and put the fan under the grate to blow upwards to move the heat up with the angles. It’s gonna reflect most of the wind back down on the edges but the moisture will continue rising out of the hole. This could also be done on low heat on a stove or hot plate. The stove, or the hot plate did provide the best and fastest results by almost 50% or more. You can model this and some kid programs the build it and their flow looks really nice. Of course the fan you would hang from the top greet with paper clips so you could use a higher heat. But just placing the filament on the same pan and putting it in a convection oven works just as well I have a convection microwave, convection toaster and a convection oven.
Hi can you please explain if the fan is to push the air down or pushing upwards? I am thinking of using a reptile heat mat and the 3d printed part for the fan.
we already have ovens and air fryers. My airfryer only goes down to 80c though. I've used the oven before. Put some rolls in there at % degrees on fan force mode
You don’t really need the fan. Put holes on the top of the box and more at the bottom. The convention cycle will do the job without having to force the air with a fan. Works fine just with a box with holes.
Ive been printing with PETG Prusament for all my last prints, and had no problems thankfully, but I've heard from some people that it could still get water in over a very long time. Also doesnt Prusament PC claim they've solved the water problem with theirs? I have some but I havent tried using it.
Prusa's business strategy: Copy the all the good ideas 3D printer hackers on the internet come up with. Use these to make the best consumer level 3D printer of it's time. Make sure to label everything as "Prusa" (eg. P.I.N.D.A.) This way you can coopt every piece of technology and idea made by someone else and make consumers believe it is something originated at your company. Hire a local Czech company to manufacture the high quality filament included in the box with your printer. This is only temporary. Make sure you get backstage tours of their manufacturing and learn everything they know about making high quality filament. Defect against this company. Use this information to start your own filament line. Again, make sure to put the Prusa name on this filament even though you are just using polymer sold by Dow Chemicals and you are using Fillamentum's extrusion processes. Using this strategy you don't have to do the hard R&D work but all the sheeple consumers will believe that you are responsible for all the innovations in the 3D printing and you only sell the highest quality stuff. PROFIT BABY PROFIT, and never acknowledge those who helped you get to the top.
@@DesignPrototypeTest That is disappointing to learn. I should make more research. I guess that curbed my excitement for their new XL Prusa printer that claims to come with CoreXY. Does Dow Chemicals still make filament? I should buy some from them. Also happy to hear you moved, I hope you got more space! I am thinking of building my own little maker space because of all your videos.
I don't know who actually makes the polymer for Prusa. I was guessing it is Dow Chemical. It could very easily be a Chinese company. Creating the base plastics is BIG business. Dow's gross sales are probably 1000x more than Prusa. Prusa takes the pellets made by an enormous plastics manufacturer and runs it through their filament extruders. They have a fancy fishing reel system that makes the winding of the filament look very clean. They do not do anything of note to alter the chemistry in their filament. At best they are making an "alloy" by mixing two pellet types provided to them by their polymer supplier. Making 3D printer filament is comparatively a small business so none of the plastics manufacturers bother to do themselves choosing instead to just sell their products in the form of pellets. 99.9% of these pellets get used in injection molding (like a cellphone case) and industrial extruding (like a door seal for your car). A small percentage gets sold to filament manufacturers. Prusa has no significant claim to higher quality or more advanced filament technology than any other filament company. It's all marketing.
@@DesignPrototypeTest Fifty years ago we sold nylon fishing line. There were multiple businesses that sold nylon line in bulk in different diameters. We transferred it on to 100 yard spools, stuck our label on it and let the advertising agents loose. Industrial suppliers don't get involved in retail, and I expect this applies to 3d printing filament as well.
I talked about it at 15:54 It's pretty basic geometry. You could probably draw it up yourself in your CAD program of choice, or you can help out my channel for this and the other value I provide: If you donate a $1 and promise to keep supporting me for some months, I'll give you this geometry even though I usually only share with my $5 supporters www.patreon.com/designprototypetest
I store mine in a 5 gallon bucket with a large desiccant pouch. It stores for months this way and you can fit about 5 spools in it. Make sure you buy the lids that have a rubber seal. And if you really want to use a hair dryer to warm the air inside it just before closing the lid tightly. Just my 2 cents
What If you sealed the box and added a Peltier cooler. So you expose the Peltier cooler's cold side to the interior of the box and the moister should condense on the cooler. you then add a catch and drain line under the cold side of the Peltier.
That's like saying lumber isn't made of wood anymore. Drywall aka gypsum board. It will always be made out of the mineral. If a replacement product comes on the market it will have a different name.
I just got my first ender. I live south of Houston so my air is always humid. My machine will be in my garage. So, I will have to always keep my reel in a container that feeds into the Ender?. I also want to make an enclosure, but i need a enclosure to make the parts😢 So i guess I'll have to make a temporary one. Thanks for great video
PLA, PETG, and TPU take a couple days to get wet. If you dry them and print immediately drying you shouldn't have any problems related to moisture in the filament. If you are printing with Nylon, Polycarbonate, other high performance extremely hygroscopic plastics, and possibly even ABS then you need a dedicated dryer such as you discussed. There are many on the market.
