@@JediJess1Man i wished it had at least like 12 chars or more on launch, id happily even trade the single-player for it. 😭 But oh well im still going to support the game regardless by going for that really sweet 30$ Kickstarter Tier. 👌
It's worth mentioning that shield dropping can also be performed just by pressing down right after letting go of shield, you don't have to do the Smash method of slowly tilting down. Also, you can still wall jump out of special fall for horizontal and downward moving specials (e.g. Maypul side special), just not up specials and other specials that go up (like Wrastor's neutral special).
What's wrong with ledgehogging? It adds way more depth offstage and if it wasn't in the game the off stage game would be very boring like how it is in smash 4/ult. @@xRagingxDemonx
@@p0kepanda462Edgehogging absolutely _ruins_ characters that are unable to make it back to the stage itself, and takes literally zero skill to do. With trumping (or simply no edgehogging), you have to earn the marginal KOs by denying the ledge, rather than turning them into a foregone conclusion.
sounds petty, but the biggest change for me is the new camera movements... the old game always felt a little stale when the zoom level was always so far out and rarely gave you a close up view of the action. Now you can feel like you're right in front of the action, like a front row seat at a concert
I think this is valid and not “petty”. Although, I think how the camera worked in RoA was fine and the preferable option for that game. Since I fear the alternative for a pixel art platform fighter is how it works in Super Smash Flash or Fraymakers. Personally, I don’t like the dynamic smooth moving camera in pixel art platform fighters such as those, as it makes the pixel art look super rough to me and somewhat nauseating. But that type of camera works perfectly for 3d platform fighters. So I feel RoA chose the right camera for it’s art style imho. And the new camera is exciting and better than RoA’s. So there’s reason for hype. ;)
i never played the first rivals, but with how polished and fun this game looks, plus with the state ultimate is in, i’m gonna give this one a shot for sure.
Really happy to see they're smash players interested in the second, rivals of aether is my favourite game but I'm also still gonna play smash even when rivals 2 comes out
@@cosmic5665Honestly dude smash isn't even worth it anymore because no matter what anyone says you're not telling that game is balanced because there are like 15 to 20 characters in that game that are unviable or borderline and I am sick of the terrible online
Wow, the Doods got me hyped. I can def see this sequel being a lot more attractive to smash players than the first one. New mechanics and it being 3D and all.
I feel like rivals is 1 of those platform fighters that, like smash, won't just have the previous game die when to next 1 is out, because of how the games play fairly different from each other, meaning that some will prefer the new mechanic, but some will prefer the old ones & some will like to do a bit of both
@@JuIianRock Is English not your first language or something? Because you took what he said and went leaps and bounds with it. All he said is that he missed the pixel art style, and that he hopes that the series gets another installation in the future. You're looking WAY too deep into this bud.
Great vid, maybe make some character specific mechanic guides next. A lot of people are confused about Fleet's resource and you guys would be the perfect channel to clear that up!
This is looking to be great. I personally really like the changes and the distant feel compared to the original because it gives old Rivals more wiggle room to thrive with its player base (kind of in the way Melee is in the Smash series) while with the second installation has a chance to thrive for being new and introducing new mechanics and things that makes the game interesting and different to play (basically what Ultimate is in the Smash series).
Nah Rivals 2 is going to add even more depth to the series and Rivals 1 will get a bit older cuz no shielding so your approach options against zoning and zoners or projectiles in general will be even more limited. Then when 2 adds Workshop its going to steal even more from the Casual playerbase of 1 or heck, even the competitive one lol. Not saying 1 still wont be great, im just saying i will find little to no reason for playing it once 2 is out other than nostalgia and Workshop.
@@SimoneBellomonte eh, i don't know about that. anyone can draw a sprite and some hitcircles, but a 3D workshop adds a layer of complexity that's going to lock out most people. i have a lot of faith in OP's argument
one thing about moonwalking that is unique to Rivals is that you can moonwalk with an upper half-circle too, not just a downward half-circle. this lets you moonwalk on platforms without dropping through!
4 หลายเดือนก่อน
Moonwalking is still kinda cool but it’ll never be like melee where your backwards velocity just exponentially gets faster which is so damn funny
It's incredible how polished this game is already looking, specially when compared to games funded by actual AAA companies such as _MultiVersus_ and _Nickelodeon All Star Brawl._ I'm so incredibly hyped for it. The way they're introducing Special Attacks into pummels, get-up attacks and ledge attacks is absolutely brilliant.
I like the ledge specials and all. But I feel like part of what made rivals unique were the lack of ledges . Get back into the action faster and made for more interesting edge guards rather than playing from the ledge
I like both ways of play. I think it would be fun as an extra mode in the game. Although, I don’t think they’ll add that, as it would create a divide between players. Which wouldn’t be good for the health of the game. At the very least, they tried to add some extra flavour to it with ledge specials. Rather than just doing the same system as Smash. Including ledges also creates an impression for the large group of smash players of: “Oh, so it’s like the Smash I know and love, plus a new mechanic? Sign me up!” Rather than: “Ugh, Rivals 2 doesn’t even have ledges. So it’s just a bare-bones Smash game. Sign me out..” So that might help towards getting more Smash players to check it out, increasing the game’s chance of success.
I didn’t know that you couldn’t hit fall shields, it makes sense when thinking about it though because I thought she shield pressure was just going to be crazy requiring you to parry at some point
my hope for this game would be to give this game more casual options like items story campaign mini games etc and here this game need to have good and replayability gameplay
I just watched a video recently about how part of the reason few platformers can get out from Smash’s shadow is because they’re constantly comparing themselves to Smash. In light of that, it was interesting to hear almost every mechanic in this game get compared to something in Smash bros every few seconds. Couldn’t unhear it.
