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Well said; you bring up the really awesome point that is how much can we actually attribute to the chrome as opposed to the cyberpsycho’s state of mind? It seems to me that cyberpsychosis is regular psychosis, induced by stress, but having chrome allows for the ability to cause large amounts of damage
No it's not... 1. You get a cyberpsycosis hack in the game. 2. The augments are designed to fail causing Malfunctions. 3. It's affecting their brain but not making the psychological issues. 4. A.I./Arasaka/Biotechnica and Night Corp. Are actively manipulating hundreds of people.
I mean it lines up with everything I've read in the game. That cyber-psychosis doesn't come from the cybernetics themselves. But people who just had something traumatic happened to them that costed them to go postal on everyone.
The thing about cybernetics is that they’re not the spark, they’re the catalyst to a flame. It’s not gonna light itself, but when you mix it in it just explodes. It’s just convenient that NC is full of those sparks.
as well as what the other 2 said, the chrome puts addtional stress on your neural-system/mind which makes a mental break far more likely the more chrome you have, which also explains the extreme mental fortification training people require to weld military grade chrome. Adam Smasher is a sociopath to begin which would ironically, given his particular psychosis, have the effect of being able to weld all the tech with no obvious effect, in effect being a high-functioning cyberpsycho (like a self-aware narcissist is able to better control themselves and able to hide/mask their psychosis).
As a point David was, very much, NOT fine. He was going off the edge, only pulled back temporarily by Lucy. I don't think he could have handled that for long, and would have gone Psycho. Though I think probably only violent towards Corpo's given his 'yeah mom, straight to the top' he was going through before Lucy
True; David is described by the creators as having a one-in-a-million resistance to cyberpsychosis. It’s also explained by David having what’s known as a high humanity stat, which is super important to the tabletop cyberpunk game. David was able to find friends/comrades and even a girlfriend despite his life completely changing and him losing his mom. When David didn’t pull back on the chrome, there was only so much his resistance could do
@bumperjumper even before the mech suit, he was slipping up. So I do not understand how people think he wad immune David had an abnormally high Humanity. Smasher was simply born with -20 Humanity, so no amount of cyberware can make him any more insane David could handle some. But he should have known to stop. Even had Rebecca recognising the signs and trying to get him to stop. But he was too convinced he was special to acknowledge it before it was way too late
@@kharnthebetrayer8251 no one thought he was immune but him, but everyone admitted that he was way stronger willed than most people they had encountered before. the mofo was packing multiple high-grade military style implants, not the least of which was his trademark sandy, which had enough power to send trucks flying, and he was mostly sane up until he grabbed the linear frame, and even with the frame he was still quite sane for a while, with those immuno-blockers or whatever they were. he was even intelligent enough to talk to smasher before 'death'. and all for his girlfriend.
@@darthjayder9914 Remember the episodes after the time jump He was losing it before the Frame Straight hung around a job, and shot a woman in the face for no reason. Zoning out during a fight and getting saved by rebecca. He was losing it, and just wouldn't admit it. He attacked his Ripperdoc when he told him he couldn't handle this load for long. And then got the 6x normal doses to keep him going because he refused to downgrade it. He had a lot of Humanity, and could certainly handle a lot. But even before the frame, he was beyond his limit. Flicking into Psychosis for moments before pulling himself back. Even without the Frame. I reckon he had maybe a month before he lost it anyways
@@kharnthebetrayer8251 same for Maine, by the time of the timeskip he was past the point of no return, but we still have to applaud him for keeping it together for so long.
Thanks for keeping this conversation alive @BigDanGaming The information in our videos complement each other really well! It’s clear that everything is not as is seems with cyberpsychosis, being a term that benefits corporations and perpetuates a system with corpos at the top. It’s possible cyberpsychosis is induced by something or someone. It’s also possible cybernetics are designed to fail, forcing people to buy more products to avoid “side effects.” Where my Edgerunners fans at?
My take on this is that it's not necessarily the chrome itself that causes cyber psychosis, but a mix of vulnerability to CyPsy, the kind of chrome you get, how you get it, what medication you take and how good your ripperdoc is. The natural vulnerability aspect to CyPsy should be selfexplanatory, some can take more than others. In the game it's stated that CyPsy is the result of too much chrome overloading your brain, so depending on what kind of chrome you get, this burden is higher or lower. In the anime there's medication to keep you from going full CyPsy, so my thinking is that you get some type of medication to get it installed, another type of meds for the healing process and as far as my medical knowledge goes you'll probably need some to keep the chrome in your body without it being rejected. Depending on the skills of your ripperdoc you may need more or less medication during install and healing, also the quality of medication is influenced by the ripperdoc. And then, depending on if he did a good job connecting everything to your nervous system, that may also make you more prone to get CyPsy.
According to the TVTropes page on the original Tabletop game, cyberpsycosis can result in a myriad of severe mental health issues. it's just that "guy goes into catatonic state due to implants" gets a lot less press than "guy goes on a killing spree due to implants".
I believe the truth lies in the middle. There are real cases of cyberpsychosis like Lizzy Wizzy or Maelstorm (e.g. bloody ritual), but there are also probably cases where someone deliberately turned someone into a cyberpsychopath (as in Sandra's papers, after all, we can do it ourselves during the game if we have the right program). There are also cases like Smasher where he was a psycho from the start and not murdering everything around just because Arasaka keeps him on a leash and drugs.
i think they just displayed it really well, cuz just as in IRL people rlly jump to conclusions way too fast, calling people all sorts of names just because they did something wrong/bad. just like one ripperdoc said (cant remember which one tho lol) is "the word cyberpsycho does not mean anything to me, it is simply used to discribe someone who did something bad" or something allong the lines like that... which i fully agree on
Always had a theory that cyberpsychosis is rooted in trying to get the brain to do things, that it wasn't originally designed for. There's no neural connections or layouts for 'mantis blades' or anything else in that ball of neural goop, that now has all sorts of external wiring integrated into it. So the trigger for utilizing all that chrome may be 'borrowing' or prioritizing connections for existing things that work differently, which is causing people to short out, in a sense. All these neat abilities, and a biological teetering scaffold to plug it all into that doesn't exactly work with machine-like precision, so its a cascade failure at some point.
As a medical condition as defined in the game, it's probably nowhere near as common as shown in game. Most of those 'CPs' are people having violent psychotic episodes, true, but in-game lore supports the idea that other stresses than the cybernetics pushed them over that edge.
I tend to see it as an umbrella term since the Cyberpunk universe is dystopian corporatocracy with governments either being as corrupt or incompetent. There might be cases where sudden & rapid augmentation could be the main cause but those are rare and usually lacked any post operation support or follow up. Most likely the corporations and gov't didn't do a thorough job when studying how cyberware(especially some models or types of cyberware) might negatively affect people because they had their own agendas when pushing for it so no follow up on how cyberware could affect soldiers or civilians and who would try 50 years later when cyberware is major industry with other side industry. Combine this with a dysfunctional society with poorly managed safety nets at best and the "cyberpsychosis" just covers a multitude of mental health issues that accrue from a bad life and the effects of cyberware usage or abuse.
There is a note in one of the Cyber Psycho sightings, I think the one with a netrunner/researcher woman and a few turrets. The note is mostly about the cyberpsichosis condition. She explicitly talks about the "silent cyber psychos" - those with just a minor augment - that might not even have weapons. And how they gradually withdrawal from the real world. In that memo, her hypothesis is that cyberpsychosis is a condition that "blurres the lines between the real world and imagination". It just so happens that fully chrormed out, violence-inclined dudes with weapons that don't know what's real end up on a killing spree. While a bum with a replacement kneecap ends up just secluding himself from society.
OR the condition is a biproduct of operating systems meeting nervus systems that is fixable with the proper adjustments to the code . -explains how their teams can be formed as enforcers under complete control -explaines how it happens -explaines why it happens -explaines all known outcomes to each situation why was this hard to figure out ? anyone captured as one shows up either as an enforcer or guard and are totally fine if not slightly stronger
With the Nomad lifepath, you can find and reveal to Meredith Stout that the Flathead was marked to be "L.O.A.", which is made perfectly clear in the Nomad beginning that a package is specifically going to be *Lost* On Arrival. Stout's competitor specifically made it available to Brick, for whatever reason. If the Maelstrom attack on a Militech convoy actually happened, the transport with the bot was probably last in the convoy, the security forces were possibly manipulated into a rotation of positions that left that transport most vulnerable, and as soon as it got stopped, the rest of the convoy was probably told to go full throttle and evacuate, leaving the others behind. The cyberpunk world is already an extremely stressful environment, having multiple ongoing environmental disasters, and a power structure that's a Libertarian's dream, in that corporations can essentially freely exert extraordinary amounts of political and military power, to the point of declaring any attempt at Labor organizing to be legally considered anti-corporation terrorism, with expedient execution by police sub-contractors to be perfectly acceptable. Desperation is the desired state of the public from the point of view of Finance and Corporate management, because it results in lower wages, longer work-weeks, and an essentially disposable workforce.
Don’t have a particular theory for the in world Cyberpsychosis, but on a personal theory and example, there’s only 4 times that V sees Maxtac in game. Once at the beginning, with Jackie, once after dealing with the Psycho on the Pier, and of course, Rory after the Jinguji incident. The last time, or second/third time depending on your play-thru, is totally dependent on you, the player, not V. You choose, typically out of boredom or something else “I’m gonna kill everyone, see how far I can get with MaxTac.” You’re the itch in the back of the mind. You’re Joshua Graham “I had a gun, and I didn’t like how they looked at me” You look at Royce and think he’s an asshole, but revel when you storm Arasaka Tower alone, in the Fear the Reaper ending. Those security forces are just regular people, they didn’t do anything to you. They’re doing their jobs. V, and you as the driving thoughts, go through hell and back, as a sense of progression, but at the end of the day, you’re the high functioning Psycho.