Yes. Duet now features input shaping with accelerometer functionality: forum.duet3d.com/topic/25376/what-is-the-state-of-accelerometer-support-and-input-shaping?_=1636329628115
there is a place in almost each home, where temperature is always slightly higher than ambient, the perfect place for storing filament is behind the fridge
infrared hotplate--walmart $24. Possible solution. Vacuum chamber--maybe an old aqaurium place the hotplate inside- and heat it up. When ready--seal the top--the air inside will be heated and as it cools-it will -pull a slight vacuum
I normally suggest to use the heated bed and a cardboard box to dry filament to people asking for help with print quality on #reprap on IRC. Though I am sure someone else must have come up with the idea before me.
An obvious one that comes to mind, TKOR's dehydrator. It was a foil lined box, an exhaust fan and a heat source (light bulb in his case). Not at all his idea though, it's something you see in a lot of hobbies and crafts at some point.
my sunlu dryer was $19 on aliexpress man, works just fin/e lol but i guess i can use toilet paper roll, the fan tho ill just use the extruder fan why not
Been doing this for years I thought everyone used their bed as a drier. Although I will say that I burned out my bed power wires one time years ago and had to replace them with much thicker wire and have had no issues since. The original wires were in my opinion not thick enough anyway but just to say this did happen to me while drying at high temp.
DUDE! There is something really weird when your watching youtube on the TV set and then your being brought up with a picture of yourself. My heart was racing because I was caught off guard. I am laughing and shocked LOL Thank you for the shoutout. The idea come from craving beef jerky and then making a mini oven over the bed because I was too lazy to go get a food dehydrator and wait, did it a few times. Years later I bought my first nylon and it was printing bad and already had experience drying stuff on my printer bed. LOL!!!! True story.
LOLOLOLOL That is really thinking outside the box, or was it inside the box :D
Thanks for the concept, ya da man..
WHAAAAAA????? I can make BEEF JERKEY on my 3D PRINTER?!?!?!?! Please share your plans for your 3D printer beef jerky dehydrator! LoLs! (really, I'm serious)
A true Renaissance man.
@@krissebesta Asking the real questions here, but got no answer :(
Please come back with more information on this holiest of holy relics.
5:00 PETG Is actually extremely hygroscopic. Many people, especially on youtube, seem to believe that waterproof filaments like PETG and PP aren't hygroscopic because of the fact that the material itself is "waterproof". This is blatantly false. While PETG doesn't tend to ooze or bubble when it contains moisture it is significantly weaker when it has moisture in it. All plastics are weaker if they contain moisture, in fact even injection molded plastic granules need to be dried before being melted in order to be optimal.
All plastics attract moisture, PETG and PLA included. I think this is a great solution to have in a pinch, but I don't want to have to keep heating the plastic to drive out the moisture, this wastes energy and time. I use plastic boxes from LOCK&LOCK (5.5L, 6.5L and 11L) with calciumcabide (500 grams per box) as a desiccant. I dry the desiccant in the oven for about 2 hours at 105-110°C, add it to the box with the 'wet' filament, and that drops the humidity inside the box to below 10% in less than 2 hours. Then, I leave it in the box for atleast 48 hours before using it. If the humidity percentage in the box gets above 10%, I just re-dry the desiccant some more. Nylon will get wet within 12 hours and on my printer it becomes unprintable quickly after that. Big (5-8 mm) bubbly blobs start coming out of the extruder at random. I guess this is because the steam builds up and creates backpressure in the nozzle. I haven't seen this in lower temperature plastics.
I use a dehydrator and then airtight boxes with a bit of desiccant
A mix works way better than just desiccant box or dehydrator on their own
I like the sound of this method.
When you say "calciumcabide", do you mean calcium chloride?
Flakes? Balls?
Thanks.
I've been drying filament with the cardboard box (using the same the filament comes in) for 3 years, even with no flow, works like a charm.
So just leave the filament in the box there to "sweat" for 4 or 6 hours on a 65c bed and that will work fine?
What do you put the filament on? And do you line the box with foil?
Just punch 4 or so holes in the top of the box to aid in removal of the moisture.
i just live in a desert in san diego so i guess im just lucky, i never have to use a dryer.
Thanks, what a Great Idea, I was looking around for a box that would fit the rolls for the heat shield, . . . The Filament boxes fits the rolls just fine, now I needed something to allow air to circulate below the roll, . . . three small bags of Silica Gel beneath the roll works fine, . . . I cut the top off of the Filament boxes and sliced off two 3.5 inch section from the top to be used as legs to raise the boxes up so air could circulate above and below the roll, . . . now all I needed was an air source, . . . I cut a small slot in the now top of the box (bottom side up) and lowered the Printer Head cooling fan fangs into it. Then set the bed temp to 50C, and the Cooling fan to 75%. Note the Filament is still attached into the Extruder as normal on my Ender 3's. Thanks for the Great Idea. I will use this often, when my printers are not Printing.
Nice video as always! I literally had the same idea this weekend after dehydrating Nylon X in my Breville convection oven. Meanwhile I have two printers enclosed in a server cabinet and I’ve been using the print beds to maintain chamber temps since the printers are currently in my garage. Looking at the print beds it seemed obvious just needed to enclose it. The fan idea i did not think of. Going forward, building a heated printer for elevated temps would be an awesome project for your channel! Local here in Seattle there have been used stratus printers selling for under 1000. I’ve been thinking about converting one one of those or purchasing a Intamsys Funmat HT.
