Wow! So many of us have been spiritually abused by cults, this explains so much of it so well, thank you for posting this! I've shared this in groups with thousands of ex Jehovah's Witnesses, we've suffered with the abuse and ptsd and need this! God bless you!
I had no idea that it was written over 30 years ago. It’s so relevant today honestly I got so much out of the book and I got a better understanding spiritual abuse and what had taken place in my life during my time in the apostolic Pentecostal church. I received this book 3 as a gift and a spiritual abuse recovery group and it’s dramatically changed my life for the better as I’m in the process of healing after recently leaving my spiritual abusive system in January 2023.
So brilliant. So accurate. I read your book many years ago and just heard it recommended in a live " Leaving the Message" episode with John Collins and Charles Paisley...so I looked for, and found, this TH-cam. Very happy. I think of the saying I have heard over the years: "There is the right way, there is the wrong way, and then there is MY way" - the last being the one the recipients are meant to adhere to. One time, these words were said in a Baptist church and sum up some of the unspoken, "subtle," rules that people were/are expected to follow in any hierarchical "cultish" group. . Just fantastic. Thank you, again.
Thank you so much for this recent interview. This is the first book I read on spiritual abuse after leaving the United Pentecostal Church in late 1993. I have recommended this book ever since then and through the years my website has given away dozens and dozens of copies to others who have been involved in unhealthy churches. I have embedded this video on the main page of my website and later today will be sharing it in my support groups and the Facebook Page for my website.
@@TruthInMotionStudios hi my name is Pedro , please I need help in these areas … and I’ve tried soo hard to find resources and people to talk to..any help !?!
I was fortunate to receive the gift of this book from your group I just finished reading the last chapter I honestly couldn’t put it down. It has helped me so much since leaving my spiritual a”abusive church that I attended for over five years.
Tears came from my eyes throughout this interview. So many people suffer and so many many people ignore and do not understand what this means. So painful. I exited the Church and have my own doubts about the truths of this religion, but abuse, spiritual abuse is not just confined to christianity, it is all kind of belief systems which wreck peoples most inner and deep part. Painful in a place and in a way it is hard to say out loud.
I'm still getting out of it, it still hurts. I got my wakeup call when I started to have anxiety attacks for a year, coupled with stomach problems etc... I went to a counseling course and the teacher talked about abuse and being overstressed and the consequences...and it was spot on. I started to recognize myself with the "victims" that they described and I started feeling so bad... betrayed, stupid, used and lost. I'm going to a counselor now who is helping me get out of it. I'm still working on it, but I know God will get me out. The attacks are very rare now and don't last for hours, but only minutes now. If you're in a church where you feel bad all the time, don't be afraid to question it all, don't wait too long to get out. Your physical and spiritual health is at stake. FInd a real church where you are accepted as you are and they don't make you feel like a failure all the time. I found mine now, though I'm still having trouble trusting the people and the pastor because I was hurt so bad in the other church.....but I trust God.
I was part of the NoName fellowship out of Spokane WA back in the early 80's I have realized that to this day there are things from that experience that affect me. I have had a hard time trusting leadership and finding a church I feel totally safe in.
@MammaKim, I am so sorry that you were in a cult also. I wonder if there's a place where you can be fully safe... kinda doubt it because people, on purpose or not, have a way of hurting each other. What I've come to look for is how people handle when problems arise. Do they begin to blame and shame and silence or are "leaders" open to reflecting and listening well to what is being brought up. Those places are also hard to find. I wish you well!
Just read this book recently I saw that it was quoted in Raymond Franz book Crisis of Conscience and thought I would see what else it said. It is amazing and really continued to open my eyes to things and strengthen my faith. 😇 I highly recommend!
My evangelical conservative church was just a cult. It destroyed what little trust l had in my self. They told me God wants us to live a holy life and that this was what makes him happy. It was conditional love. Always trying to be perfect and holy was absolute mental torture. I am so glad l left but it made me bitter and angry. I don't think l will ever go back to church again.
