I have a citizen watch with this movement. On a timegrapher it's all over the place, if i leave it in different positions it will gain or lose up to 15 seconds per day. But if I wear it constantly, which is how these movements are intended to be used, it runs at +3 seconds per WEEK.
15 seconds/day really isn't all that bad. If accuracy is your priority then no mechanical watch will fit your needs and you'll have to get a quartz instead.
I lost a lot of Casio in my childhood do to poor battery replacement job and compromise the watch waterproofing , then I move automatic watch because it's give me peace of mind to not need regularly change battery but still require service in 5-10 years, but now I already go back to Solar quartz where battery replacement might needed just as automatic required service but at least solar quartz has better accuracy.
Notes on the NH35A: I have 2 of them, both in Invicta Pro Divers. One has a power reserve of 45 hours, the other, 48 hours. On the timegrapher, dial up, both at +\- 1 spd (seconds per day). Dial down, -4 spd, crown down, - 7 spd. I regulated one of them which was +10 spd. The other was close to spot on. Given Seiko's tolerances (-20 to + 40 spd, 41 hour power reserve), the NH35A overdelivers. And, although it's much too expensive to pay a watchmaker to service it, a reasonably adept amateur can service one. Aside from changing the battery, try doing that with a quartz movement!
I have very similar experience with my 4R35... Very little delta but I have ALWAYS had a beat error of 0.5ms+ with the NH35 or 4R35 variant... Not that it matters for the time, but it looks "bad" on the timegrapher
I have owned watches with both, and own a timegrapher. The NH35 hacks and has a bye directional rota which is an advantage. However, the Miyota has better positional variance. Both are decent reliable calibers but I would go for the NH35 given the choice. I believe there is now a Miyota 8315 now, which is meant to be very good. The Miyota 9000 series is far better than the Seiko's 6R35, which is there counterpart
I finally grabbed my first watch with an NH35... that's what brought me here. I watched a JOMW video where he broke down how special the aliexpress Addiesdive 1000m diver was for $80, and I leapt at the opportunity. Its very impressive how well it keeps time when I wear it.
I bought the 007 about a year before being discontinued and found it not winding well on the watch winder. I suspected lack of rotor oil. Yes, oiling improved the winding substantially. But still somewhat stiffer than ideal normal. Seiko QC has fallen off a cliff.
I’m a Citizen fan over Seiko, so the Miyota would be my pick. But the NH35 is the only automatic I own, it’s a reliable, and accurate workhorse of a movement.
There's also a difference between 4R35 and 4R35B: the B variant is an updated version which has 23 jewels instead of the earlier 21 jewels. Idk why people claim it's 24 jewels, but my Seiko Presage has a 4R35B with 23 jewels, according to the text on the rotor.
Both excellent workhorse movements I would say the seiko is better overall, however I have a real soft spot for the miyota as based off the tried and tested 8200 movement the slight rotor noise doesn't bother me and as for hacking I have found that from around 2018/19 the miyota hacks I think maybe older stock still out there without hacking if you go for a miyota ask if it hacks.Either way I feel both movements are excellent no bells or whistles they just get the job done very well great for everyday watches .
Miyota hacking lever sits next to the balance wheel. It's pretty easy to see. I guess it engages the balance wheel when the crown is pulled. The problem is whether you will receive a 8215 with a hacking lever or not. Since the 8315 is newer, I would suspect all production of 8315 include hacking but they seem difficult to source.
My first build has a 8215, I'm so happy with it. It runs +15s p/d consistently straight from the factory. My next build will be a NH35 for sure 👌 Great video, thank you
Just curious, why not adjust it? I've got an 8215 in my watch, and I adjusted it to 0.2ms of beat error, and less than +1 second per day. It hovers around zero.
