First thing to do with a PDP is throw in a 15 lbs recoil spring. It's very oversprung from the factory (18-19 lbs) and it adds to the perceived recoil. Going down to a 15 lbs spring noticeably reduces the snappiness without affecting reliability. You don't have to worry about swapping out plunger springs, etc. until you get down to the 12lbs recoil spring. Keep the internals stock, throw in a 15lbs spring, and enjoy. Also for an ALS holster (why Safariland doesn't make them yet I don't know), Ghost Men Designs also modified Safariland ALS holsters for the PDP.
I used a spare Glock 19 Gen 3 recoil spring assembly at 15lbs and a Gen 4/5 adapter and it works very well. This is for those who dont want to spend double for the ZR tactical PDP recoil spring assembly.
I'm running a 13lb spring and stainless guiderod from ZR Tactical and I love it. I don't notice any "snapiness" and I haven't had a malfunction in the first 500 rds. I agree that it is over-sprung - as soon as I pulled the slide back, I went shopping for the spring and SS guide rod. So i've never shot it stock. Plastic guide rod - why?
Glad you said that. Because I have an arsenal of Hi Points! But seriously, I agree with what you say about people and Brenda warranty. Except for one very important point. Walther has a superior design when it comes to their barrel lug and lock up system over Glock making it supremely more accurate from a mechanical standpoint than a Glock. Not to mention Walther’s triggers smoke the mushy feel and undefined wall of the Glock. So, there’s that. But hey! At least Glock sells horse cum. 🤷🏼♂️
Thats why ive got a safe full of hi points. Ive got em in 9 and 380. In 45 and 40 (for the lulz). Ive got carbines and pistols and chassis bulpip frames. I even have a safe queen 10mm carbine gussied up in purple mud camo. Yall triflin
The con of not standardizing the Beretta 92 magazine despite many modern 9mm handgun magazines looking exactly the same just with different magazine catch cuts.
Pretty solid and honest review. I got this instead of the Glock, mainly because I wanted to be different (I’m just being honest, don’t kill me) but since I have shot about 1500 rounds through my PDP and about a thousand through my friends Glock and I can say that I like both and you won’t go wrong with either. The one gripe is that they really should be shipping these with taller iron sights for cowitness. But not a bad gun at all, a good alternative to a Glock, but definitely not a Glock killer. Glock is still king. PDP is more like a Duke. Still great, but not the same level as a king. Edit: I got the regular PDP “Compact” not the pro whatever version
Glock is only the king when it comes to sales. There's several superior striker fired pistols on the market. I honestly think that 🎉the optics ready m&p compact with the apex trigger kit is the perfect pistol. I wish Smith&Wesson would release a pistol with a trigger that matches that apex kit but they probably never will. The m&p actually beat the glock in torture tests on youtube so technically the 9mm m&p is the king in reliability not the glock.
@@onthelake9554 The glock is completely outdated. The trigger is horrible. The grip angle and texturing are horrible and it has the worst sights out of any handgun on the market. My first pistol was a glock so I know for a fact that it's inferior to the competition.
@@Shenmue06 Your opinion , and I have mine . Mine is based on decades of experience with hundreds of Pistols . If I go to pleasure , target , competition shoot I do NOT take a Glock . If you bump into me in an alley I WILL have a Glock . Probably two.
@@onthelake9554 my opinion is actually right though. You're just familiar with a glock and trust it. The truth is that it's been surpassed my multiple companies. If glock was a newly released firearm in 2023 no one would be buying them! That's a fact 💯. Glock only sells because it was the first polymer striker fired pistol.
This is all I've ever wanted ｡^‿^｡ I think I'd be less beholden to the PDP if glock would do literally anything to compete in the areas non-glocks excel. Considering the dominance glock has in the aftermarket, I can't help but think if Glock had used the RMR footprint instead of the MOS system, RMR might have become the defacto universal standard and the plate system would be a lot less common. Glock is a great gun, but with a long list of missed opportunities. PDP just ticks more boxes for me, but I do really hate accessory shopping for it.
I think the real Glock killer is just going to be Glock clones that have more base features for the same or less price. Direct optics cuts, grip shape/texture improvements, slightly nicer triggers and sights. It doesn't take much to upgrade a Glock.
"do literally anything to compete in the areas non-glocks excel." Have you picked up a Gen5 Glock? They added the big things the aftermarket 'glock clones' were doing straight from the factory. The interchangeable backstraps, improved barrel, and massively improving the trigger. As someone who owns multiple Shadow Systems among other things, I would just take a Gen5 glock in every regard besides the Optics mounting and frame stipples.
@tv321123 how have your Shadow Systems been? I held one in store and really liked the feel, esp stippling, thumb ledge, and magwell. Made an overall really great impression, but some reviews have been mixed about reliability. Sounds like they have great customer service, but I don't want to need it.
@@ctc2469 I don't think that's at all the point that OP or Hop is trying to make here. The point, as mentioned by Hop in the video, is that he wouldn't recommend running out to sell your currently-owned Glock to replace it with this or another handgun.
How about the other way around. Walther PPQ is my first gun, should I be trying to find a Glock I like? What Glock is out there that is as close to a Walther as possible. Closest I found is shadow systems@@MotoCampAdventure
Hop, I have > 1000 rounds through my PDP 4” compact now. I mounted an Aimpoint Acro and installed Walther’s enhanced trigger. I think the PDP is better than the Glock 17/19 when running an optic. It is easier for me to draw the gun from a holster and find the dot, place shots on target quickly. Without the red dot, the Glock is better (less perceived recoil and a low bore height axis). The PDP’s grip angle was made for red dot use.
I am not a Glock fan boy but there will never be a Glock killer. For the PDP I can’t draw it straight. Every time I draw it from holster it tends to be pointing slightly left. I can’t get used to the grip. Great review.
The PDP has become my primary pistol for carry and training, but Glock will always be in the inventory. Had to pull out the G19 for day 2 of a two-day course recently because the PDP optic plate came loose and wouldn't torque back down (original plate screws from C&H were too long!)
My first handgun was a Walther. It ruined me for anything else. No other handgun has come close to the comfort and reliability that brand has given me. The P99, PPQ, Q5, PDP, the Subcompact, and the double stack 45acp. All models are awesome. I love each. I have a walther collection problem.
This is what HK did to me. I have so many other handguns. Glock 17, 43x, 19, 34, CZ P-10F, CZ P-01, S&W Shield Plus, LCP Max, M1911A1 Clone, Walther P99, Walther PDP-F, KelTec P17 or something like that, and I'm probably forgetting some of them. But then I got a VP9 and a USP Compact 9mm and both of them just absolutely blew me away
Now if only we could standardize a red dot footprint like we did with picatinny and m-lok... We would have one less potential point of failure, and many pistols wouldn't even need tall sights to co-witness..
@@Borderline5440 rmr is pretty much the standard. Only time ive ever not used the rmr footprint was on a glock slimline, because the rmr footprint just doesnt physically fit
I was in one of the last classes to get issued the Woodland BDUs in '05. About halfway through new classes started getting the ACUs. I'm glad I made the cut.
I have a full-size PDP Pro Sd, I threw in a ZR tactical uncaptured guide rod with a 13lb spring and a Taylor Freelance brass backstrap, along with a ACRO P2 and a Surefire X300 Turbo. All the snappiness is gone from that gun, it is so light and flat-shooting now it's ridiculous. Not exactly a concealed carry setup though, I like the way you phrased yours as a "hypothetical competition/combat hybrid" pistol. That's what I would classify mine as now. This modified German race gun is one of the best shooting handguns I own, I just don't have anything in particular to use it for.
Does the new spring make it easier or harder to rack? I ask because I am confused. Wather rep told me it is harder to rank with the lower (15lb) wieght spring. Thank you. Trying to reduce " flip" on my girls pdp- f w/4" barrel.
Only real problem is that m&p is clearly a direct compete with the g17 and a lot of non German pistols are not but I really don't like smith and Wesson and I really like walther and cz
I am a big Walther fan, full size PDP, PDP-F, and WMP...for me, they simply work. Ergo's, trigger are top notch I am still hoping for a high cap. PDP W (something) in .22 cal.. Extra's in relation to Glock are still far short of Glock. For me Glock still reigns. The top reason is availability of Glock parts, aftermarket replacement items, and even true upgrades. The aftermarket is unparrelled in any other industry, except Harley Davidson, which is actually similar. Almost no-one buys a H-D and leaves it stock. Almost no-one buys a Glock and leaves it stock.
I have over 35 GLOCKs going clear back to my first Gen 2 G19 I bought brand new in 1993 and I still have that one with over 25k rounds through it. Except for tritium night sights ALL of mine are bone stock and shoot just fine. That's a greenhorn nOOb late comer problem thinking they needed modified to shoot well. It's the shooter and not the gun...TRUST ME. Shouldn't need a 3# trigger on a carry gun to be able to shoot it accurately. What would these people do with a double action revolver? I started shooting in 1982 for reference and there weren't nearly the rookie amateur (self proclaimed experts) and crybabies back then that there are now.
