GCN Tech covered this as a tip within one of their videos a few months ago. I used to not watch them because they were so roadie focused, but I gotta admit I get a ton of useful information from them with the caveat that the best tips are often buried within videos in their Everest sized mountain of content. They also did not demonstrate how to do it. The benefit of you making a dedicated video for this is that it's easier to find and reference, and that cannot be understated! Keep being awesome!
I was coming to see if someone had asked or answered this, and it's a great tip. Thanks. Just wondering if there's a specific product for it or can I just use anything that fits?
November is/was actually a pretty good custom wheelbuilder in New England. I feel like they’ve been less active lately, but I’m glad to see you promoting their shims. I use them on a few different wheelsets and bikes, and the system works flawlessly. Sometimes I forget that they even are on there and am surprised when I switch to another wheel/bike. Anyway, strong recommend.
World Tour teams have long been doing this for all their wheels. They have set standard size spacing for wheels and calipers to avoid rotor rubs. When swapping wheels.
I have this same issue on my rear second wheel only. I was just getting ready to search for some type of shim, so this is good timing. The Amazon seller must have been hammered with your video as when I looked, they were 3 weeks out from shipping, I found some through Boyd Cycling. Will have them Thursday.
Excellent. Overcame this issue by filing a tiny fraction off inside of the disc rotor,bringing it a fraction closer to the hub..was not aware that split washers were available though.
Nice tip, I like it! I've got 4 wheel sets being shared between a 140mm full squish and a rigid bikepacking rig, it took a little while, but I trued the rotors on all 4 to 1 bike and set the caliper on the second bike to the rotors. Has worked well with no rubbing on either bike.
well made video. I used to do this until I got identical custom wheel sets which really was great when switching 4 sets of wheels between 2 or 3 different bikes same with the cassette. which isn't always 100% flawless but is 99% perfect.
Could they easiest way to put the right number of spacers be to see how many of them you can slip without friction in between the caliper pad and the disk at its closest point (of the wider gap side) ?
Holy cow, i needed this video a couple months ago. I got a new wheel set that was slightly off my old, couple figure it out so had to take it to the LBS for them align across my wheels. Both back and front were off and longest time, i tought i messed up the set up being my first time tinkering
I've been swapping over whole wheel fork brake and cable as an assembly. Gets me from MTB to dad bike in about 5 minutes. Wish I'd have thought of this before I tracked down a wheelset with the same hubs, would have given me a lot more options.
I have QR, not thru-axle frame and fork, and I have rotor rubbing every time I swap a wheel but I stopped caring about it because its easier than to readjust my pads every time.
Rotor shims are great, I got mine off a czech guy on ebay but I hear jagwire does them too nowadays. My technique is to measure the distance from the lockring to the end of the end cap (assuming they're using the same lockring), the difference being what you need to shim. You can also do the same with cassettes for your wheelsets/turbo trainer. Some people will put up with having to adjust the tension/limit screws everytime they put the bike on the turbo, but not me...
I'm in the process of ordering a new wheelset now. After this.. all other wheelsets I order will use the same hubs. I'm hoping that will allow changes without adjustments. If needed I will also move over the same discs (and cassette) as that's quicker and easier than making adjustments
I opted for two wheel sets with hubs by the same manufacturer. My bike came with Bontrager wheels which had rebranded DT Swiss hubs. Thus my second set of wheels had DT Swiss hubs and no shims required to align anything.
I have Bontrager Aeolus on rebranded DT360 24sp straightpull and other set built on DT360 28sp J-bend and while with cassettes it's almost plug and play (different size cassettes so maybe that's why small barrel adjustment makes it work better), with discs it as a huge difference for both wheels. Rotors are MT800 on other and RT800 (or whatever is the new unified version called) on Bontragers, need to swap rotors out of curiosity if it is rotors or hubs themselves
I've got this with a pair of Hunt wheels and another pair with Bitex hubs (brilliant by the way). They are very nearly right, so when I change the wheels, I just open up the gap between the pads a touch with a plastic blade so it doesn't gouge the pads. I think it's not a bad idea to do this anyway as it keeps the pistons moving freely
If one wheel set is CenterLock and the other ISO 6 bolt, and the Centerlock is already pushing the rotor outward farther, do you have to find 6 little shim washers for the ISO wheel? I assume so...