Hmmm, "The Devil" ending, with V having also helped the Voodoo Boys, and alienated every NPC that could have helped with the penetration of Arasaka tower. Saburo is openly announcing his taking possession of his son's body, making him potentially immortal, Arasaka can data-mine all the engrams rich customers have given them access to with the "Secure Your Soul" Artifact program, the VDBs are probably better positioned to be massive traitors to the human species if the rogue AIs behind the Blackwall get out... Oh, and all the Psycho-killer mission targets get left alone, as well as the NCPD hustles.
I’ve always thought it wasn’t caused by having cyberware but by the process of getting cyberware combined with living on the edge and never being able to take time to mentally recover.
Whether it is or not is one of those things that I don't think will ever be concretely answered, in lorebooks for the tabletop game or in anything made by CDPR.
one thing that is often over looked is the dissociative effects of cyberware. To someone that already has a disposition for mental issues the augmentation of their physical and mental self can push that dissociation up. Think of it like this. If you already have trouble fitting in, having intrusive thoughts, and impulsive actions then being made less human while gaining extra human abilities will have an impact. Now your not just feeling that your an outsider people actually start to have a reason to treat you as an outsider. Your intrusive and impulsive thoughts carry more weight then you can actually do them. If your thought was man it would be wild if I could toss a car becomes less a fantasy and more a real possibly if you got a lot of body augs. And this can also help explain why the gang and specials groups have a stabilizing factor. You gain a space were you fit in. if you all are borged out and aggressive your actions will not cuase judgement as much and just be accepted by your group.
I have just finally started playing the game (long story short, didn't now if it would even run on my PC, so I am finally family sharing with my BFF and it does run in fact) so I haven't done any of this myself in game, but... I think it makes the most sense that the cybernetics themselves don't cause issues, but when used with someone who is already suffering from some form of schizophrenia, can make them unable to control their schizophrenia as a non-cybernetic person could do.
Melissa Rory, the Maxtac Lieutenant that you speak to in the fancy clothing, store is the Cyberpsycho from some promo vids for the game. If you had 18 points in your technical stat, she'd have said something about that because V notices that her Mantis Blade implants are an older model, the very same model that the Cyberpsycho had in those vids
it seems to be multifaceted. cyberpyschosis is something that can be inflicted on others but it is a catch all term for any violent behaviour by those with implants. the society in Cyberpunk is to the point that there is very little meaning or connection in life aside from consume and die. You nailed it with stating that plenty of people lose it in america already without any cybernetic enhancement. This way, no one needs to scrutinise cyberware and the corpos can keep raking in cash
After reading how most of these were treated before they went off, I think it’s true, but situational environments pushed it along, especially when they were unable to get medication.
Something I found in Cyberpunk 2077 on the shard 'The Truth about Cyberpsychosis' resonated the most with me: "[...] With supreme confidence, I can confirm this illness is, indeed, a by-product of the modern lifestyle and the obsessive emphasis placed on incorporating modern tech into our lives. Although cybernetic implants can directly affect our brain chemistry, they still serve only as a catalyst for the onset of the disease. Our world is subject to extensive dehumanization. We surround ourselves with increasingly more automated machines and artificial intelligences. Our loved ones replace their nature-given eyes, lips and faces with masks of metal. Some of us begin to lose sight of what is human; we slip into feelings of total alienation and deep-rooted panic. We lose the ability to distinguish between what is real and what is "only" artificial, digital, synthetic... Such people begin to isolate themselves, lose their empathy for others, and undergo dramatic mood swings that exhibit sadistic tendencies. The most frightening component to all of this, however, is that most will never be diagnosed. Not all cyberpsychos are known war veterans or former mercenaries equipped with Sandevistan reflex tech. Not all will go out in a blaze of gunfire with MaxTac. Many cyberpsychos in our world possess only a single implant; a knee, a liver. They are unseen, unnoticed. They lock themselves up and shut out their friends, colleagues, and loved ones. The world outside of the Net and their delusions has disappeared from conscious thought. They are sick and alone - and no is doing a thing about it. [...]"
I've talked about this before with my group and I do think that Cyberpsychosis, is real, but also widely misunderstood in game. I have always thought that the idea of the cybernetics themselves driving one crazy is a shaky idea without some additional explaining, and I know from my forays into psychology and sociology that there can be many sides to the dice. so my first guess for someone going cyberpsycho is numbness. Like killing, which is traumatic, losing body parts is traumatic, and in a society where both things are normalized, this leads to a psychological state of trauma in the persona (which is bad) to seem normal, (which is worse then the state itself) after observing MGSV:TPP, I note that one of the major points in it is loss, loss of friends, loss of limbs, loss, and the (phantom) pain. thus I would geuss first that the reason why someone would go CyberPsycho is because of an already unstable personality (low humanity score) that has suffered from both consistent killing and constant swapping of body parts. one of the things I note in Davids (and Maines) case is that they start suffering from symptoms of Cyberpsychosis, (shaky hands, hallucinations, lost time) when they hit a certain level of cybernetics and that apparently one ca downgrade the level of the cyberware to gain back their humanity. I can't exactly explain how that would work, but I can note that the symptoms are probably the fault of ones brain interacting wrong with the cyberware, that is, ones brain, when one enters psychosis, is not interpreting signals and in the way it was before. which makes it look like the persons suddenly gone from normal to abnormal. the difference between standard, hallucinating, probably murderous psychos (lookin' at 'chu zsasz from batman) and cyberpsychos of the same state, is that cyberpsychos have cybernetics which are inadvertently causing the trauma to get worse, (and I don't mean because of faulty parts, I just mean that the person having swapped out ganic parts for cyber parts is causing that trauma to exacerbate their unstable mind), and also make it easier for the Psycho in question to, oh, I dunno, go on a massive killing spree. who knows what shit they are seeing, david saw guns, maine saw black blocks in a desert road, but whatever it is, they wanna destroy it. anyways that's my theory, as you can see, grammarly can help this ^^^^^^ turn into this vvvvvv I have always thought that the idea of the cybernetics themselves driving one crazy is a shaky idea without some additional explaining, and I know from my forays into psychology and sociology that there can be many sides to the dice. So my first guess for someone going CyberPsycho is numbness. Like killing, which is traumatic, losing body parts is traumatic, and in a society where both things are normalized, this leads to a psychological state of trauma in the persona (which is bad) to seem normal, (which is worse than the state itself) after observing MGSV:TPP, I note that one of the major points in it is loss, loss of friends, loss of limbs, loss, and the (phantom) pain. Thus, I would guess first that the reason why someone would go CyberPsycho is because of an already unstable personality (low humanity score) that has suffered from both consistent killing and constant swapping of body parts. One of the things I note in Davids (and Maine's) case is that they start suffering from symptoms of CyberPsychosis, (shaky hands, hallucinations, lost time) when they hit a certain level of cybernetics and that apparently one can downgrade the level of the cyberware to gain back their humanity. I can't exactly explain how that would work, but I can note that the symptoms are probably the fault of one's brain's interacting wrong with the cyberware, that is, one's brain, when one enters psychosis, is not interpreting signals and in the way it was before. Which makes it look like the person's suddenly gone from normal to abnormal. The difference between standard, hallucinating, probably murderous psychos ( lookin' at 'chu zsasz from batman ) and CyberPsychos of the same state, is that CyberPsychos have cybernetics which are inadvertently causing the trauma to get worse, (and I don't mean because of faulty parts, I just mean that the person having swapped out Ganic parts for cyber parts is causing that trauma to exacerbate their unstable mind), and also make it easier for the Psycho in question to, oh, I don't know, go on a massive killing spree. Who knows what shit they are seeing, David saw guns, Maine saw black blocks in a desert road, but whatever it is, they want to destroy it. and this was just mostly spell checking, ahahahahahahahahaah. definitely check it out, its got a free version that has everything you need, and a preem version that has everything you want. (I have become add)
Another comment says Cyberpsychosis is caused by the strain of including functions the human brain isn't "designed" for. Must be related. The human brain is plastic, but age plays a role. I reckon if children get implants early, the risk of cyberpsychosis is reduced later in life.
@@the11382 maybe. you are correct that the human body and mind are very malleable to change, it is part of why this version of humanity has survived for so long. maybe it is just like adding more keys to a computer. add to many functions and it starts to slow down.
@@darthjayder9914 Your computer doesn't go haywire when too many programs are installed. Instead you need to look at the actual wetware. I was thinking the brain doesn't adjust "properly" to the implants. Stronger implants need more adjustment, or just don't allow it. Sandevistan overwhelms anyone who uses it.
@@the11382 I guess I was meaning the scenario where one is running to many applications on the computer, the computer may run slower or even crash. a similar thing may be happening here. the brain having access to more tasks it is able to run may short it out. and if the neurons are not connected properly or something it could be worse. actually now that I think about it, how does one figure out how to activate the Sandevistan. it takes us quite a while (potentially years) to learn how to do things like walking. how would one be able to unlock Sandevistan use from the get go, without any prior training? Anyways, that was what I was referring to in a sort of way, in reference to what you were saying.
Traumatics and mental health degradation along with feeling invicible with those powerful implants. This is like mass shooting problem which is more dangerous : the gun or the shooter
I think an important point to make here, is that a "cyberpsycho" can become psychotic even without any chrome. The Cyberpunk RED Sourcebook states that when your Empathy (Humanity) stat drops below 1, you go "Cyberpsycho", but it does also state that you can lose Empathy (Humanity) through traumatic experiences. You do not necessarily need ANY chrome (cybernetics) to actually become a "cyberpsycho"--realistically, a cyberpsycho is someone who was just pushed over the edge of humanity and has lost their ability to empathize with themselves or other people. They also just happen to not be 100% organic material. But, I am sure some are. Look at the world we live in today.
