@@luffiewebster My best guess...... Yes. I love how in MGS3 She does his hand gesture after Snake gets his eye blown out as she scolded out. Funniest thing about that scene, everyone in the room was a spy except Volgin and Sokolov.
Personally I initially saw Ocelot as a Villain during MGS1,MGS2, and MGS3, however after playing MGS4 I realized that The Patriots, an Organization that He ironically helped create, were the real Villains of the Franchise, in MGS4 Ocelot used Liquid's Meme in order to "play" the Villain knowing that Solid Snake would go to hell and back to stop "Liquid" and at the same time achieve His endgame which was to free the World from the War Economy that the Patriot AI's who ruled in Zero's stead had setup and to free Big Boss from the coma that the AI's had put Him in after being nearly burned to death by Solid Snake at the conclusion of Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake during their fight at Zanzibarland, also I see Ocelot as more of an Anti-Hero due to His brute tactics such as torturing Donald Anderson, The Darpa Chief to death during MGS1 and also conspiring with EVA/Big Mama to have Grey Fox kill Paramedic from MGS3, thus eliminating two founding Members of The Patriots who had sided with Zero, whilst Ocelot and EVA were Team Big Boss till the very end
It really did feel like when he becomes Liquid** Ocelot, he's just trying to finish the war once and for all. In his own way, it was the only way he could help gain true peace after a lifetime of conflict. Which is odd how often he swaps sides, but it definitely feels like every experience has led up him to the point of playing villain. In a way, it reminds me how every one of the main characters in MGS used someone to further their goals. Boss used Big Boss to maintain peace at the cost of herself. Big Boss used V at the cost of V's identity and sense of self. V (down the line lost his shit and) used the men he recruited through charisma as his private army for the original MGS1 before dying. IE: aerosol flamethrower. Meanwhile Ocelot used everything - including the dead. What I think is so amusing is that he's always had an idealized version of Big Boss in his head. Feels just that he wound up using himself by the end to finally bring true peace. Absolutely reckless as shit, but kinda feels in line with his character: Ocelot did like his theatrics early on..! Feels we've come full circle all over again with the difference being freedom is finally real. Though maybe that's the point.
Ocelot and The Boss did something really similar: Both needed to pretend to be villains to save the world, and the world sees them as villains while only handful of people know that they are the true heroes.
i actually think that ocelot was a good guy but became bad cause in mgs3 he was acting as a double agent and sometime around the end of the game he fell in love with big boss like everyone else. then he was loyal af to big boss and did whatever he asked until solid killed him in mg2. then he felt grief for his dead lover and tried to fine content by fighting liquid in mgs as a double agent cause liquid hates bb. in mg2 he uses hypnosis or whatever to become liquid so he can continue bb’s idea of the soldiers world or whatever but because liquid hates bb he just ended up being evil in mgs2 and 4. u can see the love how in mg5 he repeats the engraving and recoil lines that bb told him in mg3(this is prb the moment ocelot fell in love with bb cause its when i did)
In MGS2 Ocelot worked with Solidus who turned out to be a good guy who was trying to save the world. In MGS3 he had the chance to create a third world war but instead chose to prevent it from ever happening. In MGS4 he had the chance to start a nuclear world war, but instead got rid of all those weapons. In MGS5 he was working alongside Big Boss, who he looked up to, and as things was shown, Big Boss was actually not a villain, but only an enemy towards the government. Throughout the series, Ocelot has been shown as somewhat of a "joker" - where he works with different people and organizations. He's a charming, wise, and dangerous player who choses his sides carefully. He also loves revolvers and has been a triple-agent and has tricked not only all the characters in the video-game, but also all of us who's played the game. He's an anti-hero, a legend, and one of the greatest "villains" in video-game history. Oh, and he's also good.
I feel like ocelot is like one of themes of the series there is no good or evil in mgs everything in that world is morally grey good or evil is up to interpretation by the individual
Currently playing MGSV, last I played was MGS2. I am in tears trying to work out what on Earth is going on. This helped as much as it reasonably could in this meth of a plot-storm.
It's a bit poetic, Ocelot was protecting the only child figure to the original big boss. And Ocelot is the litteral child of said big boss. Two brothers working together unbeknownst to them. Much like the flip side of snake and liquid. A duality of snakes. Great video!
he’s a vandal forsure, does what he needs to do to not only survive but prosper, for him and whatever he holds his allegiance to. “U.S, USSR, d Diamond Dogs, Ocelot unit, patriots, etc.” he will see it to the end, he’s a loyal soldier and even better a loyal friend. He saw BB’s will, and interpreted it to the very end, pretty. good.
There are no real heroes in MGS, with the exception of The Boss. There's only people, with goals, philosophies and ambitions. Revolver Ocelot is undoubtedly a sociopath and a war criminal, but everything he did was done to free the world from the Patriots' control and bring back his best friend, which were ultimately noble goals. So he's a very morally gray character imo.
I mean you could argue that The Boss also lies in this morally grey area. She trained a 15 year old and the Cobra Unit was part of very secret ops meaning they could have been violating laws too.
