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Best LIGHTWEIGHT 308 Hunting Rifles
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 พ.ย. 2023
- Welcome to Ron Spomer Outdoors! It is day 4 of 308 Week, and we are looking at lightweight 308 hunting rifles. Will we find the best lightweight 308 hunting rifles? Follow along to find out!
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Who is Ron Spomer
For 44 years I’ve had the good fortune to photograph and write about my passion - the outdoor life. Wild creatures and wild places have always stirred me - from the first flushing pheasant that frightened me out of my socks in grandpa’s cornfield to the last whitetail that dismissed me with a wag of its tail. In my attempts to connect with this natural wonder, to become an integral part of our ecosystem and capture a bit of its mystery, I’ve photographed, hiked, hunted, birded, and fished across much of this planet. I've seen the beauty that everyone should see, survived adventures that everyone should experience. I may not have climbed the highest mountains, canoed the wildest rivers, caught the largest fish or shot the biggest bucks, but I’ve tried. Perhaps you have, too. And that’s the essential thing. Being out there, an active participant in our outdoor world.
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Disclaimer
All loading, handloading, gunsmithing, shooting and associated activities and demonstrations depicted in our videos are conducted by trained, certified, professional gun handlers, instructors, and shooters for instructional and entertainment purposes only with emphasis on safety and responsible gun handling. Always check at least 3 industry handloading manuals for handloading data, 2 or 3 online ballistic calculators for ballistic data. Do not modify any cartridge or firearm beyond what the manufacturer recommends. Do not attempt to duplicate, mimic, or replicate anything you see in our videos. Firearms, ammunition, and constituent parts can be extremely dangerous if not used safely.
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It is SO nice to see a young man learning from an experienced older guy. Plus, just a couple of good dudes. Well done, guys.
“What do you mean? Learning from men, especially old White men is a mega-micro-aggression...I’m fainting…Call my therapy dogs so they can take me to my safe space…” - The Modern “Man”
Thanks Eisenhower.
Agree
😂👍@@michaelhill6451
Love your vids Ron. I have a very accurate Browning Bar mk.3 in 243. Good you shoot some autos?
You really knocked it out of the park by doing this series on 308. Thank you much!
Much appreciated, Blackjack.
My vote is still for the tikka even though these were some really nice rifles.
I did an experiment a few years ago. I bought two barrels from McGowan. I think I was shooting 6.5 PRC. One barrel went on a blue printed action by a gunsmith, and the other barrel I put on a Savage Axis. Both shot four different factory ammo loads, and two hand loads. Both rifles shot 3/4 to 1/2 in groups at 100 yards with all cartridges. In my opinion, it's all about the barrel and chamber. Maybe I got lucky on that Axis, or maybe it's the barrel. Savage rifles are so easy to change barrels on too. If you already have a rifle you like, it might be worth it to buy a quality barrel from a place like McGowan instead of buying a new rifle. I took another Remington 700 270 that was just ok. I wouldn't take it hunting out west. I put a new 280AI barrel on it, and it shoots outstanding. It's all about the barrel for me.
Ron, I’ve been loving this series, and I’m not even a die-hard 308 fanatic. But one thing I’ve been thinking from watching these videos is that the 308 is so popular because it is a “confidence” round. I think people know if they do their part, they can find a load for most (all?) typical big game, and trust that the bullet will do its job. It’s been done so many times, whether on the range or in the field of battle or the game woods in many different rifles, including these handy rifles, that’s the answer to the mystery of the 308’s mystique.
Loving this series on the 308 rifles. I won a Ruger American Predator 308 rifle last week. Picked it up yesterday and threw a 1-6x LPVO scope on it last night. I bore sighted by removing the bolt and looking down the barrel at a stop sign at the end of my block. Adjusted the cross hairs and took it to the range today. Was on paper close and did a windage and elevation adjustment Norma Whitetail 150 gr ammo and I had 7/8 inch groups off sand bags with the first 7 rounds down the barrel. Should only get better. Thanks for your insight on these.
Ruger American is seriously underrated. I've seen some copies shoot near 0.5" MOA once broken in.
This has been so far a really informative and fun series, what shooter or hunter doesn’t like punching paper with different rifles? 👍
Never been much of a 308 guy, but a little while ago I bought a CZ 600 Ergo in 308 and what a great little rifle it is, lightweight, accurate and nice to shoot. So this 308 week have been fun to watch and informative, so thank you very much.
