Is Gordon Murray's T.33 Bland Or Perfectly Seasoned?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 1 ต.ค. 2024
- World renowned designer, Frank Stephenson, gives his opinion on Gordan Murray's brand new revolutionary creation - the T.33.
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Hi all,
This week is such a special episode because I'm focusing on the design of Gordon Murray's genius feat of engineering: The T.33. I'm really excited to pitch in with my perspective on this one. Gordon has created incredible and iconic cars in his time and I'm looking forward to learning more about this new bombshell!
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Would love the see Frank and Gordon meet up and have a chat about the T.33, T.50 and the F1.
Edit: Come to think of it. It would be great to hear Gordon's views on some of Frank's designs.
I second that 👍
I third it
I agree
Gordon has spoken about today’s car designs so speaking specifically about Frank designs might cause a revolt between them 😅
Have you seen a Frank review about the T.50?
Possibly is because Frank prefers to not speak openly about that design.
I absolutely love the T.33, its elegant lines that call back to the 1960’s, in a similar way that the 296GTB does. No radical angles and massive scoops or wings necessary to win me over.
I totally saw Miura. Especially the rear. I thought for sure Frank was gonna say it.
@@sports2hedz542 that’s a good comparison. I’ve heard another TH-camr compare it with a Porsche 904.
Same. The lack of attention seeking styling won me over.
I like the minimalism, but it doesn't have the emotion of many of the 60s Italian cars. Which is fine, if you are someone who just cares about driving it.
@@ohroonoko yeah 904 is a good one! Also heard the comparison to Ferrari P4
As far as the "protection" around the rear lights, it's to pass a required impact test. Gordon explains everything to Harry Metcalfe in his Harry's Garage video on the launch of this car.
Including the patented front hidden diffuser that Sir Frank expertly deduced
Indeed and it was the only simple way to incorporate 3d lights like that, otherwise they would have to be flush to pass the pendulum impact test..
@@randomsurfer3963 If you caught the first two minutes in this video, that's the problem: it's the easy solution driven by engineering instead of being the beautiful solution driven by design. Frank repeatedly makes the point in his videos that designers should not try to avoid impossible designs as it's the engineers' job to find the solutions. Design is art and art shouldn't make compromises.
@@AnttiBrax actually design isn't just art. Design must take functionality into account usually and many other constraints that art is usually free of. That's why it's called 'design', not 'art', and professionals in the field are called 'designers' and not 'artists'. Of course great design is often considered art but the inverse is not true.
I love how Gordon just goes out and does interviews for his car. To talk about the design and explain it. Seems a very humble man.
I like that the design is restrained and simple. Gordon said that this will be their last naturally aspirated car they produce, so I think it's okay that it leans on the past, if even to a fault. It's elegant, and you know it is the most brilliantly engineered thing on the road. Would give anything to drive one. Great video, Frank!! Absolute legend.
Cheers Cory! 👍
I think the T33 is easy to overlook because it is so understated. But considering so many suprecars are so overstyled in the current era, the T33 is all the more beautiful for it. There are a few tihngs I'm not quite sure on, but I think seeing a car in pictures and then in the skin are two very different things. I do however think the T50 is a more cohesive shape and design, even if the presence rear fan divides opinion. I can imagine that seeing these cars, matching with the engine noise of that free revving V12 will give it another dimension to its character entirely much like seeing and hearing a Ferrari for the first time. Pictures alone don't do these cars justice.
Cameras tend to reduce the appeal of any supercar by half, but that applies to all cars. I enjoy this car overall, but the fact that it's design mainly serves to contrast the prevalent car trends makes me worry that it won't be as memorable in the future when we've forgotten said shitty trends.
@@Baronnax It will be remembered no doubt, it has a pure and simple design that won't go out of date like the cars currently suffering from 'trends'.
Agree, exactly, agree.
Personally, I like the design because it looks cute. All the other hypercars are trying to get as aggressive as possible, where this one looks approachable and friendly. I dig Stephenson's comparison to the axolotl. Having heard Gordon Murray talking about the engineering, making the car as small as possible, focusing exclusively on creating a great driving experience rather than the stats sheet, and I am very impressed.
@@tristanbass-krueger7195 it looks refreshing to me too, I just hope it'll still be as refreshing in a decade or two when we've forgotten the overdone designs that it currently stands in contrast to.
I love the T.33. It's the type of super/hypercar that I'd want to own. Similar to a 911, understated yet has insane performance.
From the side view, does anyone else see a similarity to the C5 Vette?
Doubt it has insane performance lol
@@william_SMMA It's a lightweight V12. It'll have insane performance.