If you could, please make more Ocelot videos!!! I just think that considering how important he is to the entire Metal Gear story, he’s not being discussed or analyzed nearly enough by the community (︶︿︶)
Hmmm... perhaps a recap of Ocelot’s entire life: what he’s been up to (including “off screen” time) + why / his objectives & over all objective, obstacles facing him
Speaking of which, I do think that there are at least 2 ‘turning-point’ time periods interesting to explore: the time period between the fall out of BB and Zero all the way till the end of perhaps Peace Walker + the time period of the mission to destroy Outer Heaven all the way till the destruction of Zanzibar land. The former’s when Ocelot’s essentially working for no one. Internally he fell out with Zero along with BB (even though he didn’t formally cut ties with the Patriots because according to himself, he’s just doing it to be an insider, partially anticipating that he may be useful to BB in the future), but apparently he lost track of BB’s whereabouts indicating that BB’s not in contact with him nor seeking him as an ally. Considering a large portion of the entire MGS story from this point onwards’ centred around taking down the Patriot system which Ocelot helped to set up in the first place, it’s safe to assume that a lot must be going on internally for him (also a lot’s going on internally for him because BB’s not around to tell him what to do / all of Ocelot’s work, be it being a spy in Russia, CIA as well as Patriots were all pointless and meaningless). BB probably didn’t regain contact with him all the way till the end of PW or when BB regain consciousness after the destruction of mother base (which I believe BB never fell into a coma, so Ocelot didn’t wait 9 years; Miller on the other hand whole-heartedly believed that BB did, and put himself through hell just to protect BB, loosing an arm and a leg in the process). Only when the two of them regain contact again, did they exchange infos gathered throughout the years and create a plan / objectives of what to do next to carry out their version of the Boss’s will and fight zero’s version of the Boss’s will. The latter time period’s equally crucial because with the destruction of Zanzibar Land, Ocelot’s completely on his own. He’s completely on his own to make a new plan (the old one he and BB plotted can no longer be used, neither him or BB anticipated how strong Solid would actually become ; The seed of revenge Skull Face planted in the system / Miller’s wrath’s far worst than either of them anticipated), save BB and carry out BB’s objectives. He can’t trust anyone. He’s under so much stress and sadness for that matter. Yet once he got to meet solid face to face, he’s starting to have fun again. I genuinely do think that, “you’re pretty good” said by Ocelot before he died’s not solely intended for BB, but for Solid too. It’s almost, a way to thank Solid.
You missed the part where Ocelot is the Adam to Eva, the adam that big boss was supposed to meet in the beginning. Which is why he shows up with the Ocelot Team afterwards.
This video is a pretty solid example of: Art made by the oppressed: these are the guys who did it. This is why they did it. They're bastards Art made by the oppressor: alas for it is simple human nature. There are heroes on both sides. We'll never know how it started
I think given that I also see Venom/BB as a bad guy and Solid Snake as the eventual good guy trapped in their mess I would call Ocelot a bad guy overall. But that said, he did a great job training D-Dog....
Did Ocelot really work as an NSA codebreaker? I thought that was some kind of cover story. My impression was that Ocelot had been placed with the Russians (by the American Philosophers) from an early age, like when he was a kid. By contrast, the NSA codebreaker defection supposedly happened more recently. However, I haven't gone back and re-listened to the relevant radio conversations in a while, so I don't remember for sure.
At the end of MGS3, Ocelot reveals he was "ADAM" all along (the NSA codebreaker that defected with EVA (not our EVA, but a man using the same codename)). Its messy, but it *does* work, so long as he was a codebreaker before he was 16 haha I don't really put it past MGS tho to have that be the case. BB was working with the Boss when he was 15 so why not have Ocelot also be working before his 16th birthday?
Yet again another awesome, I do love the quetion posed of is ocelot is bad is good. I think you can expand this because unlike most traditional narratives where someone can align should be more ambiguous, which mgs series Is a perfect teaching ground of not viewing people in that black and white way, you can maybe expand on the fact that is actions could be justified to individuals I mean we live a world where people do beleive that individuals we think are evil throughout history and now but to them they are good or justified in their actions. To end it off this was an great semi character analysis and you should do some more with even obscure characters.
The Ocelot of Phantom Pain called venom a "Meme" but the Meme he referred to is blessed to have Quiet as his Buddy and was able to defeat Salantropus(I don't know the exact spelling) so I'll have this MEME hehe still thanks Ocelot for recruiting us in DD
Ocelot was a good soldier who worked to accomplish his mission by any means necessary. Anyone has ever served knows accomplishing your mission requires you to do some bad things. He was a villain and a hero depending if you were and the opposite end of his sights or benefited from his actions.
I think many of the characters in the MGS series are not simply good or bad, and exist in a gray area. Except for Volgin of course. Volgin was pure fucking evil, and it was awesome.
Thank you so much!! I’m so so grateful for the growth I’ve seen over this past year and so excited to see what this year brings! Thanks so much for your support!
Solid snake's my favorite snake I always see ocelot as an enemy he's one of those bad guys behind Metal Gear Rex's development a walking tank capable of launching nuclear war heads.
i feel like ocelot is a antihero, becasue he's not bad; but he's not good ether. overall though, the fight was against zero; and if he didn't make the the sons of big boss. then i think they could've been both on the right side of history in their approaches to the boss's legacy, but once zero did that; zero basically became more of a bad guy than big boss!! he believed in big bosses will, and tried to see it through to the end. though he is a antihero, i think he was mainly good. so i guess you can say he's "pretty good"!! also so glad i found this channel, and i love your theories/povs on the franchise :D
Cool video! Honestly, I think that this style of video would be good for Big Boss. In the games where you play as him, he seems like a good guy, and in the games where you fight him he’s portrayed as evil. I kinda think that some of his “evilness” was from him being slandered by the patriots. Would love to see your indepth opinion!