All I hope is that Steam Workshop support is just as extensive as the first game, Rivals flourished off its modding scene, and while I hope this game isn't as reliant on it, I hope it will be just as powerful if not moreso than the first game
3D modeling is way harder than pixel art, so even if the tools are there, the scene will probably be a lot less robust. Not to say I don't want the Workshop to come back, but I'd be shocked if Rivals 2 were known for it like Rivals 1 is.
I am pretty worried be honest. No sheild was a pretty important aspect of the design and flow for rivals and as someone in the competitive scene I have heard to many people saying they just aren’t gonna play it. I’m also worried about about steam workshop support cause no matter how good they make it work 3D modeling will always be harder than pixel art to look passable. I personally think the game is looking incredible but I still am curious for its feel and all. Not that it will be good, I’m certain of that, but if it will be good at being rivals of aether. Like even with many similar ideas and the same design philosophy character and game wise, but so many changes to basic core mechanics, Not just mechanics generally but core simple mechanics I am worried if rivals 2 will have the staying power of rivals 1.
When you consider that they only didn't include shields in the original due to techinical limitations, how much money the kickstarter has generated, and how much they've been letting top smash/rival/platform fighters play this pre-alpha to get their feedback and improve the game, I find it hard to believe that "too many people" aren't going to play it. I feel like this is the only platform fighter outside Smash that has a chance to be the next big thing, at least as far as a competitive scene, with the bonus of not being tied to Nintendo at all. What you consider "Rivals of Aether" is completely subjective...
Yeah but like… how can this game really stand out to the casual audience? No custom characters, art style more like smash, mechanics more like smash, and while this is subjective I know, rivals character design isn’t like, super unique
@@Swaxeman I don't know, maybe it won't and it really depends on what you consider a casual(I think it will get most people who like to compete in platform fighters to try it). The reason I like RoA so much is because the level of control you had over your character was similar to Melee without the insane timing + precision and that they were more focused on good balance rather than making a ton of characters. I also think the elemental gimmick/specials of most of the characters are pretty unique personally. Maypul's tethers and wraps, Ranno's poison and bubble. Orcane's(who I assume will be in the launch roster) puddles and all the things those entail, etc. It's more about meaningful unique aspects sprinkled in their movesets. Other game modes will be in the game eventually (just like RoA) but the focus at release is clearly to make sure the core gameplay loop and game feel is as polished and fun as possible. The core competitive gameplay is what gives games like Melee the staying power it's had.
@@Kade503 I guess. I’m more worried just about the games profit in this way. I just dont really see it capturing the more casual fanbase RoA did, with its more unique artstyle, and workshop
@@Swaxeman A lot of these things mentioned don't even drive casuals away. If the only thing that interests you about this game is seeing Peter Griffin in workshop just go play rivals 1, Mugen, or wait for when they make the game actually polished enough to warrant workshop.
Oh nah bro 6:06 I think taking that out of the game is an abysmal change cause wall jumping after free fall made even recovering an interesting game and not just lead to you losing a stock please for the love of god revert this change
They're usually called platform fighters or at the least smashlikes. I think games like Brawlhalla and Rivals are unique enough they've made the type of game a whole genre. A smash clone would be something like Smash Flash 2.
@@readyplayerthree3 ngl, I just wanted to leave a positive comment for the algorithm :P You are right about "platform fighter", I was thinking more about the Multiversus and the Nickelodeon ones.
Weird to me that some people prefer pixel art for a platform fighter. That was one of the first game's biggest issues with me. There wasnt smooth or detailed enough animation, and as good as the mechanics are, it just felt wack to play because of that. The visuals and feedback felt off. Just my opinion. This looks much better. Mechanics look great too. Special variants of existing Smash mechanics is a great idea.
well, the pixel art opened up modding much more accesibly, since original 3d art is much more time consuming, especially for ppl doing free work as a hobby. however i could see this having an inverse effect that garners more more ppl learning or harnessing their 3d animating skills down the road, but it still is bound to stagger modded content to a fraction of rivals 1.
@@AmRosary05 1s workshop will stay alive for a while, but people make impressive mods for 3d games all the time. no doubt that the devs will eventually support mod creators to live up to the og's name
Pixel art leads to a lot less jank and a lot fewer glitches. 3D is notorious for collision problems in just about every game, and though I'm sure Aether Studios will do its best to iron that stuff out during the game's lifespan, there's probably always going to be "What the hell?" moments as players engage with the game. That, and my personal preference has always been for 2D animation over 3D in general, but that's a much less objective take, and I'm aware it's not very widely shared. Still, I've put $50 toward this game's Kickstarter regardless of gripes (also not a fan of the addition of ledges since the lack of them and the robust wall-jump gameplay was part of what set Rivals 1 apart from Smash) because I have full confidence that the team will deliver an incredible game. Mild gripes can't kill the hype for what's looking to be a fantastic experience.
I prefer the pixel art of the original also kind of seems like they're overlapping a line mechanics from smash Bros making this game feel a little less distinct from that unfortunately The original rivals of either was one of the few platform fighters I actually liked outside of smash Bros they didn't feel like it was just trying to copy smash Bros
I kind of see it as a good thing, it makes the game different enough to have the original not feel obsolete (kind of in the way Smash 4 is now with Ultimate existing). You can still enjoy the original's style, play, and hopefully even continue competitive with the original while the new game gets its time to shine.
@@vicstonek9 I was kind of with you except for the fact that in my opinion and I think many others smash ultimate made smash 4 completely obsolete nobody plays that game anymore smash ultimate literally completely replaced it It would have been a better example if you said smash ultimate amd melee since those are still two distinct communities but nobody's playing smash 4
@@vicstonek9Eh, I think nobody is giving Smash 4 the respect it deserves. Questionable character balancing aside, I think it's got a lot of cool tech in it that no other game seems to have.
