Retro Gaming is Rapidly Changing! Is It Dying? Retro Gaming and the Future
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.พ. 2025
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From MiSTer FPGA to Analogue Pocket to MiSTer Pi to video game emulation I have noticed a HUGE opinion shift this year in regards to how people like to play their retro games...and it seems to be leading directly AWAY from original video game hardware! Is that a good thing? Bad thing? Let's talk about it!
Plus all the retro game scalers like RetroTink 4K and Morph 4K and how they have changed the landscape in the last 12 months too!
Questions? Comments? Just leave them below and I will do my best to answer each and every one of them!
/ videogameesoterica
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#retrogaming #retrogames #retrogamer #misterfpga #emulation #emulator
If only reduced demand for original hardware would reflect in the prices...
That would be nice.
Haha that’s always the last to move. People don’t want to leave “potential profits” on the table
I wouldn’t mind
Unfortunately I don't think it will happen because the collectors market treats the retro games market as investments.
There are a lot of people in the market now with no interest in gaming. It's just a trading commodity. They don't follow channels like this or actually follow the scene, so they're slow to react to market changes. You just have to hold fast and say I'm not spending that amount on X. The more people they see turning them down the more evidence they get that their pricing is out of whack.
I'm talking about the guys who don't really want to sit on stock. Cause they don't even enjoy it. Just a sunken cost for them. Let them squirm.
Playing with the correct controllers matters with to me more than the physical console or computer.
And it’s never been easier to do that then now which has been awesome :)
ME TOO! I have so many USB and 2.4GHz versions of classic console controllers (or adapters for the real things) it's not even funny.
You need that specific shape and layout
My theory is that original hardware folks like me are simply getting older. There are so many younger people discovering these awesome retro games for the first time that don’t have the nostalgia for the actual physical items and just want to play.
We def keep getting older that’s for sure
Yah I'm reaching 40 and I have a nice physical collection of systems from my youth but I have a 3 year old and I'm looking forward to showing him this stuff and hopefully he'll enjoy it as well. A nice bonding memory for both of us. But I'm sure as he gets older he'll get into whatever is popular at the time.
You can’t fight back the tide of current popularity that’s for sure
@@VideoGameEsoterica no and I mean, even thinking back to being a kid, my dad bought an Atari and I played it, but once that Nintendo came out I never looked back. So it's just the way she goes. 😁
Honestly playing 2d games on a CRT is still my preferred way to play. I am also one of those guys that play on OG hardware but also use FPGA. It is more of a convenience thing. The enjoyment is "almost" the same.
I do love a good CRT
Totally with you there. Where i personally draw the line is cartridges. I will take MiSTer or original hardware with a Krikzz multicart every time. I never felt compelled to go down the physical cart collection route. It just becomes too overwhelming.
I'm still an OG purist when I can be, but I do enjoy the convenience of MiSTer, Analogue Pocket and emulation through my Steam Deck. I also have a Coleco, NES, SFC, PS2, and Genesis all ready to power on at the drop of a hat. Like all good things, I think there's a balance to be had
Convenience wins the day as we all seemingly have less time to do anything these days
@VideoGameEsoterica facts, 110%
I always love some quality of life when it's available. I know I would be shamed endlessly by purists, but man I love save states when available. Sure, when we were kids we could do a playthrough of Ninja Gaiden or Rygar in one sitting, but I just don't have the time anymore!
@@aildriktquetzel5385 Yep so true that's why I like to force myself into create YT long gameplay videos
@@aildriktquetzel5385 save states are certainly part of the baked in beauty of flash carts, emulation and depending MiSTer cores (when supported)....
It would be so satisfying if these game publishers would legally SELL ROMs to the community - in particular for games that they have no intention of remastering or ever bringing back in a collection. Think of the SEGA Genesis collection on Steam/Xbox/Playstation/Nintendo. They charged like $20 for 50-some games with a completely custom 3-D virtual living room interface and a bunch of save state functionality, etc. I think that's great, but they could have also sold those individual ROMs for like $1 or $5, made far more money, and put in far less effort. Honestly, I'd probably buy BOTH. Just give us the *option* to do these things completely above-board legal.
/pipedream
Def a pipe dream haha
But Black Dynamite, I SELL ROMS to the community!
@@rorydropkick XD
Limited Run Games did this recently with the Jurassic Park and Rocket Knight Adventures collections.
🤣 nice
Collectors willl always be around to keep prices elevated, at least until these generations age-out of the market and pass away. Right now, we're in prime collecting years for the generations that grew up with these consoles and games. These are the years that they have the highest nostalgia and highest disposable income so they wont hesitate to spend the money required to relive their formative years.
We as retro gaming enthusiasts are well-informed about alternatives...the general public are not.
I feel like the general public just pops over to emulation
@VideoGameEsoterica Yeah. The vast majority do. But those that get a real nostalgic urge pop over to eBay.
I agree, I started gaming late 2600, NES launch. Nostalgia is at its all-time high with all the cartridge generation between 8 and 16 bit. I have more money than time now. I can see guys around my age having the money with more income potential and drive. Once we age out not sure who will care enough to pay the prices.
@@acem7749 Yeah, absolutely. I feel like a strong sense of loss when I think that CRTs aren't being made anymore. I've made it a point to keep an eye on Craigslist and such to rescue any nice sets from going to the dump, but for most people, even younger gamers, they just don't care. There is no connection with the hardware of the time.
Software emulation has become so good that we can now focus on filters, shaders, bezels and loads of front ends. Once FPGA gets cheaper, more powerful and has a choice of fancy features like i just mentioned then I can see it doing much better.
We’ve never been so spoiled for choice
@@VideoGameEsoterica yeah true, I think in less than 5 years FPGA will end up being a box of tricks for noobs too where they buy pre loaded boxes that are just plug and play on 4k TVs via wireless controllers
Could very well be
Check out my Sony Megatron HDR shader for accurate, performant and cheap CRT simulation
Software emulation does not become better over the years - is still laggy as hell. Even some games on PSP are unplayable due to lag, like Patapon, despite PSP was console with LCD screen and frame buffer, so introduced input lag itself. And half-working tricks like frame skipping a.k.a. "run ahed" barely helps, mostly because for most games is imposible to set up frame skipping for 5-6 frames (typical software emulation lag) and avoiding weirdo movements artifacts.
And I know peoples interested in bezels, shaders and other crap. They mostly playing around with bezels, shaders, emulation fronteds and skins and very little playing actual games.
Have you found input lag on PCSX2? I host a retro game tourney for my buddies a few times a year and people noticed lag for closer to current gen emulators, just curious. It sent me down a rabbit hole of maintaining 3-6th gen consoles, my new full-time job.
Nothing I hated. There’s a tiny bit of lag
What I like about physical games is that it helps reduce decision paralysis when choosing what to play next. You get to actually look at something and make a decision. Sure, you can have every game in existence, but being able to look at and hold a game just makes it more enjoyable, for me anyway.
That does help. I add games that i don’t have on the shelf to my MiSTer as I feel like playing them
While I could never give up a CRT, I’ve definitely been moving more and more time to my MiSTer these days. So many of consoles are starting to have issues and it bums me out. However, I don’t think I’ll get rid of my physical collection, because my kid LOVES it. There’s something about the tactile nature of pulling a game off the shelf that I think really speaks to him.
The good thing is MiSTer works on CRT so we’re getting the best of both worlds
@@VideoGameEsoterica Working with a tube and MiSTer can be quite fiddly at times. Heck, there isn't even a good RGB to composite encoder yet, however the planned Reflex Prism DAC looks promising.
MiSTer addons has other RGB to composite stuff avail now
@@VideoGameEsoterica Yup the new Analogue Pro IO Board has been a game changer for me. I’m constantly carrying my MiSTer between different sets in the house and using multiple different inputs.
@@Code7Unltdjust use a VGA to SCART Adapter and you can feed pure RGB glory directly into your CRT without any problems!
I got a Mister in 2019 and it was the first time I experienced emulation that was a better experience than original hardware. I sold my entire collection in the years following.
A lot of people have it seems
Personally, I can't wait for FPGA to support optical media, as I have a decent disc collection, and I'd love to just pop the disc in and play, get the full-fat redbook audio, enjoy the disc cover art and manual and so on, plus there is so many disc based consoles, Saturn for one is something I'm looking forward to working with FPGA and real discs, & PS1/CD32/PCE-CD/Neo-Geo-CD/etc, just booting up a demo disc will be cool. And making your own discs for English translations and fan games.