@@mr.monkey354 Well, his organization did fight in wars, so creating orphans was sadly going to happen sometimes. When you go through Zanzibar in Metal Gear 2 you do run into some children. None of them attack you, and all of them look at Big Boss like a parent figure. There’s people who if they were in BB’s position would have left the children to starve and die. He at least gave them a home. The biggest problem with BB’s ideals was he thought war was absolutely necessary; I’ll concede that as a morally degraded view.
To me Ocelot is Ocelot Dosent matter what side of the morality spectrum he falls in he just wants to revive the final Student of his mother because they had one magical week in the Jungles of Russia that one time
While Big Boss is a renowned legendary soldier who was known a hero at some point for saving the world from nuclear war, Ocelot is the hero of the world for saving the world from the Patriots' control while he will be remembered by the world as an evil villain, just like how the world sees his mother, The Boss as. In MGS3, Ocelot is not a bad guy. I'm guessing that while he's an ally, he and Big Boss developed a "friendly rivalry" towards each other. I think that the reason why Ocelot tried to kill Eva is because he knows her true nature. Ocelot is the Adam whom Big Boss was supposed to meet upon his return to Russia for Operation Snake Eater, but the former knows that something is wrong when Eva came to meet with Big Boss. She doesn't even know the passcode. Ocelot probably realized he went too far when he tried to shoot Eva during the torture chamber since Big Boss didn't know her true nature, but he still felt the need to get rid of her simply because she's not a part of their team. Ocelot is truly loyal to Big Boss, and he, like the latter, wants to get rid of the Patriots after they threw away their original ideas. To think Ocelot planned far ahead to finally get rid of the Patriots from 1 to 4 shows how intelligent and dedicated he is. Solid Snake even said that he could've easily stopped them and launch the nuke at JD to rule the world, but Ocelot simply replied that the destruction of the Patriots is his true objective, not the world domination he made Snake and his teammates believe it to be. Maybe the reason why he challenged Snake to a final CQC duel on top of Outer Haven is because he probably knows that he's going to die anyway, so he wants to settle the score and die the way he did. I'm sure Ocelot and the rest can't just announce the true intentions of the Patriots and what they really did. Nobody believed The Dead Cell when they were framed by the Patriots for a crime they didn't commit despite them the only ones telling the truth.
Good or evil? How about THE GOAT? 😂 Another banger Luffie 👊 The overall story of Metal Gear is as complicated as many of the characters. Its kind of hard to judge him or even Big Boss as a overall evil since they were at war against the system, & doing what seemed right in the long run, war is almost always messy with mistakes & questionable choices. Despite the questionable methods BB used & philosophy, outer heaven/zanzibar land seemed like a net positive overall for the world (He was saving kids, & theres no guarantee they were fighting until they became of age). With or without him the war economy was going to keep going, battles still fought & the patriots/cipher/philosophers networks were still going at it. BB was using what was given/available to him, & he was the best chance they had at beating the system, surely Ocelot knew that. Thankfully Ocelot got control though, & team Philanthropy did the rest, so no more need for BB to help add fuel to the wars or profit from them.
I think BB had some weird plan of how to free the world from the patriots by acquiring nukes and pretending/actually using child soldiers. But then he got in a coma and woke up to Ocelot having solved like 99.9% of the stuff and BB was like "holly, this way better than my nukes and child soldiers plan"
I think the thing people overlook is the fact that there are few pure good or pure evil people, except for maybe Huey, Skullface, and Volgin. People do things that can be classified as good or bad, but even then that classification can vary depending on someones morals and values. Yesterday's good may be tomorrow's evil
i just see it that whatever side bibos on, ocelot will be on that side as well. its actually really sweet to think that ocelot has spent like 40 years yearning over bb. i dont understand how ppl dont think ocelot is gay, because literally how else would you explain his actions? you dont need to think that big boss is gay/ also in love with ocelot tho
At the core of it, Ocelot is simply a man who's madly in love wth Big Boss, whatever he does is justified only for himself, but to the eyes of others I think he is a bad guy still.
No I think Ocelot’s the secret main character too haha I wish we’d get a game focused solely on him! I’m so passionate about that that I’m secretly designing an Ocelot focused game myself haha
Ocelot is neither. To quote Tom Servo "Nobody gets me. I'm the wind, baby!" I think he's a good guy but in all seriousness it'd probably be too much for me to write out in one sitting.
Its loyalty to a friend the only loyalty he had. Would i say hes bad i wouldnt say hes good nor completely bad. As for big boss he was used up by the govt every since he could hold a gun. He just wanted a place for all soldiers to live and not be used by big govt. As for child soldiers he was a child soldier so i would say he didnt know any better. His vision got twisted along the way by lost and war. Guarantee you if solid was in shoes he would have changed also
Before I watch, my answer is bad guy, because Big Boss is generally not a great influence on the world in my opinion, and he deployed Ocelot to do a bunch of evil things in the course of his foolish, traumatized idealism. When Ocelot has a free hand in his methods, he acts dead neutral if not evil, since he enjoys torture and being extra with the xtreme russian roulette, loves lying and misinfo, and of course the hypnotism bullshit. I have not played MGS4 but from what I know it follows this reading. You really can’t call him a good guy unless you morally agree 100% with MSF, which kinda no civilian would.
@@luffiewebster Big Boss has done a bunch of good things, in fact probably more good than bad. The only reason I'd consider him evil is his mindset, which never really was good.
