Tutorial on Improvising / Composing a Chopin Style Waltz
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 12 มิ.ย. 2024
- Concept, Music and Keys by Michael Koch.
Chapters:
00:00 Intro
00:42 On the “great” Tartarov
01:58 5-1-Cadences
03:16 Prolonged 4-Bar-Cadences + Licks
04:45 On 5-1-Pendulums
05:33 A 20-Bar-Phrase from 5-1’s
05:55 On 4-Bar Modularity
06:15 Simple 8-Bar example
06:43 refined 16-bar example
07:03 On 7-1’s
07:29 An 8-Bar 7-1-style with Half Cadence
07:52 A 16-Bar Period from a 7-1-Motive
08:16 A Fonte-Sequence drawn from a 7-1
09:05 A Chromatic Sequence drawn from that style
09:24 On Waltz Themes
09:39 A “classic” Sterotype
10:33 Melodic Alternatives on that Bass
11:02 Conterpoint Matters!
11:19 16-Bar Theme from that Opener
12:35 On Chopin’s Theme from Waltz in Ab
14:08 Chopin’s “Chaconnes”
15:11 A modified Version of that Theme
Follow me on Patreon and get access to all examples shown in the video and more practice materials on the subject:
www.patreon.com/posts/sheets-...
I do private lessons in GERMAN and ENGLISH in time zones all over the world. I provide a professional training based on up-to-date-scholarship, innovative methodolgy and reflected, sensitive pedagogical considerations. My teaching includes a constant supply of instructive materials, exercises and Partimenti that fit the current state of the student’s development, skill and individual needs to ensure an off-lesson support.
You can reach me out on:
Michaelkoch1@hotmail.de
Michael.koch@hfm-detmold.de
My Page on Academia.edufolkwang-hochschule.academia.edu/MichaelKoch - เพลง
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You're our Maestro. Thanks for this amazing video. You have a natural talent both in music and in teaching. We are so lucky to have you
Love ya! :DDD Thanks man!
Check out the song Vltava in the style of Chopin th-cam.com/video/jM0ExJAP6_E/w-d-xo.html
Probably one of the best Chopin's composition approach decrypted video ever. Many thanks, extremly valuable.
Appreciated! Thanks!
10:40 yes my favorite composer, Shopan!
Wow Michael the quality of content you produce is astounding.
It’s criminal how few people have had the pleasure of watching your videos. Thanks for all the hard work. I’ll totally subscribe to your Patreon this week.
Thanks a lot :D
Check out the song Vltava in the style of Chopin th-cam.com/video/jM0ExJAP6_E/w-d-xo.html
Finally a musical dissection of Chopin.
The amount of useful information in this video is off the charts!
I could go and write something in his style right now.
The production and educational value of this video is far beyond what is expected of a channel your size! Keep up the fantastic work
THX a lot! :D
Without exaggeration, this is one of the best videos you've put up so far!
Thank you so much, Jonas! Yeah, good point - I just noticed that I wanted to do a section dedicated to Chopin's melodic approach, but I just forgot it. I had a longer section on sequences that I wasn't able to put in the video anymore so I have a bunch of leftovers...
@@en-blanc-et-noir I would also LOVE to see a part two. So glad I found your channel
@@Svit.S +1 for a part 2 !
I think you've hit on something with huge pedagogical importance when you talk about repeating bass lines. I've been trying to improvise melodically with RO and a few motions and find it much more fruitful if I spend time repeating harmonic movements. Swinging between tonic and dominant harmony, playing strong short bass lines like '1 4 5 1' '1 6 5 1' or repeating cascade over and over. Your videos are always amazing and go far beyond clearly explaining the material!
Stunning presentation and piano technique. Also your piano tone/recording is as good as it gets. Thank you good sir 🙏
Thx, 😅🙏 that is the kind of comment that every creator likes to read. Thanks a lot. Not so sure about the recording quality but nice if you find it alright
I feel like your channel will blow up in the coming years
Wow Michael, one of your greatest videos you’ve made so far. Happy and loyal patron of yours and will continue be. Thank you for your top quality work, so many gold nuggets this is awesome. I also particularly like the topic of “how to write music in the style of__________”, maybe that can be a niche/rabbit hole you can jump down more in the future (just as a suggestion for future video/Patreon ideas)
Thanks man, really thanks a lot, Kristian! :D Good ideas and I'm actually playing around a little with Brahms :DD
Brahms vid is on the way, just sayin. Comin in a few days :D
That's brilliant content, very helpful for me as a beginner in understanding music. Will be very cool if you'll make such staff to some other composers. Thanks! Very good.