@@HiddenWen lol
the T50 which is the bigger brother has 650 horsepower
that's less than an Audi RS6 and almost half of a Tesla Plaid
it's not magic
it's not by the V12 or how it looks, you can have a car that weighs 500kg but if it's underpowered it'll still get destroyed by a McLaren Senna, Jesko or even a GT2RS
@@william_SMMA That's not the point of the car. It's meant to be a memorable and fun car. It's not built to break speed records.
If my memory serves me right, I think one of Gordon's daily driver is an Alpine 110. I see a small amount of influence in the T33 from the Alpine in the styling and in the role the car was designed for. The canopy area also reminds me of a C5 Corvette.
Rear fascia perimeter line also reminiscent of C5.
Rear is completely Alfa 33 stradale
Yup. C5 pillar.
The A110 is brilliant. A complete package.
Frank, there aren't enough words to express my gratitude for all the expertise and artistry you've lavished in this critique of the GMA T.33! Form still follows function but all the "overstyling" I see in so many cars is just designers showing off to their peers. This T.33 reminds me of beautiful simplicity of 1960's sports cars. If this marks the end of an era, it does so wonderfully. Thank you, Frank.
Thank YOU Edd. 👍
I find it bland. Not ugly just bland.
Agreed. Considering what the car represents, as a sort of swansong vehicle, I find it utterly forgetable in terms of its looks. Sure restraint is great to have with an understated character, but this isn't just understated. It's just boring. James Bond in a suit is in a sense understated too, but he never comes off as bland or boring. This car does.
Still original F1 is way ahead of T50 and T33, where minimalism has been taken too far ,little bit of visual drama wouldn't hurt especially in this segment.
DeTomaso p72 has taken similar 60s elements and executed beautifully.
Maybe buyers in this segment would pick a Ferrari which has more ”fire”, or step down to a z4 m.
1:15 The same thing happens to me, it's like I've seen it before... 🤨
it's not ugly but it's too soft...
I really hope design culture follows this way of elegance. Im so done withe idiotic huge grills and fake aerodynamics.
When I seen this car I went silent and whilst I listened to Gordon talk about the design and technology the hairs in the back of my neck raised what a piece of engineering no need for silly scoops and vents this is a masterpiece, if I could afford one I would have, worth watching Gordon on Harry’s garage channel.
Beautifully put. Same with me. When they came to the rear I felt tears coming up. Mamma mia! This car is the total antithesis to all the - yes, "exciting" - hypercars, which nevertheless leave me devoid of any real emotion. I am saddened that I will probably never see one in the wild.
Thought Henry Catchpole's video was better than Harry's there was more insight into the mechanics.
@@bensonarizona7820 hopefully in a video game at least.
as others have said - if the car was from some kit-car company you wouldn't give it more than 10s
@@jaromor8808 5s if that
Thanks Frank...as always excellent. In a world of ever more exaggerated supercars screaming for attention the T.33 is an object lesson in elegant confidence you will never tire of. It will never date, only becoming ever more desirable as the years roll on and will become a rarified classic...especially given its underlying performance and driver engagement is likely to be a masterpiece.
@Kumar Ankit …in your opinion…just like I have mine. Some people didn’t rate the looks of the F1 when it came out too. Its easy in hindsight. In 25 years time it will be in car collections drooled over.
Perfectly said. I think this is going to be a fascinating journey as the T33 progresses through prototypes, test drives and actual production. As awesome as the T50 is in terms of sheer design and performance, my sense is Gordon Murray has outdone himself with this model.
I strongly agree with and share your first impression. Lazy, boring design, like everything else out there. Not a fan.
Also, I don't quite get your scoring system... a car that gives you the first impression of "meh" and that leaves you clearly with a bunch of stuff you'd like to improve....how can that car be anywhere near a 9/10 ???
I think what Frank meant by saying his first impression was "meh" is that the car is very understated. It doesn't try to grab your attention. The design language is simple yet sensual. It doesn't have aggressive contours, diffusers, splitters, canards and all the aero bits that normally catch your eye today on modern hypercars. So compared to them at first or looks very plain. But like Frank explained while going through the video. The fact the cars lines and design are so simple, while still being the pinnacle of performance is what makes this car design amazing. It's able to look like a 60's concept car or le man racer while having all the modern downforce, intakes, cooling and stuff. Plus the devil is in the details. What looks simple at first glance has probably hours, days or even weeks put into thinking how can we keep the design simple/unfussy yet still provide a superior product. For example the tail lights. They are just circles. Countless cars have circular tail lights. Corvettes, ferrari and skylines are iconic for their circular tail lights. So how do they make them stand out. How do you make a simple shape stand out from the rest? Same could be said for the lack splitter, the engine mounted scoop, the rear quarter storage. Its simplicity at its finest
Uhhh ... "like everything else out there"? Everything else out there either looks like it went through a meat grinder. The T.33 is the total opposite to that.