Why would they add such a random mechanic to counter pummels? Makes me remember when I bought dbz ultimate tenkaichi and the whole game was based on if you press square or triangle, and it was completely random. Doesn't seem like a fun interaction... Which is a pity because I like the idea of the different types of pummel.
it's not to counter pummels, it's to counter chaingrabbing. see at about 2:33 when Wrastor turns yellow after getting grabbed? that's chaingrab immunity--getting grabbed in that state immediately breaks you out. winning the pummel 50-50 removes the chaingrab immunity so you can go for a regrab after your throw. it also allows them to remove the button mashing mechanic that the smash titles use to keep pummels interesting.
the game looks amazing, most smash clones struggle to make the characters not look stiff but i think they nailed it my only issue is the workshop, i don't know if we'll get one but even if we do making characters will be so much harder for modders now with all the extra mechanics and moves and especially 3D. great for the base game but, yknow, hard to mod :(
The criticism people give to this game makes no sense 1. Rivals of aether fans act like grabs and shields make the game a smash clone when thats basically saying the only difference this game has with smash is less mechanics 2. Workshop is not the only reason to play rivals of aether, the game was intended to be competitive also great video
I just cant figure out why certain moves take priority over others. It doesnt really make sense to me or feel natural. Moves that should feel more powerful dont take priority over others because of weird hurtboxes
6:30 untrue. Hitfalling is essential to learn to be good at Rivals. Maybe it works slightly differently than it did in Rivals 1, but I'm sure it still will be the case in Rivals 2 based on how the devs and some players that actually played the first game for more than just a month at most describe the game.
He's not calling it useless, just hard to utilize properly. Hence why he is telling beginners to learn the fundamentals first before trying the flashy tech stuff.
I like shields and grabs, but I do not like hearing that Edgehogging is back. It was an incredibly shallow and pointless mechanic in Melee. If an edgehog was possible in a given situation, that means it was the only option. So in effect, all its inclusion does is shrink each stage by a few pixels on each side. It adds little to the intracacies of edge guarding. Maybe it would have had more depth in Rivals 1 where you had extremely flexible recovery options. But that flexibilty seems to have been removed in the sequel, in exchange for Smash's "Ledge is Everything" philosophy.
I personally think edgehogging is the more interesting mechanic. Even in situations where it's very clear your opponent can only come back is via a ledge grab it becomes a technical check to see how fast you can get to ledge. But to me ledge hogging becomes a really interesting mechanic once the player recovering can make it back by both ledge or just landing on stage. Without ledge hogging it's almost always safer to just go for ledge, which reduces choice, with ledge hogging going for ledge isn't an automatic return to stage as it becomes an interesting mind game. Your opponent might grab ledge last minute making it so you fall to your death, but landing on stage causes landing lag making it possible for you to die that way. I personally think Melee's ledges are too strong so that isn't the best example of this mechanic working well but I personally prefer it if it's balanced correctly, it surprisingly creates more depth. Smash 4 trumping was also pretty good but I personally prefer ledge hogging.
@@t00nbink I don't think purely technical skill checks are good for the game. That's what L Canceling is, and it wasn't included in Rivals for that very reason. Sometimes edge hogging does becomes a mental game (Fox and Falco's side B), but that's the only instance it contribute depth to the edge game, and that's a vast minority of cases. And even when it does, the reward for an edge hog read is far too large (guaranteed KO at any %) compared to predicting an on-stage side B (resetting the recovery situation). That makes it feel very, like... topheavy? as a mechanic and it doesn't feel good as a result. The risk/reward is skewed. WithOUT edge hogging, the ledge is only safe due to ledge invincibility, which is its own problem. Instead of removing that problem, edge hogging just covers it up with a second problem. I did not like ledge trumping at all, and I did not like edge hogging at all. I think both are very poor mechanics. This is a big reason why Rivals was my favorite platform fighter; it elected to forego ledges altogether. As a result, the game was forced to give us so much depth of off stage movement and recovery options that it had an incredible amount of offstage skill expression on offense or defense. I think ledges could work if they were balanced to be just another one of these many options. But because flexibility of recovering has been reduced, and the ledge grants (three whole rounds of) invincibility, it looks like the ledge has become a hugely centralizing aspect of recovery, just how it is in the Smash games. And because edge hogging is an unconditional counter to grabbing the ledge, that too will be over-centralized, reducing the game's nuance.
@@NoshuHyena I think you make good arguments, and I agree. I’m still super excited for Rivals 2 and wish it the best of success and longevity. But I also particularly fear your last paragraph of prediction will be right on the money. But in any case, I think Dan and the team do good work. And do great with involving themselves in the community and take feedback. So if it indeed does prove to be too much of a problem, hopefully we can reach the devs with our concern once the game is out and potentially we have something more concrete to point to? .. Unless there’s enough people who just prefer the ledge hogging, like many also do, especially from the Melee crowd and such?
@@EonWhite Oh yes! I sometimes get so wrapped up in the negatives that I forget to praise Aether Studios for their hard work and incredible vision. Rivals 2 will still most likely be my main platform fighter when it comes out, even if it ends up faltering in some aspects. Unfortunately I think the anti-edge hogging crowd is outnumbered here. I've tried to bring this up in front of Melee players and the most common response is being called a scrub who thinks it's cheap or cheating. But that's definitely not my reasoning, of course xP Regardless, all this is moot since the game isn't even in alpha yet, but let's prepare to spread the word just in case.
I agree. I can appreciate that ledge hogging adds some much needed counter play for recovering to ledge, but I've always hated the concept that grabbing the ledge is a kill move. I'd like to see platform fighters try new approaches to ledge problems like Rivals 1 did. That being said, I have faith in the Rivals team to make a good game, and I hope they make it work well for them.
It did exist but it was more like an arcade mode with only the first 6 characters lol. Single player content was definitely it's downside steam workshop was the only thing for casuals
Rivals 2 is going to be so defensive with it having 2 forms of Parry, Power Shield and the Special Parry. I don't that's a good idea. As it means the risk of attacking will have 2 chances of being parried.