CZ P10c , HK VP-9 would be two of the few handguns I would purchase in place of the Glock. I do have a Steyr M4 that is awesome, but there are damn near NO upgrades available for it, at least the last time I searched.
I love the p10c because it provides some of what I like regarding ergos/trigger of the VP9/PDP, but the geometry/low recoil of the Glock. To me it’s the best of both worlds. I haven’t seen anything better at that sub $1000 price point, polymer striker fired gun.
I personally feel it fits my hand better than my VP9 and I added the HBi 15% striker spring and the trigger is a beauty, perfect in my opinion. I also have the Lobos trigger in my VP9 and yes it's very good but like a 1lb heavier than my P10.
@@awokeone7997 couldn’t agree more. I have the apex trigger which has 4k rounds through it, so it’s about 3.5 lbs. Butter. I love a crisp wall. I’m trying to get used to my p365 XL but I’m having a hard time with its lack of a crisp wall. The p10c ruined me
@@aztronomy7457 I agree with you on the good wall the trigger has and that's why I like the P10/VP9 and M&P 2.0 with the Apex trigger but the VP9 has the best rest
Need to shill for the Steyr M9-A1 and A2MF pistols Been concealed carrying the M9-A1 for a decade now It doesn't really have any after market mods, but it also doesn't need ANY (other than grip tape because that grip is smooth) Fires 9 but recoils like a .380, has a bore axis that would make a CZ blush, has a higher grip than most guns on the market save the Alien, and she just runs without problem. It also has a completely unique sighting system that I feel is faster than any red dot, they are trapezoid sights, stupid fast to get on target Love the fucking thing but Steyr didn't market it AT ALL so almost nobody has heard of one let alone fired one, and it's a shame, because it was made by a former glock employee and honestly feels like a Glock 2.0
Have over 5k rounds on my 4.5" full size pdp. Everything still oem other than a sprinco guide rod system running red spring. Literally eats EVERYTHING I feed her and the barrel is still more accurate than I am. From a bag I can stack shots of hst & gold dot on top each other at 20 yards. Only issue I've had was from the blue follower magazine springs being absolute JUNK. They wear out WAYYYY before quoted compression cycles. Luckily ghost inc makes 10%+ stainless steel full size Walther pdp spring replacement. They have been 100% reliable over hundreds of cycles. Only negative is that your 18rd mags turn into 17rd which I'm perfectly fine with for reliability sake.
Greetings from Austria 🇦🇹 😀 where as an armed bodyguard, I carry the Canik Rival.. and qualify as an outcast 😅 But i do have the max allowed 20rd mags, the best trigger ever in a polymer pistol and incredible accuracy.
My edc is a PDP compact with a 5 inch barrel, carried appendix. I don’t feel the snappiness personally, but I’ll have to compare to a glock the next time I’m at the range. It’s definitely blockier than glock, but I’ve personally not found that to be a problem in my year of carrying it so far. There’s definitely guns out there like the P320 that also have huge slides and run fine. PDP for CCW definitely isn’t for everyone, nor is it something you should de facto buy over a glock. If you are unhappy with some of the deficiencies of glock, and (like me) either aren’t bothered or are willing to put up with the before mentioned issues, the PDP is a great gun. Just be aware it’s more of ‘different than a glock’ than straight up ‘better than a glock’. Both have qualities over the other. Great review as always Hop, you have me looking at my own setup and considering things I had not before. And now I might just buy a threaded barrel and edc that comp just for the goofiness. Cheers. Edit: Holster is from Werkz if anyone is interested. It’s been good to me so far, and is perfectly fine for kydex
I carry the 4" compact no problem, also appendix. I also don't notice the snappiness that everyone complains about. Maybe because I don't shoot other pistols much. The only pistols I really consider snappy are subcompacts or compacts in larger calibers and I hate shooting either of those because it's hard to keep a solid grip on them. The recoil on basically all polymer, striker fired, Glock 19-type pistols feel the same to me. The difference for me is that the PDP points very naturally and fits the hand comfortably. I can't stand the grip on Glocks. Also, it seems insignificant, but the little scoop on the bottom of the grip really makes quite a difference (at least to me) in providing extra leverage in driving the gun down.
@@Rancor12 I definitely agree on both recoil and the grip curve. I also moved from a compact .45, so the recoil feels like nothing to me anyways In fact, I’d say the only gripe I’ve had is that the sights weren’t tall enough to cowitness. But for a gun I got for 550 with a free dot, I won’t complain
My biggest gripe with the pdp is the giant monkey bar of a slide release, I have to really focus on thumb placement so the slide will lock back. But that goes all the way back to the p99.
P99 doesn't have a monkey bar slide release? Sure it's big enough to hit and isn't hidden. But I never felt it to be too much. I get that with the PPQ and PDP though since they're fully exposed on both sides from axis pin to tail.
Appreciated the comment on over- insertion of the 18 round mags into the compact. Never had that issue with my Glocks and almost shat my pants the first time I jammed the 18 rounder way to far in on the range
What holster was that you were using with the suppressor? QVO Tactical? Also, thanks for the Sako (Saco?) content. My tuxedo cat, who’s been the best damned cat for the last 18 years, seems to be on his deathbed, so this content reminded me of old times and greatly helped :)
first gun was a glock 17 gen 5 when i turned 21. Not a huge glock fan but knew they were super reliable so i bought it. Walked into a gun store last week and held a PDP and fell in love. Best feeling handgun ever (Ive got a staccato too, PDP feels better in hands) as soon as i shot my PDP i was so sad lol. Its snappy as hell and just not very fun to shoot
One cool feature that Walther has over the Glock in terms of different generations is the fact that you can swap slide between the pdp, ppq and p99 (on polymer frames) regardless of the frame size. So if you wanted too you can put a pdp slide on a ppq m1 or p99 frame to use the lever release. Took a while for Glock to do that with the Glock 45, 47 , and glock 49. I’m a Walther shill but I agree it won’t kill Glock. Great vid as always!
I rented a PDP about a year ago. I love the look and it had a great stock trigger for a striker fired pistol, but I immediately noticed the harsh recoil. It just felt *rough* when shooting it. I shot an M&P 2.0 the same range session and it felt way, way better. PDPs are also a little more expensive than Glocks, which are already a little more expensive than many competitors in the class. PDPs are solid, but it’s really hard to justify the price. At that point you might as well step up a little more and get a VP9. Or spend less and get a G19/17, M&P 2.0 O.R., Echelon, p320, APX A1, FN 509, CZ P10, Canik TP9 Elite/Mete SFx,
You said you try to read all the comments in you 100k q&a so I wanted you remind you that you’re nobody til somebody loves you. And that somebody- is me. I love you🤠
I’ve been carrying my PDP from right around when it came out. Before carrying I tested it with 500ish rounds and loved it. Threw on my RMR, Surefire, ordered T1C holster and good to go. Have at least 3,000 rounds through it with various ammo, hollow/ ball/light/heavy etc…. Never had a hiccup and trust my life with it.
I have a PDP F series. I wont say its a glock killer, but for me, I prefer it over a glock. I carry a glock for work and have G21 at home. I dont hate glocks but I prefer the PDP.
I think their "compact" and fullsize labels are hilarious and the "f is for female" marketing was atrocious. Men in the gun industry are stupid and sexist whether they want to admit it or not. Plus having PDP F Series and PDP FS makes things harder to differentiate. The F series fits my hand better, but I just like the looks of a 5 inch compact.
PDP-F isn't as snappy Got a PPQ & installed the flat face metal trigger (but not the comp. trigger springs as the DPT instructions said it's wasn't drop safe with the comp. trigger springs. Also got the PDP-F 3.5 and swapped the barrel with a spare 4" barrel. I fully agree about the flush 15 round mag for concealment.
To me, the Walthers, and several others, qualify as Glock killers in what I’d call a tier “2.5” on your scale. Meaning, they wouldn’t compel someone already invested in Glock to switch systems, but they are more than “six one way…” with Glock. They beat or tie Glock in all the categories one would prioritize when choosing to buy a polymer 9mm.
And that's more or less 90% of it. Glock people tend to be Glock people...they own 4-5 of them, 3-4 holsters, 40+ magazines, etc. You're never going to switch that customer, and those customers are going to vehemently defend their Glocks because no one wants to think "Oh, I could have had something more modern..." after they're thousands of dollars into a "system". You won't unseat Glock with department/agency sales because they can provide their guns at dirt-cheap prices.
I have the 4.5 inch PDP. I didn't bother with the 4 inch because it was obvious to me this was not a handgun I would want to carry. To me it is a gun to throw my optic on and have fun with at the range. It can also serve as a home defense gun. Yea it is a bit snappy but it comes back to target right away and the felt recoil isn't bad. Better than glock in a number of categories unless you want to dump a bunch of money into a glock, but I think it is less versatile than a glock, so it really depends on what you want to use it for.