I think Cypherpsychosis is real, but it's similar to real-life psychosis in that very few people understand it properly. I doubt it is just "get too much chrome= go crazy". Pretty much every CyberPsycho has some sort of external issue in addition to whatever implants they may possess. That tells me that implants alone don't make the average person go into such a state. Though we're still unsure as to why implants may quicken the process... maybe some sort of... compatibility issue if we're going with tech speak? Though my guess would be quickening of the neural processes, including the harmful (aka psychotic) ones. You can use the CN-07 case as an outlier, of course, and any psychological analysis and study will have those. So, I think the condition exists, it's just vastly misunderstood and maybe overdiagnosed. It's quite the parallel, if you want to go deep with it. :P
It’s an established fact that in the Cyberpunk universe, cybernetics do, to some degree, disconnect the user from being their “human self”. So, when you combine external stressors WITH the dissociation from cybernetics, it becomes explosive. And a place like Night City is full of external stressors.
literally not having your own body parts I think can result in massive diassociation, just az Lizzy Wizzy said, her hands went numb a little, it doesn't feel like her body, then she violently strangled her bf.
i like my head cannon that the cyberware we get is loaded with corpo ice that can be cleaned by corporations. witch is why high up corpos are "immune" to it
It totally ignores the possibility of regular psychosis, which wouldn't be surprising in this world of crime, drugs, and apparent lack of healthcare and general care. As most people have cybernetics, it's difficult to determine if the cybernetics have anything to do with it.
The way I see it, it’s more like cyberpsychosis *stacks on top of* regular psychosis. It’s a well-established fact within Cyberpunk’s lore that cybernetics *do* impact your connection to the “human self” even in stable individuals. So, being loaded on top of cybernetics doesn’t light the wooden pile of flame ablaze by itself. It just means that if something lights that fire, it’s gonna explode. And Night City has an abundance of things to light that flame with.
The way I see it, it’s more like cyberpsychosis *stacks on top of* regular psychosis. It’s a well-established fact within Cyberpunk’s lore that cybernetics *do* impact your connection to the “human self” even in stable individuals. So, being loaded on top of cybernetics doesn’t light the wooden pile ablaze by itself. And Night City has an abundance of things to light that flame with.
i think there are 2 types of cyberpsychosis, hacked and the one we know from the anime because hacked cyberpsychos suicide after there are no people around, in the game but the cyberpsychos you fight in reginas quests we so alot of them kill people and run away to hide instead of suicide so i beleave netrunners found a way to copy the effect of cyberpsychosis into a quickhack
id argue with Maelstrom as well the gang members find a twisted kind of family in the gang and that kind of thing might help stave of cyberpsychois off somwwhat
I forgot the dudes name but in Cyberpunk Edgerunners they got after a guy who makes intense brain dances he was also the same guy who mentioned theres more to it than just going “crazy” to David
It's well established that the technology doesn't directly make the augmented mad. It's the gradual loss of their humanity and heightened abilities that make them so capable of carnage. An example would be the first world war's industrialization of warfare made war so costly in human lives, being that the technology allowed massive casualties where warfare was not as efficiently lethal in the past.
@A.C. Slater Correct and it could also pertain to accidental mishaps. Imagine if you only argued with someone, lost your temper, shoved them away from you, but because you had gorilla arms, you unintentionally sent them flying backwards to their death.
I was saying that that cyberpsychosis isn't a decease and that it's a conflict between the person and "rogue" A.I.'s for a few years. Could this confirm my theory?
I would say the gangs and maxtac are to desensitized. Normal people are weak and just go about their normal lives so when they snap due to the psychosis its a massive violent outburst where as you said the gangs do this all the time. I liked this video
Edgerunners clearly shows multiple characters suffering from cyberpychosis. Maine, the super soldier that gets gunned down right at the beginning, the homeless guy that kills pilar and even David at the end. He is constantly having to rely on drugs in order to fend off succumbing to the condition. Cyberpychosis is real.
What I think, that the whole cyberpsycho missions from Regina are cut very short, after capturing alive all 21 (or what's the number) of them, I thought there would be some kind of aftermath, not just "okay, done" 😐This one mission I find the most undeveloped and rushed & unfinished 😐
Of course it's not real. It's just trauma disorders left untreated and instead enabled to go to war. It's not actually unnatural. But as long as people wonder what makes it happen, they are distracted from how their society in general drives everyone into delusions. I mean, the Regina Jones questline was pretty direct about that...
I thought Cyber Psychosis was brought by rouge AIs infiltraring a heavily modified human's mind. That is basically what is happeneing to V. The bodieless AIs desire a body and lets not forget what Alt did to Mikoshi, she merged with all those engrams. Then Cyber Psychosis would be brought by the merging of two Psyches on a weak mind.
I mean... This is an interesting conversation of course, but being real, it's a game balance mechanic for the TTRPG with an in-universe justification. It's real because the game mechanics tell us that it is. Would this even be a discussion if the base game of 2077 had included the mechanic? It's kind of like Shadowrun having the weird character "Jake Armitage" due to the SNES version of the game not causing essence loss from installing cyberware. Due to how the game played out, he was able to be both a shaman and a decker, but in the TTRPG the essence loss mechanic is there specifically to force you to either be a magical character or a chromed one, with physical adepts using bioware as a weird middle point, but they're basically achieving cyberware builds with a magical frame in most builds anyway. I doubt any Shadowrun fan would ever question if essence loss is real though, even if that game had somehow been an SNES era megahit.
The way it was basically explained to me and the way I explain it to others is that cyberpsychosis is an inability to relate with normal human beings. When you no longer have to worry about basic human functions like eating or sleeping, you begin to find the same behaviors in other humans as annoying or even disgusting, pushing you into sociopathic behavior. Only a strong connection to one's humanity can prevent eventual cyberpsychosis. That's also why one of the most effective treatments for cyberpsychosis is to use reimplanted cloned organs. Essentially it is real, but it does affect everyone differently based on their own particular dispositions.
I think there are two types of cyberpychos: 1. People who got hacked by a net runner or rouge AI 2. Chrommed up people who went insane due to social issues and/or drug usage. Those are not the real "Cyberpsychos" but the society lumps them together with real ones because it is easier to kill them off instead of providing therapy. The anime on the other hand shows cyberpsychosis as an result of injecting too many implants. In other words the anime is not in line with the game.
Yeah, I think just like in the real world people use a term which has a fairly specific meaning as a pejorative. Cyberpsychosis is heavily based on irl conditions and is medically sound within the setting. Psychosis is a specific disassociative state yet people with antisocial personality disorder might seem like it when they're incapable of considering the rights and values of others or the realistic consequences of their actions but clinically are not dissociated. In the setting you might call someone who is fully lucid but has ASPD up the wazoo like Adam Smasher a cyberpsycho even though they are not technically in psychosis as an expression of disgust. Its definitely real in the setting because we're told it is. But I definitely think there's merit to saying how misunderstood or misapplied it is both by in universe characters and within the fandom.
I think its both. Cybernetics would have MANY consequences on the body. Some brought up in game through shards and dialouge. As far as cybernetics causing people to go phsyco. It is more complicated than yes or no. People snap under pressure, of course you have devious people who do dirty crap, ect. Sometimes I think cybernetics are just present and not neccisarily the cause. But people view it as though its focused on the cyberware causing it. This is a world where most people seem chipped or augmented in someway. The average NC citizen, maybe not as much as mercs, gangers or corpos, but still. Just as in our world people go nuts sometimes under pressure. Cybernetics is something I wish the game explored a bit more and what it does to you. Its why I like the simple cyber phsycosis mod. Though that mod does indacte the inpact cybernetics has as mental drawbacks, linked to the cybernetics as opposed to traumatic events. Which I think would be more accurate. I think the impact cyberwar has is more physical than mental. Perhaps brain augmentations are different though. Screwing with the chemicals.
Its a society who's basically a isolated city due to the AI's. Everyone is exploited and oppressed and while climbing the corporate ladder does give some security, mostly it just gives nerve wrecking stress and impossible decisions to screw your brain even more. Its no wonder that when humans get a semblance of power (like being capable of lifting a car, or shooting bullets from their fingers) they completely snap and bite back at the world around them that was eating them alive. To give a very extreme example: If you take a random person and ensure everyone around that person will ensure they have a miserable life, never handing them anything, stealing their stuff, even physically abusing them. What do you think happens when one day you give them a gun? They sure ain't gonna bring it to the police or only use it in self defense during a life of death situation. They are going to "solve" the problems that have made their life miserable. It has nothing to do with implants or machines either, apply this to a medieval setting with magic. The humans who eventually get access to magic will get more bold, and those that get magic strong enough will eventually snap and use that magic to erase what has been harming/pushing them. And those at the top in the Cyberpunk world itself won't do anything about it, as Cyber-psychosis is a nice chain on the populous. Why classify it as a regular psychological trauma and pay for therapy if you can exploit it? keeps them afraid, keeps many from giving themselves more upgrade's to prevent going psycho. And those that do go psycho don't get help, but are simply executed ("stopped" to defend the citizens.)
