Is Goku Actually Stupid? - Discussion/Analysis
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ก.ย. 2024
- As Dragon Ball has continued, many fans have pointed out that Goku has done many questionable things and has seemingly been dumbed down by the writers. Is that true? Is the criticism deserved? In today's video, we'll be exploring that.
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Mr Satan saved the world twice
First: throwing 16’s head to gohan
Second: telling earth to help create spirit bomb
Taht’s so true
Well kinda saved it
That makes sense
Holy shit you're right. And he didn't give cell a senzu bean.
@@ryanambsdorf2859 seriously.
The kissing thing was a mistranslation/language barrier thing because in Japanese Goku was referring to trunks bird feeding mai while Vegeta was referring to kissing. Because of the way that Japanese is structured they would have no idea what the other is referring too thus making goku look stupid in the English translation
Goku was actually pretty intelligent (in Z).
Goku is stong but dumb he gave cell a sensu bean and forgot the seal sticker for the evil contanment wave
@@davidwood5447 Giving Cell a senzu wasn't that a stupid thing, but at least Goku wasn't retarded like in super. It's not like if Cell got a zenkai from the bean.
@@dragonbird1283 cell did get a zenkai because of his saiyan genes
@@eatass1332 No, he gets one only if he is close to the death. You could use rn Goku when he was in his way to Namek and he was training and using some senzu to heal himself as an example, however I don't think Cell in that situation was close to his death or at least close to faint.
@@dragonbird1283 that's not true, the harder the fight the bigger the zenkai boost. Watch geekdom101's video about it
Do people realize that Goku basically had to raise himself?
People forget that.
@@KYLE1654-v7mmany have to....
Do you that many kids have to?
THIS
He should've listened to Grandpa Gohan about the moon.
The right term to describe goku is an airhead not an idiot.
Its either thanks to the writhing of the show or the jokes about goku being completely stupid that makes people think that he's completely stupid.
Several of the things he said was Goku trying to be strategic.saving Dende was making sure there were Dragon Balls cuz they were in the endgame😉.He didn't go Super Saiyan 3 cuz he wanted to save Vegeta and he knew he needed to stay around in case buu got free he knew that going 3 would waste his time. also in geekdom101 video Goku couldn't defeat fat who has a Super Saiyan 3 cuz he would have had to go full power in order to defeat him and the moment he did that he would have used up all his time before he could kill Buu because was to durable for it to be quick. also the senzu Bean thing wasn't about a fair fight that was Goku trying to draw out Gohan's power through fear and desperation like his was because Gohan wouldn't have been able to defeat cell without going Super Saiyan 2 even without the senzu bean. because Cell wasn't even using half his power when he fought Goku when he powered up later it shocked everyone except Gohan. Also Goku had no idea that is that the king would erase the losing universes even The Gods were shocked by that so don't expect him to see that coming. Goku was just naive enough to think that the Omni King saying it would be a friendly tournament was true
@@ChiChiLand299 why are you explaining this to me???
@@-Genki oh I've explained it to a lot of people. You just seem like a reasonable person 👍
@@ChiChiLand299 oh thanks
@Keaton Harris Yes, but The point was that he didn't intentionally put any of the universes at risk for his own entertainment as people want to believe. He took the Omni King's word that it would just be a tournament for fun do to him being naive. Even the Gods were shocked that the losers got erased they didn't see that coming so don't expect Goku to see it. Beerus threats were cuz he was afraid Goku would do something to get him erased not the whole universe. Reason Goku took the Omni Kings work cuz he could sense he was an good being, but didn't realize that the multiverse to Zeno was his own personal ant farm. but in the end the whole thing was a moral test, because if the winner wished for anything but the other universe to coming back he would have erased everyone so saved all 12 universes. Also 8 universe's where in the tournament 👍
He may not be book smart, but like Buu hes a fighting Genius. But its not his fault, nobody ever tried sending him to school or making him study
a part of his training with master roshi was studying but at that point the damage was already done
@@mattmoore4044 man hit his head as a baby and lived in the woods.
The best thing that GT did was mature Gokus character (even though he was in his child body). That's how he should have been in Super
Exactly
It is. You haven't read the manga.
@@FEdelasJONS Manga Goku giving moro a senzu bean. Yeah that's still not gt goku.
@@godzillagurus576 This is actually one of the smartest things he's ever done.
It's genuinely very long to explain but to try and summarise.
Merus' death caused Goku to realise life is worth preserving even if it means putting your life on the line for it. Goku before Merus only saved his home (Earth) and family. He didn't care for the rest of the galaxy. So when Goku promises Merus to protect the galaxy, this also meant helping those who took a wrong path and giving those a second chance. Not the same as Frieza as Goku wanted to let Frieza. Moro was never going to leave jail again, but to at least live is what Goku wanted by taking on Merus' will, he had to reform villains like Moro too. He was not looking to make a rival out of Moro. For the first time Goku saved a strong opponent for the simple fact of wanting them to live. Moro accepted this offer which means Goku could fulfil Merus' will. However Goku isn't stupid. He knows Moro will just heal in prison for 10 million years and break out. He already learnt from Frieza that healing someone brings out the true intentions. So he gave the senzu bean to Moro as a test. Will Moro at full power still obey or will he obey as predicted. Moro failed the test and did the same mistake Frieza did. Goku knew Moro was lying and beat his ass again. Moro was weaker than Goku no matter what and the senzu bean didn't change that fact. So it was a good test to see if Moro was able to change with evidence. Ofc Goku knew Moro wouldn't change but having that evidence, justifies his execution. Rather than killing someone without giving them a fair trial.
