They won’t bring up the fact of what that era was that Kobe was playing in because they know that it was an era where everyone was insufficient Because it was a way more defensive league than this one And it was zone basketball which is meant to stop an individual player from getting off Just a bunch of haters on this show for Kobe it’s disgusting go rewatch basketball
Duncan was boring to watch , Kobe was the most skillfull player of all time . At the time when Kobe was playing why was Kobe more the super star and the focus of the NBA but not Duncan. The Spurs were just the Spurs a team but hate him or love Kobe he was the helm of superstar of the NBA just as was Jordan. Why now is Duncan suddenly higher than Kobe. If you commentators really like some one its not ok to feed us with your favourites just because you have access to the broadcasting service. Why dont you carry out a survey in the NBA public vote to let the public decide who the best player was. Kobe was more feared on the basketball court than Duncan and I was not even a fan of the Lakers and Kobe but he is higher than LBJ and Tim Duncan is the joke in this arguement. For crying out loud Shaq was not close to a player Kobe was he could not even shoot a free throw and his game was more like wrestling than basketball. Totally disgusting just people who used size advantage are even considered great players for putting up unfair numbers. On 360 vision talent who is better than Kobe on the level of difficulty of the shots he took and made them. Your boring list is boring us Kobe was the altimate entertainer . On charecter i honestly did not like Kobe but cannot deny his tallent he is second to Jordan only by way of championships.
Kobe played great defense for like 5 years then coasted and would turn it on. Which is what most good players do to be fair but he was no MJ or Hakeem or even Tim Duncan defensively
Kobe’s inefficiency comes with the fact that he loves to take shots when he was double or triple teamed. As a Kobe fan, this was also my frustration during his playing days but I can’t complain much. His ability to hit those tough shots also gave his fans plenty of memorable and timeless highlights. He won 5 titles while being one of the best entertainers this league has seen since MJ. All is good.
1. Now Imagine how Good was Jordan and his efficiency in an era where it was even tougher to shoot 50% from the field especially for a 6'5 225 Guard playing that style. 2. Kobes all time stats are impacted negatively by some other factors - not as long of a prime as some other players. He played 20 years. A backup in his first 2 and washed post achilles. So thats about 5-6 years that make his 20 yr career look worse than it was. Lebron has kinda been on his prime and an all star level player every single yr and that efficiency and stats been high every yr. If you isolate Kobes top 13-15 seasons where he was in his prime it would look better - the era was tough in early 2000s - he took many bad shots. Thats on him too though - he had some awful teams post Shaq pre Pau Gasol. Kwame, Luke Walton and Smush Parker was no.2, 3 and 4 in minutes for Lakers one yr. Imagine that for a minute. Same Happened to Lebron in 2015 finals with a 38% percentage. Dude was alone after game 1 and the defense could focus on him more. Its hard to shoot 50% that way. 2007 finals he was 35% as well vs Spurs. Same situation for Lebron playing iso ball. -Kobe was a great shooter imo. Especially from 3. The free throw peecentage is the truest test of how good a shooter actually is. The ultimate truth teller. No wonder Steph is no.1 all time. Can't trick the free throw line. Its the same for everybody. 3. That Being Said - I got Kobe 5th. I just think this FG% stuff is overblown. He could really hit 3s. Imo - better than MJ or Lebron. His mid range game though wasn't as good as MJ (62% from midrange on yr in playoffs). His inside game not as good as MJ or Lebron. His FT game better than MJ slighly and way better than Lbj. Want to find out how well dudes shoot - put them on the free throw line Magic was an amazing FT shooter thiugh. That thing was sure.
@@erikpuka2627 it wasnt tougher, the illegal defence made defence way easier for iso players to score on. many actual players and analysts have said this
@@khalxd1991 it was way tougher man. Way tougher. Listen to players who played in both eras. KG for ex. Lebron even. Shaq even. Luka has proven that theory to be true. Its illegal to play defense now PERIOD. The slightest contact is a foul. Lane is wide open. You can't stop people from penetrating now. The thing thats tougher now is playing 1 on 1 defense on an island cause you can't touch anything. Offense never been any easier. You got Westbrook dropping hige stats. Harden even. A washed Kobe put up 60. A washed Jamal Crawford put up 50. An Ancient Wade could do work. Lance Stephenson came out of China and gave dudes bussiness semi washed. Its illegal to play defense now in general
Amidst all the subjectivity on this topic, let’s just acknowledge the overarching fact - whichever player you have as your goat or whichever players you have in your top 10 - these guys made you feel all types of emotions and made you fall in love with the game of basketball. What makes them great is the ability to fully captivate their audience and forever occupy a place in our memories. Respect to greatness 🤙🏾
People fall in love with the drive and determination of Kobe. IMO he has the greatest comeback story in sports history after the ‘03 case all while rising to the top of the league.
I also loved the redeem team documentary they did and how he was one of the key players that helped USA win gold again, that was a nice comeback story too and I’m glad he was apart of it
@@Cheif_Espada Umm - San Antonio drafted those players. All great players have to play with drafted teammates and help make them better. Great players don't demand trades because they don't have the ability to make teammates better and want "all star" free agent talent to "help them" (i.e. Kobe Bryant and LeBron James).
A lot of ppl don't realize if Duncan was not playing in a system in San Antonio for most of his career and he plays on a team with more freestyle play, he more likely would have put up bigger numbers in terms of points and assists specifically and Duncan is one the best passing big man of alltime.
Exactly..just like steph is THE system at GS and why is that a knock on such players..it takes something unique about your game for a team to build THE system around you..why couldn't kobe be THE system? Cos he couldn't willfully make his teammates better at least early into his career. Overall, Duncan is slightly better than kobe as a player. In terms of competitive will kobe was slightly higher than duncan.
Duncan is great, but because they never went back to back, they were never seen as dominant. Doing it back to back, or three-peating is immensely more challenging because of the wear and tear on your body. It's the same reason why the Lakers/Heat flamed out in 2021.
Clutch time actually isn’t just one shot alone. I thought clutch moments happened within the last 4-5 minutes of a game. Nit picking clutch to one last shot is crazy to me.
Except Duncan has the record with 15 selections. I think what you mean is 9 FIRST team selections, most all time tied with MJ Garnett and I think also Gary Payton
Broussard: Kobe shot 44% for his career and never shot over 47% for a season with Shaq drawing doubles. Nick: shaq scored 36 a game on 60% shooting for those finals Rick: oh you guys and numbers Lmao what a joke, all Rick cares about are his feelings about these players. He doesn’t like lebron so he isn’t top 5, he does like Kobe so he’s easily top 5.
That’s what people say wen the numbers don’t support there argument. Some debates are opinion based but we know who’s better immediately wen we compare certain players. The only thing that’s objective is what you like personally
Shaq and Lebron lived in the paint so of course their percentages are higher. Steph is at 47 percent for his career and we calling him the greatest shooter of all time. See how numbers can be deceiving.
To be fair that's how most if not all people structure thier lists, then they use numbers to try justify their points. If it's too much of a stretch they let it go.
And Thts true , westbrooks stats over all will be better than curry’s , but the ppl who watched them play will tell you curry was undoubtedly better than westbrook, but you will have these stat nerds tht look at only stats and bring up numbers , nd we will then say “you had to see it to understand “
@@shun8733 nah westbrook's efficiency and turnovers are horrible and the stats can tell you he cant shoot. Even looking at stats you can tell curry is much better but yes it does help to watch the games too. That being said its equally as stupid to dismiss all stats just because you "watched them play"
All of these analysts go from one extreme to the other. Some are too stats heavy and some are too intangibles heavy. The answer is somewhere in the middle.
He pretty much just said I like Kobe more. Watching him play he seemed better, with literally no argument. how is he even and analyst. He didn't analyze. He just said a statement based on literally nothing.
There's nothing wrong with weighting the eye test very heavily. That said, you can't really have the eye test without taking into account intangibles.. intangibles are the things you see with your own eyes but can't place on a stat sheet.
Numbers don’t always tell the whole story and jus cus Nick said this opinion doesn’t mean anything for the most part anything Nick says about lebron is not bias at all lol
seriously like who did he have on those teams? Pau Gasol and a bunch of role players. None of those teams were as stacked as any of the teams you see today. KD Kyrie and Harden CANT EVEN GET TO THE FINALS
@@3liteshadwgamer640 Duncan won 2 league mvps, and led the spurs to 2 championships while Kobe was playing with a top 10 all time player. Duncan was the most boring superstar of all time he never got the respect he deserved
What part of the "LEAST"ern Conference, as it was known at the time, don't you get? No one respects cake walking past the Hawks and the Paul George/Roy Hibbert Pacers as some holy accomplishment to be held up amongst all-time great achievements
@John Smith Nick and Chris aren't 2000s though. I'd argue people rank Kobe higher now then they did when he was alive. God bless the dead Kobe not top 5
He was wrong using his own metrics… Lebron undoubtedly wins any eye test against Kobe Bryant, and Tim Duncan’s resume literally equals Kobe’s resume IN THE SAME EXACT ERA.
It is his opinion. Doesn't make it fact. Also, I agree with him that Kobe is in the top 5. Again, my opinion, and everyone else has theirs. However, MJ is my favorite of all time and also who I consider the GOAT.
Kobe took more contested deep mid range shots than anyone especially at his time period . He shot a high percentage for someone always so heavily contested. Him shooting so many contested shots made him even more lethal in the playoffs . This is why numbers are bs unless you look at the advanced metrics to the type of shots they were compared to the rest of the nba . I think his effectiveness on tough shot making is ridiculously understated and it's disgusting that they just just look at raw number data . Just like when they said harden is the best isolation player of all time .
“ Kobe didn’t have that nucleus of having the same head coach & Duncan never had a down year “ but when it comes to Lebron it’s “ he can’t will his team on his own “. Man pick a side.
@@manniesupasport7977 how many of them in their prime, healthy playing at perennial all nba / all star level 1 year of D Wade all nba 3 1 year of AD all nba 2 1 year of Kyrie all nba 3 2 year of CB all star
@@manniesupasport7977 go home bruh….this man named Shaq and Drose as star teammates or something oh wait Isaiah Thom……nah bruh said Ben Wallace!!???yooooooo I’m done
There is a clear double standard when comparing different players. LeBron is consistently down-graded because of Heat's loss to Mavs in 2011. However, Kobe and Shaq simply get passes for the 2004 meltdown against the Pistons. Both finals results are excellent examples that teams with good supporting casts win championships, not individual stars.
Lebron went from 26ppg to 17ppg in the Finals. He disappeared. He was the clear best player on the team (and in the NBA) but hid under the spotlight making himself the 3rd option. Still, the Heat had 4 players scoring over 10ppg with their big 3 + Mario Chalmers pitching in 11.8ppg. Their big 3 combined for 62.8ppg in the Finals compared with 70.9 in the regular season. The Lakers were not a deep team at all and Karl Malone was injured. The 3rd highest scoring player was Derek Fisher at 6.4ppg. Shaq and Kobe combined for 49.2ppg. This was actually above their regular season average of 45.5ppg. There is no double standard. Lebron had an epic meltdown. Shaq, Kobe & the Lakers were simply outclassed.
@@rizahawkeye5912 Interesting counterpoints. However, your argument assumes that the opposition is constant. It is not. The 2011 Mavs were great defensively, deeper and more experienced. You can say the same argument about the 2004 Lakers. Not very deep, but in contrast, they were more experienced than the Pistons. I still can't see why the explanation "Epic meltdown" is more viable than "Mavs defense adapted to their opponents". Team cohesion takes time, getting the suitable skill set with the supporting cast takes time. In 2012, the Heat got a better supporting cast, and their results improved.
I think a lot of people forget that without Kobe the Lakers vs Pacers finals goes 7 games. Shaq fouled out in OT of Game 4 and it was 100% Kobe who won that game for LA and kept that series from being tied 2-2 back when game 5 would have been at Indy and the Pacers realistically could have taken a 3-2 lead and only need to steal one of the last two at LA.
These guys are haters what they never mention is that Kobe won all 5 of his titles with a BIG 2 not Big3 LeBron & Duncan both got 1 title each with a big2 the rest are Big3
Yes the Media just wanted Kobe's name to be recognized to the point they put him over defensive specialist Ron Artest. Is anyone actually going to believe that Kobe is a better defender than Ron Artest?
Nobody did. Duncan benefitted from the better organization and put talent around him consistently. How many future HOFers did TD play with vs the number of future HOFers Kobe played with?
I think KG was right there with Duncan, if he had been on those spurs teams he’d have multiple rings as well. Sucks his prime was wasted with terrible teams
Nobody is devaluing Kobe in the 3peat but when you have a teammate that averaged 37,17, and 7 you are the 2nd banana. Also people call Kobe so clutch, he would take the shot…every time but he missed more go ahead shots than anyone.
You're just talking about those Finals runs. They would've never made it to the Finals without Kobe averaging 30+ & running through The Spurs, Kings, Trailblazers, etc; KOBE dominated & closed those series at 21, 22, 23 years of age.
@@travisblair3189 just stop bro it don't even matter when people already got they mind made up......they can't even name any center shaq went up against in the finals without Google cause they was all BUMS
Kobe was an incredible player, definitely one of the greats.....but I am freaking amazed that no one is remembering that he had not only Shaq but also Horace Grant, Ron Harper, and Robert Horry on those teams! You cannot tell me the Spurs had a better lineup.
@@AngelDay1101 Your telling me you think the 2001-2003 Spurs had a better team than the 2001 -2003 Lakers?!? What about when the had Karl Malone, Gary Paxton, and Rick Fox?
@@AngelDay1101 C'mon, with Phil Jackson as coach, man that was an all star team. The Lakers swept everyone in 2001. Tim Duncan was a better player, but the Lakers were a better team.
@@donaldseigel4101 really and popavich wasn't already a champ. That 01 team had 3 eventual hall of famers and a defensive stopper in Bruce Bowen. They had Stephen Jackson Tony Parker Malik Rose Steve Smith great team with Robinson and Duncan
I guess we watched a different episode because I saw Nick talk over Rick pretty much the entire time. But I can see why most people would think that's dominating a conversation because there are a lot of morons out there that think he who shouts the loudest wins. Derp.
@@malikrevis6896 I would never take Shaq over Kobe. Kobe 3 peat with Shaq and Kobe wasn't even in his primes. Soon as Kobe was in his primes he went to 3 straight finals without Shaq. What 3peat did Shaq do when he left Kobe? Don't worry I'll wait
@@moisesfigueroa6390 MJ was great but how many first round picks did he need to make the playoffs? Jordan needed everybody to get old before he made an impact... Shaq is one of one!! Day one team one Orlando to the finals
Who beat more 50+ win teams in the playoffs than Kobe, made more three pointers in a game, scored more points in a game, and also made more than 12 all defensive teams, 🤔 please inform me
Huh??? More 3s in a game?? Didn’t Klay Steph and jr smith all shoot as many and more 3s in a game?? Beat 50 win teams?? So he beat teams that did good in the regular season?? That’s what you are supposed to do in the playoffs and he did some of that with Shaq. Kobe’s an animal but those were bad examples. His first team all defenses over Lebron or the stretch where he was asked to pass and averaged a double double the last 3 months of the season was fire. He could do more but chose to be the player he was. Cerebral and defended any star player from Jordan to Bron to Durant to Steph.
@@fabianmarshall4120 Yes, but he played and beat more 50-win teams than anyone in NBA history. The only player that really comes close is Jordan. LeBron is approaching, but is still behind. That's not something you just brush off as insignificant. People always say Kobe had Shaq (not vice versa) and forgets that he did all of that with Pau Gasol as the next best teammate from 2008-2010 playoffs. He played more 50-win teams in that span than Magic did in his entire 13 year career. That obviously meant that Kobe repeatedly faced the most consistently competitive teams thoroughout his career. As great as Magic, Kareem, LeBron, etc were/are, they didn't face nearly as many competitive teams consistently. It was times they only faced one 50-win team throughout the entire conference playoffs run and another in the Finals.
