Outstanding review. In the kind of big spruce trees we have here, I found the ability to ground anchor with SRS to be really helpful, because it is next to impossible to isolate a high single limb from the ground. Also it is a little reassuring to know that if one limb fails there may be others below that will hold twice your weight, with the caveat being the fall is twice the distance to the next limb. Time wasted isolating a limb should get added to the MRS column, and if that requires a shorter throw then there is time wasted moving the anchor up in short lengths. On the other hand if the goal is tree removal and you ascend with spurs, then MRS is simple and versatile.
The SRS does shine in the spruce situation and if you are able to throw to a very high tie in it would be great. Good point about isolating the line. You are able to work your way up the tree with the SRS system if you plan on using a canopy anchor. It is possible to use the SRS on removals, say your working on a spar you can choke the spar with the system and back up with a lanyard. Awesome comment. Thank you!
Subscribed. I dont even have to finish watching to give you full respect. Great, great video production. Split screen with minimal chitchat, just good advice and explanation.....wow. Huge thumbs up. Thank you very much for your efforts and time.
Really good review! Great editing. Good choice of music. Excellent comparison of the two systems. I’ve been doing tree work for years. This year was the first year I started actually using climbing gear. I started with a clove hitch, Blake’s hitch and a figure eight. That’s what I’m still using. I’ll eventually switch over to the two systems your using in this video.
I never had any good training , 30 years later i still loving tree work , Im still learning SRS but had to teach myself along the way . I have and still do convince climbers that SRS is the way to be more efficient . although I can not . I do enjoy the idea that someday I will walk rt up a tree .. really enjoyed the side by side comparison. Joe ..
I took my climbing gear to tree climbing because our summer oak was gringding the chimney or our neighbours. I climb SRS with a grigri... Your channel is fantastic for all the other techniques that i can take along with me now. What´s your tought on climbing trees with the Grigri?
Great Video! I've been learning a lot from Bino's videos this week, as I'm shopping for minimalist arborist gear for fun and DIY trimming/removal....I have done a bit of rock climbing, and so am trying to incorporate the gear I have, oval biners in the year 2022?......I cannot recall the last time I shopped this hard! Today's decision is 7/16" or 1/2" rope. Half inch is the standard size, easier on hands, and allows for some rigging, but my and many other mech descenders don't fit 12+mm rope. I've come up with a hybrid system in my garage, where my Petzl Grigri is SRS. Since I don't have a foot ascender, I repeated an old re-direct foot loop trick to add mechanical advantage for MRS style body thrusting on a SRS anchor...maybe we can have the best of both? after tail turns upward past Grigri, tail bends back downward through micro pulley hitch above grigri; hands pull tail to chest while grigri captures progress, then hands push hitch up to reset for next pull...a two stroke! I've been inspired by several of Bino's videos this week: After watching floating retrievable anchors, I decided to trade some rope for a quickie shackle. Westec Rigging makes short ropes affordable, so I'm ordering 77ft of 7/16 (11mm) arborist rope, a quickie shackle and a small steel rigging ring to try retrievable floating anchor & retrievable false crotch re-directs...Also, I'm building a Bino Style 2 in 1 lanyard, and hoping to take advantage of Treestuff's bonus foot ascender with a $200 purchase. Did it used to be common to do SRS with only a hitch, pulley, & biner, sans rope wrench/device? Just wondering if this is something I can safely try.....low and slow.
Thank you for that awesome comment! I glad you have low and slow on your mind. Since you are adding some gear, you might try adding a Rope Wrench and a stiff tether. Once you have that foot ascender it will make ascending easier and if you already have a hitch climber pulley and hitch cord, You could have a complete Stationary Rope System.
Interesting. I have the opposite feeling for limbwalking. I much prefer the "micro-control" of MRS when limbwalking and feel much more in control. Pro and cons with each system.