As a composer myself, this is essential!
I just found this gem of a channel. Great video, I'll be coming back for more in the future!
I still can't believe those Tartarov videos are improvisations. I mean, I know it's well known that he was an amazing improviser and imitator of the style of great composers, but those videos are 10/10, it sounds just too good to be true. There's no single mistake, lots of repetitions without changing a single note. If those are real improvs, he must have been the very best improviser ever in the world.
Heyho, thx for commenting. I see :D Well as far as I can see, improvisation is still way too exotic to most people in the classical music world and definetely those people have a way too romantic notion of what improvisation is: sitting down at the piano and always playing new stuff that they never came up with before. Improvisation is a skill that can be systematically taught, learned and trained towards a degree that for witnesses who never tried themself seriously is unimaginable - just because they cannot relate: just as somebody who never learned the piano can't really grasp how one plays a Sonata by memory. Although Tartarov is an absolute stunner (esp. because of his stylistic diversity, he is a 10/10) and andadmittingly mandates over great technical skill this phenomenon is not as singular as you might think as you probably aren't really into that bubble. There are still today great improvisers of unfathomable skill that come up with music that's seemingly flawless:
he is a real goat - Wolfgang Seifen: th-cam.com/video/f-TqeptNvR8/w-d-xo.html
An improviser whose music I find very charming is Nico Canzano: th-cam.com/video/2oKQCyQG9cw/w-d-xo.html
Or check out this guy that's as well very imaginative and can be spectacular: www.youtube.com/@Borogrove
Or this one: th-cam.com/video/LK1u_jR6B1M/w-d-xo.html
When you browse through the tutorials on my channel you can see a lot of tutorials that demonstrate methods on how improvisation related to specific stylistic details can be learned and practiced, just saying.
Cheers
@@en-blanc-et-noir I think you are probably right, Im more into jazz improvisation and haven't heard too many classical improvs, so Im probably not enough familiar with it. It's just crazy that someone can improvise like Tartarov. Gabriela Montero is another amazing improviser, her album "Take 1" is totally improv and in there she plays a Berceuse that has become one of my fav pieces of music. Definitely will take a closer look to those videos you sent and also to your channel. Thanks!
This is what I've been looking for for years! You're the best!!
Again a fantastic video. Thank you very very much
First video seen, favourite channel. I would love more chopin in the future!!
I love you for making this, thank you
This is my favorite video. I get so inspired watching this.
Thanks Bruce! :D
Hey people! If you wanna skip around: chapters are in the description!
More on Chopin style here: th-cam.com/video/KBV7N-32WDE/w-d-xo.html
If you want another video on romantic stylez: about 2 years ago I did one on romantic Fauxbourdons: th-cam.com/video/fnb2Q8gL5vY/w-d-xo.html
have fun!
I have recently started playing the piano, I am hoping one day I will understand this video. Every bit sounds so clean and natural.
Großartiges Video!
Ich hab ehrlich gesagt nur die Hälfte verstanden, bin mir aber sehr sicher, dass man mit diesem Video Stundenlang seinen Spaß haben kann... (positiv gemeint)
That was a masterclass in focused teaching. Thank you so much! I definitely want to have a try at this now.
Many thanks!
Fascinating stuff!!
amazing work.
THX 🙏
No no no wait NO DONT EXPOSE ME AAAAAAAAAAGGGGGGHH
EXPOSED !!
Very amazing video.
Thank you for this
Such beautiful realizations! And I love your secret Chaconne sub-genre theory.
Thanks, Angela... yeah, that Chaconne idea is around my head already for some time :D I know those pieces are no "real" chaconnes, but I really can imagine him jamming on those themes/basslines. There is some famous parts in his letters, where he complains about a reoccuring problem that he describes as an incabability to decide for a definitive version of compositional ideas to be written down and eventually been published. One compromise he's doing is this "chaconne" type pieces, where he just brings the same phrase in 3 or 4 (or even more) different versions.