I don't think you have to worry. You have to remember that although there are more defensive options than in Smash or Rivals 1, there are also much more movement and aggressive options than in those games (particularly Smash). And if your opponent is just sitting in shield, it seems like grabs will be very powerful similar to Melee, and shields also seem to break much easier than Smash
I’m super excited for the game. And while I like playing platform fighters both with ledges and without ledges, and also think Melee is cool and all. I must admit that taking stocks with ledge hogs is stale and boring to me. :/ Stocks should be taken with attacks rather than technicalities imho. But it is what it is, and others are allowed to prefer it or be hype about it, of course.
as someone who never played melee i could never get into the game cus every match i would get three stocked by some wave dashing mf who has a severe vitamin d deficiency
The shield break animation is terrible IMO. It looks like you've suddenly been transported to the moon. Why do they go so high and why is it so slooow ascending and falling, on top of a dizzy animation? For a game that plays so quickly it looks SO out of place
Remove powershielding and the game would be instantly better. Shields should not be super powerful braindead mash this button to get out of offensive pressure for free. Dan Fornace has clearly fallen off if he is implementing garbage broken defensive mechanics to the sequel.
I mean, power shielding is something you have to time right, so you can't just mash shield. Mash shield, and you're likely gonna get wrecked. Likewise, it also encourages you to be more careful about your attacks instead of being Masher McGee getting away with random bullshit.
I know more than you people and Dan clearly. Powershielding with bubbleshields allows you to mash shield all day without punishment. The fighting game triangle never works in platform fighters at all as intended because of all the robust movement the platform fighters give you or some physics and mechanical reasons so making bubbleshields the worse thing about platform fighters have a way to mash R and L is unhealthy for the game. This game is gonna suck lol. Powerhsielding with good buffer is all i need to know to know that. Smash bros is not something you want to copy when it has many flaws especially melee.@@Sir_Robin_of_Camelot
Encourages you to wait for teh opponent to do something first and turns a game into a snoozing campfest where whoever shielding is the meta. There is already parry and other defensive mechanics so powerhsielding is overkill and what timing lol. Timing a powertshield is so easy you could mash it even.@@LloydTheZephyrian
So not only do you have defensive mechanics the ruin the game state and what made rivals 1 so great you now also have a mechanic that invalidates parry the better mechanic that actually takes timing and predicting and learning unlike powershielding which turns a game into shield simulator. Why parry if you can just get similar punishments with the braindead powershield. Shields don't discourage mashing or encourage careful play. No Parry does and instead powerhsield encourages campy gameplay. You know nothing about gamestates and design choices and their consequences. Look at smash 4 gameplay and tell me with a straight face bubble shields and powerhsielding is good for a platform fighter. You can't. You know nothing about the issues with loads of platform fighters or even smash and games that want to be like smash.@@LloydTheZephyrian
1 Week left to support the kickstarter: www.kickstarter.com/projects/danfornace/rivals-2
Now or never boiz! Let's get it to 10 characters on launch!
@@JediJess1Man i wished it had at least like 12 chars or more on launch, id happily even trade the single-player for it. 😭 But oh well im still going to support the game regardless by going for that really sweet 30$ Kickstarter Tier. 👌
😮😅
It's worth mentioning that shield dropping can also be performed just by pressing down right after letting go of shield, you don't have to do the Smash method of slowly tilting down. Also, you can still wall jump out of special fall for horizontal and downward moving specials (e.g. Maypul side special), just not up specials and other specials that go up (like Wrastor's neutral special).
Okay, that's not so bad then.
Literally wasn't going to buy the game for that reason alone. Well, that and the inclusion of ledgehogging.
What's wrong with ledgehogging? It adds way more depth offstage and if it wasn't in the game the off stage game would be very boring like how it is in smash 4/ult. @@xRagingxDemonx
What if Zettaburn angled his Up special Horizontal or diagonally down?
@@p0kepanda462Edgehogging absolutely _ruins_ characters that are unable to make it back to the stage itself, and takes literally zero skill to do.
With trumping (or simply no edgehogging), you have to earn the marginal KOs by denying the ledge, rather than turning them into a foregone conclusion.
What about after the second downward part of Ranno’s up special?
sounds petty, but the biggest change for me is the new camera movements... the old game always felt a little stale when the zoom level was always so far out and rarely gave you a close up view of the action. Now you can feel like you're right in front of the action, like a front row seat at a concert
I think this is valid and not “petty”.
Although, I think how the camera worked in RoA was fine and the preferable option for that game. Since I fear the alternative for a pixel art platform fighter is how it works in Super Smash Flash or Fraymakers.
Personally, I don’t like the dynamic smooth moving camera in pixel art platform fighters such as those, as it makes the pixel art look super rough to me and somewhat nauseating.
But that type of camera works perfectly for 3d platform fighters. So I feel RoA chose the right camera for it’s art style imho.
And the new camera is exciting and better than RoA’s.
So there’s reason for hype. ;)
IT's a big deal in terms of presentation, I prefer the dynamic camera in games like these as well
i never played the first rivals, but with how polished and fun this game looks, plus with the state ultimate is in, i’m gonna give this one a shot for sure.
i’m thinking the same thing
Really happy to see they're smash players interested in the second, rivals of aether is my favourite game but I'm also still gonna play smash even when rivals 2 comes out
@@cosmic5665Honestly dude smash isn't even worth it anymore because no matter what anyone says you're not telling that game is balanced because there are like 15 to 20 characters in that game that are unviable or borderline and I am sick of the terrible online
I am happy to hear you guys are giving rivals a shot I love the game and I hope you do too
@@cosmic5665I honestly hope there is a smash killer soon
Wow, the Doods got me hyped. I can def see this sequel being a lot more attractive to smash players than the first one. New mechanics and it being 3D and all.
I feel like rivals is 1 of those platform fighters that, like smash, won't just have the previous game die when to next 1 is out, because of how the games play fairly different from each other, meaning that some will prefer the new mechanic, but some will prefer the old ones & some will like to do a bit of both
Personaly, I really miss the AMAZING pixel art from the 1st game but... I hope this game sell a lot to see the 3rd game in a few years. 🤟🏻
I think if they for some reason stopped updating rivals 2 and started making a new game it would be in probably at least like 10 years no joke.
