B-17 Ball Turret Gunner (Dangerous Jobs in History)
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 มี.ค. 2021
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Flying a B-17 was a very risky job since they were huge, slow and therefore easy targets for enemy aircraft and anti-aircraft defences, who always marked them as primary targets.
Out of the entire crew, the most endangered were the machine gunners housed in overexposed emplacements.
One emplacement in particular carried the greatest risk.
The Position of the underbelly, ball turret gunner.
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Credit:
Created by Daniel Turner (B.A. (Hons) in History, University College London)
Script: Dejan Milivojevic
Narrator:
Bryan 'Lazlo' Beauregard
Sources:
Drendel, Lou, Don Greer, and Ernesteo Cumpain. Walk around Boeing B-17G Flying Fortress. Squadron/Signal Publications, 1998.
Johnsen, Frederick A. Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress. Specialty Press Publishers, 2001.
O'Leary, Michael. Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress. Osprey Aviation, 1998.
Aircrewman's Gunnery Manual. U.S. Navy, Office of the Chief of Naval Operations, 1944.
![พรากรัก - เต้ย อภิวัฒน์ [ Official MV ]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ShT2ltn8GBE/mqdefault.jpg)
Most claustrophobic job ever? :S
Small places are afraid of me
I wouldn’t mind being in the ball turret
ball
K
Tunnel Rat
“So what are the safety precautions?”
“No. Good luck.”
Ball turret gunner.
Difficulty: yes
Statistically the ball turret gunner had the lowest casualty rate
They had the most accurate guns on the aircraft, well protected and in a position the enemy rarly attacked from.
The tail Gunners were the guys who got killed the most
@@jamesricker3997 There's some infamous gun camera footage from a German fighter shown in the movie "Memphis Belle."
The attacker approaches the B-17 from behind, with all guns blazing.
Meanwhile all the B-17's gun positions are eerily silent. The attacker flies up close to spitting distance, then flies off just under the left wing.
In another gun camera footage on YT, I found some other shots from the same German pilot.
It shows he's a true sharpshooter, firing his cannons from a greater distance, taking out all the gun positions, including the tail gunner's.
Ever since having watched that first footage in that movie, I was wondering why it seemed all the defensive gunners appeared to be dead.
They all probably were.
@@jamesricker3997
Lowest casualty rate out of who? Ball gunners and tail gunners?
Safety precaution - Shoot them before they shoot you.
“When I die they wash me out of the turret with a hose”
My god that’s morbid
It's true, Luftwaffe was using primarily 7.6 calibre machine guns which could turn someone into a puddle, not to mention the AAA firing explosive shells.
Yeah, war ain't no walk in the park.
@@WhatEvenIsAGoodName a puddle? A 7.62? Even a 7.62x54 cant do that. Are you sure about germans using 7.62 and not 20mm?
@@BasedMilitarist6624 they use 8mm Mauser, which was phased out in favor of the 20mm MG 151
Technically the MG 17 have the fire rate capable of shredding people apart, but practically it won't happen
@@BasedMilitarist6624 They used 20mm on late-war fighters, but those barely took to the skies because the german fuel supply lines had been slashed by then. 7.62 rounds after smashing through the lightly armored canopy of the ball turret would be traveling at odd angles, with many fragmenting. They could cut a person to ribbons, and the kinetic force of multiple impacts would vibrate the body with enough force to basically liquidise internal organs. Puddle is a bit of an overstatement, but it could most certainly mess your day up.
My Dad was a ball turret gunner, trained in B-24's but saw combat in B-17's. Made 28 missions with the 401st Bomb Group was shot down on his last mission, spent 1 year as a POW of the Nazi's. Lost him 2 years ago at the age of 91 and he was a tough ol'bird and i miss him very much. Enjoyed your video very much.
Thank you very much for all the positive comments!
God bless you and your family. Your father is a true hero.
*FYI - The B-17 Ball Turret was NOT retractable, it was fixed. How do I know, I’ve flown in one. 909 which has now crashed and was destroyed. Narrator is thinking of the B-24*
I’m sorry for your loss.
You had him a good while. Dad went at 70. Be well.
@@Av-vd3wk thanks for straightening them out.
Mac Dotson was a friend of mine. Died many years ago. He was a ball turret gunner who survived 27 combat/ bombing missions- only to be taken by stomach cancer at 73. Rest in peace Mac and thank you for your service.
One of my uncles, six feet tall, had been in the infantry during the last 11 months of the war. He was in Hurtgen Forest, the Battle of the Bulge and other horrific battles against the German Army. He survived and lived happily for another 66 years. He used to say that he was thankful that he was tall, because in boot camp the really short guys were selected by the army to be trained as B17 or B24 tail gunners and ball turret gunners, and many of them didn't survive until the end of the war.
73 is about the average life expectancy in many countries; Nothing abnormal here. Surviving the 27 missions is luck.
Brave man
Can we just appreciate the animation of the ball turret
thanks
@@Simplehistory what’s your opinion on prego pasta sauce
@@eldermaxson8251 dang it you beat me to it
@@Simplehistory simple history you should do the king tiger
@@Simplehistory thanks for being the one of the reasons I didnt die of boredom in lockdown
Therapist: don’t worry, simple history 3D can’t hurt you.