Hi Bino, thanks for the video. I'm no expert, so correct me if I'm wrong please. I prefer the SRS for some reasons, the rope is less wored and is more protected (although mechanical ascending systems on SRS take a toll on the rope, but I will not say it's critical for an arborist rope cause anyway it will get replaced anyway before that for natural wearing natural for the job, but anyway the wored is less with mechanical systems compared to doing MRS without friction saver), also in SRS no need for friction saver (less money spending) and also no need to waste time setting it up and taking it down. The other thing I liked about SRS is I can climb higher with less rope, in SRS I can do a climb of almost the same lenght of the rope (by using any cheap and thin accessory cord for the pulldown for recovering the rope. With MRS I need double the rope of my climb. The other disadvantage of MRS is the exposure of the rope, by it I mean if any side of the rope gets cut I will fall, so the rope is more exposed for breakage on the way up and on the way back to the cllimber. In the SRS only one length of rope is exposed. One good thing of the MRS is that the rope is only holding half of my weight and in the SRS the rope tension is my whole weight. Another advantage of the SRS is natural choking nature of the system which make the anchor more secure and less propense of slipping throught the branch in some situations like in a diagonal branch. The only thing I really like about an MRS is in the case of Rescue. In MRS is something happen to the climber a rescue can be performed more easy and fast from the ground. Normally. I tied down the rope to the ground anchor with a Figure 8 so in case of a Rescue, a ground rescue could be performed (although is tricky because a release line will needed to be thrown to release the left friction system or friction hitch on the climber). But even there in the SRS system this will be even more easier if you instead of doing the butterfly knot, you just pass the rope and anchor it to the ground (like in and MRS but instead just use one side of the rope to climb), this will make a super easy rescue (even though this setup will eliminate some of the benefits of SRS I mentioned above) but even there I think is worth it specially if you have the Rope length. If needed another rope can be tied to the other rope in an asymetrical knot and a long pitch rescue can be performed. These are my thoughts, I mostly think a simpler system normally is safer because is less propense to human mistake (which many times is the cause for accidents, specially when is 6pm, the sun is going doing and we have been working all day and we are in that moment exhausted and in a hurry, and even we try to not be in that situation sometimes it will happen). And I feel the SRS more simpler and ik some way with added simple redundancy (which is good), like for example even the foot climber is not considered legally a life support system, in case of an emergency it will hold you, so is an extra backup. I Tower climbing and rigging we are required to use redundant systems anyway so we used two ropes side ny side (which I like), and is an SRS. This is posibble because we use SRS. With MRS it would be a super big mess working with two redundant ropes, because we will have four lines going through us then. Sorry for the long comment. I really like the empirical comparison you made in the video side by side of both systems. Thank you very much for this very educative video.
You have made a lot of great and true points. The SRS is an exciting system to use and for all of what it does the extra expense is worth it. Thank you for your comment. Take care!
I set the mrs system up, then I get the spliced end and make a running bowline and send it up. I then attach the knot to me and use my flipline over my shoulder to help it self tend. I put the penten on the rope and begin a srs ascent. Once at the running bowline in the top I switch back to mrs and begin working. A eight or wrench is always with me incase I need to descend on srs but I never do. It is the best of both worlds for me.
The MRS definitely seems like more work. When I actually start climbing, I'll start of with it though. Watching your videos give me the insight without having done it myself. Can't wait to actually try it.
@@BinoH And limb walking? I note you said it was easier. I recall somewhere another video by someone else of some system to help pull oneself back in more smoothly/or with more balance. Are you aware of any quick mods to do so or is it not an issue for you?
You can add a foot ascender to the MRS and itta be alot better wouldn't it? Im 45 yrs old and I just started climbing and I don't have a ton of cash to spend so I'm buying as I go. I use a Blake's hitch with foot ascender and I'm working on a knee ascender.homemade, but if you use a zigzag or something like that you don't need a rope wrench right?
Yes you can add a foot ascender to an MRS system and possibly a knee ascender but be careful because with some knots when using both foot and knee ascender when you come off of walking up the line and sit back the knot may run on you. If you are planning on using the Zig Zag for SRS you'll nees to buy a Chicane it's like a Rope Wrench for the Zig Zag. If you bought a Zig Zag for MRS you wouldn't use the Blakes hitch. The Zig Zag takes the place of the friction hitch.
Bino, you know of course you can rope walk with the MRS... but that would skew the comparison a little since it would add 250(?) to the cost to get started, right?
True but using foot ascender and a knee ascender is still about half steps on every step. On the the other hand it will save your energy and will be a lot less expensive to add to an MRS climbing system.
@@BinoH I never body thrust with a hitchclimber set up. It just sucks. I'll always footlock the tail, it works better as it self tends. I find the hitchclimber not so great for ascents, I'd rather a blakes to ascend, and then o rig my hitchclimber when I make my chosen anchor. I really don't think it's possible to compare the two systems, like people, they have different strengths. Today I was doing conifers with MRS, yesterday I got up some big Ivy clad Ash trees SRS, with no fight ! Just pinged up a throwline, and walked up, easy !
