UPDATED 2021 GUIDE HERE: th-cam.com/video/NkkPZzoPfGc/w-d-xo.html MASS EFFECT 2 SUICIDE SQUAD SURVIVAL GUIDE 1) Complete all squad loyalty missions. I recommend recruiting all squadmates and doing all loyalty missions prior to obtaining the Reaper IFF. You can complete Legion's loyalty mission after the Reaper IFF since he isn't in your party before then. 2) Complete the following Normandy ship upgrades - Heavy Ship Armor, Thanix Cannon, and Multicore Shielding. 3) Launch the final mission right after Normandy crew is kidnapped. If you complete any missions between the time the crew is taken and the final mission, then some (or all) crew members won't survive. We wanna save Kelly Chambers, Doctor Chakwas, etc right?! 4) Squad Selections During Final Mission (loyalty is assumed) Phase 1 Tech Expert - Tali, Kasumi or Legion Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda Phase 2 Escort for Rescued Normandy Crew - Mordin or Tali Biotics Expert - Jack or Samara / Morinth Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda Squadmates for Final Phase - whoever is loyal. If you have non-loyal squadmates, leave them behind as part of the defense and also leave behind more combat-oriented characters (Garrus, Grunt, Legion, etc) to help protect non-loyal squadmates. If you follow all these steps then everyone will survive the events of Mass Effect 2.
I just did this mission and I spent hours preparing. I got everyones loyalty and I was at the final part so I figured everyone should be fine. I took Garrus and Grunt with me and Mordin ended up dying so I restarted the mission and Took Thane and Zaeed with me and everyone ended up surviving. So I guess that thing with combat oriented characters still applies with the loyal ones
@Big Dan Gaming Question: I did the loyalty quests and made sure all characters were loyal and followed your advice, but when I imported to game 3 it shows Tali's name on the memorial wall. Is that a possible glitch? Can loyal characters still die in the suicide mission?
“In theory, any biotic could do it!” No, I didn’t go to all the trouble to recruit an ancient Asari justicar and the most powerful human biotic in existence to give this job to some C-tier like Jacob.
I always picked Garrus as the fireteam leader because of his level-headedness, combat experience and his time with C-Sec, but I'm surprised Mordin isn't an option. Dude led covert ops back in his day you know.
im surprised there wasnt some better use for Mordin's skills during the suicide mission, like maybe a science oriented tech objective. the best thing you can do with him is have him escort the crew back to the ship.
I thought the same thing in my first playthrough of Mass Effect 2 years ago my first playthrough of Mass Effect 2 I lost Legion, Mordion, .and Thane that was the same thing I thought I chose Mordion as my squad leader
Mordin running covert ops is exactly why he's the ideal pick for getting the rest of the crew out alive and not as a fireteam leader. If you talk to him about Kirrahe he'll straight up tell you that he prefers "get the job done and go home" over "hold the line". This is your hint for the final mission.
im just curious as to how his playthrough have been different from mine. the only difference i would say is i always sent grunt with the normandy crew, I always take miranda and someone else with me in the final phase usually cuz i romance miranda and everyone survives. I do all the ship ugrades and what not. I also suggest re doing the campaign as doing so gets you minerals, money and ren/par points you can use in the new campaign and you can always change your class if you didnt like the first one you picked and you get to keep any armor you bought in the previouse campaign. In mass effect 2 i do two playthroughs. One loyal to ashely and the other i cheat on her with miranda same for ME 3 lol.
I got everyone to survive one my second playthrough when I played it all those years ago. Probably would have been fine first time if Thanes mission didnt bug out.
Hey...being as a Paragon person, I did saved the Factory Workers at Zaeed's Loyality mission. And I had enough Paragon Points to convince him to follow my lead. In fact, Kasumi and Zaeed were the first 2 Squadmates, who's Loyality Mission was completed. I was able to do that with one bar Paragon. :D
For the "Hold the Line" Force, there's actually a chart that properly explains the math behind it on the internet. Every squadmate is given a "Defense Value" in the game's eyes. Grunt, Garrus, and Zaeed all have a DV of 3, Legion, Jacob, Samara/Morinth, Miranda, and Thane have a DV of 1, and Tali, Kasumi, Mordin, and Jack have a DV of 0. All loyal squadmates get an extra 1 point to their DV, so Tali, Kasumi, Mordin, and Jack will have a DV of 1 if they are loyal, and so on. During the "Hold the Line" part, the game will add up the DVs of all the Squadmates involved then divide them by how many squadmates are present. If the total DV is equal to or greater than 2, then everyone lives. So, assuming everyone's loyal, say you send Mordin to protect the crew and take Jack and Tali with you to the final boss, then the remaining crew will have a remaining total value of 4+4+4+2+2+2+2+2+1=23/9=2.56. 2.56>2=everyone lives. But say instead, you send Grunt to protect the crew and take Garrus and Zaeed with you, 2+2+2+2+2+1+1+1+1=14/9=1.56. 1.56
@@nova3530onyt true, but at the same time it kinda puts too much stock in damage sponge potential over anything else. Like, Jack is considered a 0 DV, despite the fact that her biotics are strong enough to not only create squad barriers and ammo, but also blast entire hoards of collectors away in one shot.
There's also a priority system that I can't recall, but easy to find online. I think Mordin has the highest death priority which is why it's best to send him as an escort. Though in my head, it's because of his former STG Infiltration and extraction training, as well as the pheromones he developed.
FINALLY SOMEONE SAID IT, people keep saying it's RNG and that you only need to be loyal for everyone to survive coming from people who played it like 7 times? mediocre numbers it's more or less set that if everyone is loyal, Normandy is fully upgraded, Tali, Kasumi will die unless you take them with you against the reaper larvae
MASS EFFECT 2 SUICIDE SQUAD SURVIVAL GUIDE 1) Complete all squad loyalty missions. I recommend recruiting all squadmates and doing all loyalty missions prior to obtaining the Reaper IFF. You can complete Legion's loyalty mission after the Reaper IFF since he isn't in your party before then. 2) Complete the following Normandy ship upgrades - Heavy Ship Armor, Thanix Cannon, and Multicore Shielding. 3) Launch the final mission right after Normandy crew is kidnapped. If you complete any missions between the time the crew is taken and the final mission, then some (or all) crew members won't survive. We wanna save Kelly Chambers, Doctor Chakwas, etc right?! 4) Squad Selections During Final Mission (loyalty is assumed) Phase 1 Tech Expert - Tali, Kasumi or Legion Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda Phase 2 Escort for Rescued Normandy Crew - Mordin or Tali Biotics Expert - Jack or Samara / Morinth Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda Squadmates for Final Phase - whoever is loyal. If you have non-loyal squadmates, leave them behind as part of the defense and also leave behind more combat-oriented characters (Garrus, Grunt, Legion, etc) to help protect non-loyal squadmates. If you follow all these steps then everyone will survive the events of Mass Effect 2.
I found that talking to Jack and Miranda multiple times worked to get the paragon option up. With Jack, to the point where she says that she's not good with friendship and shit, but you've been good to her. Every other playthrough I lost Jack's loyalty, so was really happy this time.
I usually romance Jack and I found the best way is to side with Jack and then tell Miranda that you sided with Jack to calm her down. Miranda takes it as a tactical move. Both remain loyal and you don't ruin the Romance with Jack.
That happens with Wrex too, if you help him get his grandfather's armor in ME1 when you get to Virmire the Paragon/Renegade options lose their colors as if you were choosing a normal dialog.
A few corrections: - You don't actually have to do the Renegade option on Zaeed's loyalty mission. If you have high enough Paragon and let Vido get away, you can convince him at the end to let go of his revenge for the time being which still secures his loyalty. - You can also lose Thane's loyalty if you fail to keep tabs on the guy you're following. Kolyat will succeed in killing his target and the mission ends with Thane being a sad boi. - While it is true that squad members like Mordin or Tali or Kasumi are more likely to die in the final phase of the mission, as long as Grunt and Zaeed are left behind in the firing squad that is negligible. The pecking order for who lives and dies only comes into play when there aren't any heavy hitters in that final group, so you could really send any loyal squad mate back with the crew and be fine as long as your heavy hitters are there to protect your squishier companions later.