Loving these 308 series videos! Keep up the good work guys 👍
Thanks Joquin.
I’d have liked to see the Kimber Mountain Ascent in this comparison. 4lbs 13oz in .308. Has a 3 position safety that Ron would like. Not really in the market for .308, but I do like a lightweight rifle for western deer hunting, blacktails and mulies.
Great series, Ron! I think this deserves a follow-up series with the descendants of the .308... can we look forward to 7mm-08 week and .243 week? Maybe even .260 Rem week? Cheers!
What a great tribute to the 308, and what a great review of rifle options out there! Absolutely love the series ❤
As I considered my foray into buying rifles for myself, for range practice, hunting, and self-defense, I opted for limiting the number of calibers, because my dad's reloading area is out of control, and my space is limited. I went with an AR 10 in 308, and a matching bolt gun. I got an AR in 7.62x39, and an SKS, and I plan on getting the Ruger American to match. It has been tough finding hunting projectiles for the 7.62x39, but cheaper bulk ammo than other calibers for range practice. The 308 has a dizzying list of offerings, as well as bulk ammo. I guess some people bag on the 308 because other calibers can shoot farther, but I love it. Both 7.62 calibers that I got are a pleasure to shoot. Now Ron has me looking at 30.06, but I keep thinking about how few places there are within three hours drive to even shoot farther than a 308 can handle.
I absolutely adore my Kimber Adirondack .308. Rifle comes in at 4lbs 13 oz. One thing we didn't touch on though is lightweights by nature are tougher to shoot precise. A super lightweight will tell on your form in a second. They are not for everyone. You have to put time into learning them. Obviously as witnessed by your video you do not have these issues. Figured I should put it out there though. If you are a weekend warrior and only shoot the week before the season, you might be better off with a traditional weight rifle. Awesome content and .308 is my heart song for white tails. You earned my sub!
I just finished hunting with a Howa Superlight and really like it.
I have 4780 friends on Facebook and 3870 or so are military and we love you again Ron. It was getting touchy.
I think the savage 110 and the rugsr american are my choice. Im just plain vanilla and blue collar worker retired. I go for best accuracy . Every thing else is very nice to have but econimics plays a big part of your subscribers. Just my thoughts. However you are 👌👌👌👍👍👍 Ron. One of the best.
What Ron said at the end of the video spoke to me, I gave up smoking because I had a daughter and loved to shoot/hunt(and ride motorcycle) plus better for the health.
Savage ultra light should have got some love, the proof barrel on both of mine shoot 1/2 to 3/4 moa at 2 grand less than a nula,,
How is the action? Does Savage do a better job making them smoother on the more expensive models? The mid-range one I tried was not great.
They are blue printed
@@jfess1911 I do not have a ton of experience with Savage rifles but the ones I have handled, from a MkII, onto an Axis, up to a 110 Precision (I'm talking from a $150 rimfire rifle, up to their $1,400 target chassis centerfire rifle - which probably costs more than that now) were all somewhat rough out of the box. What I will say though, is they all got smoother and lighter to cycle as we worked the actions / broke them in. The groups got tighter as well.
@@CJ-by8ij Thanks, The only two centerfire bolt guns that I have owned were Lee Enfields which were extremely smooth, so I got spoiled. It is funny how something like that gets fixed in my brain as something so important, but nothing else feels "right" after that. I really want to like the Savage, but it may take a while.
@@jfess1911 Haha I know exactly what you mean! When we first got into long range precision three of us got different rifles to try. For us they are all expensive, but they are considered entry level. One got the Howa in the American Flag chassis, the other went with the Savage 110 Precision, and I went with a Bergara B14 HMR (since the BMP was discontinued). They are all great rifles and they all shoot great. Each are quirky in their own way, but I too look for that silky smooth action right out of the box. What matters in the end is the ability to feed, cycle, extract, and fire without issue. One could always try (obviously make sure it is empty, etc.) cycling the action while watching a movie or tv to break in those springs and smooth out the finish along the bolt track. Let me know if it helps, I know it did on the Axis but have not played with the 110 in quite some time.
Growing up we did not have the choice they have today.i can remember three that stood out the Roger 77 Ultra light Winchester model 70 feather weight and the Remington model 7.