@@robthompson1399 I think the best way is to learn the double rope or Mrs system and then learn SRS. Whenever you need whichever system you have it ready to go.
quick cool tree man tip of the day bye a chinese el chepo foot acendor remove straps zip tye heavy ish clevis then have a instant super easy rope wieght .it cuts out having to tye ur bag or saw on n the groundy can easily un hook it for ya
Bino saludos amigo, as always great video, thanks for all you do, I have limited SRT equipment being a newbie (decided rely on more mechanical and simple I guess), but I wanna try the double technique with the cord prozick, haven't get that far , but learning lots from your vids
Bino, I’m using MRS right nor with one foot ascender. I’m curios to try the SRS, and if go that route I already have the foot ascender. Thinking of adding the knee ascender to my MRS. I’ve been learning a lot from your videos. I’m just a recreational climbing arborist right now.
I have a home made chest harness, it has a plastic tube on it that goes over my shoulder. Inside the tube is a length of elastic which is terminated on the back of the harness, at the front it us terminated with a bowline for attaching a karabiner to my €30 croll. The croll has a foot strap and is basically my knee ascender. The long elastic is ideal for retrival. The whole thing can be made for 50 dollars another 50 dollars for the pentin makes 100 dollars for a peddle system for srs ascent.
as a beginner this video was really helpful. from my humble experience with both systems, I just wonder how inconvenient is it to switch between the two a fairly small number of times up in a tree? I just learned that I was doing the SRS wrong just putting the friction hitch with a micropulley on a single line and it did kinda freeze up on me (I thought I had a wrong or firction hitch or I tied it wrong) but some hitches were just more managable on that (I´m also quite light) - could some friction hitch or mechanical one be just fine on the single line? also, I understand that ropewalk with foot and knee ascender isn´t as effective on MRS but hey, it is still more effective then body thrusting on longer climb, isn´t it? or well depends how fit and overloaded your arms vs legs are, for me my legs are a bit better but so much less work overloaded so I enjoy even that very little help of a foot ascender on MRS, for example if I´m on the ground and the line is already set up in the top, it´s cool to get up the top on SRS but if you want to ascend halfway and use MRS there, the problem seems to me that you can turn MRS into SRS but not the other way around, or can you?
Yes the ascender do help out even in MRS. In MRS you advance up a tree and you can also do in SRS. Not sure if I would switch between them while I'm climbing.
Thank you, Yes you can use a Blake's hitch with the SRS we did a video on it title is (Blake's Hitch with a Rope Wrench) I do think that prusik cords are better to use though. You're welcom!
I just made a rope wrench from ally look handles and a strip of steel and stainless steel nuts and dolts and Nilon spacers .Got photo's but can not work out how to post them here for you to see
Thank you realy much on that comparsion. I would have another question tho. Wont the srs system shred the rope with the foot/knee ascender much faster than ddrt? And if i would do a canopy tie in in SRS wont there be a possibility of the butterfly knot getting stuck in a branch when pulling the rope down? especialy when doing a redirect? Also when i would do srt i would need to buy the ascenders/throw line and a rope wrench extra, so if i would buy a friction saver i would still be a lot cheaper than in srt right? I might want to try it out but i only have trees with rough bark here, so idk which would be better and more cost effective. Also, wont ropewalking be more secure in mrs ,since if your rope rubs past branches while you do that, there wont be all the tention on one rope which would decrease the chance of the rope snapping? And i have one last question, what do you need the chest harness for, since the system is already connected to your harness, so it will pull itself up while you climb right? Btw am i correct, that the rope wrench kinda "simulates" the second rope of the mrs? so half of the weight will be on the wrench and half of it on the knot? Anyway thank you for answering everyone with a question with all the knowledge you have, there are not a lot of people doing that, so thank you =)
If you have an SRS rope one that is made of kermantle it wont wear as easily. There are dual purpose SRS ropes that use can use for SRS and MRS. The DenaLine that Noah uses is one. Yes there is a possibility of the canopy tie becoming very difficult to take down if you do multiple redirects. A texas tug could help with that or just do less redirects. Yes it would be cheaper to buy a friction saver. You would definitely have to invest some money in SRS. SRS would be better for rough barked trees because whether you decide to us a canopy tie or a base anchor the part of the rope that touches the tree will not have friction. The only friction will be your rope to friction hitch. With MRS the is always friction with rope on tree so time it does wear on the rope. It is very difficult for ropes to snap from that type of use. when ropes snap it is usually because they have been damaged by something. Very important to inspect your rope before every climb. The chest harness in SRS is to tend you knot or system up if you don't have it the system you are using could drop to low and fail on you. It does not have to be a chest harness some people use a neck leash or you could also you a lanyard over your shoulder. Yes the rope wench takes weight off the not so you can move it. You're welcome. Take care!
