Well of Radiance got nerfed and yet somehow might be better.
ฝัง
- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 14 มิ.ย. 2024
- i'm not even joking about that, it's getting a buff that might legit make it better than its current iteration. / datto for more discussion.
well and ward: 0:00:00
golden gun and berserker: 0:15:06
arc, solar, void, strand: 0:25:03
stasis: 0:45:56
source: www.bungie.net/7/en/News/arti...
edited by: xVauda (twitter/Twitch)
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Lmao spectral blades still forgotten rotting in the corner
It needs to go, nothing can save that super 😂 it was good in PvP but man. It's so fucking bad
@@TheRedDevil7494if aint broke, dont fix it. its not op so they can keep it.
@@fuzethehostage8898 Spectral isn’t broken, it’s not really a viable super to run in ANY content. It should see actual use.
@@fuzethehostage8898nah man, that shit is broken, it has the worst hit registration in the entire game, sometimes I needed to hit 7 times to kill someone
@@fuzethehostage8898Werid way of saying something is so bad it gets 0 play anywhere.
The „day of reckoning“ is a good reference because the last time well was nerfed because of reckoning bridge dattoG
Coulda sworn it got nerfed some time after that
@@Black2overlord It sorta did. All exotics that give back super energy while using your super got nerfed, including Phoenix Protocol.
@@Black2overlordthey made it so you could destroy the sword
@@brandondennis7527 also they removed the overshield it used to give.
Back in like plunder or something they took off overshield
Ward of Dawn should make you immune to knockback so you can actually challenge big bads inside a bubble and not get instantly evicted
Honestly a taunt effect would be cool as well to help that massive damage reduction feel useful. Huge DR inside the bubble is great but it means nothing when many enemies just sit outside or shy away from the bubble when it gets cast.
Or, you can melee
@@Black2overlord hey, I was gonna say that
@@Black2overlord Maybe we could do it without having to melee, whats wrong with that?
@@Black2overlord you can do that without a ward. Ward should let you be immune to that, considering it's a SUPER.
This would actually be sick as hell. Would actually fill a niche that nothing else does.
Best buff was to solar hunter. Knock em down having its cooldown nearly removed letting auto melee work properly will be a GODSEND for knife based builds. Having your knife just not refresh because you got a kill too quickly was so annoying. That being borderline removed is so good!
Finally someone said this. I was so sick of getting my knives eaten and the loop gone. It also could be an indirect buff to caliban’s hand as well.
@@babytricep437 Amen and that's also true. We don't know the exotic change list yet but I PRAY Calibans adds a self immunity to your own explosive knife. When I used that knife frequently, more than once I blew off my own fingers by having an enemy shoot at me as I'm throwing my knife.
Dude this. I've lost so many knife recharges by chain killing too fast and not waiting for the cooldown.
@@potato1341 it could also make arthryss’ awesome as well, hucking constant strengthened knives might be good at fucking champions and yellow bars in higher content
wonder if this is enough to fix YAS builds again
I think Bungie needs to apply the same design philosophy they used for Nighthawk and Galanor to Helm of Saint-14 if they want anyone to use that helmet beyond hot-swapping.
In fact, most lackluster Super related exotics could probably use that treatment.
Yeah. Should be standard.
It absolutely blows my mind how blight ranger exists in the state it does. How did they sign off on such a shit perk. It seems planned from the getgo. It could easily be a juicer for gathering storm in the same way cuirass is for thundercrash.
Many come to mind for warlocks, apotheosis veil, balidorse wrathweavers, and stormdancers brace are greaf examples, theyre just basically useless
It needs to work like phoenix where kills near the bubble gives super energy back. Then bubble would actually be somewhat comparable to Well
Actually I’ve been getting good neutral gameplay out of Saint using the Titan glaive, since it applies blind to that shield as well. It allows you to use the shield aggressively to block off point of advance and suppress/blind targets.
44:33 "We wanted to prevent this from happening on Prismatic Hunters in combination with Stylish Executioner" Even Bungie knows Snare Bomb is so ass that Hunters are gonna instantly swap out of them when Prismatic allows them to
Should even pretty quick since hunter starts with solar and stasis lul
It's getting buffed so it'll basically be venom bomb from D1 which I think is cool but it could lead to wombo combo returning. Past that void only having 1 melee option just feels bad in general for all classes even with titan having shield bash and toss like noone has been using toss because it just feels garbage. The OS it gave you wasn't great and it didn't get access to any debuffs without a specific aspect or specific exotic and thats without considering how heavy it feels to throw compared to literally every other ranged melee and it doesn't have the damage to support that weight. Luckily it's getting buffed too so we'll see
Why would you run threaded spike when combination blow exists
@@subzero4190295threaded spike has a better uptime and applies a debuff without the need of an aspect, combination blow requires liars handshake to be viable.
-Source, me a former D1 bladedancer main/current storms edge main
"the problem with bubble is you cant shoot through it" what if, the arms that let you shoot through barricades also applied to bubble but made either the health of the bubble or the resistance lower or both
Better yet reintroduce glasshouse and make it thin the bubble health but you can shoot through it
Honestly if they are just gonna keep kneecapping bubble like this and they want to say it's a defense super, then maybe they could stop fucking making it easier to kill the titan in the bubble. It already loses to well just in terms of if you kill a titan, his bubble is gone. Not the same for warlock. In PvP it's going to have even less hp now inside the bubble so a standard shotgun should be able to kill a bubble. Well still gives the same DR in PvP so I want to know who at bungie decided the bubble needed to not exist in the game since D1
Used to like those arms, I remember they got super nerfed (larger barricade cooldown) because of being good in PVP but it also applied to PVE as well, has that been rectified since then?
@@reliusornez1448EXACTLY, FUCKING THANK YOU. MY EXACT THOUGHTS.
you basically described what ursa furiosa does, minus the bubble and just having a big shield to shoot through
"well of radiance makes you effectively invulnerable."
*Zero Hour boss arena has entered the chat*
Key word "effectively"
Literally anything post legend honestly
@@MrSeagallobro doesn’t know the definition of effectively
@@avyntide ok lil bro
I was just about to say this XD
Im interested in the smoke bomb changes for hunter. The biggest problem nightstalker has had is that there are fragments that require powered melee kills, yet you get a crappy smoke bomb that does so little dmg that it isn't worth it.