Can you critique the 599 and the 812 from Ferrari? Perhaps specifically the 599 GTO and the 812 GTS or 812 Competizione?
I think it's a very beautiful and simple car.
While the Valhalla for example is more complex and captures Aston Martin's contemporary design language very well, the T.33 is a call back to times where a car was not only a purely mechanical instrument, but also a work of art made out of sheet metal. I think the T.33 would benefit from a rich tone of red, green or blue to really emphasize its curvatures and it's "vintage racing" inspiration. If I would be able to buy one, I'd go with British racing green and some racing number decals. I think that would complement the car really well. Than I'd run my hands all over the car, the whole length just to grasp the nice shapes xD
Was about to comment the same concerning color choice. It's more critical than most because of the conservative side views, and that silver does it no favors. A dark maroon, green, or even dare I say black would really flatter the design much better.
My thoughts exactly, this car in British racing green would look amazing. It is a very British design, understated, elegant and timeless.
Absolutely. The reveal car should not have been the same silver as tge T. 50. Something strong and classic like British racing green would have been unreal. Then again its already sold out so he can do that next time!
The core philosophy of GMA is retro-modernism. Some elements of the 1960's combined with a deliberately sought modern minimalism. Now if one doesn't like this philosophy, one will never like these cars. The design should not be seen separately from that initial design. One should ask the question: within the frame of the core philosophy, did the designer come up with something that fits the philosophy hand in glove. And to me it does. When viewed separately from the philosophy, and compared to other cars, it's another story. I'm not particularly wild of the minimalism, while at the same time having the impression companies like Ferrari and Lamborghini go to close to the opposite, and are making their cars too complex, too much. I'm still waiting for something that finds a good compromise: a bit more exciting than GMA's designs, a bit less over the top than most current Italian designs. Should I be the currator of a museum with unlimited budget, I'd love to have the McLaren, the Ferrari Modulo, the Lamborghini Bravo, Lonberger's Astro 1 etc. But gosh, what could I add from the 21st century.... That would be quite a challenge....
I’m surprised you never commented on the t50! Great video maybe you will talk about it some time later
next car will have a 2stroke engine by yamaha, you heard it here first
To me, it doesn't look special enough for what it's meant to be, one of the last V12 hypercars, which should represent the pinnacle of this era. I like the back and the side view, what I find lacking is the front which is neither elegant nor sporty in my opinion, it's somewhere in between and I don't really like that. In my opinion, it should have had a bit more of a sporty look as the back does.
Murry states its not a Hyper car. More a super car/GT.
Your opinion is your opinion but if anything on the car looks elegant its the front. The whole purpose of designing this car is to look classic, basically a timeless looking design. Once you start slapping all kinds of cuts on the shape the vehicle will eventually run out of time and will be irrelevant in the next 10-20 years. This car doesn't even have video screens inside, which makes absolute sense cause technology ( infotainment systems) gets better every year. This car is made to last forever OR for a very very long time.
I beg to disagree with Frank because of this. The Mclaren F1 was never the póster car back then those were lamborghini Diablo, Jaguar XJ 220 Bugatti 110 or Ferraris. Mclaren was more restrained back then was more about right proportions that grew on people more and more over the years that Today a Mclaren F1 Looks timeless compared to other supercars of that era. So I Think the same will happen with this car sure is restrained in the design but because of that will last forever. The same Principles apply to a Carrera GT or BMW Z8 or F1 they just don't age.
Glad to see I agree with Frank. When I first saw it I was a bit underwhelmed. Uninspired. Still a beautiful car nonetheless.
Yes, I too was disappointed...shouldn't a supercar make you say wow?
Heck no señor. It should give you an immediate erection.
I really like the design of this car, but I've always thought the silver color vanishes all the drama out of any design, especially in supercars. I think in some shade of red it would look much better. Just look at the Alfa in front of Frank.
Very true
Yeah, I totally agree.
I think the car looks absolutely gorgeous. And I think silver grey is really dull.
It doesn't look bad but the car would look so much better in a tastefully chosen color.
Agree man, Gordon talks about the 60s passion in design but silver makes it feel cold and clinical.
Thats probably a design problem. Porsches with similar simple shapes look fantastic in silver. Mercs too.