@@BinoH Thank you very much for your answer again=) Another question has come up tho. When i am doing a canopy anchor in srt, there are 2 butterfly knots up in the tree according to the texas tig method. So when i what to pull the rope down,those two ropes with their eyes and the other rope in those eyes has to get pull down throu a certain spaicing in the tree or maybe even throu a crotch if you were not able to isolate a single branch. Wont that have a much higher risk of getting stuck compared to ddrt? Also i appreaciate that even tho you do many vids have people asking a lot of often stupid question ad even on old vids, you come back and help them as best as you can. Thanks for that =)
Can I use a foot ascender and knee ascender with the MRS system? I don't know much about this but it seems like it can be done. Please advice and thank you for videos, they are very helpful
@@BinoH I have not tried it yet, but I see it as a hybrid of srs/mrs. It uses less equipment than srs, and similar effort to a rads system. And as the rope does not move, less friction on the tree. Anchors to the top of the tree like a canopy anchor, but easy to remove. IAs there is no hip thrust, you shouldnt be exhausted when you get to the top. think it might be worth a try.
@@mdsaddlehunter3796 I think in a hunting application it will work well but not so much for tree work. If you used a Rope wrench or a hitch hiker and a climbing hitch with an ascender you would be able to ascned the tree without the extra hitchtes and break it down easy.
Reg Coates in th-cam.com/video/dE6n-sPaCDU/w-d-xo.html also mentioned that he found SRS actually saved his career because repetitive strain of using doubled rope was starting to make it impossible to climb. Having your body more vertical using SRS is probably less strain on the back.
@@BinoH That part without ascender just feeled like little biased towards SRS. Apart from that it is very nice comparation. Great job sir! From my POV- MRS is generally worse but way cheaper oldschool method- and yet still suitable for moving in a crown with a minor foot support (since with SRS nonstop putting on and off an ascender gets quite annoying in that situation).
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 85 | คู่เอก "ยอดเหล็กเพชร vs ผึ้งหลวง"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Qq_19bnnxEo/mqdefault.jpg)
![30 ชั่วโมงคนเดียว บนรถไฟชั้น 3 โซเวียต [Around The World Ep. 2]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/MlE9boAVqDA/mqdefault.jpg)
![MV วิถีชีวิตใต้ - ผา อัยย๊ะ [Official MV HD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/nODlkOUu9B0/mqdefault.jpg)
Thank you for putting the energy to educate the rest of us. As a new tree climber, I have learned a ton from your content.
You're welcome!
Outstanding review. In the kind of big spruce trees we have here, I found the ability to ground anchor with SRS to be really helpful, because it is next to impossible to isolate a high single limb from the ground. Also it is a little reassuring to know that if one limb fails there may be others below that will hold twice your weight, with the caveat being the fall is twice the distance to the next limb. Time wasted isolating a limb should get added to the MRS column, and if that requires a shorter throw then there is time wasted moving the anchor up in short lengths. On the other hand if the goal is tree removal and you ascend with spurs, then MRS is simple and versatile.
The SRS does shine in the spruce situation and if you are able to throw to a very high tie in it would be great. Good point about isolating the line. You are able to work your way up the tree with the SRS system if you plan on using a canopy anchor. It is possible to use the SRS on removals, say your working on a spar you can choke the spar with the system and back up with a lanyard. Awesome comment. Thank you!
I am a biginer of tree climer for just 1month. Your Video is great and simple explanation , ,so easy to understand. Thank you Bino!
You're welcome!
just rewatched after a year .. what a great comprehensive comparison Bino .. the best on the web .. a must educational resource 😊❤
Nice, Thank you! Much appreciated! Take care!
Subscribed. I dont even have to finish watching to give you full respect. Great, great video production. Split screen with minimal chitchat, just good advice and explanation.....wow. Huge thumbs up. Thank you very much for your efforts and time.
Thanks for the sub and great comment! Very much appreciated!
Really good review! Great editing. Good choice of music. Excellent comparison of the two systems. I’ve been doing tree work for years. This year was the first year I started actually using climbing gear. I started with a clove hitch, Blake’s hitch and a figure eight. That’s what I’m still using. I’ll eventually switch over to the two systems your using in this video.
Thank you, That is a great way to start. Get used to the basics and then start working on advancing. Take care!
