This Professional Dog Trainer Needs To Be Fired
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 มิ.ย. 2023
- In this video, Ed Frawley shares a question from the Ask Cindy database. Today's question is about the concerning behavior of a professional dog trainer that was hired to work with a young GSD. Ed gives his feedback and opinion on the situation.
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I am a dog trainer myself and thank you for sharing this story. It frustrates me and saddens me that people who are UNQUALIFIED are going around and acting like they are professional.
I am also a dog trainer and couldn't agree more! This situation is deeply disturbing! This person should not have any responsibilities with anyone's dogs EVER. Deplorable "training"!
What makes someone a professional? It's like any form of skill tho anyone can become a professional with time if they can get the result of a trained dog. Even abusive instruction but it's about ethics at this point. I only would hire a fellow Christian now for any trade. It's like schools for children think about this, you would let your child be with someone else for hours a day and never question if they are real teachers or not.
Insecure or dim people artificially fill their insecurities by insulting or belittling others.
Six minutes into this video and I would be extremely concerned about that trainer. I have never been to a dog training class where I wasn’t required to be there, nor would I allow my dog to be trained without my presence, and quite frankly my participation
Dogs do NOT have to be around other dogs. I have had dogs for 6 decades plus. I do NOT like dog parks. When I lived in the city, I walked my dog on a leash. TBH, I trained my Rough Collies as a kid. My dogs were trained very well by 9 yo me. They knew 2 languages:)
I have had “tough” herding dogs my whole life. I currently have Australian Cattle Dogs who can herd 20oz. bantam chickens to 165 pound goats.
They will alert me to a fledgling dove fallen from a tree. My dogs permit 3 pound senior chihuahuas at my home and walk them to their bathroom breaks. They are protective of their animals.
I might say I live in an unsafe rural area and do not encourage my dogs to be friendly.
They are very calm with people walking by,as long as they don’t try to steal a baby peacock( Yes this has happened) My poultry has free range.
How about disease? I spray my tires when I come home. I change my shoes. Parvo and distemper are prevalent here.
I love your videos and your knowledge. Thank you. Wonderful work.
There's and old saying "there are more sharks on the land than in the sea"
Sounds like this poor lady got bit by a land shark.
Sad for her and sad for her dog. Not been able to be present is a huge red flag imho and paying so much up front? wow. I would insist on pay per session for intermittent training and would be there as dog / handler combo. Training is as much, if not more, about the handler learning as it is for the dog.
I've found the only time two trainers agree is about what the third trainer is doing wrong
I will say right now, no one should use “Sit Means Sit” ‘trainers’ either. So much damage that I had to undo from what they did to my Malinois puppy. (During a board and train, but all of their training is inappropriate for shepherd breeds especially). Plus, she was sent home with worms and that was a $350+ vet bill. Psychologically made her worse with their “training” and clearly had unsanitary accommodations. My puppy had never had worms before under my care. And this was extreme vomit and diarrhea. It was the worst decision I have ever made. I don’t trust 99% of “trainers.”
Hej, just a question: what are "sit means sit" trainers? You mean like, enforcing the command under any circumstances? Why is that wrong - is it putting too much pressure on the dog, and does that only count for younger puppies? I am also usually enforcing my commands, though I don't wanna be the "alpha" kind of trainer, and when my dog then listens, she still gets rewarded. Also, when she definitely doesn't wanna do the command, I change criteria, like when the dog wouldn't want to heel on a wet section of trail I went to a dry section of path and she heeled again.
I agree 100%
What is a "sit means sit" trainer?
@@SDM3791 it's a company (think bark busters or petsmart) that doesn't use balanced training but instead aversives only.
I am so very sorry that this happened. When I am training dogs, one size never fits all. I learn the dog and then I tailor a training program for that dog.
I would never trust anyone to train my dog without me being there to see and learn. I realise, like children, it is often easier without parents & owners but trainers need the skills to deal with both
I am retired dog walker and vet tech, not a dog trainer, but even I kept a watchful eye for stray dogs that might upset the dogs I walked and also at the vet clinics I worked in. PS: happy 75 years!
Oh my goodness, trainer says can’t watch how my dog is handled as I check them out prior to signing up. I take leash in hand “let me get back to you”. Never to return. Talk to your vet or fellow dog owners for referrals read reviews. The fallout from trusting easily is the difference in the quality of life for dog and human
Really??? A puppy has to be socialized as early as possible! Insane to wait 8 months and project own fear onto dog!!! And a dogtraining has to involve owner!!
Yes socializing is important but has to be set up properly and monitored very very closely. That set up was not appropriate.
Never leave your dog with ANYONE. Seriously if its a board and train be VERY careful about your choices do your due dilegence and SPEAK people at the facility and previous owners. Puppies are young and 1 bad experience with a person or animal can create chaos in their mind.