@@fredriksvard2603 That's true, but I'm talking about the first color, the one that comes with the "press release". Back in 2018 Porsche unveiled the new 911 in silver, because other colors were reserved for the new GTS (Yellow) or the new GT3 (Blue), and I think they look way better. Mercedes released the AMG gt-r in green color, and the new SL in red and yellow colors. So yes, some cars obviously looks good in silver, but I can assure you they look better in any other colors.
Gordon Murray should have sold GM from the doors forward. For C8 corvette. Would have been perfect for our U.S. car
sophia loren dressed for church,,, no man on earth would complain,,, shes a beauty,,
It's classy as F... not like those fake poorly dressed flashy girls with big fake boobs (just like Lambo etc.)
U dont need aggressiveness in designs coz it has a v12 monster hiding.... I prefer this t33 than the t50....
I like that it's so simple and nostalgic, in an era when supercars need to be attention grabbing and edgy. I'm less excited at the fact that it's just another million plus dollar supercar that will be out of reach for the everyman.
911 always simple with almost zero drama in design.
I honestly do not like this car, it has too many elements trying too hard to hide the beast inside of the engine bay. It's almost like Gordon thought that he was forced to do this so the people who bought the T.50 didn't felt insulted, especially when not a single one of those cars has been delivered.
My believe is this car's design is getting a lot of undeserved credit just because it has the Gordon Murray name attached to it. If it was from another unknown brand, I think the song we hear from the fans would be quite different. People wouldn't even talk about it.
spot fkin on
This car's design is a parallel to it's engineering. Manual gearbox and a V12, the design isn't overstyled and is a nod to the 60s. Only a design like this one could to the engineering justice. In short, if someone else did the car, the engine and philosophy behind it would be completely different and therefore this design would not match up well
You are 100 percent correct. This does not look like a 1.3million pound car. Very boring design and offers nothing new.
@@TheMitch12356 if you buy cars for the design GMA is not for you.
@@bluemonstrosity259 I am big on engineering with cars. GMA is great engineering, but the design lacks any amazing. I still rather a T.50 over any current hyercar. T.50 and T.33 are great engineering cars, but certainly not great design.
This car is so bland that the only word that can be used to compliment it is classy. Definitely not what I would consider cool or good looking by any stretch of the imagination but who am I
A very high rating for a very "soft" design. In all super cars there should be at least something unique and identifiable. Here, there is nothing.
And that's the reason 911 sells more than its competitors.
@@arapaimagold8088 No lol. People buy porsches cause they drive really well. Their designs are way too similar to each other to ever be interesting
While i am sure it's another overpriced technological marvel on the inside , it looks like a generic GTA car .
You were right, the small side panels are indeed like the P1's. The snorkle is separate from the body because it's directly attached to the engine and he did that so it adds to the experience as it would vibrate with the engine.
The designer actually claims that the snorkel is attached directly to the engine because that eliminates air turbulence inside it caused by vibration and that makes the air flow into the engine better.
I don't know where you heard him say he made it that way to increase any vibration. He literally says it's done like that to reduce vibration in the official launch video for this car.
@@davidcobra1735 having it vibrate *with* the engine seems kinda similar to having it not vibrate as it won't be vibrating relative to the engine but vibrating relative to the body of the car
@@RWoody1995 Who cares if it's vibrating relative to the car? That doesn't change how the air's sucked in. The designer literally says so.
@@davidcobra1735 you said yourself that being attached directly to the engine eliminates air turbulence... that's because it's isolated from the car body i.e. able to move freely from it so you would see it vibrating relative to the chassis but relative to the engine it is fixed.
The body color panels on top are interesting… it creates a targa vibe. But if you turn them black, it makes the greenhouse appear longer - giving more F1 vibes - and the design looks even more minimalistic.
Also, can anyone see some A110 resemblances? It’d make sense since the original one is from the 60’s as well…
My initial thoughts were the same. Would have liked itf they had pushed the envelope a little farther. I think the design is intended to be subtle, but reveal clever flourishes under intense scrutiny.
The influence of Sixties cars is welcome, but I would have liked them to lean into that aesthetic and make the car *really* curvacious.
I've been anticipating this review from Frank and as per usual I'm not disappointed. I have to say, I love the understated design of the T.33
T33 is a masterpiece, the best sounding road car out there 💥
I fucking love you Frank, this was amazing to watch haha.
I think the T.33 is a great car. I think this car is more for petrolheads that just love to drive, without standing out too much, hence the relatively timid design. On the other hand, I also think it could have translated that wonderful V12 engine more into the exterior design of the car. Especially because Gordon Murray himself said that this would (sadly) be their last non-hybrid car
The car looks like a retro-italian version of the Lotus Elise MK2.
