I'm seeing alot of people saying different things. About Both NCR and Legion. And I'd just like to say it's neat that so many people played the same game and had such vividly differing experiences from just the NPC combat mechanics themselves.
NCR fan: Man we should crush the legion at the dam look at this npc combat Legion fan: If we’ve gotten this far with inferior weaponry and don’t win in straight combat then that must mean the legion is strategically genius to get so far. Non biased fan: It could be npc combat isn’t 100% accurate, but the NCR is in general better armed while the legion has been shown to show tactics making it a relatively even fight.
the thing is, the ncr is very lazy and don't want to spend any energy, so they send their worst to die and keep their best in the cushiest places possible
They spent so much more time on the NCR and it really shows lol. Fighting legion never felt that challenging especially when you compare them to the enclave vs Swamp People.
@@acesaylor204 A couple of brush guns are intimidating but NCR 30+ carry an antimaterial rifle and a Minigun. That's alot more Dam and DPS than what the Legion have access to, also thermic lance has natural debuffs to certain types of armor unlike the antimaterial rifle.
@jumbo Ehhh yeah I guess you have a point there, mass producing under-trained troops could be a problem when dealing with the legion, but then again if we're talking irl and let's just say that the NCR instead took the time to train there men correctly I genuinely doubt legion armor is going to defend them from people with rifles
@jumbo it still depends on the situation. NCR soldiers aren't nearly as disciplined or well you could say brainwashed. The legion is essentially the japanese imperial army if they were funded compared to an over strecthed NCR army. But 1 on 1 it depends if it's a newbie ncr trooper or a more experienced one cuz a newbie would be scared shitless. But when you have an army of furries and psychos wearing steel armour that somehow can't be easily pierced by a 5.56 round it's pretty clear who is gonna win when there's no escape. But you see each sides would adapt unlike the NPCs that just wins based on equipment and stats.
Seems to me like Legion does a lot of powerattack-esque slow animations so their attacks are slower and they have way less dps even in match ups where they should have a possibility to win like recruits vs trooper. the NCR just lay down constant fire so dps is more consistent. probably obvious tho
Semi-auto rifles en masse from range are incredibly OP both in game and in real life so that does check out. The Legion seems to do slow attacks as you said and that leads to them getting staggered under a hail of bullets.
guns >>>>>>>> melee, idk why they made the legion so dumb in this regard, and pretend they're supposed to be intimidating when they're just glorified tribals/raiders. Even the slavers in Fo3 were scarier than any legion army. Oh no please don't throw any more pointy sticks at me, my NCR power/riot armor cant hand another.
The legion favors using spears and melee (they use guns too but not nearly as much) I’m surprised they don’t use bow and arrows either lmao. They also consider long range weapons as cowardly
well yes this makes sense due to the ai being a bit old and melee based enimies getting a bit confused and the main reason the legion is so good at fighting the NCR is due to their tactics, the way they can demoralize the enemy and scare them, they also use ambushes so that also gives then another advantage, but in a 1v1 fair ground 20 paces battle they will have some problems
@jumbo 86 tribes in the span of 40 years compared to the nation pushing their centennial and is mostly industrialized? Equal in number? Yeah maybe in the Mojave where the NCR is using the "bear" minimum
@jumbo I wouldn't say better equipped considering the legion are scavengers Training doesn't mean shit if you're hit with 5.56 cause even from the varmint that has enough stopping power to stop a person
@jumbo so you're making stuff up now The service rifle can fire over 70 rounds before breaking which should be plenty The NCR retreated after stopping the first wave because it was outnumbered and even then the delaying force bought enough time to rig a city to explode Destroying the legates army while losing 105 soldiers in the process The legion wasted a rad bomb on a town if little strategic importance that's only use was watching cottonwood cove Nelson is a terrible spot to defend Golf holds if you don't do anything there so not sure what you mean about the legion takes it The legion gets stalled several times during the battle (sniper, forcefield) which only brings the main army ever closer to the Mojave who thanks to the NCR's motorization are probably bringing trucks So no it's not likely they win or are even better soldiers considering that they have a ranger locked up malnourished and abused in the fort yet no one can kill her
@jumbo the NCR emphasizes gun so it's very likely that troopers can hit at least 6 of their 20 rounds which being realistic is all you need to stop someone charging And anyone injured can be healed because the NCR doesn't huff herbs to fix bullet wounds
Why is he scared? He has an army of invincible ghosts that shoots down anyone with rays of light, not to mention the mysterious blood red cloud that began to roll across the mojave and then west to the Republic, that no one knew where it came from, only that it brought death in it's wake
I never understood why Obsidian didn't give most of the Legion service rifles or some kind of military rifle seeing as how the service rifles are from hundreds of years ago and if the legion somehow has football pads from before the war why couldn't they have just raided an armory in the vast amounts of territory they have.
philosophy: caesar deemed firearms an unnecessary tool in combat that any real warrior should not have to rely on, which is why legion recruits must prove they are efficient in hand to hand combat and be promoted to be granted the right to use firearms.