Pure evil He raped Meryl. He enjoys torturing people. Doesn't flinch to shoot people through the head point blank if they're expendable, like on the Tanker, in MGS3 with the unit. Most of all his own people. He played games to nearly shoot Eva, which cost Big Boss his right eye. He was a total villain throughout the first, second and fourth enstallment. He killed all those Russians and the mariners on MGS2, stole their Metal Gear Ray and was about to kill Snake, Fortune and Raiden at the end of the game when he suddenly turned into Liquid. We don't have to talk about MGS4 either..... it's plain obvious I mean that wasn't just Liquid. It was also Ocelot. Enjoyed torturing Solid Snake. Rigged his equipment with a bomb after he was released from prison, a truly. Somehow he wants Big Boss to succeed, as well as his son, but for some reason he is taking delight in making it harder for both or giving them pain. Plotted a scheme with Solidus to start a new nuclear war, like no good guy would ever do that. Guy is a sicko. I know he has his fair share of fans, but don't make him into a hero. The only Metal Gear Solid where he's kind of a good guy, is Metal Gear Solid V. He even is against torture this time, and is allround wise, calm and not agressive nor is he clowning around.... It's crazy. It's like he's a total different person between MGS3 and Metal Gear Solid. The way he honored Venom Snake, was a helpful ally at all times, and protected Quiet. It makes me wonder why Big Boss didn't kill him in MGS3, or Gray Fox during Shadow Moses. He only took his arm but then he disappeared again...... stil wondering why..... He has redeeming points other than MGS V. - Cheered on Naked Snake to defeat Volgin. - Crossed out Solidus' evil plans and made him look like an idiot whilst also using the disgusting Dead Cells as pawns The most absurd thing is: He was pretending to be loyal to Liquid, double crossed him but Liquid never knew since he was already dead before Ocelot calls the president at the end of the first Solid game. After that though, he took one of Liquid's limbs and somehow became him, meaning Liquid would live on through his arm. - He was involved with Solidus as president of the US, and must have had his share in informing the president, who then would call off the Nuclear Strike that the corrupt defense minister Jim Houseman plannned to clean up the evidence of Shadow Moses.
Metal Gear Solid in my opinion has no villains. Well Zero is in a way according to Big Boss. It’s complicated. I don’t even believe Big Boss is evil. The Boss will was misunderstood by both party after MGS3 or maybe it was how each side saw it. So it’s a fight between them to make the world in the vision they saw fit. It’s what I’ve come to understand. My reason that’s why I haven’t gone to get a MGS tattoo and I enjoy the series. I want to get a villain from it because good guys are overrated but in the end I don’t find the villain of the game as a villain after the debriefings.
Do you think Ocelot was a good or a bad guy?
he's a rascal
He just changed with the times.
He's both.
He is just looking out for his boyfriend
he's a silly little catboy
Imagine the world if Big Boss never told Ocelot that twisting your elbow to absorb recoil was a revolver technique..
Right?? I *love* that he gives some of the same advice to a DD that BB gives to him in MGS3 😂
Hed still be making the effeminate cat sound?
@@HANKHILLFORTXGOVERNOR MRAWW
I dunno, "Pistol Bobcat" doesn't quite have the same oompf factor.
He already had the spurs, I think he was gonna gravitate to revolvers without snake mentioning them
He just wanted to aid his best friend no matter the cost, regardless of good and evil you gotta admit he is one damn loyal friend
He's def loyal to the end! Wonder if he got that from his mom... 🤔
@@luffiewebster My best guess...... Yes. I love how in MGS3 She does his hand gesture after Snake gets his eye blown out as she scolded out. Funniest thing about that scene, everyone in the room was a spy except Volgin and Sokolov.
More like his dad
@@luffiewebster I didn't even think of that 😱
I just know after the events of MGS 4 someone found Ocelot's laptop still logged into Pinterest and he had a wedding board for him and BiBo
Doesn't matter, Ocelot will always be triple crossing everyone.
Except Big Boss
And that's why love this sob. Never change, bud!
Personally I initially saw Ocelot as a Villain during MGS1,MGS2, and MGS3, however after playing MGS4 I realized that The Patriots, an Organization that He ironically helped create, were the real Villains of the Franchise, in MGS4 Ocelot used Liquid's Meme in order to "play" the Villain knowing that Solid Snake would go to hell and back to stop "Liquid" and at the same time achieve His endgame which was to free the World from the War Economy that the Patriot AI's who ruled in Zero's stead had setup and to free Big Boss from the coma that the AI's had put Him in after being nearly burned to death by Solid Snake at the conclusion of Metal Gear 2 Solid Snake during their fight at Zanzibarland, also I see Ocelot as more of an Anti-Hero due to His brute tactics such as torturing Donald Anderson, The Darpa Chief to death during MGS1 and also conspiring with EVA/Big Mama to have Grey Fox kill Paramedic from MGS3, thus eliminating two founding Members of The Patriots who had sided with Zero, whilst Ocelot and EVA were Team Big Boss till the very end
It really did feel like when he becomes Liquid** Ocelot, he's just trying to finish the war once and for all. In his own way, it was the only way he could help gain true peace after a lifetime of conflict. Which is odd how often he swaps sides, but it definitely feels like every experience has led up him to the point of playing villain. In a way, it reminds me how every one of the main characters in MGS used someone to further their goals.
Boss used Big Boss to maintain peace at the cost of herself.