It’s beautiful. It has Pinninfarina levels of elegance and purity of form - something that has been lost in modern car designs. I applaud its intent - why not echo the gorgeous cars of the 60s - they were stunning! Why does it need to innovate. To be beautiful is more than enough for me! I also love the amount of Matt black trim - there was a time when most cars used matt black areas as an accent. And I think it worked really well. Body colour everything has got rather bland. It’s an excellent car design - an instant classic.
Full ACK. When it is the end of an era and you make the last relevant contribution, why not recite or embrace those elements which stand for the emotional peak of said era? The T.33 is masterfully done in that regard. And yet, it is not retro. It exudes a timeless beauty and elegance I haven't seen in along, long time in modern super- or hypercars.
I'm hyper critical of Gordon Murray's work because he seems to be his own biggest fan (pun intended?).
While it's perfectly reasonable to go understated instead of chase Lamborghini, this car simply robs various 60's sport prototype tropes and to less effect. Looking at the nose while hearing Gordon decry retro is particularly absurd.
OMG...so true!
I think it's simple in the same way the mc20 is, clean and purposeful.
That's great for the MC20. Next time just M20 though not MC.
ultimately,,, cars are built for driving, shes a beauty,,
I love it.
It doesn't look like a car that was designed by a twelve old with giant scoop inlets and outlets, crazy convoluted lines and creases trying to scare the public with it's 'evilness'.
I am not a fan of million dollar super or hyper cars but this one is at least beautiful.
Nice vision mate.
reminds me of a comment Frank made in a previous video about how pleasing shapes formed by erosion are, this looks like a typical supercar eroded by a few centuries in a wind tunnel until it smoothed out like a pebble. I like how clean it is
100% with you, on this.
Frank, i don't want to say this too loud but i don't like it too much either.
The design is radical BECAUSE it is so pure and simple. Contemporary supercars are covered in aero details and sharp angles - Gordon Murray is brave enough to do the opposite.
Take a look at the new Maserati MC20. Nothing but beautiful simplicity not even a spoiler. Yet still looks aggressive in an understated way....
Me: I think the T.33 looks gorgeous
Frank: meh
Me: meh
I'm not sure about this one, some fantastic details, but gives me a feeling of iteration on much more passionate designs I've seen before. Clean and modern but a little soulless. Some views on this vehicle are marvellous, while others are very bland. Not a beauty for me.
Soulless is the perfect description...
Sin alma si no tuviera ese motor Juan.
meh was the exact emotion I had when first seeing the T.50 and T.33 (while T.33 looking a lot better than the T.50)
I couldn't agree more with every word in chapter 1 and is exactly how I feel about the new GMA cars....for me the looks just doesn't match the engineering brilliance
I know both are 10/10 on a technical engineering but for me design wise the T.50 is 6/10 and T.33 is 7.5/10
although there are some great design features and details the overall look is underewhelming
the T.33 I could probably live with and love with some clever color combination to hide some weird design choices but the T.50 is just too ugly for me
I am all for the "golden era italian design beauty" look but that was not achieved to it's full potential here
The 3 fins on the rear lights are for the crash pendulum testing of the lights to protect them. Initially I was a bit underwhelmed when seeing this car but after hearing GM talk through the engineering decisions and reasoning, the design makes a lot of sense. Would be great to see Frank and Gordon talking shop together!
An excellently profound design review, as you would expect of course. Still, I think the final rating of 9.91 is not quite on par with your initial gut feeling expressed with "Meh." Almost there, yes, but lacking some cojones. 8.9/10 from my layman "analysis of the analysis", then.
Frank has put on his thickest gloves for this review :)
T33 front view reminds me of the GT40. I like Gordons work , but for a hypercar it lacks some flashyness. I guess Gordon philosophy was timeless design and cut all the flashy parts out.
Exactly, he mentioned that a few times.
For me it looks like a wolf in sheep's clothing. Like a car, that looks like it has a four cylinder in it but has much more you don't can see. Too small, too simple, too clean shaped for an exciting Supercar. A complete understatement. Nice but very much under it's worth. Even much less impressive, than its predecessor F1. I'm not a fan of Pagani (because of it's opposite design language, with plenty of playful accessories, mostly inside the cabin, like a 80ies toy from Japan) but this unexciting design would fit a Mazda MX5 or maybe a Lotus (less is more) with a small but light engine. For a proper 12 cylinder it is much too reduced and small.
I think the main issue they had was to fit a V12 in a car that small. Incredible job
What's more amazing is just how small that V12 is. It's truly tiny.
rear end is pure spyker
I think it is absolutely beautiful & love the way it draws you in without shouting at you, a stunning piece of minimalism but so much attention to detail. A wild beast is a cheetah's clothing.
