All-new 224 Valkyrie isn’t just another cartridge. It’s the best MSR 15 round ever developed and unlike anything you’ve ever seen. Learn more at bit.ly/2zL0CRB.
I read the comments on here from all of the "shooting experts" gripping wether the Grendel or the Valkyrie is better and I have came to conclusion (to be honest I had already decided before watching this video). I I got into building AR's as a hobby as a present to myself for for finally getting my head out of my a** ass and putting down a few stupid habits and growing up. The decision I made was simple... I built one of each and deciding which I love more is like trying to decide which of my two sons (grown men now) I love more. The farthest reaches of my targets in my place of living is around 7or 800yards and to be honest both guns do a superb job. I'm doing a 1-7 out of w 22" ss with the 224 and the 75grn bullets does wonders. The Grendel has been long enough so that people can pick and choose their favorite combo with it. If we are real pro2And advocates none of us should be downing anything which it represents but instead cheering and backing anything that supports it. The time is coming fast when we will have to all stand together as on or lose everything.
The 6.5 Grendel is the best cartridge to shoot out of AR15 in my opinion.It shot farther than 6.8spc ..just as far and hits harder than 224 Valkyrie, Beats 223/5.56 in everything.I really think the USA Military should have chosen the 6.5 Grendel over the 6.8 spc...But the 6.8 SPC II is a good round for close combat.
@@TexasTrained you should see what it does to a deer... its downright nasty... silver state armory sure knew what they were doin if the end goal was a 700 yrd man killer. And like 6.5 grendel, it really doesn't care what barrel length you shoot it out of.
It's different in a whole list of ways. First of all the .223 WSSM is a short magnum case and thus has a large case and hence powder capacity, yet it fires a comparatively very small caliber. Overbore cartridges (where the case capacity is very large in comparisson to the caliber it fires) are well known for rapidly wearing away the throat and thus the barrel. The .224 Valkyrie is in no way an overbore cartridge, and so it doesn't have the same problems with wearing out the throat as something like the .223 WSSM or some of the Weatherby cartridges have. Another reason for the lack of commercial succes of the .223 WSSM is the very low magazine capacity due to the case being so short and fat. In a standard AR-15 magazine they'll only fit single stack, so no more than just 5 or 6 cartridges if I remember correctly, a very low number when compared to something like the .224 Valkyrie. Another problem caused by the short magnum case geometry is that they're not as smooth and easy to chamber, unlike a more traditionally shaped cartridge, which has a longer and more slender case geometry. And yet another but much more serious problem also caused by the short magnum case geometry is very thin chamber walls and lower bolt lug failure rating. The section of the barrel extension and the barrel's chamber is always the same outer diameter no matter the caliber, but with a very fat cartridge that means the chamber walls will be a lot thinner, and the section where the bolt lugs lock up into the barrel extension will also be a lot less beefy, and to top it all off the short magnums are very high pressure cartridges, so all in all a very risky combination.
Okay, I have a question. Although it's flightpath and velocity is significantly better than all those other calibers with less wind drift as well, how does the energy of the round itself compare to a 6.5 Grendel?
Great question. The Grendel will have superior energy inside about 400 yards. However, when the round travels down range, the Valkyrie wins out. If you have specific rounds you are asking about, we have a tool on our website that will allow you to compare different types of ammo. Here's a link for you: bit.ly/2JoaqG4 Valkyrie|computed_skucaliber_s=6.5 Grendel
the ammo that shoots fast, cost 4-5x more than .223. anyone on a budget, the 224 Valkyrie rifle are reasonably price except the ammo, given more time; might be on par with 308 pricing.
They are really dishonest when comparing the 6.5 Grendel and 224 Valkyrie. If you compare the 123 grain Lapua Scenar bullet, with the 224 Valkyrie 90 grain the difference in drop and wind drift isn't that big out to a bit over a 1000 yards. You know what wins in energy out to 1000 ? The 6.5 Grendel. The 6.5 is a much better deer hunting round, being 50 state legal, unlike the 224 Valkyrie.
the DPMS G2 is the size and weight of a ar15 but can shoot .308/.243/6.5 creedmoor, even 6.5-.284, its the way to go for long range msr, easy 1,500 yard maybe 1,700yards with the 6.5-.284 if you load hot with the highest b.c rounds you can find.