Thanks a million for this great in-depth, informative video. You have produced it very concisely. Many homage watches today have either of these movements though I have always favoured the Seiko. Going through the pros and cons, I am glad I chose Seiko movements.
the nh35 inside my modded skx013 has been remarkably accurate and reliable..no exaggeration it has given me 1+- a day for the last 2 years. I know iv lucked out but its amazing that this is even possible because I rely on this watch more then my Oyster Perpetual.
NH35 is pretty cool, I had maybe 7 of them recently in my MODs. you can indeed get within 3 seconds daily variation if you have the patience to adjust the time over few day period. It can be impressive. But not all can be like this, some movements will be 10+ second difference regardless of how much time you spend adjusting them.
Great video! Thanks for making it. The funny thing I’ve found is my watches with Miyota movements have achieved really good timing, usually -3 to +4 per day, while my seiko movements are usually more like -5 to + 12 per day. Miyota underpromises and over performs while seiko usually under promises and over performs to a lesser degree.
My NH35A watches are running now -30s/d which is sad, out of the box they were around 7-10s/d, and only 8months passed. Meanwhile my 8215 is running on -1s/d from the beginning, 6months ago
I think it's time to compare chinese movement to japanese movement, they are not trash according to my knowledge. Especially DG2813, too cheap and CAN be reliable. Just make sure you didn't got bad luck. Quality control in China is getting better over time tho.
How do you ensure you don’t get “bad luck”? If a movement’s reliability and performance is unpredictable due to poor quality control then it’s a poor movement.
With the aid of my timegrapher I've been able to regulate both movements to very good numbers but the rotor spin noise on the Miyota due to the uni-directional winding is a big turn off...
4:40 - Sapphires dyed red. Not ruby. That's why they're labels jewels, not rubies anymore. Rubies and sapphires are chemically the same as far as a watch cares. 9 out of 10 in hardness. Diamond is 10. Sapphires and rubies are both part of the chromium family of structure. i.e.- they're all sapphires. The ruby had more chromium which makes it red. Any other color would just be called a sapphire.
In my opinion although both movements are similar the nh has way way more option when it comes to cases, dials, hands and other watch parts. This is because nh comes in a watch that has so much die hard fans which creates market for parts, as opposed to to the Miyota which comes in invictas, so does the nh but miyota I don’t think has a cult classic watch that it was used in to create the same demand.
I accidentally turned the crown the opposite way when setting the date on my Bulova Devil Diver with the Miyota 821d-21b movement and forced it thru two clicks, did I damage it at all?
Just got my first miyota powered watch was a mod from eBay it’s good on timekeeping but noisier than my seiko powered watches so leaving it on bedside cabinet is a no no
You're right, probably fairly unusual, but sometimes movements are ordered with the intent of either adding custom complications or significant amounts of decoration and then adjusted, in which case a "finished" movement is a waste and would require extra cleaning before being worked on, so the movement is more just a roughly assembled set of parts.
I am about to buy a Rolex case and trying to choose movements. Either Seiko NH35 or Miyota 8215. Do you have any clue if both will fit or is the NH35 too big? I have very god experience with NH36 in my Seiko 007 case and hope that will fit. Thank you for another great video!
I am trying to fit watch parts together. I bought a NH36 movement. Accydentaly i bought miyota minutes and seconds arms. I was just wandering, would the second hand will ft on nh36? I did not want to force it so it wont breake.
Hi, I have a watch with a movement who makes a lot of noise. It doesnt have a number on it, so i dont know which one it is. Its a 38mm watch and want to replace the movement, which one should i pick? Thanks in advance!
There are definitely fakes of the Miyota 8200 series movemts out there on eBay and such. You can spot them by the shock protection. Probably because the fakers weren't able to produce the citizen parashock system they did put in something else. Definitely not from the same production line. Plain and simple fakes. Be careful when buying.
There are also many "clones" of the ETA 2824( movements with same basic length and width that can be used in the same watch) such as the Sellita Sw200 the STP,s, the Seagulls etc!
