Carbon Fibre Game Changer | Inside 3T's Italian Bike Factory
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 8 ต.ค. 2021
- Bikes made from carbon fibre have been available since the mid 1980s but the carbon manufacturing process is evolving. Through the use of innovative machinery and filament winding without resin, 3T are able to craft tubes and frames with increasingly more complex shapes. Ollie was lucky enough to get a tour of the 3T factory in Lombardy to see how.
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What do you think of the finished product? Let us know down below👇
Still lust over the top Steel bike over a carbon one.
11:42 80°C? Does it mean spilling a hot espresso can weaken a frame?
Very lovely, but unfortunately outside my budget. Also: if it's 1x only, I think I have to give it a pass. (Edit: doesn't seem to be 1x only actually)
TIME bicycles yawning?!
Looks amazing 👏
An Italian company yet Ollie wears a Belgium shirt to the factory
He'll be appropriately fined.
Absolutely great point Chris. He should have borrowed my wool Campi jersey I bought in Rome in 1983.
As a Belgium I feel honored.
@@gielvh Me too
Chris Aldrich well spotted. Ollie should have 'dropped' it! 🤔😝
Cool to see manufacturing coming back to Italy.
I agree 100% man. If this is the direction for other Italian brands bring that shit on. 👌
exactly that is what all companies should do
"By doing it this way, 3T reckons it can achieve a +/-0.001mm of tolerance"
Somewhere in the UK, Hambini is starting to rub his hands together and opens up his little book of expletives.
...that he authored.
😁 😝 Brilliant as soon as he mentioned bottom bracket.. 😅
When I heard that I thought immediately of the dreaded H.😬
Agreed.
Yes. But I think Hambini likes to review customers bikes and not those sent by the marketing departments as we know they’ll be perfect.
Carbon woven frames have been a thing for quite some time now-Time and Festka come to mind.Happy that 3T is going this way.
Yeah glad to see some brands are still innovating and not just selling rebranded OEM china frames.
I think this is just the next step in what they started. It goes beyond Time and Festka in the complexity of the frame shape and the speed of production.
10:52 + -0.001mm of tolerance and alignment. Yeah whatever...
The master has spoken 🔥
i loved the bottom bracket gauge moment and the 'perfectly' round comment - clearly a misguided nod to @hambini .....all i have to say is - "3T, prove it ! "
HELLO HAMBINI FANS
bits of it might be lol
Some people have to wear hats...even indoors.
"Top secret, we can't show you!" The next two scenes its just casually sat on the table lol
So as for the basic idea of this processing is not so big secret, actually I have a few ideas how it works (It can be air balony, with some ultra stiff elements, or some kind of mechanical device).
Too much pathos for me.
@@volodymyrdonets4166 I think its like a plastic bottle with ice in it
Frozen you can put preassure on it but after that it melts and you can easily pull it out
@@simonkirchweger6090 epoxy is not capible with low temperature and moisture, that's definitely not the case
Wax. Low melting temp wax... if you are worried about it impregnation the carbon the put it in a bladder or plastic coating ect before install. Melt away the wax and pull out the thin bladder. Done
@@volodymyrdonets4166 will be some wedge and a multi part form. Just like any inside form tooling that needs to get removed.
That was truely fantastic to see a lovely frame like that being built in its home country……
I want-one ♥️
Love these factory tours. I’m a happy long time customer of 3T bars, stems and seat posts. Great quality. I believe they also own THM? This frame building process is fascinating. Made in Italy too!
I want Hambini or Peaktorque to get their hands on one of these frames
Agreed.
It'll happen
@@jonnythelegs2597 it is the same method as with Time frames
@@dietbountyicecream1444 method yes, execution: who knows? 🤷
At least some talk of tolerances and QA but yes, let's see what happens. Also love that my next potential expensive purchase was built using a popstick but if it works then it works!
Fascinating! Thanks Ollie
1 micron tolerance on bottom bracket? As a toolmaker I doubt that very much!
