"Geographical sensor" That's a new one for me. I'll have to remember to ask the guy at the parts counter next time I'm in there if they have one in stock. See how long he will search the computer before he gives up and says they don't show any in stock.
It really depends who you get! A year or so I went to AutoZone, not either of the normal ones I go to, opposite side of town -only one to have my part. I tell the counter guy I need a passenger side outer tie rod for a '00 f250 2wd. Guy asks what kind of car is it. I say an f250. Asks me what make is it, a Chevy, or whatever! I'm like, I said f250! He starts getting aggressive and says I asked you the make of the vehicle! At this point I'm like just forget it if you can't figure out a f250 manufacturer, you shouldn't be working at a parts store selling parts. Maybe sweep the floor is a better occupation for you. I just walked out & ordered it from RockAuto instead. Unbelievable this clown was that dumb! I couldn't even grasp the stupidity of someone like that, working at a parts store, selling parts through a computer that tells you everything you need to know, and not a thing more! You tell them you want a wiper for a car they ask if it's awd or not, gas or diesel, standard or auto trans, does it have grey interior or beige?! Just unbelievable 🤦🏻♂️😅🤦🏻♂️👍🏻
At 14.13 you can see the offset of the cam gear which was forcing the chain into the head. Also explains why the aluminium carrier for the top guide fractured. When the bolt is undone for that sprocket you can see it all jump forward. Previous mechanic ruined that engine…
There's a channel that I sometimes watch called "The Hydraulic Press Channel", where they crush stuff with a 300 Ton press. You should contact them to find out if a water pump from a car engine is crushable with a 300 Ton press.
One of my friends worked on Renault engines fitted to Nissans in the UK. He has always bought Hondas himself. He took great pleasure in telling me every time a new disaster was discovered. He saw a lot of engines replaced under warranty. Happily he retired just over a year ago. My brother's A-class plug in hybrid has a French engine, fortunately he leased it through the UK NHS, so he can give it back in about 9 months. He says his next car will be a Toyota hybrid.
I don't think any Toyota engine is as reliable as Renault F4R or M9R. Had both on a Laguna and X-Trail, and both vehicles did 350k and 450k km respectively, with no issues whatsoever.
@@wtfiswiththosehandles There's loads that are more reliable than that... I'm not even a Toyota fan but they make fantastic engines when they feel like it.
I work on a lot of the mini N engines that come through the shop at my work, failures I have seen are: Timing chain guides, valve stems seals, cas modules, dme’s, water pumps and pulleys, harmonic balancer, tension units that turn the water pump, the press fit plugs that go into the timing cover, footwell modules, tons of thermostats (some have a superseding part that requires adaptor harness), wastegate issues, bypass valve failure, oil control solenoid harness leaks. There’s probably more I am forgetting
In nearly 20 years as a professional mechanic, there are only 2 engines I’ve seen that had to be replaced because they bent rods without any external cause/failure. One was a BMW N20 and the other was an N13. When I say no external cause, I mean they weren’t hydrolocked, they weren’t modified/tuned, the fuel injectors were fine (not leaking), they’re just junk and bent a rod because they’re too flimsy. In both cases, it caused a slight knock, a vibration and misfire codes for the cylinder with the bent rod (because of lower compression). Both engines had less than 100k miles.
The bent rod is most likely caused by LSPI low speed pre ignition these small displacement high pressure turbo engines bend rods break pistons etc. The type of oil used in the engine is critical API SP or API SN plus these oil ratings means that the oil has been designed to mitigate against LSPI
Timing had been done and camgears were installed wrong way! Those parts in pickup were from old guide. I think that it lost timing tension and went in lean(maybe jumped a tooth?), and then they started just throwing parts at it like the vvt solenoid without getting it any better because codes were probably from timing correlation and it had new chain so it can't be that 😅
I hope one day a teardown of an Mini N18 can be done. I've been looking at 2011-2013 Coopers recently, I know the N18 addressed a number of issues that plagued the N14.
I got my n18 at the beginning of the year. A few hundred miles of track driving later, no problems. But I am waiting for the other shoe to drop. Luckily I got a deal on the car so I accept it.
Taking into consideration that it goes in a mini, there are some differences in terms of where certain stuff is that makes it bad. However, the major issues seem to be related to timing chain, high pressure fuel pump and carbon build-up. The PCV membrane can also be an issue (but this is a very easy serviceable thing). The 155 and 165 hp versions tend to be the worse in terms of chain issues. The 175 from.... 2012/2013 onwards(?) has improved quite a bit, and then there are 2 200hp versions: one is the 175hp version with a bigger turbo, and then you have the actual THP200 that doesn't seem to be available on the Mini Cooper (Peugeot RCZ R has it tho) and that one tends to be the better one in terms of reliability, oddly because of valvetronic (maybe?), as the chain issues tend to be rare here. Do keep a look on the vacuum lines and the turbo has that flap that might tend to get some play. High pressure fuel pump issues, if I'm not mistaken, there was a recall for that. Euro6 Prince engines are a bit more recent, and probably also more reliable, but these seem to be PSA only. Not sure (and from 2016 onwards only) Every engine here requires also needs good 0w-30 oil, no more than 10.000km between changes, and being a DI, give a look at the intake valves Advice, get a mini cooper from 2014 onwards, or just don't. Source: I own a 2013 DS5 with the THP200, now if it's the THP175 with the bigger turbo or the actual THP200... They do look quite alike, both of them.
Check your oil with every fuel fill up. I overfill my oil a tad bit intentionally. Check carbon buildup on valves, intake removal is simple. Do not ignore timing chain noise. Low Oil level can actually prevent the timing chain tensioner from expanding, causing a risk of chain slap and skipping time. Be ready to change oil seals, I've put 40k on mine (owned from 80k-120k) and I've resealed the entire engine. It's not that difficult.
Some engineer at BMW or Peugeot or wherever thought that his idea to run the dipstick thru a timing guide was the most brilliant idea anyone has ever had
The block is from a very reliable PSA design. BMW stipulated it had to use timing chains whereas PSA typically uses belts.... and that's where all the issues began!
@@davidv5510 dude is actually right. psa was long time user of external timing belts with a plastic cover. dead reliable. after prince engine, they tried to kept the internal timing component design but used a belt instead of chain, soaked in oil just like chain. that's where the problems began.
When I sold my gas V10 2003 Excursion 5 years ago it was because the interior was shot to shit. The paint was peeling and the CEL had been on for a decade. The transmission went for the second time and I saw no reason to put more money into a vehicle with 734,XXX miles. This had a HARD life pulling boats state to state at freeway speeds with 2 dozen different drivers. No 'modern' engine should be headed for the scrapper at 100K.
I thought I did good with 575 K miles on mine. It would still be running if they didn't put salt on the roads. Rear rockers were gone all the way to the door striker.🍻
Thank you for showing me all the engines I no longer have to work on. Back in the days when "fixing things" was my job title, I drove GMT800's and 4 cylinder Toyota's. Toyotas are the "bic" lighters of the engine world and that's not bad mouthing the Toyotas. Early LS engines are the zippo's.
I’ve switched to an EV, a bmw i4. And I do appreciate the beauty of these engine teardowns… and I’m so much happier knowing with my car, there’s far less stuff having to work in perfect harmony.
As a former owner of a Peugeot 508sw with that engine, i can confirm that this engine is an absolute nightmare. Owned it not even 2 years, had 100 000km on it, and repairs cost over 4000€ in these 2 years. A shame, since the 508sw is a nice car.
You need to sell "It's Fine", "Forbidden Glitter", "Uncle Rodney Is Knocking", "Piston Nuggets", Malice In The Combustion Palace", Cram Craps" and "Oh Blue" items. I'd snatch up coffee mugs in an instant.
It's not a good Saturday night unless we get to hear the click, click, click of those cap cracks being cammed. So Eric is making Saturday is great again.
Timing chain was definitely replaced and not done very well. As another poster noted the exhaust cam sprocket was installed backwards, which caused the chain to rub the head and caused premature wear of the new chain guides.