@@atlien1988 it’s decent to do that I never said brushed it off it’s just the most minimum way to talk about the greatness of Kobe. 50 win team in 09-10 when Lebron was by himself the heat had fell off from their chip and it was only laker Celtics and spurs vying for anything. By most 50 win teams what do you mean?? In a run to the finals or over some years?? In one run impressive but that’s 1 run not enough. You’re on another post debating Kobe with me and I’m defending his shot taking on there saying he was by himself so you just want to argue
As good as Magic was, the key thing is that the very second Kareem retired, the Magic-led Lakers never won another ring. Kobe won with AND without Shaq. Magic never won without Kareem. Kobe Bryant should be Top 5 but not over Duncan, but instead, over Magic.
As good as Kareem was, he was there in the Lakers 6 years before Magic. Never won a chip. Magic comes in, makes them win the title and wins the FMVP. Then goes on to win 4 more. So Kareem also never won a ring without Magic while he was at Lakers and never won a single ring his entire career without arguably the two greatest PG’s of all time (Magic and Oscar). Does that mean Kobe’s better than Kareem too? You can’t nitpick stats bro. Jordan, LeBron, Kareem and Magic are on the Mount Rushmore. As good as Kobe was, he’s on the bottom half of the Top 10.
As a side note, I feel that Kobe/Shaq team doesn't get anywhere near the respect nor the debate that the great teams get. That 2000 team was cutting through teams like there wasn't another team on the floor. If I remember right, my Sixers were the only team to put a loss on them in the playoffs.
that was the 2001 season. and in that season they didn't take the regular season seriously. If you could combine the 2000 regular season with the 2001 playoff, then you'd have a strong goat team argument
Lol what are you talking about? The 01 lakers are widely considered the best team other, along with the 83 76ers, 96 bulls, and 2017 warriors. They are considered a dynasty, which the lebron heat aren’t even considered
@@TheCephalon I don't know about "widely considered". I don't hear these conversations. I hear more about the Spurs and they've never repeated. Maybe it's the outlets I'm getting my sports talk from.
I don’t like that argument either. Why bring others down to elevate others? Spurs were a great dynasty. Manu and Parker played a huge role in that as well, their stats don’t do them justice but if you watched them play you knew just how valuable they were to those championship teams.
@@thisisnotmyname8766 yeah they were, but you aint building a roster around a Parker or Ginobili They aren't anyone's #40 pick on any mock draft They're basically ringless journeymen without Timmy and Pop. They're like Draymond but better. Yeah it was nice having them, but they weren't irreplaceable
The Spurs system had 67 wins in 2016 relying on a young Kawhi’s two-way play and decent contributions from the others. They were starters except for Manu, but nothing more. Kawhi had yet to make his huge leap and become a superstar (2017, 2019). They still made the playoffs when Kawhi left with virtually no star talent. The Spurs system was a real thing whether you like it or not
@@Coldskin1 I disagree, to an extent. I think overall yes Centers tend to be more valuable on the defensive end than guards, but there are those anomalies like Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, D Wade, that in my opinion were just as effective defensively as many great Centers.
All talk about the "better basketball player" but that doesn't always equate to being the highest on these lists. Durant is an objectively better player than Curry, but almost everyone has Curry higher on their all-time list. I love Kobe, and he embodies everything about hard work and dedication to your craft, but Duncan's career was better when you put all these arguments on the table. And to say the fact Shaq was averaging 36 points in the finals doesn't matter is insanity, it's so impossible to discuss these things with these old heads that make arguments just based on feelings and biases. PS: I shouldn't have used "objectively", some strong arguments against that in the replies, my bad!
But u a bit stupid! Watch THE ENTIRETY of the Playoffs and not only The Finals as Shaq played THE WORST COMPETITION of NBA finals opponents EVER for a Center!!!
I think that the guys ranked 6-15, you can’t really say one is objectively better than another, and it’s why you see such a variety with these lists; I wouldn’t make the case that KD is objectively a better basketball player than Steph. Duncan and Kobe is always a hot debate because their careers were so evenly matched and they went to battle several times head to head. I’m not mad at either selection here.
@@brandonrice2833 Fair point, objectively is a bad word here on my end. My point is that you could argue Kobe was better at basketball than Duncan and still have Duncan higher because it’s about total body of work.
KD is not better than Curry, he never was... He is just taller and plays more traditional basketball which is why the media mostly pushes the narrative that he's better.
Kobe's skills, style, and competitiveness is so inspiring. Within 10 years from being drafted, he managed to win 3 rings in 3 peat fashion, be the best player in the NBA as a shooting guard, all defensive team 7 year straight, all star team starter for 9 year straight, be the youngest player to start in an all star game while not being a starter as a Laker, dropped 81 pts in a game, outscored a team in 3 quarters, and the face of the league all in one team as a Laker in the tough western conference. When the world watched the 2008 Olympics, they knew who the guy was that Led them to a gold medal..KOBE
@@johanholguin6576 I think he was the best player in 2004 when Shaq was out of shape. He hit the memorable 2 buzzer beaters in Portland, one to force OT and the other to win the game. But I'm with you, he was the best player in year 9. The following year, he scored 81 pts.
@@JC-zk7rt Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time 1. Michael Jordan 2. LeBron James 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 6. Shaquille O'Neal 7. Tim Duncan 14. Kobe Bryant PPG: LeBron RPG: LeBron APG: LeBron SPG: LeBron BPG: LeBron FG%: LeBron 3pt%: LeBron FT%: Kobe TS%: LeBron PER: LeBron WS/48: LeBron VORP: LeBron MVP's: LeBron FMVP's: LeBron Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2) LeBron a better player then Kobe Field goal% LeBron 50.5%✔️ Kobe 44.7% Points scored career LeBron 37,062✔️ Kobe 33,643 Most missed shots in NBA history 1. Kobe Bryant 14,481 2. John Havlicek 13,417 3. Elvin Hayes 13,296 LeBron more points then Kobe Kobe more missed shots then LeBron Total 3pointers made LeBron 2,140✔️ Kobe 1,827 Total Steals career LeBron 2,136✔️ Kobe 1,944 Total Blocks career LeBron 1,041✔️ Kobe 640 Defensive win shares LeBron 75.59✔️ Kobe 50.66 Assists Leader LeBron 1✔️ Kobe 0 Career highs Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record Career highs LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters LeBron 5✔️ Kobe 1 2010 NBA finals Game 7 Lakers 83 Celtics 79 Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points 2013 NBA finals Game 7 Heat 95 Spurs 88 LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings 2011 NBA playoffs Mavericks 4 Lakers 0 Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
@@terrystyles3486 You do know that average percentages has limitations. Instead of showing us the stats, why don't you tell us what your statistics means? Like why is Lebron so bad at free throws? It's just you, the ball, and the basket. It's been 19 years and he hasn't figured it out. Why do people call him LeFlop, LeAirball, LeBum, LeBrick, LeFraud, LeSweep, LeChoke, LeCrybaby? Hmm 🤔 Kobe brings the game of basketball to life with his skills, artistry, and competitiveness that inspired old school and new school ballers. Kobe was always in the more difficult Western conference. Even Shaq agreed that it was way easier to win in the East. Offense, Defense, & Competitiveness, Kobe over Lebron.
@@JC-zk7rt Most missed shots in NBA history 1. Kobe Bryant 14,481 2. John Havlicek 13,417 Points scored LeBron 37,062✔️ Kobe 33,643 Field goal% LeBron 50.5%✔️ Kobe 44.7% LeBron more points then Kobe Kobe more missed shots then LeBron Only person with brick in they name is Kobrick Bryant with most missed shots in NBA history 14,481 Defensive win shares LeBron 75.59✔️ Kobe 50.66 LeBron better offensively and defensively then Kobe Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time 1. Michael Jordan 2. LeBron James 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 6. Shaquille O'Neal 7. Tim Duncan 14. Kobe Bryant PPG: LeBron RPG: LeBron APG: LeBron SPG: LeBron BPG: LeBron FG%: LeBron 3pt%: LeBron FT%: Kobe TS%: LeBron PER: LeBron WS/48: LeBron VORP: LeBron MVP's: LeBron FMVP's: LeBron Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2) LeBron a better player then Kobe
Yup. I always say this. Actually MAKE your list and then get back to me. I bet we are closer to agreeing than you think. “How can Dak Prescott be ranked the number 10 QB in the league...?!” Well because Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Russel Wilson, Pat Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen, Deshaun Watson, Joe Burrow, Kyler Murray, Justin Herbert... You actually have to make the list and people so rarely do.
One thing these analysts don’t tell you is that the finals series during the Lakers 3 peat that they played against cake walk eastern conference teams that really couldn’t deal with Shaq.. the series against Portland & the series against Sacramento.. which were way better opponents than the Nets & 76ers & Pacers ..The Mamba brought those series’ home 🐍
Exactly like how the narrative was Shaq couldn't win the big game. We all just forgot huh lol. First ship, Portland series game 7 the unstoppable Shaq had 18 pts, while a young 21 killer said I got yall and lead one of the best comebacks and play off history. If kobe wouldn't of done that we wouldn't of even went to the finals.
Nick's opinion is contradictory based on his very list. He said Magic was better than Kobe. Okay, let's see his list. Magic won only 5 championships playing with the second or third best player of all time, Kareem, practically all his career. Kobe Bryant won 5 championships with the ninth best player of all time, Shaq for less than half os his career. Magic had to overcome Bird, the seventh best player of all time. Kobe had to overcome Duncan the fifth best player of all time. So, who had it harder and accomplished more? Yeah, guess it was Kobe.
Ric."here we go on the numbers again"(rolls eyes) Ric. Kobe went through 5 finals.. 3 back to back...2 back to back... (those are numbers my friends... Ric "now we going into intangibles".... "with eyes I saw them.all play (yah we all did lol). this man speaks from his ars.....never bring this man back lol
When people rank Tim Duncan the convo changes to “best PF” or big man, why I don’t know 🤷🏾♂️ he’s not overlooked or under valued it’s just different with him
I love we how touch on Kobe's shooting % and efficiency when we forget how many possessions Kobe had to throw up end of shot clock prayers bc he had teammates doing nothing with the ball. Off-ball movement was lacking, Kobe knew it and more than often had to throw up double team Think about how much you hate it when a co-worker doesn't pull his weight. How frustrating that is. How many teammate interviews where they state " I would just be "stuck" watching Kobe". That's how great the man was.
Not only that. The triangle is sculptured for a big in the post but in the last 5-7 sec for a guard with INTANGIBLE GREATNESS such as MJ and Kobe. For that u need Clutch gene and guts to create ur own shot at the HIGHEST LEVEL.
When Kobe came in the NBA he was seen as a versatile version of Michael Jordan, maybe inefficient scorer but certainly had high IQ and unmatched competitiveness, there should be a list of players with same position to be more fair, cos he was the best guard behind Jordan
You can't have High IQ and decide that jacking up jumpshots with double and triple teams are the right play. He's inefficient cause his basketball IQ is low and often does the wrong play shooting his team out of competition.
@@bolo5190 srsly. People think cause Kobe was a ball hog he never passed? Nope. Think he averages 5-6 assists while being a sg. Among the sg’s those were one of the highest
If you guys wanna do an actual breakdown of Kobe’s shootings you can check his percentages from 5-10 10-20 and so on and it’s the same for other greats and you can breakdown their play style and how they score and make your own decisions instead of listening to others
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time 1. Michael Jordan 2. LeBron James 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 6. Shaquille O'Neal 7. Tim Duncan 14. Kobe Bryant PPG: LeBron RPG: LeBron APG: LeBron SPG: LeBron BPG: LeBron FG%: LeBron 3pt%: LeBron FT%: Kobe TS%: LeBron PER: LeBron WS/48: LeBron VORP: LeBron MVP's: LeBron FMVP's: LeBron Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2) LeBron a better player then Kobe Field goal% LeBron 50.5%✔️ Kobe 44.7% Points scored career LeBron 37,062✔️ Kobe 33,643 Most missed shots in NBA history 1. Kobe Bryant 14,481 2. John Havlicek 13,417 3. Elvin Hayes 13,296 LeBron more points then Kobe Kobe more missed shots then LeBron Total 3pointers made LeBron 2,140✔️ Kobe 1,827 Total Steals career LeBron 2,136✔️ Kobe 1,944 Total Blocks career LeBron 1,041✔️ Kobe 640 Defensive win shares LeBron 75.59✔️ Kobe 50.66 Assists Leader LeBron 1✔️ Kobe 0 Career highs Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record Career highs LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters LeBron 5✔️ Kobe 1 2010 NBA finals Game 7 Lakers 83 Celtics 79 Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points 2013 NBA finals Game 7 Heat 95 Spurs 88 LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings 2011 NBA playoffs Mavericks 4 Lakers 0 Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
@@TheRimasyele Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time 1. Michael Jordan 2. LeBron James 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 6. Shaquille O'Neal 7. Tim Duncan 14. Kobe Bryant PPG: LeBron RPG: LeBron APG: LeBron SPG: LeBron BPG: LeBron FG%: LeBron 3pt%: LeBron FT%: Kobe TS%: LeBron PER: LeBron WS/48: LeBron VORP: LeBron MVP's: LeBron FMVP's: LeBron Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2) LeBron a better player then Kobe Field goal% LeBron 50.5%✔️ Kobe 44.7% Points scored career LeBron 37,062✔️ Kobe 33,643 Most missed shots in NBA history 1. Kobe Bryant 14,481 2. John Havlicek 13,417 3. Elvin Hayes 13,296 LeBron more points then Kobe Kobe more missed shots then LeBron Total 3pointers made LeBron 2,140✔️ Kobe 1,827 Total Steals career LeBron 2,136✔️ Kobe 1,944 Total Blocks career LeBron 1,041✔️ Kobe 640 Defensive win shares LeBron 75.59✔️ Kobe 50.66 Assists Leader LeBron 1✔️ Kobe 0 Career highs Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record Career highs LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters LeBron 5✔️ Kobe 1 2010 NBA finals Game 7 Lakers 83 Celtics 79 Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points 2013 NBA finals Game 7 Heat 95 Spurs 88 LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings 2011 NBA playoffs Mavericks 4 Lakers 0 Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
Kobe is one of the all time greatest defenders, and also the greatest difficult shot maker. The most skilled player ever. Only MJ can compare to his mental toughness. Forget talking about stats in a team game, there are too many variables such as player role/position, what conference are you in, how good is your team, how good is your opponent, injuries, are you single/double/triple covered, what era are you playing in, what rules are in place, how much of your scoring is freethrows, did you score off an assist, were you wide open, did you shoot, layup, oop or dunk, player suspensions/holdouts, are you just doing what your coach told you, numbers/stats don't lie but they can fool you and don't tell the whole story. Just take the offensive/defensive skill set and apply it to a 1v1 game. I would take Kobe over the others, but I would not argue if someone else took MJ, but that's it no one else is close.
How else would you make judgment individually? You can't judge an individual in a team game, if you cannot make a case then it would be idiotic for you to even comment.
Ric what an awful argument - “you just reduce things to numbers” then proceeds to reduce things to number of championships in a row - and also the whole “nucleus thing” it was steady in SA cause of Duncan and turbulent in LA cause of Kobe
Not to mention with all the changes…he never won a SINGLE playoff series with any coach other than Phil Jackson. Boy had 5 coaches and only won with one (the greatest coach EVER)
It was steady in San Antonio because of Pop, are you even serious right now... before Dunacn, the Admiral made that team relevant, and after Duncan, Kawhi kept that team afloat. San antonio always had a knack of grabbing great players. Yes, Duncan was efficient, but great? cmon now... imagine KG or Dirk in those type of environments, and those are only 2 players in his era.
You’ll can have your Duncans and Lebrons, to me Kobe Bryant wore a cape. It was an immense thrill to see him play. He’s the reason why I fell in love with basketball. He’s the 🐐 in my list. Only an opinion. Everyone has their own list.
"He's the reason why I fell in love with basketball" Which is why you'd never be able to create a Top 10 Players of All Time list(or in this case the last 50 years). NBA fans just love their favorites and think that's enough to put them above other players. There's no objectivity involved. Contrary to what Nick said in this video, I don't think there's much of an argument between Duncan and Kobe. Duncan is a greater player and I don't think there's much anyone could say otherwise. His career resume is simply better across the board and his play on the court will never get the credit it deserves.