Yes totally worth it. Hate having to adjust discs when swapping wheels. Adjusting pads on cable discs is easier of course and it's another argument to #savetherimbrake 😎
1. Aim for thinner shims. You probably need less than you might guess. 2. Try a bearing (engineering) supply shop. You might get more choice and spend less than with online / bike stores.
I'm trying to figure out why the rotor rubs on 2 different wheels. Do they have different hub or are the tolerances that far off? I had 2 sets of wheels for my fat bike, but I never had to adjust my caliper or rotors, just swap and go.
November is not an “Amazon brand” (at least they didn’t used to be…). For their wheelsets, their build quality is exceptional. I have two of their wheelsets, and have rarely, if ever, had to true them!
I used to work in a shop where we'd assemble different wheels and bikes for customers. Here in Zürich it's not uncommon that customers get a bike and buy 3 or 4 different wheelset with it (aero, climbing, training and maybe something else too) we've only worked with those shims (on the disc and cassette) because getting the same hub isn't going to cut it. We've worked very closely with dt swiss (best hubs in the game) and they couldn't provide us with wheels where the same 180 or 240 hub model in a different wheel would have the same exact tolerance. If you really want to make it right, then you have to adjust each wheel and check for the recommended torque on the axle as well.
Cassette spacing bugs me more. I have enough pad clearance that rotors never rub. They do deflect a tiny bit when braking but its nothing that warps my rotors so I don't care.
Takes just as long for me to adjust the caliper than to put shims in,maybe faster,loosen 2 caliper bolts ,sqeeze brake & tighten 2 screws,washers are like take the looong route around the corner
Did you just weigh a shim? I'm a mountainbiker, slowly getting attracted to the road, but some things I'll never understand I'm afraid haha. Good tip though
That has to be the biggest markup of a product i have ever seen:D Right next to the air filter of my refrigerator that has 5 grams of activated carbon in it and costs 20 bucks if youre stupid enough to buy it:D
No. First, only one, not any: you need only particular diameter. Second, it is a standard for bolt washers, they are simply too thick.On top of having too big of an outer diameter. Shim rings are DIN 988
0.25mm sounds too big. The pad clearance on shimano is usually in the region of 0.25 mm per side. For sram it's less. Also if the caliper is not absolutely perfectly centered, you will get rubbing with sprinting or riding out of the saddle when the frame is flexing. Buy standard 0.1mm adjusting washers and split them diy.
Fun fact: calipers have a degree of self-alignment. So unless the difference is over a whole mm and makes the rotor rub agains caliper body itself, shims are not necessary. One or two firm presses on a brake lever and pads find their place.
@@redkeyspoke Yes (across my 5 wheel sets). Adjust your brake cable with your widest rims and barrel adjuster all the way in. Then use the barrel adjuster when using your narrower wheels.
GCN Tech covered this as a tip within one of their videos a few months ago. I used to not watch them because they were so roadie focused, but I gotta admit I get a ton of useful information from them with the caveat that the best tips are often buried within videos in their Everest sized mountain of content. They also did not demonstrate how to do it.
The benefit of you making a dedicated video for this is that it's easier to find and reference, and that cannot be understated!
Keep being awesome!
Great Tip, you can shim cassettes aswell. I’ve done it on my trainer so both cassettes are bang on with the derailleur
I was going to ask, good to know thanks
Great tip!
I was coming to see if someone had asked or answered this, and it's a great tip. Thanks. Just wondering if there's a specific product for it or can I just use anything that fits?
What shims do you use for the casette’s?
November is/was actually a pretty good custom wheelbuilder in New England. I feel like they’ve been less active lately, but I’m glad to see you promoting their shims. I use them on a few different wheelsets and bikes, and the system works flawlessly. Sometimes I forget that they even are on there and am surprised when I switch to another wheel/bike. Anyway, strong recommend.