BMW timing gear is what made this engine unreliable. After the agreement with them ended Peugeot sorted most of the problems. as a mechanic I love working on them and there are plenty inexpensive upgraded aftermarket parts available like metal water pump metal thermostat housing metal valve cover better gaskets this along with 5k oil changes transformes this engine
The high operating temperature and too long oil change interval! But, in Your case, maintenance error too - cam gear installed backwards These engines (of THP origin, including N12 to N18 B16 in BMW and Mini) operate at 221-225F (212F above 50 mph and at briefly 194F under load) and because of this they deteriorate very quickly - especially in city driving style (oil degrades quickly, chain tensioner begins to fail and chain streches, the rings got clogged - letting oil pass to combustion chamber and, in long term, destroying cylinder bore, the valve seals harden and oil passes through, the engine starts to burn oil, then catalytic converter dies, it made even higher temp in the combustion chamber, micro-cracks in the head appeared, valve seats loosen out, then fall out, broken valves appeared due to temp and/or loosen valve seats, especially in exhaust side and engine died). There is a (piloted) thermostat there that is electronically controlled by the ECU. You can either reprogram it in ECU or lock it in the open position and install a secondary thermostat (e.g., rated at 190F) on the hose and you're done - in my case, this was the solution (a 190F rated, bolt-on thermostat housing on the hose bought on Ali), because I couldn't find anyone in my area who would is able to changing the thermostat control maps in ECU. (but it needs additional mod, that make the fans start not at 228F but at, for example, 205F, or keep an eye on it "manually" and assist by turning on the AC, which will start the first gear of the fan). PS: this mod makes sense when there are no problems with this engine yet (or after its overhaul) PPS: there is also the famous plastic crosspipe from the thermostat to the water pump (I had a new one, replaced as a preventive measure a year ago, but recently, it cracked longitudinally and there was a sudden loss of almost all the coolant - it happened after I got there and turned off the engine, so the engine survived - I replaced it on an aluminum crosspipe and the problem is solved. PPS: lets break down N18 engine (the "revised" and "updated" version od N14)
Spot on! The high operating temeperature and thin oil is killer foor this engine and a lot of new engines. Remember that the industry went from ~80deg C thermostats and 5/10w-40 oils in the 90's and 00's to 0/5w-20/30 oils and 95-100deg target coolant temperature in the 10's-20's. that is a huge drop in operating engine oil viscosity coupled with diminished lubrication at those viscosities. And I doubt that along with these higher temperatures the've adapted all the plastics and pipes in the engine compartment to be suited for the increased operting temps. So overall a the best start to improve this engine's reliability is to drop the engin operating temperature either by remaping, piloting the thermostat with own circuitry or bypassing the original thermostat and replacing it with a mechanical one as you mentioned. I personally have a 2012 Citroen with 1.6 thp 1.6 engine and aparently have a fixed target temperature of 95deg C for the engine coolant and the ECU tries to meet that temperature but often in uphill driving conditions the coolant goes to 105-110C wich is a lot. On My Citroen wich has only 45k km I had a faild fuel pump at 30k km so these engines were indeed bad in internals and peripherals as well.
@@iulianarg2291 Then do preventive temp drop mod (by remapping ECU or by hardware hack). My Mini's N18B16 (184HP) doing 66kkm and still going strong (besides the crosspipe failure - due to poor quality of OEM replacement part). I just wonder how much or if lowering operating temp will prolong lifespan of my engine. PS: The next thing will be preventive replacement of all direct injectors due to 100 kkm
In my opinion, it was everything BMW did to these engines that made them scrap, the timing system in particular. Had a Peugeot Gti that killed itself on 57k when every valve met every piston. First engine I ever stripped down and the carnage was spectacular.
Agreed. It's the BMW mods that have made the reliability of this engine a nightmare. PSA engines have actually always been extremely solid, reliable units. As others have already commented though, this particular engine also suffered from an appalling maintenance mistake being done to it!
I would love to see you tear down a 2.4 SRT4 that came in the 2003 Chrysler PT Cruiser GT with the aluminum intake. If you can get your hands on one. Great video as usual.
Have had several 2.4 PTs, Including the Turbos, been Basically solid, not GR8 on MPG, but other than cam sensors And head gaskets (driver unawares) been solid and lots of parts available.😊
2.8s srt4 came in dodge neons also. I didn't know they came in a pt cruiser till I seen your comment and did a little research. I already knew about the neon.
@@RadDadisRad Exactly 🤷🏿♂️, Bought a 170k miler at auction, Son drove it thru a hard winter, 6 months total, swapped him out and serviced it. Sold it to a young fellow, he put a timing belt and gear (chipped tooth) and it’s still Running strong…..💯👍😎
One of the reasons modern 🚙 are way more expensive that old ones is the fact that 100K miles is the new 300K miles. Granted that maintenance is done & no donuts were made, there should be a minimum constructor warranty of 150 K miles, else it's planned obsolescence.
These engines aren't great, they are overly complicated in my opinion but a majority of major problems are due to owners not looking after them and the service intervals being far too long. I've got the later N18 engine, it's now on 107k miles, it doesn't burn any oil, it doesn't have a timing chain tick, it idles perfectly smoothly and I've not had any issues with it over my year of ownership other than an o2 sensor which is a easy cheap fix to replace. If you want this engine to last, it's not a bulletproof engine that can be neglected, it needs to have it's oil changed regularly every 5000-7500 miles, regularly check your oil level cruical for the vanos system, the timing chain is not 'lifetime' one of it's issues is that the chain will stretch (that is crap design) but since it has variable camshaft gears, it will try to adjust the camgears to counter the stretch and if the stretch is bad enough you will get a vanos code for maximum movement reached or a timing code, the idle might also get lumpy or sound odd but my point is there are warning signs to get it changed, get it changed as you would a timing belt, If you are looking to get one and it runs werid (lumpy idle), has a timing chain tick or noise, consumes oil, just run away and find one that has been well looked after with regular oil changes and serviced had any issues addressed quickly rather just ignored and carry on looking after it and it will look after you back. Fed up of countless people buying cheap neglected mini coopers and then blaming the engine. Yes it has its issues but driving it around with a check engine light, hardly ever changing the oil, timing chain rattle (and not replacing it with that obvious warning sign), ragging the crap out it and also remapping them with rubbish generic remaps isn't a fault of the engine but of the owners.
The N18 is already drastically better than the N14. Even the N18 is still a HORRIBLE engine (ask me how I know), but yeah. My Mini Cooper S was my worst automotive decision ever. Enthusiast-grade maintenance for an unbelievably mediocre engine. The power it makes is just okay, the sound it makes is just okay, the fuel economy is just okay - and the reliability is horrible!
It seems that the companies that once had great reputations for building quality engines are in a race to see which one can destroy their reputation the quickest… Toyota, BMW, Honda… and the list goes on.
I would say engine knock (pre ignition, ping, etc) takes out the same valve in these engines. Knock takes out the weakest link and in this engine it is exhaust valve in cylinder 2. Weak/bad knock sensor probably starts the failure and the cooling in the cylinder is the weakest finishes the exhaust valve.
It looks to me that the one timing gear, on the side where the chain had scored the head, was put on backwards at some point. I think this engine must of had timing issues in its history.
Oh dear someone put the cam sprocket backerds. The only decent French engine was the little 4 pot 8valve TU engine gutless but very simple and bulletproof.
@@gsbeak Yes they were reliable for their times but nowhere near the reliability of the engines produced in the above mentioned era. I have driven them all so I have an objective comparison. The difference is that the ones produced that era can do 1 million kms never opened on routine maintenance, but the older ones may need a gasket at least twice in the same period.
I owned a 2010 Mini Cooper S with the N18 engine. Brilliant car and I’d highly recommend looking at swapping the N14 in your JCW to the N18, assuming your JCW is pre-facelift. My N18 had been tuned to run a respectable 230hp, the car and the engine were perfect, best car I’ve ever owned! They get an incredibly bad wrap, but if you get the right Mini with the right engine, you’ll want to drive it all day every day. The Cooper S’ were updated to the N18 in 2010, the JCW’s were updated to the N18 in late 2012 I believe.
