Dave, thank you for this great video. I have my dad's 1946 671 and your video is just what I needed to restore the bulb style smoke unit! The flapper assembly was removed by a Lionel Service Station in the 1980s and it was thankfully placed in a plastic bag. I am in the process of giving it a thorough cleaning and refurbishing it so my kids can hopefully enjoy it for another 77 years.
Dave, use mineral spirits. I use mineral spirits to clean all metal parts, even track. I think you'll be surprised by the results. They do make odorless mineral spirits. Not to be confused with mineral oil. Mineral spirits is sold in the paint section of home stores. Mineral oil used to make smoke fluid is sold in the pharmaceutical Isles at Wal-Mart as a laxative.
@@dagryffynhobby Dave, I only use a Q-tip or a small model kit style Revell/Testor paint brush dipped into a cap full of Odorless Mineral Spirits. And I clean with the Q-Tip or brush itself.
I had a dream! I was working on my 783 steamer that hadn't been serviced in years. It was just a bit gummier than the one you're working on here, and I decided to strip it down to the last nut and bolt. I even pressed out the wheels and axels! After hours of cleaning, every last part looked shiny and new, and all of those tiny pieces were placed neatly in a parts box, ready for assembly. As I looked around the room, I noticed tons of old boxes, containers, and junk stacked up everywhere. A hoarders paradise! Suddenly, one of my young daughters came in the room, asking: "Whatcha doin'?" I replied: "I'm fixin' trains". Then, with a mischievous look on her face, she grabbed the parts box, and heaved it across the room, laughing hysterically! A multitude of tiny parts scattered everywhere! I then woke up in a cold sweat, screaming: "Noooo!" OK, maybe that's more like a nightmare! Since I couldn't sleep after that, I went over to my computer and watched one of your older train run videos. Those always make me feel better! What does this have to do with your current video? Nothing really. Watching you disassemble that turbine just reminded me of that night. Oh, Good video, Dave!
Ever think about throwing the trucks and chassis into an ultra sonic cleaner [ as another fellow does on another channel here ] and watching a few innings of MLB or a quarter of pre- season NFL and returning to it there after for a whistle clean result 😂?
@@dagryffynhobby Dave; neither do I have an ultrasonic cleaner that would be big enough for an O gauge sized frame, trucks, etc. I only have the wife's tiny "jewelry cleaner." When I first saw this other channel O gauge operator actually using a $99 Amazon bought ultrasonic cleaner with 1/2 water/1/2 simple green to clean the frame and trucks, for about 20 minutes of bath time I thought he was nuts and bad things might happen. But they didn't.
I know it’s sooo hard sometimes to force myself to service a new to me locomotive but it’s a necessary evil when you mess with stuff like that. I just recently got a 746 that has been my all time favorite locomotive, I really wanted to just put it on the track and run it. But I made myself take it apart and clean, grease, oil everything before it went on the track. I was right for doing it too as it looked as if it hadn’t really seen much track time in the last 30-40 years. Can’t wait for the next video!!
I appreciated the video as I have my dad’s 1948 671 set w/transformer. I used to play with it over 40 years ago. I tried to run it today but no movement on the locomotive. The red transformer light would turn off when full power applied and some little popping sounds. She has some issues but hopefully minor as I put it on the original track. lol on that. I’ll give everything a run through and get some new track and go from there. Definitely gonna watch your videos a few times as it’s going to help me out a lot. Much appreciated.
Awesome! Sounds like you probably have some shorts, most likely old wires with deteriorating coatings. Those old wires are like that. Good luck getting it all going and send me an email if you need any help.
hi dave, i have a filthy 671 that i havent got to yet. my understanding is that when you dissasemble the armature, the shaft will have ball bearings that will fall out. be ready. dont lose them!
I didn’t take the armature out of the motor. Looks like you would need to pull the gear off and press it back on. The ball bearings in the blocks for the geared shaft should be press fit. I have certainly lost a ball bearing or two in the past not expecting them to fall out of an engine!