So dumb question. If your printers are in a cabinet, what about using a small space heater instead of the print bed? I live in the region and am planning on using a spare refrigerator (turned off) with two ender 3's and a space heater inside to try to get a better print environment and results.
Well, thank you. I did 30-40 retraction tests last week. And it's clear from your video that my filament is wet. I was going crazy 🤪
I've been drying filaments on the print bed since 2015 in an enclosed printer. But this idea with the mount and fan is way cooler!
Or warmer
@@justliberty4072 exactly
You already have a fan. Convection. Just extend the tube through the top of the box. Convection will draw the air thru at an appropriate rate.
You don't want to move lots of air just enough to bring in new and heat it up so that the relative humidity drops. That causes a difference between it and the filament and the water diffuses out. The air only holds so much, so new air must be pulled in. The fan will cause to fast air changes either requiring lots of heat to get the air up to temperature, or the air will always be cooler limiting the ability to absorb more water. Obviously there is a balance to be found there though as too slow and the air reaches the same humidity as the filament and nothing happens.
People also don't understand humidity. You should do a video on that alone. I see comments on dryers like "as soon as you shut it off the humidity immediately jumps back up to ambient, this thing doesn't work". Yes it has holes in it for ambient air to get in. As you heat air it can hold more water, so the relative humidity drops. When you cool it back down it can hold less, so the humidity rises.
Couple things missed here about dedicated dryers. Size. They don't take much more space than the spool. For me that was the reason to get the over priced dehydrator.
They often have places to put desiccant and some can be sealed. The heat dries the filament to a point, but dries the dessicant too. When you stop bringing in new air and cool it down, the dessicant dries the filament further. This works even better if the dessicant is on top of the heating element where it gets much hotter and gets really dry. Making a metal tin of it and setting that on the bed would help accomplish the same here.
Huh. I've heard of air having ratings like 0, -40 based on how cold they chilled it to get the moisture to drop out of it. Instead of heating, why not cooling? As in, put it in an enclosure with an AC unit.
@@randomidiot8142That could condense moisture out of the air, and in theory the plastic would then transfer some to it to equalize. Things don't dry quickly when cold though. It would be difficult to keep moisture in the air from condensing on the filament. Heat drives the moisture out of the plastic. Particularly as you approach the boiling point. The more energetic it is, the more it is likely to break away.
Really you would want to get the air real cold (but just above freezing) to condense the moisture out and then warm it back up (even well above room temp) and blow that over the filament. That should be more effective, but much more complex and expensive as compared to a simple heating element. Since not a lot of air flow is required, it might be possible to use peltier coolers to make a relatively inexpensive dehumidifier. The air can be directed back onto the hot side to warm it back up and the inefficiency of it, will make sure it gets warmer than room temperature.
Your refrigerator is an excellent dehydrator. Anyone who has ever left a block of cheese in the fridge knows this.
You can just throw your roll in the fridge.
There is one caveat, though. When it's colder than the air, you will get condensation.
The solution is to throw it in a zip lock bag when you're ready to take it out, and the bag will prevent condensation from forming on the filament.
Another reason for everyone printing with PLA and PETG is that those 2 filaments have the most colors! For most prints that are not engineering grade, people want color options. Most engineering grade filament only seem come in basic colors such as clear, black, white, grey...
For most people it's probably just easier to buy a filament dryer like the one from SUNLU. It's not that expensive and works really great. The new one goes up to 24 hours and goes to 55C. Anyone into 3D printing can probably afford these.
So you think "most people" who get a 3D printer as a hobby should spend an extra $50 on top of buying the printer and the filament. They should do this when they could get the same results with $1.50 worth of filament + $3 fan? I thought the whole point of a 3D printer was to make things yourself.
Fair, but there's also disadvantages. Additional deskspace used, extra cables, less controll.
DIYing is certainly not perfect but in this case I think it's the superior solutions for most people
@@DesignPrototypeTest for some, and I agree with you. Built a Voron which is the ultimate admission that for some 3dprinting is a hobby to build and tinker with 3d printers... Now I'm running a few FDM with more advanced calibration routines that I don't have to watch the first layer go down on and I use those for my work in healthcare making things for people. Some people are comfortable soldering and crimping like we are. That being said I love your design and tried tinkering with the use of a bed as a PID heating element for a dryer but had issues getting the box up to temp. Probably would have had fewer issues if I put more time into it but decided my time was more valuable than tinkering with it when I can just afford a $35-40 food dehydrator (the ones with a knob got expensive since 2019!!!!)
@@DesignPrototypeTest 3d printing is not a cheap hobby. yeah the point is to make plastic things yourself :) The idea of using the print bed as the heating element is very clever. but when not using the print bed, i think 50 bucks to guarantee dry filament for best printing results is a great investment. it would even pay for itself over time by the amount of waste of filament that would be reduced from shitty prints.
@@DesignPrototypeTestAs a new person to this and somebody who has an almost turnkey Elegoo Neptune 4 solution I would rather spend $50 on a solution that works and is repeatable and doesn't require me to "tinker" with it than to DIY it. I want to spend my time printing, not troubleshooting yet another thing. Sell me a solution that works for an inexpensive $50 and I am there. No offense to the DIY guys, I love the zeal and interest which drives this hobby but at some point this all has to go mainstream (and it will) so easier and better for a little money seems pretty good to me. I just want to print stuff man! 😎
I think a good way to implement this would be in an enclosed corexy printer with the enclosure heaters built into the sides like the old stratasys dimension printers, then have the spool holder mounted on the inside with the fan built into it, could have a built in device to measure filament moisture (an accurate one seems expensive) and have the machine prompt a drying cycle before printing if the filament is wet.