They need a new melee option I want a dash attack with the spectral blade
hope void hunter eventually gets a backstab powered melee
@@forrestking687 that would slap
Those are useless to warlock too bc when in the world am I killing anything with my little boop buddy
I've been so butthurt about corrosive smoke's absence, I used to love using its chip damage
What gets me is the Ward of Dawn overshield regen outside the bubble is just... what you can already get with a Bastion Barricade. Which is very slow. Unless we can stack that regen, it seems.... incredibly lackluster.
It’s called an L my friend. You have to hold it.
yea but pair that with the ability to constant refresh by dipping in and out of bubble, it’s gonna be cracked
@@morellkenmoe1161 "cracked" might be a bit of a stretch
@@morellkenmoe1161 i have a perk for you bro its gonna blow your mind its called Repulsor Brace
it's nice at least. and even 1% overshield outside the bubble will be more melee damage, and full overshield and orb gen on melee kill
The Well of Radiance nerf could've been avoided if all Raid bosses (except Rhulk and Crota) wasn't designed for you to stand still during DPS phases.
chicken or egg
@@life-destiny1196bosses have been designed this way since D1. look at vault bosses they just sit there. except for Atheon I guess if you wanna count his shuffling as not standing there.
even then, well will still be the best warlock super, the free damage boost for just standing inside of it is way too convenient. its just fundamentally overpowered, it needs a full rework for it not to be the best pve super in the game.
@@chromeheartsonmeagreed, but maybe with radiant melees on song of flame it could see some competition. I’m looking forward to song of flame just for demolitionist dps strats again. So the DR from that super plus the ability spam means you keep radiant up and get insane ability spam. Could outclass well for more solo content.
THANK YOU!
ive been saying this for years, but hey people dont like to be informed these days.
the issue was never well, it was the fact bosses just sit there and let you do damage to them, and never interact or do anything to force movement.
the other issue, warlocks got nothing else for supers thats worth jack (maybe the new solar super will fix that), like cool we get to throw like 5 weak arse swords and were done......Yaaaay.....that super got so gutted when we lost the ability to regain energy on kill.
the solution was always designing encounters that push you away from wanting to use well, from either making it a detriment like in Rhulk. or pushes you out of it 99% of the time to the point youre better off getting more damage out of something like nova bomb or other supers.
In conclusion, Void Titans are now hard locked to either the Axe super or the Helm of Saint-14.
At that points what's the reason using the void titan subclass when it's prismatic subset has most the good stuff for it, that being the new aspect and super.
well still gives the damage buff so u dont rly need helm
Void titans are locked to not using void titan at all lol
The shield throw super is great in gms and dungeons etc. For boss dps though yeah the new axe super is a godsend. Thankgod they’re getting a one shot super finally.
@@jackryan5880for void synergy. Can’t have nonstop devour, overshield and volatile rounds on top of weakening etc, all at the same time on prismatic.
38:55 Ima be real with you dawg, unless they make a glaive with wolfpack rounds, I'm not using glaives
i want to throw my glaive at things like a spear
preferably without taking up an exotic slot either
Since the weapons of light buff is moving to the helm of saint 14. This could make Edge of action an absolutely viable option with its ability to deploy mini bubbles, since they synergise with the helm, you could get that insane damage resistance, weapon of light Damage buff AND a mini bubble anywhere you want which gives constant overshield when around it.
As a Bubble titan connoisseur, this prospect excites me
I appreciate the stasis buffs, but im not a fan of how bugnie's solution for making stasis better was just "everything gives you armor lmao". I wish they played more into the freezing/shattering of stasis, and made stasis the true CC subclass it was meant to be.
The problem is that's exactly how it was on release and exactly why they nerfed it. The cc uptime made everything a joke because nothing could actually hurt you when you could freeze entire rooms back to back with your abilities. GMs? Stasis. Master Raids? Stasis. Osiomancy warlock is still good to this day because it's cc uptime is really REALLY good (in part due to Agers Scepter which again...cc). Strand had this exact same problem with suspend and guess what....bungie nerfed it too. Too much cc just makes everything a joke so I actually appreciate them going in a different direction because cc just eliminates any difficulty within the game.
They could in the future.. I'm sure they've been overworked with Prismatic. Plus, anything crazy could make Prismatic way too broken.
Why so then we run back into the same issue we had with it before and with strand? It already freezes well overall and surviving was its biggest issue.
I swear we learn little from past mistakes. When something is too defining, it makes other things in game and gameplay wise irrelevant. Which is overall boring and bad for the games health. Giving things better identification helps keep “balanced” by allowing you to specialize and format into that specifically.
“What about prismatic” I’m sure there will be limitations that won’t allow it to be as potent in comparison to just using that subclass on its own. But that is just an assumption and anything can happen.
@@Black2overlord Because people like the OP never engaged with it when it was newly released, nor have they actually played it at all in the last little while, nor do they even probably do high end content where these kinds of changes actually matter.
What I took from everything stasis was: stasis hunter is still the dps king with a super that does ~40% more damage
Bungie forgot about: spectral blades, flechette storm, and another arc verb (currently not enough verbs compared to other classes).
Magnetic armor could either reduce damage/polarize damage taken to be a certain type while giving a benefit for taking arc damage.
Well is just going to require void overshield, frost armor, or woven mail.
Bungie also forgot about Chaos Reach but hey... We got that in common.
A useless roaming super and a useless 'would be' dps super lol.
@@robertpalmer8080 Nova Warp, giving second Strand and Stasis supers (gave ones already with 2 a third), Daybreak, Stormtrance and Arc Staff also all need a bit of love.
Assuming knockout activates with consecration on prismatic titan, it is going to be extremely strong. Three consecration slams with frenzied blade as your melee. Knockout buffs melee damage and heals you, plus you have 3 consecration charges, plus consecration gets buffed again?! Insane
Even though a good bit of players use pyrogale without consecration, I’m gonna use pyrogale on strand melee with knockout and consecration AND salvations grip and explode everything, really hyped for prismatic!
@@kiryukazuma-chan8803 yeah people are underestimating the potential with prismatic. At least a lot of the people I’ve talked to about it
Def agree, will be the exact load out I’ll run. With glacier grenade and facet of ruin the ad clear and major damage combined with the survivability will be one of the best combinations for Titan on launch.