All were great quality rifles that worked
I really agree with your coments at the end on carrying and balance. I dont have any true lightweights, so maybe thats a factor, but in a 7- 8lb rifle I've generally found that I preffered how a wood stock balances. With alot of synthetic rifles, the balance moves further out as butstock is lighter and I dont care for the way they carry/ handle, though they shoot fine.
Pretty cool you reviewed the Waypoint 2020, I've had mine for about a year now in .308 and have loved it. I reload for it and have worked a pill that is consistent .25 to .5 MOA at 100. Great rifle and loved packing it around this year for elk. only gripe is like you mentioned, the safety not locking the bolt, I've had that lift a couple times but it's not bad. Also, I do want to mention shooting strings atleast for me does not do well due to the carbo fiber heating, it tends to walk. but, for hunting I better not be shooting longer strings or i'm doing somethig wrong. 2 to 3 shot groups it keeps tight, barrel coolers also really help w/ carbon fiber during load development.
Just because the gun is capable doesn't mean YOU are. The same can be said for cars. Great video guys!
My face when Ron said his choice was the Tikka from the "budget" rifles 🙄 then it went 😀 when he said he was revisiting the ruger. Imo the Tikka is not a budget type rifle. But I digress. That ruger will hold it's own against rifles 4x it's price point. Great info and I'm fully happy with my choice in rifles knowing I have 1/4 of the money in mine and they shoot as good or better than any of these in this video.
Yes Tikka has become a very middle of the road in the budget department especially when you start adding features.
Great series, I think you had as much fun filming this as I did enjoy watching.
Absolutely one of the best things you can do is know your limit and stay in it. To many people don't and it don't work out very well.
Ron and Chase a great video. Would be nice to see how you got on tutoring Chase to ready him for his hunt.
I have enjoyed watching this series. It amazes me that you can buy the cheapest of the bunch (the Ruger American) and it will typically out shoot rifles costing 2 to 3 times as much. So my pick would be to buy 2 Ruger Americans in different calibers along with nicer mid range optics all for the price of 1 of the high end rifles. Just my opinion. But I do own 2 Ruger M77's and 2 N0.1's so I'm Ruger biased. LOL
180 grain generally always shoot well from most 308s
Interestingly, most of the rifles didn't like this particular load. The majority of them preferred the 150.
I wonder if barrel was warmer than they could tell with composit .don't know anything about them barrels myself
Thanks Ron, I missed the premier as I was taking my second and last GA big buck to the processor. Twelve days into the 2023 season and I'm limited out on big bucks. He weighed 203 pounds live weight. What was I using you ask - the Ruger American Predator 308 suppressed. It is the same rifle you have in these 308 videos. Needless to say I'm biased towards the Ruger American. Thanks for the review on these! There certainly are some in the review group that I would just love to have, perhaps one day.
The Savage was the overall winner. Shot good groups with all three loadings.
How about a follow-up video to drill down on ammo selection with Chases's one gun? I have an XBolt 270 and got serious about sighting in for an antelope hunt expecting 3-400 yard shot opportunities and knew my current factory ammo and skills wasn't going to cut it. I bought 7 brands of ammo and shot multiple 3 shot groups with each on different days. I quickly found Precision Hunter, Fusion, and Superformance worked best for me and ultimately settled on Precision Hunter 145 ELDX. I shot out to 400 yards and learned to dial for the first time. I really got comfortable with my gun and confidence soared. I shot my pronghorn perfectly from shooting sticks at 305 yds. Bottom line is I needed to invest in practice and ammunition more than I need another gun.
Start handloading, it becomes way easy
Nice videos on the rifles Ron. It was nice to see the different varieties. I find myself in a Goldilocks situation looking for a rifle not too heavy and not too lite with the right action and accessories. These were great and informative, now I know which 6 rifles I won’t be buying. Your videos have really helped me narrow my selection on my new purchase, not just on caliber and cartridge selection, but on what preference of rifle platform I desire.
Ron, enjoying your 308 video series. I’m 70 yrs young. I was a little disappointed that it only covered bolt action rifles. I’ve shot many deer with the 308 cal. and it is a very adequate deer cartridge. I feel the Real Value of 308 lies in the rifles in which it has been chambered in over the yrs. The Browning BLR, Win. Mod. 88, Savage 99, REM. 7600 all quick repeating and handi deer rifles. Also of value is the light budget rifles, such as Ruger American or Sav. Axis. If I’m going to spend 2 or 3 thousand for a new bolt action, there are many better calibers to choose from. I’ll bet they sell 100 budget rifles to 1 in the 2 to 3 thousand dollar range. Just an old farts opinion !