It’s pretty easy to get a high enough paragon if you imported your save without console commands, I’ve never failed the speech when I’ve played traditionally.
Same, since I did everything in ME1 along with all the missions before those 2 arguements in ME2. I had enough paragon and renegade points. Plus I was on PS3 so there was no console commands for me, so I don't know what he was talking about.
Yeah...I´m playing paragade right now (about 2/3 paragon, 1/3 renegade) and I have the paragon option opened...didn´t even know it is a big problem to open it :D. I even did Miranda and Jack loyalty missions quite early which could help or not (idk really) :D but the fact is I imported a save with bunch of paragon and renegade points earned in ME1.
I think the answer to the jack and Miranda paragon situation is that you need a paragon of 70% or higher and constantly talk to them throughout the story
Technically, it was one of Harbinger's energy blasts, not a rocket launcher...which actually makes that death somewhat personal when you think about it.
Probably trying to minimize extreme gore like shattered bodies since they are squadmates and the death has a more personal impact when the body is still whole. The only gory part in the final mission is whoever get devoured by the swarm if anyone is not loyal.
Best way to do the Paragon neutral ending for Jack and Miranda is save one of their loyalty missions to the very end right before the suicide Mission if you've done all Paragon to the whole game by the end of that mission you'll have enough paragon to the Paragon talk them down
The checks in mass effect 2 are based on how many times you’ve chosen paragon or renegade with how many of those options you’ve had. If you only ever choose one of the two options and never a mix of the two you will always be fine. I’ve heard in the legendary edition they’ve made changes to this system but I only just finished the first game so I don’t know how well it works for myself yet
there is another way to do it, on the level up system there is a perk that boosts your paragon level. if im not mistaken there is a terminal in the ship that you can use to rearrenge all the perks points you have earned in any way you want. I do this before i do jack loyalty mission to level up the perk as much as possible and boost my paragon level.
@@BigDanGaming I lost four people and replayed the mission and lost only Tali. Then I came to the video and because of it I managed to get everybody's asses out of the fire. Thank you Dan and have a good day.
On my first playthrough I picked Garrus as the infiltrator, since I thought he would be able to hold his own, given the description of the role. I was *not* expecting him to stick his head out of cover, given his experience earlier in the game.
Was very proud to have everyone walk away alive on my first ever playthrough. Feeling like anyone could get snuffed out at any time made this part of the game feel like an edge-of-your-seat moment where the stakes were raised incredibly high and remains one of the most memorable gaming moments for me.
Yeah it's a wild ride for sure! The final mission of ME2 is one of the most memorable missions I've played in a video game. Congrats on bringing your whole crew back through the Omega-4 relay on your first run! I lost Miranda and Zaeed on my first playthrough :/
@@BigDanGaming I just completed this game in the last week after getting about a quarter of the way through me3. I figured a bit of context wouldn’t hurt. I was shocked when Mordin got his head took off with a rocket after seeing him in me3
This video made me feel pretty good. I didn’t know how few people have enough paragon points to resolve the crew argument(s). In my legendary edition playthrough, I had enough paragon points to resolve the Miranda/Jack fight with a paragon speech check.
Importing from me1 makes it so much easier if you had max paragon when you beat that game (which is pretty easy to get). My first time importing from me1 was also the first time I had enough paragon to pass the speech check with Miranda and jack and was also the first time I got max paragon in me2.
Even to this day ME2's ending is my favorite in all of gaming. The amount of decisions that change how it plays out, even small things like how soon you do it and who you take with your squad, is amazing.
Awesome! Thanks for watching. I just posted a video on how to max out your paragon meter too if you're interested. You might even be able to regain Jack's loyalty before the final mission if you can boost your paragon score enough before then th-cam.com/video/NwmiYfUOsi4/w-d-xo.html
@@BigDanGaming i finished my playthrough earlier, kept jack alive and had max paragon, i went to see her after the final mission but still couldnt get the paragon answer even though i was maxed out, kept her alive thats the main thing
@@darkestfugue The problem is, in ME2 the gauge is misleading. You may have a maxed out your _absolute_ Paragon score, but if the quotient of current Paragon / max Paragon is too low, you are screwed (works the same for the Renegade score). In order to defuse the situation between Miranda and Jack the Paragon way, make sure to pick any and all Paragon dialog options (some might require Investigating an issue further before they become available), and if Paragon speech checks present themselves. use them, too. Whenever Paragon interrupts pop up, use them! They give you additional Paragon points (and usually a healthy dose on top of that). Another catch to be kept in mind: Whenever you find an Anomaly, the number of maximum Paragon points available is immediately increased while your current amount remains constant. If you are too close to certain thresholds you might quickly find yourself fall below them, rendering the Paragon speech check unavailable. So whenever you encounter one, make sure to resolve it so you don't leave any unclaimed Paragon/Renegade points behind and so maintain a sufficiently high score ratio.
Hey man. Thanks for this. I realised Kelly died tonight and I couldn't answer Dr chakwas. Was seriously stunned I had managed to get Kelly dead. I love her soothing voice and calming nature. So I quit. And searched and ended up at this brilliant step by step guide. Thank you my friend. This is my favorite guide on the citadel.
The speechcheck for Loyaltymission becomes more difficult over time. I highly recomend to do the Miranda and Jack Loyalty Mission either quite early or very late.
Me too. On my second attempt. First attempt I got Mordin killed when we crawling through the pipes. And I did Jack’s loyalty right before the suicide mission. So when Kelly died I was extremely upset.
Two Things Worth Pointing Out 1. Paragon and Renegade Speech Checks work off a system that plays off of the ratio of earned points where speech checks can be made impossible despite having a maxed bar. Make sure you fully commit to one path since certain options can accrue extra points that may throw this off. Also be sure to get the bonuses in the passive skill tree for the 100% boost to dialogue options as well as the negotiator helm to help you along the way. I've found that even with a skewed ratio the followup check should always be possible at max or near max Renegade or Paragon. 2. There are several loyalty missions that can be failed, resulting in their loyalty not being acquired. These are Thane, Samara, Zaeed and Tali. As mentioned, using the evidence in Tali's trial will result in it, for Zaeed you need to complete a paragon check to ensure his loyalty in the route where you save the workers. Samara's and Thane's can be failed if you are unable to achieve their objectives.
Amazing! Thank you, after playing for the first time ever like a month ago, i'm actually on my 2nd playthrough and I want everyone to survive b4 I move on Mass Effect 3
i recommend not following this guide on your first playthrough. the final mission is so much better after you mess it up then do it right the second playthrough.
I can dig that. Part of the reason I made the guide is because I lost Zaeed and Miranda on my first blind playthrough. It's a good experience to feel the weight of those decisions and mistakes
I actually did save everyone on my first blind playthrough. I am something of a completionist when it comes to games I love though. I do every available side quest before the next available story mission when I’m given any kind of quest log. It’s making my blind playthrough of The Outer Words take forever. Also I only picked the absolute best for other squad leaders, so Garrus each time, Tali as tech, and Jack or Samara for the biotic.
Great video. Very thorough. I was able to save everyone on my very first playthrough and never realized this was an issue for people until I was playing ME3. I'm a completionist and I play as paragon so I usually have enough paragon points for dialogue. I always choose Garrus to lead the missions, Kasumi to crawl through the vent, Jack to do the barrier and Zaeed to escort the crew members. Only time I lost someone was when I "attempted" a renegade playthrough and couldnt follow through and didnt have enough renegade or paragon points for the jack and Miranda argument and Miranda died at the end :D
I've saved the civilians in Zaed's loyalty mission and got his loyalty, all you have to do is choose the right dialogue options at the end, you see if you have enough Paragon points you can tell him that vengeance is not the way and that you need to put it aside in order to fight effectively.
I lost Garrus once letting Miranda do the biotic shield in phase 2. I started the mission over. I didn't know. And on my very 1st playthrough I did the IFF mission before I had everyone's loyalty so I started the whole game over. I've had very interesting playthroughs. 😉😁 Sidebar: I save Tali's loyalty mission until after the IFF mission because I take Legion to the Flotilla and it is HILARIOUS. Then I do Legion's loyalty mission, then it the kidnapping of the crew and right to the suicide mission.