My wife had a mini with this engine. She freaking loved that car😅. I did all I could to keep her in it, but after about 6 grand worth of work to it, it had to go. That thing was constantly in the shop. Car only had 64k on it at the time. What a steaming heap of shit. Oh, exact same failures as you’ve found in your last two mini engine tear downs.
Same here. Wife bought a new '07 Cooper S and loved it, but that's because I did all the looking after it and fighting with the dealer. It would have blown up if I was not around to baby it as it consumed about a quart of oil every 1000 miles. After about 30k miles and an intake cleaning due to carbon buildup and a timing chain replacement, we traded it. She misses it, I do not.
@@MokanEngineer exact same issues. Bits of the timing chain guides had to be fished out of the entire engine and of course the carbon blasted it out. It was a spiffy little car. Surprisingly large inside. And it had get up and go…when it went. But man that thing was killing my wallet 😂. The wife was pissed at me when I got rid of it. Until I came home with her next car, a Mercedes. That was 3 years ago. The Mercedes has only set me back for regular maintenance so far.
@@mystisith3984 that’s funny. I made that exact statement to my wife. We used to see mini coopers everywhere a few years ago. Now they’re becoming increasingly rare to see.
@@MokanEngineer so true ...... i still stick with my 09 N14 R57 ... with all the mentioned work that has to be done again .. and again .. Its a summer and fun car now. I wouldn't rely on it as a daily. For every day and the dogs i own a 99 Volvo V70 - that's a tank compared to the MINI
i don’t remember the last engine you tore down like this but glad you have parts now to sell, cool teardown sir, still learning a lot from you sharing these failures thanks eric
@7:03 They do that, because EPA regulations prevent modern engines from sounding like we are used to them. Audi has "sound modules" in their exhausts to make a V8 Diesel sound like you expect an V8 Gasoline engine to sound, Mercedes plays sound trough the car speakers etc., ...
This engine wasn't modified by bmw, it was build together by bmw & psa. It's also called "The Prince" or THP. It has problems with piston rings getting full of crap, burning oil, stretching timing chain, cam phasers stopping work, burning even more oil, throwing codes for crank/cam correlations.:D
I had this engine in a DS3 and it's probably the biggest piece of crap I ever owned. Here's a list of what went wrong in my 5 years 45-50K ownership: Timing chain (obviously) VVT Solenoids Timing Tensioner High Pressure Fuel Pump Water Pump Water hose that goes round the back of the engine became brittle and failed PCV failure (both hose and rocker cover membrane) Rocker cover replacement oil leak Oil pan gasket Turbo wastegate fail Turbo solenoid fail Premature clutch failure damaging reluctor wheel and crankshaft sensor (need new clutch, reluctor wheel, DM Flywheel) Walnut blasting twice (engine burns oil and is direct injection) Finally I sold it with an unresolved oil pressure problem as the oil pressure dropped too far at idle when the engine is hot Also probably a few other miscellaneous plastic hoses not able to stand the heat the engine makes and cracking/snapping etc. The irony is I bought this over an Alfa Romeo Giulietta 1.75 TCT as I thought it'd be more reliable. DS3s with these engines currently going for sub £2K whereas the Alfa's are holding strong as £6K-10K. Oh well, live and you learn!
My barber had one of these in a Paugeot. After endless woes he hatched a plan. One time I was getting a haircut he tells me in my ear "I've got theft insurance, lets take it to [remote area] and set it on fire" 😃 I am not a fan of insurance fraud and in the end he swapped it for a Honda at a great loss, but it goes to tell you, the man was so fed up that he was about to just set it on fire 😃
My wife drives a Citroën C1, a cooperation between Toyota (Aygo), Peugeot (1008), same engines gasoline 3 cylinder 1 liter. Remarkable little cars, a mix of Japanese and French parts, cheap always available parts. I suspect it’s a Japanese engine, because due to her driving style and sense of maintenance (close to non-existent) it still seems to be bulletproof. 😂😂😂
That'd be rad but I'm betting that the poorly maintained QUAD4s are long gone and the well maintained ones will probably outlast us all. They're neat though.
In Argentina we mostly have those Engines as Peugeot's THP. The nickname they've earned is "THPUM (as if saying TH BOOM). Theoretically they have been mostly fixed along the years, but I still don't trust them
I feel like a lot of engine failures are owner caused either due to lack of maintenance or they’re ran hard and haven’t been beefed up for the driving style, but a lot of the times engine issues are user caused…an engine is only as reliable as the owner is on getting it regular service!
I will never understand why BMW and Mercedes don’t like timing covers. So many just don’t have them. Also from working for VW/Audi, I can appreciate what a pain it is disconnecting Bosch electrical connectors.
Years ago I ended up with my nieces Mini Cooper & it just had its engine replaced 6 months before, I ended up giving it to my friends salvage yard as he needed the engine for his cousins Mini Cooper, I only had 1 stipulation that I get to destroy it myself after getting the cats & a few parts ,& he took alot of parts himself, well a few months later he had to take down a century old farm house on his property because of a partial collapse... we all decided on a late Saturday & Sunday to start tossing cars into the old house ,I literally flung the Mini Cooper with the claw while spinning it ,we ended up tossing in a bunch of Mustangs,Tempos & other useless crap until it totally collapsed ,we all had a ton of fun before recovering the vehicles & scrap from the building, he also sold off alot of the old barn wood & good surviving wooden beams
Toyota 3.4tt teardown would be popular, if one can be located! Hot topic atm; Would love to see the internals & oil routing. Does front main get oil last?
I had a Mini with the NA version of this engine and it SUCKED. Completely torqueless, wouldn't rev worth a damn and burned half a quart of oil a tank of gas. The oil consumption was either from worn valve guides or cylinders out of round, on a 70,000 mile engine, I sold the car a year into owning it for a loss and I only wish I kept the car I traded in for it
@@mikefoehr235 I wanted a stick shift sports car and Miatas at the time were at a huge premium, and I didn't want to buy one that was from the mid 00's or older, actually I should have sucked it up and bought that yellow 04 Miata
I had the NA 1.6L version of this engine (N12) and it was only on 93k miles and it consumed alot of oil, around 1-1.5L of oil per 1000 miles and it was definitely valve stem seals since you'd see a small cloud of blue smoke if you left it to idle for a bit and then blip the throttle. It revved to the redline perfectly fine but all the power was at the upper end and there was no torque low down at all.
@@scott2100 just like Toyota, often you pay a bit more and get many times the quality. Now, Toyota has made some lemons 🍋 for sure but Toyota, Mazda and Honda are all very good. I have had very few problems with any Toyota. Mostly just maintenance. Now, the real new Toyotas like the Tacoma and Tundra...well I would wait a few years.
Fun fact, this engine was revised in 2017 by Peugeot fixing a lot of it's problems. Nowadays it is still used by Opel with a hybrid drivetrain here in Europe since both are owned by Stellantis. I personally don't like this engine, but it can run quit smooth when it is working correctly.
I just want to say thank you Eric for teaching me all about engines and what their common issues or failures are. It helps me a lot at the garage I work at
Obviously had a timing chain / guide replacement job due to broken chain guide, where the exhaust cam gear was then reinstalled backwards. Doubt it was properly indexed and timed with the Mini cam alignment tool. Out of time = burnt exhaust valve. Mechanic that worked on it before was a hack. Honestly this could have been saved if it had been properly diagnosed. Compression/ leak down test would have shown the burnt valve. I would be worried about the valve shrapnel in the turbo. The N18 is a better engine than the N14 for sure.
The failure of that timing chain and the damage to the block was exactly what happened to my 18 month old 2013 Peugeot 208 GTI. Was repaired under warranty but at 15k miles it was making some horrible noises. They rebuilt the entire engine and replaced the cylinder head too. In my ownership that car cost Peugeot £14k in warranty claims..
I had a Holden (Opel) Astra when I was younger. It was a decent car. My father had a BMW 320 at the same time ( mid 1990s). His car was 3x the cost to buy and service. He also had to have a switch installed that when the engine was idling the air-conditioner would turn off, or the engine would stall. BMW techs could not be assed trying to figure out the problem, so they bastardised the aircon. Unfortunately, in Western Australia with summers being four months of over 38’c every day, it was bloody awful. My Astra, however, just worked. Perfectly. Every time.