They had a palmetto AR 10 in the first set of rifles a few days ago which held up well (that’s my palmetto bias talking)
It looked like the Savage was the winner and with all 3 kinds of ammo. Just a little heavier. Thanks for the video.
Looks like a 20 inch barrel on the Springfield
Great video. Definitely echoing other peoples feedback debt having a series of videos on the same kind of thing is great because you get to see a trend. I love the way you chronicle all the things that go into accurately shooting from the bench because. The way you just speak about things that come to mind at the moment are great because it gives the rest of us stuff to think about when we’re purchasing something things to consider. It’s hard to sum up all little details later.
Loved this .308 series of videos! Thank you for doing these!
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻 very well done! So nice to see the comparison between 3 rifles, then you shoot 3 different shell brands. Excellent. Really helps me decide. Thank you for fabulous work!
I appreciate the advice on different things to make sure it fits better for you as always Ron thanks again for the great content
Thanks for watching.
I wish you would do a video comparison of cold bore shots from a carbon fiber wrapped barrel vs steel. I don't care if carbon fiber wrapped barrels have vertical stringing. I wanna know how the 1st round hit accuracy is. This is supposed to be a hunting rifle. Not a PRS rifle.
I would love to hang out with you Ron and pick your brain. You've definitely lived an interesting life. You should do an episode about how you got into your work and earlier years. It would be really interesting
I sure enjoyed this 308 week! good stuff,nice work gentlemen.
Really enjoyed this one too, look forward to seeing chase shoot and some field training.
TRADE OFF: Ron, as we all know, the lighter the Rifle, the more recoil thump, but most of that reality goes out the window, when your focused on the shot itself, on game. Thats why, I always took recoil pads of 308, and 3006cal rifles, to aford better full field of view , eye relief. Your bulky clothing is your recoil pad.
How about some wood stock rifles!
Always enjoy your content but this series tops them all, thanks guys!
You are welcome.
That Browning X-Bolt is a feature laden rifle. I would get one in a 7mm-08.
Thanks Ron for all that you teach should be in textbooks.
ROn i have a question can all five hunting rifles (Buffalo rifle, elephant gun, express (weaponry), punt gun and varmint rifle) be combined into one?
What a fantastic Review Ron ....You have made me think very seriously about my best new favourite Hunting Rifle....😎👍Aus
Really like the new content, Ron. Keep it up.
Kimber Montana? Howa superlite, Tikka superlite?
Yes.yes. yes.
All great rifles but he can’t do a review on ALL rifles! The guns he is showing are on loan except the lady rifle!
@@edwardabrams4972 true. Just naming some common lightweight makes that most guys use
Great video and guidance from Mr. Spomer. Thanks!
PNW woods and my .308 does all I beed ot to do. Thanks for the week long of videos that I will go back to more than a couple times.
I’ve been handloadin for my 6.5prc a yr and even with a super cheap scope I’ve shot 1 hole 3rds with 135a tips over n560…I’ve got loads from the 95gr v max@3625 to 153a tips@2900 with 130tmk@3250 bein the sweet spot…those 95s at that speed as so loud it’s painful but will all touch and send a bottle into next parallel dimension….factory 143eldx under 1” easy and really hard to beat..
I have enjoyed this. The first cold bore shots may affecting what you are seeing a bit, but one thing that is really apparent is that it is worth spending a bit of money. You are getting so much more!
I would have liked to seen a Kimber on the mix.
I love how suppressor ready just means short barrel. I don’t know about you guys but I down want to give up 3-6 inches of barrel for a suppressor. I personally run a 24” barrel 6.5 PRC with a 6 inch can on the end in a bullpup chassis that is about 41” overall length with the suppressor
What chassis are you running?
You have a gun that is only 35" long with a 24" barrell? Not many of those out there.
@@z987kit’s the MK machining bullpup chassis
@@archeryhunter86-it’s a bullpup
@@stump3514 I guess I've never heard of a bullpup. I'll have to look that up.