Its def snappier. A 15lb spring helps as its oversprung for nato ammo. But the best aspect is rhe ergonomics that presents the red dot perfectly and more importantly the return to zero while shooting is fantastic.
Love my PDP pro sd. I have used my PDP compact and bought a threaded barrel and used it suppressed. Ran over 600 rounds with it suppressed without issues
I’ll also say that the suppressor ready spring did warp on me after 200 rounds in 30 mins. It would still cycle but it is something I brought up to walther. They replaced the spring but I did end up buying a metal spring
Great video. Nice to see alternate perspectives, and to know I am not alone in thinking the PDP has some shortcomings that could be remedied easily by Walther, and really shouldn't exist at the price point. Subscribed.
I don't think there is THE ONE gun that is the ultimate Glock killer. But Glock is slowly killing themselves by refusing to innovate. The only thing keeping them alive is the aftermarket support, and those guys have figured out how to live without Glock factory guns. A PSA Dagger has a lot more features than a stock Glock at a fraction of the price. And with all the plastic parts, original Glocks aren't even great value or anything. But Glock clones from PSA, Shadow Systems and alike plus other competitors like the Walther PDP, Springfield (HS) Echelon, Beretta APX 2, CZ P10,... are factually better.
Love to see a video of your "the closest thing to killing a glock" pistol. Lots of different "glock killers" but I'd love your take on what you consider the pistol that gets closest to the mark.
PDP was the only gun that almost got me to buy it instead of my Glock 19. Despite the recoil I was quite accurate with it. Great hold and trigger with a sexy look. But I chose the 19 and have zero regrets.
Another issue with the PDP that I don’t hear anybody talking about: when you pull the trigger, the gun jerks to the right. I noticed this during dry fire. At first I thought maybe it was just me, or perhaps it was just my gun. But I tried it out on somebody else’s PDP and the exact same thing happened. We took turns dry firing each other’s for a few minutes and we noticed exactly the same phenomenon. For some reason, right as the trigger breaks, there’s a slight but noticeable jerk to the right. No matter how good your grip is or how steady you can press the trigger. I have not noticed this on any other handguns that I’ve personally used.
I know exactly what you are referring to, but if I recall correctly it wasn't unique to Walther. I'm pretty sure my VP9 and a few others experienced the same phenomenon.
Coming from a person who used both the m and p 2.0 and the glock, the m and p is a glock killer. Literally better in every way except aftermarket support.
I didn't sell my glock but I did trade it as a carry gun for my VP9. I generally don't sell anything. I carry an hk and I do love my Walther PPQ above all.
I totally agree with you the term Glock killer is ridicules. The term Glock alternative is more relevant Glock set the standard and is an excellent gun, but other manufacturers have raised their bar because of this and you can buy pistols just as reliable and quality made as the Glock now.
I was always thinking "why is it so BIG?" The P99 had a problem with being really snappy but it was so LIGHT. Reasonable tradeoff for a police gun that will likely never leave the holster. Makes me wonder if they tried to make it chunkier to tame the recoil for the commercial market and just failed horribly.
@@jarvy251 This exact configuration is LITERALLY a single damn ounce heavier than a bare bones Gen 5 Glock. That is almost ENTIRELY made up by the longer barrel and magwell.
Note that RDR gear mods will work with the PDP PRO SD compact and full size without a compensator, but once you add the comp, there isn’t a safariland that can be modded to fit the full size with comp. Compact + compensator should work, full size won’t. I had asked RDR about my pro sd full size and he went through the trouble of buying the materials to test it out for me but no dice. I ended up going with a local custom kydex shop for my full size with comp and tlr1.
I've got 6 handguns and none are a Glock (1 is the PDP SD Pro, another is a CZ75, both mentioned). Strange thing is... I don't even want a Glock. And every time I touch one I can't wait to put it down. I don't get the whole Glock cult thing. Is something wrong with me?
I remember being a kid and wanting a Glock so badly. The sadness of how poorly a stock Glock shoots when I first shot one was what pushed me into CZ, especially since the p10 just came out when I turned 21.
That is one of the reasons I got rid of both my Glock's years ago, shoots poorly and feels like a brick in my hand, uncomfortable to say the least. Glock is a resilient gun with tons of aftermarket support but just not for me.
And is ignored by every glock shill, which is what allows glock to be so prolific in the industry still. Hands down a better out of the box item (which is the ONLY criteria that should matter.)
legit rolled into the comment section to say this. If the P10C couldn't kill glock, nothing short of a complete technological revolution will. The gun is better in literally every way.
LMFAO, yeah right the P10 can be had for $299 just to get it to move. All the hoopla when it was being released saying it would be the G19 killer and it doesn't even rank in the top 5 semi-autos sold. period.
I would like to see a comprehensive PSA dagger review by Hop of all the variants (full size, compact, micro, etc). Considering that it is a Glock gen3 clone, and is a gun that is just fine for people that are not wrong handed (no right side slide release), and I would like to see Hop's realistic harsh complaint, through all of the pistol variants. And I would like to see his thoughts on purchasing just the frame and upgrading everything else within it, basically starting out only with the frame and upgrading it with a complete slide assembly (such as Hooper Gun Works complete slides), and a decent reliable aftermarket trigger (Example: Tyrant CNC trigger bar and flat trigger).
@@jacobhaynieful I have yet to see a DOA dagger. Even if that happened, PSA has great customer service and it would easily be repaired. PSA only has these options based on their 2012 build construction.
@@RedZeppelinAirship I believed the internet PSA fan hype. The notch in the slide for the slide stop wasn't even cut, the rear sight couldn't be drifted enough to zero it, and it would feed a few rounds at a time before it would shit the bed. I don't care how good the warranty is if they're willing to send me a non functional pistol in the first place
@@jacobhaynieful rear sight couldn’t be drifted? You did use a Glock sight moving tool right? Like you didn’t just smack the rear sight with a hammer or the grip of a screwdriver? Were you using glock brand mags? I have seen cheap ETS mags double feed. I had gotten the wrong complete PSA glock slide assembly than I had ordered, they sent me the slide I wanted and told me to keep the other as an extra as compensation. That’s like 270 dollars of free stuff for a simple phone call and order number, and I have used both slides and neither have jammed. I understand the frustration, but not even trying to use their customer service and still complaining about one of the cheapest pistols on the market, for maybe having a single lemon out of a batch of 10000, is redundant since you never actually went through the 25 minutes of chatting to customer service, and never got a fair representation of a dagger. That’s like getting the wrong food at a restaurant but not complaining or are too scared to say anything so you eat whatever they handed you
For people looking for a holster for a PDP the Safariland 6390RDS-4502-131 for a p320 fits perfectly on my PDP pro full size. Just had to take out the barrel plug in the holster so the threaded barrel would fit.
Bought a walther CCP about 10 years ago (whenever it came out). Firing mechanism failed within the first 500 rounds (less than that actually, I think). Sent it in and customer service was crap. My barrel got all jacked up because of it. Never got an answer as to why it happened or if they would replace my barrel. They sent me a sticker; that’s it. I will NEVER buy another walther ever again.
My buddy had one that exploded on him about 500 rounds in. The little hook in the rear cracked and sent the slide, along with all of the internals, flying forward when he shot. It also just so happened that it was his first day ever of competition shooting. Left a pretty sour taste in my mouth about Walther pistols.
The CCP is probably Walther’s worst pistol even after the attempted rerelease. Not to mention there’s not much reason for it to still exist when they already offer better pistols that fulfill the same niche.
Been running a pdp compact for carry and competition, eventually just sold it and bought a glock17. Its the snappiest 9mm ive shot and i grew to hate it
I think that pdp is by far better gun than glock like almost all other succesful handguns, all glock killers are glock killers not in way that they took market but in way that they are better handguns, they just have almost everything better, so i dislike video, and then i see a cat, and i say i need to like this video so i did it, just because of cat 😻
Nice review. Glad to see the Walther pistol and I'll pass. I am happy with my CZ P10 F that is Optics and Suppressor ready. Came with Suppressor height sights that i picked up for under $500
I tried several pistols earlier that year when I was fed up with my cz p10 f and sold it. I also tried a PDP full size 5 inch. I didnt like the recoil impulse, I had a tendency to press down on the slide release and overall impression was so so. Likes the trigger and the texture. Recently I was able to shoot a pdp compact 4 inch. I grabbed that thing and thought it would be worse than the full size model. The grip felt a bit short. The small back panel was installed. And Iam 6'4 with large hands. I was very suprised that the gun felt more comfortable to me than the bigger model. It pointed better and it shot flatter for me. Sometimes the "ergonomics" and behaviour of guns is puzzeling to me.
I love you Hop instantly compares the aftermarket support of a new pistol series that's been out for only a few years vs Glock that's been around 40 years now..
I would compare it to Walther's 40 year old pistol but they discontinue everything after about a decade, because none of it is really competitive. Enjoy the meager support the PDP has while it lasts because after they replace it with yet another handgun, you're not even going to have that.