Haha, yeah...this, I personally feel Legion NEEDS to come with on the Flotilla 😂. I save Tali's mission for last as well. So excited for Legendary Edition
Thinking about getting the legendary edition since I never played Mass Effect before. If I do, then I'm gonna make sure to come back here when I start 2
Mass effect 2 probably has the best final mission of any game. The choices, the consequences, the music, it is just perfect. The first time I played the mission only Jack died because she wasn't loyal. choosing Tali/legion as a tech expert, Samara for the biotic shield, and Miranda as squad leaders made sense. I also like to do side quest before doing main in my RPGs so it mostly worked out.
It's definitely possible to max out paragon/renegade. You have to master your class level-up tree to give you really nice bonuses to how much paragon/renegade you earn. Also, you have to commit to one or the other, you can't be neutral or go back in forth, you have to go all in on your morality.
I played this on PS3 11 years ago, and I didn’t have a computer or means to look any of this up on the internet. It was all trial and error. I managed to figure out who was best to chose by writing names down and playing the mission 4 times and going back to and starting the mission over. lol ONCE I had enough Paragon points to keep Miranda and Jack both loyal. I think it was because I did all paragon options throughout the game and the DLC missions like Project Overlord, etc before doing either of their loyalty missions. I used to have this all memorized because I played this countless times, but it’s been so long, I forgot. Thanks for this guide video!
For those watching this for help with ME legendary edition, it is 100% possible to grind the paragon prior to completing jacks loyalty mission as long as you hold off for a considerable amount of time and complete almost every one else’s first. (I’ve yet to acquire legion, I have done Samara or Thanes missions) so long as you max out your class ability and go mostly paragon, you can do it. Same goes for renegade I assume, I haven’t done a full renegade play through in a while
You can definitely do the paragon speech check for Miranda and Jack if you leave one of their respective loyalty mission for last. Assuming you go full paragon, you should have enough paragon built up.
First of all i’d like to say this video was exceedingly helpful. I lost some very close characters to me so i’m not guilty in saying i reloaded a save so i could keep them alive for mass effect 3. However while you covered most things there were a few notable things i noticed you missed. 1 being that for Zaeed’s loyalty mission you can still save the scientists and keep his loyalty if you have maxed out paragon to pass a speech check, you’re strong words will whip him into shape. And 2 if you’re having trouble maxing paragon through normal means, investing talent points in the stat boost ability of your chosen class gives you a major boost (i found vanguard is good for this, it brings you from tier 1 all the way to max if you cap out the skill). Aside from those nitpicks, great work, thanks again
From what I recall about the paragon and renegade speech checks to maintain everyone’s loyalty, the amount you have to fill up either bar increases as you progress through the game. So, it’s actually easier to pass the check if you tackle these conflicts early on so long as you dedicate yourself mostly to a single bar. If you do it later and deviate between paragon and renegade a lot then you’re basically screwed.
I think it's fairly easy, just have majority of your squad loyal, get all ship upgrades, and pick the right loyal squad mates for the various roles at the end.
You don’t have to hack the game to max out paragon/renegade, you just have to time your missions so you tackle the rivals last. Only had one play through where I didn’t have enough paragon meter to pass the check with Miranda and Jack. It also helps to carry over a save with a reputation bonus from game one.
This is really useful. I completed my first playthrough last night, and lost Jack because I didn't upgrade the ship's shields. Later lost Grunt and Mordin during phase 1 and 2. Was hard, but the majority of the crew survived. Everyone was loyal but some bad calls had repercusions! Thanks for the video, I'll use it for my next attempt at saving the galaxy.
There is a bug to gain Paragon points in me2. After you kill morinth in Samara's loyalty mission, when she asks if you want to leave tell her you want to look around, you'll gain Paragon points for that, repeat the process until you have enough. It might take long but it's the easiest way to get the points. Edit: this is for PC I don't know if it works on console
@@CollinsOmo On Noveria, if you get the garage pass from the turian head of Synthetic Insights, Gianna (the secretary) comes up to you and says she's Internal Affairs yadda yadda yadda... Anyway, once you go and convince Lorik to use the evidence against Anoleise, DON'T return to Gianna. Keep talking to Lorik, but ask about Matriarch Benezia again, then pick "another question" and you'll be able to again persuade him to use the evidence. You can go either paragon or renegade each time until you max out your meter. This works for the console, and *should* work for PC. *edit You repeat the conversation until you're maxed out.
My first playthrough I didn't upgrade the Normandy at all, did at least 4 missions after the crew was kidnapped, and my only survivors were Grunt, Jack, and Tali 😭 Needless to say, I appreciate this video and am definitely saving it lol
I played this mission been trying to figure how to keep everyone alive I mostly got half the crew saved and Miranda was the only one without loyalty and survived when I did the mission with the human reaper at the end
This is a great guide. To get the Paragon high levels I always manage to pass. With Sheppard as a Commando then you get a paragon boost which I put points into first. I find dialogue options always useful in RPGs so I maxed out points in this before many others. This means you are always above the checks even early game due to (obviously) making mainly good choices, always right clicking the paragon action where possible and having the major leadership boost from commando. I also imported the standard Sheppard playthrough from ME1 which of course ended with maximum paragon points and a few renegade. Talking your way out of most situations not only gets good results but also gets even more paragon points! Of course having some renegade is useful.
Ivd gotten zaeeds loyalty and saved the workers It takes having enough paragon or renegade points tho so i only got it by having my paragon from mass effect 1 playthrough
@@sevnesioran6193 dude go save the workers you can talk him into loyalty without sacrifcing the innocent workers with enough paragon or renegade you can get his loyalty
After acquiring the Reaper IFF, you have time to complete two missions before the Collectors attack. I usually save Tali and Legion's loyalty missions for that time, as the missions are more interesting if you take them on the other's mission.
Yeah. Paragon Shepard requires a very big amount to resolve the conflict. However I did not knew that the Renegade Shepard can solve that easier. And did not knew either that at Tali's and Legion's conflict it's the other way around. That Paragon Shepard can solve it easier.
actually you can easily resolve the jack/miranda conflict with either paragon or renegade, the trick is to leave one of their loyalty missions and do it very late in the game (right before obtaining the reaper IFF) by that time you shouldve done all the main missions and some side and DLC, which will easily give you enough paragon OR renegade to resolve the situation (i personally do it in paragon and it’s easy) and it works similarly with legion/tali
Hmmm good to know. I've only ever pulled it off as a renegade but I don't remember how early in the game I did their missions on the last paragon run I did. I'll have to try it again another time.
You CAN save the factory workers on the Zaeed mission if you have a high enough paragon score in either direction. Usually after completing the Tali loyalty mission if you're being consistent. You also don't HAVE to max out your score to fix the rift between the ladies, it just has to be close in one direction or another. Just don't wait until too late in the game to choose a path and no cheating is necessary for your Paragon score. Great video though!
Dude thank you so much when I was a kid like 10 I lost everyone it was one of those games I wished I could have done better but didn't get a chance to retry now I saved em all thanks so much
I’ve always been able to save everyone with perfect paragon. and in mass effect 2/3 been able to jump back and forth from time to time with certain dialogues.... it seems more real when a paragon Shepard loses it once in a while and shows how truly ruthless and deadly she can be. 🥰
If you complete every mission except the main story and loyalty missions, you can get enough of the paragon points before the two events involving miranda and jack. Or at least mine was maxed out before that particular event. i just ran through all the N7 missions, Cerberus missions, and the occasional Alliance missions. Just paragon all the way
Awesome vid. I played this so so much on release, can't wait to finish again. You can regain Zaeed's loyalty if you save the workers by using the paragon option at the end of the mission. At least it worked for me!
For anyone wondering how the math of the final “hold the line team works”: You need the average of the teams combat points to be above 2.0. Garrus, Grunt and Zaeed are all worth 4 each if loyal. Miranda, Jacob, Thane, Samara, and Legion are worth 2 points each if loyal. Tali, Mordin, Kasumi and Jack are each worth 1 point each if loyal.