Weird stance
@@alex__9001 How is wishing success weird?
@@JuIianRock Is English not your first language or something? Because you took what he said and went leaps and bounds with it.
All he said is that he missed the pixel art style, and that he hopes that the series gets another installation in the future. You're looking WAY too deep into this bud.
@@JuIianRock Stop making me feel bad. I'm trying to play Celeste.
This looks sick! Ledge special attacks and get up special attacks is just great!
Might this be the return of the BeefyAetherDoods?
FR though, very excited for this game!
Great vid, maybe make some character specific mechanic guides next. A lot of people are confused about Fleet's resource and you guys would be the perfect channel to clear that up!
Pfp (Profile picture) and / or Banner Sauce (Source [Artist])? 🗿
Ive never played the first rivals, but im really excited to get into the esries when i get rivals 2!
This is looking to be great. I personally really like the changes and the distant feel compared to the original because it gives old Rivals more wiggle room to thrive with its player base (kind of in the way Melee is in the Smash series) while with the second installation has a chance to thrive for being new and introducing new mechanics and things that makes the game interesting and different to play (basically what Ultimate is in the Smash series).
Yeah, good point.
I agree and hope that’s how it’ll go.
Feel this entirely
Nah Rivals 2 is going to add even more depth to the series and Rivals 1 will get a bit older cuz no shielding so your approach options against zoning and zoners or projectiles in general will be even more limited.
Then when 2 adds Workshop its going to steal even more from the Casual playerbase of 1 or heck, even the competitive one lol.
Not saying 1 still wont be great, im just saying i will find little to no reason for playing it once 2 is out other than nostalgia and Workshop.
@@SimoneBellomonte eh, i don't know about that. anyone can draw a sprite and some hitcircles, but a 3D workshop adds a layer of complexity that's going to lock out most people. i have a lot of faith in OP's argument
one thing about moonwalking that is unique to Rivals is that you can moonwalk with an upper half-circle too, not just a downward half-circle. this lets you moonwalk on platforms without dropping through!
Moonwalking is still kinda cool but it’ll never be like melee where your backwards velocity just exponentially gets faster which is so damn funny
Can't wait for this game to release!! Really hope it will come to the Switch too!
Already supported on Kickstarter. Looking forward to it!
Supporting greatness! ✊😎
It's incredible how polished this game is already looking, specially when compared to games funded by actual AAA companies such as _MultiVersus_ and _Nickelodeon All Star Brawl._ I'm so incredibly hyped for it. The way they're introducing Special Attacks into pummels, get-up attacks and ledge attacks is absolutely brilliant.
I like the ledge specials and all. But I feel like part of what made rivals unique were the lack of ledges . Get back into the action faster and made for more interesting edge guards rather than playing from the ledge
Edgehogging is in Rivals 2, that most definitely won't change.
I like both ways of play.
I think it would be fun as an extra mode in the game.
Although, I don’t think they’ll add that, as it would create a divide between players. Which wouldn’t be good for the health of the game.
At the very least, they tried to add some extra flavour to it with ledge specials. Rather than just doing the same system as Smash.
Including ledges also creates an impression for the large group of smash players of: “Oh, so it’s like the Smash I know and love, plus a new mechanic? Sign me up!”
Rather than: “Ugh, Rivals 2 doesn’t even have ledges. So it’s just a bare-bones Smash game. Sign me out..”
So that might help towards getting more Smash players to check it out, increasing the game’s chance of success.
Dan would put his version of killer instinct's combo break with breaking out of grab pummels haha. That's amazing
I didn’t know that you couldn’t hit fall shields, it makes sense when thinking about it though because I thought she shield pressure was just going to be crazy requiring you to parry at some point
my hope for this game would be to give this game more casual options like items story campaign mini games etc and here this game need to have good and replayability gameplay
i think they're working on a story mode rn
Great to see you guys doing Rivaks content! I hope you will drop some more vids with the pre-Alpha build.
I just watched a video recently about how part of the reason few platformers can get out from Smash’s shadow is because they’re constantly comparing themselves to Smash. In light of that, it was interesting to hear almost every mechanic in this game get compared to something in Smash bros every few seconds. Couldn’t unhear it.
it's more because it's easier to move games when you have Mario and Pikachu and Link and so forth on the cover.
real ones remember beefy aether doods
I wonder if it's release will bring back the Beefy Rival Doods channel
All I hope is that Steam Workshop support is just as extensive as the first game, Rivals flourished off its modding scene, and while I hope this game isn't as reliant on it, I hope it will be just as powerful if not moreso than the first game
3D modeling is way harder than pixel art, so even if the tools are there, the scene will probably be a lot less robust. Not to say I don't want the Workshop to come back, but I'd be shocked if Rivals 2 were known for it like Rivals 1 is.
yall going to review Combo Devils??
I am pretty worried be honest. No sheild was a pretty important aspect of the design and flow for rivals and as someone in the competitive scene I have heard to many people saying they just aren’t gonna play it. I’m also worried about about steam workshop support cause no matter how good they make it work 3D modeling will always be harder than pixel art to look passable. I personally think the game is looking incredible but I still am curious for its feel and all. Not that it will be good, I’m certain of that, but if it will be good at being rivals of aether. Like even with many similar ideas and the same design philosophy character and game wise, but so many changes to basic core mechanics, Not just mechanics generally but core simple mechanics I am worried if rivals 2 will have the staying power of rivals 1.
When you consider that they only didn't include shields in the original due to techinical limitations, how much money the kickstarter has generated, and how much they've been letting top smash/rival/platform fighters play this pre-alpha to get their feedback and improve the game, I find it hard to believe that "too many people" aren't going to play it. I feel like this is the only platform fighter outside Smash that has a chance to be the next big thing, at least as far as a competitive scene, with the bonus of not being tied to Nintendo at all. What you consider "Rivals of Aether" is completely subjective...