I plan on using triple consecration with knockout and synthos + severance enclosure class item with the fragment that gives radiant to further buff monte for melee regen
@@kiryukazuma-chan8803 Honestly if prismatic had burning maul it would 100% replace sunbreaker, being able to have 3 consecrations that heal constantly is crazy. They were smart giving it hammer of sol
With well nerfed, ward of dawn is going to be paired with it way more often. It helps patch up the holes left by the lower defenses of ward by giving that overshield over time by being near the bubble.
Know what this does? Instead of "You're Warlock? GET ON THE DAMN WELL!", we'll the Hunter going "Hey Titan and Warlock. GET ON THE DAMN BUBBLE AND WELL!".
Yeah with well being nerfed good luck finding a lock who wants to play it at all. We already dont want to do well, and no, im not pairing it with some dumb titan bubble that you cannot shoot out of.
@@newax_productions2069 I hate to tell you this, but that's going to be the new normal, put down well, put down bubble over back 1/3ish of the well. Constant voidshield Regen plus bonus damage
@@newax_productions2069 You have a strong opinion without even knowing the changes. Bubble gives an overshield being near the bubble now.
@@newax_productions2069you mean, how it was done as a standard in d1?
"don't have a lot of opportunities for this kind of combat to shine" Because THE WELL occupies all of those opportunities. I love that well still has both healing and offensive buffs, but ward still only gets one by default. Moving towards good changes, but falling way way short.
Also lmao at Datto's "even someone like ME"
It’s because you can’t shoot out of it. Even if it did everything Well can do, it wouldn’t matter because you can’t shoot through it. It’s pure defense, pure defense has no place in this game, with or without Well.
@@MA-yv2tbI think the only thing stopping them from letting you shoot out of the bubble is how busted that would be in crucible.
Ward of dawn + well combo is coming back for sure now for GM and master raid content. Titan drops bubble behind the dps spot and well goes on it, overlapping the bubble. The overshield trickle + full refill if you step in will compensate for the slashed healing, allowing us to keep the full damage boost of the well
they could have always designed encounters around not having a well, and funny thing people would have not used well, look at rulk
but they chose not to because its easier not to, they have used well as a scape goat just as much as players have
watch them not bother to do so and also not actualy rebalance encounters now its nerfed -.-
@@MA-yv2tbthats just not true, it was literally the well of d1 which is why they nerfed it so heavily in d2y1
I knew what Datto meant as soon as I saw the title. The lingering Radiant buff after you leave the Well is great, even an extra 8 seconds of Radiant after the Well goes.
I mean hunters can dodge and give everyone 10 seconds of radiant
@@gabrieltorres6633 Yes but that would require you to actually run acrobat's dodge.
@@gabrieltorres6633except it’s an extremely long cooldown relative to the others, and aren’t worth it when you can RDM spam with rockets or even GLs
@greenlukesky4615 Yes, and how many people are actually doing very tight optimal and niche dps builds? The majority of the player base isn't checking you for min maxing, loadout swaping, damage stacking to the highest degree. Even then, a powered melee attack by any of the class makes you radiant.
@@gabrieltorres6633rdms are not a “niche” build, they’re one of the top dps builds in the game atm lmao
When I run renewal grasps, I always use whisper of chains since the damage reduction stacks. With 100 resil, renewals, and chains, you could get upwards of 70% damage reduction. With this update, not only will the total damage reduction of renewals be lower, but chains will no longer provide the extra dr to stack with renewals (presumably), which is a pretty significant nerf in my eyes.
But you are now getting healing with frost armor so it’s better
You will also get dmg resist when you jump out if your duskfield if I understand it correctly, so you will have a lingering dmg resistance.
Kind of, but I think the lingering damage resistance will be NUTS, especially for party play.
@@pirate135246Depends on the amount of healing. If it’s the same little nugget of health as is in the game right now, it’ll be pointless in high end content just like it is now. If it’s an amount of health like the Recuperation mod, then it’ll be decent. We’ll have to see.
@@CephalonAxii I'd say around Cure x1 would be pretty healthy
Datto, just wanted to say that you, Trv, and Jez really helped me through hard times. Keep up the good work and I’m excited for more videos in The Final Shape.
Same here. All the laughs and entertainment has kept me sane too.
Agreed. They're the light in the destiny community (no pun intended).
-Insert Ludwig parasocial rant-
You can thank a creator or creators without being para social. Relax @@TheCyanHawk.
If you were looking to Datto for inspiration, you were better off not being a part of this world.
Ward of Dawn changes make it straight up worse imo. Void overshield is basically no health on high end content so you'll just get one shot when you leave just like you do now.
Don't forget it is now even worse in pvp. Ward has literally zero place in the game now.
Ward sucks now lmao
@@reliusornez1448well and ward shouldn’t have a place in pvp at all
@@reliusornez1448Ward is currently the best PvP super. It has been for years. It’s time for it to die, and this won’t even be enough.
LFG raiding gonna become absolutely unbearable
"They're not supposed to design stuff around this, they can now tune damage!" = They won't.
EDIT after FS: It's not better, it's downright useless in solo stuff and contest level stuff. RIP Well.
Also everything currently in the game is tuned and designed around it like every plate based dps phase or war priest with standing in and aura
Yeah they definitely aren’t going back and tuning all the stuff they actually did design around it. Old content just got harder but hopefully over leveling and all our new stuff won’t let it get too bad. But I could definitely see it being the case that they fuck it up and make the old content way harder than the new stuff by accident.
@@doomsday_72Only things tuned for well are maybe master raids. Normal raids are tuned around having a pulse and nothing more. And GMs you definitely don't need a well.
@@doomsday_72 the war priest aura existed in destiny 1 before well was in the game. Just because a mechanic involved standing in an area doesn’t mean it’s designed around well, it just means well is most beneficial to that encounter. I think a better example of encounters designed around well are ones that force you to move around the map, like Caretaker or Rhulk
@@elegy8187 in d1 warpriest staggered really easily preventing you from getting shit on.
Hi renewal grasp hunter here, my main take away is this: the build got a pretty harsh nerf with the removal of chains and the instant 25 percent damage reduction base, it's kinda cool to be able to carry the damage resist that's left out with you but I could already have near 100% uptime on the grenade with anything that makes crystals, so it's a flat nerf all things considered.