Looking forward to reading this. Ordering tonight. Coming out of JW's after 25 years in. I won't keep the book concealed in a paper bag! Barbara Anderson referred. Her accent dialect sounds like she could be Arnold Schwarzenegger's Sister as he spent some years in Germany before coming to America via Austria. He speaks German.
Sounds like a good book to read. I was with a Church of Christ many years ago, it was very evangelistic and big on discipleship. Because it was so evangelistic most members, like myself, were not raised in Churches of Christ. You could not see it at first but it was cultic and like the United Pentecostal Church they believed they alone understood water baptism...and salvation is dependent upon water baptism. So with this in mind you cannot truly serve Christ apart from them, and they were the most effective congregation in evangelism and discipleship so just going to another Church of Christ does not mean you're not "compromising on your commitment that you made to Jesus Christ." Well eventually I saw through this and left. Saw through this further and did not go back. And furthermore studied more indepth in scriptures and saw salvation by faith in Christ and not by us having a near perfect understanding of water baptism.
Yes, the claim that one's organization holds the perfect truth is common to cultish groups/organizations. And then of course also the completely imbalanced hyper believe in one external thing/sign while neglecting to facilitate the inner maturing of the followers. I am glad you discovered this and I hope you are finding rest in Christ :)
@Pedro Ivan Sanchez, your expectations of me are unrealistic. I am not receiving your guilt trip. This is the last time I will respond to you, I am drawing a clear boundary. If you're looking for a book recommendation, I have interviewed lots of authors, just pick any book if you want. I will not engage with you further as I have tried and apparently it didn't help, so it serves no purpose. Please accept that I cannot provide any further help. You need to find professional mental health support where you are.
In 1993 I found myself in the same situation. This book came across my path. It was being passed around in my city. I am so thankful for this book. It started a journey of being set free from spiritual abuse. Thank you for writing this book.
So for someone who has been hurt by people claiming to speak for God, using God's own word to abuse and demean and harm, how do we get back our trust in God again? We had faith, and that faith betrayed us.
That is a good question! I struggled with it for years. Realizing that God is not our faith and nobody has a monopoly on God has helped. God is like Jesus and Jesus says his burden is light. I am not accepting anything anymore that doesn't feel like a light burden. That has helped me discern if I can trust people. Trusting people has helped with experiencing God's goodness again. Nobody should claim to speak for God into your life. They might have an insight or wisdom, but God speaks for himself. His voice sounds like Jesus. Grace and truth.
It is so hard to separate what is abusive, controlling, manipulative behavior from what is a genuine attempt to call out sin. I am recently struggling with this and have face the derailing of my thoughts and the exaggeration of my words. Is this being done intentionally? I am trying to figure out the best way to introduce a neutral party for wise council.
@xjasonxbx1, just a food for thought you will probably not agree with; "a genuine attempt to call out sin"... why do we believe we need to play the Holy Spirit in other people's lives? We likely fundamentally disagree on what "love" means, so for me, where I am now in my understanding of the love of God, I am concerned with my own planks in my eyes. Full stop. I don't see it as my job to make anyone else agree with my understanding. People tend to point to Matthew 18 to justify their need to make other people change their behaviors and again, we likely don't agree in how we read Matthew 18. I see Jesus telling us how WE do community, WE go after people until we kick them out for not agreeing with the way WE think they should behave and it always ends in exclusion and broken relationships. And then he tells the story of the shepherd who leaves the 99 to go to find and heal the lost sheep... I think WE create a bunch of lost sheep by making God's love conditional. We might do that with the best of intentions but the proof is in the pudding. There, food for thought.
I think spiritual abuse wounds the soul worse than physical or sexual abuse. After a Baptist Msg that puts women as second class citizens in long skirts and people between me and my Savior. I have felt so bad since and husband is not happy about going to that church without a ‘submissive’ wife. Help?
