I think there's a good out-of-universe explanation for Kibitoshin defusing. During Battle of Gods, Toriyama made a beautiful art piece depicting almost the entire relevant cast, including Shin. It wouldn't be unreasonable to speculate that, in Toriyama's mind, Kibitoshin defused before Battle of Gods, but the anime staff did not get the memo, so either Toriyama, Toyotarô, or the anime staff came up with the workaround defusing method we were told of in Super when they got to that bridge, since Shin had to return as a relevant character as the Kaiôshin of Universe 7.
it actually makes sense that them being inside of buu would make them defuse. It also make sense that potara fusions for mortals only last an hour. I'm glad we have both of these methods, making them not retconned because they both actually make sense
It makes no sense actually. Gotenks lost its fusion inside of buu due to time limitations and nothing else, since unlike Vegito, Gotenks remained fused for the entirety of the time limit. You could say that buu only affects potara fusions, but that would be weird that buus magic only affects the potara fusion, leaving the dance and namekian merging out of the equation.
That's cause potara relies on an item that is the potara earing while the dances and namekian fusion don't rely on anything... At least that's my theory@@oldmanjesus9855
@@oldmanjesus9855 potato fusion is a divine technique, while the metamoran fusion is a technique of the yardrats. seeing how buu is pure evil magical being, it makes sense that his body would reject godly fusions like the potara
The real answer is that Toriyama did not write the Dragon Ball Super anime, so the one our thing is toe animations idea. Toriyama himself always intended for the fusion to be permanent which is consistent with him having a much larger role in writing Dragon Ball Daima. So the Dragon Ball Super anime was the retcon, Dragon Ball Daima's version is the original idea from the writer himself
So is Daima non-canon? If it is, then Goku saw supreme Kai and kibito defused before asking how they defused in super. We have 3 separate explanations…
It was stated that due to Zamasu not being a full fledged Kai yet, only being an apprentice, that this fusion was not permanent. Although that could just be manga continuity.
there is only one method. stop acting like it's not a retcon. Now the potala fusion is eternal and only a demon's gas can defuse it. The mental gymnastics of dbs fans is impressive
it could be because fat Buu is technically the Grand Supreme Kai which would mean that’s white magic, but then again it is Buu which should be evil but who knows it could have been both White and Black
2:28 I’m def one of the fans who theorized SSJ Vegito decided in Super Buu’s body, long b4 DB Super & Daima was created. We only had KAI. This wasn’t a theory, it was based on Kaioshin “ki” energy & Majin Buu “ki” energy do not mix. It caused adverse affects/ effects. For example the Potarra earrings are composed of Kaioshin “ki” energy. Inside Majin Buu’s body is its own Universe. Mainly comprised of Majin Evil “ki” energy. Governed by laws rules & regulations even Super Buu is unaware of.
Also, clearly they forgot about that one part in the DBS Manga where they were still fused until they gathered the Namekian Dragon Balls for Champa and Vados, and just asked to be separated after Champa and Vados left because they weren't looking for the Namekian Dragon Balls. The Elder Kai even asked how they could unfuse, but is it because he wasn't with them and they fuse back later?
@MajinBird Well, it's just speculation but Goku is presumably limited to ssj3 and Vegeta to ssj2. If they need to power up they can't push past their limits because it could potentially break cannon unless it is somewhat convoluted. The show has a strong focus on the Kaioshin and Makaiō, and fusion is a tool of theirs. With Shin around, he has the potaras to offer to Goku and Vegeta if they can't handle a threat. I assume they are keeping with Gogeta only in the movies trend. I don't know if there examples of them bringing up the potaras randomly without using them. There were two potaras fusions in DBS. It's also suspicious to me that the show made sure Vegeta will eventually tag along. Of course, I could be wrong, but after hearing the logic and effort they went through to explain another nuance about the potaras, it hit me that they might have wrote them in again. Actually, one sneaky way to hint at it would be to show promotional material with Shin not wearing his potaras. I haven't checked to see that, maybe later.
Yeah this is the big problem with the Buu stomach idea. It's supposing that some ancient evil somehow happened to have a hidden, unintended feature that defused a Potara fusion, but only if absorbed, and wouldn't defuse Metamoran(?) fusion under the same circumstances. It's a bunch of super specific plot convenience to get rid of the only downside to Potara, and likely the only reason Vegito didn't just kill Buu and abuse Namekian/Earth dragon balls to revive people before using them to defuse himself. Saying "because magic" was just faster at the moment, and Toriyama probably wanted Goku on the final fight and not Vegito. Saying it just had a time limit for mortals is not only clearer, but also allows Vegito to be used with a more exploitable weakness.