Kobe had an arsenal of moves and shots, and was guarding your best player. One vs One, Kobe wins! Magic said Kobe is the best Laker. Shaq said it too! LeBron was interviewed saying Kobe was better than him. Kobe killed the Spurs almost every time they played against each other. Not to mention these guys saying Kobe Goat... Iverson McGrady Billups
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time 1. Michael Jordan 2. LeBron James 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 6. Shaquille O'Neal 7. Tim Duncan 14. Kobe Bryant PPG: LeBron RPG: LeBron APG: LeBron SPG: LeBron BPG: LeBron FG%: LeBron 3pt%: LeBron FT%: Kobe TS%: LeBron PER: LeBron WS/48: LeBron VORP: LeBron MVP's: LeBron FMVP's: LeBron Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2) LeBron a better player then Kobe Field goal% LeBron 50.5%✔️ Kobe 44.7% Points scored career LeBron 37,062✔️ Kobe 33,643 Most missed shots in NBA history 1. Kobe Bryant 14,481 2. John Havlicek 13,417 3. Elvin Hayes 13,296 LeBron more points then Kobe Kobe more missed shots then LeBron Total 3pointers made LeBron 2,140✔️ Kobe 1,827 Total Steals career LeBron 2,136✔️ Kobe 1,944 Total Blocks career LeBron 1,041✔️ Kobe 640 Defensive win shares LeBron 75.59✔️ Kobe 50.66 Assists Leader LeBron 1✔️ Kobe 0 Career highs Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record Career highs LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters LeBron 5✔️ Kobe 1 2010 NBA finals Game 7 Lakers 83 Celtics 79 Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points 2013 NBA finals Game 7 Heat 95 Spurs 88 LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings 2011 NBA playoffs Mavericks 4 Lakers 0 Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
Steve Nash has one more MVP, was a better passer than Kobe and was more efficient than Kobe and nobody in the cosmos thinks that Steve Nash was a better player than Kobe. Efficiency doesnt necessarily equate to being a winning formula...the problem is, you need an actual gauge of the sport to understand this and 99% of ppl online talking about basketball have absolutely NO gauge of the sport whatsoever.
He also never averaged more than 19 points a game. That’s a terrible comparison to the topic at hand because Steve Nash was never considered a super super star. He won those mvps because he was a very valuable component of his teams success. The caliber of players in the top ten is insane, so the differences are going to seem meticulous or minute. The truth is that Kobe was always considered around number 8 or 9 until his untimely passing. I love Kobe, but he was not better than MJ, Lebron, Kareem, Magic, or Tim. (IMO Larry, Wilt, and Bill should also be ahead of him, but I see the arguments against it) Edit- also how does efficiency not equate to winning? Russell Westbrook is inefficient and clearly that impacts his winning. Turnovers and missed shots don’t win games, don’t try to sound like a wise guy because that doesn’t even make sense
@@marker7443 youre lying tremendously lol Kobe was in everyones top 5 pre 2013-2014 when sports media started to turn on him. Theres nothing that Tim Duncan cn do better than Kobe Bryant on a basketball court lol and nobody ever saw Tim as even being in the discussion for best player in the world...i can tell u dont watch basketball and u gotta be like younger than 25 to even suggest something so dumb. The “Tim Duncan was better than Kobe” ppl are a new phenomenon that just popped up on the internet over the last 5-6 yrs and its all ppl who dont understand how either of their games translated on the court because their opinions are too heavily influenced by stats and analytics...you guys simply didnt watch basketball during that time and youre too young to realize that youre completely wrong, u dont even understand public sentiment during those years.
now mentioned who Shaq faced in those finals, and how the road TO those finals were dog fights and Kobe was very much needed in all facets during those wars
Exactly. shaq had a mismatch every finals so the team let him exploit it. Kobe was always comparable if not better during the series in the western conference.
Except them 9 routes though them Western Conferences to the Finals was almost pretty as equally bad as Lebrons route to the finals in them Weak East as Magic had several HOF and All stars in them teams but that's maybe something you didn't know. It's ok tho 🙏🏾
@@davidlopez2276 - Magic was 2 - 2 in his last 4 Finals. Won it in '87 and '88. Lost in '89 and '91. And the later losses were largely influenced by Kareem finally being claimed by age and major injuries to Magic and other key players.
Ric basically tears the spurs for being a great team and having multiple reliable pieces but then makes it seem like Kobe 3 peated and went back to back by himself 😂😂😂😂😂 WHAT?!
Not by himself, but with significantly less help than any other all time great that has won back to back championships. And with less help than one lebron for example, has ever had when he won.
@@Sammy-ec8cr I mean... Gasol is widely considered one of the greats at his position for his era, a shoe in for the HoF and made all star teams every year he won a title with the lakers... Of course he wasn't Shaq, but if you mean that Gasol was of minimal help, I want what you are smoking.
@@Sammy-ec8cr gasoline averaged 25pts 10 Reba n 4 assist one of the best passing big men of all time one of the best skilled big men of all time a six man of the year in Odom and Bynum was a very talented center who they got in the top 10 of the draft with other good role players they had the best front court in the league lol
kobes efficiency from 2013 until 2016 was bad cause of all the injurys he had...now in 2022 nobody cares if he was injured and had many low scoring games in his way coming back.but in 2013 he was almost done... his career was over.. nobody cares today..they look on his overall career stats..put his 2013-2016 stats in a mix with his prime days and end of the story..
He was never efficient tho, his best season in terms of efficiencywould be an okay level. There wasn't even ONE season were he reached 47% from the field, efficient scorers like MJ, KD, Steph, Bron, even Magic, Bird etc, all average more than 47% from the field FOR THEIR CAREERS. He just shot a bunch of shots so of course he's gonna make a lot of points, it's kinda like the Harden situation back kn Houston, only that Harden was ALSO more efficient from 3 and the freethrow line.
@@DonkeyKong5479 that TS% sh*t is very flawed. Kobe was never efficient, he was easily a top 10 player in my eyes so I’m only nitpicking because we’re comparing him to LeBron and Tim Duncan but the fact that they were so much more efficient makes it easier to be competitive with lesser talent. It’s part of the reason Lebron Lost Kyrie in 2018 and took the Cavs right back to the finals like nothing ever happened lol you think Kobe is taking Jordan Clarkson & Larry nance and the gang to the finals after the team trades for them at the all star break? Kobe was a monster but all the constant critiquing of Bron has really warped peoples minds.
Duncan better player then Kobe Finals Mvps (individual player) Duncan 3✔️ Kobe 2 ▫️ League Mvps ( individual player) Duncan 2✔️ Kobe 1 ▫️ Total Mvps ( league and finals ) Duncan 5✔️ Kobe 3 ▫️ Rookie of the year Duncan Yes✔️ Kobe No ▫️ Field goal% Duncan 50.6%✔️ Kobe 44.7% ▫️ 1999 NBA playoffs Spurs 4 Lakers 0 Duncan swept Kobe with a prime Shaq ▫️ Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time 1. Michael Jordan 2. LeBron James 3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 4. Magic Johnson 5. Larry Bird 6. Shaquille O'Neal 7. Tim Duncan 14. Kobe Bryant ▫️ Bleacher report has Kobe #14
The kobe take is bad because every premier perimeter player in Kobe's era shot a lower percentage from the field. Is that a coincidence or a byproduct of defense of the time?
Jordan shot a higher percentage during the 80s and 90s. You can’t tell me they played “better defense” during Kobe’s era than hand checking and getting slammed to the ground which happened to Jordan.
That era had everyone thinking Jordan did it by himself. So Kobe’s and Iversons would Chuck when by themself. They forgot about the pippen part so people chucked and the floor wasn’t as spaced. At the same time Lebron was here in 2003. Kobe had some years before him but kobe took more shots when shaq left which is when Lebron was in the league. Lebron has been efficient from day one because of his shot selection. He passes more and chooses different moments to take over only when crucial.
@@odigomez1787 no, that simply says that Jordan was a better player. Also, check the individual numbers from players in the 80s to the 90s. There was a fundamental shift in how basketball was played from the 90s to mid 2000s basketball.
@@fabianmarshall4120 LeBron scores primarily at the rim or from three. He's a below average shooter from everywhere else on the court. LeBron is one of the best finishers the game has ever seen and is a solid three point shooter
Nobody disagrees Pau was a great player. But what people do forget is that before we got Gasol, we already had one of the best records in the league. And that was with essentially the same supporting cast, only key changes were the addition of Fisher and Bynum getting more playing time over Kwame. It was only when Bynum was injured that we traded for Gasol and the rest is history. I ask you this who is downplayed more Gasol or Bosh? In my opinion Bosh was in every way just as great as Gasol, and Lebron had that level of player as a third option.
@@chito4 Bosh was better than Gasol bro and that was the sentiment that everyone had at the time. Bosh is a better shooter all around, faster, more athletic and a better defender. Ppl downplay Bosh essentially to bolster the optics of Lebron...
Once you dominate for 10+ years, no one should have a longevity argument over you. It should be just apex and consistency. To me, that's why the Duncan/Kobe debate is so close. Kobe clearly has the higher apex but Duncan was constantly impacting his teams success more (Spurs never had a drop-off)
Well said, I understand if someone’s says Kobe peak is better. But I refuse to accept when someone says Kobe’s career was better. It’s simply not true. The Spurs never had a drop-off because Duncan had every positive intangible you can wish for in a star player. The Lakers had a drop-off partly because of Kobe’s immaturity and selfishness. Other things contributed but Kobe wasn’t innocent at all.
1) If you are using Duncan 50 season argument you must apply it to everyone on the list which in this case Duncan beats them all. Stop creating arguments to discredit Kobe's career. Also Kobe has hit more game winners than anyone in history but now it's only playoffs that count in LeBron favor. You us Shaq's finals numbers but fail to mention Kobe destroyed teams in the west but against the east there were no centers that could stop Shaq so obviously a good team player would use that advantage to win that's what the Lakers did. Nicks points are outrageous and bias at best. Also go ahead and point out LeBron's playoff blemishes while you're at it as well. People just pick topics to demean Kobe. You wouldn't say Kobe beat Duncan 4-2 in playoff series so I guess he's better. Kobe 7 finals appearances in 10 years doesn't help but Magic 9 in 12 years. Kobe also basically switched his entire team and did a 3 trips without a top 75 player on Duncan's watch...with a broken finger.
Speaking of making up facts, both MJ & Lebron have hit more game winners, in history, than Kobe. This includes both regular season and playoffs. And since Lebron has a winning record against Kobe, that makes Lebron better according to what you said. Also Kobe has more Finals appearances than MJ, so I guess he’s better than MJ? Your logic is inconsistent and untrue.
Idk who that other guy is forgot his name already but he virtually said that his perception and opinion are more definitive, precise and credible than any statistics haha
this gets overlooked so often on how he was able to take horrible team to the playoffs in the strong western conference. The moment he gets an all-star (pau gasol): reaches the finals, and then goes back to back. Goes to show how great Kobe can be with a great teammate even if that player isn't a superstar. Give him a superstar (shaq) and you get 3x champs
i believe that if Kobe hadn't started his career with Shaq, he would have ended with 4-5 rings regardless. There was a good 4-5 years of his prime that was wasted, at the same time though, he did. get 3 with Shaq
Honestly probably the highest nicks ever ranked Kobe. I think as time goes on and people see these talented players lacking that will Kobe had is why he’s moving up. By no means does Kobe have the stats but his will to win almost unmatched. Also his journey was pretty unique and difficult. Not too many guys even play 2 50 win teams in a playoff run. Kobe had 3 runs the lakers played a 50 win team from the first round to the finals! At the end of the day legendary in his own way no doubt
@@alankoslowski9473 To u maybe. Why Lebron is in the conversation. Lebron won all his his championship with a top ten player next to him. As for Kobe his last 2 championship was not with a top 10 player.
@@malusintsele2552 LJ did way more to elevate his entire team. While they didn't win, in 2007 and 2015 he carried a Cavs team of scrubs to the Finals (2015 Irving and Love were both injured). After Shaq left the Lakers were terrible for a few seasons until they got Gasol and Odom. Odom was a very good and Gasol was one of the best Centers in the league. Not all time greats, but very good players. Overall Kobe might have been a better shooter, but LJ is better at everything else: passing, rebounding, and defense. Kobe is the 2nd best shooting guard behind MJ while LJ is the best small forward ever. Kobe is great, but not in the GOAT discussion.
@@malusintsele2552 that laker team was deep. Pau Gasol was considered the best scoring big in the game Bynum was the best pure center in the game . Odum was a 6,10” wing . Ron Artest the best defensive player in the game . Derek fisher smart defensive player and hit big shots and Kobe and others that came off the bench that was ready . Kobe was the leader of that team but he had lots of help
@@youngfire9361 Look don't try to make these players more than what they were. Bynum was not Boogie cousins at his prime. There were decent players to say there were deep that is a stretch. You can replace all of them except Kobe. Without Kobe that team could not be mentioned in WCF let alone a championship. They are NBA players after all but at the end this right here!!!! was all Kobe.
I must correct myself. I said it wasn’t educational. But I did learn one thing from Rick. In sport you use the numbers as facts so you can measure success. Rick argument is that you should ignore the stats and go by who you like more. This one is gold. The ridiculousness is reaching unbelievable heights 😂😂😂😂
Kobe is #4 on my list. I’m tired of hearing about efficiency. It literally a argument that people who never played ball make. Kobe is so inefficient that if he takes 20 shots he is going to make 8.5 of them and score 24-25 points. Meanwhile Steph someone we consider to be one of the most efficient players ever is gonna make 9.5 shots and score 27-28. Like we r talking about 2-3 points per game difference. Efficiency is so overrated that it’s not funny. That’s the difference between a inefficient Kobe and a AllTime efficient Steph. 2-3Ppg and 1 shot. Stop using that as a argument.
@@terrystyles3486 like bruh Bill Russell averaged 14 ppg get him the tf out of my replies that dude is the most overrated basketball player in the history of the game
@@RedEyeItachi Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in NBA history hes not even top 10 player all time You talking about Bill Russell 15 ppg like scoring only stat you bum
Total Achievements: (Titles / MVPs / Finals MVPs / 1st All-NBA / 1st All-DEF / Scoring Titles) 1) Jordan = 46 2) LeBron = 31 2) Kareem = 31 4) Kobe = 30 5) Duncan = 28 6) Wilt = 23 7) Magic = 20 8) Russell = 19 9) Shaq = 18 10) Bird = 17 11) Hakeem = 16 12) Durant = 15 There's a bunch of players with 14 Achievements. Stephen Curry has 13 Achievements. At the age of 27, Giannis has the best shot to make it into the Top 10...he already has 12 Achievements
Tim Duncan is probably still my favorite player ever. He really was the model of consistency until he got older. Kobe, meanwhile, was as much a losing factor as he was a winning factor. He shot us out of wins so many times I just wanted to tear my hair out in frustration. Was he entertaining? Yes, but it was hard not to see him as a copycat. I already got to see Michael play during his prime, and watching Kobe be less consistent, less efficient, more annoying, and more eccentric was an obvious downgrade. Meanwhile, Tim lacked a lot of the more obnoxious attributes most NBA players have: the ego, the entitlement, the lack of self-awareness. Timmy was humble, composed, and yet just as much of stone cold killer as Kobe. I think Tim's demeanor meant he would have less fans in the league, but that says more about the average casual basketball fan than it does about either Kobe or Timmy.
Great comment. If you were putting a team together, and you wanted to pick a player who’d give you the best chance of contending for a title every season, for the longest number of consecutive seasons… there’s not a lot of names you’d put ahead of Timmy.
@@TheHarvbinger nah I'd take a few ppl over Timmy. He's the Tom Brady of the nba. He's had the luxury of having the same team, teammates and coach since he got drafted. He's a system player
@@Von.NorthEnd The only player on every Spurs title winning team was Timmy, and he only had 2 teammates who were on 4/5. They won across eras with him totally adapting his game to account for declining athleticism and provide what those very different teams needed from their big man. If anything he’s the exact opposite of a “system player” - a “system player” is a guy who racks up huge stats because the style the team plays makes him look good, or who excels because he’s good at a specific role the system needs filled, but it’s a role where it’s not that hard to find a guy to replace anyone you lose. Timmy impacted the game in a way his relatively meh stats could never truly capture, and in case you haven’t noticed the Spurs haven’t exactly found it very easy to replace him. Timmy WAS the system, if anything.
Lmao that's just not true. Modern NBA players are way more efficient than previous eras. In the 40s, the league average FG % was below 30 😂 it's slowly increased relatively consistently ever since.