Jack was my only non loyal character (and i don't have the DLC character), i keep her back in the "hold the line" team. She died, even with Grunt, Jacob, Thane, Samara and Legion, all loyal. (Garrus and Miranda were with me on the bomb team)
@@lordmazdamundi2847 Thanks for catching my typo. I had the formula wrong. Sorry about that!! Fixed now. The tiers are 4,2,1. So you had a team strength of 12, which is an average of 1.7. Next time, just keep Garrus back and bring a loyal Tali or Mordin with you on the bomb team.
Started replaying ME2 (the whole OT) a week ago. Got to ME2 with the intent of speeding through it. But having played the game nonstop 5 years ago, i kinda still remembered most of what needed to be done for all 12 to survive. So, without really trying, i was able to keep them all alive. Now, if I can just work up the courage to get them all killed....again.
I found the following typically works to prevent losing any teammates in ME2: You gain loyalty from all teammates; you get full armor for the Normandy; choose Tali to enter that tunnel system heading into the final battle; choose Garrus to lead the second team; choose Kasumi to help usher out the survivors back to the Normandy; and choose Samara to put up the TK shield for the first team. Saving Gabby is a bit of a toss-up (saving her gets her a spot in ME3) I have learned as is that redhead assistant (their deaths have occurred when they are dissolved in the pod). It's like it's almost random. I have made other choices in these areas and lost at least one teammate or a member of the crew (the doctor or aforementioned gabby and assistant or all the rescued crew).
It is possible to choose the paragon option. After the Horizon mission you get more dossiers. But also the first loyalty missions start to come in. Do the loyalty missions at this point, but not Jack's or Miranda's. Next, you can do 1 dossier before you head off to the collector shop. Follow the game and before you go go the Reaper IFF mission, do Jack's or Miranda's loyalty mission. The fight triggers and then you can use the paragon option. This works for me!
I always use Garrus as my fire team leader. I know Miranda and Jacob are viable fits too but Garrus seems like the best fit. I am surprised that Mordin isn't a viable tech specialist, that seems like something he'd be able to do.
If I remember correctly, it’s the proportion of renegade to paragon that influences loyalty speech checks, not the amount. I’ve never really had a problem, but I usually save the big conflicts to closer to the PONR and play primarily paragon so that might be where the disconnect is. Also, you can still save the workers & get Zaeed’s loyalty, you just need to pass the speech check (play his mission as soon as possible to keep the paragon/renegade point balance correct)
First attempt I lost Jacob because I made him the tech expert and lost half the crew because I didn’t go straight away. I failed Thane’s loyalty mission so I kept him in on the bench to keep him alive. Was so mad that I started the game again to save everyone
You need almost a full bar of Paragon points to speech check Jack, and Miranda. I agree with you on how ridiculous it is. Mainly save either Jack, or Miranda for next to last to do it.
I was surprised how easy it was to save everyone. I thought you had to do all these special things and it turns out you just need to do the loyalty missions and pick the right folks. haha I was so relived.
I like watching your videos because it shows the other decisions that can be made especially the Renegade ones. Because everything I do on this game and the other two are always Paragon stuff so I'm always able to Max it out easily and I can always pass these things, but it's kind of cool to see what happens if I don't do certain things. And I'm glad that I can live that through your Channel
I Have played all the ME games so many times, since their original release. I can tell you this much you can get full paragon without cheating. I have in all of my playthroughs for each game gotten full paragon and I play on the XBox. Though I have never been able to save all squad members so this time I'm going base off your video to see if I save them all
For the "this is a distraction" paragon option, Shepard will just say that they should safe the effort for the collectors, with both Miranda and Jack agreeing to hold back any confrontation until after the mission is complete.
for my playthrough i chose kasumi for the ventalation and jacob on the ground, second part i chose samara, and maranda, the final push i chose to take kasumi and mordin with me... We all made it... I was only missing jack, zaed, and legoins loyalty so word of advice, make sure you get over 75% of the squad loyal due to that rng mechanic mentioned...
I was able to succeed with the paragon check with Jack and Miranda. And yes you pretty much have to be maxed out. I even made sure that I accomplished the missions in a certain order to make sure that this confrontation would be later in the game.
You can regain Miranda's loyalty by maxing out your Paragon then wearing an armor (I forgot which one) that boosts Paragon/Renegade by a percentage. Tried this and it worked.
UPDATED 2021 GUIDE HERE:
th-cam.com/video/NkkPZzoPfGc/w-d-xo.html
MASS EFFECT 2 SUICIDE SQUAD SURVIVAL GUIDE
1) Complete all squad loyalty missions. I recommend recruiting all squadmates and doing all loyalty missions prior to obtaining the Reaper IFF. You can complete Legion's loyalty mission after the Reaper IFF since he isn't in your party before then.
2) Complete the following Normandy ship upgrades - Heavy Ship Armor, Thanix Cannon, and Multicore Shielding.
3) Launch the final mission right after Normandy crew is kidnapped. If you complete any missions between the time the crew is taken and the final mission, then some (or all) crew members won't survive. We wanna save Kelly Chambers, Doctor Chakwas, etc right?!
4) Squad Selections During Final Mission (loyalty is assumed)
Phase 1
Tech Expert - Tali, Kasumi or Legion
Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda
Phase 2
Escort for Rescued Normandy Crew - Mordin or Tali
Biotics Expert - Jack or Samara / Morinth
Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda
Squadmates for Final Phase - whoever is loyal. If you have non-loyal squadmates, leave them behind as part of the defense and also leave behind more combat-oriented characters (Garrus, Grunt, Legion, etc) to help protect non-loyal squadmates.
If you follow all these steps then everyone will survive the events of Mass Effect 2.
Damn did all loyalty missions after getting Legion...
What happens when you import an ME2 save where everyone, even Shepherd, dies during this mission into ME3?
@@bittersweetjesus you cant
I just did this mission and I spent hours preparing. I got everyones loyalty and I was at the final part so I figured everyone should be fine. I took Garrus and Grunt with me and Mordin ended up dying so I restarted the mission and Took Thane and Zaeed with me and everyone ended up surviving. So I guess that thing with combat oriented characters still applies with the loyal ones
@Big Dan Gaming
Question: I did the loyalty quests and made sure all characters were loyal and followed your advice, but when I imported to game 3 it shows Tali's name on the memorial wall. Is that a possible glitch? Can loyal characters still die in the suicide mission?
“In theory, any biotic could do it!” No, I didn’t go to all the trouble to recruit an ancient Asari justicar and the most powerful human biotic in existence to give this job to some C-tier like Jacob.
What's funny is, by ME3, Jacob forget he's a biotic when he's fighting against Cerberus.
_C-tier_
You are overrating Jacob.
@@VRichardsn yeah that was wierd
It's like they realized that the Biotic Field objective was too easy, so they were like,
"Might as well make Miranda trick you into killing someone!"
Yup. I didn't even choose Miranda to lead any squad in ME2. She didn't have too much authority for any team
1 mistake I made in this video is about Zaeed. You can save the factory workers and still get his loyalty if your paragon score is high enough.
Also I'm pretty sure you can fail Thane and Samara's missions by losing the target and having Morinth lose interest respectively.
@@liamclarke91
Yep. I know that. 😅 But I kept trying at Thane's Loyalty Mission.
I was about to write a message about it but i'm glad i checked few comments below.
Dang! I missed that! His quest bugged me so much, having to choose between his revenge and saving the workers.
To break the argument between miranda and jack you need 3 bars of paragon/renegade, wanted to point that out
I always picked Garrus as the fireteam leader because of his level-headedness, combat experience and his time with C-Sec, but I'm surprised Mordin isn't an option. Dude led covert ops back in his day you know.
@Genaro Scala Yeah, commanding a very specific and science oriented special ops unit doesn’t really carry over to front lines leadership
im surprised there wasnt some better use for Mordin's skills during the suicide mission, like maybe a science oriented tech objective. the best thing you can do with him is have him escort the crew back to the ship.
I thought the same thing in my first playthrough of Mass Effect 2 years ago my first playthrough of Mass Effect 2 I lost Legion, Mordion, .and Thane that was the same thing I thought I chose Mordion as my squad leader
@Genaro Scala He also mentioned he studied under Kirahee
Mordin running covert ops is exactly why he's the ideal pick for getting the rest of the crew out alive and not as a fireteam leader.