@@joshuagrahamnationalist your not wrong consider when north of wolfpack ranch or something name like east of nipton a bunch recruit Legion i kill don't firearms instead it's machete and throwing spears
@@joshuagrahamnationalist He only came up with that philosophy in the first place because firearms were such a scarce resource in his part of America. The legion doesn’t have the same level of industry (being a conglomerate of formerly feudalistic tribes and some likely not all to advanced tributary towns/cities) as the NCR to produce their own firearms so most have to scavenged, making each gun almost as valuable as the Legionary wielding it.
All of Service Rifles found in the Mojave are produced by gun runners. The same is for 9mm pistols, SMGs, Battle Rifles and so on since its standart NCR equipment.
This is why the Legion wasn't immediately going into a headlong assault, the average person in sports equipment wielding a machete is going to die from a person with a gun. They don't win by sheer brute strength, Graham's plan was actually based around that fact, that the average Legion soldier was likely to die, so why not send them in first to whittle down the NCR's best, after all guns take up a lot more resources than machetes In a war of attrition, the Legion really shines, it is why opting for that was a TERRIBLE idea on Oliver's part. Now, the NCR has been bled dry, they are understaffed and are running out of resources, meanwhile The Legion avoids over-exerting themselves by setting up bases across the wastes, targets their moral with showcases of brutality and plans to assassinate their president, and even infiltrating their ranks The average NCR force can eradicate the average Legion force, it is in numbers, strategy, and resources that The Legion succeeds
its actually really stupid tbh. Manpower is a commodity that any post-apocalypse nation would not be able to afford to toss away. Bullets are far far cheaper than bodies. But this isn't represented in-game afaik
@@deathdealer312 Yes but no. Neither of them is post apocalyptic in the immediate sense - both sides of the conflict are 200 some odd years removed from the apocalypse. They are in more of a recovery phase dark age at this point than the immediate scarcity of the direct world ending event. As such, and more compellingly tbh, the conflict is more doctrinal than simply survival. Where the NCR would probably struggle a great deal to implement a draft, which would probably splinter their nation in factions even further, the Legion territories are basically in a perpetual state of draft as a matter of course. The legion is clearly old school in that, while for reasons they can't show in game, they'd almost certainly be using child soldiers readily - just like pretty much any other armed force in antiquity while the NCR values place it firmly with or more western aversion to doing that sort of thing. Boys as young as 12 would be pushed to the front (it's actually where the notion of cannon fodder came from). It's hard to replace skilled trained professional soldiers absolutely but it takes 9 months to replace someone you don't give a damn about. Also they have a slave empire - they'd be pumping out kids non-stop for all labour tasks. It only seems wild to us today because we can't imagine it but with all our western populations below the point of replacement we'd actually be stomped pretty readily by a motivated enemy force with a higher rate of replacement. Hell it's pretty much what drove coalition forces out of the middle east in the end - you can't fight the tide with a sand castle no matter how well you arm it. The really absurdly dangerous part of the legion though isn't that or the numbers. It's the indoctrination and by extension frumentari. NCR intelligence, much like our modern intelligence bodies, have a great deal of difficulty infiltrating and dealing with theocratic zealots like North Korea, the Taliban, or ISIS forces etc. we are basically at the mercy of sheer chance that we get a defector. Caeser effectively installed himself as a messianic figure. He's more than just a leader and emperor - he's a god-king. As a result the loyal see their place at his side as divinely ordained, and those who do not are simply purged. Consequently they are really good at policing themselves and ferreting out foreign agent infiltrators or their own compromised individuals. The frumentari have effectively infiltrated NCR forces while NCR intel is brick walled. From a strategic stand point that's a pretty untenable situation in many ways - your plans are compromised and countered with no way to answer your enemy's in the region. Lastly that indoctrination is nation wide. For better or worse (i.e. falling apart in the absence of Caeser) the Legion has a concrete solid backing to their war effort with -AT LEAST- 87 tribes (if the unique armor dropped by one of the Marked Men you create if you send the lonesome road bomb towards the legion) all subjugated and devoted to the taking of the dam and the Mojave around it. They have solid policy machine backing their war effort behind those frontlines. Meanwhile the NCR politics are clearly fractured just by one the very nature of their form of government, and secondly who knows how many Frumentari or just Legion sympathizers behind the lines of the NCR at the Mojave. Heck Ulysses even speculates ALL of the Couriers may well have been frumentari agents given Caeser's orders to leave them all unmolested. The NCR situation in the Mojave is absolutely dire, regardless of the game AI and technical limitations failing to really convey the sheer gravity of how out numbered and under supplied the NCR is compared to the Legion.
Not that far in but goddamn that NCR trooper exceeded my expectations. I thought the recruit was going to mop the floor with him as I've seen in most my playthroughs, however not only did the recruit turn into swiss cheese, he bloody swamped a cazador!!