Or you could just load a 6.5 Grendel with a lighter 100gr-108gr aluminum tip pill , B.C are still a high .4x to a low .5x but velocity is much faster which gives a flatter trajectory . Plus you can load hot and easily get 2,000ft-lbs of energy or more if you push the shoulder forward. Thats large caliber power with a relativity heavy bullet moving around the same speed as this .224Valkyrie and still in a AR-15 platform. I'm not saying the .224V doesn't have uses, i just think the 6.5 Grendel checks more boxes and can be used in more situations, also the 6.5 Grendel has not yet been fully optimized for different loads like the 108gr.
outdoorshootersupply.com/65-110gr-Rebated-Boat-Tail-Bullets_p_52.html its B.C is around a low .50, i was actually referring to www.brownells.com/reloading/bullets/rifle-bullets/scenar-bullets-6-5mm-264-108gr-hpbt-100-box-sku749005429-35685-68921.aspx which is not aluminum tip but federal could make such a thing, for a 108gr it has a B.C of .465 which is good but it could be higher with a tip, the 123gr Grendel move about 2600fps/1820 FT-LBS so dropping down to a 108gr would bring the speed up and give a little more case capacity for more powder/safer pressure and with a B.C of .465 to .500 it should do 1300yards no problem while moving faster with a heavier bullet that also hits with more energy. This link is to aluminum tip 160gr just because it has a pic and shows how crazy high the B.C is on this type of bullet outdoorshootersupply.com/65-160gr-PLR-XD_p_57.html
those alco bullets have amazingly high B.C's there .308 168gr has a B.C of .637 which is unheard of for that weight, it makes .308 win a seriously competitive round once again. not that long ago you need a 180gr 7mm to get in the .6xx b.c outdoorshootersupply.com/30-Cal-168gr-Rebated-Boat-Tail_p_16.html
I was super excited about the Alco bullets. I have heard that in real world testing, the numbers just don't add up. Heard that a few times actually. I hope that is not the case though. Had been eyeballing some of there .308 bullets.
Im sure, but i still think they are probably better then most, most bullets don't match advertised B.C like hornady 6.5 123gr claim a .510 but most people find that if they use a .480'ish BC for there calculations the bullets actually go where intended, but i think this inconsistency comes from using G1 B.C instead of the more accurate G7 ballistics. im just getting into reloading so im no expert by any means, but theres a channel th-cam.com/users/TiborasaurusRex he seems to do pretty well out to extreme ranges +2,000yards with the alco bullets, his sniper 101 series has some seriously good info.
TeensierPython - you're right it's another 30% which is substantial to say the least but they're kind of saying you can't reach that thousand yards without their cartridge or something else
I have never gone over about 500yds with a .223/5.56 so have no personal experience. But i do agree they are using the worst case scenario when comparing it to the new "super round."
poor idea,,,,,with 100 grain bullets weights, why was it not a 6mm ? longer barrel life,, better performance,,,,,more energy,,i guess the need to sell ar15s needs some help,, but the 223 will always be the top in 224 caliber,, the 6.5 grendel made more sense also,,,
The chosen 1 I don't think the barrel life will be much different than a normal .223. The extra case capacity allows for an increased built weight. Velocity between the two is very close. A 77gr .223 has a muzzle velocity of 2750 a 90gr .224 is supposedly 2700.
2,700fps with a 90gr is like 1,450ft-lbs and thats most likely from a 24in barrel which is only around 100ft-lbs more then a normal .223 rem vs. a 6.5 Grendel with 123gr @1,850ft-lbs
My 6 year old will shoot my grendel as long as I can afford it. I don't think recoil is a winning argument. Why do you say heavier bullet? 130 is more than 90 last time I checked.