If you talk to him about Kirrahe he'll straight up tell you that he prefers "get the job done and go home" over "hold the line". This is your hint for the final mission.
Anyone else watching this as "homework" for their first Legendary Edition playthrough?
It's why I'm here.
im just curious as to how his playthrough have been different from mine. the only difference i would say is i always sent grunt with the normandy crew, I always take miranda and someone else with me in the final phase usually cuz i romance miranda and everyone survives. I do all the ship ugrades and what not. I also suggest re doing the campaign as doing so gets you minerals, money and ren/par points you can use in the new campaign and you can always change your class if you didnt like the first one you picked and you get to keep any armor you bought in the previouse campaign. In mass effect 2 i do two playthroughs. One loyal to ashely and the other i cheat on her with miranda same for ME 3 lol.
exactly... so stoked to play this game again I can't wait
Yeah I'm doing just that
I got everyone to survive one my second playthrough when I played it all those years ago. Probably would have been fine first time if Thanes mission didnt bug out.
Hey...being as a Paragon person, I did saved the Factory Workers at Zaeed's Loyality mission. And I had enough Paragon Points to convince him to follow my lead. In fact, Kasumi and Zaeed were the first 2 Squadmates, who's Loyality Mission was completed. I was able to do that with one bar Paragon. :D
Likewise. I think if you save Zaeed under the rubble, he still becomes loyal to you
@@TheDancerMacabre
Yep. 😊 But need to pass the Paragon Speech Check to make sure of it. Otherwise he might not be loyal.
I never encountered this... Good to know... Zaeed's always been revenge so I had to comply with him and unfortunately gain some Renegade points...
@@TrialMacameau
You always went after Vido? It's ok.
Yeah I manage to save the Factory workers and get Zaeed's loyalty.
For the "Hold the Line" Force, there's actually a chart that properly explains the math behind it on the internet. Every squadmate is given a "Defense Value" in the game's eyes. Grunt, Garrus, and Zaeed all have a DV of 3, Legion, Jacob, Samara/Morinth, Miranda, and Thane have a DV of 1, and Tali, Kasumi, Mordin, and Jack have a DV of 0. All loyal squadmates get an extra 1 point to their DV, so Tali, Kasumi, Mordin, and Jack will have a DV of 1 if they are loyal, and so on. During the "Hold the Line" part, the game will add up the DVs of all the Squadmates involved then divide them by how many squadmates are present. If the total DV is equal to or greater than 2, then everyone lives. So, assuming everyone's loyal, say you send Mordin to protect the crew and take Jack and Tali with you to the final boss, then the remaining crew will have a remaining total value of 4+4+4+2+2+2+2+2+1=23/9=2.56. 2.56>2=everyone lives. But say instead, you send Grunt to protect the crew and take Garrus and Zaeed with you, 2+2+2+2+2+1+1+1+1=14/9=1.56. 1.56
Wow, that's awesome and complex
@@nova3530onyt true, but at the same time it kinda puts too much stock in damage sponge potential over anything else. Like, Jack is considered a 0 DV, despite the fact that her biotics are strong enough to not only create squad barriers and ammo, but also blast entire hoards of collectors away in one shot.
@@fireblast8972 I never knew that. Appreciate the info.
There's also a priority system that I can't recall, but easy to find online.
I think Mordin has the highest death priority which is why it's best to send him as an escort.
Though in my head, it's because of his former STG Infiltration and extraction training, as well as the pheromones he developed.
FINALLY SOMEONE SAID IT, people keep saying it's RNG and that you only need to be loyal for everyone to survive coming from people who played it like 7 times? mediocre numbers
it's more or less set that if everyone is loyal, Normandy is fully upgraded, Tali, Kasumi will die unless you take them with you against the reaper larvae
MASS EFFECT 2 SUICIDE SQUAD SURVIVAL GUIDE
1) Complete all squad loyalty missions. I recommend recruiting all squadmates and doing all loyalty missions prior to obtaining the Reaper IFF. You can complete Legion's loyalty mission after the Reaper IFF since he isn't in your party before then.
2) Complete the following Normandy ship upgrades - Heavy Ship Armor, Thanix Cannon, and Multicore Shielding.
3) Launch the final mission right after Normandy crew is kidnapped. If you complete any missions between the time the crew is taken and the final mission, then some (or all) crew members won't survive. We wanna save Kelly Chambers, Doctor Chakwas, etc right?!
4) Squad Selections During Final Mission (loyalty is assumed)
Phase 1
Tech Expert - Tali, Kasumi or Legion
Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda
Phase 2
Escort for Rescued Normandy Crew - Mordin or Tali
Biotics Expert - Jack or Samara / Morinth
Firesquad Leader - Garrus, Jacob or Miranda
Squadmates for Final Phase - whoever is loyal. If you have non-loyal squadmates, leave them behind as part of the defense and also leave behind more combat-oriented characters (Garrus, Grunt, Legion, etc) to help protect non-loyal squadmates.
If you follow all these steps then everyone will survive the events of Mass Effect 2.
Thanks for the upload I completely forgot how to save them all
Only lost Tali from the rocket.
**Loads from last checkpoint**
@Matthew W Jr. Hasch replaying now.
@Matthew W Jr. Hasch mission successful. All squad members alive and imported into M.E.3
The only mission I did after the crew was taken away was gain legions loyalty, and half of the crew died
After 29 hours and 45 minutes I saved everyone, romanced miranda , gaining everyones loyalty, grinding to get full paragon I've done it!!
Well played!
Dude 30 hours, that's too long. Even with DLC and all side quests. Are you scanned every planet at Terminus System?
@@lexiusugrymius9392 gotta get thise resources my gamer
"...Really, Commander?"
@@justjoking5252 probing Uranus
I found that talking to Jack and Miranda multiple times worked to get the paragon option up. With Jack, to the point where she says that she's not good with friendship and shit, but you've been good to her. Every other playthrough I lost Jack's loyalty, so was really happy this time.
I usually romance Jack and I found the best way is to side with Jack and then tell Miranda that you sided with Jack to calm her down.
Miranda takes it as a tactical move.
Both remain loyal and you don't ruin the Romance with Jack.
That happens with Wrex too, if you help him get his grandfather's armor in ME1 when you get to Virmire the Paragon/Renegade options lose their colors as if you were choosing a normal dialog.
A few corrections:
- You don't actually have to do the Renegade option on Zaeed's loyalty mission. If you have high enough Paragon and let Vido get away, you can convince him at the end to let go of his revenge for the time being which still secures his loyalty.
- You can also lose Thane's loyalty if you fail to keep tabs on the guy you're following. Kolyat will succeed in killing his target and the mission ends with Thane being a sad boi.
- While it is true that squad members like Mordin or Tali or Kasumi are more likely to die in the final phase of the mission, as long as Grunt and Zaeed are left behind in the firing squad that is negligible. The pecking order for who lives and dies only comes into play when there aren't any heavy hitters in that final group, so you could really send any loyal squad mate back with the crew and be fine as long as your heavy hitters are there to protect your squishier companions later.
It’s pretty easy to get a high enough paragon if you imported your save without console commands, I’ve never failed the speech when I’ve played traditionally.
It's not nice to mess with reality, I guess
Same, since I did everything in ME1 along with all the missions before those 2 arguements in ME2. I had enough paragon and renegade points. Plus I was on PS3 so there was no console commands for me, so I don't know what he was talking about.
Yeah...I´m playing paragade right now (about 2/3 paragon, 1/3 renegade) and I have the paragon option opened...didn´t even know it is a big problem to open it :D. I even did Miranda and Jack loyalty missions quite early which could help or not (idk really) :D but the fact is I imported a save with bunch of paragon and renegade points earned in ME1.
I won't get daddy Garrus killed now
Gotta keep the bros alive
Fuckin same, i lost him because i picked the wrong biotic :,(
@@scout3443 same I lost big daddy to but now I'm replying the game cuz of that
I think the answer to the jack and Miranda paragon situation is that you need a paragon of 70% or higher and constantly talk to them throughout the story
only the paragon one, i never talked to them
"Get's shot in the head with rocket launcher" No body limbs destroyed.
maybe he will survive :-) its only a rocket:-)))
Technically, it was one of Harbinger's energy blasts, not a rocket launcher...which actually makes that death somewhat personal when you think about it.