I like the crease in the front headlights, reminds me of the Ferrari / Dino 206 SP
But the open front grille is too soft, would've liked something more there, like a splitter or some strakes. It's nice but the F1 is much prettier as it's just such a beautiful shape, especially in long tail form. I like the rear of this more than the T50, but I think some of the curves are actually a little too subtle. Understated is good, especially comparing with the monstrosities that pass for "hypercars" now; but the T33 just isn't quite exciting or sexy enough for how good of a car it doubtless is.
I heard a lot of hype about it but I personally find its styling very dull
Maybe you are used to the styling of modern cars which have no clear lines and no style?
Cars stopped look8 g good in the early 2000s and the T33 has such a great design without ugly unnecessary lines!
I hate it when they put lines and creases everywhere where they are not necessary!
So most beautiful cars.
1: AC COBRA,
2: Mclaren F1
3: Ford GT40/GT
4:Jaguar E Type
5: Aston Martin Vulcan
6: new Mclaren in this video
I'd been waiting for you review of this as, the first time I saw the T33, I thought it was a masterpiece and was curious to know the thoughts of a designer with a bit more savvy than I!
It's design language is very understated. It doesn't shout about itself and although there is a WOW factor to it, you don't immediately know exactly why. But the more you look at it, the more you appreciate the details within it, its proportions, its stance, how the 'face' of the car is almost perfectly replicated in the rear deck (its best view is rear 3/4 imho) albeit upside down. The simplicity of it all but the beauty within it. In a number of recent interviews; Murray explains the lack of splitter, the shutlines, windscreen, diffuser - they're fascinating insights into a designer/engineers mind. Aesthetically, I find it more pleasing than the T50. Performance-wise; Murray talks about it being the last flag-waver for the combustion engine and everyone hopes that it performs as well as it looks.
Roosevelt(?) said: speak softly and carry a big stick - that is this car...
Such designs bring a smile of satisfaction on my face. I don't know why all car manufacturers see the future of car design as strange? And they do overstyling and exaggerated designs to sell electric cars! The automotive industry has enough beauty to inspire and create new things. Just like this one.❤
This is a hard one.
Clearly the T33 is well engineered and looks stunning and will go down as one of the best cars ever.
I also get what Frank is saying tho. If this is show casing where the combustion engine/engineering capabilities finished then it should have the design to match rather than a modern take on a 60’s racer however beautiful it is.
I very much appreciate Godon's design, but a 9.91? Then what is a 10? And only 0.09 from perfection? IMO a car like the 250 SWB California Spyder is closer to a 10....but it is not drawing on prior eras of design like the T33 is and the T33 is "timid" which is the antithesis of a GREAT design. You said it correctly, that it was an understated Gentleman, which is fine, but the Alfa 33 was not timid nor restrained. it's a great design that pays homage to great designs from the past, with Gordon referring to the 206SP, but that little Ferrari had flair that no one would call understated. I very much like and appreciate the T33 and agree with eveything Gordon says during his Harry's Garage interview, but this design is not a near-10.....unless nice designs start at an 8.....but then that's a squeeze.
I like it a lot but it would be better in yellow or red with a body matched roof. The roadster could be really nice.
Love your videos, and am the proud driver of a pristine MINI R50. One thing that bugs me about this car's design is (when viewed from the side) the imbalance between the front and rear overhangs; it looks chopped off at the rear in relation to the front (but Murray drives a Zagato, so maybe that makes sense). But the car otherwise looks lithe. Yes, it does evoke many other cars, but I like this one much more than the T50.
19:22 the 3 bars are there for protecting the lights in the event of a crash because the corner of a car has to be able to take a certain level of impact with the lights still being able to stay intact.
The car has the same deal at the front right under the
Headlights in the dark area, so that's why the headlights don't fill the whole shape at the bottom.
This dark element might be air inlet for brakes.
@@jareknowak8712 In Harry's Garage video i recall Gordon mentioning they couldn't fill the light element all the way down because of the pendulum test.
I would like to hear your thoughts on the Hyundai Ioniq 5 if you can find time. I think it's both unique and the best looking EV on sale right now but I did grow up in the 80's and not everyone likes it. Cheers
Funny how T.50S is barely any heavier than a same years F1 race car.
Even T.50 and T.33 are way lighter and more powerful probably than LeMans Hypercars and any GT series including GT3.
They could be lighter if the regulations allowed for it.
There's no doubt it is a beautiful car, but it could be any beautiful car.
If I were spending that kind of money, I would be a little disappointed if it was indistiguishable from another marque such as Lotus, and you'd forever be explaining to people,
"Is that a Lotus?"
"No, it's a GMA T.33"
"Oh..."