Cyberpsychosis is most definitely real but there are unique situation’s were it isn’t, since in the world of cyberpunk every person has cybernetics in them and some of them are connected to the human mind and hackers can easily hack into the person and make them do whatever they want them to do and cyberpsycho’s are quite useful in getting rid of your enemies without it being tied to you.🤔🐱
You could be right but in my opinion like cyberpunk 2077 it's not as big as they thought that they were going to be... So let's say that it was all faking.. I don't think a lot of fans wouldn't care now if this was like a game like Mass effect... And yes I think fans will be pissed.. there's even rumors about Commander Shepard that he was and that the starchild was just his fake
Ok so I just beat the game and I got the star ending. Something has been bothering me since I beat the game. If V is still going to die in the end because the relic was changing his body and mind to essentially be Johnny's body and mind. Now that V's mind is the only mind in his body his body is now rejecting him and killing him. BUT if the relic did all of that with Johnny's engram on. Wouldn't the relic just start to change V's body back to being compatible with V's mind since it's just V's engram on the relic now. So aka V shouldn't be dying in most of the endings unless I'm understanding that wrong?
I have a question for the cyberpunk community, how do I stop or get rid of the brain chip inside of my head to stop making the screen shake and V from being in pain?.
@@scottfoxwell2159 If the screen effect is constant, that's a bug. Saving and loading usually gets rid of it, I think. If it's happening from time to time between missions/combat, that's normal. Unfortunately for V.
Thematically, I don't like cyberpsychosis. It becomes juicier if you see it as propaganda made so you sympathize less with victims of modern society. A corporate war veteran given invasive implants and later becomes destitute and alienated? Easier to call him a psycho when he lashes out rather than question the mechanism that harmed him...
Cyber Psychosis I definitely real, but the term gets attributed to everything, even if it's not applicable. The sane way the term "woke" (in the real world) is treated as a *pejorative* for anything a specific subsection of society doest like 🧐
It's just Chinese gear malfunction connected to night corp hub or other corp network if you can hack people with cyberpsyhosis others would it changes their personality as mikoshi, as you see them getting paranoid as in edgerunners v is pretty much save cuz brain damage and second personality all tho night corp could talk to him in Mendez quest cyberpsyhosis is more like military weapon to make strongest enemy into combat mode to kill every one in room like atomic heart
Cyberpsychosis is just Human Nature. Understand AI is not sentient, it's literally demons. Cyberpunk presents a world only understood by spiritual eyes. The tarot cards, the voodoo boy netrunners trying to crack the black wall, aka the second heaven, another dimension. Was it Fuller that said, "If you play with the devil's toys, you'll be brought by degrees to wield his sword". V-5th root race Aryan. You're witnessing a world of art, imitating life. And I know someone will say, "no Jason, man created AI, I'll direct you right back to Fuller's quote" and leave you with one of Solomon's, "There is nothing new under the sun".
I think you are forgetting one of the major clues, the Cyberpsychosis Quickhack. "EFFECT: Induces a cyberpsychosis-like state in the target, causing them to attack both enemies and allies." As a Quickhack, the effect is temporary, but a longer duration hack with more subliminal actions maybe priming the target for more violent reactions.
the medical definition of psychoses use to be an individual who adverted extreme behaviors retaining threw sociopathic behaviors. (a person with skisophrenia, now multuple personality disorder. or a persons who separates themselves from the sociological normalities. even to that of individuals with bipolar disorder where they forget everything as emotions, feelings, ideas or thoughts from the other by a rejective defensive natures. and so-on). However in todays world a psychotic behavior or experience is referred to an individual who experiences a deviated or alternate interpretations of reality that differs from everyone else around them. so all the civilians doing their daily lives going to work, in an earth aftermath with no cows and where it is illeagle to have pinapple on pizza, that is their normal. them seeing and precieving someone even if common by parrent future stastics as a regular thing you have to remember the population for night city is nearly the 400 million count past the blade runner era, 25x the populatoin of the greater los angeles area. and building toward the judge dread era. where LA is near 2274 roberies, 490 rapes, and 224 murders a year avg 2022 fbi stastics. we dont have superclass H buildings yet, and with earth quakes ect we probably never will in california that is, if it doesnt fall into the ocean by then. but point being, current day thats .00049% of the populatoins and about 4.6% for most crimes where the majority of liklyness is rape. and those are accounted events. not the ones that arnt accounted for or marked as something else. so the actuality of those number is more like .01% and 12.4% over all. and thats today. that means walking around in LA once every 43.8 days you most likly witnessed 1 or more crimes weather you realize it or not. where the stastics in night city is 12.4% heavy crimes and 30.2% for common crimes, where you think they get those numbers humm? so when a common joe or corpo lawyer screams bloody murder, it is what it is, that the preception from the normal for the act taking place. for the general NPC termonology classificatonis of CyberPhsycosis.
as an individual whos job is a blade runner, a bounty man hunting down wrong full bots and ait who broke their command script. questioning his own sanity of if he is real or not, meanwhile having a mental intwinement with a lesser ai being, building emotional tithes within that relationships. same happens with humans and their blowup dolls or real girl life companions, ect.. they diveate from sociological norms and invert their lives into their own bubbles, which is not a mentally healthy nor stability referance of mind. weather that is socially acceptable, leagel or not. it is tasking on the human mind and soul, to point it causes hardship when being forced or having to deal with other human individuals. and thats when you see individuals like the office, with office rage outbreaks ect. where the noise of printers, and flickering of screens and buzzing of fans and processors all built into a tangable noise nothing else could be heard... and the lights went brighter as the indiviual woke up from being unconcious and had what is legally referanced to as, a moment of temporary laps of sanity. so cyberpsychosis is not just a thing in cyberpunk 2077, or bladrunner 2049, but something that is present in todays world of 2023, and has been around since 1973 as they even make jokes about it and how the times are changing in MadMen!
so the question isnt IS cyberpsychosis real? : but, is it labled cyberpsychosis, or authentic cyberpsychosis.... ie, is that indvidual having actual loss of control of mental facilities. as the prevelant deturants, isnt is his/her/its brain being hacked: but are they no longer capable functioning normality within society, as the individual isnt the judge the masses are. IE is V's chrome dome head what stopped the low caliber bullet, and the pressure on the cerebullum caused a tramatic brain injury and everything he hears is a false representations of reality as he goes on mass murderous killing spree for all these individuals who he thinks are fixers and that he is working for Dex Deshan one of the greatest and last real fixers in night city who has only recently resurfaced and came out of hidding. if so, the entire game is V's own mental cognitions of his perspective reality and created sociopathology to comprehend and fight the acceptance of reality. then cyberpsychosis is very real. making V #1 at the top of the chart, and explaining why everyone screams and runs from him for using any technology in public sight. is it possible, the relic is dead... and V refuses to pull it out because his perception of reality is he will die if it is taken out. maybe vic wanted to take it out, and in V's temporary blackouts had a tantrum and refused to let him take out the damaged relic shard. why misty is so forthcomming about allowing her friend to move toward accepting silverhand or push him away, threw the humanistic approach oppose to forcefully taking it out of him, because they need their work licenses and care about him.
another intresting example is breaking the 4th wall. like deadpool after taking the infinity gautlet from thanos, learned what a roast is and gave back the gauntlet, but in the process became aware of all the viewers. and why deadpool often talks and referances things dirrectly to the watchers. because he knows they are there. another aspect of potential cyberpsychosis, is we the players taking over the npc in their ai life script. as there are different forms of artifical lives in the game, even if in the base presect of scripted code. they might not be bionic but they are tangabally artifical threw the screen, and keyboard, as their times and days to by in a loop of each and every player who plays the game. making we the players the outside source the arasaka is trying to control, and we take over from an early stage, even before V has any implants or the relic, and the mental conditon to his/her/its own understanding is already broken from considered normalizations. and the mental instability has already commenced from the start. the wondering nomand who lost their whole family, the drug attic corpo in the office, or even the street kid returning after loosing everything in atlanta. so step 1, the indiviual is having a moving transitions, which is psycologically the number 1 stressful event a human being experiences. a simple move of housing produces more stress resonating images than; being held captive, having someone elses kid, loosing your job, and fullfill an addictions. ect ect ect. add multiuple factors into the same preset, that called the overload compendium, and the opposite of peace within maslows higherarchy of needs.
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It is convoluted but cyberpsychosis is a messed up mental health problem with it effecting those who are already messed up in the head
Well said; you bring up the really awesome point that is how much can we actually attribute to the chrome as opposed to the cyberpsycho’s state of mind? It seems to me that cyberpsychosis is regular psychosis, induced by stress, but having chrome allows for the ability to cause large amounts of damage
No it's not... 1. You get a cyberpsycosis hack in the game.
2. The augments are designed to fail causing Malfunctions.
3. It's affecting their brain but not making the psychological issues.
4. A.I./Arasaka/Biotechnica and Night Corp. Are actively manipulating hundreds of people.
It can also be deliberately included through trauma
Extremely similar to how psychosis works with drug usage
I mean it lines up with everything I've read in the game.
That cyber-psychosis doesn't come from the cybernetics themselves.
But people who just had something traumatic happened to them that costed them to go postal on everyone.
Yes it seems like the chrome, which gives the ability to cause a lot of damage, makes regular psychosis take a violent turn
The thing about cybernetics is that they’re not the spark, they’re the catalyst to a flame. It’s not gonna light itself, but when you mix it in it just explodes.
It’s just convenient that NC is full of those sparks.
as well as what the other 2 said, the chrome puts addtional stress on your neural-system/mind which makes a mental break far more likely the more chrome you have, which also explains the extreme mental fortification training people require to weld military grade chrome.
Adam Smasher is a sociopath to begin which would ironically, given his particular psychosis, have the effect of being able to weld all the tech with no obvious effect, in effect being a high-functioning cyberpsycho (like a self-aware narcissist is able to better control themselves and able to hide/mask their psychosis).