That's the summarised version, hope I made sense.
The only reason why goku gave cell a senzu bean to see the full potential of gohan even tho he was almost killed
no its cause he wanted cell and gohan to have a fair fight ..cell gave them a chance to improve by making the cell games and giving them 10 days to prepare so its only fair for goku to give him a bean
@@razkable That is very very stupid of Goku to give a bad guy a leg up, so he could destroy the planet and the next. If Goku has any sense, he could've finished off Cell to save the planet.
@@GhostCell47Yet no one talks about how Vegeta let Cell reach his perfect form out of arrogance despite knowing the consequences I guess that also makes Vegeta stupid
@@craigpeoples9883 Vegeta is stupid, no doubt about that. But the fact remains that Goku did not finish him off when he's vulnerable.
@@GhostCell47 Goku couldn't have ever finished Cell
Unfortunately, he was dumber in Super and Toriyama should've wrote Goku as a mature character, instead of going with the same personality as he was a child. I think Goku in general was a victim of bad writing for the most part.
The funny thing is when he was a child he still wasnt 100% stupid like super.
@@cerebralassassin2185 ikr idk what the writers are thinking ruining his character
@@cerebralassassin2185 for real. Goku is just pure hearted which leads to him being naive and simple minded. Goku in Super is just goofy because he is goofy
If you know what's happening in the manga rn, he's about to change tbh.
Super was the victim of bad writing*
Goku is just misunderstood and one of his character traits that was taken away, was being intemeting towards his opponents.
You know what’s really sad? Chi Chi knows Goku is pretty dumb...she forces Gohan to do all that studying but never gave Goku a book.. I’m sure he knows how to read.
lol yeah.
Goku is in more need of studying.
@@ProjektTaku Goku already studies enough. You don't become the greatest martial artist in the world just by being stronger. Goku isn't just strong, he knows all types of moves and strategies.
@@Nameless82284 I'm talking about general knowledge tho. Obviously goku's a prodigious martial artist, they showcased that in og db (and in my dbs rewrite I'm planning on showcasing it as well there alongside other characters) but I'm talking more book smart like bulma.
the whole kiss thing was in the manga that trunks was baby birding mai
The part were goku picked denda and mr satan wasnt intentional they were the closest ones to him and mr satan was holding the dog not goku
Right and Vegeta could have saved the others but didn't
Super Just messed goku's personality but dragon ball z goku was smart
Yes and no here is why GOKU GAVE CELL THE BAD GUY A FICKEN SENSU BEAN COMMON GOKU IS STUPID!!! However i will give you that dragon ball super made him even more dumb. So Congratulations for get the situation at least half right more than i would say for other people
@@davidwood5447 Agreed.
I can no longer see goku as my favorite character because of this dumbass writers🥺😡😠
I personally think goku gave cell the senzu to push gohan into his full power
I agree on this, he was putting Gohan to the test, to see if Gohan can fight Cell at his Strongest, yeah Goku is not dumb like everybody say he is, he knew what he was planning to do all along, even though he may not had a education in his life.
The ends don’t justify the means, what he did was still extremely stupid
@@donaldtrumplover2254 It really wasn't
@@donaldtrumplover2254 he wanted his son to be strong enough to be the next protector after his death.
Sadly, he misjudged Gohan and turned out he didn’t even want to fight.
All goku did in his youth was do nothing but train and nothing else he never went to school or got an education all he did was l
train how to be a fighter and that's it
From a certain point of view he is pretty intelligent when it comes to martial arts and fighting tactics
@@matthiasofgalilee but that's all he knows he probably can't even do math
@@anthonypeipert5011 yeah that is true, but at least he is very gifted in something he's passionate about. For me personally that's what I find so amazing about Goku. Even if you're not the best in certain subjects or if you may not be as intellectually capable as most, doesn't mean you can't accomplish great things. Goku does what he loves to do. He trains and fights with world champions and even gods to become the best warrior he can be, not necessarily to become the greatest in the whole universe/multiverse, but better than he was before. I'm not suggesting that education and common sense aren't important things, far from it. However, part of what makes Goku such a great character is that even though he isn't the brightest tool the shed, he's still capable of incredible accomplishments regardless.
Yo he did get an education (•̀ᴗ•́)و remember Master Roshi taught him and krillin basic education. Like math and reading, etc. >:)
@@Scribblekui of course they don’t remember, they’ve never seen it. Why would a db fan watch the first part of the series? It’s not like that’s important to watch anyway. 🗿
3:48 It wasn't just that Goku wanted to prepare the kids in case another villain came to threaten the Earth. As both Goku and North Kai pointed out, Super Saiyan 3 used up a tremendous amount of energy and, as Fortune Teller Baba told him earlier, he was only allowed 24 hours of energy. If he had tried to destroy Buu at the time, there was a chance he might fail like Vegeta did and be sent back to Other World without being able to teach the boy the Fusion Technique. And since no one knew Gohan was alive and on Supreme Kai's planet, the remaining Z Fighters would've been unable to do anything to stop Buu from killing everyone.
the fact that piccolo agreed with Goku's decision to train Goten and Trunks instead of killing Buu shows it wasn't stupid can't call Piccolo stupid. Goku never intentionally put trillions of lives at risk for the Tournament Of Power he didn't know Zeno would erase the losers even THE GODS! were surprised by that. Goku being naive took the Omni King's word that it would just be a tournament for fun not realizing that Zeno saw the entire multiverse as his plaything.