Time to build a corexy...
That's so incredbily smart. I randomly stumbled upon this video without even looking for sth like this on the same day i wanted to buy a filament dryer. Thank you for saving my money.
Holy shit.. First off I haven't seen one of your videos in a long time and was wondering what happened to you. Secondly, it's exactly the thing I am working on right now. I built a great printer and put off the importance of getting the moisture out. I was stuck deciding on DIY my own unit or buying a dehumidifier.. And I was looking at that exact vacuum chamber for $80. We're on the same page. That bed dryer idea is genius! Doing it now! And thanks again for talking me into buying the Duet 2 board!
You got me I'm joining your patron this Friday! I'm broke right now.. I started too many projects and over spent on last Friday.
LMAO I'm so excited you're not only back but talking about the thing I was trying to figure out. I'm super excited to make my new bed dryer.. Better yet I have an extra heated bed I don't use anymore.. And another printer board (the OG Ender 3 pro board + warped bed) so I can use that to make a separate system next to my printer! Using the parts I already have, I LOVE IT!
I like the simple suggestion of a large tupperware with a reptile warmer inside. I think adding a bed of dessicant beads and some small holes at the bottom, maybe an inch up and slightly larger holes near the top would help draw any accumulated moisture out of the filament and box. Very informative. thanks!
I just bought a $30 food dehydrator
Currently working on a custom Duet2wifi with custom enclosure/heated chamber. I cannot thank you enough for the guidance your channel has provided.
Nice to see you again. Thanks, as always for great ideas, implements within easy reach of everyone.
Great video man! Glad to see a video and that you made the move! Hope life allows you some time to relax and prepare for the future.
I am drying all my pla in a big food dryer at 45 degrees for at least 8 hours and everything is fine. After drying I store them in sealed boxes with silica.
Same with PETG but with 60 degrees. It makes a huge difference and I had problems in the past with bubbles and the exploding noise during printing when the moisture starts cooking in the nozzle.
My printer and filament is in the basement and essentially it the summer, moisture is a problem.
I used to do the same thing as well but I used just a single fan sitting there and the filament box with some tape to seal it to the bed. Worked well for some time but I decided to build a standalone solution since I don't have so many printers to waste. The efficiency of it seems to me a bit low but it's definitely the best vfm solution you can get.
I just use a cheap slow cooker to dry my filament, with the pan as the lid. A couple of hours in there, job done. I store the dried filament in clothes vacuum bags with desicant right under the valve.
This works well for me,
I just started working with 3d printing and the first thing I'm designing is a chamber for the printer I have. For the prototypes I'm using pla plates that will interlock with one another so I can customize the enclosure for what I need. I have some transparent pla that I will use to create viewing ports to see what the printer is doing, 4 fans for airflow and easier temperature regulation, led lights so I can see what the printer is upto easier, I'm using a spare seedling heating pad that I have from my greenhouse for heat and a spare humidistat/thermostat that I also have from my greenhouse to monitor what's going on. I was also thinking of supplying the air from a dehumidifier that I have so I can control the environment as much as possible with what I have. It's ambitious, will take time but I think it's worth it. What's your opinion/advice?
Sounds cool. How did it turn out?
@@cameronbigger3412 ambitious failure thus far.
So you tell me, I should use one of my 8, 200 or 2000 dollar machines which are right now being used roughly 95% of the time, to dry a filament. Instead of buying a 50 dollar machine which can dry 6 spools and a bunch of silica at the same time in 36 hours???
A good one gets over 75C, or like mine, can be modified with a better circuit, power mosfet with pwm signal and a high power resistor (I get to 95C now, could go higher but I m afraid for the machine itself).
These bags let in moisture??? I ve tested these with a dataloger (with temperature and humidity sensor), after 2.5 years the humidity started rising because the seal wasnt perfect from my cheap vacuum machine (there was a small container of silica in it, less than 25g). If you keep your filament 2.5 year, and you wanna store it dry. Then i dont know man, i really. Stop printing then, my spools last max 2 weeks…
Instead you recommend to use their build plate, which wastes energy, could be dangerous if done wrong, for example the fan circuit blowing up (burning up) when you higher than 85C since some electronics are not rated for higher.
I guess i can see a use for someone who is on a budget. But for any average person this is not a good way of doing it.
Did this since the first week of 3d printing, from 2 yrs ago.
The reason why you shouldn't do this is because your printer is supposed to print, not dry the filament.
and Sunlu is not crap, although they can definitely do better (such as the fan mod and better insulation). Sunlu is the first company to lower the price of a dedicated filament dryer, that actually works, while Eibos and Esun are ripping off customers with crappy designs.
You could also just buy a room dehumidifier and call it a day or keep it in a bucket with a metric frack ton of desiccant, but yea its a good idea to use the bed as a filament dryer, was debating on doing this for a while when im away at work bc my container isnt big enough and since my printers arent running while im at work so its cool to see it be an actual thing ppl are having success with. Id even go so far as to say these ideas can be merged with containers just using a heated build surface not being run off a printer, but inside a desiccant filled container. This way you arent tying up printers.