Damn. It sounded like Renewals were gonna be an awesome build in which to invest. Glad there is someone here to provide some clarity. Saved me some ascendant shards. Lol.
Felt. This was one main thing I thought is bs. I mean instant 25 and 40% gone instantly. Sure we get 36ish% with rime but still missing our other 40% from chains. All to make a shard....f that. Renewal got hit hard. For no reason. And after we just got our renewal timer nerf reversed. I still hide in my stasis crystal if stuff is bad but yeah... uncalled for
Stasis has caught nothing but nerfs and build murders for the entire year of Lightfall and seems that it'll keep going :D
@fleefie wish they buffed bad shit and left good shit alone. Super oppresive stuff is understandable but the niche good stuff...like wtf
wait til it’s in the game to see if it’s good
Personally, don't like the Nerf to Ward of Dawn and I'm skeptical on Well. I don't think this will fix the whole "forever cursed to use well" problem at all as its still the best (and thanks to Ward nerf) ONLY option for buffs and survivability during DPS since you can't shoo out of Ward. If anything, I'd bet the meta might become Well + banner of war (or Ward for the oversheild) to become immortal during DPS. So now we need two people using the same build/super and we haven't fixed anything...WTF?!?
I was thinking the exact same thing, it isn’t that well is too strong, it’s that nothing else is worth a fuck. I’m supposed to sit there and plink at the boss with time consuming lack luster damage supers? They designed the whole game around “stand there and dps” and now because of some overly vocal, tone deaf, prominent members of the community they’re back tracking.. pathetic showing from bungo
Just watch those people who say the well/ward and other stuff changes are good, just to complain they died in a well in the future dmg phase. If bungie really wants to focus on well's dmg potential just boost the dmg % to 75% and then reduce the healing... Instead buffing any dmg they just give U radiance after stepping out of well? Bruh if my team were to step out of well, the warlock would just snap his finger and give everyone radiance once they step out of well...
Yup. We’re right back to Well/bubble combo again. Nothing changes.
The only change is sever is now a must for master bosses. Well is still going to be used as long as both ward of dawn is ass and they make damage encounters that require well for survivability
Literally what I’ve been trying to say. I don’t want warlocks to be stuck with well forever but when hunters have no good support abilities and ward of dawn is kinda diminishing returns tbh why would it be any other way? I am curious to see how the raid play style changes, Im too casual to know how you pull off master Atheon without being able to tank tons of damage
"Shooting into the Nova Bomb vortex deals precision damage to affected enemies"
*7.00 AM phone alarm*
Div super sounds crazy
Maybe boss encounters will have a designated ad clear guy with a trinity ghoul or something from now on to make sure the other 5 players don't die to giga spam from a thousand ads into the well
"i call ad clear"
The only thing i can see coming out of the Bubble rework is potentially some kind of dps combo with Offensive Bulwark & Shield Bash, maybe Peregrine Greaves? But we're not doing this with Bastion walls right now, so I'm in doubt.
40:47 lol it's because it's handheld supernova. It was moved to the charged version of mag grenades with void 3.0
Ah great, now two classes are forced to run a super
Don't play with those people, they'll change their minds eventually, once they realize no one wants to play with them. Play however you want to.. if you aren't going for a world first raid, who cares.. it doesn't mean anything in real life.
@@hhasteGood luck living through getting shot at by 50 adds and a boss without any method of regen or damage resist. Stuff like Well and Ward are 100% necessary in higher end content.
I really feel like this isn't going to change things. Every boss other than Hulk requires moving around. They need to fundamentally change the way boss encounters are. It's always tank and shoot this tiny crit spot. Every. Single. Boss.
The only reason you feel like you're going to die in Well of Onslaught is because of the constant adds during the boss. That's not how raid encounters are.
Even down to how the damage phases are, it's always a limited number of attempts or the boss enrages and wipes. So either you do maximum damage by standing in one spot or gg. They need more interactive damage phases so not even warlock player needs to run Well. I cant remember the last time I ran anything other than solar for a boss.
@@avyntide You have other mehtods of regen and damage resist besides well or dawn. Stop relying on a crutch and get better.
@@NikFlyer ah right my mistake, i forgot everyone should be running healing grenades all the time. sounds fun
EDIT: actually nevermind. Nobody should be using healing nades. Those are also a crutch. So are exotics. If you ‘need’ exotics or abilities or supers to beat something then you’re crutching and suck at the game
Curious how a well next to a ward will work? The trickle of the void shield just outside of the ward and healing/radiant of the well seems like it could be powerful. And when you are close to death you just pop into the ward till regen happens.
I can see a world where with the well reduction of damage resistance you could potentially run a well and a bubble behind it to give you the survivability that you lost + some
(sigh)…and now we’re right back in the well/bubble meta again from ten years ago. This isn’t the win you think it is.
@@nicholascazmay2126 oh is it? only started few months before beyond light so i have no clue what any other meta was but i want something new that isnt just the same old well lock every single raid/dungeon/gm
@@jameysotelo540a few years ago WoL gave 10% more damage than well, so people would put a bubble behind the well during damage phase to continually refresh WoL while keeping well’s health regen
I’m actually really excited for the melee shield throw buff. I did feel like it had a habit of missing ricochets that I thought should hit
The double damage buffs to Shield Toss and Knockout, plus the improved tracking and extra bounce, are gonna make that combo absolutely COOK on Prismatic. Mark my words.
The question is will they rebalance how much damage we take in stuff designed for current Well if they even bother at all
Highly unlikely.
They won't.
Everything in the game is perfectly doable without well now so why would they do that
@@zachcate7102Because people are so used to using it it’s become a crutch and people genuinely think that it’s needed for most content in the game when it’s not. The fact that for years esoteric has been soloing content on all 3 classes and people still refuse to understand this really baffles my mind.
You do not need well for anything
Frost Armor max stacks being a 36% damage resistance sounds really great until you realize Woven Mail is a 45% DR that you can get from a single orb of power. Stasis will truly never beat the “worse than Strand” allegations.
Bro Woven Mail has been nerfed twice now, it's only 30% at this point.