Goku gave cell the senzu Bean as part of his strategy to pull out Gohan's power he felt that anger and desperation would be the key like it was with him in the past. A father seeing too much of himself in his son easy mistake to make. Goku new the power differences well it was basically a green tiger taking on a blonde T-Rex 🤣.
Goku didn't Super Saiyan 3 against Vegeta cuz he didn't want to kill Vegeta he wanted to try to save him Goku knew from the start using the form would drain his time. He knew he needed to stay around in case Buu got free he was trusting Gohan would defeat Buu. if Vegeta in his State of mind saw Super Saiyan 3 he might have completely flipped out and try to blow everything up. As geekdom101 explained in his video Goku couldn't have defeated fat Buu he would have had to go full power Super Saiyan 3 and the moment he hit that he would have run out of time and he needed to teach the boys fusion he was taking the less risky approach. And yes if he went Super Saiyan 3 fighting Vegeta Majin Buu would have popped out in no time.
And the point is he was trying to save Dende they were in the endgame they needed to make sure there were Dragon Balls and he couldn't have gotten to Gohan and the others in time anyway.
Goku also didn't have any idea who Zeno was when he first met him wasn't till after he left Beerus even stated that he could have erased the Omniverse.
Most people misunderstand the kiss scene. I've talk to Japanese fans and they say that it was Vegeta and Goku were talking about two different things. Goku was shocked to see trunks was doing it in public while Vegeta thought he meant he never did it at all. In episode 28 of super Goku watched Bulma kiss Vegeta on cheek, but he doesn't say anything about it which means he knows what it was. The whole thing was a gag about the fact that in Japan traditionally couples didn't show affection in public. Either way if he doesn't know that means Chichi didn't teach him which means she's might just not be into that I've actually seen that before it's not unheard of one of my friends is that way she can't stand the idea of kissing cuz she doesn't like the idea of someone else's spit in her mouth, but her and her husband have been together for ten years now.
Other things like forgetting senzu beans and demon seals hiring an assassin yeah that's just stupid he is dumber in super. Although Goku knew there was no consequences if he got killed by Hit cuz Dragon Balls
The manga handles the zamasu and Goku fight better in that Goku and zamasu never met face-to-face until after zamasu who stole his body he found out about him by watching Goku fight in the universe 6 tournament with his master on GodTube seeing immortal using God ki is what caused him to want to steal Goku's body. The anime one doesn't make sense because there's no possibility of zamasu ever succeed in cuz the only reason he met Goku was cuz they were suspicious of him anyway you could say they altered history by meeting him but he didn't get away with it so no success.
Rather he meant to put lives in danger at the tourment of power or not is not the point here it's the fact he did
@@davidwood5447 yes, but you don't blame someone for an accident. Even Dragon Ball itself is excusing Goku in the tournament. The people really to blame for this whole thing is Beerus and Champa their rivalry is what led to the universe 6 tournament which inspired Zeno to host his own tournament.
@@davidwood5447 Also did you read my entire my entire long comment or just the first paragraph?
Hum i see very well you did good my bad then that is refreshing for me just because most people don't even know
@Shaikh Mustafa Salman He wouldn't have been able to one shot Vegeta because he would have had to gone full power against Vegetas he was never using full power even against fat Buu that would have made him disappear before defeating him. he couldn't defeat him that quickly that's why he didn't go Super Saiyan 3 when he fought Vegeta plus he was trying to save his life. He also had no idea how strong Majin Buu was he knew he needed to stay around and save his power for the greater fightal and he couldn't defeat Majin Buu because he would have had to go full power once again and he would have disappeared without being able to teach the boys fusion. Piccolo agreed with his explanation which means that it was a smart decision. Geekdom101 made great video about this and he's like the prophet of Dragon Ball
You know goku is my favorite character but for some reason I’m not triggered
I think it's because it's not Goku's fault it's the writers fault
@@craigpeoples9883 Yes, you are right. I was thinking the same thing......😅
I actually like s and db Original goku because whenever I am depressed I start seeing his stupidness in DBS his stupidness makes me happy
Goku is the most entertaining character to me
Vegeta is my favorite
Gokus naivety is just funny and his stupidity.
I think he’s just misunderstood honestly because of like what you said plot
Gokus not stupid
It’s those idiots who made stupid in super
Radio Moon36 I think I know why they did it probably for plot convenience or some gags
@@jjfeedback443 Which it is stupid.
@@GhostCell47 that's the point. It was completely unnecessary and just made fans turn away from the character.
Yes they are complete idiots and try make goku’s fan mad with no hesitation
It’s the writers
Ok is there going to be a part 3 to what if Goku became Majin?