That's how it happened for me (sort of). Got myself a low end laptop 5 years ago to try out retroarch for 8bit and 16bit, and use Duckstation.
Now I use a mini pc to emulate up to ps2 and wii, and all my old consoles are sold.
Only my ps3, ps5 and switch remain.
Money came in handy too me being a dad.
I used to be one of those purist/elitist types, now I couldn't give a **** what I use. 😂
Been collecting since 1991 so I have a massive collection of physical hardware, games and CRTs that I won’t ever part with…..still use them a fair bit but MiSTer probably gets a heavier workout these days, it’s so flexible in terms of control and video output options….I am not a huge fan of retro games on modern TVs though, maybe because I’ve been playing on CRTs for so long it just feels weird playing SNES or MegaDrive on an LCD, but I get why ppl don’t want to deal with CRTs this far after they became obsolete
Yeah, Japanese PSX, Saturn and DC games are so much cheaper and have COOLER artwork! Tho I still have some of my US collection from the old dayz, buying JPN CDs is a no brainer
I have plenty of US discs but now if I add games it’s Japanese
I really hope one day to see Taki make that handheld MiSTer. Wish list: Horizontal form factor, 4:3 screen, full size dual analog sticks.
He will bring one out eventually
Every once in awhile I get the urge to pull the trigger on a Neo Geo MVS single slot board. They aren't expensive, and I can get a flash cart for cheap. But then I remember that I have a MiSTer and it kills that urge.
Yes in the end the result is the same minus one is a mess of wires
Some people in the community overestimate input lag and hardware demands when it comes to software emulation on PC. A desktop PC made within the last couple of years or so can probably emulate just about anything from Generation 6 and before with ease. That being said, I am fascinated by the possibilities of FPGA in the future and its ability to be more accurate in situations where software emulation has struggled over the years.
FPGA will just keep getting better but so will software emulation. Win win
Using a High Refresh Rate monitor (120Hz+) reduces greatly the Input Lag of these old games in emulators, but most people will cope saying the opposite for you.
God I wish that was true, I have a top-draw Ryzen X3D CPU with a 96MB 3D cache, an RTX 4080Ti, 128GB DDR5 (lowest CAS latency timings I could find), a couple 200GB Intel 3DX Optane PCIe NAND drives in RAID0 (multiple times faster and much lower latency than SSD drives), as well as a PCIe i-RAM Gigabyte RAMDISK, which is an absolute game changer for soft emulation, especially combined with a Ryzen X3D, which can literally give you nearly 200GBps of I/O random access, texture caching can be flawless with a hyper low latency setup, you can fit entire games inside of the 3D cache of the Ryzen chip, which is incredible, but even then, the latency is high enough to make plenty of games unplayable, I would never subject myself to playing Space Channel 5 via soft emulation for instance, or Ikuruga, the input-fidelity is just way to low to keep the gameplay quality as high as real-hardware or FPGA, it's not just end-to end latency either (which is as high as 90/95ms on Windows 10 btw), it's the frame-time spiking from background tasking, Windows phoning home (telemetry), USB encoding, it's unavoidable, even on my custom LTSB Enterprise Win10 build, modern OS's just aren't built or capable of playing nice with hardware that was originally built with bare-metal, zero latency environments in mind (CRTs, ROM carts, no operating systems or frambuffers etc), the developer of probably the best soft emulator ever made wrote a whole article on why BSNES will never be lag free on a X86 operating system, for the PPU to behave like it's real bare-metal counterpart, the tech just isn't available yet for soft emulation to do this, mind you, he wrote it before DynaRes (RGB-Pi) was a thing, but that's 240p on a low latency SoC with a very optimized kernel, and it's still subject to USB latency, and some rendering latency too, it's sub 10ms or so afaik, which is great, especially as DynaRes behaves very much like the real thing, and DynaRes 1.0 will be even lower latency and more accurate, it's closer to FPGA performance than X86-64 & Windows performance.
@@Wobble2007 Most of this thing thats why Gabe Newell (Valve) is trying to introduce alternative gaming OS and gadgets like Steam OS and Steam Deck to compete.
Windows still have the most compatibility but these random bad problems caused by their telemetry really hurts the retrogaming. Also i am old enough to remember that BNES guy (passed away in 2021).
But the difference from "lag free" to "unplayable" is big. At least i am very confortable with my setup, my PC is considered poor compared to yours.
There is still some exaggerations here and there, otherwise, the EVO Championship will never use Consoles again, because most of their fighting games runs at 60Hz ) even if they are connected to a high refresh rate monitor. You can easily run at 120, 144, 240, 280+ Hz if you have a minimal a minimal tech knowledge.
This thing is even stated by EVO/Capcom Pro Tour Staff recently, they surrendered against people on Fightcade that nowadays helps then and other companies (SNK, TAITO, SEGA) on developing netcode and and hints for lag reduction on their products and events.
This was like 2022 and 2023, most of fighting games got 120Hz+ patch in 2024, and i am not talking about framerate, just a refresh rate change.
Years ago it has also proved that SSF4 runs at lower input lag PC using a FreeSync monitor than the base version used on EVOs that was the Xbox 360 version connected to a top tier gaming monitor on that era but without freesync and a 60Hz.
@@Wobble2007 I'm actually on Linux nowadays (openSUSE Tumbleweed) so I don't have to worry about Windows telemetry. Just about every emulator out there has a Linux port. And RetroArch has things like run-ahead and settings you tweak in both OpenGL and Vulkan.
I'm only a casual retro gamer (I get most of my enjoyment / nostalgia from just listening or watching YT vids about old games) but I totally agree with this.
It’s becoming a more popular sentiment
I got into hardware bc software wasnt that good then, now its such a compelling argument (especially bc I'm not good at the technical stuff (modding, etc), so much cheaper than buying a new console when a lazer goes...
And I think the last time I was good at burning disks was 10+ years ago...
Hope you are having/had a good holiday dude! Appreciate the channel!
Haha the disc burning days are pretty much over now if you want them to be
Part of the appeal of retro in its early years was that everything could be found easily at flea markets and garage sales or on eBay listings, and this method would be natural for someone in prior generations who thought about gaming in terms of "all the games I could never afford as a kid" - making it a collector's hobby. Retro today is now a source of content, though: let's play, speedrunning, hardware repairs, etc. As well, the most popular games today tend to also be the most popular games from five years ago - Minecraft and Pokemon are retro in the way that Lego or Chess are retro, in that kids don't care if it's "old." Between these things, I think the market isn't "forgetting the past" like it used to and simply discarding old games for speculators to pick up: the demographics have shifted towards preservation of the content and a more literate appreciation of the gaming hobby, because there isn't such heated anticipation for newer consoles with more graphics, but there is a lot of concern around losing the past through DRM, software updates and terminated live services.
And at the very most entry level, if you're a kid with a school Chromebook, retro could mean browsing to Archive org and playing through the web-based emulation - that's already enough to experience a lot of stuff. FPGA, a scaler and some peripherals are a nice incremental investment over that.
Yes it used to be readily available and cheap. Now its readily available and always expensive even for common stuff
For playing Emulation the last 20 years, I have used the same hardware when playing on the Television or for portables. The OG Xbox with Component, RGB Scart, or VGA and my PSP. Final Burn has been amazing, and emulation has been working for most classic console games.
I always try ti okay games the closest as possible to how it was when they launched, so I hardly ever use enhancements on emulators. That said, have you considered making a video on CRT shaders for emulation? I use those a lot
I’ll do some shader stuff in 2025
Life happened and I had to down-size what was once a very large collection. While I do miss physically owning certain items, I am now enjoying a new mental clarity and calmness. MiSTer and various emulators have been a life-saver.
I get that mental clarity. I was looking for one thing in my studio last night. One thing! (Admittedly I put it in a stupid place)…took me 40 minutes to find!
I have lots of real hardware consoles but I have Everdrives and ODE’s for them. I missed out on the Mister Pi but I hope to get the Mister portable. I also hope the Mister portable can dock to CRT’s.
I’d presume the portable will have hdmi out so that means you can go direct video to a CRT
@ meaning I would need an HDMI to component adapter for 240p? My CRT’s have component hookups.