Thread of Warding is getting nerfed to 5 seconds from 10, though it can be refreshed, and it doesn't heal you like Stasis Shards, but you can run armor mods to let the orbs heal you. I think Shards will give more up time and healing overall though, and now you get more crowd control with Cold Snaps than before. I think Stasis and Strand are going to be much more alike in effectiveness and the artifact mods will tip the scales.
i think the reason why is because you get frost armor by literally anything, like you get frost armor from shard pick up and shatters and thats like all of stasis combined so yea
Frost armor is better than woven mail if you are only relying on orbs, if you use titan or the hunter helmet woven mail is better
Strand dropped as the perfect subclass I dont think theres room for stasis to come close
Those Well and Bubble changes are the most "Bungie" changes I've ever seen.
Before raid groups needed a couple of Well locks, now they need those locks and a couple of Bubble titans on top of that. I bet all titans will have a blast running fucking Bubble instead of having fun.
Honestly, this level of incompetence is insane.
Bold to assume every warlock enjoyed using well.
Warlock main… THANK FUCK, I CAN USE ANYTHING ELSE BESIDES WELL!!
Whisper of Reversal fragment sounds intermittently funny: imagine an overload minotaur teleporting behind you, slapping you across the cheeks and stunning itself with the ensuing slow effect
Datto for context, the Chaos Accelerant magnetic nade is the modern hand-held supernova. It was still very good, but in CA builds everyone just defaults to vortex nades, so this is actually a really big buff for void lock builds!
We're killing the LFGs with this one
Preach brother! Lfg was already a crap shoot to complete master raid content as-is. I can't see how it won't become even more toxic after these changes...
hey Datto just wanted to say thanks for being a staple in this community for as long as you have. been here since The Dark Below, have always loved the videos, no matter the topic. here's to hoping for the best for this game we love in The Final Shape.
Spark of Beacons getting a change
Bungie: yo we got a spike in usage because of this popular weapon that released
What we expect: Spark of Beacons now only triggers on sniper headshot kills with the Speed Boost buff active
What we got: have fun with Thunderlord and Tarnation
kinda pointless change honestly. if you're using this with thunderlord you're already going to kill enemies in range with the thunder strike or you know the heavy weapon type specifically meant to clear ads?
the change isn't a *bad* thing just kinda confusing cause why would you waste heavy ammo to proc a sub par blind
Didn’t they nerf sunshot because it was better this season because of the artifact? We already know Bungie doesn’t think thinks through
@@Hal_142 indirect champion stunning. Thunderlord is anti-overload to start with, right? Blinding Unstoppable and Barrier champions because of a single aspect is incredibly handy. It'll be arguably the single best Arc exotic to be running with an Arc subclass catered to add clear.
Stasis buffs? Splendid
Warlocks post nerf be like. Running well anyway because every other super in raids is worthless. Nova bomb dps is cheeks, chaos reach is too slow, dawnblade is cheeks, stasis and stormtrance are ad clear and stasis is also slow and cheeks for damage. We dont have a pyrogale or celestial nighthawk to make our damage supers a targeted nuke so what now.
dawnblade is completely fine, dawn chorus makes it melt.
@@newax_productions2069 but it takes too long to do dps. Weapons do better dps. That's the issue. The other 2 dump their supers in no time and get to use their heavies for dps immediately after.
strand warlock does quite a lot of damage, right?, and they buffed the nova bombs here
Needlestorm is great
The green super with necros rotation is like top 4 dps in the game
Bubble damage change needs to be reverted
Why? Actually makes Helm of Saint useful
@@JDxxatteis No it doesn't, it just makes it a new "Cuirass Of The Falling Star"
@@loogiemusmaximusoftides8540 except it buffs your entire teams damage so no
@@JDxxatteis yes, that’s why it’s another Cuirass, you just swap to it, you don’t use it
@@JDxxatteis 😭they made helm useful by dumperstering the base super. Look how they massacred our boy
I love these big videos it's so nice to chill and just read and listen about all the patch notes
I've been killed in a well multiple times. Exploding shanks always do it. If you get a whole bunch of them at one time it's over and there have been a few PVE events that have done that.
That would classify as overwhelming damage.
Well doesn't exactly stop you from being one shot 😂 of course Exploder Shanks are gonna kill you in a Well cuz Well ain't gonna be able to heal you if youre at 0HP
Yeah in higher end content you are not necessarily immune in well, unstops or exploding enemies or like a bunch of adds can kill you in the well if you’re not careful, that’s why on my welllock i reinforce it with healing rift and healing nades to give me a overshield and additional restoration or just dip out of the well if it’s a ton of adds. Usually like in legend and higher.
All though typically I mostly die due to being smacked out of well sometimes by majors and then get shot then.
Bubble having its offensive part being traded for more defensive focused might make it more irrelevant, I haven’t seen or used bubble in a long time and it’s damage buff being removed from the super why would I use bubble with helm when I can run thundercrash or pyrogal burning maul dump damage. Idk bubble seems even less relevant now
(Here’s an idea bring back glasshouse keep its extend bubble buff perk, have it activate weapons, increase the range and overshield charge rate for players near bubble)
Well nerf isn’t to much of a surprise it could be interesting with how it’s reworked in more fast action/movement encounters, and warlocks have been given mor freedom for super picks in raids besides Wellock
Weapons of light will still be in the game. It’s going to be part of the exotic perk on Helm of Saint 14. That exotic will essentially give ward of dawn offensive capabilities, plus the defensive buff we will see to ward of dawn.
@@Agalloch1234sure but why are people gonna run bubble when well is just.....better lmao
I think it's over for bubble if these changes stay. should just let use shoot through it
Yeah I don’t see well going away - we’re just going to get stuck with a bubble Titan chained to our hips… again.
I didn't know I was running the worst Titan build with bubble and shield throw...
33:40
Datto: "I need water. Solar."
Katara: "Long ago the four nations lived together in harmony. Then everything changed when Bungie released solar 3.0."
On the armor hot swapping argument, I really like how they are handling it on the pvp side where if you change your exotic you lose your stored super charge
so they expect us to run around and doge in the middle of a boss dps that goes against like 90% of all raid boss encounters
Yes. Exactly
And thus by running around avoiding ogre eye blasts, exploding shanks, exploding thrall, exploding harpies, thrall melee’s you will do LESS boss dps thus taking more phases to beat boss thus increasing chances of wipes and finally thus increasing player time in content.