3D ball turret:
M
@@lez6442 e
@@lez6442 f
@@frog7362 a
@The Big p
I remember watching a documentary about a WWII B-17 crew. Their plane was damaged in combat and they had to head back to base for an emergency landing. Their landing gear was destroyed and the ball turret was damaged shut with a crewman still inside. They all knew that he would be killed upon landing. So on the way back to base, they talked to him and said their goodbyes. Imagine being dead while you’re still alive.
I would have one of them shoot me if l was him. Or they should have cyanide tablets.
@@sicsempertyrannis7steven spielberg's amazing stories
@@flipao420lucky for him god lends a hand eh.
Myth. Appeared in a couple of books, but no researcher has ever been able to verify (and they have tried!). th-cam.com/video/FpPl8o2SDF4/w-d-xo.htmlsi=DEprkYkN-O7sf417
Ever see that one with Keifer Sutherland where the guy drew a cartoon landing gear ?
My grandpa served on B-17s and B-25s in the war. Being the shortest crew member, he got put in the ball turret of the B-17 and was tasked with manning the tail gun of the B-25.
He was hit with flak twice in the war but he said the worst pain he felt was when his leg cramped up while he was in the ball turret and he couldn’t stretch to relieve the cramp for hours until they were back in British airspace
My grandfather, Earnest "Buster" Matlock, was a B-17 ballgunner. He was 5'4. Did his duty, came home and lived out the rest of his life in East Texas.
I salute him!
GOD BLESS HIM!!!
I might not always support the military but I salute that man , he did his part and he has some monstrous balls
@@Jacques_the_Rooster le edgy
@@Jacques_the_Rooster Edgy much?
Wow, being stuck in a ball turret and the plane has to make a emergency landing. All you can do is watch the ground getting closer and closer. What a terrible way to go...
Once seen a documentary over this. In there was also a wounded belly gunner who was stuck. Could not sleep that night.
Even more terrible than seeing your beloved ones die in a cellar from the same suffocation and heat that will kill you in a moment while your whole city is burning and collapsing?
@@matthiasrupp3566 ok
WingBlitz ok
@@matthiasrupp3566 ok
We read "The Death of the Ball Turret Gunner" in my high school English class and even a decade later that poem still sticks with me. It's so short, but it carries such a heavy dark feeling
This was the first time I'd heard of the poem.
If you can find a copy, "Where steel winds blow" is an excellent compilation of war poetry and verse. That poem is one of them.
My grandfather fought in WW2 as a tail gunner for the RAF.
When his crew was put together, the way they chose him for this job was to give him a shotgun and shoot at clay pigeons.
He was the son of a gamekeeper, so he understood the concept of giving moving targets the right amount of lead, instead of just shooting at them.
He said it wasn't uncommon to meet a new guy at the base, chat, play some cards, the new man might put up some pictures of his family around his bunk, and then two days later... 'where's Jon?''... "he didn't make it''
He has 63 bombing missions in his flight record, and three crash landings.
He said there was a pipe to relive themselves, but in that moment, he just went in his pants.
Half laziness because there were so many layers to undo, half the fact that he thought they would go down in flames, so there was no indignity in it he recalled.
When he returned home, his own mother didn't recognise him because of the weight he lost and how the stress aged his face.
He followed his father (who died young from complications from being gassed in WW1) in becoming a gamekeeper when he came back to Britain.
He started smoking at 13, in his hay day he smoked two packs a day, and gave it up at 83.
He was a chronic alcoholic until his death at 94 years of age.
I hope everyone watching this fully appreciates the full horror that people like Les endured for our freedom.
The luckiest and most unlucky man I've ever met.
Anyone who perches on, or covers war memorials with their protests, no matter how important their message, should respect those few yards of brick and iron that commemorate the very people who allowed them to have a voice in this free society.
Amazing story, thanks for sharing
Well said
Hats off to you and a salute to your grandfather.
My grandfather Eddie “Spaghetti” Quagge was a ball turret gunner in the B-17. He flew numerous missions in Europe, including his own parents’ country of Italy. On one raid, his plane took heavy damage from enemy fire; he saved the lives of his crew by jettisoning all extra weight through the bomb port to keep them in flight long enough to make it back to base. He returned to Brockton MA for a long and happy life.
That's amazing. Your grandfather is considered a war hero in my book.
@@Scout800DR people who bomb civilians are heroes in your book? awesome! i guess your book is mein Kamp or something like that then
@@nnass262 war is war. Kill or be killed. Us or Them.
@@saltymonke3682 Then there are no heros, only men fighting each other
@@nnass262 ofc, there are heroes.
Man enlisting:”I wouldn’t want to be that guy” *he gets the job he didn’t want*
*well Im fucked
Should’ve applied to become an officer instead.
Yeah thats the one job i would guarentee to desert over... Rather get jail time then be in that death trap and i have agoraphobia, they dont like it then put me in a different role or get rid of manned ball turrets and use the materials to make a extra fighters to protect the bomber instead of condemning americans who signed over their lives to fight, to such a terrible job
@@timdillon4876 I think these type of high risk jobs were on volunteer basis, I don't think anyone got forced into it. Also even if they did, it would be easy to get out of the job simply claiming claustrafobia. (Eg: Tunnel rats in Vietnam were all strictly on volunteer basis)
That’s why no one will remember your name.
Memphis Belle for the win!
You're everywhere! I was in the JGSDF.