I train working dogs in obedience and assessed MWD and police K-9 for temperment. 90% + of rep I table trainers WANT the owner/handler present. To learn what the dog is learning.
I caused a rukus at the loacl pre-school when I started going in and sitting with my young son at the stamping table. In the following weeks many father's started joining me. The children loved it and it eased their nerves. I would have no problem sorting out a dog trainer that didn't involve me in every aspect of the training.
Your looking really good for 75.
That dog trainer is ruining a wonderful puppy & he's taking this lady for an expensive ride doing it. Fire him & maybe take legal action.
Oh no. She needs to be there. Leave that trainer. That is not okay. I want to be present and learn with my dog because I am the one living with my dog not them. I can't do a B and T with my dog, so I need to be present.
We had our German Shepherd pup with us to visit a friend. Her dog bit off the tip of our pup's ear before he defended himself. Our dog was dog aggressive his whole life. The only one he tolerated was his mate.
Sad story. To be totally honest here I have to say that it was not your friends fault, it was yours. As your dog was a pup the responsibility for their saety is you and that is it. You are your solely responsible for your dogs wellbeing and safety. Hard as it is for you to accept, you failed in your responsibility to protect your beloved pup. People with pups especially should constantly assess the situations they put their dogs into.
@@simonjeakings5433 Did anything in what I said give you the impression I blame our friend?
I am a dog trainer, and I fully expect my clients to participate in their dog's training. The only time I don't have my clients present is during the first week of a board-and-train program; their dog needs at least the first week to adjust to the new environment, and having owners present during that time can make it harder for the dog. After that first week, though, I fully expect owners to participate. I also make sure they get regular updates on their dog's progress - which includes photos and videos - and I *never* allow off-leash dogs I don't know to get anywhere near the dog I'm working with. I also *never* work a reactive dog around other dogs in an uncontrolled environment. Not ever. Your advice to the concerned owner to trust her gut... Excellent!
A lot of dog training is creating a shared language between you and your dog. I don't know how an owner could do that if they aren't present for training.
@@aina3387because the owner is likely part of the issue. The nerves/anxiety/bad behavior needs to be brought under control (by the trainer) in order for the owner to visually see what is possible by changing how he(owner) interacts with the dog. So many owners cause issues and they don’t even realize it.
At the beginning of training it’s so much fun to post progress photos and videos. It’s like an awesome before and after!
She could probably take him to small claims court.
I took my 12 week GSD to a huge, popular people park, supposed to be on leash only, and today most dogs there were off leash. Some may have had e collars, but I doubt it. After I saw a huge mastiff off leash, I packed us up and left. Not worth having a bad experience. Luckily I’ve been watching Tom Davis, Larry Krohn and Robert Cabral, so I knew enough to just get out of there. I’m in training with a local place, and it’s just the puppy course right now, and I’m present for the whole session.
All the points made in this video are things that we tell our clients. (I work for a small breeding program, and yes, we also train puppies and dogs.)
I do understand that some people are not comfortable with saying no outright, so something like: "no thank you, not right now." is softer. Personally, I just outright say: "no, thank you for your time. I'm not comfortable with your methods, and your philosophy does not resonate with mine."
Then again, subtlety isn't really something I personally care to practice in these instances.
The point about a young dog having one bad incident with another dog is absolutely true. When my third service dog was 6 1/2 months old, she was attacked by an off leash Dog (who did have a handler by the way). My dog was not terribly injured physically, but she was traumatized psychologically. I worked with her, and after about 2 1/2 years, I decided that it would be in her best interest if she retire from service work. This was hugely devastating, as she was an incredible worker… My best in many ways.
My deepest sympathy to the woman who had to go through with this. I do hope she will find someone who will respect her and understand that she is also a very critical part of her dog's training.
And I don't know that Cindy is better than you, Ed. I have watched many of your videos and read hundreds of your articles, and I think you are a pretty fine fine fine and respected trainer yourself. I think you both do phenomenal work, and thank you. I always come away learning something new.
This was fun thanks. It reminds me to retire and go fishing when it’s time.
Bill You have been "the Man" for decades Please do not sell yourself short. 75 means nothing!
Time and time again I love this channel
I am learning to train dogs on my own by working with shelter dogs and watching A LOT of behavior videos constantly. Even with my minimal experience training it is obvious how many extremely dangerous mistakes he made
Same here. Best of luck!
just wow! thats really bad experience. i hope the lady finds a better dog trainer & the dog doesn't suffer long term
I have had 7 German Shepherd Dogs in the last 50 years Czech DDR West German I trained every one of them myself I was a radio TV executive and later on a tax shelter expert
I took my dog with me Each and every time
Forget groomers Dog Walkers Trainers Do it yourself
He is hidden something if he won’t let you see it
It doesn't really help when he says this "trainer" is bad and should be fired, yet doesn't say who it is. How can people avoid this person if they don't know who he is? People really should get a breed of dog that is suitable for their time, knowledge and skill level, and train their dog themselves. Not everyone needs a GSD. Some people should have Goldens or Poodles instead and there is nothing wrong with that.