Bungie spreadsheets & data will show players playing longer times. More ceo bonuses for private jets & yachts boys.
@@EchoDoctrineBuddha is that you? 😂.
You are on point tho memes aside.
@@EchoDoctrine Or yknow just get woven mail or frost armor lol
@@EchoDoctrineI don't remember a single dps phase that spawns exploring Thralls or Shanks during it, it is simply cruel. Warlock rift can literally solve most survivability problem for experienced players during dps.
1.7k Hour Titan Here, Ward of Dawn is now just a Slightly Better Barricade. Forcing the use of the Offensive Bullwark Aspect, Mandatory Saint-14 Armour. This isnt build friendly. Unless its getting a Barricade level Cooldown its something Im going to very sadly put on the good memory shelf next to Synthocep Hammers, Ursa-Furiosa GM's, and Cuirass Thundercrash.
Thanks for the takes and time going through this!
Bungo devs when making an encounter that isn’t “stand on plate to do damage” is too hard
Rhulk, Atraks, Taniks, Crota, Ir Yut, Atheon, Templar, 3rd Encounter GOS, Sanctified Mind, etc.
surprisingly quite a lot of encounters that don't use plate mechanics for dps
Templar is well heavy, someone stuns and everyone else nukes, atheon also has you stand still ( the dmg window is too small to be jumping around, quite alot of encounters, even if theres no plate, you dont have the time to be jumping around so well is pretty important @thomasw7908
@@thomasw7908taniks, Croat, Ir yut, Atheon though do not have a “plate” to stand on. Still requires a dps phase where the team group up which is the problem with “plate” dps, not the “plate” itself
Rhulk and Crota are literally designed to be anti well of radiance and people still brute force well of radiance into it. Unless the encounter is "Every single player is seperated" or "you are constantly moving large distances", well of radiance will always forced into any single encounter.
ah yessss!!! Ward of dawn the super that I totally always use, and totally don't forget even exists
Ah yes indirect Wicked Implement buff, shoot the scout rifle and build dr from the shards that track you from miles away
More of a GM weapon though, cant see any use for solo ccontent
Exactly what I was thinking
stasis hunter dropping renewal duskfields inside wells might be a play to get some of that team dr back
As someone who abuses tf out of loadout hotswapping, I understand where you're coming from with the frustration. I don't necessarily want bungie to put a stop to it, but I understand why players don't want to have to change their builds mid fight to be more opimized.
That said, I really enjoy it. Being able to have an add clear build on my sunbracers that can keep entire rooms locked down, then being able to swap to rain of fire right before damage to top the DPS chart is super fun and encourages me to min max even further. It isn't healthy for the balance of the game and it removes a lot of the give-and-take aspects of buildcrafting, but its also super fucking fun.
No it's perfectly healthy cause otherwise we wouldn't even get Loadouts.
People who want Loadouts locked in any shape or form are flat out rRded.
The "well is too good, so we're nerfing bubble" is absolute brain rot. Actual flies festering in the heads of the balance team rn. Helm of Saint 14 better do so much more than that to make it good again.
44:32 Not breaking Invisibility is also a consideration for Assassin's Cowl- really any instance of Void invisibility, basically- not that I have a concerted Strand Assassin's Cowl build (if that's even a thing?), but I was running some low-tier stuff with an arc build, then just swapped subclasses to Strand for a bounty, and noticed Invisibility would break whenever I caught the Snare which raised an eyebrow, for sure.
Strand Assassin's Cowl is super dope, actually. It was my most played build last season when Whirling Maelstrom dropped (the artifact made it very busted--increased tangle damage and free ammo generation from tangle kills both apply to that aspect), and I've put some miles on it this season too.
Strand, much like I think they're going for with this Stasis rework, is good at CC and DR but not so great at health recovery (Banner of War doesn't count) compared to Solar or Void; adding Cowl to the mix is a very welcome survivability buff, giving you invis and a heal on Threaded Spike, grapple melee, and finisher kills. Catching the spike at bad times has been a sore point, though, so at least it won't break invis any more (now make it not override grapple melee pls).
@@life-destiny1196 Thanks for the reply, bc even as I typed that parenthetical in my comment I was like, "There are absolutely Strand builds with Assassin's Cowl, I just haven't looked into it."
Big agree on the Bubble takes. Swapping armor mid encounter is lame. The WoL change promotes that. Really unhappy about that.
Hynra saw the patch notes and fucking died
renewal is actually a bigger nerf because you have to stay in there for the full 8 seconds to get that rather than instantly
That's assuming you aren't picking up stasis shards to give yourself frost armor stacks prior to throwing your duskfield grenade. I'd say it's not that big of a deal
Like other guy said, there's a ton of Frags for Frost Armor, you should never be going into a Renewal use without some stacks already. And the ramp up that is there is balanced by it lingering when you leave.
@@skeletor8951 hmm good points, guess we'll have to see how easy it is to maintain
@Datto I feel like you missed the first sentence of the paragraph about One-Two Punch and grapple melee. They straight up said "grapple melee can't be used after firing your weapon, which removes 12P", and I'm pretty sure that means "we lock out grapple melee on firing your weapon for the duration of one-two punch".
That sounds like a really unintuitive change. Kinda lazy approach to nerfing strand Tita
They were talking about the interim between the grapple and the melee. Right now, you can shoot then immediately use the melee. This change makes firing your weapon remove the grapple melee as an option after firing. There is no change otherwise
1:05:18 The only reason I would use Stasis Titan is if they introduce a new Super ability. Personally, I would like to form a huge iceberg over my head and chuck it at my opponents. I’ll stick to Consecration.
Stasis and Strand all need second supers, one-and-dones for Behemoth, Shadebinder, Berserker and Threadrunner, and roamings for Broodweaver and Revenant. Dawnblade, Sentinel and Arcstrider already had two each so didn't need a new. completely unrelated super.
I really don't think we'll see people swapping to helm for bubble, it doesn't stack with radiant/well, and we'll have well with its8 sec lasting radiant, torches for radiant on melee, and acrobat dodge. It wasn't needed, and it does a better job of defining subclass identity to keep them separate
Why even run well if someone is running helm with bubble? It does everything well does but with way better survivability
@@swaayyzee7926 If people want to be as braindead survivable as they are now they'll almost certainly need to be stacking a Well/Song of Flame with a Ward for both the healing and the Overshield Regen.