Dude love your channel can you do a what if bardock was scented to the future instead of the past
he is smart in fighting
Lol no
@@dripvegeta601 how? he litteraly had his heart stopped and he only had 0.5 seconds to do something so he blasted energy up in the air so it would start his heart again he is a fighting genius bruh
I think Goku's dumb.
But I don't think it's his fault he's dumb.
I think 1 of the main reasons Goku often feels stupid, is just because
toriyama's stories are often simple and inconsistent.
But he's never gone to school.
He's probably never read a book.
And the one person who could taught him all that important stuff(Grandpa Gohan) was killed by Goku.
People confuse ignorance and naivety for stupidity. he's not the brightest person obviously, but it's more because he just doesn't know not because he's actually dumb. Like Albert Einstein said if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree it'll go its whole life thinking it's stupid.also some of the stuff he pointed out like the Super Saiyan 3 thing in the sense of beans for Cell were actually more strategic if you go back and carefully study it
@@ChiChiLand299 Very true.
Too Superior 2.0 and hit his head on a 79 tor bolder
@@str9306 🤨?
Monster Land *ton
You also forgot Goku giving frieza is energy on namek that could have literally backfired on him but it didn't.
The only time in super goku was even relatively smart was during the tournament of power, and i use relatively very loosely since he almost got eliminated multiple times by very careless mistakes. Hes become extremely dumbed down ever since Z ended.
this is why I like gt goku..he stil has that kid heart and is dumb but hes still acts adult sometimes and can be smart ...
Asmosis Jones you think shooting at super 17 multiple times was smart
@@jjfeedback443 he was just trying overload the energy inside of super 17 so he can explode.
For me, Goku has been written as he's been written. Regardless if it's poor/lazy writing, the fact that his idiotic decisions always work out in the end, that does not make him any less stupid. Now you could say that concussion he suffered altered more than his personality. That actually would make quite a bit of sense.
That's why I said the concussion he suffered as a kid altered more than his personality. Also, you could say in DBS, after years of getting pounded on by all the strongest villains of Z, how many more concussions has he suffered? He maybe actually disabled when it comes to anything outside of fighting. He will always have that Saiyan fighting instinct.
I recon soon they should have goku hit his head again but instead of having reverted back to his original personality before he hit his haid he could become a genious
Goku's Fallout Skill Tree
Strength: 10
Perception: 10
Endurance: 10
Charisma: 10
Intelligence: 0
Agility: 10
Luck: +10
Can you please make a what if Chi Chi was a saiyan and what if goku when't Ultra instinct against Goku Black and Tunks trained with goku and Whis in the timechaper
Definitely especially with Chichi no one's ever done that before. Could say she was adopted or she was half saiyan and her mother being a survivor. I once had a idea about what if Broly's mother was her mother to
if Chi Chi was a saiyan then she would be less naggy and annoying woman.
Do a what if freeza turned good .Also do a what if Vegeta turned ultra instinct instead of ssj blue evelution
What if frieza turned good is a good idea and the resurrection f coud be a cooler show down.
(sorry for my bad englis T_T)
@@eriksomogyi6702 If frieza turned good then he would be like another Vegeta but less obsessed for surpassing Goku but honestly frieza is very calm in top arc and broly movie so I should have said Piccolo lol.
Basiacly Kakarot is savage and never visit a skool to brainwash him! So act like pure soul with no whong filters :) He think a life is a game with fight and thats it :) Good Job Kakarot!
Goku isnt an actual idiot until super. In db and dbz he was actual smart other than a few times where he was still a hermit or comedic relief which wasnt often. Also Goku only gave cell a senzu bean because he want to draw out gohan's true potential. He knew Gohan was the only one able to beat him so he wanted to push him.
I’m glad I found this video. I’ve been debating whether or not to have Goku still give Cell the senzu bean in my own story, and getting someone else’s perspective is helping me narrow it down.
Goku in Z arranged the elder kai for a kiss. He said the word kiss Goku in Super doesn't even know what a kiss is. I have seen the first two arcs in Super. And I am not happy with what they did to Goku. Yes some things Goku did in Z were stupid. But Goku in Super is dumb rude and puts the universe in danger. Bulma learned to like Goku in OG. Krillin Yamcha Tien Piccolo and even Vegeta started to like him more from when Goku was meeting Bulma in the countryside. Until he killed Kid Buu with the spirit bomb. He gains more friends that used to be his enemies. And all of that is thrown out the window in Super
the most stupidest action he did is to call Frieza on Tournament of power, he can literally call everyone on their cause but he chose the most vile villain...lose lose situation on universe 7''s part, they lose they wipe out f they win, Frieza will be resurrected and will dominate other universes as tyrant, and Goku having 0 regards about other planets that may succumb to frieza's terror, I just do hope they change Gokus personality to just keep on fighting strong opponents to just fighting opponents but with good intentions and/or the same stance as he was!!
"Plot induced stupidity" = shitty writing
8:38 that plot point has been INCREDIBLY forced from start to finish, which really pissed me off. The fact that Goku set up the ToP was solely because he had a fight boner, saving the universes was a PURE. FUCKING. CONVENIENCE.