That was like opening Pandora's Box, Dave! What a dirty mess. And it ran so well. You'll probably need to check around with train shops and home supply centres for safe and effective cleaning fluids. In former times, gasoline was a usual goto, but of course it's dangerous to have around. Looking forward to part 2.
Another great video Dave. Thanks for sharing. I noticed near the end you showed the front and rear trucks completely dis-assembled. I bought a 681 and the first time I ran it it one of those retainers that hold the axels up in the truck was loose. It hung down far enough that it caught in a switch track and on the floor the 681 went. I didn't want to look. Luck was on my side the floor had a gouge, but the 681 was fine. I couldn't find anything bent or broken. I don't recommend trying that though. The real point is make sure the retainers are on properly and snug. Thanks again Dave I always enjoy your videos.
This is pretty timely. I got a 671 in a box with junk trains (which also included a complete prewar 752E streamliner!). Like yours it's a Variation A made in 1946 only. The chassis is very different from the 1947 up versions. It has a double worm-drive as well as the bulb smoker. Mine was filthy inside from the smoke unit, with brown crusty material that looked like rust until I scraped it off, and the whole gear system was fouled with grit and dried grease which took me over an hour of scraping and soaking with acetone to remove. I now have to clean the commutator and check and probably replace the brushes before I attempt to apply power to it. Hopefully I'll have it running by Christmas.
Great tutorial. Your honesty is refreshing. I think that once you have finished cleaning and re lubricating your 1946 671 you'll find that you have one of the best engines for slow speeds. You can use smoke fluid one drop at a time. Doesn't last long but the pills don't really dissolve. Looking forward to the next episode.
Thank you. It’s back together and running smooth. Video still being edited. It runs well but not particularly slow. I’m curious to see if I can run it slower after I run it for a while.
So THAT'S what that bulb-type smoke unit looks like! I've seen pictures and diagrams but not one "up-close-and-personal." I had an idea the bulb would be pretty fragile but that one looks pretty robust. This was a video worth watching just for that alone! Secondly, I think that 671 was run pretty hard just from the polish on the driver rims. Those are the shiniest drivers I've ever seen! It'll be interesting to see how well it pulls. Dave, have you ever tried spray carburetor cleaner on those hard-to-reach spots? I used to use STP carb cleaner on difficult to strip guns and it did a pretty good job. Anyway, a fascinating video! Looking forward to part two!
I was excited to see the bulb too. I’m sure this engine was run, but it still runs nice and smooth. The gear on the motor definitely looked like it had some wear on the teeth. That’s fine with me, it has history! Sometimes I wish one of these old engines could tell it’s story about where it’s been and the joy it’s brought. Maybe I should start writing ….
I have used way too much brake clean over the years at work. These days I don’t use it unless I have too. Besides I always felt like it dried things out too much
Wow, you beat me to one of these discovery videos. Weird part is I recently bought a 2020 thinking it was the latest postwar turbine of Lionel, only to find it has the same system as your's you demonstrated here, smoke bulb and double worm drive. Yet my 671 is the single worm drive, conventional smoke unit system. Now I found it odd that my 2020 has slot for the e-unit lever on top, but this design has it sideways and a plug on the motor to turn it on or off. Oddly still is that when you turn off the reverse unit it also stops the smoke bulb as well. Right away mine had a short and it was that connection point, just to close to the other metal parts, when it has to be the center rail pick-up. Oddly enough my 671 had a shorting problem too, and it was the rear truck draw bar hook was to long and hitting the center rail. The weird stuff you find....
Neat. Never know what you’ll find. I’ve had two 671s in the past and both were just like my 681 so I was excited to see the earlier model once I started taking it apart.
Mineral oil is parrifin oil and is an excellent cleaner to remove the white powdered residue that somtimes collects on trucks that I believe is caused by battery acid on the model's that have horns.