Very interesting that, even though the loose or wrongly installed timing chain sprocket allowed gouging of a huge amount of non-ferrous metal from the head, there was virtually no forbidden glitter in the engine. That suggests to me that the gouging was done earlier in its life rather than later and a main dealer dealt with it under warranty; cleaning out the sump and engine as well as retightening the sprocket and timing the engine.
Just an educated guess, but those valves are closest to the turbo, and it generates a lot of heat. On a diesel, if turbos idle too much, are are not allowed to cool down after a heavy load ( like on a dyno) - they can cause other issues. My guess!
The N18 was much improved. The timing chain and turbo issues were the killers of the N14, as was DI that caused so much carbon accumulation. The N18 was such a good to drive engine and I’m sure PSA has fixed all of the issues with them now seeing how they’ve now been on sale for 17 years and still put them in a variety of Peugeot, Citroen, DS, Opel, Vauxhall, etc. I owned an N18-equipped JCW and it was a really fun car. That little 1.6 sounds good, was fuel efficient, and this engine pulls hard from 1250RPM to redline. If reliability had been top notch on the rest of the car I would’ve kept it longer than 4 years. My issues were not engine related but all to do with electronic components and crummy plastic trim pieces that broke. The clutch was also a weak point that was super expensive to replace if you didn’t get it done under warranty.
Owned one Cooper S 2007, same engine, tractor sound at startup, high oil consumption at 55.000 miles, couple of thousend miles after that major engine problems, complete write off. Always serviced by a BMW dealer as lease car, I was lucky cost me nothing.
It's pretty obvious to even a basic level mechanic that the 3 raised sections on the cam gear are specifically to centre the gear on the cam. Not only was this pulley offsetting the chain relative to the other pulley, it was only relying on the bolt keeping it centre, it would have been oscillating up and down perpendicular to the cam. That's why the guide broke. The chain was literally pushed up into it by the off centre gear. That of course would have happened immediately after first start. Lunatics. p.s I personally would have liked to see you take the chain off, get a drill and rotate that exhaust cam at some RPM to see how much it was effectively out of round.
They're notorious for timing chain failures (the guides fall apart as they become brittle). I'd say the original timing chain was what did the damage to the engine and the bits in the bottom end we're from those guides that failed and someone didn't clean them out when putting the new chain and cassette in. People keep driving these cars not knowing what the issue is because it's still driving and they wait until the car had a code or wont run anymore before doing something about it. There was an issue with the timing chain tensioner being no good in that year range and they had a recall on them which caused the death rattle. But mainly these chains need to be replaced by 160K kms for preventative maintenance, this is what the Mini Cooper forums always suggested. The best way to avoid it happening sooner is change the oil much more regular than BMW says to (every 5000kms or so). Yeah theyre costly engines to maintain but they can be reliable enough if maintained properly like you said, if you like working on your car they can actually be quite fun to learn from. Definitely not the best engine to have obviously but you learn a lot about how to properly maintain a car. Those burnt valves are also common with these cars. Keeping them walnut blasted does help, good to know that running rich can also cause it. Thank you so much for your honest opinion, I think you nailed it with your final words.
This was am EJ-1 failure. Pretty mild. The valve didn't take anything else with it. But the metal part of the timing guide that was broke was impressive
In the 80s the inline 6 banger would overheat and crack the head and sometimes the block. It was cheaper to buy another 7 series than fix the engine, the car drove nicely especially at autobahn speeds. We did have a 4-1 exchange rate that helped, and there were a lot of used cars available. The trick was to Get the engine to cool slowly. A lot of the cars were brought back as grey market cars, trying to fix one in the States was difficult.
I have the equivalent PSA engine but non-turbo (so port injection instead of direct injection and no turbo) and I am at 136k miles on it (220k km) burns oil a lot but other than basic parts like thermostat or VANOS solenoid no real issues surprisingly :) When eventually the engine goes I will be half tempted to rebuild my Peugeot 207cc as EV. Probably easier than doing a full rebuild of the engine :D
The cam gear was installed backwards, you can see locators used to center it on the cam.
100% that was a maintenance error.
Crappy service job is the main reason
Fits with the RTV found in the oil pickup.
Thought the same thing once I saw the chain rub marks.
Nice observation
I love how the pistons are smiling at you while you’re disassembling them
Quite the big shnoz on them , too
They have an Easter Island statue look to them.
Google "the goon" from Popeye cartoons. It looks like that.
@@georgeperkins4171 Touché
I'm glad I wasn't the only one who saw that. 😂
"Geographical sensor" That's a new one for me. I'll have to remember to ask the guy at the parts counter next time I'm in there if they have one in stock. See how long he will search the computer before he gives up and says they don't show any in stock.
It really depends who you get! A year or so I went to AutoZone, not either of the normal ones I go to, opposite side of town -only one to have my part. I tell the counter guy I need a passenger side outer tie rod for a '00 f250 2wd. Guy asks what kind of car is it. I say an f250. Asks me what make is it, a Chevy, or whatever! I'm like, I said f250! He starts getting aggressive and says I asked you the make of the vehicle! At this point I'm like just forget it if you can't figure out a f250 manufacturer, you shouldn't be working at a parts store selling parts. Maybe sweep the floor is a better occupation for you. I just walked out & ordered it from RockAuto instead. Unbelievable this clown was that dumb! I couldn't even grasp the stupidity of someone like that, working at a parts store, selling parts through a computer that tells you everything you need to know, and not a thing more! You tell them you want a wiper for a car they ask if it's awd or not, gas or diesel, standard or auto trans, does it have grey interior or beige?! Just unbelievable 🤦🏻♂️😅🤦🏻♂️👍🏻
Thats a good idea 😂
At 14.13 you can see the offset of the cam gear which was forcing the chain into the head. Also explains why the aluminium carrier for the top guide fractured. When the bolt is undone for that sprocket you can see it all jump forward. Previous mechanic ruined that engine…
Thanks for my Saturday night entertainment Eric. Happy Fathers Day to all the dads out there.
Back at you
I usually love the sound of head bolts loosening on basically any engine, but on this one they sound absolutely horrible omg
Itought the same thing... awful.
One bent bolt on the oil pump was funny adding a second one was hilarious.
Whoever did the timing chain maintenance on that engine should never be allowed to touch a car again.
That was the catalyst for this engine failure I think.
Yes! Saturday night is complete. Some people go clubbing, I watch engine teardowns
Educational
There's a channel that I sometimes watch called "The Hydraulic Press Channel", where they crush stuff with a 300 Ton press. You should contact them to find out if a water pump from a car engine is crushable with a 300 Ton press.
You love those water pumps so much….
The shipping to Finland would be disastrous
@@Ktmfan450yeah. I bet there aren’t any water pumps in Finland.
@@Germanpilot223Nope. Not a single one. He’d have to ship a water pump to Finland.
@@HappyHarryHardon In Finland they use Vodka instead of water
That sounds like a good experiment to try
Vodka instead of coolant
One of my friends worked on Renault engines fitted to Nissans in the UK. He has always bought Hondas himself. He took great pleasure in telling me every time a new disaster was discovered. He saw a lot of engines replaced under warranty. Happily he retired just over a year ago. My brother's A-class plug in hybrid has a French engine, fortunately he leased it through the UK NHS, so he can give it back in about 9 months. He says his next car will be a Toyota hybrid.
Toyota and particularly their hybrids are the only cars worth pay your own money
Nothing wrong with Renault engines, not the same as PSA
It's always 'one of my friends', never "I worked on these engines..".
It's the modern equivalent to "A bloke in the pub told me.."
I don't think any Toyota engine is as reliable as Renault F4R or M9R. Had both on a Laguna and X-Trail, and both vehicles did 350k and 450k km respectively, with no issues whatsoever.
@@wtfiswiththosehandles There's loads that are more reliable than that...
I'm not even a Toyota fan but they make fantastic engines when they feel like it.