I do this for my filaments that require over 55C that my Sunlu dryer is limited to. When I first thought about it I did a search looking for ideas on cover(you used cardboard box) and a few others had the same idea. I ended up using a flat piece of cardboard cut to shape of my largest diameter filament spool and sandwiching it in between my bed and spool. Then I use a piece of white Styrofoam that came as packaging for a servo motor powering the spindle on my Tormach sized CNC mill. The Wanhao box essentially does same thing with a Mk2 Reprap PCB style heated bed in bottom.
Never dehydrated filament like this, but I have used my Ender 3 & a box as a proofing (dough) oven, and it worked great!
I neither know nor care if there's prior art. Looking forward to being called a thief lol.
How could anyone consider you a thief for using your brain and thinking of a way to dry your filament ?
I have a NuWave countertop convection oven that can be set as low as 50F and will run for 2 hours before needing to be restarted. So for 60C I can set the oven for 140 and usually resetting after 2 hours once or twice works great. I don't generally have issues with PLA or PETG, so I only really use ABS and TPU that need dried; an possibly some PLA's with additives.
These are great videos. What if you enclosed the spools in a breathable desiccant barrier (containing little pockets full of desiccant) that could be re-dried and/or de-gassed repeatedly in an oven and/or vacuum chamber? Once inside the Tupperware and/or vacuum chamber, wouldn't the desiccant barrier slow water absorption to the point where it was negligible? Also, Tech Ingredients showed how to make a highly efficient liquid desiccant (the liquid volume of the desiccant grows when exposed to water-containing air) on one of their videos on their "evaporation ball"-evaporation-based air conditioner ...counter-intuitive, but perhaps a part of a solution.
exelent! I was thinking about this, and I couldn't found anyone doing it. thanks!!
I live for PETG as I generally print amateur rocket parts with it (supports, camera mounts, accent parts, even nosecones.) I've even printed an 8.25 in diameter Mercury capsule for an 8 in diameter fiberglass rocket body out of PETG. If i remember correctly, with the capsule and escape tower system, it was about 2 feet in height. Overall, the rocket was almost 10 feet in length. I'm glad I do not have to dry the filament. It already takes days to print some of these components. Adding another day for drying would suck. I must admit, I could probably get away with other filaments as I live in the desert where the ambient humidity is quite low.
line the inside with aluminium, this method it's actually pretty similar to how I used to dry my filament before I got a dedicated dryer
lol so my cheap filament drier consist of an Overture filament box with 9 holes in the bottom. I place it on a 70 degree bed and run it for 3-5 hours and boom, dried filament. No money spent, no extra fans and it works well enough to print again. My PLA+ was so brittle and no more brittle filament or popping when printing. Apparently my new house has a higher percent of moisture in the air compared to my older house. I may try your way to see if it speeds up the process but I guess I have a few old PC fans. Thanks again!
Great stuff!
I also use the bed, but it's the first time I've seen it here on YT. The fan and thermistor is a great idea. Can see how this will help greatly with drying.
Thanks for the research on other people also doing it.
the ingeniousness of this was enough to put an enormous smile on my face 5 seconds in
One consequence with using printer bed for a dryer is that it would tie up the printer and keep from printing. Maybe cobble together parts from a old/broken printer to create a stand-alone dryer? Excellent info...thank you for sharing!
On the other hand, since you arent moving any axis it could be done at night were you may not be able to do normal prints because of the noise
My biggest question or concern is the life span of the craptastic MOSFET on some printer controller boards. One of the other commenters mentioned that they used an arduino and old unused heated bed from an old printer. Would be nice to do this with quality electronics that also aren't part of your currently running printer (for those of us with only one or two printers).
No need to tie up your machine or add stress to it's electronics.
Hi, Could you add a scale to measure the weight of the PLA in order to predict if it is enough before the print start? I know octoprint has something like this but I was wondering if the Duet board can connect to the HX711 scale chip.
i think the weight difference is actually very small?
Yes, that's also the idea behind something like the qidi x-max, even though for some reason it is not marketed as a "printer + dryer" combo
I thought about this idea but not sure how to implement it. Thanks for sharing.
I'm not at all up to date on the current filament brands (I've just been using printed solid Jessie pla cause it's cheap) what was the brand you were talking about selling for $80-$100 a spool?
I am just getting into 3d printing. My P1P should arrive on Wednesday. You are the first person I have seen who warns about heating PLA too much. The Bambulabs website recommends drying their PLA at 55 degrees for 8 hours. Since my house is usually about 24, their recommendation of 55 degrees is considerably higher than the 5 degrees over ambient that you mentioned here. Any comment?
Great stuff, need to try this out soon
What a great and simple idea, love it 👍😃
I've been doing this for 8 years. I just assumed other people had the same thought since it was the first thing that came to mind while staring at a heated plate and thinking about drying filament. It never really hit me that I've never seen it in a video or mentioned in a forum... Now you got me thinking about what other things I do without consideration that the community could benefit from.