Thank you very much. You nailed it!
Excellent job
yo, thanks 🥳✌️
Wow the knowledge is CRAZY HERE
lol
Brilliant!!!!!!!!!!!!!❤
This was exquisite and so exciting! Thank you so much! I've just written a theme which I want to develop in a series of variations, one of which I thought could be a waltz (which isn't a form I play much at all, although those that I have played are mostly Chopin). Fantastically helpful and interesting video for me right now :)
Yo, thanks maxjohn! :D
Personally composing Chopin-like waltzes, ornaments are vital to adding playfulness to the piece! Great video, I subbed!
THX! :DD
Wow, jazzy content 🤩
Thank you so much sir for your video ❤
your welcome
Great video
J'ai trouvé une pépite. Merci pour la chaine et bravo ;-)
This is a very good analysis on Chopin music. To think I Orchestrated prelude No.4 a couple of months ago for the fun of it. I could write my own Chopin Symphony no.1 😅
really love your channel! would love to see one in the nocturne style. amazing work
Thanks :D I'll do that anyway haha!
Interesting channel Monsieur
THX 😌🙏
Re: “edgy keys”, Chopin apparently started his students out in B, C#, and F# (and definitely not C) because they actually lie much more naturally under the hands,
haha, that's how my first piano teacher actually did it as well. In hindsight I must say that I did not profit too much from this approach :DD
Although I must say that there seem to be some technical reasons why certain piece is in a foreign key. But as well: the notorious use of those keys (e.g. by Scriabin) is definetely kind of a "statement" or an aesthetic strategy to virtually elevate a works state of art and to make it less accessible to beginners/amateurs and to "proof" a master's ability. Why would Brahms would write that badass Ab-Minor fugue as a youngster?
@@en-blanc-et-noir well, one of the best reasons for composing in “unusual keys” is that prevents your hands from composing the piece simply because of what they’re comfortable and used to playing. Sondheim said the specifically.
And of course, an even better reason for composing away from the instrument completely. 😂
Whaaaat 😮😮😮 that’s crazy
I almost never comment on videos except for shit posting. But I got to give props, this video was really good. Thank you!
Props appreciated! :D
Amazing video! Very nice editing and explanations
Thx, Rikard!
Chopin style!! Hell yeaah! 🎹. Make a video about Mozart style. 🎹🎼
haha...
@@en-blanc-et-noir please, do Mozart
Muito interessante
Um, jazz pianists do this every day. It is impressive though. Nice video.
Yeeeey! ❤🎹
I will never EVER fake a Chopin waltz. But improvising is great! :)
10:20 this is where I almost fell off my chair
10:35 and this (SHOPAN)
Yeahhh
4:02 That semi-phrase is very Chopin. 13:13 Look at that same semi-phrase in an original Chopin waltz!
Thanks man! :DDD always happy when it appeals to people!
Dude just found your channel, spent like an hour on your videos and loved them, please do some Brahms analysis 🙏
ha! Thanks a lot! I got Brahms on the list - always procrastinating. Maybe should start with a small vid
@@en-blanc-et-noir I'll be waiting for it😉
just sayin: Brahms vid is on the way! :D
@@en-blanc-et-noir wooohooo. 💘!!! Dude in the months I've been following your channel I've learnt soooo much, thanks for sharing your knowledge, keep the amazing job, can't wait to see the Brahms video and get my hands on the patreon materials 🤤❤️!
I really like your parsings.
I would like to see on your channel in the future a continuation of Chopin's compositional analyses (his ballads, scherzos); analyses of Scriabin (my favorite), Rachmaninoff, Bortkiewicz and - if you know of such a composer - Nikolai Kapustin
Yo! Thanks for your praise, Mr. Raptor! Well I made a video on Scriabin some time ago, it's probably a bit more exotic to a non-Partimentisto but why not checking it out:
th-cam.com/video/NCPueHsXQhA/w-d-xo.html
Cheers
Do you have any recommendations for how to learn the theory behind Chopin's style? I have an intermediate understanding of theory overall, but I would love to know the specific harmonic elements that enable u to create all these lines. They sound like exactly what I love about chopins sound, I'm truly blown away that you can do that
Thanks man! :D The style isn't just about harmonic elements, that's for sure. Normally music theory classes and as well youtube tutorials tend to concentrate almost exclusively on harmonic structures. You can see in the video that a lot is actually just V-I's. As I tried to show: it is definetely about melodic elements, that's why I chose to concentrate especially on the cadences at the beginning because those can define and influence a style heavily, study their melodic structure (how chromatisism is used and how these features relate to chord tones). "Lines" you say: yeah, those lines are not like arbitrary chord tones but follow more like contrapuntal principles as well, as I tried to demonstrate with the b minor examples.