He also took some of the most inefficient shots but still hit them at about league average. Which looking purely at numbers doesn't tell the story of how impactful that is when you can just hand someone the ball with 5 seconds on the clock and they can produce something even when double teamed.
Kobe is the second best Shooting guard of all time behind Michael Jordan and third is Dwayne Wade. Kobe was my MJ of 2000 era. His shooting % was decreasing after injury of achilles tendon. But it's tough to compare numbers with other all time great players. You just can't compare SG shooting % and pure Center or Forward % shoting procentage. Kobe was like looney toons carton player (not Lebron), his shoots were one of toughest in the face of opponent and his opponents was really good defenders, of course they were many bad decisions of shoot taking and some people never like that. He play both eras, era with almost no defense and era with hand checking. He play on both end of the floors. He have many injuries during his carrer, but still he adjust his gameto be the best version of himself . People always disrespect other players from a championship team, to win a championship in basketball team sports, you need all guys to play defense and do his job, all of them. Of course kobe had Shaq, one of the most dominant duo of all time. But he still manage to win championship without Shaq, and then of course have Gasol, Fisher, Odom, bynum,ariza, artest... All great players who ever win championship, never win just of themselves, but they need support team behind their backs. What I never liked is the point that he win only one season MVP award, beacuse we all know he deserve it more than just one. MVP awards were geting players with one of the best team in east or west conference, but in today's game that is not the only criteria. If I had to choose all time great list, he will be in my top 3, behind Lebron James and MJ. I don't think Duncan have better carrer, but i think he plays more time with great supporting cast like Kobe Bryant have. If you want to choose the best list of all time greats it's always tough, they were many great players who plays in different eras, all have ups and downs in their carrers and in their game. But still we must apreciate what they do and what they accomplished and respect that. We all had different opinions about players and we like some guys more than others. But sometimes numbers never tell you the end of the picture.
allen iverson >>>>>wade dwayne wade has team accolades and thats it wade only had 3-4 seasons as an mvp caliber player at best if you think avging 19-22.1 pts as a guard is superstar numbers you must be out your mind wade may won fmvp but he was far from being a superstar, his second season and the other 2 titles he wasn't even the best player on the team iverson prime was much longer than wade dispute having a shorter career also iverson was better than kobe in the 90s and early 2000s and won mvp, 4 scoring and 3 stl titles
Kobe played both sides of the ball and was amazing on defense, they didnt even mention that once in this debate. He may have took a lot of ill advised shots which knocked his efficiency down but the guy just had supreme confidence like that. The last two championships he won, the 09' and 10's lakers teams, those teams were nothing special man. But Kobe still got the job down. Got Kobe in my top 3 all time.
Kobe played in BY FAR the most inefficient era when even top big men didn’t shoot 50% a lot of the time. And his last three injury riddled seasons destroyed his averages. Duncan over Kobe is hilarious
@@kylertatumtv9443 league avg fg% was 40-41 when Kobe played compared to 44-45% the last decade…Duncan for his career is only 50.6%, he had plenty of seasons at 49% or lower which isn’t that efficient for all time big man but nobody talks about that for some reason
Why nobody points out the fact that the Lakers has beaten the Spurs in a playoffs series 4-2 times and one of those series lost Kobe didn't play in because of the Achilles. So that means Kobe is actually 4-1 vs the Spurs when it mattered the most. And Nick pointing out that Duncan never had a losing season, ok but Duncan never won back 2 back titles, never 3 peated. Kobe 3 peated and won back 2 back titles. Kobe Won his 5th ring before Duncan won his. I like tim but with all I just pointed out he can't be ranked higher than Kobe
This is a generational/preference conversation. The list is subjective and it is Nick's list. That being said, when listening to guys that PLAYED (and not one of these guys on the panel have), they have a high level of respect for both Timmy and Bean. Kenyon Martin says he could never rush Timmy but also could never figure Kobe out. Big Ticket says something similar. Matt and Stack say Kobe was the best player of their era. I think what we, the casuals, have to understand is that the players who played against Bean, respected his killa instinct which is why alot of players of that era rank Bean over Timmy. My personal preference would be the same, but I'm a SoCal/Laker/Kobe guy. And I hated the Spurs during that era BECAUSE of how great they were. So I lack objectivity as well.
@@victorbrown3570, that's a good way to put it. His swag and style of play. Which was alot more flashy than Timmy's. Timmy was "boring", but a MONSTER and a silent killer, in his own right.
The argument Ric made on Kobe's behalf vs Duncan is the same thing you can say about Lebron vs Kobe....This man said Kobe didn't have that nucleus of a good organization and good coaching and that's why he puts Kobe ahead of Duncan smh
Lebrons a coach killer and he colludes to create super teams...Spo is a HOF coach w or without Bron btw and Bron wanted him fired lol. BronTardds are the most delusional, hypocritical sports fans of all time. And i say “sports fans” VERRYYYYY loosely...
Part of Kobe’s inefficiencies came bc he always played with a traditional big clogging the paint.. unlike Lebron..who always had a big that could shoot the 3.. going all the way back to big Z. todays game is more about spacing. If you think Kobe couldn’t be more efficient, you’re fooling yourself.. & since we talking about efficiency, I’m sure Kobe makes up with his FG percentage from the field at the free throw line. I’m not a Lebron hater but analysts like Nick Wright never use their own criteria against Lebron
Listen to Flippin Bats: foxs.pt/flipbats
If Nick is gonna talk about Kobe inefficiency then he better talk about Lebrons Lack of efficiency his whole career when it comes to Defense.
They won’t bring up the fact of what that era was that Kobe was playing in because they know that it was an era where everyone was insufficient Because it was a way more defensive league than this one And it was zone basketball which is meant to stop an individual player from getting off Just a bunch of haters on this show for Kobe it’s disgusting go rewatch basketball
Duncan was boring to watch , Kobe was the most skillfull player of all time . At the time when Kobe was playing why was Kobe more the super star and the focus of the NBA but not Duncan. The Spurs were just the Spurs a team but hate him or love Kobe he was the helm of superstar of the NBA just as was Jordan. Why now is Duncan suddenly higher than Kobe. If you commentators really like some one its not ok to feed us with your favourites just because you have access to the broadcasting service. Why dont you carry out a survey in the NBA public vote to let the public decide who the best player was. Kobe was more feared on the basketball court than Duncan and I was not even a fan of the Lakers and Kobe but he is higher than LBJ and Tim Duncan is the joke in this arguement. For crying out loud Shaq was not close to a player Kobe was he could not even shoot a free throw and his game was more like wrestling than basketball. Totally disgusting just people who used size advantage are even considered great players for putting up unfair numbers. On 360 vision talent who is better than Kobe on the level of difficulty of the shots he took and made them. Your boring list is boring us Kobe was the altimate entertainer . On charecter i honestly did not like Kobe but cannot deny his tallent he is second to Jordan only by way of championships.
Nick go ask duncan who was better
Shaq would've won the same 3 in LA w/ McGrady, Vince, Wade, Reggie, Ray, etc...
I think the biggest knock on Kobe was his lack of efficiency. But Kobe did play elite defense which often gets overlooked.
So did others that played in his era and those before him
Kobe played great defense for like 5 years then coasted and would turn it on. Which is what most good players do to be fair but he was no MJ or Hakeem or even Tim Duncan defensively
Oh for real I didn’t know he shot a low percentage.
@@brandenhill8426 so he coasted and made all those all defensive teams. Impressive to me 🤷🏾♂️
@@brandenhill8426 first team all defense 9 times and 12 total selections Kobe was locking up dudes even at 34 years old
Kobe’s inefficiency comes with the fact that he loves to take shots when he was double or triple teamed. As a Kobe fan, this was also my frustration during his playing days but I can’t complain much. His ability to hit those tough shots also gave his fans plenty of memorable and timeless highlights.
He won 5 titles while being one of the best entertainers this league has seen since MJ. All is good.
1. Now Imagine how Good was Jordan and his efficiency in an era where it was even tougher to shoot 50% from the field especially for a 6'5 225 Guard playing that style.
2. Kobes all time stats are impacted negatively by some other factors
- not as long of a prime as some other players. He played 20 years. A backup in his first 2 and washed post achilles. So thats about 5-6 years that make his 20 yr career look worse than it was. Lebron has kinda been on his prime and an all star level player every single yr and that efficiency and stats been high every yr. If you isolate Kobes top 13-15 seasons where he was in his prime it would look better
- the era was tough in early 2000s
- he took many bad shots. Thats on him too though
- he had some awful teams post Shaq pre Pau Gasol. Kwame, Luke Walton and Smush Parker was no.2, 3 and 4 in minutes for Lakers one yr. Imagine that for a minute. Same Happened to Lebron in 2015 finals with a 38% percentage. Dude was alone after game 1 and the defense could focus on him more. Its hard to shoot 50% that way. 2007 finals he was 35% as well vs Spurs. Same situation for Lebron playing iso ball.
-Kobe was a great shooter imo. Especially from 3. The free throw peecentage is the truest test of how good a shooter actually is. The ultimate truth teller. No wonder Steph is no.1 all time. Can't trick the free throw line. Its the same for everybody.
3. That Being Said - I got Kobe 5th. I just think this FG% stuff is overblown. He could really hit 3s. Imo - better than MJ or Lebron. His mid range game though wasn't as good as MJ (62% from midrange on yr in playoffs). His inside game not as good as MJ or Lebron. His FT game better than MJ slighly and way better than Lbj.
Want to find out how well dudes shoot - put them on the free throw line
Magic was an amazing FT shooter thiugh. That thing was sure.
@@erikpuka2627 it wasnt tougher, the illegal defence made defence way easier for iso players to score on. many actual players and analysts have said this
Man I loved watching Kobe play. It was a work of art. Curry has filled in the void.
@@khalxd1991 it was way tougher man. Way tougher. Listen to players who played in both eras. KG for ex. Lebron even. Shaq even. Luka has proven that theory to be true. Its illegal to play defense now PERIOD. The slightest contact is a foul. Lane is wide open. You can't stop people from penetrating now. The thing thats tougher now is playing 1 on 1 defense on an island cause you can't touch anything. Offense never been any easier. You got Westbrook dropping hige stats. Harden even. A washed Kobe put up 60. A washed Jamal Crawford put up 50. An Ancient Wade could do work. Lance Stephenson came out of China and gave dudes bussiness semi washed. Its illegal to play defense now in general
I'll add he didn't cheat the fans bc he probably played with more injuries than anyone alltime.
Amidst all the subjectivity on this topic, let’s just acknowledge the overarching fact - whichever player you have as your goat or whichever players you have in your top 10 - these guys made you feel all types of emotions and made you fall in love with the game of basketball. What makes them great is the ability to fully captivate their audience and forever occupy a place in our memories. Respect to greatness 🤙🏾
Well said man 👍
Get off your knees man! Oh..wipe your chin too!
This is THE COMMENT. too much emotion is involved inn these posts
For sure
That is a fact 👌
People fall in love with the drive and determination of Kobe. IMO he has the greatest comeback story in sports history after the ‘03 case all while rising to the top of the league.
Correct
kobe the goat
Beat that shi
Greatest comeback is jordan retiring to play baseball. Then coming back to win 3 more consecutive rings. Kobe only did that once by the way.
I also loved the redeem team documentary they did and how he was one of the key players that helped USA win gold again, that was a nice comeback story too and I’m glad he was apart of it
Ric has an average on his takes like a baseball player…
Duncan is a great example of high IQ, efficiency and teamwork. One of my favorite players ever.
Humility as well.
Head down, work hard, team first.
Seemingly a great dude and great player.
Also look at the quality of the players that came up under him: Ginobli, Parker, Kawhi. His character was of the highest quality.
And he was better than Kobe
His teammate quality was waaaaay higher
@@Cheif_Espada Umm - San Antonio drafted those players. All great players have to play with drafted teammates and help make them better. Great players don't demand trades because they don't have the ability to make teammates better and want "all star" free agent talent to "help them" (i.e. Kobe Bryant and LeBron James).
Ric got absolutely BODIED 😭😭he shot down stats and THEN shot down INTANGIBLES??
GG dawg
This was hilarious to watch
Intangibles outside of the game.
Ric is from that old school where you just get to lie and no one checks you on it
A lot of ppl don't realize if Duncan was not playing in a system in San Antonio for most of his career and he plays on a team with more freestyle play, he more likely would have put up bigger numbers in terms of points and assists specifically and Duncan is one the best passing big man of alltime.
Totally agree
kobe is 2 all time
Duncan should most certainly be ahead of Kobe.
@@angel-ij4xv NO
@@oneball1926 please kobe is the goat
Duncan was the system and people use that as a way to detract from him…dude they won 3 in 5 years from 03-07.
They made the WCF too I believe in the years they didn’t win.
Exactly..just like steph is THE system at GS and why is that a knock on such players..it takes something unique about your game for a team to build THE system around you..why couldn't kobe be THE system? Cos he couldn't willfully make his teammates better at least early into his career. Overall, Duncan is slightly better than kobe as a player. In terms of competitive will kobe was slightly higher than duncan.
You hit it on the head!
Never went Back to Back
Duncan is great, but because they never went back to back, they were never seen as dominant. Doing it back to back, or three-peating is immensely more challenging because of the wear and tear on your body. It's the same reason why the Lakers/Heat flamed out in 2021.
Kobe went to the finals with Shaq 3 straight times and without Shaq 3 straight times! Kobe is 5 and 7 in the Finals💪 RIP Mamba.
Shaq went to finals BEFORE he even joined the Lakers
@@BrandonClark-StocksPassports Still didn’t go more times without Kobe like how Kobe went more times without Shaq.
Shaq won finals mvp 3 times and league mvp while playing with kobe…no one ever won anything while playing with lebron
@@vensonj So how many championships would LeBron have if he never left the cavs the first time?
Never took a pay cut to win and still ended up with 5
Clutch time actually isn’t just one shot alone. I thought clutch moments happened within the last 4-5 minutes of a game. Nit picking clutch to one last shot is crazy to me.
Facts
This is the dumbest thing ever so Duncan isn’t clutch cuz he was beating ppl heads in ?
Lebron still has more. Clutch time is within 2 minutes at the end of the game
Bron is still more clutch in last 5
@EricGarcia-fx3xs you know who has most career game winners all time with 36? You know how many lebron has?
Kobe 12 times All-Defence (tied most all time). These analysts always forgot that.
Except Duncan has the record with 15 selections. I think what you mean is 9 FIRST team selections, most all time tied with MJ Garnett and I think also Gary Payton
@@PearlJamGuy10 only KG and Kobe have 9 selections...still tied for 1st.
@@twokidsfromthebronx9844 mj has 9... pretty sure payton does too.
Exactly
@@PearlJamGuy10 15???? For defense
Nobody ever wants to talk about the Olympics. When team USA was getting SMACKED until coach K went and got KOBE...
Nobody cares about Olympic basketball 🤣🤣 but I feel you on that definitely remember
The Olympics are a joke.
Who really watches Olympic basketball?
@Jose Gomez they care when USA loses because they love being miserable
That’s a fact . Tim Duncan was on that 04 team that got spanked
When Kobe was on it
Instant Gold 😭😭💯
Broussard: Kobe shot 44% for his career and never shot over 47% for a season with Shaq drawing doubles.
Nick: shaq scored 36 a game on 60% shooting for those finals
Rick: oh you guys and numbers
Lmao what a joke, all Rick cares about are his feelings about these players. He doesn’t like lebron so he isn’t top 5, he does like Kobe so he’s easily top 5.
That’s what people say wen the numbers don’t support there argument. Some debates are opinion based but we know who’s better immediately wen we compare certain players. The only thing that’s objective is what you like personally
Ric had to pull that card because he knows he’s having his emotional and subjective argument absolutely dumped on
Kobe was being double teamed!!!! What wtf!!!
Shaq and Lebron lived in the paint so of course their percentages are higher. Steph is at 47 percent for his career and we calling him the greatest shooter of all time. See how numbers can be deceiving.
To be fair that's how most if not all people structure thier lists, then they use numbers to try justify their points. If it's too much of a stretch they let it go.