100% agree, and the change to a proximity buff is huge for addressing the core foundational weakness of Ward vs Well in that you need to leave it to do damage, which Helm has always been a bandaid fix for.
I’m also over hot-swapping loadouts mid encounter. I think a simple way around it is to have loadouts become locked once an encounter starts. You’ll be able to edit your loadout pre-encounter during rally, but if you don’t have the right loadout on then the only way to change it will be to wipe. Might have the potential to increase difficulty in endgame content.
Or maybe not do that you wannabe elitists that probably can't even go flawless nor flawless a GM solo.
I can solo almost everything if I'm willing to sit and shoot dumb ai for 50minutes and i also solo flawless every weekend so i have enough base experience.
All this locking stuff bs is literally anti qol and makes the game feel even worse,if i wanna use an smg for a room encounter then swap to my polaris when i have to fight vandal snipers on arc threat that do 95% of my health through walls i should be able to do just that.
See this is dumb because there will always be build for different occasions. What I mean by this is I have a build meant for boss melts yet it's not great for ad clear and trying to survive the encounter before the dps phase. I shouldn't have to suffer in encounters because I can't swap out of my melt build not meant for handling getting my ass shot at by hundreds of enemies.
Not to mention, there is no skill gap in hot swaps. Within my first attempt at it in an encounter I managed to get a hang of it within the same encounter no time flat. Not only that it adds to the strategy of an mmo rpg, such as before going into the raid you have to think of what build is good for this boss and the ads in the encounter.
@@GladdyBladdy Imo you are completely right that is has no skill gap and its just a press of 2 buttons. But i dont think this adds anything to the strategy. There isnt really a lot of thought put into ad clear vs boss build. You have one build with nighthawk on and another build that doesnt. You arent committing to anything and going into the menu just stops the flow of gameplay compared to games that let you hotswap without going into menus. Instead of making a strategy where you have a build that can do boss damage but also has some ad clear, or being full boss damage and having a weakness, there is no commitment at all, and some exotics are just made to be swapped to and never for anything else.
Its a small thing in destiny and idrc if nothing changes but i just dont like them at all.
If we had encounters designed more like mmorpgs, maybe then Ward of Dawn could have a place. Imagine a boss charging up a big raid wipe, and having to use WoD to block it.
Even then, I feel like that still wouldn't be good, since WoD is really the only Super that can do that. Titans would then be forced to use it, like how Well is now. It would be nice to have more "tank role" stuff for the other classes, like maybe a new Warlock Stasis Super that makes a huge shield wall with spaces to shoot through.
It all comes down, like you mentioned, to how Destiny just isn't built with hyper-defensive stuff in mind. Maybe it will have something like the mmorpg "holy trinity of classes" added someday.
In the exotic gear pass, Citan’s Ramparts are gonna get adjusted to let you shoot through the bubble. Calling it.
That would help in some sense, but then "we need a well" goes back to "we need a well and a ward of dawn."
@@life-destiny1196Yup - that’s already where this is going and it’s painful. Just creating more super slaves in raids and going back to a dead meta. Can’t wait 👎
Just a question, would healing from the healing rift stack with well? Also would boots of the assembler/stag be the play if going for a defensive well type build?
my opinion has arrived
since when did bungie care about the community
Get a new joke
My comment has arrived
Same tbh
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA 😐
stop
finally i know how to feel about these changes
The exotic armor changes better not be hella nerfs as well, i stg
Yeah, the Grapple (> release) > Shoot > Melee combo, while fairly difficult to pull off because of the short windows of time for doing the inputs after the grapple, is something I have pulled off once without practise. It's also what I *thought* people were doing, rather than shooting first... whoopsie.
Ward of dawn is so shit yet its getting nerfs
I don't understand why they are moving the best part back to an exotic. It just crippled build variety.
The lingering radiant buff is nice, but with that being said if I start getting cooked in a well by shit tier enemies we are gonna have a problem
Yeah I’m skeptical about the whole thing. It just sounds like we’re getting trapped in the well/bubble combo loop again, and I’m not a fan.
Song of flames is the new well of radiance, but instead of standing in one place you have to stick with the castor
Thank you for your hot take on hotswapping, I have been over that shit for a long ass time now too.
So now Titan's are stuck into using Saint-14? I love Saint-14 but shifting Weapons to an exotic is dumb tbh
Renewal Grasp definitely got hit
Curently, you get the damage ressistance from the crystal located in the middle of the Duskfield (asssuming you use the upgraded grenade aspect) and the damage ressistance from the exotic which is instantaneous. After the TFS launch you lose the ressistance from that crystal and the ressistance from the exotic is not instantaneous, but it requires a ramp up of several seconds. Now the crystal will have a chance of giving extra stacks if you are near so that ramp up is slightly faster but you still dont have that extra layer of protection since both sources (aspect+exotic) give the same buff.
I'm actually fine with losing the instantaneous DR. With the changes, we can effectively maintain DR even after Duskfield expires via picking up Stasis shards to refresh/increase frost armor stacks, which means we can maintain DR between Duskfield grenades allowing for a little more aggressive playstyle. As prior, you had to disengage before your duskfield expired so that you weren't instantly obliterated as your DR is instantly removed when the grenade expired.
@@nobodyscomment929 Yes, that is true, you can enter with with a max ed DR, keep refreshing it in the dome and then keep it for next but my main point was that you don't have 2 DR layers inside the dome.
The new chunk healing from knockout might be nice on prismatic titan. basically full health yourself on a consecration slam to a group of enemies. Along with all the other knockout benefits
I could see these changes leading people to placing well, putting a bubble on the well. and using the well+bubble combo as your "safe haven" during dps phase. walk into well+bubble, heal, gain overshield, gain radiance, then leave so you can do damage again. I don't see it happening much, but it'd be an interesting way for it to be done
in my opinion ward of dawn is dead. it is now just a towering barricade with extra steps
My issue with the grapple tangle nerf is that if they wanted the tangle to be a traversal tool, why nerf the initial grapple refund? They probably could’ve made it so that if you grapple melee it spends a chunk of your grenade charge. That way it keeps the traversal tool for the hunter and other grapple tangles while making it so the melee combo chain is not possible.