But, then I guess you wouldn't be buying one of these for petrol station forecourt bragging rights?...
Im with Gordon on this one .
it's not "douchey...by that I mean you won't feel like a douchbag driving it...honestly the highest praise for any supercar...but ultimately Frank said it best...Saville Row style.
Thank you, Frank, for another engaging and insightful video.
On first consideration, I largely agree with your expert analysis. However, I personally would not give it as high a rating. I think the mismatch of the understated tone vs the presumably heart-wrenching driving experience is too great. I dislike the overly aggressive styling we too often see today. However, I do think more emotion could and should have been present in the T.33. A bit more beauty, elegance and passion. 8-9/10 from my layman perspective.
It is of course, all subjective and you can only admire and appreciate Gordon Murray's work.
It looks like a Lola Mark 6 with the soul removed.
Suffice to say, if I had the money, this would be the one for me. And, at 1.3m GBP, I think it represents good value, of course, relatively speaking.
Oh please we have enough "innovative" designs running around the super\hyper sport car brands for the next decade,if you want a car full of slits, canards and air ducts and smart aero looking like it was design by jason Vorhees on acid there are plenty of choices.
I applaud and salute designers like Murray and Pagani who have the good will to embrace and homage the beautiful romantic voluptuous curvaceous 60s super\sport car era ,making then manuals nonetheless.
BLESS THEN.
In my eyes a combination with T50's front end and middle body with T33's backend would be absolutely beautiful and perfect design. With T33's air intake on top.
I was thinking exactly the same.
I wonder why Frank has not reviewed the 50?...probably because it's hideous. Those mundane front lights... And abominal black rear end are a travesty. Frank didn't want to lose friends by saying that Gordon's hypercar is terrible looking. The 33 though... She's gorgeous.
Funny, because the headlights of the T.50 is, well... not horrible, but does not belong on a supercar of that caliber. So, I have absolutely no idea why did you say that...
The McLaren F1 was unique, it was the fastest production car. It made the F40, 959 and Diablo look old. It won Le Mans. It won at the track and it was the fastest in straight line performance. Nowbody achieved that ever again. After the McLaren F1 manufacturers had to make cars for top speed or for track days. But never again a top speed record car won at the track. And a car that won at the track beat the top speed record. The 911 GT1, the CLK-GTR, the Saleen S7, MC12, were track cars. The Veyron and Koenisegg top speed record cars. But never again a car dominated both track performance and top speed record as the McLaren F1 did. What Murray is doing now is just redoing the McLaren F1. But he isnt making a record top speed car that can win Le Mans.
Your differentiated POV is the most qualified, thank you for doing this. The design of the T.33 falls behind the expectations to be honest. I think it would look much better in a different color and a LM spec.
I would love to know what do you think of my Lego Technic approach to the McLaren P1?
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All tho this car matches the F1 performance IMO the only car to match the F1 design is the T50. I think this one is to be compared your McLaren 12C, beautiful car BTW. Great content! 😃
Air brakes don't operate in that forward-opening "suicide" form. They operate as high-drag spoiler surfaces so they the fluid pressure doesn't deform or damage the panel
Using the luggage openings as air brakes was a silly suggestion. He knows better than that.
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the air from th radiators def comes through the vents "behind the hood" right before the front glass kickline (you don't want turbulent flow in underfloor).
I'm missing some "cutout" fender flair behind the wheel (maybe smth like portofino) and rear wheel bit more exposed.
Franks suggested some 2-3 "flaps" instead of mesh in the back (not completely open - safety standars) and plexi glass to show intake trumpets
I like the T33 a lot. It brings lots of elements of great car design from the 60’s up till now. I think this car is like a “super car roadster” small and and smooth lines. Kinda reminds me of a Miata in some ways and all the other great roadsters that came before it.
How about a video on the T.50s. Personally, I love the design work. Even the fan on the back of the T.50s does not look out of place. On the T.50, the fan on back does scream a WTH?
Gorgeous shape with several letdowns. Beautiful headlights but the smile on the intake could be reshaped. The tops of the fenders are a delight, but the painted B-pillar, the bottom cutout, & fat saddlebags detract. The rear is pretty but it needs 10% more drama.
If a car design reflects the culture inside the company, this is a calm studio where the designers try to please the brilliant engineer. I wish they had a designer with a little more attitude. A few arguments could have brought this car to the next level.
To me the design is boring and uninspired. It does not have a unique style. It looks a bit like a Mastretta MXT - a car which we all can agree does not look great. The front lights look like they were taken from a Ferrari but with different projectors, the rear lights look like they were taken from a GTR. I don't know, I just don't find it has a harmonic look (besides being a boring look). Just my personal non-professional opinion. I'm sure as a car it's great, fantastic and effiient. But the design REALLY lets this car down.