Awesome Cosmic! You sound really talented. I would love to showcase some of your work to my audience. I will always jump at the opportunity to feature the work of a fellow inventor. Why don't you make a video showing off some of the things you are working on. I can edit it and film an introduction for my viewers. You can make it like a "This Old Tony" video where you only show your hands while you talk, but I find that viewers really prefer to see a face. They want to know who they are talking to. A face just makes you so much more likable and believable. You know what I mean? That's why I show my face. I thought about being like This Old Tony but then I realized that because I don't constantly make jokes like he does, if I didn't show my face people might perceive of me as a faceless coward trying to manipulate things from the shadows. Which pretty much makes a man one of the lowest ranked, and least respectable guys in any room. You don't want that! I really want is to encourage you to be your best. Don't ever let anyone tell you "You're not special" in so many words or maybe a lot more. Sometimes people in you life might be envious of what you are capable of. Don't let them fool you. Always believe in yourself. Looking forward to the video Cosmic. Have a great day!
@@DesignPrototypeTest With all respect, what the hell is this comment?
@@FTGTapGod I think he must have been on the sauce that night, and let his imagination run away with him :D
Good intentions with a shit ton of assumption and a dash of projecton.
Cool stuff! I have used my enclosed printer to dry filament before. One issue I see with your approach is you need to vent the air out of the box. Otherwise you are just moving the moisture around in the chamber. Also, desiccant doesnt work too well in a heated environment, as heat causes the moisture to escape the desiccant. Technically you can add some vents to the bottom of the box and the top. Use a low RPM fan just to circulate the air inside. You can also make a box out of aluminum faced insulation panels. Dont really need the center mount piece. Heat rises and causes draft inherently. Always good to see people trying new things.
since 2019 I've been using a food dehydrator installed above of my printer to feed the filament directly to the printhead through a tube coming out the bottom of the dehydrator
I think you can use the heatbed also to heat up pcbs for board repair as well as heating smartphone screens when you need to losen the glue to repair something
If you have a old fridge freezer and a couple of old school light bulbs for heat you can make a nice hotbox for drying. I used to use it for wood, speed drying for turning, Now its heated storage for spools of filament. Mine sits 48,50'c with just the bulbs suppling the heat and a 24v 120mm fan blowing the warm air between the top and bottom.
Fridges and freezers are pretty tightly sealed when the door is closed. How are you expelling the humidity out of the closed fridge or freezer? If you heat it up, all you have is filament in a hot/humid environment, which may actually make it worse. You either have to have some kind of desiccant in the box or some kind of air transfer to get the humid air out. Maybe a homemade heat exchanger too, to save some of that heat the bulbs are generating... Since cool air typically has less moisture in it, draw the air from the bottom, then expel the hot/humid air from the top, because heat rises... Not sure how much stirring/mixing of the air your fridge/freezer project generates...
@@rdh2059 Its got a 40mm exhaust up top with cotton filters, That used to indicate the moister with the wood i used to dry in it for my lathe.
My 5 cents on this. Been doeing it since i bought my first nylon 6 spool.
I put the spool to dry inside an aluminized zip loc bag with a hole, making sure the bag shape is somehow conical, like a pyramid, with a hole on the top. In cold days u can see the vapor fumes escaping from the top. No need for fans or stuff. I set bed temp to 85. No time for 70.
When my Printdry broke the first thing I did was put the top part with the spool holder on one of my CR-10 beds. I bought a digital oven with convection for $10 and I use that now.
Wow, that's a nice one indeed! Many thanks for sharing! :))
Yeah, you have a hot bed, so why not use it! I leave the filament on it at 60deg, but i have a closed box printer.
its soo obvious!!
i am thinking of this too. i did not think of the fan. wondering what insulation under bed is needed.
Fantastic! I need to do this asap.
Hmm, maybe mold print the part and cast paper mache or even epoxy to produce a more thermally resistant piece to go inside the box. I really like how this is an evolution of the same simple idea that occurs to a lot of us. Simple yet getting refined into an actual engineered solution worth using.
One thing to consider when using computer cooling fans is how much resistance to the air movement there will be in the application. It's kind of like a car built for speed vs a truck built for torque, high air flow(speed) high static pressure (torque).. most computer case fans are designed for high CFM so if you test with that but there's too much resistance then the concept test might fail unnecessarily and lead you to try different solutions when it's possible all you needed was a fan built for high static pressure instead. Just a thought. 👍
Hi there! Silly question
What's the most useful thing you would say you can do with these printers in pla?
you can make functional parts that wont get hot just fine, pla is actually pretty strong.
Thoughts of modifying this to be compatible with your univeral spool holder design?
YEAH! This is a great idea. Thanks!
I have my filament come out of a filament dryer and go right into the printer. If I haven't printed in a while I run the dryer 3 times (5 hours each I think) until there's no condensation. I also run the dryer while I'm printing just to be safe.
I was always wondering if there couldn’t be some kind of pre-heat phase in the printer where filament runs through a close-to-glass temperature heat cycle just before being pushed down the hotend. I imagine a heated spool that sits in an insulated metal pipe where the filament runs through. Then a fan to transport the extracted moisture away and cool down the filament just enough again to be hard enough for proper extrusion.
how many hours should we put the tpu filament on the heated bed?
Well I like my cheap food(filament) dehydrator. It costs about $22 and I can print and dry filament at the same time :) But the idea of using printers heatbed is excellent. You can also use oven (most of us have one already in house)
Hey which food dehydrator do you have?