Holy cow! We are almost at 700 views and we just hit 100 subs!!! Thank you guys so much for everything. I plan on making videos for a loooooong time to come so stay tuned everyone :) If you liked this video dont forget to check out some of my other NPC battles on my channel :)
I love the Legion so much. Sure they may be violent bloodthirsty warmongers and slavers, but at least they're up and front about themselves. No fancy wording or trying to convince everyone they're paragons of virtue. Nope, they live by the mindset of, "we're invading. If you have what it takes you'll win, if not you'll join us. We're going to bring order to earth, wether you want it or not"
Lol wut they always hide being virtue and philosophical nonsense about "heleegee dialectuuu" talk about traditionalist nonsense and call others degenerates and virtue signal about drug use and gambling and in fact destroyed a whole city over it pretending to be paragons of virtue. Also ceasar pretending to be the descendant of gods and manifest destiny. They have their own philosophy like the rest of the tribes but I see people actually believe their own nonsense without looking at the political philosophies of fallout because you have the same type of brain tumor as ceasar salad being less intelligent than snuffles the mole rat. People buy into the propaganda of each tribe which is why I opt to go for true independent endings because I see nonsense from all sides
They literally try to claim the moral high ground by considering themselves more civilized and calling others degenerates. Even Legion fans try their best to prove the Legion isn't just a group of bloodthirsty warmongers and slavers.
Yeah I mean they literally take away the rights of other humans, murder and brutality execute thousands of innocents just because they can, are hardcore sexists, and are dumber than rocks but hey at least they’re honest about it. What’s not to love about them?
I appreciate the legion in game being characterized as primarily using guerilla warfare and terror tactics, cause with their focus on melee and Caesar's disdain for more advanced technology, they're pretty screwed in a flat out assault. In a gameplay sense, melee is of course viable, but from a lore perspective and if you're trying to be even a bit realistic, a well equipped unit can literally mow down a small army of dudes with machetes. The legion taking pretty much every opportunity to weaken and demoralize the NCR is about the only thing that makes them a threat, that and the pretty extreme conditioning they get. That conditioning gives them a massive psychological advantage and makes it pretty much impossible for NCR to try and infiltrate the Legion. The distinct difference between how the two have to fight each other, as well as a lot of other world building and the thought behind everything is probably why it's still one of my favourite rpgs.
The legion plays to its strengths, mobility, stealth and adaptability, they sabotage, demoralize and ambush, utilize overwhelming numbers or underhanded tactics. In a way it feels like a parallel to the difference between pre war US and China, the legion being China, with the difference that NCR doesn't have big quantities of proper power armor
Writers were too attached to their moronic idea from Van Buren and handhold the Legion.So every advantage the NCR should have is handwaved away by some bullshit excuse.
One of the praetorian guard mentioned they used fist weapon because guns are unreliable due to reloads and jams, the fight at 4:21 proved that Legion praetorian's combat doctrine actually holds in practical scenario.
The NCR veteran ranger vs praetorian should have just been the praetorian standing in the middle of the arena and then getting decapitated by a .50 BMG from somewhere offscreen.
Well, in a fight like this ncr troops with more advance weapons and armory definitely win. In the real battles Legion outnumbers NCR, so it is almost a tie.
Trained Grunt With a Semi-Automatic Assault Rifle and Actual Body Armor Fights Some Guy With a Machete Wearing Football Armor and a Skirt, What Happens Next Will Shock You
It's worth noting that the legion believes that using the best technology available (guns) creates a decadent civilization and they want to prove that you can still be a viable force in the world while only using primitive weapons, and they are willing to take higher casualties to do that.
But some legionaries in Caesar’s camp use those modern melee weapons and Caesar himself is dependent on auto doc. He even traded with van graffs for weapons
@@jacobwhitley3767 Caesar is 100% meant to be a hypocrite in the case of the auto-doc though, he absolutely would not let any regular member of the Legion use such a thing even if they needed it as desperately as he does.
I hope my npc battles of my channel will become so epic as yours! Nice job! I have also a question: how do you have the community option in your channel?
Cuz Cazadores aren't that durable. Cazadores are so dangerous because of their poisonous attacks. All you have to do is gun them down before they hit you.
Caesar: We lost first battle for the Dam using firearms. So nobody now uses firearms. Legionaries fighting mele weapons with firearmed people: ???????????????????? Legionaries couple years after, who just got accustomed to using mele, were suddenly swapped to firearms to fight: ?????????????????????????????????????????
Legion always felt easier in general to fight due to most of their soldiers not having good ranged weapons. NCR troops are easier in smaller groups than legion but when you have to fight 10 of them on extreme hardcore mode shit gets real
It sold it to me Legion fucks the NCR when I saw 2 Recruits take out 3 Mercenaries and 2 of those wandering traders 1 had just about 40% HP and a leg crippled the other was basically untouched
The main issue with ncr is they constantly switch weapons, have really crappy guns, and spend most of the fight spazzing out and running around in circles. If they literally just had a machete and charged and hit them and didnt stop they would win alot more.