Think about it, the ToP arc would have been a WHOLE LOT more interesting if all of Goku's friends and family would have seen his downward spiral from his tame desire to fight strong guys into utter obsession, to the point where he endangered billions of worlds and countless lives just for the sake of having a good fight. I mean the very concept sounds so damn compelling and would have revealed a whole new extent of Goku's desire for greater strength. His friends would have finally had enough and shun him for what he had done, Chi Chi would probably had a divorce for Goku committing such atrocity and his own sons would have seen their father in a whole different light, they would see him as someone who is worse than Frieza, Cell and Majin Buu combined. And that disdain would have been even greater if the universes remained erased, where at that point Goku can FINALLY see the fatal repercussions of his impulsive decisions and that burning desire to fight strong opponents.
But nope, since DBS turned out to be your average Saturday morning cartoon, the ToP turned out to be predictably boring. It had it's moments here and there, but that's all that arc had: moments.
Goku *did* see the problems with his ways and he didnt need chichi to leave him for it, he realized what's at stake, it's not his fault nobody told him what the consequences for losing were
Just this.
- DB Super, Moro Saga:
Piccolo: "Vegeta is changed"
Goku: "Uh? why?"
Piccolo: "Now he fights for others"
Goku: "Uh...ok 😐 good observation"
- Dragonball Z
Majin Vegeta: "I wanted to regain my original self. To return an evil person"
Goku smiling cool as f4ck with ssj2 electricity around him: "You are lying".
This is enought to understand what is not working well with Goku's characterization.
Goku has not "emotional" dumbness. He understood changes in Vegeta and his motifs, a thing he can't do in super.
In Z He just trust others too much and hopes for the better changes (having proof a change is possible, like it happened for Vegeta) and this is still a thing he does in Super. Still, he wasn't emotionally dumb as he is now
Super Goku: Completly Stupid.
Z Goku: Is playful but is serious when he has to be.
Kid Goku: Is stupid because he hit his head as a kid and was never the same again.
You honestly think Goku preferred mr. Afro and the green kid over his own kids🤣. he did it cuz he had to make sure they were Dragon Balls to undo all the damage he was thinking like a superhero Superman or Batman would have done the same thing when you can only save one you save the one you have to mr. Satan in the puppy were just there no reason to leave them to die. you just look at Goku's face afterwards you know he didn't want to do that but he couldn't risk losing a set of Dragon Balls in case Buu somehow destroys namek
Monster Land I don’t really blame Goku for that because vegeta could’ve also got someone like Gohan or trunks
@Gordon Freeman indeed but it's not about saving them because they were closer, people don't realize that dragonballtime doesn't equal real time. like what was 5 minutes with freezer of course was turned in to 74 episodes. Goku understood that you didn't have time to save Gohan and the others but he needed to make sure there were still Dragon Balls. it didn't have time to save them all so he took the more logical decision because he knew he could at least wish them back since Gohan Goten Trunks and Piccolo have never been wished back by the Earth Dragon Balls before.
Hes smart enough to realise that majin vegeta is just vegeta doing shit on purpose to satisfu his own desires.
Thank you someone gets it
Alright Goku as a character in general isn't stupid whatsoever he's just ignorant but hes actually a fighting genius and is pretty intelligent in Gt and end of Z.However the travesty that is DBS Goku has to be mentally impaired because his decisions are just too idiotic to watch.
Goku is the reason why the whole tournament begin yes. But it wasn’t mentioned until after this that Zeno was going to raise the university anyway. I’m pretty sure the writers got millions of complaints about how stupid Goku was for doing this. So the ad that little detail just to Retcon the situation and to not make Goku look like a complete selfish idiot.
6:52 Mr Satan played an important role in saving the universe's twice if you could him carrying android 16's head triggering gohans transformation to a super saiyan 2
Everyone played a part, not just Mr. Satan. Goku, Vegeta, Fat Buu, Mr. Satan, and supreme Kai all saved the world in the Buu saga.
@@youaintvalidd7379 ok I'll change to played an important role
@@noobboss0 good boy
if he had saved gohan instead of mr satan they wouldnt have needed the spirit bomb
Well kid buu is stronger than buuhan so no they wouldn’t
@@AllMight6 not stronger just more insane
He not stupid toriyam made it like that so it could work out
Gokus giving a senzu bean is part of his character archetype, which is based on Sun Wukong.
Read this analysis I did on it:
This is my analysis of Goku and Moro from the Galactic Patrol arc: comment on Seththeprogrammer video:
Yes, I'm glad you caught the Galactus influence! Moro is not a being of pure evil, since Dragon Ball is based on Eastern Philosophy and their isnt an absolute notion of that, especially in Buddhism.
Here is my character analysis of Goku and the reasons he had the senzu bean thing. Again this is based on lots of Buddhism and some Christianity.
The character archetype of Goku, is a synthesis of Shintoism, Confucianism, Daoism and Buddhism. In this case,
For Buddhism they believe in innate buddhahood for all sentient beings(which includes all evil doers like King Piccolo, Frieza, Cell, Kid Buu, Zamasu, and even Moro). Goku is like a "Bodhisattva" which, are enlightened beings who strive to get others to achieve enlightenment and awakening.
They believe in universal compassion. This is why Goku is written to be pure "kokoro" (heart) and empty minded. forgiving, as well as doing things like giving a senzu bean, or giving mercy to the most malicious beings in the universe.
Goku's character archetype is based on the central character in Journey to the West, Son Wukong. The story is about a tale of retrieving buddhist scrolls from India.