@@dagryffynhobby Dave, I got all this information from other MRR enthusiasts that have their own TH-cam channels and local train shows. Mineral oil is only used for smoke fluid. Mineral spirits is used to clean oils grease and grime from all metal surfaces. Water based detergents is used on plastics and isn't the best habit to get into to use on metal surfaces that wil eventually rust or corrode through oxidative stress. Even brass and copper oxidizes due to minerals in tap or well water, often refered to as tarnish unless using distilled water. Mineral spirits is a petroleum based paint thinner and cleaner that's flammable. So there's that and may be a concern if you have young children around. It really is one of the best solvents for cleaning metal and can be purchased odorless if the petroleum odor is obtrusive.
Dave: You could use mineral spirits but acetone or MIBK will work better. They will solubilize the grease and evaporate quickly. You may want to consider also using simple green ( water mixture of butyl cellusolve and water. Will cut through grease. Good luck. Interesting video.
Mineral spirits is a non-polar (non water based) solvent that's good at removing oil and grease from metal surfaces that rust. Polar cleaners, (water based) such as detergent, is safe to use on plastics. The ease at which cleaning with mineral spirits vs detergent is a night and day difference
You seem a little frustrated. A while back I rebuilt a no. 2026 2-6-2, a locomotive at the other end of the postwar Lionel design spectrum. I've never liked the looks of the 671, but your dissasembly reveals the wonderful engineering in those horizontal drives. I think the people at Lionel must have been a little excited after the War, too, when they conceived the idea of mating arguably the best toy-train technology with the acme of steam locomotive development.
Not frustrated, at least not with the trains. Maybe my diminishing dexterity and eyesight though! The engine is a bit stubby and overly compressed but it’s a fantastic runner.
Great video Dave! I saw in the last video that you made, that they had a 682 at the Greenberg show. The one thing I need to do with my 671 is to eventually replace the back plug for the E-unit. Have you tried cleaning the back truck with a magic eraser?
I was just wondering if you have or know anybody that did replace his axle bushings, I have two I need to replace them on. I’m kind of confused about the type of bushings I see two different types and I don’t know if these bushings press in and stop or if you have to gauge how far to press them in I’m having a hard time finding info
I actually found the Lionel smoke bulb and that power contact strip. I'll post my repair of the same engine on my TH-cam channel Red House Trains Thanks
A 1946 version of the turbine. Nice I have one as well.
My first. I like it. I really like the absence of the e unit lever
@@dagryffynhobby Yeah. Mine still runs great to this day. I also have a 681 form I think 1951. Another great runner.
Cool steamer. Love watching a tear down and repair. Love doing it myself😂
It’s just so rewarding to tinker and service these engines
I just don’t WANNA!!! 😂
But I don’t! Lol
A postwar tinker, the best kind
It makes me happy 😃
I just got a 1946 671 with smoke bulb. It was given to me in a plastic bin…in pieces. I will be using this as reference. Thank you very much.
Awesome. Hope the video helps. Part 2 will be out soon
Dave, thank you for this great video. I have my dad's 1946 671 and your video is just what I needed to restore the bulb style smoke unit! The flapper assembly was removed by a Lionel Service Station in the 1980s and it was thankfully placed in a plastic bag. I am in the process of giving it a thorough cleaning and refurbishing it so my kids can hopefully enjoy it for another 77 years.
Nice! Glad the video was helpful. I will have to restore the flapper in mine too at some point.
❤
WOW!!! Thanks for sharing!! Great skills!!.....Part 2???
Part 2 soon, as soon as I’m done editing. I just let the camera run so I have way too much footage to sift through.
Dave, use mineral spirits. I use mineral spirits to clean all metal parts, even track. I think you'll be surprised by the results. They do make odorless mineral spirits. Not to be confused with mineral oil. Mineral spirits is sold in the paint section of home stores. Mineral oil used to make smoke fluid is sold in the pharmaceutical Isles at Wal-Mart as a laxative.
I do need to give it a try.
Great video, I'm restoring a 671 for my brother-in-law (diff version) and used this video to help as a reference.
Great. Hope this helps.
Interesting good video
Glad you think so!
Odorless Mineral Spirits. 😊
Gotta try that
@@dagryffynhobby Dave, I only use a Q-tip or a small model kit style Revell/Testor paint brush dipped into a cap full of Odorless Mineral Spirits. And I clean with the Q-Tip or brush itself.