Boundaries!! Granny Gear, submission is freely given and freedom giving (I am quoting my mother in law). Submit to one another means that this freely given submission is not only met by reciprocity but also makes you both freer. If that’s truthfully not the consequence of mutual submission, you get to renegotiate your covenant to your spouse and protect your boundaries that, if he won’t, you get to protect. My two cents.
Truth In Motion Studios - thanks. I was so upset at this because I will not allow any legalists type ‘pastor’ to insert idols between me and my Lord. I had a long skirt on and this lady skirt-cop said it was not long enough. Sheesh.. It all has stumbled me. With Irish and William Wallace ancestry, I do poorly under this kind of authoritarian preaching.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 87 วันนี้!! คู่เอก "ก้องชัย vs โชคปรีชา"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YN6e7HVnekw/mqdefault.jpg)
Wow! So many of us have been spiritually abused by cults, this explains so much of it so well, thank you for posting this! I've shared this in groups with thousands of ex Jehovah's Witnesses, we've suffered with the abuse and ptsd and need this! God bless you!
Hopefully many will get their book as well. In addition, Jeff wrote some other books such as Tired of Trying To Measure Up.
Yes! I am SO grateful this has been helpful!
I had no idea that it was written over 30 years ago. It’s so relevant today honestly I got so much out of the book and I got a better understanding spiritual abuse and what had taken place in my life during my time in the apostolic Pentecostal church. I received this book 3 as a gift and a spiritual abuse recovery group and it’s dramatically changed my life for the better as I’m in the process of healing after recently leaving my spiritual abusive system in January 2023.
So brilliant. So accurate. I read your book many years ago and just heard it recommended in a live " Leaving the Message" episode with John Collins and Charles Paisley...so I looked for, and found, this TH-cam. Very happy. I think of the saying I have heard over the years: "There is the right way, there is the wrong way, and then there is MY way" - the last being the one the recipients are meant to adhere to. One time, these words were said in a Baptist church and sum up some of the unspoken, "subtle," rules that people were/are expected to follow in any hierarchical "cultish" group. . Just fantastic. Thank you, again.
Thank you so much for this recent interview. This is the first book I read on spiritual abuse after leaving the United Pentecostal Church in late 1993. I have recommended this book ever since then and through the years my website has given away dozens and dozens of copies to others who have been involved in unhealthy churches. I have embedded this video on the main page of my website and later today will be sharing it in my support groups and the Facebook Page for my website.
Thank you for watching our video! I am so happy that you found it! I'll tell Dave and Jeff of your support ;P
@@TruthInMotionStudios hi my name is Pedro , please I need help in these areas … and I’ve tried soo hard to find resources and people to talk to..any help !?!
I was fortunate to receive the gift of this book from your group I just finished reading the last chapter I honestly couldn’t put it down. It has helped me so much since leaving my spiritual a”abusive church that I attended for over five years.
Tears came from my eyes throughout this interview. So many people suffer and so many many people ignore and do not understand what this means. So painful. I exited the Church and have my own doubts about the truths of this religion, but abuse, spiritual abuse is not just confined to christianity, it is all kind of belief systems which wreck peoples most inner and deep part. Painful in a place and in a way it is hard to say out loud.
I'm still getting out of it, it still hurts. I got my wakeup call when I started to have anxiety attacks for a year, coupled with stomach problems etc... I went to a counseling course and the teacher talked about abuse and being overstressed and the consequences...and it was spot on. I started to recognize myself with the "victims" that they described and I started feeling so bad... betrayed, stupid, used and lost. I'm going to a counselor now who is helping me get out of it. I'm still working on it, but I know God will get me out. The attacks are very rare now and don't last for hours, but only minutes now. If you're in a church where you feel bad all the time, don't be afraid to question it all, don't wait too long to get out. Your physical and spiritual health is at stake. FInd a real church where you are accepted as you are and they don't make you feel like a failure all the time. I found mine now, though I'm still having trouble trusting the people and the pastor because I was hurt so bad in the other church.....but I trust God.