Yeah but like… how can this game really stand out to the casual audience? No custom characters, art style more like smash, mechanics more like smash, and while this is subjective I know, rivals character design isn’t like, super unique
@@Swaxeman I don't know, maybe it won't and it really depends on what you consider a casual(I think it will get most people who like to compete in platform fighters to try it). The reason I like RoA so much is because the level of control you had over your character was similar to Melee without the insane timing + precision and that they were more focused on good balance rather than making a ton of characters.
I also think the elemental gimmick/specials of most of the characters are pretty unique personally. Maypul's tethers and wraps, Ranno's poison and bubble. Orcane's(who I assume will be in the launch roster) puddles and all the things those entail, etc. It's more about meaningful unique aspects sprinkled in their movesets.
Other game modes will be in the game eventually (just like RoA) but the focus at release is clearly to make sure the core gameplay loop and game feel is as polished and fun as possible. The core competitive gameplay is what gives games like Melee the staying power it's had.
@@Kade503 I guess. I’m more worried just about the games profit in this way. I just dont really see it capturing the more casual fanbase RoA did, with its more unique artstyle, and workshop
@@Swaxeman A lot of these things mentioned don't even drive casuals away. If the only thing that interests you about this game is seeing Peter Griffin in workshop just go play rivals 1, Mugen, or wait for when they make the game actually polished enough to warrant workshop.
I could be wrong, but did you guys forget to mention DACUS?
Great video though! I'm looking forward to more Rivals 2 content!
Hope it gets a strong modding scene like the first
1:42 Fleet's parry is menacing...
Yeah, lol.
Oh nah bro 6:06 I think taking that out of the game is an abysmal change cause wall jumping after free fall made even recovering an interesting game and not just lead to you losing a stock please for the love of god revert this change
It looks incredible, definitely can’t wait to play!
I've been waiting on y'all to make this video tyty
What about DI or SDI?
There is di its very standard and was in the first game and I believe there's sdi but don't quote me
This game alrdy looks great in its current state im so excited to see it on full release! Just joined the kickstarter at the last minute
The special variations of stuff is simple and amazing at the same time 😂omg
The revival of beefy aether doods?
Game looks absolutely insane. Other smash clones in shambles
They're usually called platform fighters or at the least smashlikes. I think games like Brawlhalla and Rivals are unique enough they've made the type of game a whole genre. A smash clone would be something like Smash Flash 2.
I guess halo is a doom clone, Tekken is a street fighter clone, terraria is a Minecraft clone
@@readyplayerthree3 ngl, I just wanted to leave a positive comment for the algorithm :P You are right about "platform fighter", I was thinking more about the Multiversus and the Nickelodeon ones.
@@ArchesBromultiversus wasn't really good at all but it's still really different to smash, nasb, I barely know about
@@cosmic5665 a lot of early FPS games actually DID get called doom clones, as I understand it.
Dude this game is gonna be SO sick
Weird to me that some people prefer pixel art for a platform fighter. That was one of the first game's biggest issues with me. There wasnt smooth or detailed enough animation, and as good as the mechanics are, it just felt wack to play because of that. The visuals and feedback felt off. Just my opinion.
This looks much better. Mechanics look great too. Special variants of existing Smash mechanics is a great idea.
well, the pixel art opened up modding much more accesibly, since original 3d art is much more time consuming, especially for ppl doing free work as a hobby.
however i could see this having an inverse effect that garners more more ppl learning or harnessing their 3d animating skills down the road, but it still is bound to stagger modded content to a fraction of rivals 1.
@@AmRosary05 I see both happening. RoA1's workshop scene will continue to thrive, and the devs fully intend to add workshop support down the line.
@@AmRosary05 1s workshop will stay alive for a while, but people make impressive mods for 3d games all the time. no doubt that the devs will eventually support mod creators to live up to the og's name
Pixel art leads to a lot less jank and a lot fewer glitches. 3D is notorious for collision problems in just about every game, and though I'm sure Aether Studios will do its best to iron that stuff out during the game's lifespan, there's probably always going to be "What the hell?" moments as players engage with the game.
That, and my personal preference has always been for 2D animation over 3D in general, but that's a much less objective take, and I'm aware it's not very widely shared.
Still, I've put $50 toward this game's Kickstarter regardless of gripes (also not a fan of the addition of ledges since the lack of them and the robust wall-jump gameplay was part of what set Rivals 1 apart from Smash) because I have full confidence that the team will deliver an incredible game. Mild gripes can't kill the hype for what's looking to be a fantastic experience.
I am soooo hyped about this game !!!
I miss when you guys posted new videos to your Beefy Aether Doods channel
I prefer the pixel art of the original also kind of seems like they're overlapping a line mechanics from smash Bros making this game feel a little less distinct from that unfortunately The original rivals of either was one of the few platform fighters I actually liked outside of smash Bros they didn't feel like it was just trying to copy smash Bros
To be fair the only reason a lot of smash mechanics weren't in rivals 1 was due to limitations they were facing with the engine they had
I kind of see it as a good thing, it makes the game different enough to have the original not feel obsolete (kind of in the way Smash 4 is now with Ultimate existing). You can still enjoy the original's style, play, and hopefully even continue competitive with the original while the new game gets its time to shine.
@@vicstonek9 I was kind of with you except for the fact that in my opinion and I think many others smash ultimate made smash 4 completely obsolete nobody plays that game anymore smash ultimate literally completely replaced it It would have been a better example if you said smash ultimate amd melee since those are still two distinct communities but nobody's playing smash 4
@@vicstonek9Eh, I think nobody is giving Smash 4 the respect it deserves. Questionable character balancing aside, I think it's got a lot of cool tech in it that no other game seems to have.