So its basically a 6.5 Grendel necked down to .224? and I've heard prices as low as $12 a box of 20? Then why are your 6.5 Grendel fusion msr $25 a box? they are not even match grade, just hunting bullets. So are you just ripping us 6.5 Grendel guys off? because fundamentally 6.5 Grendel is just 7.62x39 brass and you sell that dirt cheap, The 6.5 Grendel community would like a 108gr OTM from$15-20 and a 105gr/115gr FMJ option for around $10-12 a box. I'd buy bricks of 1000 rounds regularly if you'd just sell what we want to buy.
well thats poor designing, with the shorter case and neck the Grendel case would have far more case capacity with the only disadvantage being 25 round mags instead of 28 round mags. The 6.8 case only had good case capacity because of it length once shortened it is not much better then a .223 rem with it only real advantage being it can shoot the longer 90gr bullets. A Grendel case necked down to a 6mm/.243 with the shoulder pushed forward would have been a far better cartridge for Federal to hit the market with if they really wanted to make a light, fast, flat,and long range capable round for the AR-15/mini action rifles
I'll be Frank I'm Leary about using my name This round beats a 6.5G handily in drop and drift, and it stays supersonic much longer than the Grendel. The .224V's ballistics are more on par with the 6.5 Creedmoor.
thats kinda true but misleading Federal seems to be quoting Alexander Arms 130gr loads which run 200fps slower then normal loads and are heavier then most people shoot, its like saying a .308 has less drop then a .30-06 just because the .30-06 is loaded with 220gr bullets when the .308 is using 150gr. A normal 6.5 Grendel moves a 123gr at approximately 2600fps vs .224V which moves a 90gr at 2700fps , if you put a 110gr/108gr bullet in the Grendel it will go +2700fps and the B.C is still plenty high for long range th-cam.com/video/OgRvEcG9fk4/w-d-xo.html plus the .224V only hits with 1450ft-lbs of energy whereas a 6.5G hits with 1,825ft-lbs of energy and can be safely hand loaded hot to 2,000ft-lbs because the Grendel is a low pressure round leaving a lot of potential. The .224V is running high pressure already so what you see is what you get. And the .224 90gr is a new bullet with a fairly high BC For weight but most of the 6.5 bullets are old from the 1980s, some of the newer 6.5 pill like the alco tipped vlds have crazy BCs in the high .5^^ for a 120gr and still in the low .5xx/high .4^^ for a 115gr/110gr. pill.
I read the comments on here from all of the "shooting experts" gripping wether the Grendel or the Valkyrie is better and I have came to conclusion (to be honest I had already decided before watching this video). I I got into building AR's as a hobby as a present to myself for for finally getting my head out of my a** ass and putting down a few stupid habits and growing up. The decision I made was simple... I built one of each and deciding which I love more is like trying to decide which of my two sons (grown men now) I love more. The farthest reaches of my targets in my place of living is around 7or 800yards and to be honest both guns do a superb job. I'm doing a 1-7 out of w 22" ss with the 224 and the 75grn bullets does wonders. The Grendel has been long enough so that people can pick and choose their favorite combo with it. If we are real pro2And advocates none of us should be downing anything which it represents but instead cheering and backing anything that supports it. The time is coming fast when we will have to all stand together as on or lose everything.
I can't wait to get my hands on one. I've been putting a rifle together since I heard about it a month ago.
We are looking forward to do some extensive testing with this caliber! Would love to see 95-100gr bullets with 1:6.5 twist barrels.
what twist rate on a 18" and 20" barrel???
Almost all barrels out today are using 1:7 twist. In less than a month we are looking at doing some testing with 1:6.5 twist rate barrels.
I would love to see a 14.5" barrel call me crazy but they're lightweight at just about any contour even an spr and i'm a small framed individual
Just ordered the 6.5 Grendel. I’m not shooting past 500 yards ever. Within 500 yards 6.5 Grendel is the clear winner
I think the 90gr Fusion is gonna be a great option for the serious pork hunters.
Besides being cool. I didn’t realize until now how long a Grendel stays super sonic. More than larger action calibers. Neat
The 6.5 Grendel is the best cartridge to shoot out of AR15 in my opinion.It shot farther than 6.8spc ..just as far and hits harder than 224 Valkyrie, Beats 223/5.56 in everything.I really think the USA Military should have chosen the 6.5 Grendel over the 6.8 spc...But the 6.8 SPC II is a good round for close combat.