Damn i forgot how bad the AI for melee combatants was in this game lol, legionary takes one light swing and waits 2 seconds like its a turn-based game XDDDD.
The legion assassins are the worst part about the legion. They come out of nowhere and are as deadly as anything. I Play on very hard, hardcore, so they may seem more deadly to me idk.. but making enemies with the legion is dangerous especially in early game.
Lol I promise its not. In fact I like both NCR and Legion equally, they both have good qualities and bad. When i do these NPC battles i usually use the 1st battle as the one i show in videos unless something crazy happens. Thanks for watching :)
@@RiotNpcBattles maybe it's something to do with squad sized numbers of units in a battle. Maybe the AI is bad at ranged to melee fights with multiple potential targets. Who knows.
The AI always acts dumb especially troopers at close range They swap targets way to often but in a 1v1 the service rifle packs a mean punch if the legionnaire isn't fast enough
@John Doe I mean let's be realistic the NCR isn't trying and we're told this by Hanlon If the NCR put more than the "bear" minimum they'd have won by now simply because their military is massive what we see in the Mojave is the conscripts
0:53 - That NCR Trooper is an absolute UNIT taking on a cazadore after defeating a legionary in single-combat.
Halfway to general already
Straight up. Not only did he tank a javelin to the chest, he kills one of the Mojave's most deadly animals afterwards. Man is the main character
Watching this for the first time and was just about to say that.
Cazadore is not that deadly literally shoot the big ass orange wing
Right? He needs to go to ranger school
I'm seeing alot of people saying different things. About Both NCR and Legion. And I'd just like to say it's neat that so many people played the same game and had such vividly differing experiences from just the NPC combat mechanics themselves.
I guess that's what makes the game so good :)
NCR fan: Man we should crush the legion at the dam look at this npc combat
Legion fan: If we’ve gotten this far with inferior weaponry and don’t win in straight combat then that must mean the legion is strategically genius to get so far.
Non biased fan: It could be npc combat isn’t 100% accurate, but the NCR is in general better armed while the legion has been shown to show tactics making it a relatively even fight.
in an enclosed space, it would have gone much better for the legion.
did that ncr trooper just kill a fucking cazador?
yes, yes he did
Give that man a medal For his balls of steel
@clauseblitz4682 i Guess it's because the Civ rangers act adopt a police force role
I want to see a whole army trying to kill the legendary bloatfly
100 easy Pete's vs deathclaw promontory
Not for gay
😅
NCR: We can’t take on the Legion they will destroy us!
*also NCR:*
I blame General Oliver.
the thing is, the ncr is very lazy and don't want to spend any energy, so they send their worst to die and keep their best in the cushiest places possible
They spent so much more time on the NCR and it really shows lol. Fighting legion never felt that challenging especially when you compare them to the enclave vs Swamp People.
Legion hit squads are always a bigger threat than the NCR ones
@@acesaylor204 A couple of brush guns are intimidating but NCR 30+ carry an antimaterial rifle and a Minigun. That's alot more Dam and DPS than what the Legion have access to, also thermic lance has natural debuffs to certain types of armor unlike the antimaterial rifle.
@jumbo cap tbh unless we're talking hand to hand lol
@jumbo Ehhh yeah I guess you have a point there, mass producing under-trained troops could be a problem when dealing with the legion, but then again if we're talking irl and let's just say that the NCR instead took the time to train there men correctly I genuinely doubt legion armor is going to defend them from people with rifles
@jumbo it still depends on the situation. NCR soldiers aren't nearly as disciplined or well you could say brainwashed. The legion is essentially the japanese imperial army if they were funded compared to an over strecthed NCR army. But 1 on 1 it depends if it's a newbie ncr trooper or a more experienced one cuz a newbie would be scared shitless. But when you have an army of furries and psychos wearing steel armour that somehow can't be easily pierced by a 5.56 round it's pretty clear who is gonna win when there's no escape. But you see each sides would adapt unlike the NPCs that just wins based on equipment and stats.
That first NCR soldier woke up and chose violence 😂
Seems to me like Legion does a lot of powerattack-esque slow animations so their attacks are slower and they have way less dps even in match ups where they should have a possibility to win like recruits vs trooper. the NCR just lay down constant fire so dps is more consistent. probably obvious tho
Semi-auto rifles en masse from range are incredibly OP both in game and in real life so that does check out. The Legion seems to do slow attacks as you said and that leads to them getting staggered under a hail of bullets.
guns >>>>>>>> melee, idk why they made the legion so dumb in this regard, and pretend they're supposed to be intimidating when they're just glorified tribals/raiders. Even the slavers in Fo3 were scarier than any legion army. Oh no please don't throw any more pointy sticks at me, my NCR power/riot armor cant hand another.