I work on a lot of the mini N engines that come through the shop at my work, failures I have seen are: Timing chain guides, valve stems seals, cas modules, dme’s, water pumps and pulleys, harmonic balancer, tension units that turn the water pump, the press fit plugs that go into the timing cover, footwell modules, tons of thermostats (some have a superseding part that requires adaptor harness), wastegate issues, bypass valve failure, oil control solenoid harness leaks. There’s probably more I am forgetting
So I might be alone when saying this but I don't need the carnage. I actually really just enjoy your commentary. It's why I keep watching.
I’m glad he removes the cram craps off.
Yup. Eric knows his craps.
20:05
How my hip sounds after I mow the lawn
If I've learned nothing else from watching your videos, it's "check your oil!"
In nearly 20 years as a professional mechanic, there are only 2 engines I’ve seen that had to be replaced because they bent rods without any external cause/failure. One was a BMW N20 and the other was an N13. When I say no external cause, I mean they weren’t hydrolocked, they weren’t modified/tuned, the fuel injectors were fine (not leaking), they’re just junk and bent a rod because they’re too flimsy. In both cases, it caused a slight knock, a vibration and misfire codes for the cylinder with the bent rod (because of lower compression). Both engines had less than 100k miles.
The bent rod is most likely caused by LSPI low speed pre ignition these small displacement high pressure turbo engines bend rods break pistons etc. The type of oil used in the engine is critical API SP or API SN plus these oil ratings means that the oil has been designed to mitigate against LSPI
Timing had been done and camgears were installed wrong way! Those parts in pickup were from old guide. I think that it lost timing tension and went in lean(maybe jumped a tooth?), and then they started just throwing parts at it like the vvt solenoid without getting it any better because codes were probably from timing correlation and it had new chain so it can't be that 😅
I hope one day a teardown of an Mini N18 can be done. I've been looking at 2011-2013 Coopers recently, I know the N18 addressed a number of issues that plagued the N14.
I own one. Don't.
N18 suffer the same problems as n14 they are just as bad!
I got my n18 at the beginning of the year. A few hundred miles of track driving later, no problems. But I am waiting for the other shoe to drop. Luckily I got a deal on the car so I accept it.
Taking into consideration that it goes in a mini, there are some differences in terms of where certain stuff is that makes it bad.
However, the major issues seem to be related to timing chain, high pressure fuel pump and carbon build-up. The PCV membrane can also be an issue (but this is a very easy serviceable thing). The 155 and 165 hp versions tend to be the worse in terms of chain issues. The 175 from.... 2012/2013 onwards(?) has improved quite a bit, and then there are 2 200hp versions: one is the 175hp version with a bigger turbo, and then you have the actual THP200 that doesn't seem to be available on the Mini Cooper (Peugeot RCZ R has it tho) and that one tends to be the better one in terms of reliability, oddly because of valvetronic (maybe?), as the chain issues tend to be rare here. Do keep a look on the vacuum lines and the turbo has that flap that might tend to get some play.
High pressure fuel pump issues, if I'm not mistaken, there was a recall for that.
Euro6 Prince engines are a bit more recent, and probably also more reliable, but these seem to be PSA only. Not sure (and from 2016 onwards only)
Every engine here requires also needs good 0w-30 oil, no more than 10.000km between changes, and being a DI, give a look at the intake valves
Advice, get a mini cooper from 2014 onwards, or just don't.
Source: I own a 2013 DS5 with the THP200, now if it's the THP175 with the bigger turbo or the actual THP200... They do look quite alike, both of them.
Check your oil with every fuel fill up. I overfill my oil a tad bit intentionally. Check carbon buildup on valves, intake removal is simple.
Do not ignore timing chain noise.
Low Oil level can actually prevent the timing chain tensioner from expanding, causing a risk of chain slap and skipping time.
Be ready to change oil seals, I've put 40k on mine (owned from 80k-120k) and I've resealed the entire engine. It's not that difficult.
Some engineer at BMW or Peugeot or wherever thought that his idea to run the dipstick thru a timing guide was the most brilliant idea anyone has ever had
The block is from a very reliable PSA design. BMW stipulated it had to use timing chains whereas PSA typically uses belts.... and that's where all the issues began!
@@khalidacosta7133 ah ok interesting 👍
@@khalidacosta7133 Thats not true, it it not reliable at all. PSA went from chains to belts and the problems became even worse
@@davidv5510 dude is actually right. psa was long time user of external timing belts with a plastic cover. dead reliable. after prince engine, they tried to kept the internal timing component design but used a belt instead of chain, soaked in oil just like chain. that's where the problems began.
@@khalidacosta7133 tell that to 1.2 puretech owner... way worse than 1.6THP...
When I sold my gas V10 2003 Excursion 5 years ago it was because the interior was shot to shit. The paint was peeling and the CEL had been on for a decade. The transmission went for the second time and I saw no reason to put more money into a vehicle with 734,XXX miles. This had a HARD life pulling boats state to state at freeway speeds with 2 dozen different drivers. No 'modern' engine should be headed for the scrapper at 100K.
I thought I did good with 575 K miles on mine. It would still be running if they didn't put salt on the roads. Rear rockers were gone all the way to the door striker.🍻
You could've used bungees on the doors!😂
Thank you for showing me all the engines I no longer have to work on.
Back in the days when "fixing things" was my job title, I drove GMT800's and 4 cylinder Toyota's.
Toyotas are the "bic" lighters of the engine world and that's not bad mouthing the Toyotas.
Early LS engines are the zippo's.
I’ve switched to an EV, a bmw i4. And I do appreciate the beauty of these engine teardowns… and I’m so much happier knowing with my car, there’s far less stuff having to work in perfect harmony.
As a former owner of a Peugeot 508sw with that engine, i can confirm that this engine is an absolute nightmare.
Owned it not even 2 years, had 100 000km on it, and repairs cost over 4000€ in these 2 years.
A shame, since the 508sw is a nice car.
At some point I was considering buying a 508. Then I read about the engine problems and changed my mind. Bought a 607 instead.
You need to sell "It's Fine", "Forbidden Glitter", "Uncle Rodney Is Knocking", "Piston Nuggets", Malice In The Combustion Palace", Cram Craps" and "Oh Blue" items. I'd snatch up coffee mugs in an instant.
I particularly like the "Piston Nuggets"...
He should patent the phrases.
CAM GEAR is backwards on this engine! Wow. No wonder the shop hated it... They are the ones who destroyed it.
And were clueless
It's not a good Saturday night unless we get to hear the click, click, click of those cap cracks being cammed.
So Eric is making Saturday is great again.
You should do a video of your top 10 most and least liked/ reliable engines
Timing chain was definitely replaced and not done very well. As another poster noted the exhaust cam sprocket was installed backwards, which caused the chain to rub the head and caused premature wear of the new chain guides.
BMW timing gear is what made this engine unreliable. After the agreement with them ended Peugeot sorted most of the problems. as a mechanic I love working on them and there are plenty inexpensive upgraded aftermarket parts available like metal water pump metal thermostat housing metal valve cover better gaskets this along with 5k oil changes transformes this engine
is there an up graded after market timing chain system. chains. guides. tensioners?
Funny how the BMW version of this engine is much much better. ;)
@@cocodog85Yes. The tensioner is the most critical.
@@kristoffer3000Wrong, actually Peugeot version is so much better plus they ironed out most the issues after the cooperation ended.
@@vs6300 Not talking about the Mini engine here, the BMW N13B16 is actually pretty good.
The high operating temperature and too long oil change interval! But, in Your case, maintenance error too - cam gear installed backwards
These engines (of THP origin, including N12 to N18 B16 in BMW and Mini) operate at 221-225F (212F above 50 mph and at briefly 194F under load) and because of this they deteriorate very quickly - especially in city driving style (oil degrades quickly, chain tensioner begins to fail and chain streches, the rings got clogged - letting oil pass to combustion chamber and, in long term, destroying cylinder bore, the valve seals harden and oil passes through, the engine starts to burn oil, then catalytic converter dies, it made even higher temp in the combustion chamber, micro-cracks in the head appeared, valve seats loosen out, then fall out, broken valves appeared due to temp and/or loosen valve seats, especially in exhaust side and engine died).