Oh nice! Didn’t know the brand
World Tour teams have long been doing this for all their wheels. They have set standard size spacing for wheels and calipers to avoid rotor rubs. When swapping wheels.
I just had this pain when swapping between gravel wheels and deeper road wheels, this method makes perfect sense, will definitely try it out 😜
Been using washers since the centerlock was introduced lol. Local hardware shop sells the same washer for cents per piece.😂
👍 nice work!
I have this same issue on my rear second wheel only. I was just getting ready to search for some type of shim, so this is good timing. The Amazon seller must have been hammered with your video as when I looked, they were 3 weeks out from shipping, I found some through Boyd Cycling. Will have them Thursday.
Didn't know these existed!
I had to buy same wheels to be free of this hassle. Now I know there's a better way, thanks!!
Excellent. Overcame this issue by filing a tiny fraction off inside of the disc rotor,bringing it a fraction closer to the hub..was not aware that split washers were available though.
Nice tip, I like it! I've got 4 wheel sets being shared between a 140mm full squish and a rigid bikepacking rig, it took a little while, but I trued the rotors on all 4 to 1 bike and set the caliper on the second bike to the rotors. Has worked well with no rubbing on either bike.
well made video. I used to do this until I got identical custom wheel sets which really was great when switching 4 sets of wheels between 2 or 3 different bikes same with the cassette. which isn't always 100% flawless but is 99% perfect.
Could they easiest way to put the right number of spacers be to see how many of them you can slip without friction in between the caliper pad and the disk at its closest point (of the wider gap side) ?
Fantastic and timely. I am in the middle of this issue now.
I love the illustration of the hub! Nice addition to a tutorial video :)
Yes! Someone noticed 🙏
Holy cow, i needed this video a couple months ago. I got a new wheel set that was slightly off my old, couple figure it out so had to take it to the LBS for them align across my wheels. Both back and front were off and longest time, i tought i messed up the set up being my first time tinkering
Genius. Thanks for this
I've been swapping over whole wheel fork brake and cable as an assembly. Gets me from MTB to dad bike in about 5 minutes. Wish I'd have thought of this before I tracked down a wheelset with the same hubs, would have given me a lot more options.
Cool. Much appreciated. I run two wheel sets on my Revolt.
I have QR, not thru-axle frame and fork, and I have rotor rubbing every time I swap a wheel but I stopped caring about it because its easier than to readjust my pads every time.
McMaster has thinner 0.1 shims for a more precise fit and they're cheaper
Oh nice. Thx for that
link to site
Rotor shims are great, I got mine off a czech guy on ebay but I hear jagwire does them too nowadays. My technique is to measure the distance from the lockring to the end of the end cap (assuming they're using the same lockring), the difference being what you need to shim. You can also do the same with cassettes for your wheelsets/turbo trainer. Some people will put up with having to adjust the tension/limit screws everytime they put the bike on the turbo, but not me...
Beautiful. Ordering some shims because I have the exact same problem! Thanks!!!!
I'm in the process of ordering a new wheelset now. After this.. all other wheelsets I order will use the same hubs. I'm hoping that will allow changes without adjustments. If needed I will also move over the same discs (and cassette) as that's quicker and easier than making adjustments
Great tip! Great video! So nice to learn something new.
Great idea, but currently unavailable on Amazon.
I have several wheelset and don't need to re-adjust since all my hubs is made by standard and default specifications.
I said “beautiful” out loud when the second wheel spun freely lol
I opted for two wheel sets with hubs by the same manufacturer. My bike came with Bontrager wheels which had rebranded DT Swiss hubs. Thus my second set of wheels had DT Swiss hubs and no shims required to align anything.
I have Bontrager Aeolus on rebranded DT360 24sp straightpull and other set built on DT360 28sp J-bend and while with cassettes it's almost plug and play (different size cassettes so maybe that's why small barrel adjustment makes it work better), with discs it as a huge difference for both wheels. Rotors are MT800 on other and RT800 (or whatever is the new unified version called) on Bontragers, need to swap rotors out of curiosity if it is rotors or hubs themselves
Very useful tip - thanks for sharing!