It's also apparent that Eastern Philosophy is there. Because historically, Buddhism spread from India to China and then Japan. As it spread to China. The Shaolin Monks incorporated Buddhism into their martial arts(Kung fu) as it spread to Japan, in influenced the way of the warrior, or Bushido. (Zen Buddhism)
One of the coolest things to come from Dragon Ball, is "Migatti No Gokui". Geekdom101 did a video on it's basis, which is Mushin. However, I also believe it to be a reference to a real life swordsman named Miyamoto Musashi, he founded a Zen Buddhist school of thought, for kenjutsu technique called niten'ichi (二天一, "two heavens as one") or nitōichi (二刀一, "two swords as one") or 'Niten Ichi-ryū' (A Kongen Buddhist Sutra refers to the two heavens as the two guardians of Buddha).
All of Son Goku's lessons from his martial arts masters(Roshi, Korin, Popo, Kami, King Kai, Whis, and even Merus, have all led up to his spiritual culmination, the mastery of self movement.
Goku being a pure and empty minded being, is the first step in spiritual enlightenment in achieving such a state. Goku's inner aggregates is his selfish desire to fight. He queals this desire to fight (even if temporarily) and that is what allows him to achieve Ultra Instinct.
Goku, detest taking life, because it takes away from people's potential(regardless of them being evil entities). In Buddhism everyone is capable of buddhahood and enlightenment, even all of the villains of the series.
Goku fights to conquer himself, which is the turtle school way of martial arts, and martial arts is based on Daoism and Zen Buddhism. Well it's true that Son Goku's character has struggled with this lessons, time and time again. I believe it's still consistent with the character archetype, which is to show compassion to your enemies, no matter how wicked or "evil" they may be. Moro is basically Galactus, who continues to remain youthful, as long as he consumes planets with life. For as long as he has existed, that has been his M.O. Goku after he defeated Moro initially, asked Moro if he had trained, to which Moro has responded that he hadn't. The point of this conversation, wasn't the training, it was mercy, a chance at self reflection.
Moro is a being, who is caught in selfishness, who is obsessed with the five aggregates in Buddhism. This is a pattern that affects most mortals, and keeps them from reaching Tathagata and enlightenment.
Beings who relentlessly cling to mortal obsessions will find themselves in a vicous, never ending cycle of reincarnation. They will experience "dukka"(suffering) and "anatta"(impermanence). Until they let go of their illusionary self's.
Goku, in this conversation, showed compassion to a being, who had tried to kill him multiple times. This is the "universal compassion montra" that Bodhisattva examplfiy.
Is it annoying writing, to Westerners? Yes.
Does it make sense in the cultural context? Yes.
Again, I should make clear, Goku himself, hasn't reach this stage of englightment. Goku mind is "empty", which is based on the Song Wukong character archetype. Having a empty mind, is the first step in Buddhist englightment. This was also the reason he was able to use "Migatti no Gokui" The height of martial arts. Goku to some extent, had let go of his selfish desire to fight(by that, I mean, the saiyan drive to enjoy fighting), if temporarily.
Goku doesn't really reach the kind of Bodhisattva level enlightenment, until he meets Uub. Or if you enjoy GT, when he beats Omega Shenron
In the East, specifically in terms of Buddhism, the primary struggle facing people is the cultivation of self and freeing themselves from the cycle of samsara. Those who selfishly pursue things will be forced to endlessly reincarnate and thus, continue to experience "dukka"(suffering) and "anatta"(impermance) until they let go of the five aggregates of Buddhism.
In Confucianism, You have a humanist centered philosophy, that espouses, the flourishing of society as being the best good. Anything deviating from this or the virtues of a enlightened individual in society leads to the imbalance and gives the impression of "Evil". that is Specifically to "way of the gentlemen" are benevolence (ren 仁), righteousness (yi 義), ritual propriety (li 禮), wisdom (zhi 智), and trustworthiness (xin 信).
However, in Shintoism, there is a struggle and balancing of kegare ("pollution" or "impurity"), while ensuring harae ("purity"). Which contradicts some Buddhist ideas of the non-self(atman)
I really think people need to understand that the Eastern Philosophy in Asian cultures is vastly different than in Western cultures.
In regards to Metaphysics and Ethics, it is night and day on concepts of Gods and Evil.
There is no ultimate good or evil in Eastern philosophy. There is only relative good and evil. "All undertakings are beset with imperfections, as fire with smoke" (Gita 18.48).
In Daoism, you have the Cosmic Yin and Yang. Which is Dialectical monism, also known as dualistic monism. This is not to be confused with just monism(the idea that reality is built on things of a material substance, like atomism). This is a special case of ontology (study of being) where the forces represent themselves, as perceptions in the realm of the minds, not substantive nature. It's also merely an illusion like Buddhism.
For example, Evil in the East is not a "substance" in a monist point of view. It does not have matter associated with it.
This should be obvious, as you don't see "evil" or "good" on the periodic table of elements. Even if you trace evil down to some basic element of thing in common across cultures or religion and even science, you will find that it's only rooted in perception, it's a idea that is found only in the minds of observers. It possesses no material form outside subjective experience, hence it's relative and not objective. There are no cells that produce evil, humans don't produce evil, the Universe doesn't produce evil. Everything has a purpose in the Universe. Marcus Singer says: "If something is really evil, it can't be necessary, and if it is really necessary, it can't be evil"
In the West, from a theological point of view, St. Augustine viewed evil as a "privation of good" he didn't believe Evil was created since that would deconstruct the presumption that a God was perfect in the sense of omnipotent, all good, and omniscient.