I was part of the NoName fellowship out of Spokane WA back in the early 80's I have realized that to this day there are things from that experience that affect me. I have had a hard time trusting leadership and finding a church I feel totally safe in.
@MammaKim, I am so sorry that you were in a cult also. I wonder if there's a place where you can be fully safe... kinda doubt it because people, on purpose or not, have a way of hurting each other. What I've come to look for is how people handle when problems arise. Do they begin to blame and shame and silence or are "leaders" open to reflecting and listening well to what is being brought up. Those places are also hard to find. I wish you well!
Amazing! God bless each and everyone of you!
Thanks, Eric! May God bless you as well!
I found this thoroughly interesting, the examples given are captivating. Thank you for your lucid discussion.
Watchman Nee's book called Spiritual and Submission is one of the main source of evil authority at churches.
This is such an amazing eye opening book!! 🔥🔥💯💯
You are correct, Torrin!
I just started watching but I have to say, her personality is so great!
great book … it helped me understand why I had to leave an abusive group 20 years ago
Just read this book recently I saw that it was quoted in Raymond Franz book Crisis of Conscience and thought I would see what else it said. It is amazing and really continued to open my eyes to things and strengthen my faith. 😇 I highly recommend!
My evangelical conservative church was just a cult. It destroyed what little trust l had in my self. They told me God wants us to live a holy life and that this was what makes him happy. It was conditional love. Always trying to be perfect and holy was absolute mental torture. I am so glad l left but it made me bitter and angry. I don't think l will ever go back to church again.
God’s unfailing love = Hebrews 12:5-11 🤏
I am experiencing this right now & can relate
WOW! This is so informative! Thank-you so much for this video.
You are so welcome!
We love this SO much and I’d love to do a very informal audio recording of this book for new leavers...
Looking forward to reading this. Ordering tonight. Coming out of JW's after 25 years in. I won't keep the book concealed in a paper bag! Barbara Anderson referred.
Her accent dialect sounds like she could be Arnold Schwarzenegger's Sister as he spent some years in Germany before coming to America via Austria. He speaks German.
Thanks so nice. Put more of these posts. Do more, more thank you.
More to come! I promise :D
I'm definitely subscribed. I love your channel. 🥰
thank you, Elisa! it’s bittersweet that you find my channel helpful ❤️
yo this was so really great.
danke :)
Sounds like a good book to read. I was with a Church of Christ many years ago, it was very evangelistic and big on discipleship. Because it was so evangelistic most members, like myself, were not raised in Churches of Christ.
You could not see it at first but it was cultic and like the United Pentecostal Church they believed they alone understood water baptism...and salvation is dependent upon water baptism. So with this in mind you cannot truly serve Christ apart from them, and they were the most effective congregation in evangelism and discipleship so just going to another Church of Christ does not mean you're not "compromising on your commitment that you made to Jesus Christ." Well eventually I saw through this and left. Saw through this further and did not go back. And furthermore studied more indepth in scriptures and saw salvation by faith in Christ and not by us having a near perfect understanding of water baptism.
Yes, the claim that one's organization holds the perfect truth is common to cultish groups/organizations. And then of course also the completely imbalanced hyper believe in one external thing/sign while neglecting to facilitate the inner maturing of the followers. I am glad you discovered this and I hope you are finding rest in Christ :)
@Pedro Ivan Sanchez, your expectations of me are unrealistic. I am not receiving your guilt trip. This is the last time I will respond to you, I am drawing a clear boundary. If you're looking for a book recommendation, I have interviewed lots of authors, just pick any book if you want. I will not engage with you further as I have tried and apparently it didn't help, so it serves no purpose. Please accept that I cannot provide any further help. You need to find professional mental health support where you are.
@@TruthInMotionStudios how do you know this person needs help …?
@@carmenburgos1616 because he asked for help. However, what he needed help with I could not help with.
In 1993 I found myself in the same situation. This book came across my path. It was being passed around in my city. I am so thankful for this book. It started a journey of being set free from spiritual abuse. Thank you for writing this book.
awesome!