Great comparison! I lean toward mrs, but I use foot and knee ascenders. Something about the doubled rope just feels more secure to me.
The best system is the one you feel comfortable in. Thank you!
MRS is definitely better, cheaper, and easier, also you only have half the weight on each side of the rope, which does give a much better sensation.
I never had any good training , 30 years later i still loving tree work , Im still learning SRS but had to teach myself along the way . I have and still do convince climbers that SRS is the way to be more efficient . although I can not . I do enjoy the idea that someday I will walk rt up a tree .. really enjoyed the side by side comparison. Joe ..
It is still great to great to keep on learning. We may never know everything about tree work the journey to learn is awesome. Thank you Joe!
I took my climbing gear to tree climbing because our summer oak was gringding the chimney or our neighbours.
I climb SRS with a grigri...
Your channel is fantastic for all the other techniques that i can take along with me now.
What´s your tought on climbing trees with the Grigri?
I have not used that for SRS my favorite to use is the Rope Wrench.
Great Video! I've been learning a lot from Bino's videos this week, as I'm shopping for minimalist arborist gear for fun and DIY trimming/removal....I have done a bit of rock climbing, and so am trying to incorporate the gear I have, oval biners in the year 2022?......I cannot recall the last time I shopped this hard! Today's decision is 7/16" or 1/2" rope. Half inch is the standard size, easier on hands, and allows for some rigging, but my and many other mech descenders don't fit 12+mm rope. I've come up with a hybrid system in my garage, where my Petzl Grigri is SRS. Since I don't have a foot ascender, I repeated an old re-direct foot loop trick to add mechanical advantage for MRS style body thrusting on a SRS anchor...maybe we can have the best of both? after tail turns upward past Grigri, tail bends back downward through micro pulley hitch above grigri; hands pull tail to chest while grigri captures progress, then hands push hitch up to reset for next pull...a two stroke! I've been inspired by several of Bino's videos this week: After watching floating retrievable anchors, I decided to trade some rope for a quickie shackle. Westec Rigging makes short ropes affordable, so I'm ordering 77ft of 7/16 (11mm) arborist rope, a quickie shackle and a small steel rigging ring to try retrievable floating anchor & retrievable false crotch re-directs...Also, I'm building a Bino Style 2 in 1 lanyard, and hoping to take advantage of Treestuff's bonus foot ascender with a $200 purchase. Did it used to be common to do SRS with only a hitch, pulley, & biner, sans rope wrench/device? Just wondering if this is something I can safely try.....low and slow.
Thank you for that awesome comment! I glad you have low and slow on your mind. Since you are adding some gear, you might try adding a Rope Wrench and a stiff tether. Once you have that foot ascender it will make ascending easier and if you already have a hitch climber pulley and hitch cord, You could have a complete Stationary Rope System.
there is no better! choose the climbing system based of the circumstance that arises! simple as that
Thanks for your videos. I appreciate the pace / tempo - very helpful for us beginners.
You're welcome, Thank you!
Interesting. I have the opposite feeling for limbwalking. I much prefer the "micro-control" of MRS when limbwalking and feel much more in control. Pro and cons with each system.
Very true. Take care!
Thank you so much for your videos and sharing your knowledge with me. Keep them coming I love your content and everything your doing!
Thank you!
Hi Bino, thanks for the video. I'm no expert, so correct me if I'm wrong please. I prefer the SRS for some reasons, the rope is less wored and is more protected (although mechanical ascending systems on SRS take a toll on the rope, but I will not say it's critical for an arborist rope cause anyway it will get replaced anyway before that for natural wearing natural for the job, but anyway the wored is less with mechanical systems compared to doing MRS without friction saver), also in SRS no need for friction saver (less money spending) and also no need to waste time setting it up and taking it down. The other thing I liked about SRS is I can climb higher with less rope, in SRS I can do a climb of almost the same lenght of the rope (by using any cheap and thin accessory cord for the pulldown for recovering the rope. With MRS I need double the rope of my climb. The other disadvantage of MRS is the exposure of the rope, by it I mean if any side of the rope gets cut I will fall, so the rope is more exposed for breakage on the way up and on the way back to the cllimber. In the SRS only one length of rope is exposed. One good thing of the MRS is that the rope is only holding half of my weight and in the SRS the rope tension is my whole weight.
Another advantage of the SRS is natural choking nature of the system which make the anchor more secure and less propense of slipping throught the branch in some situations like in a diagonal branch.