Also in the West, people tend to believe in a concept in Theodicy called the "vale of soul making". This would be the explaination for the problem of evil. That is, the existence of evil as a phenomenological effect, that motivates and breeds self cultivation of behavior and harmonious virtues in mortals.
The reason I added the stuff about evil and Godhood, is that people always struggle with coming to terms of why don't Whis or the Kaioshins or the other Gods, actually intervene. This is a struggle that parallels actual history in theology and is across cultures.
Thinking of these things, helps to appreciate the ideas behind the fiction.
Yes gokus dumb but what do you expect from a guy who fell on his head when he was a child and he never went to school
In super he’s stupid but in the Db manga and both db and dbz he’s not stupid he’s naive
He not stupid but he just so naive
That's different when he was a child at the time. But he's a grown ass man, so him acting like an idiot is no excuse.
@@GhostCell47 True
They turned him into post movie Patrick Star in Super.
Writers are stronger
There is an obvious explonation for Goku's increase increased stupidity in super. Goku has suffered aditional brain damage from all his fights. Getting punched in the face by guys like Frieza, Cell and Buu probably isn't good for your brains health
@Salad Saiyan, the REAL villian , is Akira Toriyama: The Retcon King. Always retconning err-thang.
He really need to hire editors.
The amount of brain damage goku has suffered will never be reverted, it’s probably beyond shenron’s powers
Goku like any other prodigy chess music so much of his time is focused on one thing he doesn't have time for normal things 😭😭😭
What if goku had God ki as a kid
If he had taken gohan he would have easily beaten kid buu as he was beating the life out of super buu
in that scene he could not make it to gohan in time and he had to make sure there were Dragon Balls to undo all the damage that's why he tried to save dende specifically not the dog and mr. Satan they were just standing nearby and there was no reason to leave them to die
I mean, technically Goku DID die when he fought hit on Earth. The only reason why he came back was because of that ki blast he launched up into the air right before he died
Z tard crybabys: Whaaaaa whaaaaaa goku isn't heroic like in z Z GOKU: fuck cell i cant beat him u fight him gohaun. SUPER GOKU: IM NO HERO OF JUSTICE OR ANYTHING (goku being humble) BUT THOSE WHO HURT MY FRIENDS WILL PAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!. Z TARDS fuck that thats just him being a fight freak. Me: stupid z tards are idiots who nitpick everything. They just like the people who say playstation 2 is better than 4 because of the nostalgia of ther childhood. Grow up iv watched dragon ball to dragon ball z to non-canon GT witch was dogshit and potted meat. And boring. And super which was so hyped fun and will always be my best . To be honest dragon ball was realy good I liked the android-cell saga z was good but super it was more. How is it a kids show. I was watching DBZ WITH MY MOM AT 4 YEARS OLD SO HOW IS SUPER A KIDS SHOW BUT Z AINT! GOKU DOES ACT GOOFY BUT HE STRAITEN UP WHEN HE NEEDS TOO. WHEN I HEARD GOKU SAY I DONT KNOW PEOPLE KISS I I DIDNT JUST TAKE MY COMPUTER SCREEN AND THROW IT OUT THE WINDOW SAYING FUCK U RETARDED GOKU I JUST STRUGED IT OFF AND ENJOYED THE REST OF THE GOKU BLACK ARK WITCH WAS GREAT. YALL Z TARDS IS ASS. ITS LIKE IF DRAGON BALL TARDS SAID "MAN Z IS TRASH DRAGON BALL IS THE OG SERIES." THATS WHAT Z TARDS HAVE STARDED DOING.
One word: flanderization
The difference is that he actually knows things in dbz
Before watching this video, just want to point out that he was (and I'm not joking) dropped on his head as a baby, from several feet in the air.
Yes, as a matter of fact, he is. Canon makes that pretty clear, I'd say.
Do what if goku went to vampa next
I’m supposed to believe that the guy who had enough critical thinking skills to piece together that he was the one who killed his grandpa after seeing vegeta transform is the same guy who didn’t know what kissing was? Smd
Goku doesn’t care about things he isn’t interested in and yeah I don’t think it was all that hard to figure out he’s the one that killed G.Gohan
Goku being dumb is the only reason he was able to achieve ultra instinct I feel like super made him this dumb just for that reason
Actually roshi forgot to give goku the seal
I think the manga of dragon ball super handled goku better.
He was airheaded in casual moments, but he would get down to business when it came too it and wasn't nearly as goofy as the anime.
And for the seal part, instead of forgetting it, he simply got the wrong one, which seems like an actual mistake one could make instead of just a plot device.
Well dbs was written by different writers and the dbs manga is written by Toyotaro
@@Sydney-wi1ym the dbs anime is made by toei taking from toriyama's notes, the same people who made dbz filler, meanwhile the manga is a fan of the series taking toriyama's notes and then building around them.