HDMI to component would be fine yes
You might as well wait for the Multi Console 2.0, will probs be the best MiSTer prebuild available yet, or Takis MiSTer console, not sure what exactly that will be yet though.
I've been looking at Neo Geo hardware on and off for the past twenty years and it has consistently been too expensive for me. MiSTer FPGA gives me the opportunity to experience this elusive console for a fraction of the cost. 😊
Exactly. Nobody wants an AES and flash cart today for near to $1000 when you have a Neo Geo that’s ALSO a flash cart for $200…because that’s what MiSTer is. Plus 200 other “things” it can be via the menu
@VideoGameEsoterica thanks for all the videos; helpful, informative and very entertaining!
MiSTer's Neo-Geo nuked core is also one of the few 1:1 replica cores too afaik, along with the Mega Drive nuked core, just means it's 100% accurate to real hardware, right down to the individual pixels. I hope the Amiga and X68K cores get to that point eventually.
Happy to do it
Completely agree with what you are saying here. I know personally, I went from a slew of retro consoles under the TV a couple of years ago to just a MiSTer and a PC and between that it handles everything I want. Particularly on the PS1 and PS2, upscaling makes a HUGE difference.
I"ll also add that my quest a year ago to find a good CRT was so incredibly frustrating, I just don't want to deal with it any more. Those things are, sadly, getting very hard to find in good working condition.
Weirdly in Chicago you can still get a great crt for pocket change if you look enough
@VideoGameEsoterica yeah it is the downside of living in West Texas. Very literally the middle of nowhere. Dallas probably has them but that is a 4 hour drive or having it shipped which is pretty tricky.
Shipping just isn’t advisable. In person only. Road trip time!
I bet you can still find a nice 17 inch CRT monitor in good nic for cheap, perfect for MiSTer & PC emulation, beats a PVM imo, even the bay has those decent Dell 17 inchers for cheap (under 80 bucks or so), combine one of those with a 20 dollar VGA scanline generator, and you have a 1000 TVL CRT setup for just 100 bucks or less.
I go straight to Mister when I'm wanting to play anything retro anymore. I have the games on the shelf but can't beat the quality and convenience.
The convenience is the key factor
I have everything hooked up from
NES on - recapped and hdmi modded - nothing is turned on anymore because of mister.
That isn’t a bad thing.
Their only purpose is so my kids know the history!
Def not a bad thing. It’s a good thing!
I want scenes to render correctly with the right colors. I want to avoid audio pops, desync, and any and all hitching. I want the accuracy to approximate 100% including frametimes and frame pacing. When I see FPGA working to achieve that, I go with FPGA. When FGPA isn't there yet (e.g. PS2), I go with OG hardware and have it jailbroken and modded. When I can achieve the above list of wants for a given title and also benefit from higher internal resolution and AI upscaled textures, I go with software emulation.
A fair methodology
I'll never understand why people would prefer the much smaller 16:9 aspect over 16:12 (4:3), which has a much larger & more immersive FOV, 16:10 comes close, but nothing beats 16:12, I love the IMAX 16:12 (4:3) films too, like the Snyder Cut of Justice League, I think it's just most people don't understand that 4:3 is a larger and much fuller aspect than 16:9, as they use a much older term to describe it, that is 4:3, when the modern equivalent comparison to 16:9 & 16:10 is 16:12, that said, each to his own, I respect everyone has a preference, just keep in mind that 1600x1200 vs 1600x900 is a pretty big difference, and you might actually much prefer 16:12 (4:3) over 16:9, one of my fave features of the Steam Deck is the 16:10 display, so much nicer than 16:9 imo, and nothing beats a full-frame 4:3 IMAX film on a large 36 inch 4:3 CRT or an RGB-LASER projector in 4:3 aspect mode, keep in mind a 36 inch 4:3 display has the same real-estate footprint (viewable screen size) as a 60 inch 16:9 display, a 22-inch CRT monitor has more viewable screen real estate than a 27 inch 16:9 monitor (it about the equivalent to a 30 inch 16:9, or a 25 inch 16:10 display).
I guess it’s all just subjective what people enjoy. I try to let them do what they want :)
Average joes and janes want their screen filled (as in: annoyed at significant borders), but don't understand that 16:9 (4²:3²) was just a compromise betwixt 4:3 and 2.35.
Honestly, I'm more a stickler for an accurate frame.
16:9 isn't smaller than 4:3.. lol it's not larger either. It's a ratio of length to width. Size is totally ambiguous
@@mrburns366 It literally has a third less vertical resolution, what on earth do you mean my dude? lol 0_o, Full-frame (open matt) 4:3 has a much larger FOV as well, it's pretty basic tbh.
I'm a random viewer who never comment on videos but that's a great insight on the state of our hobby.
You've quite perfectly worded my impression on how the "market"/mood is evolving and that's why I've sold all the retro hardware and games I had collected (not much but still worth 2k € altogether). In the end, it was just taking dust in drawers and closets. I just run whatever Retroarch/emulator with a decent frontend on some capable hardware and it's so much more convenient.
Old genuine hardware has become too precious and quirky to use now that I'm older and that I just want my video gaming fix.
Emulation has reached such a good state and FPGAs look so promising (and are already delivering) that I saw no point in keeping old hardware. Having exchanged with other same-aged gamers, I get the feeling that it's mostly nostalgia that has them playing on original hardware. And prices got many to stop collecting genuine retro hardware.
Thanks for all your work on your channel by the way. I discovered many unknown (to me) gems thanks to you.
👍
Comment more. It’s always welcome :) and yes emulation has gotten very mature in the last few years
The only things I have nostalgia for are, ironically, the things I couldn't afford as a kid. The Saturn, Neo Geo, etc. I've collected bits and pieces in the last 10 years, but by and large I've been priced out of the retro market. Now as I'm older, when I want to play a game I'm turning on my ROG Ally or using my computer. Sure, CRT's and hardware are great, but the flip side of cost, maintenance and inconvenience aren't worth it to me personally. This is why I'm so happy to see things like Mister community thrive and new/better emulators emerge.
Haha makes total sense. Thats why I collect
i one of those who enjoys messing around with real hardware, not just playing but also fixing it, but i got into FPGA emulation recently, i even bought a scart adapter for my mister pi, i'm amazed how well it emulates the real thing, hooked up to a crt it feels like the real deal.
That’s basically because it really is the real deal
The only original console I’m still using is a modded PS2 to play the Time Crisis games on my CRT. The MiSTer covers the rest. Man, what an incredible piece of hardware.
Gotta have that lightgun support
I have my Steam Deck docked to a 65" 4k tv with multiple retro styled 8Bitdo bluetooth controllers and an arcade stick. That's all I need.
Deck has been amazing
I do use emulation on my laptop, but with Saturn I have a console hooked up to my modern TV and that's how I like to play that system as far as the retro consoles
Saturn is def a bit of an outlier
Can I get a nice crt filter using the morph 4k? Or the ones on retrotink 4 are better?
Tink filters are better. Morph filters are nice too. You have CRT filters on both
A bit late commenting on this one, but...
For me, the main issue that prevents me from having all my retro consoles out in the open along with all my more recent hardware is a lack of physical space to put them all. I just don't have all the space I'd need right now to have every single bit of gaming hardware I own under the same roof. So what I do is I keep my Xbox 360, PS3, PS4, Nintendo Switch, gaming PCs, Steam Deck and a few other things like my Analogue devices all in the same room, while keeping everything else I have at storage.
I don't have a good upscaler like the RetroTink 4k as of yet, and I'm reluctant to modify any of my older console hardware (the most I'll do is jailbreak what I can, but physical modifications are a bridge too far for me, personally), so having FPGA devices like the Analogue devices I currently own (which will include the Analogue 3D come next year) and a MiSTer DE-10 Nano are a godsend to me because those devices are able to emulate most of the older gaming hardware I have packed away in storage while adding a few extra bells and whistles to make playing those emulated systems on my 4K TV a much more pleasant and hassle-free experience. In the case of the MiSTer specifically, its like having most of my old early childhood consoles and devices all conveniently rolled into one nice, compact package that I can easily set up on a small shelf and boot up whenever I want to play a particular system prior to the 6th generation of consoles (sans the Gameboy Advance), and my libraries of games for each of those systems are all stored on the device itself and don't require their own seperate space nearby and using more of my already limited real estate.