Big Boss used V at the cost of V's identity and sense of self.
V (down the line lost his shit and) used the men he recruited through charisma as his private army for the original MGS1 before dying. IE: aerosol flamethrower.
Meanwhile Ocelot used everything - including the dead.
What I think is so amusing is that he's always had an idealized version of Big Boss in his head. Feels just that he wound up using himself by the end to finally bring true peace.
Absolutely reckless as shit, but kinda feels in line with his character: Ocelot did like his theatrics early on..! Feels we've come full circle all over again with the difference being freedom is finally real. Though maybe that's the point.
actually V got killed by RC Rockets/Machinegun fire, MG2 had the actual, aerosol flamethrower big boss get comatosed.
Ocelot and The Boss did something really similar: Both needed to pretend to be villains to save the world, and the world sees them as villains while only handful of people know that they are the true heroes.
It is ill-advised to put Ocelot in a good/bad compass. Ocelot is neither good nor bad, he's just... Pretty Good
points for good guy cause he juggles and has cool engravings
But they give you no good guy, let alone tactical advantages... Jury still out 🤔
i actually think that ocelot was a good guy but became bad cause in mgs3 he was acting as a double agent and sometime around the end of the game he fell in love with big boss like everyone else. then he was loyal af to big boss and did whatever he asked until solid killed him in mg2. then he felt grief for his dead lover and tried to fine content by fighting liquid in mgs as a double agent cause liquid hates bb. in mg2 he uses hypnosis or whatever to become liquid so he can continue bb’s idea of the soldiers world or whatever but because liquid hates bb he just ended up being evil in mgs2 and 4. u can see the love how in mg5 he repeats the engraving and recoil lines that bb told him in mg3(this is prb the moment ocelot fell in love with bb cause its when i did)
😂
Same to me 🫡❤
He doesn't need to be a good or bad guy he's a badass peace and have a great day
In MGS2 Ocelot worked with Solidus who turned out to be a good guy who was trying to save the world. In MGS3 he had the chance to create a third world war but instead chose to prevent it from ever happening. In MGS4 he had the chance to start a nuclear world war, but instead got rid of all those weapons. In MGS5 he was working alongside Big Boss, who he looked up to, and as things was shown, Big Boss was actually not a villain, but only an enemy towards the government. Throughout the series, Ocelot has been shown as somewhat of a "joker" - where he works with different people and organizations. He's a charming, wise, and dangerous player who choses his sides carefully. He also loves revolvers and has been a triple-agent and has tricked not only all the characters in the video-game, but also all of us who's played the game. He's an anti-hero, a legend, and one of the greatest "villains" in video-game history.
Oh, and he's also good.
I don't think he was either. I think he had no issues playing both parts to complete his objectives.
I feel like ocelot is like one of themes of the series there is no good or evil in mgs everything in that world is morally grey good or evil is up to interpretation by the individual
Currently playing MGSV, last I played was MGS2.
I am in tears trying to work out what on Earth is going on.
This helped as much as it reasonably could in this meth of a plot-storm.
It's a bit poetic, Ocelot was protecting the only child figure to the original big boss. And Ocelot is the litteral child of said big boss. Two brothers working together unbeknownst to them. Much like the flip side of snake and liquid. A duality of snakes. Great video!
I always figured he was the son of the Sorrow and the first big boss.
Just finished my 2nd MGSV playthrough and youtube recommends me this video! very cool! subscribed!
What perfect timing!! I'm glad you liked the vid and thanks for subscribing!!!
he’s a vandal forsure, does what he needs to do to not only survive but prosper, for him and whatever he holds his allegiance to. “U.S, USSR, d
Diamond Dogs, Ocelot unit, patriots, etc.” he will see it to the end, he’s a loyal soldier and even better a loyal friend. He saw BB’s will, and interpreted it to the very end, pretty. good.
100%!
Hard to say I would say he’s an anti hero who has his own agenda
Metal Gear is just one really long and complicated gay love story between 2 war criminals
100% 😂
There are no real heroes in MGS, with the exception of The Boss. There's only people, with goals, philosophies and ambitions. Revolver Ocelot is undoubtedly a sociopath and a war criminal, but everything he did was done to free the world from the Patriots' control and bring back his best friend, which were ultimately noble goals. So he's a very morally gray character imo.
Yeah, I remember Kojima saying that you're not meant to look up to mgs characters.Which is true.
I mean you could argue that The Boss also lies in this morally grey area. She trained a 15 year old and the Cobra Unit was part of very secret ops meaning they could have been violating laws too.
Ocelot is a tweener hard to predict what his real dream is, when you see him smile with glee watching many sides in chaos
If you could, please make more Ocelot videos!!! I just think that considering how important he is to the entire Metal Gear story, he’s not being discussed or analyzed nearly enough by the community (︶︿︶)
I def have more Ocelot vids coming further down the line! Is there anything specific you'd like me to dive into?