Here is my full review of the MIYOTA 8215: th-cam.com/video/iCIbLyXq0ho/w-d-xo.html
I have a citizen watch with this movement. On a timegrapher it's all over the place, if i leave it in different positions it will gain or lose up to 15 seconds per day. But if I wear it constantly, which is how these movements are intended to be used, it runs at +3 seconds per WEEK.
15 seconds/day really isn't all that bad. If accuracy is your priority then no mechanical watch will fit your needs and you'll have to get a quartz instead.
@@BoleDaPoleliar,liar pants on fire.
I lost a lot of Casio in my childhood do to poor battery replacement job and compromise the watch waterproofing , then I move automatic watch because it's give me peace of mind to not need regularly change battery but still require service in 5-10 years, but now I already go back to Solar quartz where battery replacement might needed just as automatic required service but at least solar quartz has better accuracy.
Me too. My citizenship with the 8200 only looses about 5 seconds a month as long as I wear it daily.
Notes on the NH35A: I have 2 of them, both in Invicta Pro Divers. One has a power reserve of 45 hours, the other, 48 hours. On the timegrapher, dial up, both at +\- 1 spd (seconds per day). Dial down, -4 spd, crown down, - 7 spd. I regulated one of them which was +10 spd. The other was close to spot on. Given Seiko's tolerances (-20 to + 40 spd, 41 hour power reserve), the NH35A overdelivers. And, although it's much too expensive to pay a watchmaker to service it, a reasonably adept amateur can service one. Aside from changing the battery, try doing that with a quartz movement!
Thank you for sharing your experiences!
I have very similar experience with my 4R35... Very little delta but I have ALWAYS had a beat error of 0.5ms+ with the NH35 or 4R35 variant... Not that it matters for the time, but it looks "bad" on the timegrapher
Nh35 is going to be a legendary movement. Its an all time great in my opinion
I have owned watches with both, and own a timegrapher. The NH35 hacks and has a bye directional rota which is an advantage. However, the Miyota has better positional variance. Both are decent reliable calibers but I would go for the NH35 given the choice. I believe there is now a Miyota 8315 now, which is meant to be very good. The Miyota 9000 series is far better than the Seiko's 6R35, which is there counterpart
I finally grabbed my first watch with an NH35... that's what brought me here. I watched a JOMW video where he broke down how special the aliexpress Addiesdive 1000m diver was for $80, and I leapt at the opportunity. Its very impressive how well it keeps time when I wear it.
great work, amazing videos. Please do reviews on movements like SW200/300 / MIYOTA 9015 too
I bought the 007 about a year before being discontinued and found it not winding well on the watch winder. I suspected lack of rotor oil. Yes, oiling improved the winding substantially. But still somewhat stiffer than ideal normal. Seiko QC has fallen off a cliff.
Excellent video! I thought I knew these movements, but I learned a few little details I didn't know.. thank you for a great video!
I’m a Citizen fan over Seiko, so the Miyota would be my pick. But the NH35 is the only automatic I own, it’s a reliable, and accurate workhorse of a movement.
I've never had any problem with either of these movements. They have proven to be accurate and reliable movements.
There's also a difference between 4R35 and 4R35B: the B variant is an updated version which has 23 jewels instead of the earlier 21 jewels.
Idk why people claim it's 24 jewels, but my Seiko Presage has a 4R35B with 23 jewels, according to the text on the rotor.
Both excellent workhorse movements I would say the seiko is better overall, however I have a real soft spot for the miyota as based off the tried and tested 8200 movement the slight rotor noise doesn't bother me and as for hacking I have found that from around 2018/19 the miyota hacks I think maybe older stock still out there without hacking if you go for a miyota ask if it hacks.Either way I feel both movements are excellent no bells or whistles they just get the job done very well great for everyday watches .
Miyota hacking lever sits next to the balance wheel. It's pretty easy to see. I guess it engages the balance wheel when the crown is pulled. The problem is whether you will receive a 8215 with a hacking lever or not. Since the 8315 is newer, I would suspect all production of 8315 include hacking but they seem difficult to source.