yea the chromaticism is definitely key that's for sure. I will try to focus more on the melody. i just discovered this idea of the rule of the octave and that type of harmonization approach instead of functional harmony. would you recommend me to delve deeper into that or sticking to functional harmony is better? @@en-blanc-et-noir
@@michaelgoikhberg3107 lol there is no "instead" between rule of the octave and functional harmony as "functionalism" is just a way of looking and analyzing tonal music, so you can look at the rule of the octave through a functional lens as well :DD Learn the rule of the octave and it's good to learn a lot more 18th century sequences and schemata as those are being conserved throughout the 19th century.
Ich muss dich mal was fragen: kennst Du das Satzmodell "Linearer Parallelismus"?
Es geht so: I - V6 - vi - *iii6* - IV - I6, also quasi Pachelbel mit linearem Bass. Mich irritiert die *iii6* und ich finde sie nicht schön. Gibt es für dieses Modell echte Beispiele? Was ich bisher so aus dem Generalbass mitgenommen habe, genießen die vierte und fünfte Baßstufe doch eine gewisse Sonderstellung aus der die Funktionstheorie später dann auch solche Gestalten wie S65 oder D6 gebastelt hat.
Käptn Kööörk, gut das hier, John Rice betreibt einen YT Kanal wo er in einem Video Musikbeispiele zu je einem Satzmodell kompiliert:
th-cam.com/video/LJc-OCZo8Hc/w-d-xo.html
funktionale Sonderstellung der 4./5. Bassstufe: ja, aber nur wenn es um Kadenzen/Kadenzvorfeld geht. Vielleicht ist dir das schon einmal begegnet, aber es gibt mehrere Satzmodelle wo die funktionelle "Logik" aufgrund einer mehr horizontalen Mechanik nicht greift und Klangfolgen entstehen, die aus Sicht der Funktionstheorien weniger plausible erscheinen.
@@en-blanc-et-noir Dankeschön. Wieder einen Kanal kennengelernt... 😇
Very nice video. Chopin would be proud lol.
What’s is The piece in the intro? It’s very beautiful
thanks lol that‘s an improv in waltz style I guess
Better than a fake book
❤👏👏👏
Chopin got reincarnated
Would you do a English translation on compendium improvisation markus schwenkreis ? Thanks
HAHA alright! I guess there's already someone working on it! - Just speculation... But I'd definetely a good Idea and probably a well selling book.
So basically learn these improv snippets, memorize them and apply them to all keys and then patrician them structurally.
yep. You can of course design your own snippets if you wanna develope a personal style. From that exhaustive transposition drill emerges actually something more than just the finger memory and a repertoire of patterns: it trains the brain as well to find quicker on the spot decisions. The longer you do it the more flexible you'll become.
At 9:17 I yelled out “Wow!”
This film is a good material for training AI.
Please anyone provide me with name of the peices in the Cadences part . It sounds so beautiful . and the name of the peice in the intro part . Thank you in advance.
I designed that cadences myself, but ‚in the style‘ of Chopin… I made a Patreon post with all materials of the video
This was randomly recommended to me. I love Chopin and I play violin, I’ve always wanted to compose, but I only have a AMEB ~3 grade level so I don’t understand this enough. How did you get into composition? Also what software do you use?
start out having fun with it and gradually take it more seriously.. you’ll start to discover what sounds good to you etc
if you cant read music already you’ll probably have to learn that which is arguably the hardest part
@@goodcatholicgirl I’m doing AMEB grade 6 violin so I understand music and musicality fairly well. My main problem is just chords and all that III IV number kinda stuff
@@samanam1931 ah i got you , i definitely recommend piano lessons on the web’s channel for videos on chord progressions etc he explains it very well for ppl not familiar with the subject , if you wanna learn about chords and roots more it’s best to draw back to the absolute beginning and first learn BASIC core chords , after this the other ones will begin to make sense
Wie bist du zu den Inhalten des Videos gekommen? Gibt es Bücher die sowas beleuchten oder hast du einfach spezifische Walzer von Chopin selbst analysiert?