Dave that just Train life! A fantastic part of the Hobby indeed! Thank You 😊
Thanks!
I had a dream! I was working on my 783 steamer that hadn't been serviced in years. It was just a bit gummier than the one you're working on here, and I decided to strip it down to the last nut and bolt. I even pressed out the wheels and axels! After hours of cleaning, every last part looked shiny and new, and all of those tiny pieces were placed neatly in a parts box, ready for assembly. As I looked around the room, I noticed tons of old boxes, containers, and junk stacked up everywhere. A hoarders paradise! Suddenly, one of my young daughters came in the room, asking: "Whatcha doin'?" I replied: "I'm fixin' trains". Then, with a mischievous look on her face, she grabbed the parts box, and heaved it across the room, laughing hysterically! A multitude of tiny parts scattered everywhere! I then woke up in a cold sweat, screaming: "Noooo!" OK, maybe that's more like a nightmare! Since I couldn't sleep after that, I went over to my computer and watched one of your older train run videos. Those always make me feel better! What does this have to do with your current video? Nothing really. Watching you disassemble that turbine just reminded me of that night. Oh, Good video, Dave!
Oh wow! That’s just not right! Definitely a nightmare. I have the chills just thinking about it.
Glad the train run videos help. I do the same thing.
Been there done that. I love it.
😃
Ever think about throwing the trucks and chassis into an ultra sonic cleaner [ as another fellow does on another channel here ] and watching a few innings of MLB or a quarter of pre- season NFL and returning to it there after for a whistle clean result 😂?
I have, but I don’t have one. Maybe eventually.
I try to keep the tools used to basic tools anyone would have.
@@dagryffynhobby Dave; neither do I have an ultrasonic cleaner that would be big enough for an O gauge sized frame, trucks, etc. I only have the wife's tiny "jewelry cleaner." When I first saw this other channel O gauge operator actually using a $99 Amazon bought ultrasonic cleaner with 1/2 water/1/2 simple green to clean the frame and trucks, for about 20 minutes of bath time I thought he was nuts and bad things might happen. But they didn't.
I know it’s sooo hard sometimes to force myself to service a new to me locomotive but it’s a necessary evil when you mess with stuff like that. I just recently got a 746 that has been my all time favorite locomotive, I really wanted to just put it on the track and run it. But I made myself take it apart and clean, grease, oil everything before it went on the track. I was right for doing it too as it looked as if it hadn’t really seen much track time in the last 30-40 years. Can’t wait for the next video!!
It really is tough! But yeah so necessary. I alway say I won’t run it till it’s serviced, but I’m not that patient!
I appreciated the video as I have my dad’s 1948 671 set w/transformer. I used to play with it over 40 years ago. I tried to run it today but no movement on the locomotive. The red transformer light would turn off when full power applied and some little popping sounds. She has some issues but hopefully minor as I put it on the original track. lol on that. I’ll give everything a run through and get some new track and go from there. Definitely gonna watch your videos a few times as it’s going to help me out a lot. Much appreciated.
Awesome! Sounds like you probably have some shorts, most likely old wires with deteriorating coatings. Those old wires are like that. Good luck getting it all going and send me an email if you need any help.
I appreciate that very much. Thank you
hi dave, i have a filthy 671 that i havent got to yet. my understanding is that when you dissasemble the armature, the shaft will have ball bearings that will fall out. be ready. dont lose them!
I didn’t take the armature out of the motor. Looks like you would need to pull the gear off and press it back on. The ball bearings in the blocks for the geared shaft should be press fit.
I have certainly lost a ball bearing or two in the past not expecting them to fall out of an engine!
That was like opening Pandora's Box, Dave! What a dirty mess. And it ran so well. You'll probably need to check around with train shops and home supply centres for safe and effective cleaning fluids. In former times, gasoline was a usual goto, but of course it's dangerous to have around. Looking forward to part 2.