My first build has a 8215, I'm so happy with it. It runs +15s p/d consistently straight from the factory. My next build will be a NH35 for sure 👌 Great video, thank you
Just curious, why not adjust it? I've got an 8215 in my watch, and I adjusted it to 0.2ms of beat error, and less than +1 second per day. It hovers around zero.
+15 s p/d? Even my 50-years old Omega cal. 613 runs better, below 10 s p/d.
15 spd ? es horrible
@@LuxWacht richtig
Great comparison. Thanks!
Thanks for watching!
Thanks a million for this great in-depth, informative video. You have produced it very concisely. Many homage watches today have either of these movements though I have always favoured the Seiko. Going through the pros and cons, I am glad I chose Seiko movements.
the nh35 inside my modded skx013 has been remarkably accurate and reliable..no exaggeration it has given me 1+- a day for the last 2 years. I know iv lucked out but its amazing that this is even possible because I rely on this watch more then my Oyster Perpetual.
On the internet it says the Miyota 8215 has no hacking second, but mine has, it stops when you pull the crown. But bought just weeks ago.
NH35 is pretty cool, I had maybe 7 of them recently in my MODs. you can indeed get within 3 seconds daily variation if you have the patience to adjust the time over few day period. It can be impressive. But not all can be like this, some movements will be 10+ second difference regardless of how much time you spend adjusting them.
I have a couple of both. My Miyotas handle low charge or not being worn much better. My NH35's or 6R's go nuts after 20h or so.
Great video! Thanks for making it. The funny thing I’ve found is my watches with Miyota movements have achieved really good timing, usually -3 to +4 per day, while my seiko movements are usually more like -5 to + 12 per day. Miyota underpromises and over performs while seiko usually under promises and over performs to a lesser degree.
My NH35A watches are running now -30s/d which is sad, out of the box they were around 7-10s/d, and only 8months passed. Meanwhile my 8215 is running on -1s/d from the beginning, 6months ago
I have to add, that after regulating the nh35 (which is ez as can be) its running solid on 0s/d - +1s/d
Great comparison of the two movements, as a hobbyist of watches, gives me better insight. Have both Seiko and Citizen watches in my collection.
I think it's time to compare chinese movement to japanese movement, they are not trash according to my knowledge. Especially DG2813, too cheap and CAN be reliable. Just make sure you didn't got bad luck. Quality control in China is getting better over time tho.
They cannot even made a good finishing of their clone movements lol
How do you ensure you don’t get “bad luck”? If a movement’s reliability and performance is unpredictable due to poor quality control then it’s a poor movement.
You dont.. it's a complete gamble unfortunately. QC at the Seagull factory just isn't up to par and there is always a risk of purchasing a dud.
What’s funny to me is that in my experience the best Chinese movements are the Dandong Rolex 3135/3235 clones lol
*i have DG2813 watch… When brand new the accuracy is +5s/day, after a simple adjust it can have -1sec/day accuracy.*
Thank You for this very concise Presentation! You are helping the. consumer make an Educated choice!❤
With the aid of my timegrapher I've been able to regulate both movements to very good numbers but the rotor spin noise on the Miyota due to the uni-directional winding is a big turn off...
Great information ❤👍✌️
Great video! Not really a fan of the Miyota movement but I do really like the Seiko.
4:40 - Sapphires dyed red. Not ruby. That's why they're labels jewels, not rubies anymore. Rubies and sapphires are chemically the same as far as a watch cares. 9 out of 10 in hardness. Diamond is 10. Sapphires and rubies are both part of the chromium family of structure. i.e.- they're all sapphires. The ruby had more chromium which makes it red. Any other color would just be called a sapphire.
There are many other "clones"( movements that can be used in the same watch) of the ETA 2824 Such as the Sellita Sw200,the STP's the Seagulls etc!
I have a NH35 movement.
But the next is a miyota to compare.