One thing about those Dara holsters - make sure you loctite the shit out of those 2 bolts that keep it together. I've never had to loctite any of my Safariland holsters and I've used them for almost 10yrs now almost everyday as an LE. I had to buy a Dara holster because I was using the new G21 G5, and Safariland doesn't make a holster. I could feel my gun moving around one day at work, put my hand on my holster, and realized both of the retention screws were completely gone, so the gun was barely being held in the holster. Not the best feeling as a cop. I'm also someone who takes the gun out of my holster before literally every single shift, so it wasn't like that when I started my day. I turn on my 508T, press check and make sure my TLR1 is working before every shift.
Does anyone have the slide weight on the 4.5” vs a g17? Same with a height over bore measurement for both. I’ve always heard this, but never seen the numbers
@@gammatheta491 Bore axis on Glocks is about 1.25", last I checked the PDP has the same bore axis as the PPQ, of approximately 1.5", which is right in line with 90% of polymer striker fire guns.
It would shoot better if it wasn’t over sprung. Bore height naturally has something to do with it. My PPQ (15.7 oz)is the closest thing I have to weigh but its slide assembly is actually lighter than a G19 (17.1oz). I believe the PDP slide has measured even lighter than the PPQ. My PPQ and G19 are very comparable. Unfortunately I can’t weigh my 4.5” PDP as it has an optic and I no longer have a G17, but I would think their numbers would be similar in comparison.
Had a P99 Gen3, Ergonomic, accurate, lotta muzzle flip, got a PPQ, Better feeling ergos, lotta muzzle flip. Cycled through a few more handguns settled on a G19.5. Its night and day. Yes P99/PPQ/PDP trigger is better, and way easier to shoot groups, but they aren't as svelte and trim as blocks. and I enjoy the block grip angle, reminds me of my Colt huntsman. Also, block mags don't rust from fingerprints. I ignored Glocks for 20yrs mainly cause my hand was too big for the 9mm until the replacement beavertails.
As a Glock fanboy, the only other brand that has impressed me enough to purchase a pistol other than a Glock is CZ. And the only reason I bought a CZ in the first place was because I wanted a hammer fire pistol.
My two SP-01 tacticals were both an unreliable POS until I put Wolff increased power extractor springs in, and then my first had the firing pin retaining pin shear and brick the gun during a USPSA match. Soured me big time on CZ, which is a bummer for someone of Czech heritage.
Phew! Hop, you've helped my darling 43x validate itself. I love the hell out of it so it's great to hear that the fancy stuff may not necessarily be better.
@Hoplopfheil try a ZR Tactical 15 lb recoil spring. The factory is oversprung at about 17-18 lbs and I think that is the reason for the higher felt recoil. They also make a 13 lb for softer shooting, but maybe not as reliable. Try them both for a follow video, there's not a lot of info out there.
I've avoided buying a Glock because I absolutely hate the grip and, to a lesser extent, the controls. Also not a real big pistol guy to begin with and previously only owned a Sig M17, which I ended up hating. When I visited a buddy and held his PDP for the first time, it was like the first time I picked up a CZ75. The grip is just made for hands. It's so damn comfortable and the controls are great. We later went to the range and had 2 PDPs, a P10, a Canik TP9, and a gucci'd out Glock 19. The other pistols were cool, but I immediately fell in love with the PDP after shooting it. I've never shot a pistol so well in my life. I was out shooting the owners of the PDPs with their own pistols. Even shot better and faster with it than the gucci Glock, which had a nice trigger and a brake on it. I immediately bought one for myself when I got back home and it's been my CCW since. Something about it just really clicks with me because I can't even shoot a Shadow 2 as well as I shoot my PDP. Comes with me every range day whereas before, I almost never shot pistols. My only complaint with it is that the plastic guide rod broke around 700 rounds. Replaced it with a stainless steel one and have had no other problems with it.
"It might have killed the wrong Glock" LOL
Fr rip Gaston but that shit was hilarious
yeah that one got me lmao
It's a banger line, ngl. Lol
I JUST CAME DOWN HERE TO COMMENT THIS
I love hop's humor.
Now we need a striker fired handgun tier list video
No, we don't. Glock > everything else. Even Glockz with factory plastic sights.
@@Enjoyer.762over priced trash
@@tedundercarriage8183Buy a Police trade-in 👍
@@Enjoyer.762Glock will upgrade your plastic sights with steel ones for $20.
@@tedundercarriage8183 Wrong. Perfection.
First thing to do with a PDP is throw in a 15 lbs recoil spring. It's very oversprung from the factory (18-19 lbs) and it adds to the perceived recoil. Going down to a 15 lbs spring noticeably reduces the snappiness without affecting reliability. You don't have to worry about swapping out plunger springs, etc. until you get down to the 12lbs recoil spring.
Keep the internals stock, throw in a 15lbs spring, and enjoy.
Also for an ALS holster (why Safariland doesn't make them yet I don't know), Ghost Men Designs also modified Safariland ALS holsters for the PDP.
I use a model 6004 and a 578-83-551 for my PPQ. Works great. Garand thumb also had a video where he mentioned that you can use a 6004 for a PPQ.
I used a spare Glock 19 Gen 3 recoil spring assembly at 15lbs and a Gen 4/5 adapter and it works very well. This is for those who dont want to spend double for the ZR tactical PDP recoil spring assembly.
US Duty Gear makes a 'duty holster' for the PDP if you're desperate enough.
PDP F
I'm running a 13lb spring and stainless guiderod from ZR Tactical and I love it. I don't notice any "snapiness" and I haven't had a malfunction in the first 500 rds. I agree that it is over-sprung - as soon as I pulled the slide back, I went shopping for the spring and SS guide rod. So i've never shot it stock. Plastic guide rod - why?
I only buy pistols from countries that don't refer to potatoes as "dirt apples". Exclusively how I make my financial decisions in general.
so no FN's either.
No poms de terre for you🙃
In some German dialects potatoes are in fact called Erdapfeln rather than Kartoffeln. Mainly the Alemannic dialects along the Rhine.
@@oklahomahank2378 those dialects are spoken in Austria. You've successfully solved my irrational bias.
My PDP-F was made in the USA
Brand loyalty, and psychology is 99.9999999 percent of buying prowess when comparing similar quality items. Shoot what you like and works for you.
Glad you said that. Because I have an arsenal of Hi Points! But seriously, I agree with what you say about people and Brenda warranty. Except for one very important point. Walther has a superior design when it comes to their barrel lug and lock up system over Glock making it supremely more accurate from a mechanical standpoint than a Glock. Not to mention Walther’s triggers smoke the mushy feel and undefined wall of the Glock. So, there’s that. But hey! At least Glock sells horse cum. 🤷🏼♂️
Thats why ive got a safe full of hi points. Ive got em in 9 and 380. In 45 and 40 (for the lulz). Ive got carbines and pistols and chassis bulpip frames. I even have a safe queen 10mm carbine gussied up in purple mud camo. Yall triflin
If horse cum works for you. I won’t judge. I’m happy you found what you need in life.
Exactly this! People don't realize the tribalism in the firearms industry. This is increased x1000 in the NFA space because of price and wait times.
or i can get like, an AK with a red dot for that@@linkinblack371
Diet Mountain Dew vs. Mountain Dew Zero comparison when
Depends on my mood and sometimes the store doesn't have both to choose from.
Zero, all day.... less of a chemical taste.
Look at that chiseled jaw line. I bet she uses those jaw strength trainers
You can see it when he shoots. Pretty sure he's doing multi leveled training all at once.
Did you mean to type "she" or is that a typo?
😂
@@5jjt Maybe he was trying on big mom energy and got carried away?
Soon he/she will like those nice young men in their nice white coats.
@@5jjtThe joke is Hop is our super cool lesbian Aunt.
Biggest question for a 'glock killer'
_"how much are the MAGS broooooooo"_
Always laugh at my friend who's a Sigger and his $60 mags
The con of not standardizing the Beretta 92 magazine despite many modern 9mm handgun magazines looking exactly the same just with different magazine catch cuts.
How many fucking mags do you Glock fan boys really use???? Just like having dozens of mags laying around ?
Pretty solid and honest review. I got this instead of the Glock, mainly because I wanted to be different (I’m just being honest, don’t kill me) but since I have shot about 1500 rounds through my PDP and about a thousand through my friends Glock and I can say that I like both and you won’t go wrong with either. The one gripe is that they really should be shipping these with taller iron sights for cowitness. But not a bad gun at all, a good alternative to a Glock, but definitely not a Glock killer. Glock is still king. PDP is more like a Duke. Still great, but not the same level as a king.
Edit: I got the regular PDP “Compact” not the pro whatever version
Glock is only the king when it comes to sales. There's several superior striker fired pistols on the market. I honestly think that 🎉the optics ready m&p compact with the apex trigger kit is the perfect pistol. I wish Smith&Wesson would release a pistol with a trigger that matches that apex kit but they probably never will. The m&p actually beat the glock in torture tests on youtube so technically the 9mm m&p is the king in reliability not the glock.