> no body limbs
What other kinds of limbs are there? Head limbs??
I chose loyal tali for this spot but she died anyways so i was confused
Probably trying to minimize extreme gore like shattered bodies since they are squadmates and the death has a more personal impact when the body is still whole. The only gory part in the final mission is whoever get devoured by the swarm if anyone is not loyal.
Best way to do the Paragon neutral ending for Jack and Miranda is save one of their loyalty missions to the very end right before the suicide Mission if you've done all Paragon to the whole game by the end of that mission you'll have enough paragon to the Paragon talk them down
The game is balanced to make it difficult without the DLC. If you use the DLC bonuses to either paragon and renegade, the checks are all fairly easy.
I've always played paragon without DLC and I've always managed to use the paragon response between miranda an jack
Also, use some fucking punctuation. Or regular punctuation. Either type should work.
The checks in mass effect 2 are based on how many times you’ve chosen paragon or renegade with how many of those options you’ve had. If you only ever choose one of the two options and never a mix of the two you will always be fine. I’ve heard in the legendary edition they’ve made changes to this system but I only just finished the first game so I don’t know how well it works for myself yet
there is another way to do it, on the level up system there is a perk that boosts your paragon level. if im not mistaken there is a terminal in the ship that you can use to rearrenge all the perks points you have earned in any way you want. I do this before i do jack loyalty mission to level up the perk as much as possible and boost my paragon level.
When playing full paragon pays off :’)
Without cheating or anything. Really wasn’t hard getting full paragon either.
hey man this is a great help, it's my first play-through and this was a huge help
Happy to help!
@@BigDanGaming I lost four people and replayed the mission and lost only Tali. Then I came to the video and because of it I managed to get everybody's asses out of the fire.
Thank you Dan and have a good day.
On my first playthrough I picked Garrus as the infiltrator, since I thought he would be able to hold his own, given the description of the role. I was *not* expecting him to stick his head out of cover, given his experience earlier in the game.
Was very proud to have everyone walk away alive on my first ever playthrough. Feeling like anyone could get snuffed out at any time made this part of the game feel like an edge-of-your-seat moment where the stakes were raised incredibly high and remains one of the most memorable gaming moments for me.
Yeah it's a wild ride for sure! The final mission of ME2 is one of the most memorable missions I've played in a video game. Congrats on bringing your whole crew back through the Omega-4 relay on your first run! I lost Miranda and Zaeed on my first playthrough :/
@@BigDanGaming I just completed this game in the last week after getting about a quarter of the way through me3. I figured a bit of context wouldn’t hurt. I was shocked when Mordin got his head took off with a rocket after seeing him in me3
This video made me feel pretty good. I didn’t know how few people have enough paragon points to resolve the crew argument(s). In my legendary edition playthrough, I had enough paragon points to resolve the Miranda/Jack fight with a paragon speech check.
Importing from me1 makes it so much easier if you had max paragon when you beat that game (which is pretty easy to get). My first time importing from me1 was also the first time I had enough paragon to pass the speech check with Miranda and jack and was also the first time I got max paragon in me2.
Even to this day ME2's ending is my favorite in all of gaming. The amount of decisions that change how it plays out, even small things like how soon you do it and who you take with your squad, is amazing.
I have got the high paragon and passed both, it helps not to fool around with any character and it keeps Miranda alive in me3.
thank you for this, im going through a full paragon playthrough of mass effect 2 and lost jacks loyalty, now i know how to keep her alive
Awesome! Thanks for watching. I just posted a video on how to max out your paragon meter too if you're interested. You might even be able to regain Jack's loyalty before the final mission if you can boost your paragon score enough before then
th-cam.com/video/NwmiYfUOsi4/w-d-xo.html
@@BigDanGaming i finished my playthrough earlier, kept jack alive and had max paragon, i went to see her after the final mission but still couldnt get the paragon answer even though i was maxed out, kept her alive thats the main thing
@@darkestfugue The problem is, in ME2 the gauge is misleading. You may have a maxed out your _absolute_ Paragon score, but if the quotient of current Paragon / max Paragon is too low, you are screwed (works the same for the Renegade score).
In order to defuse the situation between Miranda and Jack the Paragon way, make sure to pick any and all Paragon dialog options (some might require Investigating an issue further before they become available), and if Paragon speech checks present themselves. use them, too. Whenever Paragon interrupts pop up, use them! They give you additional Paragon points (and usually a healthy dose on top of that).
Another catch to be kept in mind: Whenever you find an Anomaly, the number of maximum Paragon points available is immediately increased while your current amount remains constant. If you are too close to certain thresholds you might quickly find yourself fall below them, rendering the Paragon speech check unavailable. So whenever you encounter one, make sure to resolve it so you don't leave any unclaimed Paragon/Renegade points behind and so maintain a sufficiently high score ratio.
Hey man. Thanks for this. I realised Kelly died tonight and I couldn't answer Dr chakwas. Was seriously stunned I had managed to get Kelly dead. I love her soothing voice and calming nature. So I quit. And searched and ended up at this brilliant step by step guide. Thank you my friend. This is my favorite guide on the citadel.
Thanks! Much appreciated!
Awesome. I'm subscribing mate. Mass effect fans gotta stick together right. Peace and blessings from South Africa.
one of the few games where actual ship upgrades matter LOL
The speechcheck for Loyaltymission becomes more difficult over time. I highly recomend to do the Miranda and Jack Loyalty Mission either quite early or very late.
I'm kinda surprised that I managed this without a guide way back when
Me, too. Pure dumb luck on my part.
Crazy right? It's more complex when you absorb the information all at once, but manageable through hours of gameplay xD
Ya, the game gives you a couple cues, bit there is a bit of luck involved without a guide.
Me too. On my second attempt. First attempt I got Mordin killed when we crawling through the pipes. And I did Jack’s loyalty right before the suicide mission. So when Kelly died I was extremely upset.
wow this was WAY more helpful than some other guides, well done
Glad you found it helpful! Thanks!
Two Things Worth Pointing Out
1. Paragon and Renegade Speech Checks work off a system that plays off of the ratio of earned points where speech checks can be made impossible despite having a maxed bar. Make sure you fully commit to one path since certain options can accrue extra points that may throw this off. Also be sure to get the bonuses in the passive skill tree for the 100% boost to dialogue options as well as the negotiator helm to help you along the way. I've found that even with a skewed ratio the followup check should always be possible at max or near max Renegade or Paragon.
2. There are several loyalty missions that can be failed, resulting in their loyalty not being acquired. These are Thane, Samara, Zaeed and Tali. As mentioned, using the evidence in Tali's trial will result in it, for Zaeed you need to complete a paragon check to ensure his loyalty in the route where you save the workers. Samara's and Thane's can be failed if you are unable to achieve their objectives.
Thanks for this guide, it especially helped me with succesfully solving conflicts
You're welcome! Glad to hear it
I saved the factory workers and Zaeed was still loyal
Same
Amazing! Thank you, after playing for the first time ever like a month ago, i'm actually on my 2nd playthrough and I want everyone to survive b4 I move on Mass Effect 3
Gotta keep the squad alive! Thanks for watching!
Gosh, I can’t imagine how beautiful the suicide mission is gonna be in Legendary Edition
Awesome by the way
i recommend not following this guide on your first playthrough. the final mission is so much better after you mess it up then do it right the second playthrough.
I can dig that. Part of the reason I made the guide is because I lost Zaeed and Miranda on my first blind playthrough. It's a good experience to feel the weight of those decisions and mistakes
I actually did save everyone on my first blind playthrough. I am something of a completionist when it comes to games I love though. I do every available side quest before the next available story mission when I’m given any kind of quest log. It’s making my blind playthrough of The Outer Words take forever. Also I only picked the absolute best for other squad leaders, so Garrus each time, Tali as tech, and Jack or Samara for the biotic.
Great video. Very thorough.
I was able to save everyone on my very first playthrough and never realized this was an issue for people until I was playing ME3. I'm a completionist and I play as paragon so I usually have enough paragon points for dialogue. I always choose Garrus to lead the missions, Kasumi to crawl through the vent, Jack to do the barrier and Zaeed to escort the crew members.