What a good video, we want more videos like this, of Swiss, German, more Japanese movements...... thanks and greetings
One simple quesiton. I have a myiota on tsuyosa (8210) and i would like to know if it has a manual charge. Thanks
Is these movement eny oil in these movements when you buy these or ismovements try !???
9015, 9019, 9039 whats the thinnest model? all three same accuracy and power reserve?
In my opinion although both movements are similar the nh has way way more option when it comes to cases, dials, hands and other watch parts. This is because nh comes in a watch that has so much die hard fans which creates market for parts, as opposed to to the Miyota which comes in invictas, so does the nh but miyota I don’t think has a cult classic watch that it was used in to create the same demand.
It's called seiko. Not psycho
I actually like psycho better 😂😂😂😂
I accidentally turned the crown the opposite way when setting the date on my Bulova Devil Diver with the Miyota 821d-21b movement and forced it thru two clicks, did I damage it at all?
Definitely
I've got five watches all with the nh35a movement and I've not had any problems and all keep good time
Ive seen 8250... just a newer version in the 8200 family?
Good info👍🏻
Just got my first miyota powered watch was a mod from eBay it’s good on timekeeping but noisier than my seiko powered watches so leaving it on bedside cabinet is a no no
Really, my Miyota 8215 is really quiet I can sleep with it on my wrist no problems. Maybe it depends how it is cased?
Not oiled? Manufacturer is expected to take it apart and oil before use?
You're right, probably fairly unusual, but sometimes movements are ordered with the intent of either adding custom complications or significant amounts of decoration and then adjusted, in which case a "finished" movement is a waste and would require extra cleaning before being worked on, so the movement is more just a roughly assembled set of parts.
I am about to buy a Rolex case and trying to choose movements. Either Seiko NH35 or Miyota 8215. Do you have any clue if both will fit or is the NH35 too big? I have very god experience with NH36 in my Seiko 007 case and hope that will fit. Thank you for another great video!
Hi, if the NH35 fits your case, I would go for that movement. Unfortunately, I have no idea if that movement fits.
I know the 8215 fits in a deep sea sea dweller and a GMT master 2. I know this because I have them. 😃
I am trying to fit watch parts together. I bought a NH36 movement. Accydentaly i bought miyota minutes and seconds arms. I was just wandering, would the second hand will ft on nh36? I did not want to force it so it wont breake.
citizen must be upgrade their movements but its good reliable movement anyway, everyone loves tsuyosa's afterall
VeRy gOod vIdeo !!! Thank you !!👏🏾🤞🏾
Hi, I have a watch with a movement who makes a lot of noise. It doesnt have a number on it, so i dont know which one it is. Its a 38mm watch and want to replace the movement, which one should i pick?
Thanks in advance!
So which one do you prefer Sir ?
Seiko has the licenced Magic Lever
Excellent
You are comparing a 21 jewel to a 24 jewel?
Only big difference is winding direction
An Orient Movement would have been right at home here
My fugu Japanese made citizen is more accurate than my Seiko and Rolex!
There are definitely fakes of the Miyota 8200 series movemts out there on eBay and such. You can spot them by the shock protection. Probably because the fakers weren't able to produce the citizen parashock system they did put in something else. Definitely not from the same production line. Plain and simple fakes. Be careful when buying.
There are counterfeit nh35 movements.
And there are many Counterfeit 8215's!
There are also many "clones" of the ETA 2824( movements with same basic length and width that can be used in the same watch) such as the Sellita Sw200 the STP,s, the Seagulls etc!
They're both obsolete: Miyota 9k series movements are where it's at.
Rotor sound on miyota is VERY loud and annoying. I'll never buy it again!
Sea-gull st 16 weeeeee
One of these is built in Japan and one is assembled by 9 year olds in china.
Comparing the 8205 would have been fairer.
... isn't that just the name for the identical citizen in house movement ?
The Miyota 8215 is a real Japanese-made movement. The other is not.
Both movement are crap
I love miyota
The biggest problem is the 8000 series is noisy.