@@Shenmue06 King of youtube test only . Doesn't make it king or OG . Glock is Glock everything else is a copy.
@@onthelake9554 The glock is completely outdated. The trigger is horrible. The grip angle and texturing are horrible and it has the worst sights out of any handgun on the market. My first pistol was a glock so I know for a fact that it's inferior to the competition.
@@Shenmue06 Your opinion , and I have mine . Mine is based on decades of experience with hundreds of Pistols . If I go to pleasure , target , competition shoot I do NOT take a Glock . If you bump into me in an alley I WILL have a Glock . Probably two.
@@onthelake9554 my opinion is actually right though. You're just familiar with a glock and trust it. The truth is that it's been surpassed my multiple companies. If glock was a newly released firearm in 2023 no one would be buying them! That's a fact 💯. Glock only sells because it was the first polymer striker fired pistol.
This is all I've ever wanted ｡^‿^｡
I think I'd be less beholden to the PDP if glock would do literally anything to compete in the areas non-glocks excel. Considering the dominance glock has in the aftermarket, I can't help but think if Glock had used the RMR footprint instead of the MOS system, RMR might have become the defacto universal standard and the plate system would be a lot less common. Glock is a great gun, but with a long list of missed opportunities. PDP just ticks more boxes for me, but I do really hate accessory shopping for it.
I think the real Glock killer is just going to be Glock clones that have more base features for the same or less price. Direct optics cuts, grip shape/texture improvements, slightly nicer triggers and sights. It doesn't take much to upgrade a Glock.
Are there one or two clones that outclass the others in your opinion?
"do literally anything to compete in the areas non-glocks excel." Have you picked up a Gen5 Glock? They added the big things the aftermarket 'glock clones' were doing straight from the factory. The interchangeable backstraps, improved barrel, and massively improving the trigger. As someone who owns multiple Shadow Systems among other things, I would just take a Gen5 glock in every regard besides the Optics mounting and frame stipples.
@tv321123 how have your Shadow Systems been? I held one in store and really liked the feel, esp stippling, thumb ledge, and magwell. Made an overall really great impression, but some reviews have been mixed about reliability. Sounds like they have great customer service, but I don't want to need it.
Well Glocks are subpar out of the box @@Hoplopfheil
Yet again "yeah it's okay, but i wouldn't choose it"
I dont think ill ever understand fanboi mentallity why limit yourself to one ok thing if you can have 5 good things?
@@ctc2469 I don't think that's at all the point that OP or Hop is trying to make here. The point, as mentioned by Hop in the video, is that he wouldn't recommend running out to sell your currently-owned Glock to replace it with this or another handgun.
How about the other way around. Walther PPQ is my first gun, should I be trying to find a Glock I like? What Glock is out there that is as close to a Walther as possible. Closest I found is shadow systems@@MotoCampAdventure
it's not better, just different. that's the whole point@@ctc2469
@@ctc2469 why own 5 if anything 😅
This is like a 2008 Nutnfancy review comparing everything to a Glock 17 or 19, lol.
Except it’s 1/3 the length
@@williamflowers9435that's what she said 😬
That's why it's so good 🤤
Nutn was right then adn hes right now
i wonder why new products in the industry are compared to the industry standard. weird.
Hop, I have > 1000 rounds through my PDP 4” compact now. I mounted an Aimpoint Acro and installed Walther’s enhanced trigger. I think the PDP is better than the Glock 17/19 when running an optic. It is easier for me to draw the gun from a holster and find the dot, place shots on target quickly. Without the red dot, the Glock is better (less perceived recoil and a low bore height axis). The PDP’s grip angle was made for red dot use.
Thanks Hop :) this was exactly what I needed to watch today at work so now I won't go jump off a bridge. Same time next Monday?
Sure. Maybe you should move to a city without a bridge.
I am not a Glock fan boy but there will never be a Glock killer. For the PDP I can’t draw it straight. Every time I draw it from holster it tends to be pointing slightly left. I can’t get used to the grip. Great review.
The PDP has become my primary pistol for carry and training, but Glock will always be in the inventory. Had to pull out the G19 for day 2 of a two-day course recently because the PDP optic plate came loose and wouldn't torque back down (original plate screws from C&H were too long!)
Everything is Glock 17/18 killer when you hate the Glock grip angle...
I feel this in my bones.
@@morganestillget a shadow systems. I personally don’t mind the grip angle but if you do that’s a good solution
@@Romanus-I’ve been semi-eyeing those for a bit. The grip angle does look better, but I’ve never had an opportunity to get hands on one.
this dude is living in the future
muh angle
My first handgun was a Walther. It ruined me for anything else. No other handgun has come close to the comfort and reliability that brand has given me. The P99, PPQ, Q5, PDP, the Subcompact, and the double stack 45acp. All models are awesome. I love each. I have a walther collection problem.
This is what HK did to me. I have so many other handguns. Glock 17, 43x, 19, 34, CZ P-10F, CZ P-01, S&W Shield Plus, LCP Max, M1911A1 Clone, Walther P99, Walther PDP-F, KelTec P17 or something like that, and I'm probably forgetting some of them.
But then I got a VP9 and a USP Compact 9mm and both of them just absolutely blew me away
Now if only we could standardize a red dot footprint like we did with picatinny and m-lok...
We would have one less potential point of failure, and many pistols wouldn't even need tall sights to co-witness..
Rest in peace keymod
Listen here youngsters, you'll use iron sights and like it.
Why RMR isn't the standard is beyond me.
@@Borderline5440 It kind of is becoming the standard. Most custom Glock slides from HGW, 80P Builder etc. come with the RMR/Holosun footprint.
@@Borderline5440 rmr is pretty much the standard. Only time ive ever not used the rmr footprint was on a glock slimline, because the rmr footprint just doesnt physically fit
I love the pdp, and i am very happy to see he didnt totally eviscerate the pdp in regular hop fashion.
"Stop talking over my narration!"
I was in one of the last classes to get issued the Woodland BDUs in '05. About halfway through new classes started getting the ACUs. I'm glad I made the cut.
They still used M16 A2 20" Governments in 2005 as well. M4s weren't standard or across the board until post 2006 and even as late as 2007ish.
That's why I always laugh at both young inexperienced and virgin OLD guys who can't shoot without optics. Freakin' greenhorn nOobS! Lol
I have a full-size PDP Pro Sd, I threw in a ZR tactical uncaptured guide rod with a 13lb spring and a Taylor Freelance brass backstrap, along with a ACRO P2 and a Surefire X300 Turbo. All the snappiness is gone from that gun, it is so light and flat-shooting now it's ridiculous. Not exactly a concealed carry setup though, I like the way you phrased yours as a "hypothetical competition/combat hybrid" pistol. That's what I would classify mine as now. This modified German race gun is one of the best shooting handguns I own, I just don't have anything in particular to use it for.
Does the new spring make it easier or harder to rack? I ask because I am confused. Wather rep told me it is harder to rank with the lower (15lb) wieght spring. Thank you. Trying to reduce " flip" on my girls pdp- f w/4" barrel.
@@robertkwiatkoski1292 It's easier to rack with the ZR 13lb spring installed.
The actual tiers are: pre glock, non-german alternatives, german (broadly speaking) pistols (walther, hk, cz, steyr)
Thats a pretty solid cut line tbh.
Only real problem is that m&p is clearly a direct compete with the g17 and a lot of non German pistols are not but I really don't like smith and Wesson and I really like walther and cz
CZ is Czech
@@rondobrondo that's why I said broadly speaking
SOCKO CONTENT LFG
Came for the review of a pistol I never plan on buying, stayed for the Socko footage.
Steyr M9-A2 did it for me. Like the Steyr, Diet Mtn Dew is used to being overlooked (and is a nice green color).
I am a big Walther fan, full size PDP, PDP-F, and WMP...for me, they simply work. Ergo's, trigger are top notch I am still hoping for a high cap. PDP W (something) in .22 cal.. Extra's in relation to Glock are still far short of Glock. For me Glock still reigns. The top reason is availability of Glock parts, aftermarket replacement items, and even true upgrades. The aftermarket is unparrelled in any other industry, except Harley Davidson, which is actually similar. Almost no-one buys a H-D and leaves it stock. Almost no-one buys a Glock and leaves it stock.
I have over 35 GLOCKs going clear back to my first Gen 2 G19 I bought brand new in 1993 and I still have that one with over 25k rounds through it. Except for tritium night sights ALL of mine are bone stock and shoot just fine. That's a greenhorn nOOb late comer problem thinking they needed modified to shoot well. It's the shooter and not the gun...TRUST ME. Shouldn't need a 3# trigger on a carry gun to be able to shoot it accurately. What would these people do with a double action revolver? I started shooting in 1982 for reference and there weren't nearly the rookie amateur (self proclaimed experts) and crybabies back then that there are now.