😮
Psychosis doesn't automatically mean violence though. Cybernetics have to play a part.
As a point
David was, very much, NOT fine.
He was going off the edge, only pulled back temporarily by Lucy. I don't think he could have handled that for long, and would have gone Psycho. Though I think probably only violent towards Corpo's given his 'yeah mom, straight to the top' he was going through before Lucy
True; David is described by the creators as having a one-in-a-million resistance to cyberpsychosis. It’s also explained by David having what’s known as a high humanity stat, which is super important to the tabletop cyberpunk game. David was able to find friends/comrades and even a girlfriend despite his life completely changing and him losing his mom. When David didn’t pull back on the chrome, there was only so much his resistance could do
@bumperjumper even before the mech suit, he was slipping up. So I do not understand how people think he wad immune
David had an abnormally high Humanity.
Smasher was simply born with -20 Humanity, so no amount of cyberware can make him any more insane
David could handle some. But he should have known to stop. Even had Rebecca recognising the signs and trying to get him to stop. But he was too convinced he was special to acknowledge it before it was way too late
@@kharnthebetrayer8251 no one thought he was immune but him, but everyone admitted that he was way stronger willed than most people they had encountered before. the mofo was packing multiple high-grade military style implants, not the least of which was his trademark sandy, which had enough power to send trucks flying, and he was mostly sane up until he grabbed the linear frame, and even with the frame he was still quite sane for a while, with those immuno-blockers or whatever they were. he was even intelligent enough to talk to smasher before 'death'. and all for his girlfriend.
@@darthjayder9914 Remember the episodes after the time jump
He was losing it before the Frame
Straight hung around a job, and shot a woman in the face for no reason.
Zoning out during a fight and getting saved by rebecca.
He was losing it, and just wouldn't admit it.
He attacked his Ripperdoc when he told him he couldn't handle this load for long. And then got the 6x normal doses to keep him going because he refused to downgrade it.
He had a lot of Humanity, and could certainly handle a lot.
But even before the frame, he was beyond his limit. Flicking into Psychosis for moments before pulling himself back. Even without the Frame. I reckon he had maybe a month before he lost it anyways
@@kharnthebetrayer8251 same for Maine, by the time of the timeskip he was past the point of no return, but we still have to applaud him for keeping it together for so long.
you can cause cyber psychosis in enemies using quick hacks in game, so it is canon that it can be caused by hacking someone else
Thanks for keeping this conversation alive @BigDanGaming
The information in our videos complement each other really well! It’s clear that everything is not as is seems with cyberpsychosis, being a term that benefits corporations and perpetuates a system with corpos at the top. It’s possible cyberpsychosis is induced by something or someone. It’s also possible cybernetics are designed to fail, forcing people to buy more products to avoid “side effects.”
Where my Edgerunners fans at?
Definitely a possibility, considering even the player character can induce it in others through a quickhack.
@@Kristers_K exactly!
My take on this is that it's not necessarily the chrome itself that causes cyber psychosis, but a mix of vulnerability to CyPsy, the kind of chrome you get, how you get it, what medication you take and how good your ripperdoc is. The natural vulnerability aspect to CyPsy should be selfexplanatory, some can take more than others. In the game it's stated that CyPsy is the result of too much chrome overloading your brain, so depending on what kind of chrome you get, this burden is higher or lower. In the anime there's medication to keep you from going full CyPsy, so my thinking is that you get some type of medication to get it installed, another type of meds for the healing process and as far as my medical knowledge goes you'll probably need some to keep the chrome in your body without it being rejected. Depending on the skills of your ripperdoc you may need more or less medication during install and healing, also the quality of medication is influenced by the ripperdoc. And then, depending on if he did a good job connecting everything to your nervous system, that may also make you more prone to get CyPsy.
According to the TVTropes page on the original Tabletop game, cyberpsycosis can result in a myriad of severe mental health issues. it's just that "guy goes into catatonic state due to implants" gets a lot less press than "guy goes on a killing spree due to implants".
I believe the truth lies in the middle.
There are real cases of cyberpsychosis like Lizzy Wizzy or Maelstorm (e.g. bloody ritual), but there are also probably cases where someone deliberately turned someone into a cyberpsychopath (as in Sandra's papers, after all, we can do it ourselves during the game if we have the right program).
There are also cases like Smasher where he was a psycho from the start and not murdering everything around just because Arasaka keeps him on a leash and drugs.
i think they just displayed it really well, cuz just as in IRL people rlly jump to conclusions way too fast, calling people all sorts of names just because they did something wrong/bad. just like one ripperdoc said (cant remember which one tho lol) is "the word cyberpsycho does not mean anything to me, it is simply used to discribe someone who did something bad" or something allong the lines like that... which i fully agree on
I like this
If cyber-psychos are just people with a lot of Chrome committing violent acts then V would make them look like harmless puppies.
Always had a theory that cyberpsychosis is rooted in trying to get the brain to do things, that it wasn't originally designed for. There's no neural connections or layouts for 'mantis blades' or anything else in that ball of neural goop, that now has all sorts of external wiring integrated into it. So the trigger for utilizing all that chrome may be 'borrowing' or prioritizing connections for existing things that work differently, which is causing people to short out, in a sense. All these neat abilities, and a biological teetering scaffold to plug it all into that doesn't exactly work with machine-like precision, so its a cascade failure at some point.
"Cyberpsychosis isn't real!"
Riiight... And the Arasaka Ending is a happy, rainbow-filled walk through a peaceful forest.
As a medical condition as defined in the game, it's probably nowhere near as common as shown in game. Most of those 'CPs' are people having violent psychotic episodes, true, but in-game lore supports the idea that other stresses than the cybernetics pushed them over that edge.
I tend to see it as an umbrella term since the Cyberpunk universe is dystopian corporatocracy with governments either being as corrupt or incompetent. There might be cases where sudden & rapid augmentation could be the main cause but those are rare and usually lacked any post operation support or follow up. Most likely the corporations and gov't didn't do a thorough job when studying how cyberware(especially some models or types of cyberware) might negatively affect people because they had their own agendas when pushing for it so no follow up on how cyberware could affect soldiers or civilians and who would try 50 years later when cyberware is major industry with other side industry. Combine this with a dysfunctional society with poorly managed safety nets at best and the "cyberpsychosis" just covers a multitude of mental health issues that accrue from a bad life and the effects of cyberware usage or abuse.
There is a note in one of the Cyber Psycho sightings, I think the one with a netrunner/researcher woman and a few turrets. The note is mostly about the cyberpsichosis condition. She explicitly talks about the "silent cyber psychos" - those with just a minor augment - that might not even have weapons. And how they gradually withdrawal from the real world.
In that memo, her hypothesis is that cyberpsychosis is a condition that "blurres the lines between the real world and imagination". It just so happens that fully chrormed out, violence-inclined dudes with weapons that don't know what's real end up on a killing spree. While a bum with a replacement kneecap ends up just secluding himself from society.
I like this
OR the condition is a biproduct of operating systems meeting nervus systems that is fixable with the proper adjustments to the code .
-explains how their teams can be formed as enforcers under complete control
-explaines how it happens
-explaines why it happens
-explaines all known outcomes to each situation
why was this hard to figure out ? anyone captured as one shows up either as an enforcer or guard and are totally fine if not slightly stronger
With the Nomad lifepath, you can find and reveal to Meredith Stout that the Flathead was marked to be "L.O.A.", which is made perfectly clear in the Nomad beginning that a package is specifically going to be *Lost* On Arrival. Stout's competitor specifically made it available to Brick, for whatever reason. If the Maelstrom attack on a Militech convoy actually happened, the transport with the bot was probably last in the convoy, the security forces were possibly manipulated into a rotation of positions that left that transport most vulnerable, and as soon as it got stopped, the rest of the convoy was probably told to go full throttle and evacuate, leaving the others behind.
The cyberpunk world is already an extremely stressful environment, having multiple ongoing environmental disasters, and a power structure that's a Libertarian's dream, in that corporations can essentially freely exert extraordinary amounts of political and military power, to the point of declaring any attempt at Labor organizing to be legally considered anti-corporation terrorism, with expedient execution by police sub-contractors to be perfectly acceptable.
Desperation is the desired state of the public from the point of view of Finance and Corporate management, because it results in lower wages, longer work-weeks, and an essentially disposable workforce.
Wait, how do you discover that? I've gone through that quest as a Nomad and don't remember that being an option.
Don’t have a particular theory for the in world Cyberpsychosis, but on a personal theory and example, there’s only 4 times that V sees Maxtac in game. Once at the beginning, with Jackie, once after dealing with the Psycho on the Pier, and of course, Rory after the Jinguji incident.
The last time, or second/third time depending on your play-thru, is totally dependent on you, the player, not V. You choose, typically out of boredom or something else “I’m gonna kill everyone, see how far I can get with MaxTac.” You’re the itch in the back of the mind. You’re Joshua Graham “I had a gun, and I didn’t like how they looked at me” You look at Royce and think he’s an asshole, but revel when you storm Arasaka Tower alone, in the Fear the Reaper ending. Those security forces are just regular people, they didn’t do anything to you. They’re doing their jobs.
V, and you as the driving thoughts, go through hell and back, as a sense of progression, but at the end of the day, you’re the high functioning Psycho.
i would love to see you do a "worst cyberpunk playthrough possible" video like you did for mass effect and dragon age 🤣
Hmmm, "The Devil" ending, with V having also helped the Voodoo Boys, and alienated every NPC that could have helped with the penetration of Arasaka tower. Saburo is openly announcing his taking possession of his son's body, making him potentially immortal, Arasaka can data-mine all the engrams rich customers have given them access to with the "Secure Your Soul" Artifact program, the VDBs are probably better positioned to be massive traitors to the human species if the rogue AIs behind the Blackwall get out...