If space and a lack of proper upscaling devices weren't factors in my case, I'd definitely have every single one of my devices all under the same roof as me, all hooked up and I'd be jumping back and forth between all of them in addition to FPGA and software emulation via PC. But as you yourself point out in this video, maintaining all this older hardware for regular use could get potentially expensive depending on how far you want to take it, and things like disc rot are something that's beyond my ability to fix, especially if the discs in question are proprietary and are no longer being manufactured. I could circumvent this to a degree using jailbreaking methods and, in the case of cartridge-based systems, flashcarts, but finding working lasers for the disc-based consoles is only going to get harder for EVERYBODY, and not everyone can repair/put together cartridge readers from scratch that you can use as substitutes for reading your carts.
With software emulation, and FPGA in the case of hardware emulation, as long as I have my game files, console bios files, and the minimum amount of hardware required to set up whatever emulation solution I want to use, I know I can always boot up and play all the games across all the various consoles I have accumulated over the course of my life. With FPGA in particular, I can even emulate the original hardware itself while adding a few quality-of-life enhancements to them to make playing them on modern displays almost hassle free. In an ideal world I'd love to always be able to just use my original hardware and add an upscaler as needed, but these older devices, and the storage mediums for a lot of the games themselves, won't last forever. I got to set up alternatives to these things that will allow me to be able to more easily access and play these games/systems without it causing me any issues when it comes to space and regular maintenance. It sucks, but in my case my gradual replacing of my older hardware with things like the MiSTer and software emulation via PC gaming is largely born less out of of convenience for convenience's sake, but moreso out of necessity due to personal living conditions and costs for regular upkeep via regular usage.
I won't ever get rid of my older hardware and physical games if I can help it, but the fact of the matter is that I simply don't have the luxury to keep ALL my gaming goods under one single roof anymore, and it'll likely stay this way for the foreseeable future, so I have to use the MiSTer and a handful of other devices to try and store/play the vast majority of my library digitally.
Long story short, I literally only have enough space under my current roof to keep only the hardware that I KNOW I'm going to regulary use that can ALSO in some way or another play my ENTIRE library of games across ALL platforms, otherwise I'd have everything with me out in the open and being used.
Physical space is always a problem. I’m near to capacity myself!
I agree with everything you said, but I also think prices really killed interest in original hardware. Everything is so expensive/overpriced it's really diminished my interest in looking for physical copies of games for my favourite systems (SNES, PSX, etc.).
And as much as I love physical media, and hate the way current-gen games have shifted to digital (and the rights/ownership issues associated with it), if I'm being honest I mostly buy and play digital games these days. It's a combination of convenience, price, and the fact that the modern games I play are almost exclusively VR games which often don't get physical releases.
Great and thought-provoking video. Hope you have a happy holidays.
Prices have gotten pretty bad in the last five or so years. Getting speculative
Ps where is the pixel fx morph 4k $200? It's $275 + postage, and I've never seen one used (set ebay alerts too but never got an alert)
Maybe just meant to say 250. Which it’s listed for now
If we are comparing the NeoGeo original hardware.
Then my opinion is that the Neogeo Aes joystick adds a lot to the experience.
However I do also like being able to use button combinations with MiSTer + Emulators
Don’t forget you can easily just hook the AES stick up to MiSTer or your PC too
i built my own aes sticks 💖
i have a couple of the black original ones but dont like them tbh
They aren’t perfect but for nostalgia they are a ton of fun
I bought a MisterAddon's FPGA kit this year & it's become the SINGE BEST video game purchase I've ever made. Been playing tons of old favorites, games I missed out on, and loads of really cool ROM hacks/mods/QoL improvements, etc. I've since sold most of my original hardware as a result.
Glad you are enjoying the FPGA club :)
I've been considering a consolized MVS from AliExpress with a multi cart. But I know I'd use it once and then put it in the cupboard never to be used again. For me the convenience of FPGA and emulation wins every time
I rarely if ever turn my AES on now
@@VideoGameEsotericawhat's the difference between AES and MVS?
Cart pinout and game modes. But you can run the MVS version of games on an AES via the univios
For me the most important things are accuracy, input lag, CRT comparability, and features. So yeah, if i had a Mister I'd probably just boot that up 9 times out of 10 (as long as the console is supported).
Yeah KiSTer gets that job done well
ill put it this way i do work on emulation and i have a huge real collection few years back the rubber band drive belt broke on my Sega Saturn cast me 200 buck to replaced never opened one of my consoles since then and theirs some thoughtful and painstaking work put into emulation
As much as I've always wanted an AES, I agree with you. Emulation is just too good and convenient these days. Nice video. 👍🏾
You don’t get anything extra for the cost minus being able to hold the game
We are a dying breed......it's just the newer generations don't remember what it is going into an arcade and seeing SF II for the first time or gathering around the the first MK and seeing someone pulling off a head from Sub Zero hearing FATALITY.....or what it was growing up with the NES, MS, SNES and SG/MD..... I got my huge collection of those from way back, do I play them not as much but just looking at them on my shelf brings all those memories back....
Sadly modern arcades are just a shell of what they used to be
@@VideoGameEsoterica Very sad.... millennials and Gen Z just can't fathom and understand what arcades were and that they represented the top of what was possible in entertainment....like first time you sat down in the full cab of Out Run or G-Loc or Afterburner.....they just don't understand it
@@carlosprieto1242 Millennials were definitely the core audience along with Gen X, in the 80s and 90s. Don't get us confused with Gen Z.
Recently I was chatting with my friend and his son about gaming and how they enjoy playing NES games on the Switch. I took them to the flea market and his son picked up a NES with some games and they both are loving it.
Over the summer his son, who’s 12, got a job walking dogs and regularly goes on eBay to buy games.
For Christmas I bought them a SNES 🎉
I agree, retro collecting has changed for some of us. But maybe the older generation is passing the torch to the younger generation.
For Christmas this year… my son, who is 28, asked for a Gamecube. It was a “proud dad moment” 😊
Haha get your son the best GameCube you can find!
@@VideoGameEsoterica And copies of Eternal Darkness & Chibi-Robo to get him off to a good start.
I think it depends on the system. For systems that are not currently FPGA implemented (say Dreamcast or OG XBOX, etc...), I am modding those to be able to use without OG discs, but for most things that are all but perfect HW replication in FPGA, Im using MiSTer (ESPECIALLY for Arcade).
Yes past N64 gen OG hardware is still great in its own way
My end goal for playing retro games is real hardware, but modded/fixed up to modern standards. Disk/Cartridge emulators like an Everdrive, to play whatever I want without having to spend hundreds on older copies for all games I want. Audio/controller/video output/power port mods for ease of use and enchanted quality. All on a CRT tv.
The younger generation is definitely not steering away from physical media. My friends and I are all teenagers, and we understand the importance of physical media, even if we didn’t grow up with it as much as older generations. There is also just a wow factor of having that authenticity in your room. The real deal. It still exists.
I just don’t feel that for the most part EVERYONE needs real hardware now in their minds
The only pieces of OG hardware that I have are 4 PC Engines (OG, 2x Core Grafx and 1 Core Grafx II) and a modified Game Boy. I really, really like the design of the PCE and the way they thought about using hu-cards as media for it, that's why I keep them. And to think that I have no nostalgia for PCE, it's something that I started experiencing in the past 1 year or so.
For me, retro gaming is and has always been about the games themselves, not about the hardware, not about CRTs, the games, period. And I don't have issues with either using FPGA or software emulation. The only major reason why I prefer FPGA more than software emulation, is simply because of convenience and the fact that I don't have to play around with too many settings (looking at you, Retroarch) and instead it's almost plug and play.
The PC Engine is such an iconic design. Just a fun object to have around
Playing on a CRT is still essential to me, but MiSTer has replaced many of my real hardware consoles. I sold them both to afford the MiSTer and Tink4k, but also because I only wanted to keep hardware I was willing to maintain due to my love for them - N64, Playstation. Dolphin is Ok, but GameCube still plays best on real hardware. PS2 as well.