Heresay, unfortunately. He had no personal experience, so could not name the trainer and be possibly sued for slander. The client would need to be the one to put his name out there, touting her own personal experience.
My baby Rott will give other dogs about three chances before she sets them down. Nobody gets my dog and the trainer is training me not the dog. The dog is smarter than me. Had a non family member get heavy handed to correct some of her bad behavior. Now you have to be firm with my baby Rott. I have found the food drive for my puppy is much more stronger than confusing her by being heavy handed. I now know how and understand some of the training tools out there. I have my daily walks as the Rott requires it and we stop at houses with aggressive dogs behind a fence. She was scared at first. She then realized I was with her and would not let her get hurt. She then gave two short warning barks and the dogs continued to bark. But she sat down at my feet and waited till I was ready to continue the walk. I think my dog is smarter than a remote collar, she would just wear the battery's out. I feel much better making sure she doesn't get out. I have watched her when she ran off one day and she is curious and wanted to explore. But last week she jumped up on a elderly neighbor and that is the stuff we are working on. She is just so friendly and gets so excited. I just wanted to share and say this guy calling out the other trainer is justified if it were my dog. If you dont train your dog you dont have control and better hope its a small breed.
Socializing is fine, if the person agrees to it and wants them to be around other dogs. If they have balanced dogs as mentors thats fine, but this guy sounds sketchy from the start. Wont let you see them work, or show video of his work. These are not state secrets, there no reason a person shouldnt be able to see the training their paying for. RUN
My GSD almost died from pneumonia he contracted at a Board and Train. Had i not trusted my gut and ahowed up at the place and demanded to see my dog he would have died. They finally brought out my dog and pretended that just that morning his appetite was off. I had to take hom to an ER hospital and they kept him several days with IV antibiotics. He recovered sevrral thousand dollars later. The Board and Train never refunded my money nor responded to my communications.
This puppy is going to possibly be screwed up for life. That dog needs to feel like their owner is their rock.
My gsd dog lost that trust with us when my bedroom floor got refinished. My dog was kenneled two rooms away that day(near open window), I got paged into work on an emergency and I had to leave the house when the floor workers had less then an hour left for the day. I’d worked with these floor guys multiple other times on other rooms and never an issue. Over a decade later and the dog still has issues. Breaks my heart to this day. No idea what happened but I’ll never leave any intelligent breeds of dog home alone with anyone but my kids and their spouses.
Thank you for telling it like it is. You were still very diplomatic IMO. Just the lady's description of one incident seems to prove this "dog trainer" doesn't know what he's doing. I think you can judge -- and for the protection of your pet and your wallet -- you need to use some judgment. If you aren't familiar with dog training methods, then interview 2 or 3 trainers to help you decide with whom you will trust your dog. If the trainer won't let you observe him/her actually training, that's a red flag. I'm one of those people who got certified as a dog trainer late in life, but even before that if I had my dog in a group class and didn't think what a trainer was asking us to do was right for me and my dog, I'd just say sorry, but I prefer not to do that. Again, thank you for the righteous indignation you showed on this lady's behalf. I hope she removed her GSD from this person's influence ASAP.
Ask that guy for a refund, if he refuses small claims court him. Then report him to the I.R.S. as well.
I love the I.R.S. touch 😁
Sigh...you know it is bad when Ed goes scorched earth on you. As an aspiring trainer, I constantly want to learn what to do. Here is an obvious what NOT to do...
What's worse is the dog training industry is unregulated.
Time to move on away from that dog trainer...😡
Good video here. 😊
I'm a dog groomer. While I don't allow owners to stay while I'm cutting their dog's hair because it makes for an anxious, distracted dog, I will absolutely do a live video on fb and let them watch the entire process if they wish. Too many pet "professionals" learned from online classes or people who are like this guy. Yes, a GSD needs to be socialized. But there were so many red flags in this story.
It's a red flag if someone won't be transparent with their handling of your dog or children. I would not send my kids to a babysitter with those conditions. So I also wouldn't agree to that training for my beloved dog. Can you imagine what goes on behind closed doors if that's what he is doing in front of her while bringing her the dog. Yikes.