Oh, and all the Psycho-killer mission targets get left alone, as well as the NCPD hustles.
@@OriginalLictre oof 😭 that is rough
I’ve always thought it wasn’t caused by having cyberware but by the process of getting cyberware combined with living on the edge and never being able to take time to mentally recover.
I don’t think there’s a big enough difference between cyber psychosis and going crazy, but having Cyberware. Maybe the Cyberware makes it worse
Whether it is or not is one of those things that I don't think will ever be concretely answered, in lorebooks for the tabletop game or in anything made by CDPR.
Always enjoy the videos can't wait to see more CP77 vids when the Liberty DLC drops! I should go.
Lizzy hadn't been copied yet. As far as I know she still possessed her original brain and only the rest of her body had been augmented.
one thing that is often over looked is the dissociative effects of cyberware. To someone that already has a disposition for mental issues the augmentation of their physical and mental self can push that dissociation up. Think of it like this. If you already have trouble fitting in, having intrusive thoughts, and impulsive actions then being made less human while gaining extra human abilities will have an impact. Now your not just feeling that your an outsider people actually start to have a reason to treat you as an outsider. Your intrusive and impulsive thoughts carry more weight then you can actually do them. If your thought was man it would be wild if I could toss a car becomes less a fantasy and more a real possibly if you got a lot of body augs. And this can also help explain why the gang and specials groups have a stabilizing factor. You gain a space were you fit in. if you all are borged out and aggressive your actions will not cuase judgement as much and just be accepted by your group.
I have just finally started playing the game (long story short, didn't now if it would even run on my PC, so I am finally family sharing with my BFF and it does run in fact) so I haven't done any of this myself in game, but... I think it makes the most sense that the cybernetics themselves don't cause issues, but when used with someone who is already suffering from some form of schizophrenia, can make them unable to control their schizophrenia as a non-cybernetic person could do.
Big Dan uploads, I click
Melissa Rory, the Maxtac Lieutenant that you speak to in the fancy clothing, store is the Cyberpsycho from some promo vids for the game. If you had 18 points in your technical stat, she'd have said something about that because V notices that her Mantis Blade implants are an older model, the very same model that the Cyberpsycho had in those vids
it seems to be multifaceted. cyberpyschosis is something that can be inflicted on others but it is a catch all term for any violent behaviour by those with implants.
the society in Cyberpunk is to the point that there is very little meaning or connection in life aside from consume and die. You nailed it with stating that plenty of people lose it in america already without any cybernetic enhancement. This way, no one needs to scrutinise cyberware and the corpos can keep raking in cash
After reading how most of these were treated before they went off, I think it’s true, but situational environments pushed it along, especially when they were unable to get medication.
Something I found in Cyberpunk 2077 on the shard 'The Truth about Cyberpsychosis' resonated the most with me:
"[...]
With supreme confidence, I can confirm this illness is, indeed, a by-product of the modern lifestyle and the obsessive emphasis placed on incorporating modern tech into our lives. Although cybernetic implants can directly affect our brain chemistry, they still serve only as a catalyst for the onset of the disease.
Our world is subject to extensive dehumanization. We surround ourselves with increasingly more automated machines and artificial intelligences. Our loved ones replace their nature-given eyes, lips and faces with masks of metal. Some of us begin to lose sight of what is human; we slip into feelings of total alienation and deep-rooted panic. We lose the ability to distinguish between what is real and what is "only" artificial, digital, synthetic... Such people begin to isolate themselves, lose their empathy for others, and undergo dramatic mood swings that exhibit sadistic tendencies. The most frightening component to all of this, however, is that most will never be diagnosed.
Not all cyberpsychos are known war veterans or former mercenaries equipped with Sandevistan reflex tech. Not all will go out in a blaze of gunfire with MaxTac. Many cyberpsychos in our world possess only a single implant; a knee, a liver. They are unseen, unnoticed. They lock themselves up and shut out their friends, colleagues, and loved ones. The world outside of the Net and their delusions has disappeared from conscious thought. They are sick and alone - and no is doing a thing about it.
[...]"
I've talked about this before with my group and I do think that Cyberpsychosis, is real, but also widely misunderstood in game.
I have always thought that the idea of the cybernetics themselves driving one crazy is a shaky idea without some additional explaining, and I know from my forays into psychology and sociology that there can be many sides to the dice. so my first guess for someone going cyberpsycho is numbness. Like killing, which is traumatic, losing body parts is traumatic, and in a society where both things are normalized, this leads to a psychological state of trauma in the persona (which is bad) to seem normal, (which is worse then the state itself) after observing MGSV:TPP, I note that one of the major points in it is loss, loss of friends, loss of limbs, loss, and the (phantom) pain. thus I would geuss first that the reason why someone would go CyberPsycho is because of an already unstable personality (low humanity score) that has suffered from both consistent killing and constant swapping of body parts. one of the things I note in Davids (and Maines) case is that they start suffering from symptoms of Cyberpsychosis, (shaky hands, hallucinations, lost time) when they hit a certain level of cybernetics and that apparently one ca downgrade the level of the cyberware to gain back their humanity.
I can't exactly explain how that would work, but I can note that the symptoms are probably the fault of ones brain interacting wrong with the cyberware, that is, ones brain, when one enters psychosis, is not interpreting signals and in the way it was before. which makes it look like the persons suddenly gone from normal to abnormal. the difference between standard, hallucinating, probably murderous psychos (lookin' at 'chu zsasz from batman) and cyberpsychos of the same state, is that cyberpsychos have cybernetics which are inadvertently causing the trauma to get worse, (and I don't mean because of faulty parts, I just mean that the person having swapped out ganic parts for cyber parts is causing that trauma to exacerbate their unstable mind), and also make it easier for the Psycho in question to, oh, I dunno, go on a massive killing spree. who knows what shit they are seeing, david saw guns, maine saw black blocks in a desert road, but whatever it is, they wanna destroy it.
anyways that's my theory, as you can see, grammarly can help this ^^^^^^ turn into this vvvvvv
I have always thought that the idea of the cybernetics themselves driving one crazy is a shaky idea without some additional explaining, and I know from my forays into psychology and sociology that there can be many sides to the dice. So my first guess for someone going CyberPsycho is numbness. Like killing, which is traumatic, losing body parts is traumatic, and in a society where both things are normalized, this leads to a psychological state of trauma in the persona (which is bad) to seem normal, (which is worse than the state itself) after observing MGSV:TPP, I note that one of the major points in it is loss, loss of friends, loss of limbs, loss, and the (phantom) pain. Thus, I would guess first that the reason why someone would go CyberPsycho is because of an already unstable personality (low humanity score) that has suffered from both consistent killing and constant swapping of body parts. One of the things I note in Davids (and Maine's) case is that they start suffering from symptoms of CyberPsychosis, (shaky hands, hallucinations, lost time) when they hit a certain level of cybernetics and that apparently one can downgrade the level of the cyberware to gain back their humanity.
I can't exactly explain how that would work, but I can note that the symptoms are probably the fault of one's brain's interacting wrong with the cyberware, that is, one's brain, when one enters psychosis, is not interpreting signals and in the way it was before. Which makes it look like the person's suddenly gone from normal to abnormal. The difference between standard, hallucinating, probably murderous psychos ( lookin' at 'chu zsasz from batman ) and CyberPsychos of the same state, is that CyberPsychos have cybernetics which are inadvertently causing the trauma to get worse, (and I don't mean because of faulty parts, I just mean that the person having swapped out Ganic parts for cyber parts is causing that trauma to exacerbate their unstable mind), and also make it easier for the Psycho in question to, oh, I don't know, go on a massive killing spree. Who knows what shit they are seeing, David saw guns, Maine saw black blocks in a desert road, but whatever it is, they want to destroy it.
and this was just mostly spell checking, ahahahahahahahahaah. definitely check it out, its got a free version that has everything you need, and a preem version that has everything you want.
(I have become add)
Another comment says Cyberpsychosis is caused by the strain of including functions the human brain isn't "designed" for. Must be related. The human brain is plastic, but age plays a role. I reckon if children get implants early, the risk of cyberpsychosis is reduced later in life.
@@the11382 maybe. you are correct that the human body and mind are very malleable to change, it is part of why this version of humanity has survived for so long. maybe it is just like adding more keys to a computer. add to many functions and it starts to slow down.
@@darthjayder9914 Your computer doesn't go haywire when too many programs are installed. Instead you need to look at the actual wetware. I was thinking the brain doesn't adjust "properly" to the implants. Stronger implants need more adjustment, or just don't allow it. Sandevistan overwhelms anyone who uses it.
@@the11382 I guess I was meaning the scenario where one is running to many applications on the computer, the computer may run slower or even crash. a similar thing may be happening here. the brain having access to more tasks it is able to run may short it out. and if the neurons are not connected properly or something it could be worse. actually now that I think about it, how does one figure out how to activate the Sandevistan. it takes us quite a while (potentially years) to learn how to do things like walking. how would one be able to unlock Sandevistan use from the get go, without any prior training? Anyways, that was what I was referring to in a sort of way, in reference to what you were saying.
regina jones runs the whole max-tac operation, or at least recruit out of recovered psychos.
Traumatics and mental health degradation along with feeling invicible with those powerful implants. This is like mass shooting problem which is more dangerous : the gun or the shooter
I think an important point to make here, is that a "cyberpsycho" can become psychotic even without any chrome. The Cyberpunk RED Sourcebook states that when your Empathy (Humanity) stat drops below 1, you go "Cyberpsycho", but it does also state that you can lose Empathy (Humanity) through traumatic experiences. You do not necessarily need ANY chrome (cybernetics) to actually become a "cyberpsycho"--realistically, a cyberpsycho is someone who was just pushed over the edge of humanity and has lost their ability to empathize with themselves or other people. They also just happen to not be 100% organic material. But, I am sure some are. Look at the world we live in today.