Hmmm... perhaps a recap of Ocelot’s entire life: what he’s been up to (including “off screen” time) + why / his objectives & over all objective, obstacles facing him
Speaking of which, I do think that there are at least 2 ‘turning-point’ time periods interesting to explore: the time period between the fall out of BB and Zero all the way till the end of perhaps Peace Walker + the time period of the mission to destroy Outer Heaven all the way till the destruction of Zanzibar land. The former’s when Ocelot’s essentially working for no one. Internally he fell out with Zero along with BB (even though he didn’t formally cut ties with the Patriots because according to himself, he’s just doing it to be an insider, partially anticipating that he may be useful to BB in the future), but apparently he lost track of BB’s whereabouts indicating that BB’s not in contact with him nor seeking him as an ally. Considering a large portion of the entire MGS story from this point onwards’ centred around taking down the Patriot system which Ocelot helped to set up in the first place, it’s safe to assume that a lot must be going on internally for him (also a lot’s going on internally for him because BB’s not around to tell him what to do / all of Ocelot’s work, be it being a spy in Russia, CIA as well as Patriots were all pointless and meaningless). BB probably didn’t regain contact with him all the way till the end of PW or when BB regain consciousness after the destruction of mother base (which I believe BB never fell into a coma, so Ocelot didn’t wait 9 years; Miller on the other hand whole-heartedly believed that BB did, and put himself through hell just to protect BB, loosing an arm and a leg in the process). Only when the two of them regain contact again, did they exchange infos gathered throughout the years and create a plan / objectives of what to do next to carry out their version of the Boss’s will and fight zero’s version of the Boss’s will. The latter time period’s equally crucial because with the destruction of Zanzibar Land, Ocelot’s completely on his own. He’s completely on his own to make a new plan (the old one he and BB plotted can no longer be used, neither him or BB anticipated how strong Solid would actually become ; The seed of revenge Skull Face planted in the system / Miller’s wrath’s far worst than either of them anticipated), save BB and carry out BB’s objectives. He can’t trust anyone. He’s under so much stress and sadness for that matter. Yet once he got to meet solid face to face, he’s starting to have fun again. I genuinely do think that, “you’re pretty good” said by Ocelot before he died’s not solely intended for BB, but for Solid too. It’s almost, a way to thank Solid.
i love the otacon and snake plushies in the background they really slay
You missed the part where Ocelot is the Adam to Eva, the adam that big boss was supposed to meet in the beginning. Which is why he shows up with the Ocelot Team afterwards.
This video is a pretty solid example of:
Art made by the oppressed: these are the guys who did it. This is why they did it. They're bastards
Art made by the oppressor: alas for it is simple human nature. There are heroes on both sides. We'll never know how it started
I think given that I also see Venom/BB as a bad guy and Solid Snake as the eventual good guy trapped in their mess I would call Ocelot a bad guy overall.
But that said, he did a great job training D-Dog....
And he was great with the kids on motherbase! :D
His ability to take care of people is just as good as his ability to interrogate people... scary
I absolutely loved Kojima's moral complications in his games
Did Ocelot really work as an NSA codebreaker? I thought that was some kind of cover story. My impression was that Ocelot had been placed with the Russians (by the American Philosophers) from an early age, like when he was a kid. By contrast, the NSA codebreaker defection supposedly happened more recently. However, I haven't gone back and re-listened to the relevant radio conversations in a while, so I don't remember for sure.
At the end of MGS3, Ocelot reveals he was "ADAM" all along (the NSA codebreaker that defected with EVA (not our EVA, but a man using the same codename)). Its messy, but it *does* work, so long as he was a codebreaker before he was 16 haha I don't really put it past MGS tho to have that be the case. BB was working with the Boss when he was 15 so why not have Ocelot also be working before his 16th birthday?
Yet again another awesome, I do love the quetion posed of is ocelot is bad is good. I think you can expand this because unlike most traditional narratives where someone can align should be more ambiguous, which mgs series Is a perfect teaching ground of not viewing people in that black and white way, you can maybe expand on the fact that is actions could be justified to individuals I mean we live a world where people do beleive that individuals we think are evil throughout history and now but to them they are good or justified in their actions. To end it off this was an great semi character analysis and you should do some more with even obscure characters.
Sooo, we are just glossing over the fact that in MGS1 Ocelot is a famous torturer and it’s implied that he canonical räped Meryl
When is that latter bit implied???
I thought ocelot actually was possessed by liquid in mgs2 but just pretending in 4
Probably my favorite character ever
The Ocelot of Phantom Pain called venom a "Meme" but the Meme he referred to is blessed to have Quiet as his Buddy and was able to defeat Salantropus(I don't know the exact spelling) so I'll have this MEME hehe still thanks Ocelot for recruiting us in DD
Ocelot was a good soldier who worked to accomplish his mission by any means necessary. Anyone has ever served knows accomplishing your mission requires you to do some bad things. He was a villain and a hero depending if you were and the opposite end of his sights or benefited from his actions.
He's a tough guy, like it really rough guy...
I think many of the characters in the MGS series are not simply good or bad, and exist in a gray area. Except for Volgin of course. Volgin was pure fucking evil, and it was awesome.
Liquid isn’t a good person
We can all agree about Volgin 😂
Liquid's just a lil turned around
@@luffiewebster But even Volgin wanted to unite the world and end wars, he just wanted to do it in a very evil and selfish way.
what a chad betrays everyone in almost every game
From less than a thousand subs to over 4 thousand in ~1 year's time? That's awesome! Pretty good growth, no? Best of luck to ya goin forward!
Thank you so much!! I’m so so grateful for the growth I’ve seen over this past year and so excited to see what this year brings! Thanks so much for your support!