I just ordered my PDP Match SF. Can’t wait! Haven’t been excited for a gun in a while.
CZ P10c , HK VP-9 would be two of the few handguns I would purchase in place of the Glock. I do have a Steyr M4 that is awesome, but there are damn near NO upgrades available for it, at least the last time I searched.
Don't own a Glock and probably never will but my P10SC/M&P 2.0 and VP9 are more than enough gun for me.
I love the p10c because it provides some of what I like regarding ergos/trigger of the VP9/PDP, but the geometry/low recoil of the Glock. To me it’s the best of both worlds. I haven’t seen anything better at that sub $1000 price point, polymer striker fired gun.
I personally feel it fits my hand better than my VP9 and I added the HBi 15% striker spring and the trigger is a beauty, perfect in my opinion. I also have the Lobos trigger in my VP9 and yes it's very good but like a 1lb heavier than my P10.
@@awokeone7997 couldn’t agree more. I have the apex trigger which has 4k rounds through it, so it’s about 3.5 lbs. Butter. I love a crisp wall. I’m trying to get used to my p365 XL but I’m having a hard time with its lack of a crisp wall. The p10c ruined me
@@aztronomy7457 I agree with you on the good wall the trigger has and that's why I like the P10/VP9 and M&P 2.0 with the Apex trigger but the VP9 has the best rest
M81 field pants in medium long.... This targeted ad stuff is getting out of hand
just imagine what "they" about us but don't target in ads...
Brought to you by Carl's Jr.
@@Jonesy_Ripley it's Hardee's around my way, but either way you name it I still find it damn good haha
Need to shill for the Steyr M9-A1 and A2MF pistols
Been concealed carrying the M9-A1 for a decade now
It doesn't really have any after market mods, but it also doesn't need ANY (other than grip tape because that grip is smooth)
Fires 9 but recoils like a .380, has a bore axis that would make a CZ blush, has a higher grip than most guns on the market save the Alien, and she just runs without problem.
It also has a completely unique sighting system that I feel is faster than any red dot, they are trapezoid sights, stupid fast to get on target
Love the fucking thing but Steyr didn't market it AT ALL so almost nobody has heard of one let alone fired one, and it's a shame, because it was made by a former glock employee and honestly feels like a Glock 2.0
TLDW; it's a PPQ Q4 Tac with a slightly better optics mount
and much more useful slide serrations.
@@InvidiousIgnoramus And grip texture.
Also I wouldn't say slightly better. Aren't the PPQ plates like 3/8ths of an inch thick?
Have over 5k rounds on my 4.5" full size pdp. Everything still oem other than a sprinco guide rod system running red spring. Literally eats EVERYTHING I feed her and the barrel is still more accurate than I am. From a bag I can stack shots of hst & gold dot on top each other at 20 yards. Only issue I've had was from the blue follower magazine springs being absolute JUNK. They wear out WAYYYY before quoted compression cycles. Luckily ghost inc makes 10%+ stainless steel full size Walther pdp spring replacement. They have been 100% reliable over hundreds of cycles. Only negative is that your 18rd mags turn into 17rd which I'm perfectly fine with for reliability sake.
Greetings from Austria 🇦🇹 😀 where as an armed bodyguard, I carry the Canik Rival.. and qualify as an outcast 😅
But i do have the max allowed 20rd mags, the best trigger ever in a polymer pistol and incredible accuracy.
Caniks are clones of the Walther P99.
My edc is a PDP compact with a 5 inch barrel, carried appendix. I don’t feel the snappiness personally, but I’ll have to compare to a glock the next time I’m at the range.
It’s definitely blockier than glock, but I’ve personally not found that to be a problem in my year of carrying it so far. There’s definitely guns out there like the P320 that also have huge slides and run fine.
PDP for CCW definitely isn’t for everyone, nor is it something you should de facto buy over a glock. If you are unhappy with some of the deficiencies of glock, and (like me) either aren’t bothered or are willing to put up with the before mentioned issues, the PDP is a great gun. Just be aware it’s more of ‘different than a glock’ than straight up ‘better than a glock’. Both have qualities over the other.
Great review as always Hop, you have me looking at my own setup and considering things I had not before. And now I might just buy a threaded barrel and edc that comp just for the goofiness. Cheers.
Edit: Holster is from Werkz if anyone is interested. It’s been good to me so far, and is perfectly fine for kydex
I carry the 4" compact no problem, also appendix. I also don't notice the snappiness that everyone complains about. Maybe because I don't shoot other pistols much. The only pistols I really consider snappy are subcompacts or compacts in larger calibers and I hate shooting either of those because it's hard to keep a solid grip on them. The recoil on basically all polymer, striker fired, Glock 19-type pistols feel the same to me. The difference for me is that the PDP points very naturally and fits the hand comfortably. I can't stand the grip on Glocks. Also, it seems insignificant, but the little scoop on the bottom of the grip really makes quite a difference (at least to me) in providing extra leverage in driving the gun down.
@@Rancor12 I definitely agree on both recoil and the grip curve. I also moved from a compact .45, so the recoil feels like nothing to me anyways
In fact, I’d say the only gripe I’ve had is that the sights weren’t tall enough to cowitness. But for a gun I got for 550 with a free dot, I won’t complain
It seems no pistol, nor rifle, is “perfection,” and needs to be modified to user preference.
“Neutralize.”
9 Hole Reviews has entered the chat
"Impact"
Wait, was that a snippet of you casually shooting with Jerry Miculek? That's so cool
My biggest gripe with the pdp is the giant monkey bar of a slide release, I have to really focus on thumb placement so the slide will lock back. But that goes all the way back to the p99.
P99 doesn't have a monkey bar slide release? Sure it's big enough to hit and isn't hidden. But I never felt it to be too much. I get that with the PPQ and PDP though since they're fully exposed on both sides from axis pin to tail.
i chopped my p99 slide release and havent looked back
Appreciated the comment on over- insertion of the 18 round mags into the compact. Never had that issue with my Glocks and almost shat my pants the first time I jammed the 18 rounder way to far in on the range
What holster was that you were using with the suppressor? QVO Tactical?
Also, thanks for the Sako (Saco?) content. My tuxedo cat, who’s been the best damned cat for the last 18 years, seems to be on his deathbed, so this content reminded me of old times and greatly helped :)
Prototype from Hush Holsters. They've got some new stuff in the works soon.
@@Hoplopfheil New stuff in the works? What about all the people who ordered before he ghosted everyone and ran off with the money?
first gun was a glock 17 gen 5 when i turned 21. Not a huge glock fan but knew they were super reliable so i bought it. Walked into a gun store last week and held a PDP and fell in love. Best feeling handgun ever (Ive got a staccato too, PDP feels better in hands) as soon as i shot my PDP i was so sad lol. Its snappy as hell and just not very fun to shoot
I’ll buy it from ya
Fear not Hop, I saw a kicker box full of Woodland and Desert BDUs being moved by forklift last week while at CIF, so there is still hope for you. 😁
One cool feature that Walther has over the Glock in terms of different generations is the fact that you can swap slide between the pdp, ppq and p99 (on polymer frames) regardless of the frame size. So if you wanted too you can put a pdp slide on a ppq m1 or p99 frame to use the lever release. Took a while for Glock to do that with the Glock 45, 47 , and glock 49. I’m a Walther shill but I agree it won’t kill Glock. Great vid as always!
Bless you for critical reviews. Ive seen red dots fail in competitions, and cowitness ironsights were life savers
I rented a PDP about a year ago. I love the look and it had a great stock trigger for a striker fired pistol, but I immediately noticed the harsh recoil. It just felt *rough* when shooting it. I shot an M&P 2.0 the same range session and it felt way, way better.
PDPs are also a little more expensive than Glocks, which are already a little more expensive than many competitors in the class. PDPs are solid, but it’s really hard to justify the price. At that point you might as well step up a little more and get a VP9. Or spend less and get a G19/17, M&P 2.0 O.R., Echelon, p320, APX A1, FN 509, CZ P10, Canik TP9 Elite/Mete SFx,
You said you try to read all the comments in you 100k q&a so I wanted you remind you that you’re nobody til somebody loves you. And that somebody- is me. I love you🤠
There is one reason I use the PPQ over my glock 19: the true single stage trigger helps me shoot one-handed with consistently better accuracy.
Nice review. Echelon next? I’ve seen the other GunTubers do it but I’m interested to see what you think of it.
I’ve been carrying my PDP from right around when it came out. Before carrying I tested it with 500ish rounds and loved it. Threw on my RMR, Surefire, ordered T1C holster and good to go. Have at least 3,000 rounds through it with various ammo, hollow/ ball/light/heavy etc…. Never had a hiccup and trust my life with it.
I have a PDP F series. I wont say its a glock killer, but for me, I prefer it over a glock. I carry a glock for work and have G21 at home. I dont hate glocks but I prefer the PDP.
The F series fits my hand so well.