I've got this with a pair of Hunt wheels and another pair with Bitex hubs (brilliant by the way). They are very nearly right, so when I change the wheels, I just open up the gap between the pads a touch with a plastic blade so it doesn't gouge the pads. I think it's not a bad idea to do this anyway as it keeps the pistons moving freely
Every time you do this (even sightly) without cleaning the pistons, you're pushing dirty pistons in so not ideal.
Wow, thanks for posting this. I had no idea 😊
my issue is the cassette! and im using the same kind of solution. or im gonna try anyway
I had a set of thin washers at each of the 6bolts under the disc... also worked and not $16
The concept still applies
If one wheel set is CenterLock and the other ISO 6 bolt, and the Centerlock is already pushing the rotor outward farther, do you have to find 6 little shim washers for the ISO wheel? I assume so...
They exist, Syntace made them back in 2015. I don't know if they're still making them now.
Does it apply to the rear wheel too?
Yea same process
Yes totally worth it. Hate having to adjust discs when swapping wheels. Adjusting pads on cable discs is easier of course and it's another argument to #savetherimbrake 😎
1. Aim for thinner shims. You probably need less than you might guess.
2. Try a bearing (engineering) supply shop. You might get more choice and spend less than with online / bike stores.
Can't say I've ever had this problem with my stock diverge dismiss wheels and my bontrager aeolus wheels.
Looks like the shims aren't available on Amzn right now. Is there an alternate source, or dimensions?
What is the id & od of the shims?
Brilliant! Totally worth it.
You could probably get like 20 of the same dimensional shim from McMaster for less than $16 shipped. Like maybe part # 98089A284.
FYI pack of 10 with shipping + tax is $22
These don't seem to be split. How did you get them past the centerlock splines?
Such a simple but genius tip! Thank you!!!
Great info, also short and to the point👍
I can realign the brake disc more quickly, or get 10 aluminum washers from the hardware store for the brake disc
Awesome video, thanx!
Is there something like this for hubs? So that you don’t have to retune the rear D eqch time you swap wheel sets
Probably not.
I'm trying to figure out why the rotor rubs on 2 different wheels. Do they have different hub or are the tolerances that far off? I had 2 sets of wheels for my fat bike, but I never had to adjust my caliper or rotors, just swap and go.
Different hubs
Wow great tip. Thanks!
Great tip!
I think its quicker to just reset the caliper ?🤔
Once you install shims, you don’t have to mess with calipers at all
this is actually such a great trick! thanks
November is not an “Amazon brand” (at least they didn’t used to be…). For their wheelsets, their build quality is exceptional. I have two of their wheelsets, and have rarely, if ever, had to true them!
Genius!
Can’t find a six bolt variant shim. Anyone got a link? TIA.
Syntace made them in 2015, not sure if they're still in production. Use the search term "6-bolt rotor shim".
brilliant, thanks!
the price is a crime. but I still bought and use them. wish there was some competition in the space!
Super smart!!!!!!!!!!!
Dope. Thanks!
If you using a gravel bike or one all round bike for road and gravel, this is a decent solution. 👍
Awesome find!
Rides of Japan made a video on this exact topic a while back. The easiest solution was to get the same hubs across both wheel sets.
Certainly not the cheapest option tho..
That would be HELLA expensive to do. Especially if you own 3+ different wheelsets.
was just thinking that , took as long to just re set up
I used to work in a shop where we'd assemble different wheels and bikes for customers. Here in Zürich it's not uncommon that customers get a bike and buy 3 or 4 different wheelset with it (aero, climbing, training and maybe something else too) we've only worked with those shims (on the disc and cassette) because getting the same hub isn't going to cut it. We've worked very closely with dt swiss (best hubs in the game) and they couldn't provide us with wheels where the same 180 or 240 hub model in a different wheel would have the same exact tolerance. If you really want to make it right, then you have to adjust each wheel and check for the recommended torque on the axle as well.