The legion favors using spears and melee (they use guns too but not nearly as much) I’m surprised they don’t use bow and arrows either lmao. They also consider long range weapons as cowardly
well yes this makes sense due to the ai being a bit old and melee based enimies getting a bit confused and the main reason the legion is so good at fighting the NCR is due to their tactics, the way they can demoralize the enemy and scare them, they also use ambushes so that also gives then another advantage, but in a 1v1 fair ground 20 paces battle they will have some problems
@jumbo they stomp them the same way the samurai fought the imperial army
They lose twice the men in small assaults
@jumbo 86 tribes in the span of 40 years compared to the nation pushing their centennial and is mostly industrialized? Equal in number? Yeah maybe in the Mojave where the NCR is using the "bear" minimum
@jumbo I wouldn't say better equipped considering the legion are scavengers
Training doesn't mean shit if you're hit with 5.56 cause even from the varmint that has enough stopping power to stop a person
@jumbo so you're making stuff up now
The service rifle can fire over 70 rounds before breaking which should be plenty
The NCR retreated after stopping the first wave because it was outnumbered and even then the delaying force bought enough time to rig a city to explode
Destroying the legates army while losing 105 soldiers in the process
The legion wasted a rad bomb on a town if little strategic importance that's only use was watching cottonwood cove
Nelson is a terrible spot to defend
Golf holds if you don't do anything there so not sure what you mean about the legion takes it
The legion gets stalled several times during the battle (sniper, forcefield) which only brings the main army ever closer to the Mojave who thanks to the NCR's motorization are probably bringing trucks
So no it's not likely they win or are even better soldiers considering that they have a ranger locked up malnourished and abused in the fort yet no one can kill her
@jumbo the NCR emphasizes gun so it's very likely that troopers can hit at least 6 of their 20 rounds which being realistic is all you need to stop someone charging
And anyone injured can be healed because the NCR doesn't huff herbs to fix bullet wounds
Schizo Elijah is shaking and crying rn
muh based legion
@@mullythebully5557 bases (femboys) legión
tbf in lore the ncr are pretty incompetent
Why is he scared? He has an army of invincible ghosts that shoots down anyone with rays of light, not to mention the mysterious blood red cloud that began to roll across the mojave and then west to the Republic, that no one knew where it came from, only that it brought death in it's wake
@@liamlinson7563 Their leaders in FNV are bad not the soldiers themselves
I never understood why Obsidian didn't give most of the Legion service rifles or some kind of military rifle seeing as how the service rifles are from hundreds of years ago and if the legion somehow has football pads from before the war why couldn't they have just raided an armory in the vast amounts of territory they have.
philosophy: caesar deemed firearms an unnecessary tool in combat that any real warrior should not have to rely on, which is why legion recruits must prove they are efficient in hand to hand combat and be promoted to be granted the right to use firearms.
A lot of Service Rifles are newly produced in the NCR by groups like the Gun Runners.
@@joshuagrahamnationalist your not wrong consider when north of wolfpack ranch or something name like east of nipton a bunch recruit Legion i kill don't firearms instead it's machete and throwing spears
@@joshuagrahamnationalist He only came up with that philosophy in the first place because firearms were such a scarce resource in his part of America. The legion doesn’t have the same level of industry (being a conglomerate of formerly feudalistic tribes and some likely not all to advanced tributary towns/cities) as the NCR to produce their own firearms so most have to scavenged, making each gun almost as valuable as the Legionary wielding it.
All of Service Rifles found in the Mojave are produced by gun runners. The same is for 9mm pistols, SMGs, Battle Rifles and so on since its standart NCR equipment.
The sounds effects of this video take me back to the era of classic TH-cam Poops and old meme videos. The days…
If only game AI didnt get befuddled by having more than three weapons on them at all times
cope
Or if when they attacked in melee, they didnt just stand there while getting shot in the head 13 times before their next swing lol
Perhaps with the veteran ranger one you could have made a second round where the ncr ranger is using the ranger sequioa or the anti material rifle
This video feels likes it’s from 2014.
So moral of the story is don't mess with someone in power armour
lol ncr power armor is more like trash put together powered by a battery
@@hittingwater4639 dude its legit just t-45 without a fusion core
How dare you call this mess of an armor power armor. NCR heavy troopers are virgins compared to the chad brotherhood of steel paladins
@@KeanuCheems aren't the heavy troopers basically wearing the corpses of said paladins
@@hittingwater4639 at least it isn't just some fuckin old American football Armor salvaged together
Schizo Elijah must be making a Chad VS Virgin meme about this and seething about too.