Some of those cyberpsyco fights are hard ..I really think Cyberpunk didn't get enough love..I love cyberpunk.
I think Cypherpsychosis is real, but it's similar to real-life psychosis in that very few people understand it properly. I doubt it is just "get too much chrome= go crazy". Pretty much every CyberPsycho has some sort of external issue in addition to whatever implants they may possess. That tells me that implants alone don't make the average person go into such a state. Though we're still unsure as to why implants may quicken the process... maybe some sort of... compatibility issue if we're going with tech speak? Though my guess would be quickening of the neural processes, including the harmful (aka psychotic) ones.
You can use the CN-07 case as an outlier, of course, and any psychological analysis and study will have those.
So, I think the condition exists, it's just vastly misunderstood and maybe overdiagnosed. It's quite the parallel, if you want to go deep with it. :P
It’s an established fact that in the Cyberpunk universe, cybernetics do, to some degree, disconnect the user from being their “human self”. So, when you combine external stressors WITH the dissociation from cybernetics, it becomes explosive.
And a place like Night City is full of external stressors.
literally not having your own body parts I think can result in massive diassociation, just az Lizzy Wizzy said, her hands went numb a little, it doesn't feel like her body, then she violently strangled her bf.
i like my head cannon that the cyberware we get is loaded with corpo ice that can be cleaned by corporations. witch is why high up corpos are "immune" to it
It totally ignores the possibility of regular psychosis, which wouldn't be surprising in this world of crime, drugs, and apparent lack of healthcare and general care.
As most people have cybernetics, it's difficult to determine if the cybernetics have anything to do with it.
The way I see it, it’s more like cyberpsychosis *stacks on top of* regular psychosis. It’s a well-established fact within Cyberpunk’s lore that cybernetics *do* impact your connection to the “human self” even in stable individuals.
So, being loaded on top of cybernetics doesn’t light the wooden pile of flame ablaze by itself. It just means that if something lights that fire, it’s gonna explode.
And Night City has an abundance of things to light that flame with.
The way I see it, it’s more like cyberpsychosis *stacks on top of* regular psychosis. It’s a well-established fact within Cyberpunk’s lore that cybernetics *do* impact your connection to the “human self” even in stable individuals.
So, being loaded on top of cybernetics doesn’t light the wooden pile ablaze by itself.
And Night City has an abundance of things to light that flame with.
i think there are 2 types of cyberpsychosis, hacked and the one we know from the anime
because hacked cyberpsychos suicide after there are no people around, in the game
but the cyberpsychos you fight in reginas quests we so alot of them kill people and run away to hide instead of suicide
so i beleave netrunners found a way to copy the effect of cyberpsychosis into a quickhack
id argue with Maelstrom as well the gang members find a twisted kind of family in the gang and that kind of thing might help stave of cyberpsychois off somwwhat
I forgot the dudes name but in Cyberpunk Edgerunners they got after a guy who makes intense brain dances he was also the same guy who mentioned theres more to it than just going “crazy” to David
It's well established that the technology doesn't directly make the augmented mad. It's the gradual loss of their humanity and heightened abilities that make them so capable of carnage.
An example would be the first world war's industrialization of warfare made war so costly in human lives, being that the technology allowed massive casualties where warfare was not as efficiently lethal in the past.
A lot of them are heavily traumatized or in really bad circumstances and they snap
@A.C. Slater Correct and it could also pertain to accidental mishaps. Imagine if you only argued with someone, lost your temper, shoved them away from you, but because you had gorilla arms, you unintentionally sent them flying backwards to their death.
I was saying that that cyberpsychosis isn't a decease and that it's a conflict between the person and "rogue" A.I.'s for a few years. Could this confirm my theory?
I like this theory a lot too, but Mike pondsmith, the creator of the cyberpunk universe, blatantly said it wasn’t true
I would say the gangs and maxtac are to desensitized. Normal people are weak and just go about their normal lives so when they snap due to the psychosis its a massive violent outburst where as you said the gangs do this all the time. I liked this video
Edgerunners clearly shows multiple characters suffering from cyberpychosis. Maine, the super soldier that gets gunned down right at the beginning, the homeless guy that kills pilar and even David at the end. He is constantly having to rely on drugs in order to fend off succumbing to the condition.
Cyberpychosis is real.
What I think, that the whole cyberpsycho missions from Regina are cut very short, after capturing alive all 21 (or what's the number) of them, I thought there would be some kind of aftermath, not just "okay, done" 😐This one mission I find the most undeveloped and rushed & unfinished 😐
Of course it's not real. It's just trauma disorders left untreated and instead enabled to go to war. It's not actually unnatural. But as long as people wonder what makes it happen, they are distracted from how their society in general drives everyone into delusions. I mean, the Regina Jones questline was pretty direct about that...
In the game many either had mental problems or got experimented on against their will.
I thought Cyber Psychosis was brought by rouge AIs infiltraring a heavily modified human's mind. That is basically what is happeneing to V. The bodieless AIs desire a body and lets not forget what Alt did to Mikoshi, she merged with all those engrams. Then Cyber Psychosis would be brought by the merging of two Psyches on a weak mind.
I mean... This is an interesting conversation of course, but being real, it's a game balance mechanic for the TTRPG with an in-universe justification. It's real because the game mechanics tell us that it is. Would this even be a discussion if the base game of 2077 had included the mechanic? It's kind of like Shadowrun having the weird character "Jake Armitage" due to the SNES version of the game not causing essence loss from installing cyberware. Due to how the game played out, he was able to be both a shaman and a decker, but in the TTRPG the essence loss mechanic is there specifically to force you to either be a magical character or a chromed one, with physical adepts using bioware as a weird middle point, but they're basically achieving cyberware builds with a magical frame in most builds anyway. I doubt any Shadowrun fan would ever question if essence loss is real though, even if that game had somehow been an SNES era megahit.
The way it was basically explained to me and the way I explain it to others is that cyberpsychosis is an inability to relate with normal human beings.
When you no longer have to worry about basic human functions like eating or sleeping, you begin to find the same behaviors in other humans as annoying or even disgusting, pushing you into sociopathic behavior. Only a strong connection to one's humanity can prevent eventual cyberpsychosis. That's also why one of the most effective treatments for cyberpsychosis is to use reimplanted cloned organs.
Essentially it is real, but it does affect everyone differently based on their own particular dispositions.
I think there are two types of cyberpychos:
1. People who got hacked by a net runner or rouge AI
2. Chrommed up people who went insane due to social issues and/or drug usage. Those are not the real "Cyberpsychos" but the society lumps them together with real ones because it is easier to kill them off instead of providing therapy.
The anime on the other hand shows cyberpsychosis as an result of injecting too many implants. In other words the anime is not in line with the game.
Yeah, I think just like in the real world people use a term which has a fairly specific meaning as a pejorative.
Cyberpsychosis is heavily based on irl conditions and is medically sound within the setting. Psychosis is a specific disassociative state yet people with antisocial personality disorder might seem like it when they're incapable of considering the rights and values of others or the realistic consequences of their actions but clinically are not dissociated.
In the setting you might call someone who is fully lucid but has ASPD up the wazoo like Adam Smasher a cyberpsycho even though they are not technically in psychosis as an expression of disgust.
Its definitely real in the setting because we're told it is. But I definitely think there's merit to saying how misunderstood or misapplied it is both by in universe characters and within the fandom.
I think its both. Cybernetics would have MANY consequences on the body. Some brought up in game through shards and dialouge. As far as cybernetics causing people to go phsyco. It is more complicated than yes or no. People snap under pressure, of course you have devious people who do dirty crap, ect. Sometimes I think cybernetics are just present and not neccisarily the cause. But people view it as though its focused on the cyberware causing it. This is a world where most people seem chipped or augmented in someway. The average NC citizen, maybe not as much as mercs, gangers or corpos, but still. Just as in our world people go nuts sometimes under pressure. Cybernetics is something I wish the game explored a bit more and what it does to you. Its why I like the simple cyber phsycosis mod. Though that mod does indacte the inpact cybernetics has as mental drawbacks, linked to the cybernetics as opposed to traumatic events. Which I think would be more accurate. I think the impact cyberwar has is more physical than mental. Perhaps brain augmentations are different though. Screwing with the chemicals.
Dan you can hack others as a netrunner made them psycho and even suicide. I think it's just someone hacking them.
Well, those discussions exists in-game, so there aren't a definitive answer
Its a society who's basically a isolated city due to the AI's.
Everyone is exploited and oppressed and while climbing the corporate ladder does give some security, mostly it just gives nerve wrecking stress and impossible decisions to screw your brain even more.
Its no wonder that when humans get a semblance of power (like being capable of lifting a car, or shooting bullets from their fingers) they completely snap and bite back at the world around them that was eating them alive.
To give a very extreme example:
If you take a random person and ensure everyone around that person will ensure they have a miserable life, never handing them anything, stealing their stuff, even physically abusing them.
What do you think happens when one day you give them a gun?
They sure ain't gonna bring it to the police or only use it in self defense during a life of death situation.
They are going to "solve" the problems that have made their life miserable.
It has nothing to do with implants or machines either, apply this to a medieval setting with magic.
The humans who eventually get access to magic will get more bold, and those that get magic strong enough will eventually snap and use that magic to erase what has been harming/pushing them.
And those at the top in the Cyberpunk world itself won't do anything about it, as Cyber-psychosis is a nice chain on the populous.