That’s not what they’re doing, you’ll still get your grapple back when you grapple to a grapple tangle, it’s just that the grapple tangle doesn’t get refunded duration when you grapple to it
I was confused and concerned at first too but thankfully it was just confusing phrasing. A grapple point currently lasts for a set time (15 seconds or so I think) before disappearing but that time limit refreshes completely when someone grapples to it.
The change is that the point itself will have only 5 seconds added to its lifespan whenever someone grapples to it, with the added time diminishing by 1 second for each additional grapple to that point rather than a full refresh of the timer.
@@DarkDemon259 oh that makes a lot more sense now, thanks. But that makes this change a little silly, no? I mean it effectively doesn’t change as long as you do your damage within the ~30 seconds the tangle will be up so long as One Two Punch still works.
@@Reeeset Like Datto said, it is still doable but this change will put a soft time limit on that particular combo before a new grapple point has to be made which would make it more impractical. Think of it as a change targeting that specific solo titan grapple melee spam strategy the same way changes were make specifically targeting the 6 golden gun star eater strategy.
The really high level players who can do the combo as efficiently as a robot will still make good use of that time limit and will be able to put out a good chunk of damage before the point disappears. But the majority of players won't be able to match that kind of output and uptime.
As it is now, you can simply do that combo indefinitely once a grapple point is in place as long as you grapple to it once every 15 seconds or so to keep the point alive. Consider the RoN Explicator encounter as an example: just put a grapple point above the boss when damage starts and you can use that same grapple for all 3 plates because you keep refreshing the timer to 15 seconds. After the change, you can only really use it to chunk damage for one plate then the point would expire in the time it takes even the best players to go to the 2nd plate to get the buff. The Navigator catalyst (which titans need to make grapple points on their own) would probably still be on cooldown and they wouldn't be able to do any damage until they make a new one as the entire build revolves around having that combo.
I think with the insane well healing nerfs bubble will be more valuable as an extra defense option.
Could the “menu game” be addressed by locking access to changing full loadouts after an encounter begins, while still letting people swap individual items (like the example of the weapon that isn’t working and trying something else in the moment)?
As a returning players from Forsaken, Armor Loadouts is one of the Huge improvements added to the game and I've enjoyed it a lot setting up multiple builds and such, but when I started trying to minmax things out ( which I like a lot ) it ended up as a Headache, Hot-swapping 2-3 times for a Insane DPS rotation for example for Strand titan Making your own Green Grapple Orb and then Swapping into Puglist/One-two punch shotgun and tractor and start mashing buttons and fast as possible for the most amount of melees hits which I Did and abused it where I could with the boys when we went to reclear all the previous raids that we missed but at some point it felt too much and too powerful and Thank god it got fixed. In my Opinion Armor Loadouts should be Locked when Encounter starts to Avoid future nerfs to certain things which aren't broken on their own but broken when Hot swaps exists.
What did ward of dawn do to deserve such a butchering
My whole thing with Loadout Swapping is I feel its what ever in its current form. Armor Swapping was a thing that some people would do before the Loadout system was a thing and all the loadout system did was make it more convenient and easier to do so, especially on console for menu loading times could be a killer.
It offers the people who want to go that extra mile to optimize the opportunity and reward for doing so, and its not mandatory either in 99% of play where everyone else is using the loadout system as you'd expect someone to.
The important thing is for Bungie to not step over that line where the average players start to feel like loadout swapping is mandatory.
Also they really did just Punch Strand Titan as hard as it was punching those bosses.
My guy fully misses the part of Offensive Bulwark where they made it so that it regenerates a portion of your void overshield on melee kill, like, the best friggen thing to ever happen to Offensive Bulwark XD
Yeah man, I yelled out loud "YES!!! FINALLY!" when I saw that.
I think a way to have both Well and Ward work together would be to let players shoot thru the Ward and have Well only give damage.
Bu healing tho....f the damage buffs on well I want the healing fantasy thas wha I was promised an thas wha I want...an not jus in the subclass at tha point might as well use titan as now they get all the healing despite the warlocks being advertised as such, I instead want well wi healing bu no damage buff as then it fits into the healing playstyle...
An btw, if thas all, tha literally jus makes titans ward better if ward can do both bu well cant
@@Yumiaia-26 I meant that Ward keeps the defense but gets rid of the offense
@@smallss7197 mm....I see...ig jus cause I'm a healing fantasy warlock I don like the idea of the weaker healing an survivability based part...
Type in English oh my god. @@Yumiaia-26
I also like how arc Titan got nerfed a little while ago and left with little to nothing rn and it’s a surprise that it’s complete trash without thundercrash.
Should’ve been left alone when we had pulse/storm grenade spam(but arc warlocks can do so with no issue) now we’re completely useless with no survivability. Somehow it’s a surprise that we are worse than useless now.
Its good on pvp tho
@@senormacaco2834 that is not the issue at all
didnt they just buff arc titan
@@9ballciety u wanna use arc Titan the way it is now in high end content. RIGHT NOW? Or u wanna use something else that’s more efficient?
@@logankimp5563 whatever is fun
But what about encounters where the mechanics force you to stand in one spot to do damage to the boss with no way to protect yourself. The caretaker, ogre in kings fall, ogre in warlords ruin, necromancer in ghosts of the deep, fist encounter in warlords ruin. just to name a few.
So with the Well of Radiance change.
Celestial nighthawk need to super before they go into the well yeah?
Cause if they touch the well than go out to ult, they will have the Radiant buff linger for 8 seconds. Does that make sense?
renewal nerd here, slight nerf but giga buff, the dr persists after you leave the grenade which is huge since you cant stand too still because lack of healing, and with the fragment it basically got a GIGA buff because higher dr than before, alongside the grenade energy changes from the other fragment we can cycle genades A LOT
When talking about renewal grasps specifically sure, but the change to chains means a colossal reduction in maximum DR.
@@Ellingmint i mean he did ask how more adept renewal players felt about the renewal changes sooooo
Time to listen to this while eating. Life is good.
Best feeling
Does Well Radiant work with Celestial Golden gun? In my experience it seems I do less damage standing in well than if I throw a knife and get radiant.
I already watched Aztecross's video on the twab, but my boss wouldnt stop talking over it. Something about "getting back to work" or something idk