Nick and Bru - give stats, accomplishments, intangibles to defend their points
Ric - “I saw them play”
😂😂🤣🤣🤣
@@omarshafi786 lol only nerds dont understand that stats dont tell the entire story
And Thts true , westbrooks stats over all will be better than curry’s , but the ppl who watched them play will tell you curry was undoubtedly better than westbrook, but you will have these stat nerds tht look at only stats and bring up numbers , nd we will then say “you had to see it to understand “
@@shun8733 nah westbrook's efficiency and turnovers are horrible and the stats can tell you he cant shoot. Even looking at stats you can tell curry is much better but yes it does help to watch the games too. That being said its equally as stupid to dismiss all stats just because you "watched them play"
@@shun8733 Westbrook is inaccurate af and the stats say that, wtf you talkin' about?
"I don't want numbers I don't want intangibles I want the eye test... my eyes and only My eyes" - Ric n Skip
All of these analysts go from one extreme to the other. Some are too stats heavy and some are too intangibles heavy. The answer is somewhere in the middle.
He pretty much just said I like Kobe more. Watching him play he seemed better, with literally no argument. how is he even and analyst. He didn't analyze. He just said a statement based on literally nothing.
There are plenty of numbers. Go watch Skap Attack :)
@@ludvigwittgenstein6469skap attack is a Kobe meat rider and LeBron detractor. At least offer up a good basketball YT channel that keeps things fair
There's nothing wrong with weighting the eye test very heavily. That said, you can't really have the eye test without taking into account intangibles.. intangibles are the things you see with your own eyes but can't place on a stat sheet.
Nick: "you don't want the numbers or the intangibles, what are we allowed to use?" 🤣perfect victory!
LBJ is the best took kobe 4-5years to avg over 26
Lmfaooooooo facts. Rick was hanging on by a thread 😂
Numbers don’t always tell the whole story and jus cus Nick said this opinion doesn’t mean anything for the most part anything Nick says about lebron is not bias at all lol
If you wanna use numbers that means Lebron still isn’t the best and is arguably top5
@@supasav6667 Kobe was playing with Shaq he could have easily average 25 plus stop it 😂
People don’t give Kobe enough credit for his defense and those 2 finals in 3 years
3 finals in 3 years 2/3 record
people give Kobe too much credit for his defense, he was average defender.
And rebounding🤷🏾♂️
@@idontknowhowtojapa lmao 12 all defense selections but he’s a average defender tell me your a clown without telling me your a clown
seriously like who did he have on those teams? Pau Gasol and a bunch of role players. None of those teams were as stacked as any of the teams you see today. KD Kyrie and Harden CANT EVEN GET TO THE FINALS
What part of 8 straight finals don't people get?
And as far as Duncan, he's not rated by all because he wasnt flashly
But see the difference is Lebron was 3-5 in those Finals meanwhile Duncan was 5-1.
Kobe and Duncan played at the same time, and no one ever stated Duncan was as good as Kobe….
@@3liteshadwgamer640 1. Yes they did and 2. Because people were obsessed with flashy play and Kobe is undeniably the flashier player.
@@3liteshadwgamer640 Duncan won 2 league mvps, and led the spurs to 2 championships while Kobe was playing with a top 10 all time player. Duncan was the most boring superstar of all time he never got the respect he deserved
What part of the "LEAST"ern Conference, as it was known at the time, don't you get? No one respects cake walking past the Hawks and the Paul George/Roy Hibbert Pacers as some holy accomplishment to be held up amongst all-time great achievements
Kobe DOMINATED the slowest paced, most aggressively played defensive era in NBA history....
No he didn’t. Shaq did
They embarrassed this man he couldn’t even keep a straight face 😂
You're a goof if you think that🤦🏾♂️😂
Nah you tweaking. Ric bucher was cooking them
@John Smith Agreed
@John Smith Nick and Chris aren't 2000s though. I'd argue people rank Kobe higher now then they did when he was alive. God bless the dead Kobe not top 5
@@nsmith3128 kobe been top 5 all time since 2011, it has nothing to do with his death
Ric Butcher ALWAYS has terrible takes in my opinion. Everyone else I agree with but Ric it's like "What? How is this man still here?"
The worst of them all including Skip
He was wrong using his own metrics…
Lebron undoubtedly wins any eye test against Kobe Bryant, and Tim Duncan’s resume literally equals Kobe’s resume IN THE SAME EXACT ERA.
@@KeefChief_ If that’s true then why have most nba players that played against both of them, say Kobe is better
No fr tho lol
It is his opinion. Doesn't make it fact. Also, I agree with him that Kobe is in the top 5. Again, my opinion, and everyone else has theirs. However, MJ is my favorite of all time and also who I consider the GOAT.
Kobe took more contested deep mid range shots than anyone especially at his time period . He shot a high percentage for someone always so heavily contested. Him shooting so many contested shots made him even more lethal in the playoffs . This is why numbers are bs unless you look at the advanced metrics to the type of shots they were compared to the rest of the nba . I think his effectiveness on tough shot making is ridiculously understated and it's disgusting that they just just look at raw number data . Just like when they said harden is the best isolation player of all time .
Nitpicking stats.
kobe the goat
Ur Words are Like those of the Quran!…💯💯💯
He took contested shots cuz he was a ballhog 😂😂😂
Thats also why he was so inefficient lol
Tim vs Kobe is a position paradox. That's like smaller scale version of Kareem vs Jordan.
“ Kobe didn’t have that nucleus of having the same head coach & Duncan never had a down year “ but when it comes to Lebron it’s “ he can’t will his team on his own “. Man pick a side.
Lol Lebron had mo williams
@@johnnyrockets7543
You forgot
D Wade
Bosh
Shaq
Kyrie
K-Love
AD
Dwight
Westbrook
Carmelo
D-Rose
IT
Ben Wallace
Rondo
@@manniesupasport7977 your awareness is concerning
@@manniesupasport7977 how many of them in their prime, healthy playing at perennial all nba / all star level
1 year of D Wade all nba 3
1 year of AD all nba 2
1 year of Kyrie all nba 3
2 year of CB all star
@@manniesupasport7977 go home bruh….this man named Shaq and Drose as star teammates or something oh wait Isaiah Thom……nah bruh said Ben Wallace!!???yooooooo I’m done
There is a clear double standard when comparing different players. LeBron is consistently down-graded because of Heat's loss to Mavs in 2011. However, Kobe and Shaq simply get passes for the 2004 meltdown against the Pistons. Both finals results are excellent examples that teams with good supporting casts win championships, not individual stars.
Lebron went from 26ppg to 17ppg in the Finals. He disappeared. He was the clear best player on the team (and in the NBA) but hid under the spotlight making himself the 3rd option. Still, the Heat had 4 players scoring over 10ppg with their big 3 + Mario Chalmers pitching in 11.8ppg. Their big 3 combined for 62.8ppg in the Finals compared with 70.9 in the regular season.
The Lakers were not a deep team at all and Karl Malone was injured. The 3rd highest scoring player was Derek Fisher at 6.4ppg. Shaq and Kobe combined for 49.2ppg. This was actually above their regular season average of 45.5ppg.
There is no double standard. Lebron had an epic meltdown. Shaq, Kobe & the Lakers were simply outclassed.
the lakers 3 peat though it was unlikely they would would win 4 in a row lebron lost in first appearance in the finals with the heat
They had already lost in 2003 in the 2nd round so there was no chance to win 4 in a row.
@@rizahawkeye5912 Interesting counterpoints. However, your argument assumes that the opposition is constant. It is not. The 2011 Mavs were great defensively, deeper and more experienced. You can say the same argument about the 2004 Lakers. Not very deep, but in contrast, they were more experienced than the Pistons. I still can't see why the explanation "Epic meltdown" is more viable than "Mavs defense adapted to their opponents". Team cohesion takes time, getting the suitable skill set with the supporting cast takes time. In 2012, the Heat got a better supporting cast, and their results improved.
@@MrClebophd it also helped that they played a young, untested OKC in those finals.
I think a lot of people forget that without Kobe the Lakers vs Pacers finals goes 7 games. Shaq fouled out in OT of Game 4 and it was 100% Kobe who won that game for LA and kept that series from being tied 2-2 back when game 5 would have been at Indy and the Pacers realistically could have taken a 3-2 lead and only need to steal one of the last two at LA.
... And that he was also injured at the time
But Nick said they ddnt need a closer 😐😐🤣
Nick Wright literally lied on tv 😂😂😂🤦🏾
Without Shaq the Lakers dont even get out of the first round.
Thank you man for speaking up for Kobe and point out things that so many of these analysts overlook when it comes to him.
These guys are haters what they never mention is that Kobe won all 5 of his titles with a BIG 2 not Big3 LeBron & Duncan both got 1 title each with a big2 the rest are Big3
@@spartanrealah2121 yeah and aging dwade and bosh don’t equal shaq 😂 also ric didn’t make a single point other than that Kobe was better
@@atake_plays7784 Manu and Tony also don’t equal Shaq
@@danielburdisso1483 thats irrelevant
@@atake_plays7784 you know i was just adding to your point right? I wasn’t disagreeing with you
Nick fails to realize Kobe was nba all defense 12 times and 9 times first team defense. That's more than any other guard and second all time.
Yes the Media just wanted Kobe's name to be recognized to the point they put him over defensive specialist Ron Artest. Is anyone actually going to believe that Kobe is a better defender than Ron Artest?
I Saw Kobe And Duncan At The Same Time And I Never For A Second Thought Duncan Was Better Than Kobe
1997 - 2005 I take Duncan
2007 - later i take Kobe
Does anyone think Duncan is better than Kobe outside of these media talking heads? I don't think I've met one lol
Nobody did. Duncan benefitted from the better organization and put talent around him consistently. How many future HOFers did TD play with vs the number of future HOFers Kobe played with?
Right nobody ever said Duncan was the best player in the Nba at no point
I think KG was right there with Duncan, if he had been on those spurs teams he’d have multiple rings as well. Sucks his prime was wasted with terrible teams
Nobody is devaluing Kobe in the 3peat but when you have a teammate that averaged 37,17, and 7 you are the 2nd banana. Also people call Kobe so clutch, he would take the shot…every time but he missed more go ahead shots than anyone.
He's played 20 years. Thats why hes missed the most. How is that hard to understand 🤔
Plus he had several down years.
@@christiannieto9827 lebron also is gonna play 20 years and is considered un clutch but he has less misses than Kobe
You're just talking about those Finals runs. They would've never made it to the Finals without Kobe averaging 30+ & running through The Spurs, Kings, Trailblazers, etc; KOBE dominated & closed those series at 21, 22, 23 years of age.
@@travisblair3189 just stop bro it don't even matter when people already got they mind made up......they can't even name any center shaq went up against in the finals without Google cause they was all BUMS
Kobe was an incredible player, definitely one of the greats.....but I am freaking amazed that no one is remembering that he had not only Shaq but also Horace Grant, Ron Harper, and Robert Horry on those teams! You cannot tell me the Spurs had a better lineup.
🤣 David Robinson and Tim Duncan Malik Rose Antonio Daniels Avery Johnson Stephen Jackson Speedy Claxton Derek Anderson but ok
@@AngelDay1101 Your telling me you think the 2001-2003 Spurs had a better team than the 2001 -2003 Lakers?!? What about when the had Karl Malone, Gary Paxton, and Rick Fox?
@@donaldseigel4101 players and team is different. Chemistry
@@AngelDay1101 C'mon, with Phil Jackson as coach, man that was an all star team. The Lakers swept everyone in 2001. Tim Duncan was a better player, but the Lakers were a better team.
@@donaldseigel4101 really and popavich wasn't already a champ. That 01 team had 3 eventual hall of famers and a defensive stopper in Bruce Bowen. They had Stephen Jackson Tony Parker Malik Rose Steve Smith great team with Robinson and Duncan
This was, objectively, one of Nick's best takes. Hate him or not, but Nick roasted Rick B.
He cooked him foreal
Bec he talked 50% of the time and Father Brousaard 30% so there u go.
It's the Nick fake Show!
ABSOLUTELY FALSE‼️
I guess we watched a different episode because I saw Nick talk over Rick pretty much the entire time. But I can see why most people would think that's dominating a conversation because there are a lot of morons out there that think he who shouts the loudest wins. Derp.
I think Rick beat nick wright's argument he took him to school what you talking bout fool facts.
Rick wouldn't take Shaq in his prime over Kode? This is why people make up the eye test.. because you can't argue with a ghost stat "eye test"
Eye test is essentially “I’m right you’re wrong” based off of biased opinions and trying to force them on others lol
I would take Shaq over any player in their prime ..does that mean he's greater then MJ? Smdh 🤦🏾♂️
@@moisesfigueroa6390 me too. Nobody is stopping shaq and i mean nobody literally
@@malikrevis6896 I would never take Shaq over Kobe. Kobe 3 peat with Shaq and Kobe wasn't even in his primes. Soon as Kobe was in his primes he went to 3 straight finals without Shaq. What 3peat did Shaq do when he left Kobe? Don't worry I'll wait
@@moisesfigueroa6390 MJ was great but how many first round picks did he need to make the playoffs? Jordan needed everybody to get old before he made an impact... Shaq is one of one!! Day one team one Orlando to the finals
Who beat more 50+ win teams in the playoffs than Kobe, made more three pointers in a game, scored more points in a game, and also made more than 12 all defensive teams, 🤔 please inform me
All of those things are reason Kobe is top 8 all time
Huh??? More 3s in a game?? Didn’t Klay Steph and jr smith all shoot as many and more 3s in a game?? Beat 50 win teams?? So he beat teams that did good in the regular season?? That’s what you are supposed to do in the playoffs and he did some of that with Shaq. Kobe’s an animal but those were bad examples. His first team all defenses over Lebron or the stretch where he was asked to pass and averaged a double double the last 3 months of the season was fire. He could do more but chose to be the player he was. Cerebral and defended any star player from Jordan to Bron to Durant to Steph.
Kobe went to less finals because he played in the West which was notoriously more difficult than the East
@@fabianmarshall4120 Yes, but he played and beat more 50-win teams than anyone in NBA history. The only player that really comes close is Jordan. LeBron is approaching, but is still behind.
That's not something you just brush off as insignificant. People always say Kobe had Shaq (not vice versa) and forgets that he did all of that with Pau Gasol as the next best teammate from 2008-2010 playoffs. He played more 50-win teams in that span than Magic did in his entire 13 year career. That obviously meant that Kobe repeatedly faced the most consistently competitive teams thoroughout his career.
As great as Magic, Kareem, LeBron, etc were/are, they didn't face nearly as many competitive teams consistently. It was times they only faced one 50-win team throughout the entire conference playoffs run and another in the Finals.
@@atlien1988 it’s decent to do that I never said brushed it off it’s just the most minimum way to talk about the greatness of Kobe. 50 win team in 09-10 when Lebron was by himself the heat had fell off from their chip and it was only laker Celtics and spurs vying for anything. By most 50 win teams what do you mean?? In a run to the finals or over some years?? In one run impressive but that’s 1 run not enough. You’re on another post debating Kobe with me and I’m defending his shot taking on there saying he was by himself so you just want to argue
As good as Magic was, the key thing is that the very second Kareem retired, the Magic-led Lakers never won another ring.
Kobe won with AND without Shaq. Magic never won without Kareem.
Kobe Bryant should be Top 5 but not over Duncan, but instead, over Magic.
As good as Kareem was, he was there in the Lakers 6 years before Magic. Never won a chip. Magic comes in, makes them win the title and wins the FMVP. Then goes on to win 4 more. So Kareem also never won a ring without Magic while he was at Lakers and never won a single ring his entire career without arguably the two greatest PG’s of all time (Magic and Oscar). Does that mean Kobe’s better than Kareem too?
You can’t nitpick stats bro. Jordan, LeBron, Kareem and Magic are on the Mount Rushmore. As good as Kobe was, he’s on the bottom half of the Top 10.
He was older and he got them too the finals Jordan was just ready to take the 🔦
kareem was doing nothin before magic came lol
I'll take it one further Jordan never won without pippen let that sink in
Magic only played a couple of years without Kareem and I feel like he’s underated he played only 12 years and made 9 finals
It's funny how Nick doesn't mention how Kobe beat Duncan in the playoffs to those Lakers and Spurs battle were great.
Kobe has a winning record vs Duncan lol
@@joshboy438 yeah, with shaq. Only beat duncan once when he was the man.
@@Lonewolf_665 how many times Duncan beat Kobe ?