8,8 Flak for the win
I lived in Ohio in preble county, I’ve drove to Wright Patterson Air Force base and have seen the Memphis belle myself. What a cool plane!
Yes sir
Matsimus the ever-present !
To anyone fascinated with B17's in general and the ball turret position in particular, in the mid '80s Stephen Spielberg had a TV show called 'Amazing Stories', and an episode called 'The Mission'. It's Fantasy, but fun to watch.
Of that tv series, the only one I remember. Hard to find. I love the ending when...........no spoilers, watch it if you can find it.
@Colin van Overdijk Well, there's 'Family Dog', which in my opinion practically kick-started the cartoon renaissance, and if some Halloween you want to see something humorous rather than horrifying, you can't do better than 'Mummy Daddy'.
...actually, if you're willing to shell out a couple of bucks, all these are available on TH-cam, Google, and Vudu.
Hah! Great memories, I remember that episode and series! That drawing totally saved him. Lol! I remember it being pretty cool in the 80’s that Spielberg was actually doing TV!
AC/DC: We got the biggest balls of them all
B-17 Turret: *Hold my ammo*
Everybody gangsta till balls start shooting
This made me chuckle
@@DyslexicMitochondria I was curious by your username so i clicked on your channel. Your channel is a hidden gem bro
The balls give'th and the balls take'th away.
Enemy planes: *YOU AND ME! BALL BREAKER!*
My wonderful Dad was a Ball Turret Gunner. He flew 33 missions between B-17's and B-24's. I know that he volunteered to be in the Ball Turret, and he wasn't that short at all, about 5'10". I had the greatest Dad ever. He passed away in 2008 at 86 years old. I miss him and my Mom terribly 😥
Your dad was a a hero
They will always love you and their menories will live on thanks to you
@@matty1754 No one is a hero in wars.
@@boranates1320 bruh
You had the same parents mine did who raised me to be in awe of your parents and my grandparents... The Greatest Generation. I am grateful for them and will unfortunately have to face the same fight they did, here on home soil with enemies from within.
My great uncle (maternal grandma's brother) was a ball gunner during WW2. He wrote home during the whole war that he had one of the safer jobs on the plane, a waist gunner, I think. It wasn' until they got the letter that he was killed, that the family learned he was actually a ball gunner. He was trying to spare them the worry.
I’ve heard the ball gunner was the safest, and the waist gunner had the highest casualties? At least according to 8th airforce 1944 reports.
@@carrott36 while I don't doubt that, seeing as they're in line for lots of fuselage hits, I think it was more about perception. You're inside the plane, rather than hanging out there in a glass bubble.
@@SlyBlu7 That is very much a good point!
It’s what my Dad’s job in WWII. I didn’t have full appreciation till now. Thank you. I’ll add that during a training mission the turret unexpectedly spun leaving him holding on until the tail gunner could get out and come pull him to safety. They remained life-long friends.
I met a Ball Turret Gunner. When he told me, I asked him, "Can I shake your hand?" Later on after telling him how much I heard that that was a suicide position, he surprised me by saying that he actually liked it. It was such a privilege to meet that WW2 generation.
It’s surprising the things people can find enjoyable once they completely accept the chances of imminent death.
@@simonnachreiner8380 it was actually one of the safest spots on the aircraft! It takes quite a lot for the ball turret to become a death trap. We’re taking a WWII ball turret gunner for a spin in our ball turret next weekend. 🥰
Okay boomer
@@prestons9305 This is really not the place for your bullshit jokes
@@starstencahl8985 okay boomer
I can truly appreciate this. My grandfather was a B 17 crewman and was injured while manning the ball turret. His crew managed 24 combat missions in the European theatre.
My Uncle Dave was a ball turret gunner on a B-17 and he shared everything that this video related about not being able to wear a parachute, being trapped inside if the hydraulics were damaged and the vulnerability of being inside.
My Uncle lost his left leg below the knee from flack but called it his “million dollar wound” because it meant he was alive, pretty much in tact, out of combat and going home.
Alternative title: "Short Kings with steels balls frag german airforce inside an aluminum hamster ball with the armour of a Smart Car and about the same leg room"
Thats hilarious
Yee
God damn that's delicious
I read in a few cases they tried to fit a series of segmented steel plates into improvised vests against shrapnel.
They usually abandoned them, but some people swore by their armour.
Like any other hamster, they get tormented until they crack.
The ball-turret gunner had lots of trouble because unlike other members of a B-17 crew in Simple History videos, they had to wrestle with a 3rd dimension.
The pilots kinda had to do that too
....right....
@@joshuajespersen3336 Woosh.
He meant that simplehistory videos are all done 2d while this vid alone has a 3d model.
@@IanSumallo
er, is it really 3d? some parts of it warp a lot, so it looks weird . . .
and I "work" with a 3d modeling program (blender, it is free :) ) so idk how you would get it to look like that, without some weird rendering.
@@iaimboti Regardless if it's 3d modeled or not, it has perspective that creates illusion of rotation. That's more 3d than anything else we've seen on this channel.
"If you're getting in the ball turret, don't plan on coming out."
my buddies grandfather who is still alive and lives with him (although he has late stage dementia) was a ball gunner. He took some of the most insane photos of other planes and combat from that spot. Unconceivable how anyone could do this. Thank you to those who did this to protect our future.
"Ball turret bloody uncomfortable."