I have a pro and a F series and I don't own a glock so I'm not comparing them but I absolutely love the grip texture on the PDP's.
I think their "compact" and fullsize labels are hilarious and the "f is for female" marketing was atrocious. Men in the gun industry are stupid and sexist whether they want to admit it or not. Plus having PDP F Series and PDP FS makes things harder to differentiate.
The F series fits my hand better, but I just like the looks of a 5 inch compact.
@zendell37 I hope they put the pro series trigger into an f series frame, that would be the perfect Walther for me
9:30 always breaks my heart when I see a married couple fighting :(
😂😂😂😂
PDP-F isn't as snappy
Got a PPQ & installed the flat face metal trigger (but not the comp. trigger springs as the DPT instructions said it's wasn't drop safe with the comp. trigger springs.
Also got the PDP-F 3.5 and swapped the barrel with a spare 4" barrel.
I fully agree about the flush 15 round mag for concealment.
To me, the Walthers, and several others, qualify as Glock killers in what I’d call a tier “2.5” on your scale. Meaning, they wouldn’t compel someone already invested in Glock to switch systems, but they are more than “six one way…” with Glock. They beat or tie Glock in all the categories one would prioritize when choosing to buy a polymer 9mm.
And that's more or less 90% of it. Glock people tend to be Glock people...they own 4-5 of them, 3-4 holsters, 40+ magazines, etc. You're never going to switch that customer, and those customers are going to vehemently defend their Glocks because no one wants to think "Oh, I could have had something more modern..." after they're thousands of dollars into a "system". You won't unseat Glock with department/agency sales because they can provide their guns at dirt-cheap prices.
I have the 4.5 inch PDP. I didn't bother with the 4 inch because it was obvious to me this was not a handgun I would want to carry. To me it is a gun to throw my optic on and have fun with at the range. It can also serve as a home defense gun. Yea it is a bit snappy but it comes back to target right away and the felt recoil isn't bad. Better than glock in a number of categories unless you want to dump a bunch of money into a glock, but I think it is less versatile than a glock, so it really depends on what you want to use it for.
Its def snappier. A 15lb spring helps as its oversprung for nato ammo. But the best aspect is rhe ergonomics that presents the red dot perfectly and more importantly the return to zero while shooting is fantastic.
Love my PDP pro sd. I have used my PDP compact and bought a threaded barrel and used it suppressed. Ran over 600 rounds with it suppressed without issues
I’ll also say that the suppressor ready spring did warp on me after 200 rounds in 30 mins. It would still cycle but it is something I brought up to walther. They replaced the spring but I did end up buying a metal spring
Can't wait for the Daniel H9 review in 3 years!
A Gen 5 Glock 19 is still better.
G19 looks positively SKINNY next to this pistol.
They have the same dimensions the pdp had a sight on it and has good serrations. Makes it look a little bigger.
Great video. Nice to see alternate perspectives, and to know I am not alone in thinking the PDP has some shortcomings that could be remedied easily by Walther, and really shouldn't exist at the price point. Subscribed.
I don't think there is THE ONE gun that is the ultimate Glock killer.
But Glock is slowly killing themselves by refusing to innovate. The only thing keeping them alive is the aftermarket support, and those guys have figured out how to live without Glock factory guns. A PSA Dagger has a lot more features than a stock Glock at a fraction of the price. And with all the plastic parts, original Glocks aren't even great value or anything.
But Glock clones from PSA, Shadow Systems and alike plus other competitors like the Walther PDP, Springfield (HS) Echelon, Beretta APX 2, CZ P10,... are factually better.
Thats wrong thinking. All things dont need innovation. Lets innovate our diks next.
@@reefread1234 then please get off the internet and write me a letter about your musket
Love to see a video of your "the closest thing to killing a glock" pistol. Lots of different "glock killers" but I'd love your take on what you consider the pistol that gets closest to the mark.
9:36 is real-time footage of my parents arguing
Which one of them is your "mom"?
PDP was the only gun that almost got me to buy it instead of my Glock 19. Despite the recoil I was quite accurate with it. Great hold and trigger with a sexy look.
But I chose the 19 and have zero regrets.
I get vibes from a Nutnfancy soldier boy run and gun at the end of the video!! 😂
Another issue with the PDP that I don’t hear anybody talking about: when you pull the trigger, the gun jerks to the right. I noticed this during dry fire. At first I thought maybe it was just me, or perhaps it was just my gun. But I tried it out on somebody else’s PDP and the exact same thing happened. We took turns dry firing each other’s for a few minutes and we noticed exactly the same phenomenon.
For some reason, right as the trigger breaks, there’s a slight but noticeable jerk to the right. No matter how good your grip is or how steady you can press the trigger. I have not noticed this on any other handguns that I’ve personally used.
I know exactly what you are referring to, but if I recall correctly it wasn't unique to Walther. I'm pretty sure my VP9 and a few others experienced the same phenomenon.
Coming from a person who used both the m and p 2.0 and the glock, the m and p is a glock killer. Literally better in every way except aftermarket support.
here's the thing tho, if you make a good enough gun...you dont NEED as much aftermarket support...
I didn't sell my glock but I did trade it as a carry gun for my VP9. I generally don't sell anything. I carry an hk and I do love my Walther PPQ above all.
Premature lockbacks happen as you get older.
I totally agree with you the term Glock killer is ridicules. The term Glock alternative is more relevant Glock set the standard and is an excellent gun, but other manufacturers have raised their bar because of this and you can buy pistols just as reliable and quality made as the Glock now.
I was always thinking "why is it so BIG?" The P99 had a problem with being really snappy but it was so LIGHT. Reasonable tradeoff for a police gun that will likely never leave the holster. Makes me wonder if they tried to make it chunkier to tame the recoil for the commercial market and just failed horribly.
It's not any heavier.
@@InvidiousIgnoramus So just big for no reason huh
@@jarvy251 it's literally not even big. Nobody who says this has actually compared it physically to an equivalent model from another company.
@@InvidiousIgnoramus My dude Hop literally does that in this very video 11:43
@@jarvy251 This exact configuration is LITERALLY a single damn ounce heavier than a bare bones Gen 5 Glock. That is almost ENTIRELY made up by the longer barrel and magwell.
Note that RDR gear mods will work with the PDP PRO SD compact and full size without a compensator, but once you add the comp, there isn’t a safariland that can be modded to fit the full size with comp. Compact + compensator should work, full size won’t. I had asked RDR about my pro sd full size and he went through the trouble of buying the materials to test it out for me but no dice. I ended up going with a local custom kydex shop for my full size with comp and tlr1.
I've got 6 handguns and none are a Glock (1 is the PDP SD Pro, another is a CZ75, both mentioned). Strange thing is... I don't even want a Glock. And every time I touch one I can't wait to put it down. I don't get the whole Glock cult thing. Is something wrong with me?
Nah just your preference
I remember being a kid and wanting a Glock so badly. The sadness of how poorly a stock Glock shoots when I first shot one was what pushed me into CZ, especially since the p10 just came out when I turned 21.
That is one of the reasons I got rid of both my Glock's years ago, shoots poorly and feels like a brick in my hand, uncomfortable to say the least. Glock is a resilient gun with tons of aftermarket support but just not for me.
Cz P10 series is easily the closest "glock killer" that's ever been produced.
And is ignored by every glock shill, which is what allows glock to be so prolific in the industry still. Hands down a better out of the box item (which is the ONLY criteria that should matter.)
legit rolled into the comment section to say this. If the P10C couldn't kill glock, nothing short of a complete technological revolution will. The gun is better in literally every way.
@@cz75fanaticI tried to like mine, but the first time I inserted a magazine into mine, the ejector bar snapped off. Couldn’t trust it after that.
so much better with their $40 magazines@@RamikinHorde
LMFAO, yeah right the P10 can be had for $299 just to get it to move. All the hoopla when it was being released saying it would be the G19 killer and it doesn't even rank in the top 5 semi-autos sold. period.
Hop's ability to draw in some of the most smooth brain commenters is truly unmatched
I would like to see a comprehensive PSA dagger review by Hop of all the variants (full size, compact, micro, etc).
Considering that it is a Glock gen3 clone, and is a gun that is just fine for people that are not wrong handed (no right side slide release), and I would like to see Hop's realistic harsh complaint, through all of the pistol variants.
And I would like to see his thoughts on purchasing just the frame and upgrading everything else within it, basically starting out only with the frame and upgrading it with a complete slide assembly (such as Hooper Gun Works complete slides), and a decent reliable aftermarket trigger (Example: Tyrant CNC trigger bar and flat trigger).
daggers will be viable when PSA stops sending guns that are DOA
@@jacobhaynieful I have yet to see a DOA dagger. Even if that happened, PSA has great customer service and it would easily be repaired.
PSA only has these options based on their 2012 build construction.