Thanks for the interesting and educational videos; this series was well done and it looks like there will be one more. What are the bolt action rifles chambered for straight walled cartridges? Yes, I know, most straight walled cartridges are in lever actions. Some are in the falling block like the Ruger No. 1. The straight walled .50 Beowulf cartridge is chambered in the AR-15, but I don't think many hunters would use that on something as small as a deer.
If there are enough straight walled, bolt actions, that would make a fine video.
I've been enjoying this series but I think that you should have pointed out the twist rate on each rife... without looking it up I know that some of them tested in the series are 1 in 12 while others are 1 in 10
Mel Forbes is not only a great rifle maker. He is also an outstanding person. I grew up in the same area he lives in. He does a lot for the community. Good ol WV gentleman.
High capacity AR 10 battle rifles chambered in the potent wildly available 308 Win is why American Patriot’s love that ammo. Didn’t you know???? ❤
Hope to see the Christiansen Ridgeline as a light weight option
I have a similar setup in 6.5 creedmoor. It was so nice carrying during rifle hunt instead of my heavy .338
Jeez Ron you going to let the barrel cool down I do after every 3 shot group maybe I’m wrong but cold bore shots are what you want to group on for hunting
That last rifle was sweet . I liked the browning too. But the NULA was very sweet .
as much as some of these rifle makers charge for a rifle you would think they all would have a locking bolt, a bolt that doesn't lock completely turns me off.. They all should have a locking bolt with a release button like the Browning or a 3 position safety. thats a terrible corner to cut to save money.
Hey Ron, the Remington Mohawk 308. Shoots great. Out to 300ish yards. Can reach out farther but, that is enough for me.
I hate the plastic stocks and always replace them. Some of them will get more accurate if you adjust the torque on the action screws. Some plastic stocks will have a steel or aluminum pillar and can handle more torque, but some can't handle more than about 30 inch pounds.
They have their places. Any wood, polymer, or any stock material that can compress or deform needs to have some sort of pillar or molded in block to support the action screw torque. It’s not about how many inch lbs it can take, it’s just about what it needs to achieve support and consistency. I’ve got high end bolt guns that want only 25 in-lbs per action screw and low budget Rugers that call for 60 or 65 in-lbs.
Recently picked up a weatherby vanguard talon in 6.5 prc with a leupold vx3 on top and it is super light! I may be a little biased to the new weatherbys since im from sheridan, but this is my favorite rifle so far, consistently shoots sub moa with federal terminal ascents with my best group being 1/2" at 200! Love your videos Ron! Would love a model 307 review as thats my next rifle I'm wanting to get!
Love my waypoint! Antelope at 322 in Wyoming 2 weeks ago and quite a few Prairie dogs out to 500.
Happy to see 30 years old concept proved it is still working and is still on top :)
Use to have a rem 700 mountain in 260. It would shoot 3/10 of an inch with my hand loads.
I am amazed at how similar the specs are for the browning x bolt and the ruger american 308 compact. Even as a 6'1" i enjoy carrying the ruger american compact 308 through the woods as its a very handy size and very light.
Ron, I would love to see you make some hand loads and dial those rifles into one jacket hole. You and I both know you could be a great video showing people the benefits of hand loading
Because he said (you will understand that the rifle will always do it) the rifle always does what it was built for, hit a target but it is the shooter who is not always able to shoot where he wants and as you have demonstrated not even once he was able to do it.
Hey guys. A good series of videos. It would have been a good addition to the information if you also had measured the muzzle velocities. With the MVs, viewers would be able to put the data into a ballistics calculator. Otherwise, good videos and good work. Have a good day.
I'm with you I hate bolts that don't lock when on safe
I don't know where you learned to shoot but we professionals usually shoot with the root of the first phalanx which is the hardest part of all the fingers and pulls the trigger back correctly without moving sideways
brilliant video Ron looking forward to seeing you two in next one 👍👍
Great series. Really enjoyed it
Winchester Model 88, lever action. Chambered in .308
This is some wholesome stuff here. Love these videos
Would like you to do the same series but with 30 06 rifles.
It has been told the Fly on the target at 7:28 still has flashbacks to this day of this moment.
I think if I was looking at rifles like this, I would be using 125gr bullets, and maybe even reduced loads. I once got a Winchester Low Wall in .260 Rem, and that little rifle was kinda unpleasant to shoot although I'm not *that* sensitive to recoil. I sold it...