There is a (piloted) thermostat there that is electronically controlled by the ECU. You can either reprogram it in ECU or lock it in the open position and install a secondary thermostat (e.g., rated at 190F) on the hose and you're done - in my case, this was the solution (a 190F rated, bolt-on thermostat housing on the hose bought on Ali), because I couldn't find anyone in my area who would is able to changing the thermostat control maps in ECU.
(but it needs additional mod, that make the fans start not at 228F but at, for example, 205F, or keep an eye on it "manually" and assist by turning on the AC, which will start the first gear of the fan).
PS: this mod makes sense when there are no problems with this engine yet (or after its overhaul)
PPS: there is also the famous plastic crosspipe from the thermostat to the water pump (I had a new one, replaced as a preventive measure a year ago, but recently, it cracked longitudinally and there was a sudden loss of almost all the coolant - it happened after I got there and turned off the engine, so the engine survived - I replaced it on an aluminum crosspipe and the problem is solved.
PPS: lets break down N18 engine (the "revised" and "updated" version od N14)
Spot on! The high operating temeperature and thin oil is killer foor this engine and a lot of new engines. Remember that the industry went from ~80deg C thermostats and 5/10w-40 oils in the 90's and 00's to 0/5w-20/30 oils and 95-100deg target coolant temperature in the 10's-20's. that is a huge drop in operating engine oil viscosity coupled with diminished lubrication at those viscosities. And I doubt that along with these higher temperatures the've adapted all the plastics and pipes in the engine compartment to be suited for the increased operting temps. So overall a the best start to improve this engine's reliability is to drop the engin operating temperature either by remaping, piloting the thermostat with own circuitry or bypassing the original thermostat and replacing it with a mechanical one as you mentioned.
I personally have a 2012 Citroen with 1.6 thp 1.6 engine and aparently have a fixed target temperature of 95deg C for the engine coolant and the ECU tries to meet that temperature but often in uphill driving conditions the coolant goes to 105-110C wich is a lot. On My Citroen wich has only 45k km I had a faild fuel pump at 30k km so these engines were indeed bad in internals and peripherals as well.
@@iulianarg2291 Then do preventive temp drop mod (by remapping ECU or by hardware hack). My Mini's N18B16 (184HP) doing 66kkm and still going strong (besides the crosspipe failure - due to poor quality of OEM replacement part). I just wonder how much or if lowering operating temp will prolong lifespan of my engine.
PS: The next thing will be preventive replacement of all direct injectors due to 100 kkm
In my opinion, it was everything BMW did to these engines that made them scrap, the timing system in particular. Had a Peugeot Gti that killed itself on 57k when every valve met every piston. First engine I ever stripped down and the carnage was spectacular.
Agreed. It's the BMW mods that have made the reliability of this engine a nightmare.
PSA engines have actually always been extremely solid, reliable units.
As others have already commented though, this particular engine also suffered from an appalling maintenance mistake being done to it!
I would love to see you tear down a 2.4 SRT4 that came in the 2003 Chrysler PT Cruiser GT with the aluminum intake. If you can get your hands on one. Great video as usual.
Have had several 2.4 PTs,
Including the Turbos, been
Basically solid, not GR8 on
MPG, but other than cam sensors
And head gaskets (driver unawares)
been solid and lots of parts
available.😊
2.8s srt4 came in dodge neons also.
I didn't know they came in a pt cruiser till I seen your comment and did a little research. I already knew about the neon.
PT GT is a fun car. Weird but fun. Everyone loves where the window buttons are 😂
@@RadDadisRad
Exactly 🤷🏿♂️,
Bought a 170k miler at auction,
Son drove it thru a hard winter,
6 months total, swapped him out and serviced
it. Sold it to a young fellow, he put a timing
belt and gear (chipped tooth) and it’s still
Running strong…..💯👍😎
Every time i watch one of your video's it relaxes me. My state of mind is at peace.
I offer this as constructive criticism: Timing chains don't use gears. They use sprockets. I enjoy your videos. Thanks for doing them.
Blue to the rescue!! 21:13
One of the reasons modern 🚙 are way more expensive that old ones is the fact that 100K miles is the new 300K miles. Granted that maintenance is done & no donuts were made, there should be a minimum constructor warranty of 150 K miles, else it's planned obsolescence.
These engines aren't great, they are overly complicated in my opinion but a majority of major problems are due to owners not looking after them and the service intervals being far too long. I've got the later N18 engine, it's now on 107k miles, it doesn't burn any oil, it doesn't have a timing chain tick, it idles perfectly smoothly and I've not had any issues with it over my year of ownership other than an o2 sensor which is a easy cheap fix to replace. If you want this engine to last, it's not a bulletproof engine that can be neglected, it needs to have it's oil changed regularly every 5000-7500 miles, regularly check your oil level cruical for the vanos system, the timing chain is not 'lifetime' one of it's issues is that the chain will stretch (that is crap design) but since it has variable camshaft gears, it will try to adjust the camgears to counter the stretch and if the stretch is bad enough you will get a vanos code for maximum movement reached or a timing code, the idle might also get lumpy or sound odd but my point is there are warning signs to get it changed, get it changed as you would a timing belt, If you are looking to get one and it runs werid (lumpy idle), has a timing chain tick or noise, consumes oil, just run away and find one that has been well looked after with regular oil changes and serviced had any issues addressed quickly rather just ignored and carry on looking after it and it will look after you back. Fed up of countless people buying cheap neglected mini coopers and then blaming the engine. Yes it has its issues but driving it around with a check engine light, hardly ever changing the oil, timing chain rattle (and not replacing it with that obvious warning sign), ragging the crap out it and also remapping them with rubbish generic remaps isn't a fault of the engine but of the owners.
The N18 is already drastically better than the N14. Even the N18 is still a HORRIBLE engine (ask me how I know), but yeah.
My Mini Cooper S was my worst automotive decision ever. Enthusiast-grade maintenance for an unbelievably mediocre engine. The power it makes is just okay, the sound it makes is just okay, the fuel economy is just okay - and the reliability is horrible!
Today is not saying thank you for a Tear down but saying happy Father's Day for a great Dad thank you❤
Evidently that valve situation is a known problem on that engine, you can buy a complete set of upgraded valves that come in a kit for about $800.
Bought my 2003 R53 in 2006 with 28k miles. Still driving it today with 245k miles. Runs great!
Stretched chains, coolant leaks, oil consumption and so on and so on. It's crap. And that is an understatement.
i hate ANYTHING mini! theyre just plain garbage!
@@peterpeter5666 The original ones are not too bad, just suffer the usual Leyland leaks and slop all over.
An engine codevelopped by BMW and PSA, it was a recipe for disaster.
It seems that the companies that once had great reputations for building quality engines are in a race to see which one can destroy their reputation the quickest… Toyota, BMW, Honda… and the list goes on.
@@yapod9061Any engine co-development by two separate entities usually doesn’t end well.
I would say engine knock (pre ignition, ping, etc) takes out the same valve in these engines. Knock takes out the weakest link and in this engine it is exhaust valve in cylinder 2. Weak/bad knock sensor probably starts the failure and the cooling in the cylinder is the weakest finishes the exhaust valve.
The timing chain part was designed by BMW on the Prince engine, not PSA.
It looks to me that the one timing gear, on the side where the chain had scored the head, was put on backwards at some point. I think this engine must of had timing issues in its history.
At 11:37 you can see the chain is in the head because of it.
must *HAVE, not "of"...
Oh dear someone put the cam sprocket backerds. The only decent French engine was the little 4 pot 8valve TU engine gutless but very simple and bulletproof.
Practically anything they made between 1995-2005 was bullet proof. Then came 2006 and they released this messy Prince.
@@vs6300 between 1960-2005. 403, 404, 504 engines were bullet proof for hundred thousands of km.
@@gsbeak Yes they were reliable for their times but nowhere near the reliability of the engines produced in the above mentioned era. I have driven them all so I have an objective comparison. The difference is that the ones produced that era can do 1 million kms never opened on routine maintenance, but the older ones may need a gasket at least twice in the same period.