rent free
schizo elijah Is writing a bible to explain this
This is why the Legion wasn't immediately going into a headlong assault, the average person in sports equipment wielding a machete is going to die from a person with a gun. They don't win by sheer brute strength, Graham's plan was actually based around that fact, that the average Legion soldier was likely to die, so why not send them in first to whittle down the NCR's best, after all guns take up a lot more resources than machetes
In a war of attrition, the Legion really shines, it is why opting for that was a TERRIBLE idea on Oliver's part. Now, the NCR has been bled dry, they are understaffed and are running out of resources, meanwhile The Legion avoids over-exerting themselves by setting up bases across the wastes, targets their moral with showcases of brutality and plans to assassinate their president, and even infiltrating their ranks
The average NCR force can eradicate the average Legion force, it is in numbers, strategy, and resources that The Legion succeeds
its actually really stupid tbh. Manpower is a commodity that any post-apocalypse nation would not be able to afford to toss away. Bullets are far far cheaper than bodies. But this isn't represented in-game afaik
@@deathdealer312 Yes but no. Neither of them is post apocalyptic in the immediate sense - both sides of the conflict are 200 some odd years removed from the apocalypse. They are in more of a recovery phase dark age at this point than the immediate scarcity of the direct world ending event. As such, and more compellingly tbh, the conflict is more doctrinal than simply survival. Where the NCR would probably struggle a great deal to implement a draft, which would probably splinter their nation in factions even further, the Legion territories are basically in a perpetual state of draft as a matter of course. The legion is clearly old school in that, while for reasons they can't show in game, they'd almost certainly be using child soldiers readily - just like pretty much any other armed force in antiquity while the NCR values place it firmly with or more western aversion to doing that sort of thing. Boys as young as 12 would be pushed to the front (it's actually where the notion of cannon fodder came from). It's hard to replace skilled trained professional soldiers absolutely but it takes 9 months to replace someone you don't give a damn about. Also they have a slave empire - they'd be pumping out kids non-stop for all labour tasks. It only seems wild to us today because we can't imagine it but with all our western populations below the point of replacement we'd actually be stomped pretty readily by a motivated enemy force with a higher rate of replacement. Hell it's pretty much what drove coalition forces out of the middle east in the end - you can't fight the tide with a sand castle no matter how well you arm it.
The really absurdly dangerous part of the legion though isn't that or the numbers. It's the indoctrination and by extension frumentari. NCR intelligence, much like our modern intelligence bodies, have a great deal of difficulty infiltrating and dealing with theocratic zealots like North Korea, the Taliban, or ISIS forces etc. we are basically at the mercy of sheer chance that we get a defector. Caeser effectively installed himself as a messianic figure. He's more than just a leader and emperor - he's a god-king. As a result the loyal see their place at his side as divinely ordained, and those who do not are simply purged. Consequently they are really good at policing themselves and ferreting out foreign agent infiltrators or their own compromised individuals. The frumentari have effectively infiltrated NCR forces while NCR intel is brick walled. From a strategic stand point that's a pretty untenable situation in many ways - your plans are compromised and countered with no way to answer your enemy's in the region.
Lastly that indoctrination is nation wide. For better or worse (i.e. falling apart in the absence of Caeser) the Legion has a concrete solid backing to their war effort with -AT LEAST- 87 tribes (if the unique armor dropped by one of the Marked Men you create if you send the lonesome road bomb towards the legion) all subjugated and devoted to the taking of the dam and the Mojave around it. They have solid policy machine backing their war effort behind those frontlines. Meanwhile the NCR politics are clearly fractured just by one the very nature of their form of government, and secondly who knows how many Frumentari or just Legion sympathizers behind the lines of the NCR at the Mojave. Heck Ulysses even speculates ALL of the Couriers may well have been frumentari agents given Caeser's orders to leave them all unmolested. The NCR situation in the Mojave is absolutely dire, regardless of the game AI and technical limitations failing to really convey the sheer gravity of how out numbered and under supplied the NCR is compared to the Legion.
This was pretty good. Nice work.
Thank you so much for the comment! I appreciate it tons! More to come :)
and people say the legion would win without Courier intervention.
Maybe if the legion was entirely made up of praetorian guards XD. Thanks for the comment professor radio :)
I think it’s a lot more legionaries than NCR troops tho I think that’s why
The legion is higher trained the ncr are scared as shit they have more troopers
They would.
@Sergeant Arch Dornan haha same response
Not that far in but goddamn that NCR trooper exceeded my expectations. I thought the recruit was going to mop the floor with him as I've seen in most my playthroughs, however not only did the recruit turn into swiss cheese, he bloody swamped a cazador!!
Holy cow! We are almost at 700 views and we just hit 100 subs!!! Thank you guys so much for everything. I plan on making videos for a loooooong time to come so stay tuned everyone :) If you liked this video dont forget to check out some of my other NPC battles on my channel :)
We won't go quietly, the legion can count on that
great video! deserves way more views :)
Than you, thank you. More to come :)
It would have been cool if the legionaires were hard coded to just fearlessly melee charge
I love the Legion so much.
Sure they may be violent bloodthirsty warmongers and slavers, but at least they're up and front about themselves. No fancy wording or trying to convince everyone they're paragons of virtue.
Nope, they live by the mindset of, "we're invading. If you have what it takes you'll win, if not you'll join us. We're going to bring order to earth, wether you want it or not"
Lol wut they always hide being virtue and philosophical nonsense about "heleegee dialectuuu" talk about traditionalist nonsense and call others degenerates and virtue signal about drug use and gambling and in fact destroyed a whole city over it pretending to be paragons of virtue. Also ceasar pretending to be the descendant of gods and manifest destiny.