@freetheost potara is based on Kai magic, while the fusion dance is based on a metamoran technique. One uses magic to keep the two combined regardless of power discrepancy, while the other is a technique that requires the power levels to be equal and the poses to be perfect.
@@anakomaru Going on magic versus technique is opening up an entirely new can of worms. Is Elder Namekian's potential unlocking magic? Namekian fusion? Namekian splitting? Elder Kai's potential surpassing? It was implied that Kais can just do things like heal, teleport, or create because they're gods, but splitting hairs between what is and isn't magic makes the Buu split more convenient and complicated than it already was.
It’s a new timeline as we can obviously see it contradicts what they showed in both super versions of the story manga and anime… so another timeline 🤷🏾♂️ not a big mystery… yes the story is a retcon but I just look at everything that doesn’t connect as a new timeline to soften the blow of canon since dragon ball creators don’t care about canon at all
I think there's a good out-of-universe explanation for Kibitoshin defusing. During Battle of Gods, Toriyama made a beautiful art piece depicting almost the entire relevant cast, including Shin. It wouldn't be unreasonable to speculate that, in Toriyama's mind, Kibitoshin defused before Battle of Gods, but the anime staff did not get the memo, so either Toriyama, Toyotarô, or the anime staff came up with the workaround defusing method we were told of in Super when they got to that bridge, since Shin had to return as a relevant character as the Kaiôshin of Universe 7.
it actually makes sense that them being inside of buu would make them defuse. It also make sense that potara fusions for mortals only last an hour. I'm glad we have both of these methods, making them not retconned because they both actually make sense
I agree with this
It makes no sense actually. Gotenks lost its fusion inside of buu due to time limitations and nothing else, since unlike Vegito, Gotenks remained fused for the entirety of the time limit. You could say that buu only affects potara fusions, but that would be weird that buus magic only affects the potara fusion, leaving the dance and namekian merging out of the equation.
That's cause potara relies on an item that is the potara earing while the dances and namekian fusion don't rely on anything... At least that's my theory@@oldmanjesus9855
@@oldmanjesus9855 potato fusion is a divine technique, while the metamoran fusion is a technique of the yardrats. seeing how buu is pure evil magical being, it makes sense that his body would reject godly fusions like the potara
@thepersoninsideyourcloset1 Metamoran Fusion were invented by the Metamorans, not the Yardrats.
The real answer is that Toriyama did not write the Dragon Ball Super anime, so the one our thing is toe animations idea. Toriyama himself always intended for the fusion to be permanent which is consistent with him having a much larger role in writing Dragon Ball Daima. So the Dragon Ball Super anime was the retcon, Dragon Ball Daima's version is the original idea from the writer himself
The issue is that Kibitokai previously stated that they wished on the DBs to defuse
Except they use the potara again (because of a crucial event) and then have to resort later to the namekian dragon balls, because Buu is napping.
So is Daima non-canon? If it is, then Goku saw supreme Kai and kibito defused before asking how they defused in super. We have 3 separate explanations…
1:41 That's because Zamasu was a Kai, so if one of the fusee is a Kai then the two won't separate. Like with the Elder Supreme Kai and that witch.
It was stated that due to Zamasu not being a full fledged Kai yet, only being an apprentice, that this fusion was not permanent. Although that could just be manga continuity.
@@memersnas8684Zamasu was a full fledged Kai, he was being an apprentice to become a Supreme Kai.
there is only one method. stop acting like it's not a retcon.
Now the potala fusion is eternal and only a demon's gas can defuse it.
The mental gymnastics of dbs fans is impressive
Didn’t Buu heal the blind kid and also his dog? Wouldn’t that make his magic white magic?
@@pamendez3 this is a good point
it could be because fat Buu is technically the Grand Supreme Kai which would mean that’s white magic, but then again it is Buu which should be evil but who knows it could have been both White and Black
thats the grand supreme kai magic not buu
@@sonictheman06 its both. we learn that when evil buu split they had 2 different ki 1 normal and 1 god for the supreme kai
@@Neuvillete4.6 yea you’re right so yea it’s both
Another better question is, how did Gotenks not de fuse immediately after being absorbed.
the mental gymnastics dragon ball fans be doing to make sense of the bad writing is impressive
Actually dbs retconned the original manga. daima is 100% made by the creator himself so it's simply the correct explanation in daima
2:28 I’m def one of the fans who theorized SSJ Vegito decided in Super Buu’s body, long b4 DB Super & Daima was created. We only had KAI.