I owned a 2010 Mini Cooper S with the N18 engine. Brilliant car and I’d highly recommend looking at swapping the N14 in your JCW to the N18, assuming your JCW is pre-facelift. My N18 had been tuned to run a respectable 230hp, the car and the engine were perfect, best car I’ve ever owned! They get an incredibly bad wrap, but if you get the right Mini with the right engine, you’ll want to drive it all day every day. The Cooper S’ were updated to the N18 in 2010, the JCW’s were updated to the N18 in late 2012 I believe.
My wife had a mini with this engine. She freaking loved that car😅. I did all I could to keep her in it, but after about 6 grand worth of work to it, it had to go. That thing was constantly in the shop. Car only had 64k on it at the time. What a steaming heap of shit. Oh, exact same failures as you’ve found in your last two mini engine tear downs.
Same here. Wife bought a new '07 Cooper S and loved it, but that's because I did all the looking after it and fighting with the dealer. It would have blown up if I was not around to baby it as it consumed about a quart of oil every 1000 miles. After about 30k miles and an intake cleaning due to carbon buildup and a timing chain replacement, we traded it. She misses it, I do not.
There's a reason you don't see a lot of recent Minis on the roads (I see more vintage ones I swear).
@@MokanEngineer exact same issues. Bits of the timing chain guides had to be fished out of the entire engine and of course the carbon blasted it out. It was a spiffy little car. Surprisingly large inside. And it had get up and go…when it went. But man that thing was killing my wallet 😂. The wife was pissed at me when I got rid of it. Until I came home with her next car, a Mercedes. That was 3 years ago. The Mercedes has only set me back for regular maintenance so far.
@@mystisith3984 that’s funny. I made that exact statement to my wife. We used to see mini coopers everywhere a few years ago. Now they’re becoming increasingly rare to see.
@@MokanEngineer so true ...... i still stick with my 09 N14 R57 ... with all the mentioned work that has to be done again .. and again ..
Its a summer and fun car now. I wouldn't rely on it as a daily. For every day and the dogs i own a 99 Volvo V70 - that's a tank compared to the MINI
When you took off the crank bolt, I just about had a heart attack.
i don’t remember the last engine you tore down like this but glad you have parts now to sell, cool teardown sir, still learning a lot from you sharing these failures thanks eric
I saw somewhere that someone did a Honda K24 swap in one of those cars. Beside the upgrade in power, should be an upgrade in reliabilty as well.
@7:03 They do that, because EPA regulations prevent modern engines from sounding like we are used to them. Audi has "sound modules" in their exhausts to make a V8 Diesel sound like you expect an V8 Gasoline engine to sound, Mercedes plays sound trough the car speakers etc., ...
Old Volvo 5 cylinders had similar issue. My '99 V70R lost a valve. Something about sodium valves. A google search revealed that this is pretty common.
This engine wasn't modified by bmw, it was build together by bmw & psa. It's also called "The Prince" or THP. It has problems with piston rings getting full of crap, burning oil, stretching timing chain, cam phasers stopping work, burning even more oil, throwing codes for crank/cam correlations.:D
I had this engine in a DS3 and it's probably the biggest piece of crap I ever owned.
Here's a list of what went wrong in my 5 years 45-50K ownership:
Timing chain (obviously)
VVT Solenoids
Timing Tensioner
High Pressure Fuel Pump
Water Pump
Water hose that goes round the back of the engine became brittle and failed
PCV failure (both hose and rocker cover membrane)
Rocker cover replacement oil leak
Oil pan gasket
Turbo wastegate fail
Turbo solenoid fail
Premature clutch failure damaging reluctor wheel and crankshaft sensor (need new clutch, reluctor wheel, DM Flywheel)
Walnut blasting twice (engine burns oil and is direct injection)
Finally I sold it with an unresolved oil pressure problem as the oil pressure dropped too far at idle when the engine is hot
Also probably a few other miscellaneous plastic hoses not able to stand the heat the engine makes and cracking/snapping etc.
The irony is I bought this over an Alfa Romeo Giulietta 1.75 TCT as I thought it'd be more reliable. DS3s with these engines currently going for sub £2K whereas the Alfa's are holding strong as £6K-10K. Oh well, live and you learn!
Yeah. Thanks Eric. Another great tear down.
My little one says all I do is drink beer and watch engine videos 😊
My barber had one of these in a Paugeot. After endless woes he hatched a plan. One time I was getting a haircut he tells me in my ear "I've got theft insurance, lets take it to [remote area] and set it on fire" 😃
I am not a fan of insurance fraud and in the end he swapped it for a Honda at a great loss, but it goes to tell you, the man was so fed up that he was about to just set it on fire 😃
The bolt cracking sound is strangely satisfying
You stole my comment. I agree wholeheartedly
So we have a British car, made by a German company, with a French motor...........someone is spinning in hell.
A combination of all their problems and defects wrapped up into 1 engine.
Thats O.K.,
I own a 2nd gen Smart for two.
German company, assembled in France, with a Japanese motor.
My wife drives a Citroën C1, a cooperation between Toyota (Aygo), Peugeot (1008), same engines gasoline 3 cylinder 1 liter. Remarkable little cars, a mix of Japanese and French parts, cheap always available parts. I suspect it’s a Japanese engine, because due to her driving style and sense of maintenance (close to non-existent) it still seems to be bulletproof. 😂😂😂
@@jobertvangool9961 It's mostly a Toyota and yes, it's a Toyota engine.
@@ltsradio Swiss Watch company on top of that.
I bet a mini cooper would be fun as hell with a K20 or K24 swap.
That would be a proper cooper missile
Hell yeah. A +/- 800hp turbo k20 awd Mini would be a blast.
@@boosted95 I do believe BMW (or whoever made the components) made AWD versions of the mini.
@CrazyTony65 half way there then.
Or just buy a Civic Type R and have more fun and none of the problems
I finally get to enjoy an I do cars video on time!
Btw, please do a Quad4 please.
That'd be rad but I'm betting that the poorly maintained QUAD4s are long gone and the well maintained ones will probably outlast us all.
They're neat though.
For some reason, this is totally compelling viewing. And for that I thank you!
Still hoping for an old Saturn 1.9l DOHC/SOHC from the s-series to make a debut for teardown!
22:00 ,the piston has a smile 😃 or a smirk 😏
In Argentina we mostly have those Engines as Peugeot's THP. The nickname they've earned is "THPUM (as if saying TH BOOM). Theoretically they have been mostly fixed along the years, but I still don't trust them
For that oil pump I would have clamped the chain in the vice with wood to protect it and used that to stop the sprocket from turning.
I feel like a lot of engine failures are owner caused either due to lack of maintenance or they’re ran hard and haven’t been beefed up for the driving style, but a lot of the times engine issues are user caused…an engine is only as reliable as the owner is on getting it regular service!
I will never understand why BMW and Mercedes don’t like timing covers. So many just don’t have them. Also from working for VW/Audi, I can appreciate what a pain it is disconnecting Bosch electrical connectors.
Please make a video on bmw b47.
I know that it’s not so common in Us, but here in Europe 90% of BMW mount it. (18d 20d and 23d) Thanks in advance! ❤
Years ago I ended up with my nieces Mini Cooper & it just had its engine replaced 6 months before, I ended up giving it to my friends salvage yard as he needed the engine for his cousins Mini Cooper, I only had 1 stipulation that I get to destroy it myself after getting the cats & a few parts ,& he took alot of parts himself, well a few months later he had to take down a century old farm house on his property because of a partial collapse... we all decided on a late Saturday & Sunday to start tossing cars into the old house ,I literally flung the Mini Cooper with the claw while spinning it ,we ended up tossing in a bunch of Mustangs,Tempos & other useless crap until it totally collapsed ,we all had a ton of fun before recovering the vehicles & scrap from the building, he also sold off alot of the old barn wood & good surviving wooden beams
*a lot
"alot" isn't a word
@@GrainGrown a lot is a parking lot ,or empty lot 😁.....or a full lot
@@daewooparts A lot is also plenty. You wouldn't say "alittle" or "abit" either...
Keep learning English, kiddo.