Solid snake's my favorite snake I always see ocelot as an enemy he's one of those bad guys behind Metal Gear Rex's development a walking tank capable of launching nuclear war heads.
can you make a vid comparing the history of parasites VS nanomachines? i feel those two get constantly misconstrued in the MGS lore
I'll def put this on my list! You're right, the parasites and nanomachines def get confusing!
i feel like ocelot is a antihero, becasue he's not bad; but he's not good ether. overall though, the fight was against zero; and if he didn't make the the sons of big boss. then i think they could've been both on the right side of history in their approaches to the boss's legacy, but once zero did that; zero basically became more of a bad guy than big boss!! he believed in big bosses will, and tried to see it through to the end. though he is a antihero, i think he was mainly good. so i guess you can say he's "pretty good"!! also so glad i found this channel, and i love your theories/povs on the franchise :D
Ocelot is by far the best Charakter in the series.
Cool video! Honestly, I think that this style of video would be good for Big Boss. In the games where you play as him, he seems like a good guy, and in the games where you fight him he’s portrayed as evil. I kinda think that some of his “evilness” was from him being slandered by the patriots. Would love to see your indepth opinion!
Watch the video "Big Boss did nothing wrong" by Afterlife games
@@johnfkennedyinanopentopcar8976 Thanks! I’ve got it saved and I’ll give it watch.
So causing orphans so you can groom them into soldiers isn't evil?
@@mr.monkey354 Well, his organization did fight in wars, so creating orphans was sadly going to happen sometimes. When you go through Zanzibar in Metal Gear 2 you do run into some children. None of them attack you, and all of them look at Big Boss like a parent figure. There’s people who if they were in BB’s position would have left the children to starve and die. He at least gave them a home. The biggest problem with BB’s ideals was he thought war was absolutely necessary; I’ll concede that as a morally degraded view.
To me Ocelot is Ocelot Dosent matter what side of the morality spectrum he falls in he just wants to revive the final Student of his mother because they had one magical week in the Jungles of Russia that one time
he's just a romantic guy in a snake world
Doesn't matter my precious gunslinger did nothing wrong
Nevermind... calling Big Boss a war criminal is the real crime here 😂
Good or bad is always a thing of perspective, so judging it here by one standard is weird, especially in this world.
Honestly, I think he’s a fucked up guy. He got miller captured and made sure he gets blindsided so he couldn’t recognize decoy Boss.
While Big Boss is a renowned legendary soldier who was known a hero at some point for saving the world from nuclear war, Ocelot is the hero of the world for saving the world from the Patriots' control while he will be remembered by the world as an evil villain, just like how the world sees his mother, The Boss as.
In MGS3, Ocelot is not a bad guy. I'm guessing that while he's an ally, he and Big Boss developed a "friendly rivalry" towards each other. I think that the reason why Ocelot tried to kill Eva is because he knows her true nature. Ocelot is the Adam whom Big Boss was supposed to meet upon his return to Russia for Operation Snake Eater, but the former knows that something is wrong when Eva came to meet with Big Boss. She doesn't even know the passcode. Ocelot probably realized he went too far when he tried to shoot Eva during the torture chamber since Big Boss didn't know her true nature, but he still felt the need to get rid of her simply because she's not a part of their team.
Ocelot is truly loyal to Big Boss, and he, like the latter, wants to get rid of the Patriots after they threw away their original ideas. To think Ocelot planned far ahead to finally get rid of the Patriots from 1 to 4 shows how intelligent and dedicated he is. Solid Snake even said that he could've easily stopped them and launch the nuke at JD to rule the world, but Ocelot simply replied that the destruction of the Patriots is his true objective, not the world domination he made Snake and his teammates believe it to be. Maybe the reason why he challenged Snake to a final CQC duel on top of Outer Haven is because he probably knows that he's going to die anyway, so he wants to settle the score and die the way he did.
I'm sure Ocelot and the rest can't just announce the true intentions of the Patriots and what they really did. Nobody believed The Dead Cell when they were framed by the Patriots for a crime they didn't commit despite them the only ones telling the truth.
Good or evil? How about THE GOAT? 😂 Another banger Luffie 👊 The overall story of Metal Gear is as complicated as many of the characters. Its kind of hard to judge him or even Big Boss as a overall evil since they were at war against the system, & doing what seemed right in the long run, war is almost always messy with mistakes & questionable choices. Despite the questionable methods BB used & philosophy, outer heaven/zanzibar land seemed like a net positive overall for the world (He was saving kids, & theres no guarantee they were fighting until they became of age). With or without him the war economy was going to keep going, battles still fought & the patriots/cipher/philosophers networks were still going at it. BB was using what was given/available to him, & he was the best chance they had at beating the system, surely Ocelot knew that. Thankfully Ocelot got control though, & team Philanthropy did the rest, so no more need for BB to help add fuel to the wars or profit from them.
He enjoys torturing and even raped Meryl.... Based on that, yes he's evil.
He is not good or bad he is just willing to do anything for bb
I think BB had some weird plan of how to free the world from the patriots by acquiring nukes and pretending/actually using child soldiers. But then he got in a coma and woke up to Ocelot having solved like 99.9% of the stuff and BB was like "holly, this way better than my nukes and child soldiers plan"
I think the thing people overlook is the fact that there are few pure good or pure evil people, except for maybe Huey, Skullface, and Volgin. People do things that can be classified as good or bad, but even then that classification can vary depending on someones morals and values. Yesterday's good may be tomorrow's evil
He's babygorl and that's all that matters to me
Great explanation
Big Boss raised Ocelot
Ocelot is not bad hes just misunderstood
i just see it that whatever side bibos on, ocelot will be on that side as well. its actually really sweet to think that ocelot has spent like 40 years yearning over bb. i dont understand how ppl dont think ocelot is gay, because literally how else would you explain his actions? you dont need to think that big boss is gay/ also in love with ocelot tho
At the core of it, Ocelot is simply a man who's madly in love wth Big Boss, whatever he does is justified only for himself, but to the eyes of others I think he is a bad guy still.