Only time I lost someone was when I "attempted" a renegade playthrough and couldnt follow through and didnt have enough renegade or paragon points for the jack and Miranda argument and Miranda died at the end :D
I've saved the civilians in Zaed's loyalty mission and got his loyalty, all you have to do is choose the right dialogue options at the end, you see if you have enough Paragon points you can tell him that vengeance is not the way and that you need to put it aside in order to fight effectively.
love how you say someone is going to die then a second later you put the scene just for us to cry 😂😭cause they die so tragic
I lost Garrus once letting Miranda do the biotic shield in phase 2. I started the mission over. I didn't know. And on my very 1st playthrough I did the IFF mission before I had everyone's loyalty so I started the whole game over. I've had very interesting playthroughs. 😉😁
Sidebar: I save Tali's loyalty mission until after the IFF mission because I take Legion to the Flotilla and it is HILARIOUS. Then I do Legion's loyalty mission, then it the kidnapping of the crew and right to the suicide mission.
Haha, yeah...this, I personally feel Legion NEEDS to come with on the Flotilla 😂. I save Tali's mission for last as well. So excited for Legendary Edition
very useful since jack was the only non loyal member on my team, thanks!
Glad I could help! Hope Jack survived!
@@BigDanGaming Sorry for the very late response, Jack did survive, your tutorial was perfect.
Thinking about getting the legendary edition since I never played Mass Effect before. If I do, then I'm gonna make sure to come back here when I start 2
Mass effect 2 probably has the best final mission of any game. The choices, the consequences, the music, it is just perfect. The first time I played the mission only Jack died because she wasn't loyal. choosing Tali/legion as a tech expert, Samara for the biotic shield, and Miranda as squad leaders made sense. I also like to do side quest before doing main in my RPGs so it mostly worked out.
Fun fact, if you choose an un-loyal miranda for the role of the the 2nd fire team leader then she actually won't die unlike an un-loyal Garrus/Jacob.
It's definitely possible to max out paragon/renegade. You have to master your class level-up tree to give you really nice bonuses to how much paragon/renegade you earn. Also, you have to commit to one or the other, you can't be neutral or go back in forth, you have to go all in on your morality.
Yeah definitely saving this video for when the legendary edition comes out. Thanks
I played this on PS3 11 years ago, and I didn’t have a computer or means to look any of this up on the internet. It was all trial and error. I managed to figure out who was best to chose by writing names down and playing the mission 4 times and going back to and starting the mission over. lol
ONCE I had enough Paragon points to keep Miranda and Jack both loyal. I think it was because I did all paragon options throughout the game and the DLC missions like Project Overlord, etc before doing either of their loyalty missions.
I used to have this all memorized because I played this countless times, but it’s been so long, I forgot. Thanks for this guide video!
Zaeed lived for me, I had to have enough paragon points to have him be loyal
Same. 1st playthrough I saved everyone. But I didn't let Zaeed kill that guy.
For those watching this for help with ME legendary edition, it is 100% possible to grind the paragon prior to completing jacks loyalty mission as long as you hold off for a considerable amount of time and complete almost every one else’s first. (I’ve yet to acquire legion, I have done Samara or Thanes missions) so long as you max out your class ability and go mostly paragon, you can do it.
Same goes for renegade I assume, I haven’t done a full renegade play through in a while
You can definitely do the paragon speech check for Miranda and Jack if you leave one of their respective loyalty mission for last. Assuming you go full paragon, you should have enough paragon built up.
First of all i’d like to say this video was exceedingly helpful. I lost some very close characters to me so i’m not guilty in saying i reloaded a save so i could keep them alive for mass effect 3. However while you covered most things there were a few notable things i noticed you missed. 1 being that for Zaeed’s loyalty mission you can still save the scientists and keep his loyalty if you have maxed out paragon to pass a speech check, you’re strong words will whip him into shape. And 2 if you’re having trouble maxing paragon through normal means, investing talent points in the stat boost ability of your chosen class gives you a major boost (i found vanguard is good for this, it brings you from tier 1 all the way to max if you cap out the skill). Aside from those nitpicks, great work, thanks again
I view this as a guide to save everyone you care about and still have Jacob take a rocket to the face lmao
From what I recall about the paragon and renegade speech checks to maintain everyone’s loyalty, the amount you have to fill up either bar increases as you progress through the game. So, it’s actually easier to pass the check if you tackle these conflicts early on so long as you dedicate yourself mostly to a single bar. If you do it later and deviate between paragon and renegade a lot then you’re basically screwed.
Totally not here to save the video for when the legendary edition comes out... noooooooooooo
At least I’m honest
See you in May! Hope it will be useful for ya
Same
Ha just did that too
I think it's fairly easy, just have majority of your squad loyal, get all ship upgrades, and pick the right loyal squad mates for the various roles at the end.
I am so glad I found these videos before the remaster comes out
I'm sure it'll be done around October, six months after it's released.
I wish I saw this before i played, i forgot to upgrade the Normandy 😓
How?
You don’t have to hack the game to max out paragon/renegade, you just have to time your missions so you tackle the rivals last.
Only had one play through where I didn’t have enough paragon meter to pass the check with Miranda and Jack.
It also helps to carry over a save with a reputation bonus from game one.
Great video
Thanks Henry! Much appreciated
This is really useful.
I completed my first playthrough last night, and lost Jack because I didn't upgrade the ship's shields. Later lost Grunt and Mordin during phase 1 and 2. Was hard, but the majority of the crew survived.
Everyone was loyal but some bad calls had repercusions!
Thanks for the video, I'll use it for my next attempt at saving the galaxy.
There is a bug to gain Paragon points in me2. After you kill morinth in Samara's loyalty mission, when she asks if you want to leave tell her you want to look around, you'll gain Paragon points for that, repeat the process until you have enough. It might take long but it's the easiest way to get the points.
Edit: this is for PC I don't know if it works on console
Ooo. I'll give it a try. You know how to max out your paragon/renegade points in ME1 on Noveria, right?
@@sarasunshinemt4444 No. I just give myself max points at the start
@@CollinsOmo On Noveria, if you get the garage pass from the turian head of Synthetic Insights, Gianna (the secretary) comes up to you and says she's Internal Affairs yadda yadda yadda...
Anyway, once you go and convince Lorik to use the evidence against Anoleise, DON'T return to Gianna. Keep talking to Lorik, but ask about Matriarch Benezia again, then pick "another question" and you'll be able to again persuade him to use the evidence.
You can go either paragon or renegade each time until you max out your meter.
This works for the console, and *should* work for PC.
*edit
You repeat the conversation until you're maxed out.
My first playthrough I didn't upgrade the Normandy at all, did at least 4 missions after the crew was kidnapped, and my only survivors were Grunt, Jack, and Tali 😭
Needless to say, I appreciate this video and am definitely saving it lol
I played this mission been trying to figure how to keep everyone alive I mostly got half the crew saved and Miranda was the only one without loyalty and survived when I did the mission with the human reaper at the end
This is a great guide. To get the Paragon high levels I always manage to pass. With Sheppard as a Commando then you get a paragon boost which I put points into first. I find dialogue options always useful in RPGs so I maxed out points in this before many others. This means you are always above the checks even early game due to (obviously) making mainly good choices, always right clicking the paragon action where possible and having the major leadership boost from commando. I also imported the standard Sheppard playthrough from ME1 which of course ended with maximum paragon points and a few renegade. Talking your way out of most situations not only gets good results but also gets even more paragon points! Of course having some renegade is useful.
That's a great way to do Paragon runs
Completed all missions and still haven't got enough paragon to get Jack's loyalty back why is she so angry with me 😥😥
I’ve definitely gotten my paragon high enough to pass both the Miranda-Jack fight and to regain loyalty later
I thought u could choose zaed for The fire mission, considering he is a experienced merc and leader
Every time you talk to him his stories always end with him being the only survivor.
@@milkmaster87 do they? I must have missed that 😂
@@insert1name0com No one around to point it out.
according to shadow broker's file, zaeed is lack of interpersonal skill so that's why he's not qualified as fire squad leader
I never had an issue with getting enough paragon points, it also helped that I did Miranda’s loyalty mission late
Ivd gotten zaeeds loyalty and saved the workers
It takes having enough paragon or renegade points tho so i only got it by having my paragon from mass effect 1 playthrough
You mean at the refinery? I had to let them die :l so Zaeed won't think I was a pussy with a heart (which I'm).