FPGA is basically taking the “need original hardware and CRT” argument and reducing it to “don’t need original hardware. Use MiSTer. It plugs into your CRT”
@@VideoGameEsoterica Absolutely! I'd love to just drop a MiSTer into an arcade cabinet with a 25" Wells-Gardner in it-- but, alas, I do not have the space for something like that or the will to lug a full-size cab up the stairs.
a full size cab?? 🥹
i wouldnt be able to get it through my narrow california bay area front door lmao
@@stevenrun34 I have an X-Arcade cabinet that I picked up right as they were phasing out CRTs. I believe it is a Wells-Gardner, and will only do 640x480 in Windows. I've always had a PC hooked up to it running LaunchBox, but I've been more and more tempted to hook a MiSTer up to it. Only problem is you lose out on the later gen MAME stuff.
@@aildriktquetzel5385 I remember those! I built a cabinet around 2002-- it was really rough-- but I put some care into the control panel at least using Happ sticks and buttons. They were local, so I picked them at the will call window... aaah those were the days. I put those sticks and buttons into my Street Fighter II Arcade 1-up when I modded it and made it into a mame cabinet with launchbox-- so part of it lives on.
Great content as always! I totally agree with you, I think younger generation gamers who didn't grow up 'back in the day' to experience the dawn of home gaming on the Atari 2600, on CRTs, probably aren't going to really care how they are playing these games. I know for me personally, I get a sense of joy sitting down in front of my 32" Trinitron with my MiSTer hooked up, playing some good ol' NES classics. Then, my daughter will call from upstairs in the kitchen if I have my old TV turned on because she can actually hear the high frequency CRT 'whine', LOL. Then my wife complains "why do we have all these old tube TVs in our house, can't you get rid of some??". It's just what I grew up with!
Haha I hear that too. Do you need all these tube TVs
@@VideoGameEsoterica That's when it's time to buy her something, new boots do the trick, happy wife, happy life.
You can often get rid of coil whine btw, with any analogue AV gear, just use a decent power filter with a pure sine-wave, a cheap UPS does the trick too, even works with high-end GPU's.
I feel lucky to have been able to own a bunch hardware I never had as a kid like an AES and a couple of arcade cabs, but I think there has been a convergence where consoles with flash carts are basically just a Mister imo and it feels the exact same especially with og controllers via snac, so owning both has started to feel redundant. Mister plus a crt has been my go to for a while now and I plan on moving soon so I have to get rid of a bunch of systems, but mister makes it ok.
Yes MiSTer has made a ton redundant
Retro gaming is a solid 50% of my gaming time. I still play a lot of modern games of course, but I also love me my retro games! And the MiSTer has been the best retro gaming purchase I've made in my life. So much fun to be had on it!
The gift that keeps on giving
FGPA sideshow has produced so much entertainment this year more so than the FGPA scene proper. Thanks Mars. Thanks SuperSega.
It’s been a bit of an odd year in spots
still OG hardware and games here with CRT, nothing touches real stuff for me. Of course MAME gets a decent work out too.
I’ll never part with my stuff. But I also don’t play it as much these days
I have my second Mister FPGA now with the Mister Pi and did a quite minimal Setup with a CRT in a corner of my living room. Wireless Controllers and a Zaparoo reader as well as a growing NFC Card Collection. I still have all the old consoles in my basement hooked up with huge Scart Switches. FPGA is more than good enough to create a truthful experience. The future belongs to high end scalers though.
Don’t forget to play my “zaparoo” party game. Throw cards like ninja stars at the reader and try to get one to register haha
@VideoGameEsoterica good idea. I also like having a bunch of cards with no stickers and just throwing a random card in
Plenty of fun to be had!
Really hoping we see FPGA adopted more into the speed run community in 2025 as an acknowledgement of the equivalency between some of the best FPGA cores and original hardware. 🏅
Me too. We shall see!
It's very nice to play the reliable consoles on real hardware going to RetroTINK-4K. I mean Famicom, Super Famicom and Sega Saturn. You could include Mega Drive in there but I dislike the jail bars. Dreamcast, PS2 and PS are just more hassle than I need. I love those systems but I'll need to wait for FPGA to catch up for Dreamcast and PS2.
I’m sure FPGA will catch up to Dreamcast in the next 2-3 years
Having FPGA cater to CRTs with RCA, S Video, or component, even RF would be nice to have. I do have CRTs and older games always look better to me on tubes. But, eventually, if I ever have an FPGA device and a modern monitor, I could still have fun using filters to get a prettier, non bare-pixel look.
I like having flash carts and turning on my Super Famicom and just playing whatever.
I like playing Shox in pcsx2 without worrying if the PS2 will Read the disc
More people being able to play old games means better indies in the future.
PCSX2 is basically my de facto now
The stop and start nature of your Silent Hill footage is exactly why I prefer and seek out original hardware. I want simple plug and play because my life is busy. I don't want to fiddle about with dithering settings and resolution; whilst wondering how close to the original it looks. I may not be actively looking but my subconscious will be.
Ands its not even a case of just accepting defaults, as someone with any form or neuro divergence is going to check out the settings and fiddle around for a good set up.
That’s fair. I set them once and forget them but I understand some people see it more as a rabbit hole
I own almost all the original consoles and have them connected to CRTs via SCART RGB, but I just love my MiSTer with my Retrotink 4K!
It looks so good and is so much fun!
Just buy some controllers matching the systems you love to play and the experience is amazing!
Controller matching is essential
I like to have original Amiga, PS1, Vectrex hardware but for the most part use groovyarcade with a CRT for everything else. There is no substitute for gaming on a CRT
That’s what MiSTer is great. Easily works on old CRTs
Emulation is in an incredible spot, and CRT simulation from scalers looks incredible. It's never been better to be a retro game enjoyer. Collecting on the other hand....
Also I'm completely done with replacing lasers. I love my CRT, but this time around when my NGC laser got to weak to read I got an ODE and I will do the same with any other disc based device. Once I can get a RT4k in my budget I'm seriously considering switching to an OLED. It's really exciting tho the direction the scene is going. This has been one of my favorite retro videos I like this much better than the typical doom and gloom or drama baiting that is so common on youtube anymore.
Lasers just keep dying and the replacements seem to die even quicker
My setup is almost done. Today it is easier for me to play games on the original hardware than on the emulator.
What’s the setup?
@ I posted a video on your post on X.
I have 16 video games mounted on the furniture, I use component cables and gComp Switch.
So the only problem is connecting the HD Retrovision Cable and the Triad Power Supply to the video game I will use.
But in the future I will solve this with the SVS switch, more Retrovision Cables and more power supply.
I’ll take a peek
@@VideoGameEsoterica The video was filmed at Trap House: Brazil Edition 😂
🤣 so glad that caught on
Looks like I'm going to buck the trend here and say that original hardware is still tops for me. Software emulation and FPGAs are cool but I prefer the actual hardware, warts and all. Part of the fun is learning and experiencing stuff such as the Genesis hardware's various quirks due to the multiple revisions released.
What has changed is how I play my games. I still buy physical copies of stuff if it's affordable, but most of my gaming is done with flash carts or storage devices. Buying games isn't as fun these days due to the rising prices and sellers flat out lying about the condition of their items. I'm also mostly playing on my OLED TV using a RetroTink 4K despite owning several CRTs. I only started using my CRTs recently after buying several Guncons, which obviously don't work on modern TVs. I'll most likely branch out into Gun4IR next once I get my fill of the PS1/PS2 lightgun library.
There’s no wrong answer so don’t worry about it :)
I have all my consoles connected with flashcarts and ODEs and I'm lucky to have the space to have several CRTs, so that will always be my preference, especially when using the original controllers. But I've also been enjoying my Mister that I purchased a few months ago to play arcade games. So a mixture of real hardware and emulation is the best of both worlds.
Space is always the hardest part
Does anyone know why MiSTer Add-ons pre-configured kits are so scarce?
Because MisterAddons has difficulty getting their paws on the required DE10 Nanos, despite them being at every retailer *except direct from Terasic.*
Even QMtech stocks their pre-assembled kit more frequently, *and their I/O board has a real-time clock that just needs a battery.*
@Code7Unltd Thank you for the info. Thing is there's so much I don't know about the MiSTer project. I just wanted to grab a ready out of the box kit like pink kit Videogame esoterica always shows haha
Not something you want to sit on a ton of stock of
Emulation is very convenient however, personally I don't think that nothing beats the nostalgic felling of the original hardware. Never owned a Dreamcast or a Sega genesis and I got both units in the past year. The oddness of the DC controller and how ti felt in my hand it was mind blowing. The experience of playing on the original hardware, felling what kids felt when they first got it, I think that is the core of the retro gaming. To experience things for the first time just like when it came out years and years ago.