@@RedZeppelinAirship I believed the internet PSA fan hype. The notch in the slide for the slide stop wasn't even cut, the rear sight couldn't be drifted enough to zero it, and it would feed a few rounds at a time before it would shit the bed. I don't care how good the warranty is if they're willing to send me a non functional pistol in the first place
@@jacobhaynieful rear sight couldn’t be drifted? You did use a Glock sight moving tool right? Like you didn’t just smack the rear sight with a hammer or the grip of a screwdriver?
Were you using glock brand mags? I have seen cheap ETS mags double feed.
I had gotten the wrong complete PSA glock slide assembly than I had ordered, they sent me the slide I wanted and told me to keep the other as an extra as compensation. That’s like 270 dollars of free stuff for a simple phone call and order number, and I have used both slides and neither have jammed.
I understand the frustration, but not even trying to use their customer service and still complaining about one of the cheapest pistols on the market, for maybe having a single lemon out of a batch of 10000, is redundant since you never actually went through the 25 minutes of chatting to customer service, and never got a fair representation of a dagger.
That’s like getting the wrong food at a restaurant but not complaining or are too scared to say anything so you eat whatever they handed you
@@RedZeppelinAirship the sight couldn't be drifted "enough" to zero the gun. As in the sight was pushed out of the dovetail and still not hitting poa.
For people looking for a holster for a PDP the Safariland 6390RDS-4502-131 for a p320 fits perfectly on my PDP pro full size. Just had to take out the barrel plug in the holster so the threaded barrel would fit.
Bought a walther CCP about 10 years ago (whenever it came out). Firing mechanism failed within the first 500 rounds (less than that actually, I think). Sent it in and customer service was crap. My barrel got all jacked up because of it. Never got an answer as to why it happened or if they would replace my barrel. They sent me a sticker; that’s it. I will NEVER buy another walther ever again.
My buddy had one that exploded on him about 500 rounds in. The little hook in the rear cracked and sent the slide, along with all of the internals, flying forward when he shot. It also just so happened that it was his first day ever of competition shooting. Left a pretty sour taste in my mouth about Walther pistols.
@@Seseous mine exploded too
The CCP is probably Walther’s worst pistol even after the attempted rerelease. Not to mention there’s not much reason for it to still exist when they already offer better pistols that fulfill the same niche.
@@Horgler hands down. You’re 100% right. Unfortunately, that was my first, and probably last foray into Walthers.
Been running a pdp compact for carry and competition, eventually just sold it and bought a glock17. Its the snappiest 9mm ive shot and i grew to hate it
I think that pdp is by far better gun than glock like almost all other succesful handguns, all glock killers are glock killers not in way that they took market but in way that they are better handguns, they just have almost everything better, so i dislike video, and then i see a cat, and i say i need to like this video so i did it, just because of cat 😻
Nice review. Glad to see the Walther pistol and I'll pass. I am happy with my CZ P10 F that is Optics and Suppressor ready. Came with Suppressor height sights that i picked up for under $500
Walther lost me when they ditched the mag release. Just made it a walther.
They brought it back on the PD380, but nearly everything else about that gun is pretty underwhelming.
I tried several pistols earlier that year when I was fed up with my cz p10 f and sold it. I also tried a PDP full size 5 inch. I didnt like the recoil impulse, I had a tendency to press down on the slide release and overall impression was so so. Likes the trigger and the texture.
Recently I was able to shoot a pdp compact 4 inch. I grabbed that thing and thought it would be worse than the full size model. The grip felt a bit short. The small back panel was installed. And Iam 6'4 with large hands. I was very suprised that the gun felt more comfortable to me than the bigger model. It pointed better and it shot flatter for me. Sometimes the "ergonomics" and behaviour of guns is puzzeling to me.
I love you Hop instantly compares the aftermarket support of a new pistol series that's been out for only a few years vs Glock that's been around 40 years now..
Do you want to buy your aftermarket parts now or in 40 years? It's not about fairness. It's about reality and performance.
@@michaelmcatee221 You don’t really need to compared to a factory glock. Trigger & sights on the PDP are superior out of the box.
I would compare it to Walther's 40 year old pistol but they discontinue everything after about a decade, because none of it is really competitive. Enjoy the meager support the PDP has while it lasts because after they replace it with yet another handgun, you're not even going to have that.
One thing about those Dara holsters - make sure you loctite the shit out of those 2 bolts that keep it together. I've never had to loctite any of my Safariland holsters and I've used them for almost 10yrs now almost everyday as an LE. I had to buy a Dara holster because I was using the new G21 G5, and Safariland doesn't make a holster. I could feel my gun moving around one day at work, put my hand on my holster, and realized both of the retention screws were completely gone, so the gun was barely being held in the holster. Not the best feeling as a cop. I'm also someone who takes the gun out of my holster before literally every single shift, so it wasn't like that when I started my day. I turn on my 508T, press check and make sure my TLR1 is working before every shift.
The PDP wouldve shot way better if the slide mass wasnt a brick and the bore axis was lower
Does anyone have the slide weight on the 4.5” vs a g17? Same with a height over bore measurement for both. I’ve always heard this, but never seen the numbers
The slides are comparatively lighter, not sure where you heard that. It's just the heavy recoil spring and stepped chamber that makes it recoil more.
@@gammatheta491 Bore axis on Glocks is about 1.25", last I checked the PDP has the same bore axis as the PPQ, of approximately 1.5", which is right in line with 90% of polymer striker fire guns.
Yup. I sent mine back for a refund due to these reasons
It would shoot better if it wasn’t over sprung. Bore height naturally has something to do with it. My PPQ (15.7 oz)is the closest thing I have to weigh but its slide assembly is actually lighter than a G19 (17.1oz). I believe the PDP slide has measured even lighter than the PPQ. My PPQ and G19 are very comparable. Unfortunately I can’t weigh my 4.5” PDP as it has an optic and I no longer have a G17, but I would think their numbers would be similar in comparison.
Had a P99 Gen3, Ergonomic, accurate, lotta muzzle flip, got a PPQ, Better feeling ergos, lotta muzzle flip. Cycled through a few more handguns settled on a G19.5. Its night and day. Yes P99/PPQ/PDP trigger is better, and way easier to shoot groups, but they aren't as svelte and trim as blocks. and I enjoy the block grip angle, reminds me of my Colt huntsman. Also, block mags don't rust from fingerprints. I ignored Glocks for 20yrs mainly cause my hand was too big for the 9mm until the replacement beavertails.
Happy to hear a reasonable review on this gun. I thought it was the most "meh" thing ever made when I shot it.
Walther makes good non innovative guns lol. I like them fine enough to have a couple, but they don't give a awful lot of reason to buy them.
@@ericm381Trigger used to be their selling point. But that was before everyone and their mother was a gunsmith.
Would love to hear your opinion on the m&p 2.0...I shoot Glocks but the 2.0 with the glock-style trigger looks interesting.
As a Glock fanboy, the only other brand that has impressed me enough to purchase a pistol other than a Glock is CZ. And the only reason I bought a CZ in the first place was because I wanted a hammer fire pistol.
Same. An SP-01 or Jericho 941r is still on my bucket list.
What about p10?
My two SP-01 tacticals were both an unreliable POS until I put Wolff increased power extractor springs in, and then my first had the firing pin retaining pin shear and brick the gun during a USPSA match. Soured me big time on CZ, which is a bummer for someone of Czech heritage.
Honestly you had me at Diet Mountain Dew enjoyer... subscribed, and now to finish the video!
Glock killers with $50 mags?
Phew! Hop, you've helped my darling 43x validate itself. I love the hell out of it so it's great to hear that the fancy stuff may not necessarily be better.
There is some utility in suppressing a bedside pistol.
@Hoplopfheil try a ZR Tactical 15 lb recoil spring. The factory is oversprung at about 17-18 lbs and I think that is the reason for the higher felt recoil. They also make a 13 lb for softer shooting, but maybe not as reliable. Try them both for a follow video, there's not a lot of info out there.
Ahh yes, the thumb knuckle. The thuckle, if you will.
For some reason that sounds really gross.
I've avoided buying a Glock because I absolutely hate the grip and, to a lesser extent, the controls. Also not a real big pistol guy to begin with and previously only owned a Sig M17, which I ended up hating. When I visited a buddy and held his PDP for the first time, it was like the first time I picked up a CZ75. The grip is just made for hands. It's so damn comfortable and the controls are great.
We later went to the range and had 2 PDPs, a P10, a Canik TP9, and a gucci'd out Glock 19. The other pistols were cool, but I immediately fell in love with the PDP after shooting it. I've never shot a pistol so well in my life. I was out shooting the owners of the PDPs with their own pistols. Even shot better and faster with it than the gucci Glock, which had a nice trigger and a brake on it. I immediately bought one for myself when I got back home and it's been my CCW since.
Something about it just really clicks with me because I can't even shoot a Shadow 2 as well as I shoot my PDP. Comes with me every range day whereas before, I almost never shot pistols. My only complaint with it is that the plastic guide rod broke around 700 rounds. Replaced it with a stainless steel one and have had no other problems with it.
I'm ideologically opposed to Glocks