It sure was! I’ve been told many differently methods and materials, my theory is whatever works best for the individual. 🤷♂️
Another great video Dave. Thanks for sharing. I noticed near the end you showed the front and rear trucks completely dis-assembled. I bought a 681 and the first time I ran it it one of those retainers that hold the axels up in the truck was loose. It hung down far enough that it caught in a switch track and on the floor the 681 went. I didn't want to look. Luck was on my side the floor had a gouge, but the 681 was fine. I couldn't find anything bent or broken. I don't recommend trying that though. The real point is make sure the retainers are on properly and snug. Thanks again Dave I always enjoy your videos.
Wow, what a scary moment but a fortunate outcome! They are tough little engines, but yeah I won’t go intentionally dropping one to prove it!
This is pretty timely. I got a 671 in a box with junk trains (which also included a complete prewar 752E streamliner!). Like yours it's a Variation A made in 1946 only. The chassis is very different from the 1947 up versions. It has a double worm-drive as well as the bulb smoker. Mine was filthy inside from the smoke unit, with brown crusty material that looked like rust until I scraped it off, and the whole gear system was fouled with grit and dried grease which took me over an hour of scraping and soaking with acetone to remove. I now have to clean the commutator and check and probably replace the brushes before I attempt to apply power to it. Hopefully I'll have it running by Christmas.
A 671 and a 752e in a junk box!? Wow. Yeah this is the first early turbine I’ve had, all my others were later models. I’m really enjoying this one.
Cool 😊
Thanks👍
Dab of brake clean on q-tips works wonders. Small blast in the gear box should help get the old grease out. Ventilation!!!! Have a great day . Be safe
Yeah, brake clean is good for that, but I’ve used too much of it over the years and try not to use it any more.
@@dagryffynhobby me too. Instant headache. Be safe
Dave great video. That engine was really filthy but I am sure once you have it all cleaned up it will be an excellent runner.
It is really running wonderfully now that it’s all cleaned up.
Great tutorial. Your honesty is refreshing. I think that once you have finished cleaning and re lubricating your 1946 671 you'll find that you have one of the best engines for slow speeds. You can use smoke fluid one drop at a time. Doesn't last long but the pills don't really dissolve. Looking forward to the next episode.
Love the video. Can't wait to see the final results.
Thank you. It’s back together and running smooth. Video still being edited. It runs well but not particularly slow. I’m curious to see if I can run it slower after I run it for a while.
@@dagryffynhobby
Did you remove the e-unit and decrease then re-lube the front worm?
@@ronalddevine9587 the e unit was removed and gears cleaned and greased
Great video Dave, wow that engine was dirty. If it ran good like that, I can only imagine how good it will run when you’re done cleaning it.
Thanks Corey. It runs super smooth and quiet now, well at least compared to my 681. I’m really enjoying this one.
So THAT'S what that bulb-type smoke unit looks like! I've seen pictures and diagrams but not one "up-close-and-personal." I had an idea the bulb would be pretty fragile but that one looks pretty robust. This was a video worth watching just for that alone!
Secondly, I think that 671 was run pretty hard just from the polish on the driver rims. Those are the shiniest drivers I've ever seen! It'll be interesting to see how well it pulls.
Dave, have you ever tried spray carburetor cleaner on those hard-to-reach spots? I used to use STP carb cleaner on difficult to strip guns and it did a pretty good job.
Anyway, a fascinating video! Looking forward to part two!
The old ones had nickel plated rims. SHINY!!!!!!
@@johnblair8146 Right, the pre-MagneTraction engines had nickle rims.
I was excited to see the bulb too. I’m sure this engine was run, but it still runs nice and smooth. The gear on the motor definitely looked like it had some wear on the teeth. That’s fine with me, it has history! Sometimes I wish one of these old engines could tell it’s story about where it’s been and the joy it’s brought. Maybe I should start writing ….
Brake cleaner on all metal parts like your wheels and frame ben using it for years with excellent results,,, use out side
I have used way too much brake clean over the years at work. These days I don’t use it unless I have too. Besides I always felt like it dried things out too much
Awsum!!!!!!!