@@sevnesioran6193 dude go save the workers you can talk him into loyalty without sacrifcing the innocent workers with enough paragon or renegade you can get his loyalty
After acquiring the Reaper IFF, you have time to complete two missions before the Collectors attack. I usually save Tali and Legion's loyalty missions for that time, as the missions are more interesting if you take them on the other's mission.
Thanks man, on my first playthrough i lost Jack's loyalty (which led to her death) by siding with Miranda. This explains a lot.
Yeah. Paragon Shepard requires a very big amount to resolve the conflict. However I did not knew that the Renegade Shepard can solve that easier. And did not knew either that at Tali's and Legion's conflict it's the other way around. That Paragon Shepard can solve it easier.
actually you can easily resolve the jack/miranda conflict with either paragon or renegade, the trick is to leave one of their loyalty missions and do it very late in the game (right before obtaining the reaper IFF) by that time you shouldve done all the main missions and some side and DLC, which will easily give you enough paragon OR renegade to resolve the situation (i personally do it in paragon and it’s easy) and it works similarly with legion/tali
Hmmm good to know. I've only ever pulled it off as a renegade but I don't remember how early in the game I did their missions on the last paragon run I did. I'll have to try it again another time.
Wow. Can't believe folks needed a video for this.
You CAN save the factory workers on the Zaeed mission if you have a high enough paragon score in either direction. Usually after completing the Tali loyalty mission if you're being consistent. You also don't HAVE to max out your score to fix the rift between the ladies, it just has to be close in one direction or another. Just don't wait until too late in the game to choose a path and no cheating is necessary for your Paragon score. Great video though!
Dude thank you so much when I was a kid like 10 I lost everyone it was one of those games I wished I could have done better but didn't get a chance to retry now I saved em all thanks so much
I’ve always been able to save everyone with perfect paragon. and in mass effect 2/3 been able to jump back and forth from time to time with certain dialogues.... it seems more real when a paragon Shepard loses it once in a while and shows how truly ruthless and deadly she can be. 🥰
If you complete every mission except the main story and loyalty missions, you can get enough of the paragon points before the two events involving miranda and jack. Or at least mine was maxed out before that particular event.
i just ran through all the N7 missions, Cerberus missions, and the occasional Alliance missions. Just paragon all the way
First time i played this when it was released i lost Miranda and Mordin. This time thanks to your video i will try to save everyone. Thanks again
Thank you so much for this guide. All my crew survived.
Awesome vid. I played this so so much on release, can't wait to finish again.
You can regain Zaeed's loyalty if you save the workers by using the paragon option at the end of the mission. At least it worked for me!
For anyone wondering how the math of the final “hold the line team works”:
You need the average of the teams combat points to be above 2.0.
Garrus, Grunt and Zaeed are all worth 4 each if loyal.
Miranda, Jacob, Thane, Samara, and Legion are worth 2 points each if loyal.
Tali, Mordin, Kasumi and Jack are each worth 1 point each if loyal.
Jack was my only non loyal character (and i don't have the DLC character), i keep her back in the "hold the line" team.
She died, even with Grunt, Jacob, Thane, Samara and Legion, all loyal. (Garrus and Miranda were with me on the bomb team)
@@lordmazdamundi2847 Who did you send to escort the crew??
@@chop54321 Oh yeah, Jacob
@@lordmazdamundi2847 Thanks for catching my typo. I had the formula wrong. Sorry about that!! Fixed now. The tiers are 4,2,1.
So you had a team strength of 12, which is an average of 1.7. Next time, just keep Garrus back and bring a loyal Tali or Mordin with you on the bomb team.
@@chop54321 Understood, thanks !
You can definitely pass the Jack/Miranda and Tali/Legion speech checks by doing them towards the end.
Started replaying ME2 (the whole OT) a week ago. Got to ME2 with the intent of speeding through it. But having played the game nonstop 5 years ago, i kinda still remembered most of what needed to be done for all 12 to survive. So, without really trying, i was able to keep them all alive.
Now, if I can just work up the courage to get them all killed....again.
I found the following typically works to prevent losing any teammates in ME2: You gain loyalty from all teammates; you get full armor for the Normandy; choose Tali to enter that tunnel system heading into the final battle; choose Garrus to lead the second team; choose Kasumi to help usher out the survivors back to the Normandy; and choose Samara to put up the TK shield for the first team. Saving Gabby is a bit of a toss-up (saving her gets her a spot in ME3) I have learned as is that redhead assistant (their deaths have occurred when they are dissolved in the pod). It's like it's almost random. I have made other choices in these areas and lost at least one teammate or a member of the crew (the doctor or aforementioned gabby and assistant or all the rescued crew).
It is possible to choose the paragon option. After the Horizon mission you get more dossiers. But also the first loyalty missions start to come in. Do the loyalty missions at this point, but not Jack's or Miranda's. Next, you can do 1 dossier before you head off to the collector shop. Follow the game and before you go go the Reaper IFF mission, do Jack's or Miranda's loyalty mission. The fight triggers and then you can use the paragon option. This works for me!
I always use Garrus as my fire team leader. I know Miranda and Jacob are viable fits too but Garrus seems like the best fit. I am surprised that Mordin isn't a viable tech specialist, that seems like something he'd be able to do.
If I remember correctly, it’s the proportion of renegade to paragon that influences loyalty speech checks, not the amount. I’ve never really had a problem, but I usually save the big conflicts to closer to the PONR and play primarily paragon so that might be where the disconnect is. Also, you can still save the workers & get Zaeed’s loyalty, you just need to pass the speech check (play his mission as soon as possible to keep the paragon/renegade point balance correct)
I was always able to pass the paragon speech check during the Jack/Miranda confrontation
First attempt I lost Jacob because I made him the tech expert and lost half the crew because I didn’t go straight away. I failed Thane’s loyalty mission so I kept him in on the bench to keep him alive.
Was so mad that I started the game again to save everyone
You need almost a full bar of Paragon points to speech check Jack, and Miranda. I agree with you on how ridiculous it is. Mainly save either Jack, or Miranda for next to last to do it.
Thank you dude you just totally saved my team in Mass Effect I finally completed it this out any of my team members dying
did suicide mission with legion on normal following your guide and saved everyone pretty cool thank you
I was surprised how easy it was to save everyone. I thought you had to do all these special things and it turns out you just need to do the loyalty missions and pick the right folks. haha I was so relived.
I like watching your videos because it shows the other decisions that can be made especially the Renegade ones. Because everything I do on this game and the other two are always Paragon stuff so I'm always able to Max it out easily and I can always pass these things, but it's kind of cool to see what happens if I don't do certain things. And I'm glad that I can live that through your Channel
I Have played all the ME games so many times, since their original release. I can tell you this much you can get full paragon without cheating. I have in all of my playthroughs for each game gotten full paragon and I play on the XBox. Though I have never been able to save all squad members so this time I'm going base off your video to see if I save them all
For the "this is a distraction" paragon option, Shepard will just say that they should safe the effort for the collectors, with both Miranda and Jack agreeing to hold back any confrontation until after the mission is complete.
for my playthrough i chose kasumi for the ventalation and jacob on the ground, second part i chose samara, and maranda, the final push i chose to take kasumi and mordin with me... We all made it... I was only missing jack, zaed, and legoins loyalty so word of advice, make sure you get over 75% of the squad loyal due to that rng mechanic mentioned...
im so pumped to play the series again thankyou!!!
I passed the Paragon check for Miranda and Jack's confrontation, but I'm a bit of a completionist and hate taking renegade options mostly.
I was able to succeed with the paragon check with Jack and Miranda. And yes you pretty much have to be maxed out. I even made sure that I accomplished the missions in a certain order to make sure that this confrontation would be later in the game.
I think zaeed also adds a lot to the ‘hold the line’ score as well
You can regain Miranda's loyalty by maxing out your Paragon then wearing an armor (I forgot which one) that boosts Paragon/Renegade by a percentage. Tried this and it worked.