So for someone who has been hurt by people claiming to speak for God, using God's own word to abuse and demean and harm, how do we get back our trust in God again? We had faith, and that faith betrayed us.
That is a good question! I struggled with it for years. Realizing that God is not our faith and nobody has a monopoly on God has helped. God is like Jesus and Jesus says his burden is light. I am not accepting anything anymore that doesn't feel like a light burden. That has helped me discern if I can trust people. Trusting people has helped with experiencing God's goodness again. Nobody should claim to speak for God into your life. They might have an insight or wisdom, but God speaks for himself. His voice sounds like Jesus. Grace and truth.
@@TruthInMotionStudios I like that, "I am not accepting anything anymore that doesn't feel like a light burden."
We need croatian translation of these book and subject. This is dont talk theme here in Croatia. I cant stand it anymore
Wow. Been there done that. Got the tee shirt.
Marsha, yeah. What does your shirt say? Mine says: there's life after organized religion!
The Subtle Power of Spiritual Abuse
we nee that books in croatian language, this is very importamt and alarm subject
I will tell the authors when I meet them next :)
great :)
These leaders just cause condemnation , from their speech on being faithful to church so God can use to actually paying you to come
...why is the verbal audio only on the left side, and the music is stereo?
the only reason, honestly, is that I didn't know how to do this better than the way I did it when I first published the video.
To use God's name for personal agendas and to manipulate people in the church is to use His name in vain
amen! you are speaking my mind!
It is so hard to separate what is abusive, controlling, manipulative behavior from what is a genuine attempt to call out sin. I am recently struggling with this and have face the derailing of my thoughts and the exaggeration of my words. Is this being done intentionally? I am trying to figure out the best way to introduce a neutral party for wise council.
@xjasonxbx1, just a food for thought you will probably not agree with; "a genuine attempt to call out sin"... why do we believe we need to play the Holy Spirit in other people's lives? We likely fundamentally disagree on what "love" means, so for me, where I am now in my understanding of the love of God, I am concerned with my own planks in my eyes. Full stop. I don't see it as my job to make anyone else agree with my understanding. People tend to point to Matthew 18 to justify their need to make other people change their behaviors and again, we likely don't agree in how we read Matthew 18. I see Jesus telling us how WE do community, WE go after people until we kick them out for not agreeing with the way WE think they should behave and it always ends in exclusion and broken relationships. And then he tells the story of the shepherd who leaves the 99 to go to find and heal the lost sheep... I think WE create a bunch of lost sheep by making God's love conditional. We might do that with the best of intentions but the proof is in the pudding. There, food for thought.
I think spiritual abuse wounds the soul worse than physical or sexual abuse. After a Baptist Msg that puts women as second class citizens in long skirts and people between me and my Savior. I have felt so bad since and husband is not happy about going to that church without a ‘submissive’ wife. Help?
Boundaries!! Granny Gear, submission is freely given and freedom giving (I am quoting my mother in law). Submit to one another means that this freely given submission is not only met by reciprocity but also makes you both freer. If that’s truthfully not the consequence of mutual submission, you get to renegotiate your covenant to your spouse and protect your boundaries that, if he won’t, you get to protect. My two cents.
Truth In Motion Studios - thanks. I was so upset at this because I will not allow any legalists type ‘pastor’ to insert idols between me and my Lord. I had a long skirt on and this lady skirt-cop said it was not long enough. Sheesh.. It all has stumbled me. With Irish and William Wallace ancestry, I do poorly under this kind of authoritarian preaching.
Isn't it amazing that the god of the bible just stands around and watches all these evils going on... shame on him...!!?
yup, stands or sits around as the world goes through all this suffering! truly amazing!
Family is a spiritually abusive system.
Sure can be!
LEARN ABOUT GROOMING ON LINE...YOUR KIDS ARE AT RISK..AND YOU ARE AS WELL..
Adda 0:47