haha, danke der Nachfrage. Es gibt keine Bücher dazu - leider. Ich habe Musiktheorie studiert und hatte Klavier als instrumentales Hauptfach, Chopin ist ein Komponist der mir gut gefällt und den ich einfach viel gespielt und studiert habe :D Walzer lassen sich meiner Meinung nach relativ leicht improvisieren und lehren. Das Konzept, so wie ich es im Video andeute habe ich beim Unterrichten in den letzten zwei Jahren selbst nach und nach entwickelt... irgendwann macht man dann halt ein Video.
@@en-blanc-et-noir alles klar, danke für die Antwort :))
Hey, excellent and clear video!
Can someone help me with the chord and bass notations used in this video? I'm not familiar with it and would like to know more.
Many thanks :D... The chord / bass notations: this is the nomenclature that emerged from historically informed theory and in the recent 15 years became some sort of standard within this bubble but more and more encroach into the mainstream of music theory. It's actually pretty simple: the circled numbers always refer to scale degrees (mostly in the bass) of a major or minor scale (e.g. melodic minor 1-2-3-4-5-#6-#7-1) the chords above them are usually expressed by figured bass numbers. As for beginners those numbers seem to be total arbitrary, but for people who are expierienced with this system these are a very meaningful and significant tools of analysis or abreviations for musical events that most supporters (including me) prefer instead of the well established roman numerals. Those semingly odd numbers become much more meaningful the more the musician is aquainted with other related concepts such as 1) the Rule of the Octave, a more or less standardized harmonization concept of ascending and descending scales (or stepwise bassmotion in general) in the bass that emerged around 1700 and - depending on local traditions - was still taught in the late 19th century, Chopin learned it as well with his teacher Josef Elsner exactly like this! 2) The other big topic related to this is the so called "moti del basso" which in the most general way refers to continuous bassmotions at regular intervals e.g. 2up/3down/2up/3down ...and the "chords" or intervals that are related to those bass motions. An example you probably know is the circle of 5ths progression... but there are a dozen others. 3) the third area is related to non-sequencial but well-established standard situations, called "schemata" that most commonly show a certain specific scaffolding as a combination of counterpoint/outer-voice-motion and chordprogressions (such as the I-V-V-I-opener that I showed in the video) but there are countless of more of those.
Ok that should be enough for now... If you wanna dive into that, I promise you'll have an exiting journey ahead...
When you browse through the other videos of my channel you'll find this concepts all over the place. Why not starting with this one "Chopin and the Rule of the octave“ th-cam.com/video/FFWbb0-YCN0/w-d-xo.html
Cheers
P.S. The starting point for most people in this field probably was Robert Gjerdingen's now famous book "Music in the Galant Style"... check it out, for a book on music thoery this is a downright page turner
@@en-blanc-et-noir Thank you very much for your answer and for lending me some knowledge. I will definitely dive into this concept and check out your videos starting with the one you recommend.
Cheers from Portugal
Do you have any videos on the general principle of spinning out textures and melodies from the contrapuntal guidelines?
Cheers, yeah this is a topic that pops up sooner or later in every video on this channel. There is a video I made two years ago about the circle of fifths where the entire episode is about drawing diminutions from several different, but related C5-scaffoldings. th-cam.com/video/KxAqEvW8piI/w-d-xo.html
let me know if this was helpful😅✌️
@@en-blanc-et-noir That was helpful. Another question I have, if you have the time, is how one would go about trying to absorb the most important other patterns in chopin, and other romantic composers? perhaps this is too broad a question, my apologies if so. I am much more familiar with patterning in Galant music, ie the work of Gjerdingen, Rice, Byros etc, so this area is a bit unknown to me.
12:11
It's coming to my attention that when improvising melodies the skill of memorising what you have just played is of huge importance. With enough practice melodies will come and I've found jazz pedagogy to be useful for training the creativity that requires, but turning phrases into music seems to rely on repetition and transformation of ideas.
Improvising a melody that changes harmony or is longer than 1 bar is hard!