This seems like a fun ass game
Why would they add such a random mechanic to counter pummels? Makes me remember when I bought dbz ultimate tenkaichi and the whole game was based on if you press square or triangle, and it was completely random. Doesn't seem like a fun interaction... Which is a pity because I like the idea of the different types of pummel.
it's not to counter pummels, it's to counter chaingrabbing. see at about 2:33 when Wrastor turns yellow after getting grabbed? that's chaingrab immunity--getting grabbed in that state immediately breaks you out. winning the pummel 50-50 removes the chaingrab immunity so you can go for a regrab after your throw.
it also allows them to remove the button mashing mechanic that the smash titles use to keep pummels interesting.
the game looks amazing, most smash clones struggle to make the characters not look stiff but i think they nailed it
my only issue is the workshop, i don't know if we'll get one but even if we do making characters will be so much harder for modders now with all the extra mechanics and moves and especially 3D. great for the base game but, yknow, hard to mod :(
Game look so promising, I am planning to really get sucked into it!
I really hope this comes out on the Switch or the Switch’s successor because I’ve played the first game and while I suck at it I still enjoy it.
I'm gonna say it... Krag is on the juice 😂
Super hyped for this game, I love the first one and its my most played game on Steam!
Very hyped for this game. The devs care about balance, online, and competitive which is a huge pet peeve of smash ultimate.
I'll probably still play without these but I hope the workshop (and Mollo) return
Ohh this looks really good
I’m very excited for this game.
I am so hoping this game will become as popular as Smash is.
Also, I’m super hyped for BSD Rivals 2 content.
🙌
Really hype for Rivals 2. Hope it comes to Switch at some point
I am already calling it, there will be about 10+ mods the first week it officially comes out
The game looks amazing. I wish they implemented ledge trump though.
Kragg looks so sick bro
Yo, the editing on the end of the video was clean.
When is it coming out?
And will it be modable?
What's the song at the end?
The criticism people give to this game makes no sense
1. Rivals of aether fans act like grabs and shields make the game a smash clone when thats basically saying the only difference this game has with smash is less mechanics
2. Workshop is not the only reason to play rivals of aether, the game was intended to be competitive also great video
Shrink Krag please! I really liked his small compact design in OG rivals
I like both, but as a DK player in Smash, I love his new size.
Expand Kragg. :p
You clearly just don't like big characters, I main gief in SF and pot in ggst, keep kragg big
he's as natty as the Liver King 😂
Beefy aether dudes comeback?
Looks like an amazing game. Unfortunately, i don't think i have enough time to get into it
good game progress!
Is this an 8 direction game or analog stick game?
Game looks siiiiick
Love to see the R2 comment
Will there be workshop support? I will miss Obama if not
i was sold with ledge hoging
Slime mechanic when? 👀
No wall jumping from special fall makes me sad
I hate the 3D look and I liked the old way to recover but Rivals will always be a great game.
I just cant figure out why certain moves take priority over others. It doesnt really make sense to me or feel natural. Moves that should feel more powerful dont take priority over others because of weird hurtboxes
6:30 untrue.
Hitfalling is essential to learn to be good at Rivals. Maybe it works slightly differently than it did in Rivals 1, but I'm sure it still will be the case in Rivals 2 based on how the devs and some players that actually played the first game for more than just a month at most describe the game.
He's not calling it useless, just hard to utilize properly.
Hence why he is telling beginners to learn the fundamentals first before trying the flashy tech stuff.
Not true.. you can still be very high level without hitfall. But obviously using hitfall improves the gameplay a lot!
I like shields and grabs, but I do not like hearing that Edgehogging is back. It was an incredibly shallow and pointless mechanic in Melee. If an edgehog was possible in a given situation, that means it was the only option. So in effect, all its inclusion does is shrink each stage by a few pixels on each side. It adds little to the intracacies of edge guarding.
Maybe it would have had more depth in Rivals 1 where you had extremely flexible recovery options. But that flexibilty seems to have been removed in the sequel, in exchange for Smash's "Ledge is Everything" philosophy.
I personally think edgehogging is the more interesting mechanic. Even in situations where it's very clear your opponent can only come back is via a ledge grab it becomes a technical check to see how fast you can get to ledge. But to me ledge hogging becomes a really interesting mechanic once the player recovering can make it back by both ledge or just landing on stage.
Without ledge hogging it's almost always safer to just go for ledge, which reduces choice, with ledge hogging going for ledge isn't an automatic return to stage as it becomes an interesting mind game. Your opponent might grab ledge last minute making it so you fall to your death, but landing on stage causes landing lag making it possible for you to die that way. I personally think Melee's ledges are too strong so that isn't the best example of this mechanic working well but I personally prefer it if it's balanced correctly, it surprisingly creates more depth. Smash 4 trumping was also pretty good but I personally prefer ledge hogging.
@@t00nbink
I don't think purely technical skill checks are good for the game. That's what L Canceling is, and it wasn't included in Rivals for that very reason.
Sometimes edge hogging does becomes a mental game (Fox and Falco's side B), but that's the only instance it contribute depth to the edge game, and that's a vast minority of cases. And even when it does, the reward for an edge hog read is far too large (guaranteed KO at any %) compared to predicting an on-stage side B (resetting the recovery situation). That makes it feel very, like... topheavy? as a mechanic and it doesn't feel good as a result. The risk/reward is skewed.
WithOUT edge hogging, the ledge is only safe due to ledge invincibility, which is its own problem. Instead of removing that problem, edge hogging just covers it up with a second problem. I did not like ledge trumping at all, and I did not like edge hogging at all. I think both are very poor mechanics. This is a big reason why Rivals was my favorite platform fighter; it elected to forego ledges altogether. As a result, the game was forced to give us so much depth of off stage movement and recovery options that it had an incredible amount of offstage skill expression on offense or defense.