Toyota 3.4tt teardown would be popular, if one can be located! Hot topic atm; Would love to see the internals & oil routing. Does front main get oil last?
I had a Mini with the NA version of this engine and it SUCKED. Completely torqueless, wouldn't rev worth a damn and burned half a quart of oil a tank of gas. The oil consumption was either from worn valve guides or cylinders out of round, on a 70,000 mile engine, I sold the car a year into owning it for a loss and I only wish I kept the car I traded in for it
German cars are total.garbage
@@mikefoehr235 I wanted a stick shift sports car and Miatas at the time were at a huge premium, and I didn't want to buy one that was from the mid 00's or older, actually I should have sucked it up and bought that yellow 04 Miata
I had the NA 1.6L version of this engine (N12) and it was only on 93k miles and it consumed alot of oil, around 1-1.5L of oil per 1000 miles and it was definitely valve stem seals since you'd see a small cloud of blue smoke if you left it to idle for a bit and then blip the throttle. It revved to the redline perfectly fine but all the power was at the upper end and there was no torque low down at all.
@@scott2100 just like Toyota, often you pay a bit more and get many times the quality. Now, Toyota has made some lemons 🍋 for sure but Toyota, Mazda and Honda are all very good. I have had very few problems with any Toyota. Mostly just maintenance. Now, the real new Toyotas like the Tacoma and Tundra...well I would wait a few years.
Should have tried the cheap stuff first, new cam cover..........worked wonders on mine for oil consumpsion.
Fun fact, this engine was revised in 2017 by Peugeot fixing a lot of it's problems. Nowadays it is still used by Opel with a hybrid drivetrain here in Europe since both are owned by Stellantis. I personally don't like this engine, but it can run quit smooth when it is working correctly.
I just want to say thank you Eric for teaching me all about engines and what their common issues or failures are. It helps me a lot at the garage I work at
That flintstone friction wheel for the water pump go out very quickly. A real ridiculous design.
Obviously had a timing chain / guide replacement job due to broken chain guide, where the exhaust cam gear was then reinstalled backwards. Doubt it was properly indexed and timed with the Mini cam alignment tool. Out of time = burnt exhaust valve. Mechanic that worked on it before was a hack. Honestly this could have been saved if it had been properly diagnosed. Compression/ leak down test would have shown the burnt valve. I would be worried about the valve shrapnel in the turbo. The N18 is a better engine than the N14 for sure.
I admit, when I saw the clean spark plug and even more clean piston I expected a water leak into the cylinder from the head gasket.
14:38 Someone needs to make a sound effect out of that 'pop'!
The failure of that timing chain and the damage to the block was exactly what happened to my 18 month old 2013 Peugeot 208 GTI. Was repaired under warranty but at 15k miles it was making some horrible noises. They rebuilt the entire engine and replaced the cylinder head too. In my ownership that car cost Peugeot £14k in warranty claims..
Wish you had removed the oil pump screen cover to reveal all items on the screen. Interesting video as always. Thank you.
I had a Holden (Opel) Astra when I was younger. It was a decent car. My father had a BMW 320 at the same time ( mid 1990s). His car was 3x the cost to buy and service. He also had to have a switch installed that when the engine was idling the air-conditioner would turn off, or the engine would stall. BMW techs could not be assed trying to figure out the problem, so they bastardised the aircon. Unfortunately, in Western Australia with summers being four months of over 38’c every day, it was bloody awful.
My Astra, however, just worked. Perfectly. Every time.
Love this week's "Cram the cam craps off" 😁
Still waiting on a Tritec out of a R53 mini....
Very interesting that, even though the loose or wrongly installed timing chain sprocket allowed gouging of a huge amount of non-ferrous metal from the head, there was virtually no forbidden glitter in the engine. That suggests to me that the gouging was done earlier in its life rather than later and a main dealer dealt with it under warranty; cleaning out the sump and engine as well as retightening the sprocket and timing the engine.
Funny that you made another video on this engine. I've watched the other one a few times already, since I own an N13.
Just an educated guess, but those valves are closest to the turbo, and it generates a lot of heat. On a diesel, if turbos idle too much, are are not allowed to cool down after a heavy load ( like on a dyno) - they can cause other issues. My guess!
Another great video Eric. Thank you. I absolutely love the sound of the bolts being cracked. Cheers
6:09 USed turbos from cars like this are perfect for building jet engines to put on gokarts out of!
The N18 was much improved. The timing chain and turbo issues were the killers of the N14, as was DI that caused so much carbon accumulation. The N18 was such a good to drive engine and I’m sure PSA has fixed all of the issues with them now seeing how they’ve now been on sale for 17 years and still put them in a variety of Peugeot, Citroen, DS, Opel, Vauxhall, etc.
I owned an N18-equipped JCW and it was a really fun car. That little 1.6 sounds good, was fuel efficient, and this engine pulls hard from 1250RPM to redline. If reliability had been top notch on the rest of the car I would’ve kept it longer than 4 years. My issues were not engine related but all to do with electronic components and crummy plastic trim pieces that broke. The clutch was also a weak point that was super expensive to replace if you didn’t get it done under warranty.
Owned one Cooper S 2007, same engine, tractor sound at startup, high oil consumption at 55.000 miles, couple of thousend miles after that major engine problems, complete write off. Always serviced by a BMW dealer as lease car, I was lucky cost me nothing.
Love to have a business like yours. Keep up the great content 👍🏻
It's pretty obvious to even a basic level mechanic that the 3 raised sections on the cam gear are specifically to centre the gear on the cam.
Not only was this pulley offsetting the chain relative to the other pulley, it was only relying on the bolt keeping it centre, it would have been oscillating up and down perpendicular to the cam. That's why the guide broke. The chain was literally pushed up into it by the off centre gear.
That of course would have happened immediately after first start.
Lunatics.
p.s I personally would have liked to see you take the chain off, get a drill and rotate that exhaust cam at some RPM to see how much it was effectively out of round.
They're notorious for timing chain failures (the guides fall apart as they become brittle). I'd say the original timing chain was what did the damage to the engine and the bits in the bottom end we're from those guides that failed and someone didn't clean them out when putting the new chain and cassette in. People keep driving these cars not knowing what the issue is because it's still driving and they wait until the car had a code or wont run anymore before doing something about it.
There was an issue with the timing chain tensioner being no good in that year range and they had a recall on them which caused the death rattle. But mainly these chains need to be replaced by 160K kms for preventative maintenance, this is what the Mini Cooper forums always suggested. The best way to avoid it happening sooner is change the oil much more regular than BMW says to (every 5000kms or so). Yeah theyre costly engines to maintain but they can be reliable enough if maintained properly like you said, if you like working on your car they can actually be quite fun to learn from. Definitely not the best engine to have obviously but you learn a lot about how to properly maintain a car.
Those burnt valves are also common with these cars. Keeping them walnut blasted does help, good to know that running rich can also cause it.
Thank you so much for your honest opinion, I think you nailed it with your final words.
Mini Cooper blues band. with special guest the burnt valve.
This was am EJ-1 failure. Pretty mild.
The valve didn't take anything else with it. But the metal part of the timing guide that was broke was impressive
Dude, the dipstick had me laughing. I done exactly the same thing the first time.
In the 80s the inline 6 banger would overheat and crack the head and sometimes the block. It was cheaper to buy another 7 series than fix the engine, the car drove nicely especially at autobahn speeds. We did have a 4-1 exchange rate that helped, and there were a lot of used cars available. The trick was to Get the engine to cool slowly. A lot of the cars were brought back as grey market cars, trying to fix one in the States was difficult.
"Geographical sensor" got a laugh out of me 😂😂😂
I have the equivalent PSA engine but non-turbo (so port injection instead of direct injection and no turbo) and I am at 136k miles on it (220k km)
burns oil a lot but other than basic parts like thermostat or VANOS solenoid no real issues surprisingly :)
When eventually the engine goes I will be half tempted to rebuild my Peugeot 207cc as EV. Probably easier than doing a full rebuild of the engine :D
If I'm not mistaken, an exhaust valve failure would be considered a BLOW JOB... am I correct?