@@TexasTrained you should see what it does to a deer... its downright nasty... silver state armory sure knew what they were doin if the end goal was a 700 yrd man killer. And like 6.5 grendel, it really doesn't care what barrel length you shoot it out of.
My 22/250 rem with a 1 in 7 twist cruises past 1000 yards with 90 grain berger
Sounds awesome, my concern is barrel life a service weapon. Sounds like youd burn the throat out alot quicker, any feedback would be great
Josh Opp Replace the barrel.
Anybody remember the 223 wssm? I do. Never took off for several reasons. Most important was barrel life! Or lack of. How is this round any different?
it's not
It's different in a whole list of ways. First of all the .223 WSSM is a short magnum case and thus has a large case and hence powder capacity, yet it fires a comparatively very small caliber. Overbore cartridges (where the case capacity is very large in comparisson to the caliber it fires) are well known for rapidly wearing away the throat and thus the barrel. The .224 Valkyrie is in no way an overbore cartridge, and so it doesn't have the same problems with wearing out the throat as something like the .223 WSSM or some of the Weatherby cartridges have. Another reason for the lack of commercial succes of the .223 WSSM is the very low magazine capacity due to the case being so short and fat. In a standard AR-15 magazine they'll only fit single stack, so no more than just 5 or 6 cartridges if I remember correctly, a very low number when compared to something like the .224 Valkyrie. Another problem caused by the short magnum case geometry is that they're not as smooth and easy to chamber, unlike a more traditionally shaped cartridge, which has a longer and more slender case geometry. And yet another but much more serious problem also caused by the short magnum case geometry is very thin chamber walls and lower bolt lug failure rating. The section of the barrel extension and the barrel's chamber is always the same outer diameter no matter the caliber, but with a very fat cartridge that means the chamber walls will be a lot thinner, and the section where the bolt lugs lock up into the barrel extension will also be a lot less beefy, and to top it all off the short magnums are very high pressure cartridges, so all in all a very risky combination.
Okay, I have a question. Although it's flightpath and velocity is significantly better than all those other calibers with less wind drift as well, how does the energy of the round itself compare to a 6.5 Grendel?
Great question. The Grendel will have superior energy inside about 400 yards. However, when the round travels down range, the Valkyrie wins out. If you have specific rounds you are asking about, we have a tool on our website that will allow you to compare different types of ammo. Here's a link for you: bit.ly/2JoaqG4 Valkyrie|computed_skucaliber_s=6.5 Grendel
the ammo that shoots fast, cost 4-5x more than .223. anyone on a budget, the 224 Valkyrie rifle are reasonably price except the ammo, given more time; might be on par with 308 pricing.
They are really dishonest when comparing the 6.5 Grendel and 224 Valkyrie. If you compare the 123 grain Lapua Scenar bullet, with the 224 Valkyrie 90 grain the difference in drop and wind drift isn't that big out to a bit over a 1000 yards. You know what wins in energy out to 1000 ? The 6.5 Grendel. The 6.5 is a much better deer hunting round, being 50 state legal, unlike the 224 Valkyrie.
90gr SMKs need 6.5 twist or faster. Many are already finding out the 7 twist barrels are not accurate with the 90gr SMKs.
The lower the twist rate the heavier the bullet you need to use so 1:7 twist you use 78 grain for 556/223 1:12 twist you use 55 grain
Looks cool but I think I would go with a 6mm creedmoor. I am set up for 243 so I will just stick with that.
Hugh Jair yeah but the creedmoor is an msr10 not an msr15 round. It's a ar10 not an ar15 in other words.
the DPMS G2 is the size and weight of a ar15 but can shoot .308/.243/6.5 creedmoor, even 6.5-.284, its the way to go for long range msr, easy 1,500 yard maybe 1,700yards with the 6.5-.284 if you load hot with the highest b.c rounds you can find.