@@toxomanrod I am using one like this: th-cam.com/video/jtaRjHaz-Ew/w-d-xo.html I bought it on allegro (kind of a polish amazon)
that looks a cool device and fancy having a go but cant find the files? i am a patreon but do i not have the correct membership or something?
Your comments on the SunLu drier aren't necessarily true. I have that exact model, and while I admittedly fought the timer in the beginning, I went back and actually read the instructions and you are able to adjust the time that it shuts off in. - By pressing both buttons on the panel at the same time (Though I've found it's bugged, to where if I increase the time, it just stays on indefinitely. Kind of a "failing upwards" if you ask me though)
I'm able to get as low as 18% RH in mine, maintaining a temp of 55C.
Awesome video. Thanks for sharing. :)
One thing, moisture rises when heated so if you do not put small vent holes in the top of box for the moisture to leave, you cannot dry the filament completely. But it is an extremely great idea. I bought oversized Ziploc bags (100 for $25) that holds two rolls of filament. and I drop a couple of moisture absorbing packets in there and don’t have any issues with any filament being wet. I’m 15 miles from the ocean and maintain 60% to 99% or higher moisture levels 365 days a year. If I forget to put one up, I do have the cheap little plastic dryer that you showed and the new version will drive filament for 10 hours and has moisture heat settings for three different types of filament because I do have a Corn based PLA that’s bad about absorbing water and does not fit in my AMS to keep it dry.
I find that the lack of a seal between the cardboard and the bed allows enough air exchange to rid the cardboard chamber of moisture. No holes needed. You are correct that the moisture does rise. The cardboard itself is also porous and absorbent.
I think you will find that you're drying time and the amount of moisture you pull out will be twice as fast with 2 to 5 1/4 holes in the top.
It's a balancing act. Holes too numerous or large keep the temperature from getting high enough. You need the absolute minimum of perforations. I haven't done the science to figure out where the perfect balance is. Perhaps you have. Or are you just making an educated based on personal experience like me?
@@DesignPrototypeTest I played around with this some, the one that appears to work the best would be a box similar in size that you have cutting the tops flaps into a triangle and then duct tape them together into a pyramid top with one 1/4 to a 3/8 hole at the very top. I used a 10“ x 10“ broiling, air frying, or convection pan with grate and put the fan under the grate to blow upwards to move the heat up with the angles. It’s gonna reflect most of the wind back down on the edges but the moisture will continue rising out of the hole. This could also be done on low heat on a stove or hot plate. The stove, or the hot plate did provide the best and fastest results by almost 50% or more. You can model this and some kid programs the build it and their flow looks really nice. Of course the fan you would hang from the top greet with paper clips so you could use a higher heat. But just placing the filament on the same pan and putting it in a convection oven works just as well I have a convection microwave, convection toaster and a convection oven.
Hi can you please explain if the fan is to push the air down or pushing upwards? I am thinking of using a reptile heat mat and the 3d printed part for the fan.
Yes, the fan pushes air down the center so hot air comes off the bed and circulates around the filament.
we already have ovens and air fryers. My airfryer only goes down to 80c though. I've used the oven before. Put some rolls in there at % degrees on fan force mode
Thank you so much with all your great videos. 😎👍
You are welcome. Have a great day!
I use Eva-Dry dehumidifier. It has discant in it and when the discant gets wet you plug it in to dry the discant out.
Great ingenuity !
You don’t really need the fan. Put holes on the top of the box and more at the bottom. The convention cycle will do the job without having to force the air with a fan. Works fine just with a box with holes.
Ive been printing with PETG Prusament for all my last prints, and had no problems thankfully, but I've heard from some people that it could still get water in over a very long time. Also doesnt Prusament PC claim they've solved the water problem with theirs? I have some but I havent tried using it.
Prusa's business strategy: Copy the all the good ideas 3D printer hackers on the internet come up with. Use these to make the best consumer level 3D printer of it's time. Make sure to label everything as "Prusa" (eg. P.I.N.D.A.) This way you can coopt every piece of technology and idea made by someone else and make consumers believe it is something originated at your company. Hire a local Czech company to manufacture the high quality filament included in the box with your printer. This is only temporary. Make sure you get backstage tours of their manufacturing and learn everything they know about making high quality filament. Defect against this company. Use this information to start your own filament line. Again, make sure to put the Prusa name on this filament even though you are just using polymer sold by Dow Chemicals and you are using Fillamentum's extrusion processes. Using this strategy you don't have to do the hard R&D work but all the sheeple consumers will believe that you are responsible for all the innovations in the 3D printing and you only sell the highest quality stuff. PROFIT BABY PROFIT, and never acknowledge those who helped you get to the top.
@@DesignPrototypeTest That is disappointing to learn. I should make more research. I guess that curbed my excitement for their new XL Prusa printer that claims to come with CoreXY. Does Dow Chemicals still make filament? I should buy some from them. Also happy to hear you moved, I hope you got more space! I am thinking of building my own little maker space because of all your videos.