They have their own philosophy like the rest of the tribes but I see people actually believe their own nonsense without looking at the political philosophies of fallout because you have the same type of brain tumor as ceasar salad being less intelligent than snuffles the mole rat.
People buy into the propaganda of each tribe which is why I opt to go for true independent endings because I see nonsense from all sides
They literally try to claim the moral high ground by considering themselves more civilized and calling others degenerates. Even Legion fans try their best to prove the Legion isn't just a group of bloodthirsty warmongers and slavers.
Yeah I mean they literally take away the rights of other humans, murder and brutality execute thousands of innocents just because they can, are hardcore sexists, and are dumber than rocks but hey at least they’re honest about it. What’s not to love about them?
Keep coping in the comments Legion fans.
It won’t un-cancer your Caesar.
I appreciate the legion in game being characterized as primarily using guerilla warfare and terror tactics, cause with their focus on melee and Caesar's disdain for more advanced technology, they're pretty screwed in a flat out assault. In a gameplay sense, melee is of course viable, but from a lore perspective and if you're trying to be even a bit realistic, a well equipped unit can literally mow down a small army of dudes with machetes. The legion taking pretty much every opportunity to weaken and demoralize the NCR is about the only thing that makes them a threat, that and the pretty extreme conditioning they get. That conditioning gives them a massive psychological advantage and makes it pretty much impossible for NCR to try and infiltrate the Legion. The distinct difference between how the two have to fight each other, as well as a lot of other world building and the thought behind everything is probably why it's still one of my favourite rpgs.
Judging from this, how could the NCR lose to a bunch of cosplayers?
probably tactics, the NCR's generals seem more like politicians than career military men
The legion plays to its strengths, mobility, stealth and adaptability, they sabotage, demoralize and ambush, utilize overwhelming numbers or underhanded tactics.
In a way it feels like a parallel to the difference between pre war US and China, the legion being China, with the difference that NCR doesn't have big quantities of proper power armor
They say it in the game that the ncr is spread very thin. The legion on the other hand occupies less areas but are more concentrated.
Writers were too attached to their moronic idea from Van Buren and handhold the Legion.So every advantage the NCR should have is handwaved away by some bullshit excuse.
Guerrila tactics maybe
The sound affects got me crying 😭
The Good Ending.
Imagine the fight getting interrupted by some big pinko insects.
Tfw the ranger beats a legion vet even tho the ranger legit has a bolt action rifle and the vet a god damn marksman
if it were possible to dual wield in this game Id want the legion to be able to field a ballistic shield in their other hand
All the NCR has to do is have some decent artillery to dispense democracy.
One of the praetorian guard mentioned they used fist weapon because guns are unreliable due to reloads and jams, the fight at 4:21 proved that Legion praetorian's combat doctrine actually holds in practical scenario.
4:43 you should’ve use the falcon punch sound effect
So many memories from halo, wow, mortal combate. Absolute masterpiece.
I could never understand how the NCR was losing to these dudes who wear hub caps as armor....
They said themselves, the NCR are spread too thin. They gotta deal with Fiends, Powder Gangers, secure their camps and all.
Who cares about the legion, my man killed a cazador like it was nothing.
On my most recent play though a legion assassin squad chased me around camp mcarren and killed every NCR soldier outside.
An ncr veteran ranger without his sequoia aint a ranger
There should’ve been random encounters of fights like this.
If there is then lemme know :D
feels like this video was made in 2013, nope it was made in 2021.
First NCR trooper was a CHAD. First kills the legion recruit then makes a Cazador his bitch.
Only reason Vet Ranger lost is because of he got disarmed. Vet Rangers usually defwat most Lsgionaires in 1v1 with the exception of Lanius.
being disarmed 2 times these ranger vets suck lol
@@TrustaVII this is false
I've been patrolling the Mojave for so long that I can take on a Legionary and a Cazador
It's fair to say that NCR will win any ranged combat with the Legion, since they literally spec into melee over everything else.
In short ranged pretty sure legion win
The NCR veteran ranger vs praetorian should have just been the praetorian standing in the middle of the arena and then getting decapitated by a .50 BMG from somewhere offscreen.
The genius of Ceasar carries the legion
And the NCR system of government holds them back
“No energy weapons or power armor and somehow giving the NCR a tougher time than the Brotherhood ever did” doesn’t seem so accurate anymore lol
Well, in a fight like this ncr troops with more advance weapons and armory definitely win. In the real battles Legion outnumbers NCR, so it is almost a tie.
Most underrated fallout channel.
The NCR kicks ass they have more guns
The Legion fared a lot better than i expected.
I loved the halo sound effects
Legion suffers heavy losses.
Legate Lanius has entered the chat.