if this round work with aug will be nice you can use 24 inch barrel gun will be in same size of ar15 16inch barrel
Or you could just load a 6.5 Grendel with a lighter 100gr-108gr aluminum tip pill , B.C are still a high .4x to a low .5x but velocity is much faster which gives a flatter trajectory . Plus you can load hot and easily get 2,000ft-lbs of energy or more if you push the shoulder forward. Thats large caliber power with a relativity heavy bullet moving around the same speed as this .224Valkyrie and still in a AR-15 platform. I'm not saying the .224V doesn't have uses, i just think the 6.5 Grendel checks more boxes and can be used in more situations, also the 6.5 Grendel has not yet been fully optimized for different loads like the 108gr.
what 100-108 grain aluminum tip bullets are you referring to?
outdoorshootersupply.com/65-110gr-Rebated-Boat-Tail-Bullets_p_52.html its B.C is around a low .50, i was actually referring to www.brownells.com/reloading/bullets/rifle-bullets/scenar-bullets-6-5mm-264-108gr-hpbt-100-box-sku749005429-35685-68921.aspx which is not aluminum tip but federal could make such a thing, for a 108gr it has a B.C of .465 which is good but it could be higher with a tip, the 123gr Grendel move about 2600fps/1820 FT-LBS so dropping down to a 108gr would bring the speed up and give a little more case capacity for more powder/safer pressure and with a B.C of .465 to .500 it should do 1300yards no problem while moving faster with a heavier bullet that also hits with more energy. This link is to aluminum tip 160gr just because it has a pic and shows how crazy high the B.C is on this type of bullet outdoorshootersupply.com/65-160gr-PLR-XD_p_57.html
those alco bullets have amazingly high B.C's there .308 168gr has a B.C of .637 which is unheard of for that weight, it makes .308 win a seriously competitive round once again. not that long ago you need a 180gr 7mm to get in the .6xx b.c outdoorshootersupply.com/30-Cal-168gr-Rebated-Boat-Tail_p_16.html
I was super excited about the Alco bullets. I have heard that in real world testing, the numbers just don't add up. Heard that a few times actually. I hope that is not the case though. Had been eyeballing some of there .308 bullets.
Im sure, but i still think they are probably better then most, most bullets don't match advertised B.C like hornady 6.5 123gr claim a .510 but most people find that if they use a .480'ish BC for there calculations the bullets actually go where intended, but i think this inconsistency comes from using G1 B.C instead of the more accurate G7 ballistics. im just getting into reloading so im no expert by any means, but theres a channel th-cam.com/users/TiborasaurusRex he seems to do pretty well out to extreme ranges +2,000yards with the alco bullets, his sniper 101 series has some seriously good info.
Release all the f***ing specs!
out4danoney29 don't rush them and make them release a cartridge that is less than what it could be because I'd like this cartridge to be a success
Taylor McKay you sound stupid, they’ve already designed it. They’ve manufactured ammunition and barrels
What does it require? A different barrel and BCG? Do you use standard 556 upper and lower? What about mags?
Will there be lighter loadings available such as 77 grain? Also, what is the recommended twist rate?
The American Eagle 224 will be 75gr
BR awsome. I wonder what the velocity number on that will be
Sounds like right around 3000. And only $12 a box. Not bad
1:7 is the recommended twist rate. We have a 60 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip and a 75 grain American Eagle TMJ.
federalpremiumammo excellent. Thank you very much for the response. I look forward to see what this round can do
I'm getting 1000 yards of supersonic range from my 223 Remington with 70 grain Nosler RDF,s
So if what federal says is true you would add another 30% on top of that.
TeensierPython - you're right it's another 30% which is substantial to say the least but they're kind of saying you can't reach that thousand yards without their cartridge or something else
TeensierPython - I should also add that I could get 1100 yards but that would be in the realm of dangerous pressures
I have never gone over about 500yds with a .223/5.56 so have no personal experience. But i do agree they are using the worst case scenario when comparing it to the new "super round."
I like it.