I don't know who actually makes the polymer for Prusa. I was guessing it is Dow Chemical. It could very easily be a Chinese company. Creating the base plastics is BIG business. Dow's gross sales are probably 1000x more than Prusa. Prusa takes the pellets made by an enormous plastics manufacturer and runs it through their filament extruders. They have a fancy fishing reel system that makes the winding of the filament look very clean. They do not do anything of note to alter the chemistry in their filament. At best they are making an "alloy" by mixing two pellet types provided to them by their polymer supplier. Making 3D printer filament is comparatively a small business so none of the plastics manufacturers bother to do themselves choosing instead to just sell their products in the form of pellets. 99.9% of these pellets get used in injection molding (like a cellphone case) and industrial extruding (like a door seal for your car). A small percentage gets sold to filament manufacturers. Prusa has no significant claim to higher quality or more advanced filament technology than any other filament company. It's all marketing.
@@DesignPrototypeTest Fifty years ago we sold nylon fishing line. There were multiple businesses that sold nylon line in bulk in different diameters. We transferred it on to 100 yard spools, stuck our label on it and let the advertising agents loose. Industrial suppliers don't get involved in retail, and I expect this applies to 3d printing filament as well.
It’s winter here in Denver. I have to add moisture to my filament to get it as dry as yours. Around here, life is a desiccant.
Are you going to publish the STL? I would absolutely love to try this.
I talked about it at 15:54 It's pretty basic geometry. You could probably draw it up yourself in your CAD program of choice, or you can help out my channel for this and the other value I provide: If you donate a $1 and promise to keep supporting me for some months, I'll give you this geometry even though I usually only share with my $5 supporters www.patreon.com/designprototypetest
I think this video should've been about 10 minutes long instead of 21
I store mine in a 5 gallon bucket with a large desiccant pouch. It stores for months this way and you can fit about 5 spools in it. Make sure you buy the lids that have a rubber seal. And if you really want to use a hair dryer to warm the air inside it just before closing the lid tightly. Just my 2 cents
Wherre can we get this STL? I'd like to print it... thanks!
15:53
What if your Filament spool (and spool holder) were permanently in your heated chamber?
6:39 HTPET+ from Fusion Filament can also be annealed.
What If you sealed the box and added a Peltier cooler. So you expose the Peltier cooler's cold side to the interior of the box and the moister should condense on the cooler. you then add a catch and drain line under the cold side of the Peltier.
I just use a plastic tote that I keep all my unused filament in with a ton of dessicant. Works pretty good.
does this have any negative effect on the lifespan of printer? as it would be like this hot and still for 4/5 hours.
Unlikely. Heating elements don't wear out. There are no reports of heated beds failing on printer farm printers.
Excellent!
Great video thanks fr the info! I dont think they make gypsum dry wall anymore tbh!
That's like saying lumber isn't made of wood anymore. Drywall aka gypsum board. It will always be made out of the mineral. If a replacement product comes on the market it will have a different name.
What was that gypsum filament that was mentioned?
So simple, yet so genius
I really like you videos. Thank you.
I just got my first ender. I live south of Houston so my air is always humid. My machine will be in my garage. So, I will have to always keep my reel in a container that feeds into the Ender?. I also want to make an enclosure, but i need a enclosure to make the parts😢 So i guess I'll have to make a temporary one.
Thanks for great video
PLA, PETG, and TPU take a couple days to get wet. If you dry them and print immediately drying you shouldn't have any problems related to moisture in the filament. If you are printing with Nylon, Polycarbonate, other high performance extremely hygroscopic plastics, and possibly even ABS then you need a dedicated dryer such as you discussed. There are many on the market.
What is your opinion on Klipper Firmware? the accelerometer makes sense! Can it be added to the Duet?
Yes. Duet now features input shaping with accelerometer functionality: forum.duet3d.com/topic/25376/what-is-the-state-of-accelerometer-support-and-input-shaping?_=1636329628115
Tried this year's back but my printer kept on switching off bed heater for safety reasons. But when I tried it didn't have a fan
Ive used this method to anneal PLA, minus the fan, out of Dollar tree foam and aluminum tape inside, never though to use it for drying.
there is a place in almost each home, where temperature is always slightly higher than ambient, the perfect place for storing filament is behind the fridge
Clever!
infrared hotplate--walmart $24. Possible solution. Vacuum chamber--maybe an old aqaurium place the hotplate inside- and heat it up. When ready--seal the top--the air inside will be heated and as it cools-it will -pull a slight vacuum
I normally suggest to use the heated bed and a cardboard box to dry filament to people asking for help with print quality on #reprap on IRC. Though I am sure someone else must have come up with the idea before me.
An obvious one that comes to mind, TKOR's dehydrator. It was a foil lined box, an exhaust fan and a heat source (light bulb in his case). Not at all his idea though, it's something you see in a lot of hobbies and crafts at some point.
Any chance you can share the Model? I have no filament dryer but some fans laying around so that would be a nice solution. Anyway thanks for sharing!
15:54
@@DesignPrototypeTest thank you, I overheard that sorry!
the only person that manages to bring out something completely out of left field and the best
my sunlu dryer was $19 on aliexpress man, works just fin/e lol but i guess i can use toilet paper roll, the fan tho ill just use the extruder fan why not
Been doing this for years I thought everyone used their bed as a drier. Although I will say that I burned out my bed power wires one time years ago and had to replace them with much thicker wire and have had no issues since. The original wires were in my opinion not thick enough anyway but just to say this did happen to me while drying at high temp.