"I believe he's sitting cross-legged hoping not get them blown off."
-Call of Duty 1:United Offensive
What's my status? they bloody everywhere!
Its actually quite comfortable. Which is not the same as saying that there wasnt any room.
I heard it was comfortable sitting in an almost fetal position, scary part was when they started firing 20mm and 30mm while you have no where to run because then it's uncomfortable
In video games, it is the most fun place to be. Not so in real life
When Call of Duty actually felt like a call OF DUTY game......
My Grandad, Pete “Sarge” Sardenollia was a ball turret gunner in the pacific, he flew missions across the Pacific and did missions in the Philippians. He passed back in 08, He was a great man
May his soul rest in peace.
Honor and respect to him!
@@permafrost7558 Da Heck....
@@Sim0132 he deleted the comment, what he said
Correction: it's not philippians it's "Philippines"
My great uncle had this job, he fought in WW2 in the European theater, he was awarded the oak branch for his actions, and survived the entire war
As someone's who's been a 50cal gunner, the thought of being able to fire 2 at the same time while under a plane is absolutely amazing.
Must have been an incredible feeling being strapped into the belly of a bomber with twin.50 cals at your disposal. Imagine the smell of all that gun powder in that small little space. Must have been quite a rush!
To OP. Yes, but you're also unlikely to ever see a German fighter much less hit one.
My great grandfather was a ball turret gunner, he died in 2002. Had a lot of good stories.
May your grandfather rest in peace
F
Rest in peace and all my respect going to your grandfather. Thank for all
Another hero lost to time
RIP
F
“The Death of a Ball Turret Gunner” poem:
From my mother's sleep I fell into the State,
And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze.
Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life,
I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters.
When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.
Its really beautiful
@@DyslexicMitochondria Cool channel bro
@@DyslexicMitochondria amazing videos
@@mattearenzi8972 can we eat a tumor tho
@@DyslexicMitochondria It has the dramatic element of kafkasque and also mythologizing.
My grandpa was a Belly gunner instructor during WW2. He was the shortest guy of the group. These guys are on a whole other level.
Thank you to him and every other gunner!!
My great grandfather was a tail gunner in the B-17 “Big Red”, which if I recall correctly is at the Dayton National Air Force Museum. Tail gunners & ball turret gunners were usually very short and very small, and had to have a strict height requirement for gunners. Super cool history! I always think of the ball turret gunner section in COD 2: Big Red One when you fly in a B-24 Liberator!
fun fact: American bomber crews had a higher percentage of casualties than the infantry in WW2. If I had to be a ball turret gunner, I think i'd have an accidental discharge into my foot.
That’s where all the nerves end, thus shoot ur pinkie off!
But people would have needed you
Makes sense seeing how the Americans fought mostly on the sea at the time.
British bomber casualties were even worse; 55% KIA. Remember, the RAF was bombing at night.
@@silenthunteruk Dang
Boeing Designer: So how many guns do you want on this Bomber?"
FDR: "Yes."
I would rather be a pilot rather than being inside of that turret
FDR:yes, but the ball turret gunner has to shoot with Fp-45 liberator because we have to cut cost
There was actually a pure gunship version they tried. No bombs, a bunch of extra guns and gunners. It couldn’t keep up with the standard B-17s though and it wasn’t much more effective as far as protecting bomber formations. The YB-40 - read about that a bit, it was a great idea but didn’t pan out.
@Callum Ruddy FDR’s New Deal did not save America from the Great Depression.
World War II did.
@@spudskie3907, FDR was a war criminal who screwed this country up severely. He is the poster child for term limits and limited presidential powers, his stain upon this country is lasting to this day.
Grandpa scored In the top 1% of pilots for b17s. He was the master instructor for all of recruit pilots entering the 8th Air Force. He never saw combat but he taught all those pilots who did.
30 years ago deer hunting with my best friend. We stayed at his grandparent's house. One night we found a manual distributed to tail gunners for the B17. We learned his grandfather was a tail gunner. The manual listed everything the tail gunner needed to know including the weapon system and how to properly use the sights. It was a fascinating read.
God bless these brave heroes. I can't even fathom how they fit into that small death trap....how did they manage to fit their massive balls in there with them??
@Fishy Vagina No it wasn’t, because balls of steel like this would have deflect anti-tank round.
It looked dangerous on the surface but ball turret Gunners had the lowest casualty rates among bomber crewmen
The poor guys Manning the tail guns at the highest casualty rates
In the military you understand the risks of your job and how you have to trust your team mates and you understand the job has to be filled by someone if not you it will be filled by someone else.
b
@Fishy Vagina *their*
"I got one"
"Great kid, now don't get cocky"
Says the guy on the ceilling gunner
@@da_plasma_catto1801 ceiling gunners were still a dangerous job,
Not as dangerous as the lower one but still pretty dangerous
Luke is that you?
*ballsy
Was that a Big Red One reference just now?
Mad respect for those brave guys going up in those turrets back in the day; I hope to meet one one day and thank him for his service.
My grandfather, Clarence “Butch” Hecker, was also a bakl turret gunner in WW2. He always loved to show me around the B-17 at the Cleveland Air Show when I was a kid. He passed in 1997, and it wasn’t until he had passed away that we found all of the medals he’d been awarded for his service. I’m grateful for everything he did for me, and to all service personnel for their service.