OG controllers matter. Luckily you can plug anything into basically anything else these days
Pipe dream. Nothing can compete with original hardware. Your channel even supports that by championing physical arcade boards; and showing how emulation can pale.
And I said as such in the vid. My point is it’s never been a better time options wise
The retro market is getting mature that's it, CIB and sealed in very good condition will keep going up, while incomplete or average condition will go down. An "average" price will mean nothing then.
Good. Let it keep going down!
Agree sealed prices are crazy high
And not worth it
@@VideoGameEsoterica value is the eye of the beholder innit
To me playing old systems such as the MegaDrive 1 or PS1 FAT in composite on a PVM is the best experience. But if you prefer RGB or playing on a modern display, a Mister or even software emulation is almost the same experience as original hardware.
You can get composite out of MiSTer too don’t forget
@@VideoGameEsoterica True, and it's the next best thing to original hardware, but still prefer original hard when I can afford it. But yeah, tested Mister composite VS Japanese MD1 on the same PVM by switching channels, it's really close, but still prefer the original.
That’s fair. Everyone gets their own pick.
I think people are very much underestimating the demand of old hardware, mainly because people talk less about it. However this ignores that info about how to set-up, run, etc. real hardware is extremely easy to find these days unless you're getting into rather niche systems (And, no, Neogeo isn't particularly niche when it comes to info about it). Emulation on the other hand is still changing a lot every year so naturally is talked more about.
I believe systems are still really popular but games less so, looking in my local scene and online people simply move to flash carts. You still have the die hard game collectors though.
As for prices specifically, it's become increasingly popular to buy to resell to "fund the hobby" pushing up prices more.
But also that specifically new people into the hobby have a rather twisted view on what they want (probably thanks to youtube). The amount of people complaining about about pricing and when prompted about what they're talking about mention complete in box sets is just crazy to me, buying complete in box has never really been the thing to go for for anyone just wanting to play the system. A decade ago complete in box system were considered for the hardline collector or super fans of a system (or a neat find if you got one), certainly not the go to for just a system to play on.
The buy to resell is just ruining things
Hi! Great video, as always. The main reason i support FPGA technology over software emulation is due to ease of use and portability. Being able to have a low latency, tiny device that barely uses more than 10w is incredible, compared to booting up my 7900xtx +5800x3d pc combo just to play mario world, id take the benefits of misterfpga anyday
My take on retrogaming is that the older generation is getting older, and the younger generation lacks nostalgia for original hardware and its accessories. As someone who's 22 and collects original hardware, it is a major inconvenience compared to emulation. I believe ive commented on this before, but i repaired crt's for years, and I've just given up. Its not worth it anymore, and crt's are too difficult to find in my city.
Eventually prices will drop, I've already seen a decline in prices for quite a few things. it's just a matter of time before the main stuff most retro gamers want (nintendo first party games) drops in price. And with how many ODE's are coming out nowadays, i see less and less people collecting physical games
They def lack the nostalgia for the hardware. Which totally makes sense. To them it’s just an object
@VideoGameEsoterica I'd also like to add that younger gamers are less inclined to play games prior to the 6th generation of consoles due to those feeling somewhat modern in terms of QOL features. I know this is blasphemy to some, but I find the majority of NES games and arcade games unfun. The difficulty isn't rewarding, and my time is limited. Game over will result in having to play the game again? Nah, I'm putting an infinite life cheat on and enjoying my time LOL. That's how I actually got good at castlevania 1 for nes before I was good enough to beat the game in one run, after many completed playthroughs. Probably would've given up and played some N64 if it wasn't for those cheats LOL
Edit: While i do generally like difficult games, NES and early arcade games are another level. Its like early RPG's, they're not as fun as ps1 and newer rpgs imo
What? Arcade games are the best haha but everyone gets their opinion :)
@VideoGameEsoterica I like arcade beat-em-ups, but they are definitely quarter eaters, I can't imagine playing them without unlimited coins. Contra arcade is a perfect example of a game i found overly difficult, I can't imagine playing that without unlimited continues.
I don't have the hardware for any light gun games, but I love arcade shooters
Once modern displays finally catch up to SD CRT's in terms of motion handling and input lag, and once all of 6th gen emulation is accurate and efficient enough or FPGA's can handle that gen, I can see the vast majority of retro gaming enthusiasts migrating en masse to those solutions. Hopefully well see many more quality replica USB controllers on the market too with proper accessory functions built in like rumble!
Seems like we get new controllers pretty consistently and I bet we see a lot more this year
Not that many people are buying CRT's anymore because more and more of those who are selling "know what they have", so they are crazy expensive. The days of "finding that CRT for free" are getting fewer and farther between. It is what it is. For those of us who still have one, all we can do is recap the electronics board and pray nothing happens to the gun or tube for the next 20 years or so.
As crazy as it sounds, as much as I like playing on the hardware, playing on MiSTer is just more convenient. Of course, I also have my share of Analogue consoles, just "because" 🙂 - but I actually like playing all of them on my CRT more than on a modern TV (long live the DAC!) - heck, the default config on my MiSTer is set up for CRT output (Alt1 is set up for my DELL 2007FPb). Sure, scan line filters have gotten better, but there's no CRT emulation better than actually playing on a CRT for these games. They were MADE for playing on them!
Again, I don't know that I will ever part with my original hardware (as much as I LOVE waiting for SegaCD games to load). I've enjoyed projects like restoring the defective Model 2 Genesis that came with the SegaCD I bought (had to resolder the cold joints on the power plug and replace the AV port, including fixing the trace for the Red signal), or fixing a region mod that was poorly installed on a Saturn I found in a friend's storage unit that he let me have many years ago. This hobby isn't for anyone, but who knows? Maybe it will be something I can hand down to my kids if they want it. I'm a proud papa knowing that they enjoy retro gaming as well.
Chicago must just still be a place where you can get a nice 27” Wega for “$50 and I won’t help you move it”
@ Haha! Maybe - I can tell you that in South FL, those days are at least 12 years gone… that’s when I picked up My 27” WEGA for $30, BTW… 😁 But yes, I DID have to carry it myself, LOL.
Also Japanese region games are honestly the greatest deal in retro gaming bar none. If you make it a goal to learn japanese the language difference goes from a barrier to a tool for you to learn an invaluable skill. Although you can also emulate these discs the neat thing about these games is that most of them still have their manuals, meaning you now have tons of reading material for learning japanese using the hobby you love. Things like saturn, dreamcast, snes, ps1, are literal unobtanium now where even disc only copies are being sold for offensively high prices, while their japanese counterparts can be had for less than 10 dollars when buying direct from japan. Sidenote: honestly the thing i love more than anything in retro gaming is the cool art and manuals that used to come with games, ive always emulated but nothing beats having a color manual with a whole bunch of art from the game in it. Unfortunately most of the cool art is only in the japanese version of a lot of these games because ‘murica didnt want their japanese games to be too japanese lol.
Yes most Japanese releases have better art and are better maintained than US stuff avail for sale
It's good to have more options but I still cant get neo geo to work on the mister followed the guide perfect the games still won't work
Did you grab the right file set? 9/10 times that’s the issue
Gamed all my life. Own all the popular consoles and a crt. Bought an analogue super nt and mega sg. Loved it and could see how strong fpga was. Recently got a mister. Packed away the analogues and the original consoles as I now have one box that plays them all. Installed in a ps3 with original controller ports on the front and can't see me going back to original systems. Fpga is the future
The “one box that plays them all” aspect is incredible
I hear this every couple of years, "emulation is so good you dont need the real thing."
Then I check it out and play some old games where input lag really matters, and find it hasnt gotten any better.
I am as close as ever to trying FPGA because the price to get in has come so far down but Im keeping my original hardware for now.
Nobody said you couldn’t keep it :) I’m not even saying x is better than y. I’m just saying a lot of people tell me they’ve gotten off the real hardware wagon
What really gives me the nostalgia kick its to play the old games with an original controller and a CRT TV...the console and original cartridges or discs it is not so important for me, emulation or FPGA it is OK with me. The new technologies coming on OLED TVs are getting way better on displaying old games so that's the future I guess . Emulation and FPGA will keep evolving to a point that we won't be caring much(specially the younger folks) about the old hardware and storage formats.