I think ledges could work if they were balanced to be just another one of these many options. But because flexibility of recovering has been reduced, and the ledge grants (three whole rounds of) invincibility, it looks like the ledge has become a hugely centralizing aspect of recovery, just how it is in the Smash games. And because edge hogging is an unconditional counter to grabbing the ledge, that too will be over-centralized, reducing the game's nuance.
@@NoshuHyena
I think you make good arguments, and I agree.
I’m still super excited for Rivals 2 and wish it the best of success and longevity.
But I also particularly fear your last paragraph of prediction will be right on the money.
But in any case, I think Dan and the team do good work. And do great with involving themselves in the community and take feedback. So if it indeed does prove to be too much of a problem, hopefully we can reach the devs with our concern once the game is out and potentially we have something more concrete to point to?
.. Unless there’s enough people who just prefer the ledge hogging, like many also do, especially from the Melee crowd and such?
@@EonWhite Oh yes! I sometimes get so wrapped up in the negatives that I forget to praise Aether Studios for their hard work and incredible vision. Rivals 2 will still most likely be my main platform fighter when it comes out, even if it ends up faltering in some aspects.
Unfortunately I think the anti-edge hogging crowd is outnumbered here. I've tried to bring this up in front of Melee players and the most common response is being called a scrub who thinks it's cheap or cheating. But that's definitely not my reasoning, of course xP Regardless, all this is moot since the game isn't even in alpha yet, but let's prepare to spread the word just in case.
I agree. I can appreciate that ledge hogging adds some much needed counter play for recovering to ledge, but I've always hated the concept that grabbing the ledge is a kill move. I'd like to see platform fighters try new approaches to ledge problems like Rivals 1 did. That being said, I have faith in the Rivals team to make a good game, and I hope they make it work well for them.
Rivals has always been the only other plat fighter, because the game is just so unique and in many ways ,kinda better than smash.
I hope ori is still in the game
Did rivals 1 ever get a single player campaign or did that just never happen lol?
It did exist but it was more like an arcade mode with only the first 6 characters lol. Single player content was definitely it's downside steam workshop was the only thing for casuals
It looks awesome but I’m definitely disappointed by the fact that ledge trumps aren’t a thing, that always annoyed me about melee
man i REALLY dont like that they brought back shields and grabs
I’m so excited
Rivals 2 is going to be so defensive with it having 2 forms of Parry, Power Shield and the Special Parry. I don't that's a good idea. As it means the risk of attacking will have 2 chances of being parried.
I don't think you have to worry. You have to remember that although there are more defensive options than in Smash or Rivals 1, there are also much more movement and aggressive options than in those games (particularly Smash). And if your opponent is just sitting in shield, it seems like grabs will be very powerful similar to Melee, and shields also seem to break much easier than Smash
This looks really fun, and we don’t have to deal with Nintendo.
So sad they removed rivals from rivals, it’s a whole different game 😭
am I the only one who pogged at ledge hogging?
Ikr! Ledgehogging is dope!
I’m super excited for the game.
And while I like playing platform fighters both with ledges and without ledges, and also think Melee is cool and all.
I must admit that taking stocks with ledge hogs is stale and boring to me. :/
Stocks should be taken with attacks rather than technicalities imho.
But it is what it is, and others are allowed to prefer it or be hype about it, of course.
This game will kill ult
as someone who never played melee i could never get into the game cus every match i would get three stocked by some wave dashing mf who has a severe vitamin d deficiency
The shield break animation is terrible IMO. It looks like you've suddenly been transported to the moon. Why do they go so high and why is it so slooow ascending and falling, on top of a dizzy animation?
For a game that plays so quickly it looks SO out of place
lesgooo
El smash bros de furros xd
I don't like the new artstyle tbh
Interesting.... but so many furry.... that`s what pushes me back to Melee... sorry.
Literally the best character in the game is a furry lmao
@@javi994 yup, but I don't play it
@@javi994 imagine a game with all fox and Falco.. no thanks
_>ledging hogging instead of trumping_
_>chain grabbing_
Oof, that's a bit of a dealbreaker for me...
you take too long to get to the point and you're too monotonous
No ledge trump? Lame!
Remove powershielding and the game would be instantly better. Shields should not be super powerful braindead mash this button to get out of offensive pressure for free. Dan Fornace has clearly fallen off if he is implementing garbage broken defensive mechanics to the sequel.
I mean, power shielding is something you have to time right, so you can't just mash shield. Mash shield, and you're likely gonna get wrecked.
Likewise, it also encourages you to be more careful about your attacks instead of being Masher McGee getting away with random bullshit.
You don't know enough details to make an argument lol
I know more than you people and Dan clearly. Powershielding with bubbleshields allows you to mash shield all day without punishment. The fighting game triangle never works in platform fighters at all as intended because of all the robust movement the platform fighters give you or some physics and mechanical reasons so making bubbleshields the worse thing about platform fighters have a way to mash R and L is unhealthy for the game. This game is gonna suck lol. Powerhsielding with good buffer is all i need to know to know that. Smash bros is not something you want to copy when it has many flaws especially melee.@@Sir_Robin_of_Camelot
Encourages you to wait for teh opponent to do something first and turns a game into a snoozing campfest where whoever shielding is the meta. There is already parry and other defensive mechanics so powerhsielding is overkill and what timing lol. Timing a powertshield is so easy you could mash it even.@@LloydTheZephyrian
So not only do you have defensive mechanics the ruin the game state and what made rivals 1 so great you now also have a mechanic that invalidates parry the better mechanic that actually takes timing and predicting and learning unlike powershielding which turns a game into shield simulator. Why parry if you can just get similar punishments with the braindead powershield. Shields don't discourage mashing or encourage careful play. No Parry does and instead powerhsield encourages campy gameplay. You know nothing about gamestates and design choices and their consequences. Look at smash 4 gameplay and tell me with a straight face bubble shields and powerhsielding is good for a platform fighter. You can't. You know nothing about the issues with loads of platform fighters or even smash and games that want to be like smash.@@LloydTheZephyrian