Goku's character is inconsistent and I think It's because of having different writers writing him that would make him look good or bad
I never knew Goku hired a Hit on himself😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Explosive gaming is right that is my favorite what if for this channel
Well I don’t care I’m a true Goku fan
No. Giving Cell a senzu was actually a brilliant idea. From Goku's experience to achieve/enhance Super Saiyan transformation, one needs both anger and DESPERATION. Goku turned ssj 1 when he was cornered by massively overpowered Frieza with his best friend blown up to pieces, Piccolo dying on the ground and his son about to be killed next. He had no other choice but to ascend to Super Saiyan. So Goku has decided to created a similar situation for Gohan by giving Cell a senzu bean to add that desperation factor. If Gohan has fought Cell with a thought that he is tired after fight wih Goku or that his father would intervene in the last moment, Gohan would never go ssj2 and Cell would eventually outlast him since he is an android. Goku is much smarter and more cunning than what others think he is.
Do what if gohan went to vampa plz
In Z he seems more naïve than anything but I’m super Id say lacks any common sense.
I'd argue he's evil, not stupid. He intentionally risks getting everyone killed multiple times just so he can have a good 1 on 1 fight.
But honestly just one line could have made the ToP thing with Goku much more reasonable. If he said that he wants to win so he can have a wish with the Super Dragon Balls to bring back the other universes then he would have acted like an actual adult who has a plan! And you could still have tension with Freeza being one of the last ones standing since we pretty much know he wouldn't wish for something like that. Simple as that, one line, and you have a much more likeable Goku.
He says that but in a subtle way to 17
I don't really think Goku is stupid, just naive and not every forward thinking. Most of his plans are short sighted like the Gohan vs. Cell and the T.O.P., but he's aware enough to realize the stakes of certain desicions. Like you said, most of his stupid desicions in Super are needed by the plot to continue forward. I think that Goku in the original series was just young and out of touch with how the world works mainly because he lived alone for years and hadn't learned much after Grandpa Gohan died. In DBZ, he's a but smarter, bit is naive and reckless. DBS his stupidity is caused by over used gags and plot convenience.
My personal Head-cannon: Buu kicked Goku in the head really hard.
Edit: New Hypothesis - This is what a Saiyan mid-life crisis looks like.
I think Goku really hitting his head really hard
Goku now is just stupid. Dbz Goku was misunderstood
Space sure is dark... or maybe it’s just nighttime
Don't forget Goku hit his head when he was mini saiyan
Hey, there any chance you can cover "What if Cell Jr was good" or something similar?
I know this video is like over 9 months old but Goku Wanted Gohan to humiliate Cell not so he could have a fair fight!
He is a smart fighter but in
in like academics and stuff he isn't the sharpest shed in the tool
In Super They Dumbed him down really Badly I Guess Bringing Back the "Kid Goku Vibes" But it felt Forced Like Just No Maturity Or Growth around Him were I just wanna Jump through my Screen and Punch him Because He's Literally In Super a 8 year old Inside of a Grown man's Body
When dbz came to America, the dubbers were afraid his selfish and dumb personality would upset the viewers and not root for him. Their solution? Turn Goku into Superman, this involved changing the dialogue, some mistranslations like Goku’s dad being a brilliant scientist, and basically just doing whatever made the character seem more heroic. That is the Goku I know and love, but that’s not the original Goku. The original is dumb, naive, only cares about fighting and getting stronger, and never changes. After awhile, the dubbers weren’t afraid of what Goku’s reputation was and stopped making changes, so Goku in Super is just regular Goku, Japanese Goku. What can I say except American Goku(DBZ) is cool, Super(Japanese) Goku is dumb, that’s why I don’t watch it.
In my opinion the smartest not dumb goku is gt
Goku is not writin bad I wish he was a person like his father at least he should be a little bit serious if there’s a new dragon ball series I want his personality to change a bit I want him to make better decisions and a bit of a serious person when he’s not fighting also he needs to chill out with the trainning
I still don't consider him stupid though as he has always been playful towards stupid household and daily things.... He is a protector of earth.... If he was like vegeta.... He wouldn't have got that much inspiration and curiosity to grow.... Vegeta just follows gokus discoveries....
bro if goku had grabbed gohan when kid buu was blowing up earth,
as soon as he had his stamina back gohan would have kicked kid buus ass harder than he kicked the cell jrs asses
Theroy Goku inherited bardock time seeing thing and he does the stupid stuff to save the whole universe and the others or its plot
I believe Goku is just poorly written in Super. I think they just went a bit overboard with his childlike demeanor when coming back to the series. Even in Battle of Gods, before the anime adaption, Goku wasn’t this immature man child. He isn’t someone who’s okay with risking another life to satiate his battle lust. He always sees the best in people, even in people like Vegeta. Him being warned about dangerous people isn’t something knew. His heart is pure and trusts his instincts. And he honestly hasn’t been wrong that much.
I mean unlike in Super he actually made up for his mistake by sacrificing his life technically.
gohan and vegeta are much better characters and goku shouldn't have been wished back to life
lol you didn't mention gt which makes him the smartest goku
there was a time when goku put a energy blast in the air before fighting hit to that if he got him the energy blast would come down and jumpstart his heart. so for me hes not completely dumb but he does questionable stuff. but i think he has more battle iq.
What if saiyans were good next
SSJ3 Goku has no eyebrows