My wife’s grandfather was a ball turret gunner. He was one of the toughest and most badass old dudes I’ve ever met.
I believe you. This Sir deserves our respect.
I guess, after experiencing such nerve wrecking job, everything else are piece of cake.
The 55
B-17 ball turrets couldn’t retract into the plane, they were permanently suspended underneath the plane, unless the turrets was ejected for aerodynamic reasons. The B-24 however had a retractable ball turret.
Correct.
Imagine they ejected when someone was inside.
@@mrstorch5068 they have of the gunner was KIA and they couldn’t get them out.
@@mrstorch5068 There were unfortunate cases of the catches for the entry/exit hatches failing in flight and the unfortunate ball-turret gunner falling to his death. Mind you at the heights that the B-17's and B-24's were flying, they quite possibly passed out from lack of oxygen during the early part of the fall. We shall never know for certain, but there was no get out of jail card.
@@mrstorch5068 all you gotta do is use it as a hamster ball and roll around, best infantry support weapon out there
And yet men still did it, knowing the risks. We should never stop showing our gratitude.
I’m more shocked that the turret wasn’t able to just eject off the bomber with its own parachute, maybe right on the outside of the actual turret itself
Typically the reason is logistical. If you make a small change, say adding a window, every plane from there onwards now costs more. Additionally there is the cost of adjusting the assembly line to include this change. This means for every small change, a big change must be made. Though, I think this isn't quite the exact limitation this time. It does contribute, however it is more likely to be a mechanical issue as well. I know I'm getting annoying, but if you were to attach a parachute externally to the turret, it would interfere with the turret's ability to rotate (you could try attaching it internally? {though it *is* cramped?}). To go along with dilemma, there is the issue of making the turret-- which is a surprisingly difficult task given the limitations a bomber suffers. To bring this back to the "a small change is a big change thing," this is not a small change. This is adding a mechanically complex and potentially large device onto an already crowded assembly. Your icon is cute btw.
@@airmagebobby7269 first of all, ahh i see, i just thought it migjt ne a little safer than just "you are dead, although if you're short in war youre dead, and second, why thank you
@Lets Play Minecraft the detaching mechanism, a parachute, or the placement? Because both are possible (they dropped bombs and had parachutes) and you can disconnect the entire rotation mechanism
my great grandfather was a bombardier in a b-17. he was almost shot in the head by a bullet that flew threw the bombardier compartment. but he moved his seat down 6 inches from standard placement. and that 6 inches was exactly where the bullet landed. He lived to tell me the tale and died in 2014 on thanksgiving night. He was a 1st LT.
This is why I had an irrational fear of sitting in front of windows when I was a kid.
Damn bro ur grandpa is badass
My father was a navigator in a C130 during desert storm/ sarajevo/ late 80s-90s, and he once dropped his pencil mid flight, after reaching down to get it he came back up to see a bullet hole in the screen he just had his face in. He said if he hadnt dropped the pencil at that moment, the bullet likely would have been in his head rather than the screen
@@drewpac1765 nice
Sorry to hear that, may he rests in peace, he was part of the usa army or the british?
Ironically in a ball turret most of the room was taken up by the size of the balls of the operator, hence the name.
Let’s be honest, every guy at one point in their life is a ball turret gunner.
@@rileypoe7331 I'm waiting for it to happen to the guys in my generation (gen z). So far all I see is them doing TikTok and Fortnite dances
@@InsAnItYschild101 LMAO SO TRUE
Clap 👏 clap
@@InsAnItYschild101 Gen Z, especially those born in the 90s are old enough for military service and have seen action in the ME and in Syria. Shove that "my generation sucks" BS somewhere else, please. War fucking sucks
That poem at the end gave me chills wow.
Analysis of 1,117 air-combat casualties from the the 8th Air Force B-17 and B-24 bomb groups show that the ball turret was the safest position in the aircraft. Records show 233 casualties among waist gunners, but only 6 for ball turret gunners.
Not to be silly, but you'll note the aircraft has several waist gunners and only one ball turret gunner? More people to die= more deaths for people in that position by the law of large numbers.
Twice as many waist gunners. 94 times the casualties.
“So what airforce position did you get?”
“Ball with guns”
PEW PEW BALL
Pp ball gun
More like violent hamster wheel
PEW PEW BALL GUN
@Jacob Drotar man whaat😳
Ironically enough, the lowest mortality rate of all crew positions on the entire B-17 was the ball turret. It's just that when they did die, they suffered some of the most gruesome deaths which is why they are seen as being the worst job on the plane. Even though the most dangerous position was actually the waist gun. Still an awesome video though :)
So it's the bestest job then with possibility of gruesome outcomes
@CK Lim Yeah, though in terms of aircraft, enemy fighters typically (when attacking from the rear or sides) aimed for the center of the plane, near the Bombay or cockpit. While leading targets, shots often fell short, landing closer to the waist. The highest casualty rate in a B-17 was that of the waist gunner
@CK Lim Yeah, it was weird that they said that, considering that bombers could only fit at most 1 gunner in the tail, making it a much safer place for a fighter to attack and much harder for even a skilled bomber pilot to outmaneuver them from there, and the sides gave a fighter pilot a really nice profile, making hits much easier. Attacking from above was also popular, given the added speed of a dive making a gunner's job that much more difficult and the relative ease of shredding the wings from such an angle, and if the German was flying something with a turret, which some dedicated night fighters and defensive fighters did have, then his own gunner could do even more damage on the way down
All the fragments get redirected internally to the waist guns, apparently
Ehh tail gunners got shredded
4:43 thats next level animation
My maternal grandfather was a B-17 tail gunner and survived his ship going down in enemy territory on the Western Front. He passed away over a decade before I was born but I was named in his honor. Hard to comprehend the bravery and deeds of these men, and I would give anything to have been able to meet him in person. Knowing my ancestor lived through all of this before starting a family has been a source of strength in my most trying moments. That generation was incredible
"They washed me out of the turret with a hose"
*BRUTAL*
Stop making these stupid jokes and just try to respect the people that have served for their country. Please have some respect
@@KrshnVisualizer dude its a joke, calm down
@@KrshnVisualizer So do you have respect for the German soldiers in WW2? If so, that is good.