@@Lonewolf_665 Kobe was the man then too ... He carried the team through those series against the Spurs.
Kobe also dunked on Tim 4 times in his career and Tim failed to avg 20PPG 10 years in his career.
As a side note, I feel that Kobe/Shaq team doesn't get anywhere near the respect nor the debate that the great teams get. That 2000 team was cutting through teams like there wasn't another team on the floor. If I remember right, my Sixers were the only team to put a loss on them in the playoffs.
that was the 2001 season. and in that season they didn't take the regular season seriously. If you could combine the 2000 regular season with the 2001 playoff, then you'd have a strong goat team argument
That’s why during that time they 3peated the spurs had to retool and Sacramento Queens and drugged up Portland trailblazers was their best competition
Lol what are you talking about? The 01 lakers are widely considered the best team other, along with the 83 76ers, 96 bulls, and 2017 warriors. They are considered a dynasty, which the lebron heat aren’t even considered
@@TheCephalon I don't know about "widely considered". I don't hear these conversations. I hear more about the Spurs and they've never repeated. Maybe it's the outlets I'm getting my sports talk from.
That’s not true, in 2000 against the blazers they needed every bit of the help they got from the refs. Ask Timmy lol
I agree with Nick on this one. Tim Duncan wasn't in the Spurs system. He WAS the system
I don’t like that argument either. Why bring others down to elevate others? Spurs were a great dynasty. Manu and Parker played a huge role in that as well, their stats don’t do them justice but if you watched them play you knew just how valuable they were to those championship teams.
Playing with hall of famers his entire career would be easier
@@1YpsiBoi he made them HoFers bub 🥱
@@thisisnotmyname8766 yeah they were, but you aint building a roster around a Parker or Ginobili
They aren't anyone's #40 pick on any mock draft
They're basically ringless journeymen without Timmy and Pop.
They're like Draymond but better. Yeah it was nice having them, but they weren't irreplaceable
The Spurs system had 67 wins in 2016 relying on a young Kawhi’s two-way play and decent contributions from the others. They were starters except for Manu, but nothing more. Kawhi had yet to make his huge leap and become a superstar (2017, 2019). They still made the playoffs when Kawhi left with virtually no star talent. The Spurs system was a real thing whether you like it or not
No one ever mentions that Kobe has the most all defense selections among guards in the history of the NBA
Amongst literally everyone
too bad pf/c >>>>>>>>guards defensively
while guards can make all defense just for being on top seed team
@@Coldskin1 I disagree, to an extent. I think overall yes Centers tend to be more valuable on the defensive end than guards, but there are those anomalies like Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, D Wade, that in my opinion were just as effective defensively as many great Centers.
@@martyg2333 facts, look at what kawhi did during his 4 year peak, or what gary payton accomplished during his finals run. They were game changing
@@pootypotputt no one talks about them because he shouldnt have won like half of them.
“What you don’t want the numbers OR the intangibles?!?”
classic Nick
Soon as Rick said that I’m like oh boy nick bout to go offff
Yeah Rick was all over the place and Nick and Chris came with the Heat. Rick just like Kobe better. Which is his choice
Rick is a LeBron Hater but also a Analyst that Has The “You Had To Be There” mindset or he changes the Standards to Help his Debate
@@jermainee26 Facts
Nick is a nerd that never played the game and nerds don’t get to set the standards of what makes a great player FOH.
He said I watched all guys play up close and I’m taking Kobe over everybody
All talk about the "better basketball player" but that doesn't always equate to being the highest on these lists. Durant is an objectively better player than Curry, but almost everyone has Curry higher on their all-time list.
I love Kobe, and he embodies everything about hard work and dedication to your craft, but Duncan's career was better when you put all these arguments on the table.
And to say the fact Shaq was averaging 36 points in the finals doesn't matter is insanity, it's so impossible to discuss these things with these old heads that make arguments just based on feelings and biases.
PS: I shouldn't have used "objectively", some strong arguments against that in the replies, my bad!
But u a bit stupid!
Watch THE ENTIRETY of the Playoffs and not only The Finals as Shaq played THE WORST COMPETITION of NBA finals opponents EVER for a Center!!!
I think that the guys ranked 6-15, you can’t really say one is objectively better than another, and it’s why you see such a variety with these lists; I wouldn’t make the case that KD is objectively a better basketball player than Steph. Duncan and Kobe is always a hot debate because their careers were so evenly matched and they went to battle several times head to head. I’m not mad at either selection here.
@@brandonrice2833 Fair point, objectively is a bad word here on my end. My point is that you could argue Kobe was better at basketball than Duncan and still have Duncan higher because it’s about total body of work.
KD is not better than Curry, he never was... He is just taller and plays more traditional basketball which is why the media mostly pushes the narrative that he's better.
Durant being objectively a better basketball player is up for debate
Kobe's skills, style, and competitiveness is so inspiring. Within 10 years from being drafted, he managed to win 3 rings in 3 peat fashion, be the best player in the NBA as a shooting guard, all defensive team 7 year straight, all star team starter for 9 year straight, be the youngest player to start in an all star game while not being a starter as a Laker, dropped 81 pts in a game, outscored a team in 3 quarters, and the face of the league all in one team as a Laker in the tough western conference. When the world watched the 2008 Olympics, they knew who the guy was that Led them to a gold medal..KOBE
Kobe was not the best player in the league during the three peat, he wasn't even the best in his own team until year 9.
@@johanholguin6576 I think he was the best player in 2004 when Shaq was out of shape. He hit the memorable 2 buzzer beaters in Portland, one to force OT and the other to win the game. But I'm with you, he was the best player in year 9. The following year, he scored 81 pts.
@@JC-zk7rt
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time
1. Michael Jordan
2. LeBron James
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Tim Duncan
14. Kobe Bryant
PPG: LeBron
RPG: LeBron
APG: LeBron
SPG: LeBron
BPG: LeBron
FG%: LeBron
3pt%: LeBron
FT%: Kobe
TS%: LeBron
PER: LeBron
WS/48: LeBron
VORP: LeBron
MVP's: LeBron
FMVP's: LeBron
Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2)
LeBron a better player then Kobe
Field goal%
LeBron 50.5%✔️
Kobe 44.7%
Points scored career
LeBron 37,062✔️
Kobe 33,643
Most missed shots in NBA history
1. Kobe Bryant 14,481
2. John Havlicek 13,417
3. Elvin Hayes 13,296
LeBron more points then Kobe
Kobe more missed shots then LeBron
Total 3pointers made
LeBron 2,140✔️
Kobe 1,827
Total Steals career
LeBron 2,136✔️
Kobe 1,944
Total Blocks career
LeBron 1,041✔️
Kobe 640
Defensive win shares
LeBron 75.59✔️
Kobe 50.66
Assists Leader
LeBron 1✔️
Kobe 0
Career highs
Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record
Career highs
LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record
Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters
LeBron 5✔️
Kobe 1
2010 NBA finals
Game 7
Lakers 83 Celtics 79
Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points
2013 NBA finals
Game 7
Heat 95 Spurs 88
LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points
Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player
Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings
2011 NBA playoffs
Mavericks 4 Lakers 0
Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series
LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings
Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
@@terrystyles3486 You do know that average percentages has limitations. Instead of showing us the stats, why don't you tell us what your statistics means? Like why is Lebron so bad at free throws? It's just you, the ball, and the basket. It's been 19 years and he hasn't figured it out. Why do people call him LeFlop, LeAirball, LeBum, LeBrick, LeFraud, LeSweep, LeChoke, LeCrybaby? Hmm 🤔 Kobe brings the game of basketball to life with his skills, artistry, and competitiveness that inspired old school and new school ballers. Kobe was always in the more difficult Western conference. Even Shaq agreed that it was way easier to win in the East. Offense, Defense, & Competitiveness, Kobe over Lebron.
@@JC-zk7rt
Most missed shots in NBA history
1. Kobe Bryant 14,481
2. John Havlicek 13,417
Points scored
LeBron 37,062✔️
Kobe 33,643
Field goal%
LeBron 50.5%✔️
Kobe 44.7%
LeBron more points then Kobe
Kobe more missed shots then LeBron
Only person with brick in they name is Kobrick Bryant with most missed shots in NBA history 14,481
Defensive win shares
LeBron 75.59✔️
Kobe 50.66
LeBron better offensively and defensively then Kobe
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time
1. Michael Jordan
2. LeBron James
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Tim Duncan
14. Kobe Bryant
PPG: LeBron
RPG: LeBron
APG: LeBron
SPG: LeBron
BPG: LeBron
FG%: LeBron
3pt%: LeBron
FT%: Kobe
TS%: LeBron
PER: LeBron
WS/48: LeBron
VORP: LeBron
MVP's: LeBron
FMVP's: LeBron
Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2)
LeBron a better player then Kobe
The fact that Ric's whole argument got diminished to "I know what I saw" was sad to watch
It was one of the most pathetic things anyone has said on television regarding basketball.
Exactly
Ppl forget Kobe ties the record with 9x all nba defensive team... and ppl act like that's nothing
Facts, u dont make all defense if your defense overrated
they don't which is why he is top 10 all time
Bcoz casuals dont care about Defense bro. And that's facts
People hate the number associated to the player, while not thinking to who should be before him
Yup. I always say this. Actually MAKE your list and then get back to me. I bet we are closer to agreeing than you think.
“How can Dak Prescott be ranked the number 10 QB in the league...?!”
Well because Aaron Rodgers, Tom Brady, Russel Wilson, Pat Mahomes, Lamar Jackson, Josh Allen, Deshaun Watson, Joe Burrow, Kyler Murray, Justin Herbert...
You actually have to make the list and people so rarely do.
One thing these analysts don’t tell you is that the finals series during the Lakers 3 peat that they played against cake walk eastern conference teams that really couldn’t deal with Shaq.. the series against Portland & the series against Sacramento.. which were way better opponents than the Nets & 76ers & Pacers ..The Mamba brought those series’ home 🐍
Exactly like how the narrative was Shaq couldn't win the big game. We all just forgot huh lol. First ship, Portland series game 7 the unstoppable Shaq had 18 pts, while a young 21 killer said I got yall and lead one of the best comebacks and play off history. If kobe wouldn't of done that we wouldn't of even went to the finals.
Nick's opinion is contradictory based on his very list. He said Magic was better than Kobe. Okay, let's see his list. Magic won only 5 championships playing with the second or third best player of all time, Kareem, practically all his career. Kobe Bryant won 5 championships with the ninth best player of all time, Shaq for less than half os his career. Magic had to overcome Bird, the seventh best player of all time. Kobe had to overcome Duncan the fifth best player of all time. So, who had it harder and accomplished more? Yeah, guess it was Kobe.
Ric."here we go on the numbers again"(rolls eyes)
Ric. Kobe went through 5 finals.. 3 back to back...2 back to back... (those are numbers my friends...
Ric "now we going into intangibles".... "with eyes I saw them.all play (yah we all did lol).
this man speaks from his ars.....never bring this man back lol
That’s what arguing with Kobe fans is like
No you speak from your ars.
@@kingjaydex7464 y'all can't stand the fact that there is FINALLY somebody on mainstream media that PROPERLY defends Kobe! GET OVER IT.
@@travisblair3189 defends Kobe or has no brain ? 🤔 sounds like you don’t either 🤣🤡
@@travisblair3189 I found another one ^ @kingjaydex
Kobe vs Duncan on an All-Time list is Intriguing for sure!!
Shaq and lebron is also intriguing
Kobe all day
Facts, ppl overrate Kobe into the top 3-5 convo and skip over Tim. Tim's resume is clearly more impressive than Kobe but ppl hate real.
When people rank Tim Duncan the convo changes to “best PF” or big man, why I don’t know 🤷🏾♂️ he’s not overlooked or under valued it’s just different with him
@@dsworld8721 tim duncan averages like 20 pts for his career. Kobe belongs in the top 5 especially if lebron is in the top 5
I love we how touch on Kobe's shooting % and efficiency when we forget how many possessions Kobe had to throw up end of shot clock prayers bc he had teammates doing nothing with the ball. Off-ball movement was lacking, Kobe knew it and more than often had to throw up double team Think about how much you hate it when a co-worker doesn't pull his weight. How frustrating that is. How many teammate interviews where they state " I would just be "stuck" watching Kobe". That's how great the man was.
Complete lies, he played in the triangle, if dudes didn’t move they’d be benched
Kobe routinely refused to pass to the open man
Not only that.
The triangle is sculptured for a big in the post but in the last 5-7 sec for a guard with INTANGIBLE GREATNESS such as MJ and Kobe.
For that u need Clutch gene and guts to create ur own shot at the HIGHEST LEVEL.
When Kobe came in the NBA he was seen as a versatile version of Michael Jordan, maybe inefficient scorer but certainly had high IQ and unmatched competitiveness, there should be a list of players with same position to be more fair, cos he was the best guard behind Jordan
You can't have High IQ and decide that jacking up jumpshots with double and triple teams are the right play. He's inefficient cause his basketball IQ is low and often does the wrong play shooting his team out of competition.
Better guard than magic?
When it comes to who was a better playmaker between MJ and Kobe it was Kobe just saying but it doesn't mean he's greater than MJ for sure.
@@bolo5190 srsly. People think cause Kobe was a ball hog he never passed? Nope. Think he averages 5-6 assists while being a sg. Among the sg’s those were one of the highest
@@Dilly_Dil1y Right
I only had to listen to 27 seconds of Rick Bucher, to determine that he was going to put his anti-LeBron bias on open display.
If you guys wanna do an actual breakdown of Kobe’s shootings you can check his percentages from 5-10 10-20 and so on and it’s the same for other greats and you can breakdown their play style and how they score and make your own decisions instead of listening to others
Yessir
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time
1. Michael Jordan
2. LeBron James
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Tim Duncan
14. Kobe Bryant
PPG: LeBron
RPG: LeBron
APG: LeBron
SPG: LeBron
BPG: LeBron
FG%: LeBron
3pt%: LeBron
FT%: Kobe
TS%: LeBron
PER: LeBron
WS/48: LeBron
VORP: LeBron
MVP's: LeBron
FMVP's: LeBron
Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2)
LeBron a better player then Kobe
Field goal%
LeBron 50.5%✔️
Kobe 44.7%
Points scored career
LeBron 37,062✔️
Kobe 33,643
Most missed shots in NBA history
1. Kobe Bryant 14,481
2. John Havlicek 13,417
3. Elvin Hayes 13,296
LeBron more points then Kobe
Kobe more missed shots then LeBron
Total 3pointers made
LeBron 2,140✔️
Kobe 1,827
Total Steals career
LeBron 2,136✔️
Kobe 1,944
Total Blocks career
LeBron 1,041✔️
Kobe 640
Defensive win shares
LeBron 75.59✔️
Kobe 50.66
Assists Leader
LeBron 1✔️
Kobe 0
Career highs
Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record
Career highs
LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record
Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters
LeBron 5✔️
Kobe 1
2010 NBA finals
Game 7
Lakers 83 Celtics 79
Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points
2013 NBA finals
Game 7
Heat 95 Spurs 88
LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points
Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player
Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings
2011 NBA playoffs
Mavericks 4 Lakers 0
Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series
LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings
Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
@@TheRimasyele
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time
1. Michael Jordan
2. LeBron James
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Tim Duncan
14. Kobe Bryant
PPG: LeBron
RPG: LeBron
APG: LeBron
SPG: LeBron
BPG: LeBron
FG%: LeBron
3pt%: LeBron
FT%: Kobe
TS%: LeBron
PER: LeBron
WS/48: LeBron
VORP: LeBron
MVP's: LeBron
FMVP's: LeBron
Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2)
LeBron a better player then Kobe
Field goal%
LeBron 50.5%✔️
Kobe 44.7%
Points scored career
LeBron 37,062✔️
Kobe 33,643
Most missed shots in NBA history
1. Kobe Bryant 14,481
2. John Havlicek 13,417
3. Elvin Hayes 13,296
LeBron more points then Kobe
Kobe more missed shots then LeBron
Total 3pointers made
LeBron 2,140✔️
Kobe 1,827
Total Steals career
LeBron 2,136✔️
Kobe 1,944
Total Blocks career
LeBron 1,041✔️
Kobe 640
Defensive win shares
LeBron 75.59✔️
Kobe 50.66
Assists Leader
LeBron 1✔️
Kobe 0
Career highs
Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record
Career highs
LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record
Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters
LeBron 5✔️
Kobe 1
2010 NBA finals
Game 7
Lakers 83 Celtics 79
Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points
2013 NBA finals
Game 7
Heat 95 Spurs 88
LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points
Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player
Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings
2011 NBA playoffs
Mavericks 4 Lakers 0
Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series
LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings
Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
All-day
Kobe is one of the all time greatest defenders, and also the greatest difficult shot maker. The most skilled player ever. Only MJ can compare to his mental toughness. Forget talking about stats in a team game, there are too many variables such as player role/position, what conference are you in, how good is your team, how good is your opponent, injuries, are you single/double/triple covered, what era are you playing in, what rules are in place, how much of your scoring is freethrows, did you score off an assist, were you wide open, did you shoot, layup, oop or dunk, player suspensions/holdouts, are you just doing what your coach told you, numbers/stats don't lie but they can fool you and don't tell the whole story. Just take the offensive/defensive skill set and apply it to a 1v1 game. I would take Kobe over the others, but I would not argue if someone else took MJ, but that's it no one else is close.