@@TheBikeSauceUnless you know this before getting the 2nd wheelset.
Interesting product 👍
Cassette spacing bugs me more. I have enough pad clearance that rotors never rub. They do deflect a tiny bit when braking but its nothing that warps my rotors so I don't care.
Takes just as long for me to adjust the caliper than to put shims in,maybe faster,loosen 2 caliper bolts ,sqeeze brake & tighten 2 screws,washers are like take the looong route around the corner
😆😆
difference is, you put shims only once per lifetime of the rotor. While caliper adjustment is needed every wheel swap.
Did you just weigh a shim? I'm a mountainbiker, slowly getting attracted to the road, but some things I'll never understand I'm afraid haha. Good tip though
Fantastic
Oh hell yeah.
That has to be the biggest markup of a product i have ever seen:D
Right next to the air filter of my refrigerator that has 5 grams of activated carbon in it and costs 20 bucks if youre stupid enough to buy it:D
Lucky both my bikes agree with each other with all 4 wheelsets
I really wish I had this problem *cries quietly in single wheelset despair*
november is not an amazon brand. wtf are you taking about?
Instantly sold-out / not available
Nice. It never ends with disc brakes 😢
😆😆
ebay - Shim Washers 0.1/0.2/0.3/0.5mm Thick DIN 988 High Quality 304 Stainless Steels M35x45x0.2mm 5pcs at $5.94
The hero we all need!
I can buy another hub with the price of these shims lmao
Seems to be a bit of GENIUS hyper-inflation going on….
‘Very Smart Tip for Bikes w 2 Wheelsets’ didn’t have the same oomph
Easier to just get a second bike for the second wheelset
😆 there you go
Here's what I do. I loosen BOTH caliper bolts, squeeze brake, and evenly tighten the bolts, they self center this way.
Thats what he’s trying to eliminate, The whole reason for this video.
@@phillevin6651ok, but it takes a minute.
It takes more than a minute, but yea some can do it faster than others
@@mazescopak405 That doesn't work for every single frame and fork. Sometimes I had to center manually.
Any ISO 7089 spacer will do. Buy it for some cents at your local hardware store.
No. First, only one, not any: you need only particular diameter. Second, it is a standard for bolt washers, they are simply too thick.On top of having too big of an outer diameter. Shim rings are DIN 988
@@feedbackzaloop You're right about DIN 988. Thanks for the correction!
0.25mm sounds too big. The pad clearance on shimano is usually in the region of 0.25 mm per side. For sram it's less. Also if the caliper is not absolutely perfectly centered, you will get rubbing with sprinting or riding out of the saddle when the frame is flexing. Buy standard 0.1mm adjusting washers and split them diy.
It’s fine enough resolution for my bones so far. A thinner shim could help in some cases tho
#ProTip 🚴✨✨
Fun fact: calipers have a degree of self-alignment. So unless the difference is over a whole mm and makes the rotor rub agains caliper body itself, shims are not necessary. One or two firm presses on a brake lever and pads find their place.
Nah man. Give it a try
@@TheBikeSauce never had to. Except when rotors were 1...1,5mm off. But I can understand that acoustic pleasure of zero rub right off the bat.
Maybe in the MTB world, but not the road disc world.
@@lastfm4477 those worlds are not that really different when you don't cook rotors on the road. Tough call, I know.
Much easier to switch wheels for rim brake bikes. I have 3 sets of wheels.
Is it though? Brake track and external width can vary with different rims. I'm a rim brake user myself, but there are pros and cons to both systems.
It’s really not the pad height needs adjusting too
@@redkeyspoke for different widths you have a barrel adjuster... Radius-wise there is no difference.
@@archieman123 I've never had that problem.
@@redkeyspoke Yes (across my 5 wheel sets). Adjust your brake cable with your widest rims and barrel adjuster all the way in. Then use the barrel adjuster when using your narrower wheels.
First 🎉