FPGA + CRT = gold standard IMO
i love emulators and used them for decades.
now i have 12 consoles all modded and using the highest quality signals hooked to sony crt, this setup is very nice and not comparable to pc stuff. totally worth it.
rt4k is nice but it is 750$ + the need for 2000$ oled monitor... it is not cheap
Def not cheap. But also for what it does it’s a fair price
For a good few years i had every console i owned set up with both a flatscreen and crt and as many everdrives, ODEs, etc. as i could get. As time went on in the last year or two ive slowly put the collection into storage. These days it's just been MiSTer on a crt and a handful of consoles I'm less familar with software emulation like Xbox, 360, Wii U, and im sure those will be put away in the next year or so as well. I wont be selling anything and i still fantasize ablut a dedicated game room but we'll see if that ever happens, hahaha.
I gave up on keeping everything setup forever ago. It became more trouble than benefit
I grew up in the 8-bit era and the shift for me, price aside, is that I'm finally no longer chasing nostalgia. I don't need the perfect CRT setup. I've reached a stage where I realize I legitimately like these older games more than modern ones and just want a convenient way to play them. Games for "modern audiences" have nothing for me.
Convenience is king. Less obstructions between you and just having fun
I am usually rather inclined to buy real hardware and games.
However prices are always skyrocketting more and more.
I wanted to see how much Neo Turf Master costs: more than 17 000$/€ !!!
So I feel I am now slightly switching opinion about emulation.
Analog Pocket looks like a good product as well but I am not sure to be willing to invest the 200$ yet.
I probably hould begin to gather information about FPGA and emulation (on Mac OS).
Neo Turf Masters has risen to “insanity pricing”
Modern screens are one of the reasons people have changed their collecting bias, they're cheap and putting original setups onto them shows how dated these older systems are, scalers and conversion boxes have advanced so much that now the upscaled setups are an absolute must for modern screens and the resulting eye candy is so glorious even to old hands like myself, although I must admit the original hardware is still my preferred way to play as og controllers are part of the nostalgia too, I spend most time on arcade hardware, but like you said it takes the hobby to a different level and yes i own a microscope (like you) because these old eyes aint what they used to be, and again as I type my Virtua racing cab has decided to show signs of failing again so another day of less time playing and more time fixing the old gal appears to be on the cards again but that's what you get with vintage electronics.
Yes it takes a lot more time and hardware to get a good image on a modern panel
Yeah sounds interesting, but still I just dont have the time for studying emulation with all that technical gobbledygook and installment adjustments.
I still play only on original hardware and always know what to do.
That’s fair. Everyone gets to pick
A pretty significant change as to why soft-emulation isn't as good as it used to be for me is due to how much more latency modern operating systems have, ram latency is also much higher in pursuit of r&w bandwidth over random access latency, so even on the hardware side things have gotten worse for emulation performance, you can use a good Windows 7 PC build for soft emulation, and I do, but you lose out on many of the important milestones than emulation has made, especially for Dreamcast, PS2, GC, OGXB, 360, PS3 etc, Windows 10 is just way to unoptimized, and has way too much end-to-end latency, and background processes causes so much frame-time spiking, not to mention the horrible USB encoding lag, thankfully Steam OS is a thing, and it's getting better & better, and as soon as Valve opens it up to everybody to use, I'll be the first to make a Steam OS emulation build with a RAMDISK, decent GPU and HDFury4, it would be amazing if we get a version of DynaRes 2.0 for Steam OS too, as this really can really bridge the gap between soft emulation and FPGA/real-hardware.
All that said, FPGA is by far the gold standard for accuracy, compatibility, and most importantly, latency performance and audio quality, not even DynaRes can touch MiSTer for 5th gen and under, and we are only at gen 1 FPGA as it were at the moment, gen 2 FPGA platforms should be amazing, I canny wait for Replay 2 and MiSTer 2.0, as I have said before though, I think really, the future lies in the hybrid approach, combining a low latency RISC SoC with dual FPGA's, which is exactly what Replay 2 is, at least until we see 1 million LE dual FPGA boards under 300 £$E, which is what, 10 years away?, So hybrid is perfect until then, imagine the perfect blend of Replay OS, Analogue Pocket and MiSTer, so a powerful hybrid FPGA/RISC platform that can be used as a handheld, and docked like a Switch, the dock could have an extra FPGA that works like a RetroTink 4K, I'd also love to see better audio quality, such as RetroTink equivalent for audio, being able to upsample the N64 to 176.8Khz 16-Bit (that's a proper integer for N64 audio) would be amazing, so many good soundtracks on the N64, just listen to the Banjo Kazooie and Tooie remastered XBA ports on the 360 to hear just how good the N64 sound-banks sound when re/upsampled.
I think a good quality audio DSP that works natively with the FPGA platform is what would work best, that can resample in real-time, and let you play any retro system with up to DSD512 audio, the MiSTer is amazing, but it has very sterile and synthetic sounding audio, not the devs fault, it's down to the piss poor ADC, and only having the FPGA to replicate the original analogue oscillators, MiSTer would be incredible if it had some beefy analogue multi-clock VCO's for all the different systems it supports, especially the more hardcore arcade cabs, the FPGA just canny do those justice, the DE10 Nano was never meant for decent sound output though, let alone replicating Hi-Fi audio hardware, and the actual audio processing side of things is already really well done, near bit-perfect in fact (like the nuked Mega Dive and Neo Geo cores), it's just the way the audio is handled after being processed that leaves something to be desired, kind of like the GBA, the CPU itself outputs beautiful synth audio, it's just the low-res DAC that completely destroys it, GBA games on the GC GBA player sound incredible, better than the SNES even, the GBA also has access to the OG GB's chiptune sound hardware, and uses it to awsome effect in some games, maybe we will even get an FPGA platform that uses a real synth ASIC with multiple sound-banks and synth modes, depending on which console or arcade cab it is, a real ASIC & DSP would be so sweet, they have already cracked this with a fork of the BlastEm Mega-Drive soft-emulator, that uses SPI communication for real-time FM-Synth via a real OPL3 synth ASIC, and it sounds glorious on a decent sound setup, I love the idea of using multiple sound-banks with different systems too, like using the GB sound-fonts for SNES games, or real-time PSG or FM with the SNES, or a full-fat MIDI soundbank in real-time for the N64/PS1, and so on.
For now though, nothing beats MiSTer with a CRT, or MiSTer with an OLED & Tink4K can be a great substitute, the Analogue Pocket is a really sweet bit of kit too, and has actually really nailed the sound quality for some systems, like the NGPC sounds batsh** good on the Pocket, as does the GB & GBC, much better than the MiSTer, partly due to using real game carts, but also the fine-tuned EQ by FireBrandX, his work on the Mega-Drive Analogue console sounds so good, and even though MiSTer's nuked SMD core is much more accurate to a model one MD on the FPGA side (bit perfect in fact), the DAC and EQ of the Analogue SMD manages to sound much better, even when you hook your MiSTer up to a decent DAC, only so much you can do when the EQ isn't there (the Analogue SMD is also clocked at the original sample rate, and not just rounded up), you can really improve things with a DSP, but you can't really change the main character of the sterile sounding digital sound the DE10 Nano ADC puts out, for a significant improvement, the audio needs to be handled by a decent ADC that can handle multiple clock/sample-rates, some of Terasic's FPGA platforms have modular ADC modules, would be so dope if I could just drop in a decent 80/90's ADC board into the MiSTer build, with some nice phat VCO's and decent swappable opamps (depending on the system cores you play), at least MiSTer lets you use custom sound hardware with the Amiga and AO486 cores (recommend the Dreamblaster XG16, man I'd frickin love it if that worked with arcade and console cores too).
I've found for the best case scenario audio wise with MiSTer, is to install an i2s HDMI sound-module with a PLL, and to go from there, that is plugged it into a decent receiver, this will give you lossless audio and pass-through whatever the MiSTer is putting out at its best, a receiver with a good DSP for EQ is also a good idea, with low/high-pass filters, treble/bass/gain, would be dope if someone made a MiSTer console with a HQ DSP, Pre-AMP & DAC built in with pre-tunes EQ profiles out of the box, a decent HP-AMP would be nice too.