Stats don’t tell the whole story but just doing a list based on how well they would play in a 1v1 setting is even more idiotic then only using stats
How else would you make judgment individually? You can't judge an individual in a team game, if you cannot make a case then it would be idiotic for you to even comment.
Wrote all this just to be wrong lol
@@enomfonsammy5646 I appreciate you taking the time to read my comment of my view
@@123jayb3 I didn't read all that, I could sense your error in the force😂
Nick just roasted the man in the middle with facts.
Ric what an awful argument - “you just reduce things to numbers” then proceeds to reduce things to number of championships in a row - and also the whole “nucleus thing” it was steady in SA cause of Duncan and turbulent in LA cause of Kobe
Not to mention with all the changes…he never won a SINGLE playoff series with any coach other than Phil Jackson. Boy had 5 coaches and only won with one (the greatest coach EVER)
It was steady in San Antonio because of Pop, are you even serious right now... before Dunacn, the Admiral made that team relevant, and after Duncan, Kawhi kept that team afloat. San antonio always had a knack of grabbing great players. Yes, Duncan was efficient, but great? cmon now... imagine KG or Dirk in those type of environments, and those are only 2 players in his era.
@@Domeo_Divine when did Pop leave San Antonio? lmao
You’ll can have your Duncans and Lebrons, to me Kobe Bryant wore a cape. It was an immense thrill to see him play. He’s the reason why I fell in love with basketball. He’s the 🐐 in my list. Only an opinion. Everyone has their own list.
"He's the reason why I fell in love with basketball"
Which is why you'd never be able to create a Top 10 Players of All Time list(or in this case the last 50 years). NBA fans just love their favorites and think that's enough to put them above other players. There's no objectivity involved. Contrary to what Nick said in this video, I don't think there's much of an argument between Duncan and Kobe. Duncan is a greater player and I don't think there's much anyone could say otherwise. His career resume is simply better across the board and his play on the court will never get the credit it deserves.
clown
@@carteljameson8395 I disagree. Kobe was the best player of his era and btw Duncan played in it.
@@brettself4520 must be a Bronsexual
@@rowdyalejandro Of course Duncan played in the same era and he was simply better than Kobe. It's not rocket science.
Kobe had an arsenal of moves and shots, and was guarding your best player. One vs One, Kobe wins! Magic said Kobe is the best Laker. Shaq said it too! LeBron was interviewed saying Kobe was better than him. Kobe killed the Spurs almost every time they played against each other. Not to mention these guys saying Kobe Goat...
Iverson
McGrady
Billups
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time
1. Michael Jordan
2. LeBron James
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Tim Duncan
14. Kobe Bryant
PPG: LeBron
RPG: LeBron
APG: LeBron
SPG: LeBron
BPG: LeBron
FG%: LeBron
3pt%: LeBron
FT%: Kobe
TS%: LeBron
PER: LeBron
WS/48: LeBron
VORP: LeBron
MVP's: LeBron
FMVP's: LeBron
Rings: Kobe (Best player on 2)
LeBron a better player then Kobe
Field goal%
LeBron 50.5%✔️
Kobe 44.7%
Points scored career
LeBron 37,062✔️
Kobe 33,643
Most missed shots in NBA history
1. Kobe Bryant 14,481
2. John Havlicek 13,417
3. Elvin Hayes 13,296
LeBron more points then Kobe
Kobe more missed shots then LeBron
Total 3pointers made
LeBron 2,140✔️
Kobe 1,827
Total Steals career
LeBron 2,136✔️
Kobe 1,944
Total Blocks career
LeBron 1,041✔️
Kobe 640
Defensive win shares
LeBron 75.59✔️
Kobe 50.66
Assists Leader
LeBron 1✔️
Kobe 0
Career highs
Kobe Bryant 28-46 fg and 7-13 3pt for 81 points vs Raptors 27-55 record
Career highs
LeBron James 22-33 fg and 8-10 3pt for 61 points vs Bobcats 43-39 record
Playoffs game winning buzzer beaters
LeBron 5✔️
Kobe 1
2010 NBA finals
Game 7
Lakers 83 Celtics 79
Kobe Bryant 6-24 fg and 0-6 3pt for 23 points
2013 NBA finals
Game 7
Heat 95 Spurs 88
LeBron James 12-23 fg and 5-10 3pt for 37 points
Pippen 6 rings > Kobe 5 rings so having more team awards rings dont mean better player
Shaquille O'Neal 3 finals mvps best player on Lakers 3peat and carried Kobe Bryant to 3 sidekick rings
2011 NBA playoffs
Mavericks 4 Lakers 0
Kobe got swept with home court advantage and favored to win series
LeBron 16-6 winning record owns Kobe in 22 career meetings
Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in the NBA history isnt even top 10 player all time thats why Bleacher report has him #14
Steve Nash has one more MVP, was a better passer than Kobe and was more efficient than Kobe and nobody in the cosmos thinks that Steve Nash was a better player than Kobe.
Efficiency doesnt necessarily equate to being a winning formula...the problem is, you need an actual gauge of the sport to understand this and 99% of ppl online talking about basketball have absolutely NO gauge of the sport whatsoever.
He also never averaged more than 19 points a game. That’s a terrible comparison to the topic at hand because Steve Nash was never considered a super super star. He won those mvps because he was a very valuable component of his teams success.
The caliber of players in the top ten is insane, so the differences are going to seem meticulous or minute. The truth is that Kobe was always considered around number 8 or 9 until his untimely passing.
I love Kobe, but he was not better than MJ, Lebron, Kareem, Magic, or Tim.
(IMO Larry, Wilt, and Bill should also be ahead of him, but I see the arguments against it)
Edit- also how does efficiency not equate to winning? Russell Westbrook is inefficient and clearly that impacts his winning. Turnovers and missed shots don’t win games, don’t try to sound like a wise guy because that doesn’t even make sense
You honestly believe that kobe deserved only one mvp? The “ raping" allegations back then had a negative impact on his carrer!!
@@fwsreal Kobe deserved at least 3 MVPs...
@@marker7443 youre lying tremendously lol Kobe was in everyones top 5 pre 2013-2014 when sports media started to turn on him. Theres nothing that Tim Duncan cn do better than Kobe Bryant on a basketball court lol and nobody ever saw Tim as even being in the discussion for best player in the world...i can tell u dont watch basketball and u gotta be like younger than 25 to even suggest something so dumb.
The “Tim Duncan was better than Kobe” ppl are a new phenomenon that just popped up on the internet over the last 5-6 yrs and its all ppl who dont understand how either of their games translated on the court because their opinions are too heavily influenced by stats and analytics...you guys simply didnt watch basketball during that time and youre too young to realize that youre completely wrong, u dont even understand public sentiment during those years.
@@josephschmizzo1595 even Tim knows Kobe is better than him!
now mentioned who Shaq faced in those finals, and how the road TO those finals were dog fights and Kobe was very much needed in all facets during those wars
Exactly. shaq had a mismatch every finals so the team let him exploit it. Kobe was always comparable if not better during the series in the western conference.
@@impactovernumbers5157 better*
@@josephschmizzo1595 lol facts but I always wanna give diesel his credit. You not lying tho.
That was like 12 minutes of Rick saying "I saw them both and I feel like Kobe was better." There was no real substance to it -_-
11:00 Nick's voice when he says "he left!" Lmao!
Wow 9 finals in 12 seasons. Why was that not in his docu-series. Magic sounds amazing.
Except them 9 routes though them Western Conferences to the Finals was almost pretty as equally bad as Lebrons route to the finals in them Weak East as Magic had several HOF and All stars in them teams but that's maybe something you didn't know.
It's ok tho 🙏🏾
Only went 5-4 in those series, losing three of the last four.
@@davidlopez2276 - Magic was 2 - 2 in his last 4 Finals. Won it in '87 and '88. Lost in '89 and '91. And the later losses were largely influenced by Kareem finally being claimed by age and major injuries to Magic and other key players.
@@nathanmulchandani2869 is u blind ?
He was....magic
They forgetting Kobe went to the finals 3 in a row w out Shaq
Ric basically tears the spurs for being a great team and having multiple reliable pieces but then makes it seem like Kobe 3 peated and went back to back by himself 😂😂😂😂😂 WHAT?!
Not by himself, but with significantly less help than any other all time great that has won back to back championships. And with less help than one lebron for example, has ever had when he won.
@@TyreG18 Having a Shaq at his peak is arguably the best thing you can get
@@phoenixplayz1581 Kid… he went to 3 straight finals without shaq, with his best help being gasol 😹 stop it!
@@Sammy-ec8cr I mean... Gasol is widely considered one of the greats at his position for his era, a shoe in for the HoF and made all star teams every year he won a title with the lakers... Of course he wasn't Shaq, but if you mean that Gasol was of minimal help, I want what you are smoking.
@@Sammy-ec8cr gasoline averaged 25pts 10 Reba n 4 assist one of the best passing big men of all time one of the best skilled big men of all time a six man of the year in Odom and Bynum was a very talented center who they got in the top 10 of the draft with other good role players they had the best front court in the league lol
Nick Wrong hating on Kobe is ridiculously out the roof. Stop hating Nick Wrong.
How is hating putting Kobe in top 6? Sorry buck-o that's where he belongs and Lebron is top 2. Get use to it. Those are facts.
kobes efficiency from 2013 until 2016 was bad cause of all the injurys he had...now in 2022 nobody cares if he was injured and had many low scoring games in his way coming back.but in 2013 he was almost done... his career was over.. nobody cares today..they look on his overall career stats..put his 2013-2016 stats in a mix with his prime days and end of the story..
He was never efficient tho, his best season in terms of efficiencywould be an okay level. There wasn't even ONE season were he reached 47% from the field, efficient scorers like MJ, KD, Steph, Bron, even Magic, Bird etc, all average more than 47% from the field FOR THEIR CAREERS. He just shot a bunch of shots so of course he's gonna make a lot of points, it's kinda like the Harden situation back kn Houston, only that Harden was ALSO more efficient from 3 and the freethrow line.
@@angelaquino6755 His TS% was above league average for his time
@@angelaquino6755 facts
@@DonkeyKong5479 that TS% sh*t is very flawed. Kobe was never efficient, he was easily a top 10 player in my eyes so I’m only nitpicking because we’re comparing him to LeBron and Tim Duncan but the fact that they were so much more efficient makes it easier to be competitive with lesser talent. It’s part of the reason Lebron Lost Kyrie in 2018 and took the Cavs right back to the finals like nothing ever happened lol you think Kobe is taking Jordan Clarkson & Larry nance and the gang to the finals after the team trades for them at the all star break? Kobe was a monster but all the constant critiquing of Bron has really warped peoples minds.
@@DonkeyKong5479 "above league average" isn't good enough for somebody that people are trying to rank top 5.
Duncan over Kobe is the funniest thing I've ever heard.
Duncan better player then Kobe
Finals Mvps (individual player)
Duncan 3✔️
Kobe 2
▫️
League Mvps ( individual player)
Duncan 2✔️
Kobe 1
▫️
Total Mvps ( league and finals )
Duncan 5✔️
Kobe 3
▫️
Rookie of the year
Duncan Yes✔️
Kobe No
▫️
Field goal%
Duncan 50.6%✔️
Kobe 44.7%
▫️
1999 NBA playoffs
Spurs 4 Lakers 0
Duncan swept Kobe with a prime Shaq
▫️
Bleacher report top 50 best NBA players all time
1. Michael Jordan
2. LeBron James
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
4. Magic Johnson
5. Larry Bird
6. Shaquille O'Neal
7. Tim Duncan
14. Kobe Bryant
▫️
Bleacher report has Kobe #14
@@terrystyles3486 hahahahahahaha
@@terrystyles3486now what about 2008 when Kobe killed that Duncan lead team? Who were also defending champs
@@studmuffin3264 nice argument
@@magicjohnson5733 okay how about this. Duncan was literally never the best player in the NBA lol
The kobe take is bad because every premier perimeter player in Kobe's era shot a lower percentage from the field. Is that a coincidence or a byproduct of defense of the time?
Jordan shot a higher percentage during the 80s and 90s. You can’t tell me they played “better defense” during Kobe’s era than hand checking and getting slammed to the ground which happened to Jordan.
That era had everyone thinking Jordan did it by himself. So Kobe’s and Iversons would Chuck when by themself. They forgot about the pippen part so people chucked and the floor wasn’t as spaced. At the same time Lebron was here in 2003. Kobe had some years before him but kobe took more shots when shaq left which is when Lebron was in the league. Lebron has been efficient from day one because of his shot selection. He passes more and chooses different moments to take over only when crucial.
@@odigomez1787 no, that simply says that Jordan was a better player. Also, check the individual numbers from players in the 80s to the 90s. There was a fundamental shift in how basketball was played from the 90s to mid 2000s basketball.
@@fabianmarshall4120 LeBron scores primarily at the rim or from three. He's a below average shooter from everywhere else on the court.
LeBron is one of the best finishers the game has ever seen and is a solid three point shooter
@@atlien1988 what was the “fundamental shift” if you care to elaborate
Agreed I’m taking Kobe over anybody all time
Shocking the way they downplay how good Pau Gasol was, particularly in 2010.
LOL 😂🤣😂
Nobody disagrees Pau was a great player. But what people do forget is that before we got Gasol, we already had one of the best records in the league. And that was with essentially the same supporting cast, only key changes were the addition of Fisher and Bynum getting more playing time over Kwame. It was only when Bynum was injured that we traded for Gasol and the rest is history. I ask you this who is downplayed more Gasol or Bosh? In my opinion Bosh was in every way just as great as Gasol, and Lebron had that level of player as a third option.
@@chito4 Bosh was definitely better than Gasol. Bosh was the leader on the raptor team.
@@chito4 Bosh was better than Gasol bro and that was the sentiment that everyone had at the time. Bosh is a better shooter all around, faster, more athletic and a better defender.
Ppl downplay Bosh essentially to bolster the optics of Lebron...
Well except Kobe and Gasol that Lakers team was nothing exceptional...Pieces just worked together
Once you dominate for 10+ years, no one should have a longevity argument over you. It should be just apex and consistency. To me, that's why the Duncan/Kobe debate is so close. Kobe clearly has the higher apex but Duncan was constantly impacting his teams success more (Spurs never had a drop-off)
Well said, I understand if someone’s says Kobe peak is better. But I refuse to accept when someone says Kobe’s career was better. It’s simply not true. The Spurs never had a drop-off because Duncan had every positive intangible you can wish for in a star player. The Lakers had a drop-off partly because of Kobe’s immaturity and selfishness. Other things contributed but Kobe wasn’t innocent at all.
Duncan never had players as scrubby as Kwame Brown and Smush Parker
@@Cheif_Espada Duncan never had a player of the caliber of Shaq either.
@@michaelmaccrazy That’s cute. He started his career with David Robinson. They won a title in 1999
@@Cheif_Espada That's cute. David Robinson wasnt the player that he was before the broken foot either.