I want one in bolt. Even if it is Savage or Mossberg.
poor idea,,,,,with 100 grain bullets weights, why was it not a 6mm ? longer barrel life,, better performance,,,,,more energy,,i guess the need to sell ar15s needs some help,, but the 223 will always be the top in 224 caliber,, the 6.5 grendel made more sense also,,,
I wonder if they will ever get this cartridge worked out...
can someone please tell me where to get one of those clip on shooting bags???? i have been looking forever
BigStarch96 wie bad shooting bag,that's a tac pad
I’ll wait till ammo prices on 224 become reasonable
*1000* shot barrel life
The chosen 1 I don't think the barrel life will be much different than a normal .223. The extra case capacity allows for an increased built weight. Velocity between the two is very close. A 77gr .223 has a muzzle velocity of 2750 a 90gr .224 is supposedly 2700.
@@Strickland325 Yep. Same maximum pressure, too. 55,000 PSI.
Paelorian I’ve shot around 2400 out of mine now and it’s still moa
Muzzle energy? Velocity?
2,700fps with a 90gr is like 1,450ft-lbs and thats most likely from a 24in barrel which is only around 100ft-lbs more then a normal .223 rem vs. a 6.5 Grendel with 123gr @1,850ft-lbs
that's from a 20" barrel.
This is why I single-load .223 Scenar L.
its better the 22.250 whit 55 grs
What handguard is that?
Seekins Precision SP3R hand guard. The upper/lower/hand guard/muzzle brake and more appear to be Seekins Precision.
My 6 year old will shoot my grendel as long as I can afford it. I don't think recoil is a winning argument. Why do you say heavier bullet? 130 is more than 90 last time I checked.
Both are good both are quick both will put a hole in your target
So its basically a 6.5 Grendel necked down to .224? and I've heard prices as low as $12 a box of 20? Then why are your 6.5 Grendel fusion msr $25 a box? they are not even match grade, just hunting bullets. So are you just ripping us 6.5 Grendel guys off? because fundamentally 6.5 Grendel is just 7.62x39 brass and you sell that dirt cheap, The 6.5 Grendel community would like a 108gr OTM from$15-20 and a 105gr/115gr FMJ option for around $10-12 a box. I'd buy bricks of 1000 rounds regularly if you'd just sell what we want to buy.
It's 6.8 SPC necked down actually.
well thats poor designing, with the shorter case and neck the Grendel case would have far more case capacity with the only disadvantage being 25 round mags instead of 28 round mags. The 6.8 case only had good case capacity because of it length once shortened it is not much better then a .223 rem with it only real advantage being it can shoot the longer 90gr bullets. A Grendel case necked down to a 6mm/.243 with the shoulder pushed forward would have been a far better cartridge for Federal to hit the market with if they really wanted to make a light, fast, flat,and long range capable round for the AR-15/mini action rifles
I'll be Frank I'm Leary about using my name It's a 6.8 necked down.
I'll be Frank I'm Leary about using my name This round beats a 6.5G handily in drop and drift, and it stays supersonic much longer than the Grendel. The .224V's ballistics are more on par with the 6.5 Creedmoor.
thats kinda true but misleading Federal seems to be quoting Alexander Arms 130gr loads which run 200fps slower then normal loads and are heavier then most people shoot, its like saying a .308 has less drop then a .30-06 just because the .30-06 is loaded with 220gr bullets when the .308 is using 150gr. A normal 6.5 Grendel moves a 123gr at approximately 2600fps vs .224V which moves a 90gr at 2700fps , if you put a 110gr/108gr bullet in the Grendel it will go +2700fps and the B.C is still plenty high for long range th-cam.com/video/OgRvEcG9fk4/w-d-xo.html plus the .224V only hits with 1450ft-lbs of energy whereas a 6.5G hits with 1,825ft-lbs of energy and can be safely hand loaded hot to 2,000ft-lbs because the Grendel is a low pressure round leaving a lot of potential. The .224V is running high pressure already so what you see is what you get. And the .224 90gr is a new bullet with a fairly high BC For weight but most of the 6.5 bullets are old from the 1980s, some of the newer 6.5 pill like the alco tipped vlds have crazy BCs in the high .5^^ for a 120gr and still in the low .5xx/high .4^^ for a 115gr/110gr. pill.
Way too go Federal !!!
Stop all the publicity and just put it out already.
ARC or Valkyrie anyone?
Is this the round that the military will adapt?
JimmyEG1 no
Hell no
🤩😍
this is a lie
What part exactly?
No it's true
It is too good to be true... but it is!