It's not a joke, it's a line from a poem
@@KrshnVisualizer calm down snowflake
Rest In Peace to those ball turret crewmen... my great-grandfather was a all turret crewman and he died in 2006, also the day before my birthday, I never knew what was his name but I heard great stories from him, he once served in bombing Germany and many more axis countries. I was told that he got 9-11 confirmed kills/destroyed enemy aircraft and he was also a victim of belly landing, yet he survived TWICE while he was inside the ball turret. Rest In Peace ✌️
My grandfather was a ball turret gunner during the war and served in Europe. He flew 32 missions...a 5% chance of coming back alive. I remember him telling a story of when a new mission was announced to the crew a few men would faint from the fear of going up again. My grandfather was awarded the distinguished flying cross and an unofficial membership to the "lucky bastards" club. He passed when I was young but I know the horror of this job followed him for the rest of his life. He was a true hero to our family, I visit his grave every veterans day because I never got to acknowledge what a sacrifice he made.
In most battles you pray to live
A ball turret Gunner: prays to stay in one piece
Small correction: The ball turret in the B-24 was hydraulically retractable, but the ball turret in the B-17 was not. Depressing the turret guns straight down put the crew hatch upward inside the fuselage, enabling the gunner to enter or exit the turret during flight. If damage prevented the turret from depressing, the gunner was trapped. But regardless, there was no way to retract a ball turret completely into a B-17 fuselage.
you could not enter or exit the turret from inside the B-17, the opening from the turret to the plane was only big enough to pass ammo and ration tins
Not accurate. The only way in or out of the ball was by pointing the guns straight down and going through the hatch from inside the waist position
@@Chaplain_Asmodai incorrect my dude, source: I’ve ridden in a ball turret during flight in the 17, you most certainly can enter and exit during flight.
There were also many contingencies for making sure the gunner would never be caught in the ball during landing.
Thanks for correcting the video. Still impressed by Dad's fortitude to crawl back into it on all the missions.
@@Chaplain_Asmodai nonsense
Person signing up for job: so how dangerous actually is it
Army: yes
Wow.
Great vid, whole reason I subbed to this channel
My grandfather also, belly gunner. Shot down over occupied France, escaped through Ukraine. My GFs grandfather was a B-17 tail gunner, the other most dangerous job on the plane. Proud of the airforce in our family.
Possibly the worst and most terrifying crew role of the war. Mad respect to those who survived and those who did not.
Indeed. Nearly 1/10th of all US deaths in the war were members of the 8th alone.
The ball turret gunner was the safest position tho
Everyone should watch “Memphis Belle”, that’s a heck of a movie.
Ye it’s good I’ve seen it
It's a propaganda show
@@misterbig9025 piss off, it’s a war movie. Literally any war movie in any country is idealized. It’s going to be patriotic and idealistic. You’re not meant to take it literally.
Rudy (Sean Astin) was the Ball Turret Gunner. If I recall he barely got out and needed Reed Diamond to rescue him.
@@clipobserver Sean Astin was in it? Damn, I need to watch it again. I primarily remember Harry Connick, Jr. and John Lithgow.
I thank GOD for these men and women who fought this great war for us to this very day.... People have forgotten how precious freedom really is these days....
@@whitewolf6280 Are you f**king kidding???? :/
I’m absolutely lost for words at the bravery of these men. I’m greatful for your humble service.
“Wash me out with a hose “
If I walk into a girls house and she dont got the b17 hoodie I'm leaving
“Sorry ladies, the b17 jacket stays on”
@@Brutusoogabooga best comment ever
"get ready for the ball turret position!"
Her: "the what?"
"Fetal position and vulnerable, just how you like it"
Any way to delete the comment above from existence?
And my eyes too
@@breezy5673 report
In the 70’s I went to the Oshkosh Air show with my Uncle Charles who was a pilot . As a young boy I was fascinated with the B-17 and approached one . As I examined the Turret a small man spoke from behind me “ I used to sit in an identical Turret during the war “ As he spoke I couldn’t have been more honored as he explained many concepts and procedures. I hadn’t noticed but a good 30 or more people has gathered around us to hear his story. . I’m sure this fine man is gone by now. Boy we really owe a lot to a few don’t we ?
hi\
You touched a nerve. So many stories here. My uncle was a ball turret gunner. He had a messed up elbow but survived the experience. Used to razz my father who was in the navy about how the navy was a "gold brick outfit"
My refrigerator (Lance Cpl Hitachi “ice cold” HP4638) was a ball turret gunner, it flew 69 missions and was shot down at 4:20 on the 20th of August. After being shot down it was captured by the Germans and spent a year as a ROW.