The only thing I really like about an MRS is in the case of Rescue. In MRS is something happen to the climber a rescue can be performed more easy and fast from the ground. Normally. I tied down the rope to the ground anchor with a Figure 8 so in case of a Rescue, a ground rescue could be performed (although is tricky because a release line will needed to be thrown to release the left friction system or friction hitch on the climber). But even there in the SRS system this will be even more easier if you instead of doing the butterfly knot, you just pass the rope and anchor it to the ground (like in and MRS but instead just use one side of the rope to climb), this will make a super easy rescue (even though this setup will eliminate some of the benefits of SRS I mentioned above) but even there I think is worth it specially if you have the Rope length. If needed another rope can be tied to the other rope in an asymetrical knot and a long pitch rescue can be performed.
These are my thoughts, I mostly think a simpler system normally is safer because is less propense to human mistake (which many times is the cause for accidents, specially when is 6pm, the sun is going doing and we have been working all day and we are in that moment exhausted and in a hurry, and even we try to not be in that situation sometimes it will happen). And I feel the SRS more simpler and ik some way with added simple redundancy (which is good), like for example even the foot climber is not considered legally a life support system, in case of an emergency it will hold you, so is an extra backup.
I Tower climbing and rigging we are required to use redundant systems anyway so we used two ropes side ny side (which I like), and is an SRS. This is posibble because we use SRS. With MRS it would be a super big mess working with two redundant ropes, because we will have four lines going through us then.
Sorry for the long comment. I really like the empirical comparison you made in the video side by side of both systems.
Thank you very much for this very educative video.
You have made a lot of great and true points. The SRS is an exciting system to use and for all of what it does the extra expense is worth it. Thank you for your comment. Take care!
I set the mrs system up, then I get the spliced end and make a running bowline and send it up. I then attach the knot to me and use my flipline over my shoulder to help it self tend. I put the penten on the rope and begin a srs ascent. Once at the running bowline in the top I switch back to mrs and begin working. A eight or wrench is always with me incase I need to descend on srs but I never do. It is the best of both worlds for me.
Sound like it works well for you.
The MRS definitely seems like more work. When I actually start climbing, I'll start of with it though. Watching your videos give me the insight without having done it myself. Can't wait to actually try it.
Good to hear that you are starting with the MRS system it's very good way to begin.
That's what I kind of figured. Thanks again.
Wow Bono. What a brilliant systematic comparison. I think I might convert to SRS!
I think you will find that you like it. Take care!
@@BinoH Thanks Bino - I'm curious - have you made the transition to SRS and if not why?
@@tuberider1171 yes I have it's so much easier to get into the tree.
@@BinoH And limb walking? I note you said it was easier. I recall somewhere another video by someone else of some system to help pull oneself back in more smoothly/or with more balance. Are you aware of any quick mods to do so or is it not an issue for you?
You can add a foot ascender to the MRS and itta be alot better wouldn't it? Im 45 yrs old and I just started climbing and I don't have a ton of cash to spend so I'm buying as I go. I use a Blake's hitch with foot ascender and I'm working on a knee ascender.homemade, but if you use a zigzag or something like that you don't need a rope wrench right?
Yes you can add a foot ascender to an MRS system and possibly a knee ascender but be careful because with some knots when using both foot and knee ascender when you come off of walking up the line and sit back the knot may run on you. If you are planning on using the Zig Zag for SRS you'll nees to buy a Chicane it's like a Rope Wrench for the Zig Zag. If you bought a Zig Zag for MRS you wouldn't use the Blakes hitch. The Zig Zag takes the place of the friction hitch.
@@BinoH thanks I use a stopper knot also for back up. I a big guy about 280 pounds so I need all the Xtra saftey I can get.lol
@@cujodavis3236 Yes a stopper knot is a good way to go. You got me by 40 pounds, I'm 240.
Bino, you know of course you can rope walk with the MRS... but that would skew the comparison a little since it would add 250(?) to the cost to get started, right?
I guess that's what I though, as a newbie myself,
True but using foot ascender and a knee ascender is still about half steps on every step. On the the other hand it will save your energy and will be a lot less expensive to add to an MRS climbing system.
@@BinoH I never body thrust with a hitchclimber set up. It just sucks. I'll always footlock the tail, it works better as it self tends. I find the hitchclimber not so great for ascents, I'd rather a blakes to ascend, and then o rig my hitchclimber when I make my chosen anchor.
I really don't think it's possible to compare the two systems, like people, they have different strengths.