Love your videos, Frank. Could listen to you de-construct car design all day. Thank you! I wonder if Gordon Murray has produced a car that has a purity of form, a fusion of design principles and tech, and advanced packaging that is so understated that it will take time for it to be seen as near perfection; a slow burner in terms of its impact and recognition but a car that will in time be seen as a masterpiece of design.
Less is more
I am going to have to beg to differ with you on this one, Frank. To me the "reference" to the Ferrari Scaglietti 612 design vocab is genius....sheer elegance in proportion. Sophia Loren-Catherine Deneuve! I am not a designer but I am a critical observer of the hordes of ugly shapes on the roads-e.g. the "Origami School" of Creased Planes. To me the T33 is a masterpiece of proportions and visual discipline...originality is not the yardstick for me.....
When it comes to design inspired by the 60s, I much more prefer the DeTomaso P72
Too over the top, bit cartoonish and almost insectlike
I enjoy the design quite a lot. you're completely right, it purposefully tries to not push the envelope and do what works - an italian-ish design that will always be timeless, even if it's not new. In a way, I think it's a sort of boast about the car, GMA is so confident that the t.33 (and the spider variant too, so beautifully timeless) will be a car that will be appreciated forever that they gave it a look that will be appreciated forever as well, a beautiful balance of feminine and masculine design. While I agree it doesn't quite have it's own DNA, like a disco volante for example, it can get away with it. On their website, they even say that the design is heavily inspired by the spirit of 60's sportscars
A safe design that fails to express its intent
I must say I get what Mr. Stephenson says - the car not being strikingly modern. A year ago I found it very well done. Now in 2023 I think it is already old style. When I see designs like the Purosangue this car is really looking already 10 years old
Wow, couldn't have put it better myself. An amazing piece of engineering, and certainly a good looking car, but I do find it's missing something aesthetically. I am one of those people who (if I could ever afford one) would get over that very quickly as I'd spend all my time fawning over the small engineering wonders, but I do think you've nailed it when you say that perhaps the outside doesn't quite match up to under the skin.
Those were my thoughts as well, it is perfectly executed but it lacks the eyecatching factor. Is like looking at a perfect circle, you get impressed by how well it was made but you dont really remember it after two days.
@@marciliojunior4919 So well said!
I feel it has innovation. Design has become a bit minimalistic dont you think? I think the pringles logo is a great example. Looks like the same guy, but there are less pencil drawn detail. The absence of a splitter and a spoiler, in a supercar isn't today. Enzo, laferrari, they look a bit naked. Where this does not look "from the early 2000s", yet has a similar amount of "detail" in sense of aerodynamic phallic elements.
And if they'd do a gt3 version, maybe then it'd reach some noticeability like the F1, and then it'd have em :) A cool car nonetheless, must be great to drive fast.
Frank it would be cool if one day (Covid permitting) you could do a video with Gordon and/or his designer and go over their approach, go over the cars and discuss these questions you have, why they made certain decisions etc. Gordon has been very open in the videos I've seen with answering questions and clarifying why they've done things the way they have, so could be a great discussion.
Yeah it must be awesome if Frank do that.
im sure they are great friends behind the scene. its very nowadays that designers share the same passion of simplicity.
If this wasn't a Gordon Murray design I'm pretty sure this car wouldn't get all the hype and attention it is getting. From a front three-quarter view, it looks like a 2004 Lotus Elise, and looking at it from the rear it looks as if it has no more than 140 hp. Another car that came to my mind is the Isdera Commendatore 112i, although it comes across as far more potent even though it has a relatively sleek and non-aggressive appearance. I still think that the McLaren F1 is Gordon Murray's masterpiece and one which encapsulates the essence of British high-performance race car design by not being ostentatious yet looking powerful. 'Meh' sums up the T.33 for me.
As a car that that doesn’t grab you by the balls, I wouldn’t place it in 9ths, 8.7 would be a very nice and fair score for the design.
You summed it up as a swan song of yesterday's super cars. Beautiful, smooth, nothing new, taking design elements from everywhere. Then again, some cars trying to push the envelope, have cuts and vents and creases that end up with design elements from everywhere. Designers don't live in a vacuum.
It’s quite a pretty car, almost a sleeper/Q-car, considering the spectacular drivetrain, suspension and aerodynamic components that are dressed in its elegantly understated body work. I can’t wait to see and hear it in motion.
Great vid. Would really like to hear your thoughts on the Lotus 62-inspired Radford type 62-2, another car that also reflects the beautiful flowing curves and lines of the 60s.