I can understand that some situations where you do not want the owner to be present. I personally always require the dogs owner to not be present in specific situations or a specific training course sessions. For example when it comes to behavioral issues, generally it is due to the lack of knowledge by it owner. I like to assess the dog both when owner is present and not. However. I always expect the owner to be present during the majority of times. After all, I think we all know that we were not really training the dog but the handler.
A couple of things. A) It would be helpful to know who the trainer is and if he has online videos to watch. And B) while you didn't give his name you should at least give him a chance to tell his side of the story.
Also, although you don't give names, you did agree with someone (another commenter) who bashed Sit Means Sit. And truthfully, as a person who worked with them for a month in Las Vegas 20 years ago, before it became a franchise, I tend to agree with you. I didn't like their training methods. On the other hand, I seriously doubt that all the SMS franchises train in any specific way. The company is more interested in franchise and royalty fees than dog training techniques.
im a beginner dog trainer, i train my 2 dogs and i trained dogs from family and neighbours so far with extremely good results,i love the work but i know i still have a lot to learn and a long way to go to become a professional dog trainer. that said, i dont video my sessions yet, but i do let the owners be present afterall im at their house working their dog, im even super happy when they ask me like "can we also watch?" and i rack up an audience of the whole family, i dont mind that at all because if they watch they hear what i say and they can learn something just that way. What ticks me off the most, is that these so called professional trainers, there's also the youtuber trainers we need to mention, that are making starting off in this industry quite the hell to go through, but at least for me, i wont let that deter me, i have the passion and the natural touch for this, all i need is more experience and learn a whole lot more and im sure i will do just fine in the industry eventually
If I needed a dogtrainer which I don't because I train my own dogs I would never even think about using you in a million years. Your posting name "weedhigh" says it all.
@@simonjeakings5433 yeah you know, i dont really care what you think... if you go at me because of my user name it shows me right away what kind of person you are and i wouldnt want you as a client either. I prefer people with good common sense, which you clearly dont have. I would point out as well that people like you generally dont tend to look for trainers but prefer to do the work themselves as they think they are smarter and better than anyone else and usually end up with the most screwed up dogs which is their own fault and i feel sorry for said dogs, a point which you go and make for me as well. And for the final point, i dont really see the problem with a dog trainer smoking weed, if anything i see a lot of potential benefits. A more relaxed, collected trainer, that does not get angry or frustrated with the training when things dont go right, someone that tends to think outside the box for solutions and will brush off anxiety and fear. Now im not saying you necessarily need weed to achieve that, if you can do it without it then good for you, im just saying it could help someone and there are no adverse effects for the dogs. Ehhh but why did i even bother doing this, you are not going to read it and even if you will there is quite a high chance you will not understand my message.
Wow! Lots of red flags with that trainer!!! 😱
I could never, ever, leave a dog to a trainer, I am just not that trusting. Either I get to be involved, or I read ever book out there and do it myself.
This happens all to often. 😔
Careful tiger 15
I hope with all my heart that this lady will never ever let this guy touch her puppy again!
red flag .....
🐾🐾 sounds a lot like what ceasar would do.
Some people should just not be around animails
I was thinking it was going to be another Dog Daddy bashing. Been showing up in my feeds.
@@cyborg8623 How can someone be responsible for random unleashed dogs running up?
@@lilly5157well the thing is - if you're going to hold a class with reactive aggressive dogs in public, like augusto, safety measures need to be taken for the dogs in the class and off leash dogs that may run up. He should have numerous (1 for every 2 dogs - who stick with those dogs for duration of class) assistants to prevent that. Portable gates are also helpful. Skillful dog trainers would take proactive measures to prevent it.
That guy is a complete clown along with pretty much EVERY "trainer" on youtube. These Leerburg videos, Michael Ellis and Andy Krueger are about the only real dog trainers I've seen on here.
He is awful. Can’t bear to watch any more.
Smart part 04
First thing is I would Never Ever have allowed my dog to go to this trainer.
Busy baby 02
Yikes
As a dog trainer, whenever I am not training or sleeping, lol, I watch dog training videos online, like yours, I like your videos and thank you, but we all know how difficult and not understanding dog training clients could be, that being said I can't judge/agree about how good or bad this trainer was, that's my 2 cents.
I guarantee this trainer is using a shock collar! 😡😡😡
I would agree with you there. The psychological danage that trainer coukd do is unforgivable.
Nothing wrong with using an ecollar if you are properly trained. Ecollars are an important tool and Leerburg has a course on how to properly use them.
Maybe this industry needs to be regulated some day 🤔.
The ecollar has a place as a tool in learning long recall. Its not something youre supposed to zap all the time in general training.
Hopefully she doesn’t do this with her kids
Easy head 23
So many red flags and wth is he doing using an e - collar. I don't even want to think about what that dog endured under the hands of this so call dog trainer. She did the best thing by firing him ..