Today I was doing conifers with MRS, yesterday I got up some big Ivy clad Ash trees SRS, with no fight ! Just pinged up a throwline, and walked up, easy !
@@robthompson1399 I think the best way is to learn the double rope or Mrs system and then learn SRS. Whenever you need whichever system you have it ready to go.
quick cool tree man tip of the day bye a chinese el chepo foot acendor remove straps zip tye heavy ish clevis then have a instant super easy rope wieght .it cuts out having to tye ur bag or saw on n the groundy can easily un hook it for ya
Bino saludos amigo, as always great video, thanks for all you do, I have limited SRT equipment being a newbie (decided rely on more mechanical and simple I guess), but I wanna try the double technique with the cord prozick, haven't get that far , but learning lots from your vids
Thank you!
Bino, I’m using MRS right nor with one foot ascender. I’m curios to try the SRS, and if go that route I already have the foot ascender. Thinking of adding the knee ascender to my MRS. I’ve been learning a lot from your videos. I’m just a recreational climbing arborist right now.
Cool MRS is the best way to start it will give you a great understanding of the required knots. Thank you!
I have a home made chest harness, it has a plastic tube on it that goes over my shoulder. Inside the tube is a length of elastic which is terminated on the back of the harness, at the front it us terminated with a bowline for attaching a karabiner to my €30 croll. The croll has a foot strap and is basically my knee ascender. The long elastic is ideal for retrival. The whole thing can be made for 50 dollars another 50 dollars for the pentin makes 100 dollars for a peddle system for srs ascent.
Always good video.just staring to climb old school sistem...no money to buy fancy equipment
Thank you, Old school is the best way to start. Take your time to learn all off the knots and equipment. Practice low and slow. Take care!
What knots do you use to climb I'm kinda new, and I use a self ascending Blake's hitch.
Blake s hitch..is a good choice
as a beginner this video was really helpful. from my humble experience with both systems, I just wonder how inconvenient is it to switch between the two a fairly small number of times up in a tree? I just learned that I was doing the SRS wrong just putting the friction hitch with a micropulley on a single line and it did kinda freeze up on me (I thought I had a wrong or firction hitch or I tied it wrong) but some hitches were just more managable on that (I´m also quite light) - could some friction hitch or mechanical one be just fine on the single line? also, I understand that ropewalk with foot and knee ascender isn´t as effective on MRS but hey, it is still more effective then body thrusting on longer climb, isn´t it? or well depends how fit and overloaded your arms vs legs are, for me my legs are a bit better but so much less work overloaded so I enjoy even that very little help of a foot ascender on MRS, for example if I´m on the ground and the line is already set up in the top, it´s cool to get up the top on SRS but if you want to ascend halfway and use MRS there, the problem seems to me that you can turn MRS into SRS but not the other way around, or can you?
Yes the ascender do help out even in MRS. In MRS you advance up a tree and you can also do in SRS. Not sure if I would switch between them while I'm climbing.
Can one climb SRS using a foot and knee ascender by adding a split tail using a Blake's hitch? This was a very good video . Thanks Bino?
Thank you, Yes you can use a Blake's hitch with the SRS we did a video on it title is (Blake's Hitch with a Rope Wrench) I do think that prusik cords are better to use though. You're welcom!
What's a good climbing rope. I bought a 12 mm no stretch and it hard to work with
Blue moon is nice
Hi Bino, could you use the notch jet step on the example MRS? 🇨🇦🇺🇸
Yes you can.
Good editing
Thank you, My son Noah does it.
Thanks
Welcome
I just made a rope wrench from ally look handles and a strip of steel and stainless steel nuts and dolts and Nilon spacers .Got photo's but can not work out how to post them here for you to see
Nice, does it work well?
Can you use a a zigzag ascender with MRS?
I believe the Zig Zag was made for MRS but you can also use it for SRS. If you wanted to use it SRS you need to have a Petzl Chicane.
Thank you realy much on that comparsion.
I would have another question tho.
Wont the srs system shred the rope with the foot/knee ascender much faster than ddrt?
And if i would do a canopy tie in in SRS wont there be a possibility of the butterfly knot getting stuck in a branch when pulling the rope down? especialy when doing a redirect?
Also when i would do srt i would need to buy the ascenders/throw line and a rope wrench extra, so if i would buy a friction saver i would still be a lot cheaper than in srt right?
I might want to try it out but i only have trees with rough bark here, so idk which would be better and more cost effective.