I'm a little lost. The Springfield is 6.9lbs. Why would you not hunt with it? It's short, light and ergonomically nice. The flat fore stock might be weird off of a branch. Maybe? The stock eliminates the wrong angle of the trigger pull.
Love mine!
@@joshszydel8202 I think it is the most gorgeous, feels good in hand rifle ever built. Have fun, just out of my price point.
@@TheNutzandBoltz picked up another in 6.5 with a jewel trigger for 1200
@@joshszydel8202 Awesome. Paid retail for the Bergera B-14 Squared Crest but I'm a big fan so far.
I think it’s more about how the rifle feels to him not you or the rifle! Us old guys have shoot hundreds of rifles over 60+ years and some rifles just feel better in Our hands just like the waypoint feels in your hands it doesn’t make the Waypoint a bad or good rifle it’s just what works best for the shooter!
My 2020 waypoint rocks. I’ve shot well under 1/2” groups from Nosler custom 168gr match ammo.
You needed to cool the barrel completely between groups. The groups opened up as the guns heated up, which is normal.
I guess Melvin Forbes had to retire eventually. I'm glad to see that his rifle is still the best. Shalom.
Nice series, awesome content.
Nice....really nice. Good groups all in all. Thank you. Happy hunting.
tikka t3 lite or ultralite. cheap. light. accurate
Ron: "I think we might be touching. Touching is a good thing Chase" (wasn't quite sure where that was going)
Chase: 'That's a good thing... unless it's my teenage daughter then I say it's bad thing"
Please do more videos with Chase!
And yes we would hope that a $3000+ rifle would group 1MOA!
I would really like to try a few shots with that Springfield! Thankful for your video.
That was very well done.
Ron, Great stuff you have going on here. Just getting into .308. I was wondering about your shooting table? Who makes it?
Superbly stable table, Able. I mean Robert. From Stukeysbenches.com.
The browning's muzzle break is rotating. It needs to be tightened
It is probably throwing your shots
You could be right it will be interesting to know if that is true and if they mention it in the comment section!
Honestly I think the cheaper savage probably the cheapest Rifle $600. The Very 1st Rifle U shot on Day 1 or episode 1 ....Shot the tightest group with 150 grain American Whitetail the very best group even better than that last over $3000 Rifle did. The 150 grain American Whitetail Ammo group in that Savage was all 3 together in a very tight group the size of a dime or probably smaller.
That rifle showed some very impressive groups for a $600 rifle. If i was U Chase I’d put me a very good Swarovski Scope on it and zero it in. I’d almost bet that Savage rifle could outshoot most all of those expensive rifles.
To me much more impressive than all the other more expensive rifle groups. That just goes to show that just because they’re more expensive don’t necessarily mean they shoot better. Many of the expensive rifles are way over rated. I’ve seen some of the cheapest rifles that I bought over the years to shoot much better than my expensive ones. I bought my son a mossberg 243 bolt action in a light weight mountain rifle with camo synthetic stock & floating barrel. That was When I think the first year Mossberg started making budget rifles several years back. The Manufacturers list price then was $349 and I think I paid less than that around slightly over $300. That rifle shot groups smaller than a dime right out of the box! It shot well enough to shoot it in competition!!!
I kinda wished now I’d have bought it for myself instead of for my son 😂 . Sometimes the cheaper budget or introductory rifles will perform like that. Especially Look for companies like that who get into starting a bolt action Budget hunting rifle and get one when they first start making them. Then you’ll using get a rifle that will drive tacks so to speak and shoot smaller than dime groups. Just something about a old well known established pistol or shotgun companies going into Making hunting rifles that’s special. Because I think they try extra hard to put out a excellent rifle to make a lasting impression on people so they build a much better shooting rifle while trying to build a awesome reputation. I should’ve bought one in all the best hunting calibers of Mossbergs first year of making those Budget free floating barrel rifles. I can honestly say of all the hunting rifles I’ve ever bought from expensive to budget.....That Mossberg 243 shot the tightest groups @ 100 yards right out of the box of any rifle I’ve ever purchased. That was with factory ammo, & it shot as good if not better than rifles I spent a lot of money on having all kinds of work done to them to make them shoot better!! So cheap budget rifles don’t mean they’re gonna shoot worse & Expensive guns don’t mean they’re gonna shoot better.