It's funny how Chopins melodies remind me of bebop soloing
Well I tend to overdo it a bit with the chromatizism melodically. It's definetely a little more / a little different than he'd do it...
Part 2 comin?
Let's see haha, I got other plans for upcoming videos but I still got it on the list and actually would like to show more on the topic! :D
10:47
(10:32) There a “Shopan” word right there?
can you do a bach tutorial next?
what do you mean exactly? when you browse through the channel’s videos you‘ll recognize that a lot of videos are specifically on baroque style improvisation or composition. There are 3 videos surrounding Corelli, one on improvising baroque preludes and several on baroque sequences in general: e.g. ‚the circle of fifths revisited‘ or the one the Romanesca.
I will look into the Corelli videos. I am a HUGE Bach fan but I found what you said about him being "eccentric and cringe" interesting... yes I knew this was how he was perceived then. perhaps it will be interesting to study some other baroque artists to see if i actually love Bach specifically (of course I do) or if the baroque genre is of interest to me to explore. Thank you for your channel... subscribed! 🙂@@en-blanc-et-noir
@@fifibg haha you I guess I gotta be precise now. "cringe and eccentric" was a more or less "free" (lol) translation of a quote by a contemporary critic that I came up with in the one of the Corelli videos, it's not at all my own opinion - as everybody else I say Bach is one of my favorites, I play, study or listen to his music almost every day and the volumes of the WTC I/II are on my piano constantly. When you would browse through my sheet music shelf you'd see that you that the biggest share of scores I possess are by JS Bach. And you're right, I should make a video about him - Although it is very hard as for a video you gotta concentrate on certain aspects. He is literally unfathomable as he not just wrote so much but as well changed his style significantly throughout his lifetime: the Bach of the Toccatas is incomparable with that of the "Art of Fugue"
Thx for subscribing though!
Cheers
I completely understand and agree... you would need to focus on a particular style... how about his prelude BWV 999... what do you think about this as a video analysis or something for beginners? wouldnt that be like beginner/intermediate? I love to play this song all the time! @@en-blanc-et-noir
7:29
The pattern at 5:10 doesn't work in minor IMO. It's too bright for the chopin aesthetic.
Cheers! Dunno... can't really relate at the moment. Anyway: I stumbled upon your channel a few days ago and saw you posted a piece by Wendelin Bitzan - the "Mouse Ballet" ... HOW in the world did you come to this piece??? :D I know Wendelin as colleague and friend and find him a very decent composer!
Can you clone yourself and do a series of videos on 16th-century contrapuntal styles-say, Palestrina and Lassus? 😁
that tartarov guy looked like Christian Bale lol
agreed! haha
2:16 how is this 5-1 cadence
how is this not???
@@en-blanc-et-noir I'm beginner composer... I'm really struggling to understand that how its 5-1 cadence i mean i don't see the fifth and first there
is your channel name a reference to debussy?
haha, no actually not. Just a refference to the colors of the keys (Well, Debussy's probably as well)... Isn't Debussy's piece called "en noir et blanc"?
is it me or just you look like Paul dano in some angle
lol I dunno who that is🥳
Very good stylistic explanations and playing . Just maybe he can fool good listeners well versed in Chopin's style .Real genius like Chopin never has additional notes even his grace notes make it all perfect. Everything here actually sounds subMoskowsky . Those who know Chopin really well would know this is not Chopin . Beethoven Sonatas are easier to fake .The last 5 will never be faked :their depth is real .Scriabin ,rach maybe even Debussy or ravel(as perfect and perfectionist creative artisan as eas Ravel was i m not sure )
haha phew, at least "sub Moskowsky" lol... I'm gonna adopt this term...
"Those who know Chopin really well would know this is not Chopin"... I will pin that aove my bed, just as a reminder
Thanks for your hard work in putting this together and for coming up with the idea -- something quite original. But as someone who has listened to Chopin for nearly 60 years, nothing I hear in this video sounds remotely like Chopin. That may be because we can analyze the structure, harmonics, patterns, transpositions, chromaticism, etc. of Chopin's works -- or those of Beethoven, Scarlatti, Haydn, Rachmaninoff, take your pick -- and never, ever come up with a melody that sounds like it was written by the composer. For the simple reason that it wasn't. Best wishes, david
fair enough… thx