Lesson of the day: never be the shortest guy
I would be fcked with my 5’6 xD
@@kauepereira6 maybe not
Ball Turret Gunners had the highest survival rate among crewmen
Short troopers in the Vietnam war also had to enter rat tunnels with only a pistol and a flashlight
Thank god I'm 6'1"
5'4...the bigger they are the harder they fall
My dad was a ball turret gunner. He passed away this year. Sadly he never got to see these amazing animations. He would have really enjoyed them.
He would’ve start getting flasbacks and get claustrophobic
A big salute to your dad then. And the other crewmen who kept the big bird and the rest of the crew safe. My grandfather was a B24 pilot in ww2. He died before I was born but I bet he would have had all kinds of stories to tell from those days.
From what I heard from a WW2 veteran was the average life span when inside that ball turret was 17 seconds in a fight. That is scary.
I heard one of those crewmen on a documentary say that the survival rate for B-17 crewmen was 4%. Factor in a 25 mission requirement, and, he chuckled you do the math...
The true definition of a man. Signing up for almost imminent death, while being suspended from the bottom of a fighter plane 10,000+ feet in the air. Knowing that little aluminum ball might as well be your casket. They have all my respect.
This video immediately reminded me of the B17 bomber “909.” I remember going on that beautiful aircraft in summer of 2016. Got to do it with my dad, and it was one of the most surreal experiences I’ve ever had. I was so disheartened when I heard the news that 909 went down in an accident. Rest In Peace to those on 909 and all the brave souls who lost their lives fighting in bombers during WW2.
I was on that plane the summer before it went down! theyre a lot smaller than i had thought they were. amazing experience though. tragic what happened to it and all those people.
Some years back I had the opportunity to fly Aluminum Overcast and as much fun as that was being in the pilot seat, the special moment for me was when I manned my father's position that he had in World War II.
That is when it transformed into flying in a piece of LIVING history as I easily pictured it being the early 1940s and my having to do his job. Everyone working as a team so the entire crew might survive the mission.
@@pauld6967 what an awesome story and bless your father for serving! My great grandmother “Pearl” (1925-2019), lived on Oahu during Pearl Harbor. She was sitting on the roof of her parents house as the planes started to strafe around her. For the rest of the war, she was working in the dry docks of Pearl Harbor building battleships, she did all of this while pregnant with my grandmother “Betty.”
@@retrocollector1999 Thank you and blessings in return.
They were made of stern stuff. I like to think of myself and those I served with in the military as chips off the old block.
It does cause me concern to see how many in the vocal minority, a.k.a. the Twitter crowd, are just a bunch of snowflakes who are offended at every little thing. The sacrifices that were made in battle for our great nation will be in vain if people don't wake up and correct things at the ballot box in 2022 and 2024. Even sooner for those suffering in Washington State and Minnesota with their so-called "autonomous zones" that are just little pockets of dictatorial socialism.
Thank goodness that there may be at least a little justice in the near future, meaning the possibility that Whitmer, Neusome and Cuomo all get bounced out of office.
My great grandfather was one , he took an AA round through his hand
absolute legend
Ouch.
Did he get a purple heart?
AA?
@@woodfaith Anti-Aircraft, I assume. It's unlikely Spinago meant Alcoholics Anonymous.
Wow. Respect for these brave and talented individuals.
My grandpa who was in the Marines during the Second World War was a bubble gunner over the south pacific who got shot down, he was chosen at the age of 17 because of how small he was thanks for the video
Guys just a point, only the B24's ball turret could be retracted, not the B17s.
8th Air Force had the highest casualty rate of any Army unit during the war.
I was thinking that but wasn't sure.
Maybe they got it confused a bit.
@@mylakay100 Some of those casualties weren't even pilots/crewmen of planes either. Alot of them were just mechanics and ground crew charged with loading bombs, ammo and fuel...
Thanks for mentioning that. I was a bit confused when they said that the B17 had a retractable ball turret
@@mylakay100 ah another military history geek. cool good to meet you sir.
I feel unsafe inside a ball turret fearing that it’ll fall off in the sky
Speaking of which, there was a ball-gunner that fell out of the turret due to damage and he survived by chance simply because there was a train station that exploded and the shockwave supposedly saved him from dying. Here's a link to the man's Wikipedia page including his story: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Magee
@@FloodExterminator it says that he fell through the window and thats what saved him
@@FloodExterminator if you get hit by a shockwave that’s powerful enough to move you it’ll also be powerful enough to turn your insides to liquid
@@adamneznamy8076 Indeed, It might have been another soldier, or I misread somewhere xD
I knew a guy that was a 'Ball Turret" Gunner in WW II. He was small, his B-17 was called "Devils Mistress." He told me one time they were coming back from a raid on one of those ball bearing factories, and were flying over Holland with two engines on fire, parts of the tail shot away. They put on their 'Chutes, went to the door to bail out. He said they looked down at the ground below, looked at each other and said "nope! Cant do it!" So they all tucked in, and the pilot put it down in a field. They seperated, and were hiding in some farmers attic for a few weeks, until some resistance guys got them to the coast, and back to England. R.I.P. Frank Douer, 35 missions!