Why classify it as a regular psychological trauma and pay for therapy if you can exploit it?
keeps them afraid, keeps many from giving themselves more upgrade's to prevent going psycho.
And those that do go psycho don't get help, but are simply executed ("stopped" to defend the citizens.)
Cyberpsychosis is most definitely real but there are unique situation’s were it isn’t, since in the world of cyberpunk every person has cybernetics in them and some of them are connected to the human mind and hackers can easily hack into the person and make them do whatever they want them to do and cyberpsycho’s are quite useful in getting rid of your enemies without it being tied to you.🤔🐱
Its a quick hack V can use. Not even a unique hack that the player makes. I bought it at a quick hack npc merchant.
Iirc the description of the quickhack says it induces a "cyberpsychosis-like state". It's not full-blown cyberpsychosis.
This is going to piss off the edgerunner fans
You could be right but in my opinion like cyberpunk 2077 it's not as big as they thought that they were going to be... So let's say that it was all faking.. I don't think a lot of fans wouldn't care now if this was like a game like Mass effect... And yes I think fans will be pissed.. there's even rumors about Commander Shepard that he was and that the starchild was just his fake
This is making me want to rewatch the glorious anime
Ok so I just beat the game and I got the star ending. Something has been bothering me since I beat the game. If V is still going to die in the end because the relic was changing his body and mind to essentially be Johnny's body and mind. Now that V's mind is the only mind in his body his body is now rejecting him and killing him. BUT if the relic did all of that with Johnny's engram on. Wouldn't the relic just start to change V's body back to being compatible with V's mind since it's just V's engram on the relic now. So aka V shouldn't be dying in most of the endings unless I'm understanding that wrong?
The devil ending explains why.
I have a question for the cyberpunk community, how do I stop or get rid of the brain chip inside of my head to stop making the screen shake and V from being in pain?.
That's the neat part, you don't.
There's a mod to disable it, I think.
@@Tombsar it's just a part of the game?, If so no worries. Thank you
@@scottfoxwell2159 If the screen effect is constant, that's a bug. Saving and loading usually gets rid of it, I think.
If it's happening from time to time between missions/combat, that's normal. Unfortunately for V.
Thematically, I don't like cyberpsychosis. It becomes juicier if you see it as propaganda made so you sympathize less with victims of modern society. A corporate war veteran given invasive implants and later becomes destitute and alienated? Easier to call him a psycho when he lashes out rather than question the mechanism that harmed him...
Gotta be clicking fast!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cyber Psychosis I definitely real, but the term gets attributed to everything, even if it's not applicable. The sane way the term "woke" (in the real world) is treated as a *pejorative* for anything a specific subsection of society doest like 🧐
Pfft. XD I'm a dumbass, but it always makes me happy to see my name pop up at the end of these videos. XD
The answer is simple. They were not blessed by the Omnissiah.
It's just Chinese gear malfunction connected to night corp hub or other corp network if you can hack people with cyberpsyhosis others would it changes their personality as mikoshi, as you see them getting paranoid as in edgerunners v is pretty much save cuz brain damage and second personality all tho night corp could talk to him in Mendez quest cyberpsyhosis is more like military weapon to make strongest enemy into combat mode to kill every one in room like atomic heart
there is no such thing as a disorder in sea coutries, its just an excuse for the weak, the weaklings, everything is in order, my order that is.
Dan, you are so intelligent. 😊
If you believe in yourself and with a tiny pinch of magic, all your dreams can come true
Wait what!!!!!!
Cyberpsychosis is just Human Nature. Understand AI is not sentient, it's literally demons. Cyberpunk presents a world only understood by spiritual eyes. The tarot cards, the voodoo boy netrunners trying to crack the black wall, aka the second heaven, another dimension. Was it Fuller that said, "If you play with the devil's toys, you'll be brought by degrees to wield his sword". V-5th root race Aryan. You're witnessing a world of art, imitating life. And I know someone will say, "no Jason, man created AI, I'll direct you right back to Fuller's quote" and leave you with one of Solomon's, "There is nothing new under the sun".
I think you are forgetting one of the major clues, the Cyberpsychosis Quickhack.
"EFFECT: Induces a cyberpsychosis-like state in the target, causing them to attack both enemies and allies."
As a Quickhack, the effect is temporary, but a longer duration hack with more subliminal actions maybe priming the target for more violent reactions.
In lesser words: Skill issue. 😅
No your wrong it's the cat's.
Its. Not. Real. Control your mind!
Nah, it's definitely real
yo
the medical definition of psychoses use to be an individual who adverted extreme behaviors retaining threw sociopathic behaviors. (a person with skisophrenia, now multuple personality disorder. or a persons who separates themselves from the sociological normalities. even to that of individuals with bipolar disorder where they forget everything as emotions, feelings, ideas or thoughts from the other by a rejective defensive natures. and so-on). However in todays world a psychotic behavior or experience is referred to an individual who experiences a deviated or alternate interpretations of reality that differs from everyone else around them. so all the civilians doing their daily lives going to work, in an earth aftermath with no cows and where it is illeagle to have pinapple on pizza, that is their normal. them seeing and precieving someone even if common by parrent future stastics as a regular thing you have to remember the population for night city is nearly the 400 million count past the blade runner era, 25x the populatoin of the greater los angeles area. and building toward the judge dread era. where LA is near 2274 roberies, 490 rapes, and 224 murders a year avg 2022 fbi stastics. we dont have superclass H buildings yet, and with earth quakes ect we probably never will in california that is, if it doesnt fall into the ocean by then. but point being, current day thats .00049% of the populatoins and about 4.6% for most crimes where the majority of liklyness is rape. and those are accounted events. not the ones that arnt accounted for or marked as something else. so the actuality of those number is more like .01% and 12.4% over all. and thats today. that means walking around in LA once every 43.8 days you most likly witnessed 1 or more crimes weather you realize it or not. where the stastics in night city is 12.4% heavy crimes and 30.2% for common crimes, where you think they get those numbers humm? so when a common joe or corpo lawyer screams bloody murder, it is what it is, that the preception from the normal for the act taking place. for the general NPC termonology classificatonis of CyberPhsycosis.
as an individual whos job is a blade runner, a bounty man hunting down wrong full bots and ait who broke their command script. questioning his own sanity of if he is real or not, meanwhile having a mental intwinement with a lesser ai being, building emotional tithes within that relationships. same happens with humans and their blowup dolls or real girl life companions, ect.. they diveate from sociological norms and invert their lives into their own bubbles, which is not a mentally healthy nor stability referance of mind. weather that is socially acceptable, leagel or not. it is tasking on the human mind and soul, to point it causes hardship when being forced or having to deal with other human individuals. and thats when you see individuals like the office, with office rage outbreaks ect. where the noise of printers, and flickering of screens and buzzing of fans and processors all built into a tangable noise nothing else could be heard... and the lights went brighter as the indiviual woke up from being unconcious and had what is legally referanced to as, a moment of temporary laps of sanity. so cyberpsychosis is not just a thing in cyberpunk 2077, or bladrunner 2049, but something that is present in todays world of 2023, and has been around since 1973 as they even make jokes about it and how the times are changing in MadMen!
so the question isnt IS cyberpsychosis real? : but, is it labled cyberpsychosis, or authentic cyberpsychosis.... ie, is that indvidual having actual loss of control of mental facilities. as the prevelant deturants, isnt is his/her/its brain being hacked: but are they no longer capable functioning normality within society, as the individual isnt the judge the masses are. IE is V's chrome dome head what stopped the low caliber bullet, and the pressure on the cerebullum caused a tramatic brain injury and everything he hears is a false representations of reality as he goes on mass murderous killing spree for all these individuals who he thinks are fixers and that he is working for Dex Deshan one of the greatest and last real fixers in night city who has only recently resurfaced and came out of hidding. if so, the entire game is V's own mental cognitions of his perspective reality and created sociopathology to comprehend and fight the acceptance of reality. then cyberpsychosis is very real. making V #1 at the top of the chart, and explaining why everyone screams and runs from him for using any technology in public sight. is it possible, the relic is dead... and V refuses to pull it out because his perception of reality is he will die if it is taken out. maybe vic wanted to take it out, and in V's temporary blackouts had a tantrum and refused to let him take out the damaged relic shard. why misty is so forthcomming about allowing her friend to move toward accepting silverhand or push him away, threw the humanistic approach oppose to forcefully taking it out of him, because they need their work licenses and care about him.
another intresting example is breaking the 4th wall. like deadpool after taking the infinity gautlet from thanos, learned what a roast is and gave back the gauntlet, but in the process became aware of all the viewers. and why deadpool often talks and referances things dirrectly to the watchers. because he knows they are there. another aspect of potential cyberpsychosis, is we the players taking over the npc in their ai life script. as there are different forms of artifical lives in the game, even if in the base presect of scripted code. they might not be bionic but they are tangabally artifical threw the screen, and keyboard, as their times and days to by in a loop of each and every player who plays the game. making we the players the outside source the arasaka is trying to control, and we take over from an early stage, even before V has any implants or the relic, and the mental conditon to his/her/its own understanding is already broken from considered normalizations. and the mental instability has already commenced from the start. the wondering nomand who lost their whole family, the drug attic corpo in the office, or even the street kid returning after loosing everything in atlanta. so step 1, the indiviual is having a moving transitions, which is psycologically the number 1 stressful event a human being experiences. a simple move of housing produces more stress resonating images than; being held captive, having someone elses kid, loosing your job, and fullfill an addictions. ect ect ect. add multiuple factors into the same preset, that called the overload compendium, and the opposite of peace within maslows higherarchy of needs.
im gonna get back to my modding, but good video!