100%! Ocelot is def doing what he can for the man he loves, but he's also def still a bad guy haha
am i the only one who thinks that ocelot is the real main character of the entire saga?
No I think Ocelot’s the secret main character too haha I wish we’d get a game focused solely on him! I’m so passionate about that that I’m secretly designing an Ocelot focused game myself haha
The answer is yes, just yes
I love this girls Nicknames for everyone
He’s… unique.
He’s a good character all together because his main goal is to free society from a system that wants nothing but control.
Hard because each game he’s different
Thank you!!!
Ocelot is neither. To quote Tom Servo "Nobody gets me. I'm the wind, baby!"
I think he's a good guy but in all seriousness it'd probably be too much for me to write out in one sitting.
Its loyalty to a friend the only loyalty he had. Would i say hes bad i wouldnt say hes good nor completely bad. As for big boss he was used up by the govt every since he could hold a gun. He just wanted a place for all soldiers to live and not be used by big govt. As for child soldiers he was a child soldier so i would say he didnt know any better. His vision got twisted along the way by lost and war. Guarantee you if solid was in shoes he would have changed also
He murders or doesnt murder meryl for no reason in mgs1 so uhhhhhh
He's pretty good
Is Ocelot a Good Gay or a Bad Gay?
He's actually just selfish. You decide what that means
Before I watch, my answer is bad guy, because Big Boss is generally not a great influence on the world in my opinion, and he deployed Ocelot to do a bunch of evil things in the course of his foolish, traumatized idealism. When Ocelot has a free hand in his methods, he acts dead neutral if not evil, since he enjoys torture and being extra with the xtreme russian roulette, loves lying and misinfo, and of course the hypnotism bullshit. I have not played MGS4 but from what I know it follows this reading. You really can’t call him a good guy unless you morally agree 100% with MSF, which kinda no civilian would.
Yes.
UGH, LIQUID!
He is pretty good
Make such video about bb too please.
Haha! Name one good thing BB has ever done. The vid would just be, bad--bad--go to jail! 😂
He did save the world from nuclear armageddon a few times.
@@luffiewebster Big Boss has done a bunch of good things, in fact probably more good than bad. The only reason I'd consider him evil is his mindset, which never really was good.
He’s neither … he’s just out for himself and his beliefs and depending on where you stand your either his enemy or someone he can use
Pure evil
He raped Meryl.
He enjoys torturing people.
Doesn't flinch to shoot people through the head point blank if they're expendable, like on the Tanker, in MGS3 with the unit. Most of all his own people.
He played games to nearly shoot Eva, which cost Big Boss his right eye.
He was a total villain throughout the first, second and fourth enstallment.
He killed all those Russians and the mariners on MGS2, stole their Metal Gear Ray and was about to kill Snake, Fortune and Raiden at the end of the game when he suddenly turned into Liquid.
We don't have to talk about MGS4 either..... it's plain obvious I mean that wasn't just Liquid. It was also Ocelot.
Enjoyed torturing Solid Snake. Rigged his equipment with a bomb after he was released from prison, a truly. Somehow he wants Big Boss to succeed, as well as his son, but for some reason he is
taking delight in making it harder for both or giving them pain.
Plotted a scheme with Solidus to start a new nuclear war, like no good guy would ever do that.
Guy is a sicko. I know he has his fair share of fans, but don't make him into a hero.
The only Metal Gear Solid where he's kind of a good guy, is Metal Gear Solid V. He even is against torture this time, and is allround wise, calm and not agressive nor is he clowning around.... It's crazy. It's like he's a total different person between MGS3 and Metal Gear Solid. The way he honored Venom Snake, was a helpful ally at all times, and protected Quiet.
It makes me wonder why Big Boss didn't kill him in MGS3, or Gray Fox during Shadow Moses. He only took his arm but then he disappeared again...... stil wondering why.....
He has redeeming points other than MGS V.
- Cheered on Naked Snake to defeat Volgin.
- Crossed out Solidus' evil plans and made him look like an idiot whilst also using the disgusting Dead Cells as pawns
The most absurd thing is: He was pretending to be loyal to Liquid, double crossed him but Liquid never knew since he was already dead before Ocelot calls the president at the end of the first Solid game. After that though, he took one of Liquid's limbs and somehow became him, meaning Liquid would live on through his arm.
- He was involved with Solidus as president of the US, and must have had his share in informing the president, who then would call off the Nuclear Strike that the corrupt defense minister Jim Houseman plannned to clean up the evidence of Shadow Moses.
Bibi???
Weird answer but yes and no lol
Recent my sister
Well, almost every mgs character is completely morally gray with their own objectives. Hell everything in mgs is completely ambiguous
Metal Gear Solid in my opinion has no villains. Well Zero is in a way according to Big Boss. It’s complicated. I don’t even believe Big Boss is evil. The Boss will was misunderstood by both party after MGS3 or maybe it was how each side saw it. So it’s a fight between them to make the world in the vision they saw fit. It’s what I’ve come to understand. My reason that’s why I haven’t gone to get a MGS tattoo and I enjoy the series. I want to get a villain from it because good guys are overrated but in the end I don’t find the villain of the game as a villain after the debriefings.