Thanx 👍
Wow, you beat me to one of these discovery videos. Weird part is I recently bought a 2020 thinking it was the latest postwar turbine of Lionel, only to find it has the same system as your's you demonstrated here, smoke bulb and double worm drive. Yet my 671 is the single worm drive, conventional smoke unit system. Now I found it odd that my 2020 has slot for the e-unit lever on top, but this design has it sideways and a plug on the motor to turn it on or off. Oddly still is that when you turn off the reverse unit it also stops the smoke bulb as well. Right away mine had a short and it was that connection point, just to close to the other metal parts, when it has to be the center rail pick-up. Oddly enough my 671 had a shorting problem too, and it was the rear truck draw bar hook was to long and hitting the center rail. The weird stuff you find....
Neat. Never know what you’ll find. I’ve had two 671s in the past and both were just like my 681 so I was excited to see the earlier model once I started taking it apart.
Mineral oil is parrifin oil and is an excellent cleaner to remove the white powdered residue that somtimes collects on trucks that I believe is caused by battery acid on the model's that have horns.
I really do need to try mineral oil. It’s been recommended many times
@@dagryffynhobby Dave, I got all this information from other MRR enthusiasts that have their own TH-cam channels and local train shows. Mineral oil is only used for smoke fluid. Mineral spirits is used to clean oils grease and grime from all metal surfaces. Water based detergents is used on plastics and isn't the best habit to get into to use on metal surfaces that wil eventually rust or corrode through oxidative stress. Even brass and copper oxidizes due to minerals in tap or well water, often refered to as tarnish unless using distilled water. Mineral spirits is a petroleum based paint thinner and cleaner that's flammable. So there's that and may be a concern if you have young children around. It really is one of the best solvents for cleaning metal and can be purchased odorless if the petroleum odor is obtrusive.
Dave: You could use mineral spirits but acetone or MIBK will work better. They will solubilize the grease and evaporate quickly. You may want to consider also using simple green ( water mixture of butyl cellusolve and water. Will cut through grease. Good luck. Interesting video.
Thanks. I’ve used simple green to strip paint but not to clean the grease out of an engine. I’ll have to try it.
@@dagryffynhobby test it but it is a grease cutter.
Mineral spirits is a non-polar (non water based) solvent that's good at removing oil and grease from metal surfaces that rust. Polar cleaners, (water based) such as detergent, is safe to use on plastics. The ease at which cleaning with mineral spirits vs detergent is a night and day difference
I really do need to pick some up
You seem a little frustrated. A while back I rebuilt a no. 2026 2-6-2, a locomotive at the other end of the postwar Lionel design spectrum. I've never liked the looks of the 671, but your dissasembly reveals the wonderful engineering in those horizontal drives. I think the people at Lionel must have been a little excited after the War, too, when they conceived the idea of mating arguably the best toy-train technology with the acme of steam locomotive development.
Not frustrated, at least not with the trains. Maybe my diminishing dexterity and eyesight though!
The engine is a bit stubby and overly compressed but it’s a fantastic runner.
Great video Dave! I saw in the last video that you made, that they had a 682 at the Greenberg show. The one thing I need to do with my 671 is to eventually replace the back plug for the E-unit. Have you tried cleaning the back truck with a magic eraser?
Thanks. Magic eraser? Nope haven’t used it. I’ll check it out.
My experience, nobody lubes these engines and you have to replace the axle bushings to correct side play
I’ve got an engine or two that definitely need axle bushings. This one seems fine running.
I was just wondering if you have or know anybody that did replace his axle bushings, I have two I need to replace them on. I’m kind of confused about the type of bushings I see two different types and I don’t know if these bushings press in and stop or if you have to gauge how far to press them in I’m having a hard time finding info
@@coreyleed8572 I wish I could tell you but I don’t know. I do need to try at some point though.
Do you know the part number for the bulb? Thanks
I do not. Sorry
I actually found the Lionel smoke bulb and that power contact strip. I'll post my repair of the same engine on my TH-cam channel Red House Trains
Thanks