1) If you are using Duncan 50 season argument you must apply it to everyone on the list which in this case Duncan beats them all. Stop creating arguments to discredit Kobe's career. Also Kobe has hit more game winners than anyone in history but now it's only playoffs that count in LeBron favor. You us Shaq's finals numbers but fail to mention Kobe destroyed teams in the west but against the east there were no centers that could stop Shaq so obviously a good team player would use that advantage to win that's what the Lakers did. Nicks points are outrageous and bias at best. Also go ahead and point out LeBron's playoff blemishes while you're at it as well. People just pick topics to demean Kobe. You wouldn't say Kobe beat Duncan 4-2 in playoff series so I guess he's better. Kobe 7 finals appearances in 10 years doesn't help but Magic 9 in 12 years. Kobe also basically switched his entire team and did a 3 trips without a top 75 player on Duncan's watch...with a broken finger.
That’s factually untrue. Kobe was really bad close & late. He just took all the shots whether they were good shots or not.
@@grahamstrouse1165 🧢 how was he bad if he has 5x.
All facts
@@grahamstrouse1165 that's factually 1000% correct actually. Kobe has the most ALL TIME
Speaking of making up facts, both MJ & Lebron have hit more game winners, in history, than Kobe. This includes both regular season and playoffs. And since Lebron has a winning record against Kobe, that makes Lebron better according to what you said. Also Kobe has more Finals appearances than MJ, so I guess he’s better than MJ?
Your logic is inconsistent and untrue.
Idk who that other guy is forgot his name already but he virtually said that his perception and opinion are more definitive, precise and credible than any statistics haha
Yessir! Let’s go Rick. Putting respect on Kobe name
How is it Kobe's fault that he had down years when his teammates consisted of Smush Parker and Kwame Brown?
this gets overlooked so often on how he was able to take horrible team to the playoffs in the strong western conference. The moment he gets an all-star (pau gasol): reaches the finals, and then goes back to back. Goes to show how great Kobe can be with a great teammate even if that player isn't a superstar. Give him a superstar (shaq) and you get 3x champs
No one said that
Duncan took pay cuts to keep a good roster around him and the same reason he played with more HOFers than Kobe
i believe that if Kobe hadn't started his career with Shaq, he would have ended with 4-5 rings regardless. There was a good 4-5 years of his prime that was wasted, at the same time though, he did. get 3 with Shaq
Man kobe played with them for a season and a half, I hate that people act like he played with Donyell Marshall for 5 years
Honestly probably the highest nicks ever ranked Kobe. I think as time goes on and people see these talented players lacking that will Kobe had is why he’s moving up. By no means does Kobe have the stats but his will to win almost unmatched. Also his journey was pretty unique and difficult. Not too many guys even play 2 50 win teams in a playoff run. Kobe had 3 runs the lakers played a 50 win team from the first round to the finals! At the end of the day legendary in his own way no doubt
No he’s ranked the same
8th as always. It’s bc bill and wilt on the list since it’s just past 50 years lol.
He’s probably being generous about Kobe because the Mamba mob would be coming with pitchforks 😂
@@michaelmaccrazy we run deep! 😂
@@Neanebk 😂, I respect the loyalty. I’m sorry to say this, but Ric Bucher got DESTROYED on this segment.
Don't forget Kobe played with um oh yea SHAQ!!!
I love it Rick. That's why my name is Rick. Its Kobe for LIFE!!! I saw him on TV. You saw him in person and its final!!!
Look at the 01 02 and 08 series between lakers and spurs Kobe was the best player on the court including shaq
Because of Shaq dominance and able to draw double and even triple team means Kobe and rest of the lakers were able to do whatever they want.
Kobe’s back to back championships cemented his GOAT level status
No, he's nowhere near GOAT. That's between MJ, LJ, and maybe Magic. Kobe is not even in the discussion.
@@alankoslowski9473 To u maybe. Why Lebron is in the conversation. Lebron won all his his championship with a top ten player next to him. As for Kobe his last 2 championship was not with a top 10 player.
@@malusintsele2552 LJ did way more to elevate his entire team. While they didn't win, in 2007 and 2015 he carried a Cavs team of scrubs to the Finals (2015 Irving and Love were both injured).
After Shaq left the Lakers were terrible for a few seasons until they got Gasol and Odom. Odom was a very good and Gasol was one of the best Centers in the league. Not all time greats, but very good players.
Overall Kobe might have been a better shooter, but LJ is better at everything else: passing, rebounding, and defense. Kobe is the 2nd best shooting guard behind MJ while LJ is the best small forward ever. Kobe is great, but not in the GOAT discussion.
@@malusintsele2552 that laker team was deep. Pau Gasol was considered the best scoring big in the game Bynum was the best pure center in the game . Odum was a 6,10” wing . Ron Artest the best defensive player in the game . Derek fisher smart defensive player and hit big shots and Kobe and others that came off the bench that was ready . Kobe was the leader of that team but he had lots of help
@@youngfire9361 Look don't try to make these players more than what they were. Bynum was not Boogie cousins at his prime. There were decent players to say there were deep that is a stretch. You can replace all of them except Kobe. Without Kobe that team could not be mentioned in WCF let alone a championship. They are NBA players after all but at the end this right here!!!! was all Kobe.
Top 10 all-time:
Smush Parker
Usher
Jordan
Lavar Ball
Skip Bayless
Draymond Green
White Mamba
Greg Oden
Jake from State Farm
The rock
White Mamba in 4
Basically Ric is saying his argument is subjective and Kobe is ahead of bron and Duncan only cuz he said so lol
because he likes flashy players and duncan is boring to watch that's how he rank players.
Kobe 4-2 vs Duncan in the playoffs
I must correct myself. I said it wasn’t educational. But I did learn one thing from Rick. In sport you use the numbers as facts so you can measure success. Rick argument is that you should ignore the stats and go by who you like more. This one is gold. The ridiculousness is reaching unbelievable heights 😂😂😂😂
Kobe is #4 on my list. I’m tired of hearing about efficiency. It literally a argument that people who never played ball make. Kobe is so inefficient that if he takes 20 shots he is going to make 8.5 of them and score 24-25 points. Meanwhile Steph someone we consider to be one of the most efficient players ever is gonna make 9.5 shots and score 27-28. Like we r talking about 2-3 points per game difference. Efficiency is so overrated that it’s not funny. That’s the difference between a inefficient Kobe and a AllTime efficient Steph. 2-3Ppg and 1 shot. Stop using that as a argument.
Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in NBA history isn't even top 9 player all time
Jordan, Kareem, LeBron, Chamberlain, Russell, Magic, Shaq, Duncan all 8 players better then Kobe
@@terrystyles3486 like bruh Bill Russell averaged 14 ppg get him the tf out of my replies that dude is the most overrated basketball player in the history of the game
kobe a top 4 player 😂😂😂😂 this is too funny lol.
@@RedEyeItachi
Kobe Bryant 44.7% fg only 32.9% 3pt and most missed shots in NBA history hes not even top 10 player all time
You talking about Bill Russell 15 ppg like scoring only stat you bum
Total Achievements: (Titles / MVPs / Finals MVPs / 1st All-NBA / 1st All-DEF / Scoring Titles)
1) Jordan = 46
2) LeBron = 31
2) Kareem = 31
4) Kobe = 30
5) Duncan = 28
6) Wilt = 23
7) Magic = 20
8) Russell = 19
9) Shaq = 18
10) Bird = 17
11) Hakeem = 16
12) Durant = 15
There's a bunch of players with 14 Achievements.
Stephen Curry has 13 Achievements.
At the age of 27, Giannis has the best shot to make it into the Top 10...he already has 12 Achievements
Tim Duncan is probably still my favorite player ever. He really was the model of consistency until he got older. Kobe, meanwhile, was as much a losing factor as he was a winning factor. He shot us out of wins so many times I just wanted to tear my hair out in frustration. Was he entertaining? Yes, but it was hard not to see him as a copycat. I already got to see Michael play during his prime, and watching Kobe be less consistent, less efficient, more annoying, and more eccentric was an obvious downgrade. Meanwhile, Tim lacked a lot of the more obnoxious attributes most NBA players have: the ego, the entitlement, the lack of self-awareness. Timmy was humble, composed, and yet just as much of stone cold killer as Kobe. I think Tim's demeanor meant he would have less fans in the league, but that says more about the average casual basketball fan than it does about either Kobe or Timmy.
Great comment. If you were putting a team together, and you wanted to pick a player who’d give you the best chance of contending for a title every season, for the longest number of consecutive seasons… there’s not a lot of names you’d put ahead of Timmy.
@@TheHarvbinger nah I'd take a few ppl over Timmy. He's the Tom Brady of the nba. He's had the luxury of having the same team, teammates and coach since he got drafted. He's a system player
Tim Duncan is your favorite player ever…
🤣😂😭 😂🤣
@@Von.NorthEnd The only player on every Spurs title winning team was Timmy, and he only had 2 teammates who were on 4/5. They won across eras with him totally adapting his game to account for declining athleticism and provide what those very different teams needed from their big man. If anything he’s the exact opposite of a “system player” - a “system player” is a guy who racks up huge stats because the style the team plays makes him look good, or who excels because he’s good at a specific role the system needs filled, but it’s a role where it’s not that hard to find a guy to replace anyone you lose. Timmy impacted the game in a way his relatively meh stats could never truly capture, and in case you haven’t noticed the Spurs haven’t exactly found it very easy to replace him. Timmy WAS the system, if anything.
U must be a BronTardd lol 🤣
Kobe was “inefficient” in the league’s most inefficient era. Era’s is why the numbers game just doesn’t add up to me but I respect nick’s consistency.
lebron played in the same era and was far more efficient in basically every way
Lmao that's just not true. Modern NBA players are way more efficient than previous eras. In the 40s, the league average FG % was below 30 😂 it's slowly increased relatively consistently ever since.
@@Adam-zy9fv he scored most of his points at the rim.
@@martelljhixson Lebron had a better 3 point percentage than Kobe on similar attempts between 03-13 (the last great year of Kobe’s career).
He also took some of the most inefficient shots but still hit them at about league average. Which looking purely at numbers doesn't tell the story of how impactful that is when you can just hand someone the ball with 5 seconds on the clock and they can produce something even when double teamed.
You see they didn't have an answer about Kobes 2 rings without Shaq
THEY NEVER DO!!!
The Lakers were a garbage fire after Shaq left…until they got Pau.
Against the 2 teams that beat Lebron.. 🫠
Yeah. 2 rings…duncan has 5 without shaq and lebron has 4
@@jaust9077 Arguments like that are the dumbest. Funny thing is, y'all actually thinks that makes since. Smh🤦🏾♂️
Kobe is the second best Shooting guard of all time behind Michael Jordan and third is Dwayne Wade. Kobe was my MJ of 2000 era. His shooting % was decreasing after injury of achilles tendon. But it's tough to compare numbers with other all time great players. You just can't compare SG shooting % and pure Center or Forward % shoting procentage. Kobe was like looney toons carton player (not Lebron), his shoots were one of toughest in the face of opponent and his opponents was really good defenders, of course they were many bad decisions of shoot taking and some people never like that. He play both eras, era with almost no defense and era with hand checking. He play on both end of the floors. He have many injuries during his carrer, but still he adjust his gameto be the best version of himself . People always disrespect other players from a championship team, to win a championship in basketball team sports, you need all guys to play defense and do his job, all of them. Of course kobe had Shaq, one of the most dominant duo of all time. But he still manage to win championship without Shaq, and then of course have Gasol, Fisher, Odom, bynum,ariza, artest... All great players who ever win championship, never win just of themselves, but they need support team behind their backs. What I never liked is the point that he win only one season MVP award, beacuse we all know he deserve it more than just one. MVP awards were geting players with one of the best team in east or west conference, but in today's game that is not the only criteria. If I had to choose all time great list, he will be in my top 3, behind Lebron James and MJ. I don't think Duncan have better carrer, but i think he plays more time with great supporting cast like Kobe Bryant have. If you want to choose the best list of all time greats it's always tough, they were many great players who plays in different eras, all have ups and downs in their carrers and in their game. But still we must apreciate what they do and what they accomplished and respect that. We all had different opinions about players and we like some guys more than others. But sometimes numbers never tell you the end of the picture.
allen iverson >>>>>wade
dwayne wade has team accolades and thats it
wade only had 3-4 seasons as an mvp caliber player at best
if you think avging 19-22.1 pts as a guard is superstar numbers you must be out your mind
wade may won fmvp but he was far from being a superstar, his second season
and the other 2 titles he wasn't even the best player on the team
iverson prime was much longer than wade dispute having a shorter career
also iverson was better than kobe in the 90s and early 2000s
and won mvp, 4 scoring and 3 stl titles
Kobe played both sides of the ball and was amazing on defense, they didnt even mention that once in this debate. He may have took a lot of ill advised shots which knocked his efficiency down but the guy just had supreme confidence like that. The last two championships he won, the 09' and 10's lakers teams, those teams were nothing special man. But Kobe still got the job down. Got Kobe in my top 3 all time.
and duncan lebron played defense also. if you have kobe in top 3 then you just riding his nuts
Yea, no.
Kobe stopped playing defense when Shaq left
@@J.D.M2.1 wrong A 12-time All-Defensive Team selection, a nine-time 1st team All-Defense and three-time 2nd team All-Defense,
No team in the NBA in 09’ and 10’ were special. Even the Celtics struggled with injuries in 2009
PRIME Kobe > prime Duncan. Who was the better player at their peaks? Give me Kobe all day.
Kobe played in BY FAR the most inefficient era when even top big men didn’t shoot 50% a lot of the time. And his last three injury riddled seasons destroyed his averages.
Duncan over Kobe is hilarious
LOL show the numbers then please
It’s not that hilarious
@@kylertatumtv9443 league avg fg% was 40-41 when Kobe played compared to 44-45% the last decade…Duncan for his career is only 50.6%, he had plenty of seasons at 49% or lower which isn’t that efficient for all time big man but nobody talks about that for some reason
Duncan over kobe clearly
@@sekokhan5307 😂
Why nobody points out the fact that the Lakers has beaten the Spurs in a playoffs series 4-2 times and one of those series lost Kobe didn't play in because of the Achilles. So that means Kobe is actually 4-1 vs the Spurs when it mattered the most. And Nick pointing out that Duncan never had a losing season, ok but Duncan never won back 2 back titles, never 3 peated. Kobe 3 peated and won back 2 back titles. Kobe Won his 5th ring before Duncan won his. I like tim but with all I just pointed out he can't be ranked higher than Kobe
This is a generational/preference conversation. The list is subjective and it is Nick's list. That being said, when listening to guys that PLAYED (and not one of these guys on the panel have), they have a high level of respect for both Timmy and Bean. Kenyon Martin says he could never rush Timmy but also could never figure Kobe out. Big Ticket says something similar. Matt and Stack say Kobe was the best player of their era. I think what we, the casuals, have to understand is that the players who played against Bean, respected his killa instinct which is why alot of players of that era rank Bean over Timmy. My personal preference would be the same, but I'm a SoCal/Laker/Kobe guy. And I hated the Spurs during that era BECAUSE of how great they were. So I lack objectivity as well.
I've often felt that Kobe gets extra credit for his swag which is what I think you're saying.
@@victorbrown3570, that's a good way to put it. His swag and style of play. Which was alot more flashy than Timmy's. Timmy was "boring", but a MONSTER and a silent killer, in his own right.
no most none Kobe fans have both Bron and Magic over him. the argument is between him and Duncan
The argument Ric made on Kobe's behalf vs Duncan is the same thing you can say about Lebron vs Kobe....This man said Kobe didn't have that nucleus of a good organization and good coaching and that's why he puts Kobe ahead of Duncan smh
Lebron haters ALWAYS contradict themselves
Lebron ran from competition
@@amenx Translation "LeBron refused to go solo vs 3 Hof so he teamed up 2"
Lebrons a coach killer and he colludes to create super teams...Spo is a HOF coach w or without Bron btw and Bron wanted him fired lol.
BronTardds are the most delusional, hypocritical sports fans of all time. And i say “sports fans” VERRYYYYY loosely...
Part of Kobe’s inefficiencies came bc he always played with a traditional big clogging the paint.. unlike Lebron..who always had a big that could shoot the 3.. going all the way back to big Z. todays game is more about spacing. If you think Kobe couldn’t be more efficient, you’re fooling yourself.. & since we talking about efficiency, I’m sure Kobe makes up with his FG percentage from the field at the free throw line. I’m not a Lebron hater but analysts like Nick Wright never use their own criteria against Lebron
I love when Rick Beuker is on the show. Always keeps it real
At least spell his name properly lol