0:42
So Akihiko is NCR soldier
Trained Grunt With a Semi-Automatic Assault Rifle and Actual Body Armor Fights Some Guy With a Machete Wearing Football Armor and a Skirt, What Happens Next Will Shock You
these sound effects are so cringe
Ulysses said, " .... NCR are not new to war. "
It's worth noting that the legion believes that using the best technology available (guns) creates a decadent civilization and they want to prove that you can still be a viable force in the world while only using primitive weapons, and they are willing to take higher casualties to do that.
Based
But some legionaries in Caesar’s camp use those modern melee weapons and Caesar himself is dependent on auto doc. He even traded with van graffs for weapons
@@dickgrayson4237 They only allow high ranking Legionaries to use modern weapons. And Caesar himself depending on an Auto Doc is hypocrisy.
@@dickgrayson4237Not reliant doesn't mean they don't use them
@@jacobwhitley3767 Caesar is 100% meant to be a hypocrite in the case of the auto-doc though, he absolutely would not let any regular member of the Legion use such a thing even if they needed it as desperately as he does.
bros really said "1v1 on Rush"
Does it have to be full of loud, obnoxious mortal kombat noises
I hope my npc battles of my channel will become so epic as yours! Nice job!
I have also a question: how do you have the community option in your channel?
Thank you so much! Also I know a requirement is 500 subs. If there's more to it than that then I have no idea. :)
300k people with ranged weapons and combat armor vs a bunch of tribals and druggies with sports gear machetes and spears
Friggin cazadores.
Cool video.
That NCR trooper had that much trouble with a Recruit Legionary but was able to take down a cazadore like nothing?
Cuz Cazadores aren't that durable. Cazadores are so dangerous because of their poisonous attacks. All you have to do is gun them down before they hit you.
Caesar: We lost first battle for the Dam using firearms. So nobody now uses firearms.
Legionaries fighting mele weapons with firearmed people: ????????????????????
Legionaries couple years after, who just got accustomed to using mele, were suddenly swapped to firearms to fight: ?????????????????????????????????????????
Honestly I expected vet to win but Vex to lose
2:40 Bruh XD This is too funny lmao
Legion always felt easier in general to fight due to most of their soldiers not having good ranged weapons. NCR troops are easier in smaller groups than legion but when you have to fight 10 of them on extreme hardcore mode shit gets real
wtf are those sound effects
that trooper needs a medal
It sold it to me Legion fucks the NCR when I saw 2 Recruits take out 3 Mercenaries and 2 of those wandering traders 1 had just about 40% HP and a leg crippled the other was basically untouched
Bro activate your windows lmao
If you lower all guns weapon spreads to be more accurate (to the guns they where based on, not just so you can hit better) ncr doest seem as bad
The main issue with ncr is they constantly switch weapons, have really crappy guns, and spend most of the fight spazzing out and running around in circles.
If they literally just had a machete and charged and hit them and didnt stop they would win alot more.
Is it that the Legion's bad or that the melee skill is bad?
CL would have performed better in a building than out in the open 1v1 but pretty good nonetheless.
0:27 guy really hid behind the sign lol
I thought the ncr soldier would lose the first battle
Legion was definitely the devs least prioritized faction. Still, ave true to Caesar
No it’s just in realistic if guys with shoulder pads and dressses beat a soldier with decent armor and a gun
For the republic.
Where is Legate vs General? :')
NCR > Legion
I would love to see this fight in the Thorn lol
Why are you using so much unecessary sounds like with vexillarius?
5:24 what did he just do
"MONEH JUMP DUTCH."
Legion pretorians and others spam non stop their melee attacks,in this video they dont reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
"activate windows"
NCR: 6
CL: 2
Damn i forgot how bad the AI for melee combatants was in this game lol, legionary takes one light swing and waits 2 seconds like its a turn-based game XDDDD.
hydrogen bomb vs coughing baby
W NCR. No one can change my mind or tell me otherwise.
The legion assassins are the worst part about the legion. They come out of nowhere and are as deadly as anything. I Play on very hard, hardcore, so they may seem more deadly to me idk.. but making enemies with the legion is dangerous especially in early game.
My games have always shown the opposite. The legion always crush the NCR...... this seems a little rigged to me
Lol I promise its not. In fact I like both NCR and Legion equally, they both have good qualities and bad. When i do these NPC battles i usually use the 1st battle as the one i show in videos unless something crazy happens. Thanks for watching :)
@@RiotNpcBattles maybe it's something to do with squad sized numbers of units in a battle. Maybe the AI is bad at ranged to melee fights with multiple potential targets. Who knows.
The AI always acts dumb especially troopers at close range
They swap targets way to often but in a 1v1 the service rifle packs a mean punch if the legionnaire isn't fast enough
@John Doe by gameplay yes the legion is better by logical thinking not by a long shot really
@John Doe I mean let's be realistic the NCR isn't trying and we're told this by Hanlon
If the NCR put more than the "bear" minimum they'd have won by now simply because their military is massive what we see in the Mojave is the conscripts
Im 2ys late but i still think it boils down to, i have more range then ur pointy things
3:18 She felt a little woozy