I still remember in CoD Big Red One when you are put in one of these for a mission, still one of my favorite CoDs
The earliest of the manned versions didn't even have the ability to retract the ball turret. Only the B-24 Liberators came stock with the retractor setup.
and that's why my great grandfather is alive, his crew got shot down and they had to crash land, he survived but was injured
@@HanzTheODST that's a tough s.o.b
Two brothers I was raised along side of Father was a ball turret gunner. My favorite poem is The Death of the Ball Turret Gunner
Randall Jarrell - 1914-1965-
From my mother's sleep I fell into the State,
And I hunched in its belly till my wet fur froze.
Six miles from earth, loosed from its dream of life,
I woke to black flak and the nightmare fighters.
When I died they washed me out of the turret with a hose.
My great grandfather Eugene R. Freeman flew 35 combat missions as a ball turret gunner in the Mediterranean theater of operations. I had the honor to hear some of his amazing stories and have most of his awards framed on my wall.
'*being a clone Trooper in the Battle of Geonosis'*
Good thing those bugs can't aim!
*Landing craft blows up seconds later*
@@jonseon5952 “Good thing those Nazis can’t aim!”
Get it?
-because the thumbnail looks like the LAAT Gunship's gunner ball thing that was used in the Battle Of Geonosis (as well of other battles in Star Wars, but especially the Battle of Geonosis), and the Battle of Geonosis was quite deadly for many Clone Troopers.
Watch those wrist rockets
I doubt you’ll see this but I have a story to tell.
My great great uncle was one of those belly ball gunners. He went on numerous raids in Germany and made it back. But one raid he was shot down and managed to get the ball turret back into the plane before hitting the ground. He was woken up by a German farmer with a pitchfork. He was soon after captured by the Germans and was sent to a P.O.W camp. They treated the prisoners horribly. They barely fed them and when they did it was only raw potatoes that was fertilized by animal manure. They made them do hard labor and other things. One night they woke them up and marched them into the open snow. He thought they were about to get executed but turns out they had marched them to the British lines and he returned home safely. He didn’t tell his family what happened in his time in the military until he died. Before he died he had someone write a book for him and in said book it described what it was like in training, the ball turret, at base, and in the camp. They books are meant for family only. But I think it’s ok I say it here. Anyways thanks for reading if you do
I appreciate the story. Thank you for sharing.
Thank you for sharing. This shows that the Germans are just soldiers. Same as americans or brits.
Hopefully your family share that book. Would love to read it
Thank you for sharing! You should consider publishing parts of those books! Many people today are too young to hear firsthand accounts from those days. Back when peace wasn't guaranteed, and millions sacrificed everything for their countries.
Great story. Thank you
my grandfather was a bottom ball turret gunner. His plane, B-17 42-30045, was eventually shot down in enemy territory. the retraction system failed as well as hydraulics. His crew was able to get him out before belly landing and being taken as POW's. He survived the war, after being liberated from an internment camp where he was set to be executed with his crew. I never got to meet him unfortunately.
My nextdoor neighbor Mr.George Roberts was a small gentleman during WWII who was a ball turret gunner on a B-24 Liberator. He never bragged. He was a hero. Just passed away last year. Warren Massachusetts.
I had nightmares about the ball turret section from Call of Duty: Big Red One
TAKE IT EASY ROGERS WE'LL BE OK!
*gets hits by ack ack*
Man, how I miss big red one ;(
This is the job my Great Grandfather had. He was stationed in the pacific and never really talked about his war experience. It's sad that we never really got his full story.
As a boy l had a fishing buddy who was a ball turret gunner. He was one of the few who would talk a bit about it. He said watching a fort fall out of the box was horrific he'd count parachutes. He had stories about flying low following train tracks said he'd start at the back and open up the 50s; guys would be bailing off it and the locomotives boiler would send out feathers of steam. Said the poker games on ship going home were insane. RIP Jim thanks for everything. My grandfather was a bomb aimer 405 RCAF pathfinders shot down '43 KIA on his third tour. It took 2min for his plane to come down some crew jumped clear, no chute, as plane was on fire. I spoke with a guy whose uncle picked up the bodies. Soft ground they went 8 inches in. Granddad was relieving the tail gunner apparently as he was found there. RIP Maurice you were a very brave man.
I LOVE THIS WAR AIRCRAFT. ONE OF MY OVERALL FAVORITES.
"When I died, they washed me out of the turret with a hose"
Oh my god... ehhhrrrr
F
My grnadfather flew a p-38j in ww2, and his brother was very short, and was put into one of these turrets. They both survived the war.
That poem is DARK and hits hard with that last line.
*"Your back problems are not service related to the 6 years you spent curled up in a ball turret. You have been denied compensation."*
My great grandpa was a b17 tail gunner. His plane got shot down killing half of the crew. The plane was torn in half. He had to kick part of the tail of the plane off of his parachute and when he hit the ground he ran for 3 days before he was caught by the Germans. He received an air medal with 4 oak leaf clusters. He flew 13 missions.
Had an uncle who was a navigator on one. He was not only the sole survivor of his crew but the entire nine-plane formation when he was shot down during an unescorted night strike; one minute he was in the compartment, the next he was falling through the sky. The only other guy to get out didn't survive the boat ride to shore. He got an Air Medal and Purple Heart "for swimming in the North Sea" as he put it decades later because he simply didn't bother to file for them once he got home.