This wasn’t a theory, it was based on Kaioshin “ki” energy & Majin Buu “ki” energy do not mix. It caused adverse affects/ effects. For example the Potarra earrings are composed of Kaioshin “ki” energy. Inside Majin Buu’s body is its own Universe. Mainly comprised of Majin Evil “ki” energy. Governed by laws rules & regulations even Super Buu is unaware of.
😢 I don't know why it doesn't hit like it used to..
... I clicked and watched this video two times and because I forgot 💀
They defuse from the gas time limit and wishing it to defuse
I thought they just reconned the time limit thing altogether😂
I always took it as Universe 7 and 10 having different potara.
Also, clearly they forgot about that one part in the DBS Manga where they were still fused until they gathered the Namekian Dragon Balls for Champa and Vados, and just asked to be separated after Champa and Vados left because they weren't looking for the Namekian Dragon Balls. The Elder Kai even asked how they could unfuse, but is it because he wasn't with them and they fuse back later?
I've read the first 5 parts of the DBS Manga already and I don't plan on stopping.
I believe Kai’s are beings that are still learning just like humans
Y didn’t gotenks defuse immediately then
Question is would vegetia's spirit fission udo the the fushion.
Do the demon kais have black magic earrings
vegito could have defused from the time limit though too
They plan on using Vegito in this show too.
@@juicebowl what makes you say that?
@MajinBird Well, it's just speculation but Goku is presumably limited to ssj3 and Vegeta to ssj2. If they need to power up they can't push past their limits because it could potentially break cannon unless it is somewhat convoluted.
The show has a strong focus on the Kaioshin and Makaiō, and fusion is a tool of theirs. With Shin around, he has the potaras to offer to Goku and Vegeta if they can't handle a threat. I assume they are keeping with Gogeta only in the movies trend. I don't know if there examples of them bringing up the potaras randomly without using them. There were two potaras fusions in DBS.
It's also suspicious to me that the show made sure Vegeta will eventually tag along.
Of course, I could be wrong, but after hearing the logic and effort they went through to explain another nuance about the potaras, it hit me that they might have wrote them in again.
Actually, one sneaky way to hint at it would be to show promotional material with Shin not wearing his potaras. I haven't checked to see that, maybe later.
I never really cared that much that the potara had a time limit. I mean, it did make some sense because Gotenks didn't defuse when he got absorbed.
Yeah this is the big problem with the Buu stomach idea. It's supposing that some ancient evil somehow happened to have a hidden, unintended feature that defused a Potara fusion, but only if absorbed, and wouldn't defuse Metamoran(?) fusion under the same circumstances. It's a bunch of super specific plot convenience to get rid of the only downside to Potara, and likely the only reason Vegito didn't just kill Buu and abuse Namekian/Earth dragon balls to revive people before using them to defuse himself. Saying "because magic" was just faster at the moment, and Toriyama probably wanted Goku on the final fight and not Vegito.
Saying it just had a time limit for mortals is not only clearer, but also allows Vegito to be used with a more exploitable weakness.
@freetheost potara is based on Kai magic, while the fusion dance is based on a metamoran technique. One uses magic to keep the two combined regardless of power discrepancy, while the other is a technique that requires the power levels to be equal and the poses to be perfect.
@@anakomaru Going on magic versus technique is opening up an entirely new can of worms. Is Elder Namekian's potential unlocking magic? Namekian fusion? Namekian splitting? Elder Kai's potential surpassing? It was implied that Kais can just do things like heal, teleport, or create because they're gods, but splitting hairs between what is and isn't magic makes the Buu split more convenient and complicated than it already was.
Consider that we find out buu has god ki from grand kai it could have also bin the God ok being to much
It’s a new timeline as we can obviously see it contradicts what they showed in both super versions of the story manga and anime… so another timeline 🤷🏾♂️ not a big mystery… yes the story is a retcon but I just look at everything that doesn’t connect as a new timeline to soften the blow of canon since dragon ball creators don’t care about canon at all
Buu being the cause for the defusion was not a fan theory. It was directly stated in the series by the characters.
i think they ask dragon separate them
Max video 360p my guy
goku black is still a kai juat a mortal one
Still make goku dumb and forgetful
Daima > Super