Also, wont ropewalking be more secure in mrs ,since if your rope rubs past branches while you do that, there wont be all the tention on one rope which would decrease the chance of the rope snapping?
And i have one last question, what do you need the chest harness for, since the system is already connected to your harness, so it will pull itself up while you climb right?
Btw am i correct, that the rope wrench kinda "simulates" the second rope of the mrs? so half of the weight will be on the wrench and half of it on the knot?
Anyway thank you for answering everyone with a question with all the knowledge you have, there are not a lot of people doing that, so thank you =)
If you have an SRS rope one that is made of kermantle it wont wear as easily. There are dual purpose SRS ropes that use can use for SRS and MRS. The DenaLine that Noah uses is one.
Yes there is a possibility of the canopy tie becoming very difficult to take down if you do multiple redirects. A texas tug could help with that or just do less redirects.
Yes it would be cheaper to buy a friction saver. You would definitely have to invest some money in SRS.
SRS would be better for rough barked trees because whether you decide to us a canopy tie or a base anchor the part of the rope that touches the tree will not have friction. The only friction will be your rope to friction hitch.
With MRS the is always friction with rope on tree so time it does wear on the rope. It is very difficult for ropes to snap from that type of use. when ropes snap it is usually because they have been damaged by something. Very important to inspect your rope before every climb.
The chest harness in SRS is to tend you knot or system up if you don't have it the system you are using could drop to low and fail on you. It does not have to be a chest harness some people use a neck leash or you could also you a lanyard over your shoulder.
Yes the rope wench takes weight off the not so you can move it.
You're welcome. Take care!
@@BinoH Thank you very much for your answer again=)
Another question has come up tho.
When i am doing a canopy anchor in srt, there are 2 butterfly knots up in the tree according to the texas tig method. So when i what to pull the rope down,those two ropes with their eyes and the other rope in those eyes has to get pull down throu a certain spaicing in the tree or maybe even throu a crotch if you were not able to isolate a single branch.
Wont that have a much higher risk of getting stuck compared to ddrt?
Also i appreaciate that even tho you do many vids have people asking a lot of often stupid question ad even on old vids, you come back and help them as best as you can.
Thanks for that =)
You didnt mention that you can rope walk using MRS as well.
True but we made a video about it. MRS Tree Climbing with a Foot and Knee Ascender.
The amount of energy saved/spent is worth the extra upfront investment in the SRS system.
Very true!
Can I use a foot ascender and knee ascender with the MRS system? I don't know much about this but it seems like it can be done. Please advice and thank you for videos, they are very helpful
Yes you can, I made a video on that subject named Faster MRS, Ddrt. Check it out.
I leave my device on the rope all the time and use base ties which is way faster then canopy tie
I can see how that would be quicker. What system do you use?
How about a hybrid "JRB" system?
I never heard of the JRB system. I looked it up seems like a lot of work to get into a tree. Looks like very light weight and more for hunting.
@@BinoH I have not tried it yet, but I see it as a hybrid of srs/mrs. It uses less equipment than srs, and similar effort to a rads system. And as the rope does not move, less friction on the tree. Anchors to the top of the tree like a canopy anchor, but easy to remove. IAs there is no hip thrust, you shouldnt be exhausted when you get to the top. think it might be worth a try.
@@mdsaddlehunter3796 I think in a hunting application it will work well but not so much for tree work. If you used a Rope wrench or a hitch hiker and a climbing hitch with an ascender you would be able to ascned the tree without the extra hitchtes and break it down easy.
Reg Coates in th-cam.com/video/dE6n-sPaCDU/w-d-xo.html also mentioned that he found SRS actually saved his career because repetitive strain of using doubled rope was starting to make it impossible to climb. Having your body more vertical using SRS is probably less strain on the back.
Yes it is a lot better on your body. Thank you!
DRT/MRS everything!!!
You like them both?
@@BinoH I normally climb using MRS, i feel its alot faster to set up and more efficient in the tree
Bring a couple of McDonald's on your climb on Mrs. Damn you need to rest.
SRS
Yes!
There is no point to avoid ascenders with MRS...
True but on this video I was going for basic mrs. I also made a video using ascenders with the mrs system.
@@BinoH That part without ascender just feeled like little biased towards SRS. Apart from that it is very nice comparation. Great job sir!
From my POV- MRS is generally worse but way cheaper oldschool method- and yet still suitable for moving in a crown with a minor foot support (since with SRS nonstop putting on and off an ascender gets quite annoying in that situation).
@@panhouska Good point I think it's great to understand both methods and everything in between. Thanks!