Overall, I'm really excited for the future of FPGA, even the near future, we have the Multi-Console 2.0 coming out, Taki's MiSTer handheld (gonna be dope for listing to real-time synth music albums, the AP is awsome for chiptune albums like some bangers from Bit-Shifter, was actually made on an AP with Nanoloop, which I love for making music with, no one has yet made the ideal portable real-time synth playback device, a SynthMan as it were, that can playback real PSG, FM, MIDI, sequenced music samples, keygen style tracker music and so on, I'd make a dope little ROM cart slot for it too, so artists can release their albums on a decent ROM cart format (low latency ROM chips won't stretch/warp/mess up audio timings), till then though (it will never happen lol), the Pocket is the best portable real-time synth music device, it has a really decent HP-AMP, I'd also love to see Taki team up with Marseille, the makers of the mClassic, as despite the stupid new ones they put out, the original is actually really damn good with 3D 480p graphics, it will take 480p and scale it up to really nice looking 1440p, on par with a real GPU going from low-medium 480p, to medium-high 1440p, it works wonders with the N64, Dreamcast, PS2, Wii, Switch, it is actually crazy how much better the Switch looks when set to 720p, being upscaled to 1440p on a CRT or OLED monitor, it cleans up all the edges, upsamples the colour depth, it's amazing tbh, all Marseille needs to do is do some R&D to produce a mClassic 20 with upgraded edge AA, they should also add in subpixel-rendering up to 8to1 subpixel rendering, it could be an incredible device, especially if they keep it under 100 bucks, and it would be awsome if Taki's MiSTer console had an improved mClassic chipset built in out of the box.
Yes latency will always be a factor in software emulation. Hence MiSTer!
@@VideoGameEsoterica I think the OG reason I wanted a MiSTer was for the CRT support, as trying to get decent 15Khz CRT quality and frame-time pacing from a PC is a bit of a joke, it's easier just to go with S-Video from an older GPU, but your limited to 480i, so I was pretty shocked to see that MiSTer's 240p RGB was basically immaculate looking, not to mention the same bare-metal performance as the OG hardware, which prior to owning a MiSTer, I had no idea was even possible, I've loved MiSTer and FPGA ever since, and it just gets better every year tbh.
The CRT support on MiSTer is second to none
OG hardware and software will always be relevant with the niche, nostalgia and collector audience....but the hype train with this has run its course. There are way too many alternative ways available to play and experience these games that don't require the og hardware like before.
I think the biggest change you'll see in future with "retro gaming" is that you will see less people with bookshelves full of games, boxed hardware and other stuff showing off on TH-cam and social media.
The people with collections will be the people that already got this stuff when it was a lot more affordable or have a justification in having their collections because it's big part of their brand/channel. People can vicariously have the experience of owning this stuff through TH-cam videos or looking up some online database.
Surrogacy, simulation, emulation, replication, and a reproduction of the real thing/experience will be more relevant in the future...that's not only with video games but with other things as well.
Def got all mine when it was affordable haha. Or stuff I get now that nobody else cares about
ALL I WANT IS ZAPAROO SUPPORT ON ORIGINAL HARDWARE !
That would be a fun pivot on the project
I think the same as you, I sold my collection a while ago and I have a mister fpga from mister addons, even the same pink color as yours, I have it connected to a morph 4k, which I also use for a PS2 fat modified with a retro gem, and with that plus a modified Nintendo switch I already have the whole retro scene, I'm missing Dreamcast for FPGA, but luckily we already have SuperSega, hahaha, greetings from Spain, what a shameful character of the retro scene Mr. Alejandro represents Spain xD
“We have SuperSEGA” 🤣
MiSTer is just more convenient and better value for the money than even modding one console with HDMI with a flash cart. Also emulators for Dreamcast and newer systems have gotten really good also. I really only buy games I really love and consoles (mostly prototypes and rare stuff) to collect
Yes by price it’s the clear winner
I think retro gaming is getting more popular in general. No doubt more and more people are deciding FPGA is "close enough" to the way OG hardware works that they no longer care to maintain several different ageing consoles. That said, YOU are partly responsible for this shift in how people currently play retro games. "If" I can play a game on FPGA based hardware versus software emulation, FPGA wins out most every time. Consoles such as PS2 and GC are starting to be referred to as "retro" these days and obviously no cores for either are out. If FPGA hardware that could play such games exists at all, it is financially out of reach for us mere mortals. I have read more than a few times that certain consoles would be impossible to run on the MiSTer hardware we all know (and love). Many of these claims of impossibility have been dispelled such as PS1, N64 and Saturn. I know the Saturn core isn't finished put based on the progress thus far, it WILL be finished. The FPGA developers never cease to amaze so, I never say newer consoles such as PS2 and GC are impossible. They may be highly impractical or even impossible based on today's FPGA hardware, but not impossible in the future. People that once relied on an abacus for calculations could not imagine a modern calculator much less a modern computer. All this said, there is a lot of good things happening with software emulation these days. I like to see PS2, PSP, GC and a few others upscaled to anywhere from twice to several times their original resolution. It was my desire to play NeoGeo on original hardware that brought me into the FPGA camp. I had picked up a consolized MVS setup before the core for NeoGeo was out for MiSTer hardware. One I learned a NeoGeo core was working, I bought my first MiSTer stack, put it in an aluminum case and have only started the MVS once since to compare. I can't tell any difference at all between the two so, it's "close enough" for me.
It’s getting more popular but real hardware seems to be getting less popular
Not me buying a Psx and then watching this haha. I’m one of the few like you. As well as pippin and everything else you have. It I agree I see the shift too
The Pippin dev unit actually moved on. It’s now with Neil and RMC on display at the Cave in the UK so more people can check it out
I like OG hardware but admittedly I don’t do game collecting, I just don’t see it as a worthwhile endeavor so I just use flash carts or ODEs. If I really wanted to, I can sell it all off for a MiSTER but I really like to see games running on the original hardware because that’s what they were made for and because I find old technology really interesting in general.
I’m a young guy so a lot of this stuff was before my time and I like vintage stuff in other “mediums” such as clothes and records, etc. I think I have a more intrigued lens on it than someone who grew up during its contemporary era and finds it kinda boring and unremarkable to own the old stuff because it doesn’t interest them anymore after so much saturation.
Lot of people saying they don’t really collect the games. I find that interesting. Not what I expected to hear
I feel like its all a matter of how much its costs to you. Old hardware can still be had for a huge bargain depending on where you live. I live in Tennessee and i have been extremely fortunate in the things ive been able to find for bargain bin prices. Ive been able to get heavy hitter games from wii, ps2, xbox 360, and more for literal dollars, and at least for me it hasnt been an expensive hobby for the most part. Also never sleep on the so called “junk” bin. Literally more than half of my collection sold as broken but worked perfectly fine with just a little cleaning. Storage also comes into play when you move up to ps3 and onwards. Buying a getting a cheap ps3 game will save you 25gb+ of storage space and wear and tear on your existing hard drives. Once ps4 becomes retro it probably wont be feasible to download 100gb+ files on an unstable connection for the average person, so cheap ps4 games would probably be a more desirable option (if they stay cheap)
Its all a matter of how much time and effort you invest in it. The people going overboard collecting full sets paying 60+ for games are wasting their money tbh. Unemulated Arcade hardware is probably the only thing worth the high asking price, but even then the amount of work you’d have to put in to have a working setup is asinine and the average person should just wait for mame to get around to it.
Yes “junk” means something wholly diff in Japan. Sometimes it’s just “kinda ugly”
Bring out some official retro consoles with support for save data would interest me. One of the reasons I don't buy retro consoles is because of the lack of ability to save game progress.
Yes that can always be tricky
The original hardware won't last forever so ultimately isn't the most important aspect of retro gaming. Documenting the hardware, and maintaining the existence of that documentation is probably the most important thing to do. Play the games via whatever method makes you happy.
Yes it’s a good thing we have replacements for the real hardware for basically everything now
I don't mind software emulation but it always just feels... off to me. Original hardware, ESPECIALLY Neo Geo is expensive but I appreciate it more. Something always feels like its going wrong whenever I emulate
I guess it just depends on what emulator you are using
also enhancements in emulators always have made me feel weird, especially the low res hud elements over the 3D graphics