Have to agree with you there. I've worked with CNC machinery for over 20 years, and those kind of tolerances are difficult enough to maintain in precision grinding. Most lathes and work centres will maintain 0.01 under good conditions. I would expect there to be at least 0.01, probably more, between the mould and the bottom bracket plug otherwise just assembling them would become a very tricky job.
Especially with carbon filaments, I agree 👍
Fantastic work by 3T. Respect.
What a stunning piece of kit
1:41: Hey, props to whoever came up with that editing! Please more videos like this.
That's a special fountain using anti-water. 3T built a robot for that.
Except for the cameraman who's like a kid with his first camera, constantly fiddling with the zoom button. In, out, in, in, out, in, out, out, out, IN!
Wonderful content of some of the very best carbon manufacturing process technologies - A great video GCN !
I'm a Mold Enginner and also cyclist this video is very accurate to the process! I was surprised, congratulations!
What a great video and thanks for making me smile with this beautiful illustration of bike creation, Ollie! Only wished to hear more about your ride. Thanks!
I really like these gcn factory tour videos!
Thank you Ollie! Great video.
I look forward to seeing the price of 3T bikes drop now as their process for making carbon frames is cheaper and simpler!
LOL
@@moistnugget4019 yeah LOL 😂
I was going to say the same thing, since they're using women, which reduces labor costs to 77c on the dollar.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Yeh. Not going to happen.
Knowing the industry as it is now they will probably double in price.
Love this guy he has that great quality of giving us information with I don't know it all presentation. Perfect.
Need to send a frame to HAMBINI then I'll be impressed
Agree.
100% see how long it takes him to say its bullshit :)
Was thinking the same.
@@ezquiel700c Or wankers :P
Definitely send the frame to Hambini especially being the tolerance of the bottom bracket has been told and now we want to know if it is as such...if not...be prepared for the power point reaming!!!
This is high quality GCN content. Ollie’s 3T factory tour is full of interesting information and is very entertaining.
After working for a bike manufacturer, I’m always intrigued by all the different ways each company creates their products. Carbon fibers and engineering combined is truly fascinating. Thanks for each episode that showcases this tech!!🤙
This video has quadrupled the appreciation that I already had for my 3T racemax. So cool!
Wow, 3T finally managed to build a good-looking bike frame. Also, Kudos to the factory worker for wearing a T-shirt with the old 3T-Logo from back in the day when 3T (tecno tubi Torino) made the nicest titanium stems and the lightest aluminium handlebars ever.
I appreciate you showing the manufacturing process. I ride a Time Alp d’Huez made using a similar technique. I will definitely purchase this TTT bike made using this weaving process.
Time Alp d’Huez is RTM, not similar technique. Time is almost 20 years ahead of 3T when it comes to RTM.
Thank you guy’s once again going above and beyond
Let Hambini have a sample frame. If it’s as good as 3t say, it will be the bast advertising for the product. It might even tempt me away from my Columbus airplane aluminium frame........but I doubt it.😉
Hambini is only an hater. For him only his product are good....
Not just a hater but a justified hater. The crap bike companies try to get away with is ridiculous
Only a few cyclists, who buy new frames, watch hambini.
Nah, dude, watch literally anything from Luescher Teknik. That's THE guy for anything carbon. May be a little boring in his explanation, but nevertheless scientific and practicall especially.
I will never understand the obsession with Hambini's alleged 'finds'. He never presents any hard evidence on his claims and when needed he pulls the secrecy card due to his employment situation. He is a little coward hiding behind a pseudonym slinging mud at people.
What a cool video and truly amazing bikes 🤟🏼😜🤟🏼
Stunning frame/bike and great to see they have a nod with Made in Italy on the frame 👌🏻 given the container issues and environmental impact coming to the fore I wonder how many other manufacturers will follow suit 🤞🏻
at 4k per 40 foot container it costs about $8 per bike, at 20k per container it's only $40 per bike. Shipping is really cheap.
Great video. Makes me want to go buy a 3t.
Just bought a 1x Strada and I’m loving it 😍
Awesome & Thanks :)
Another high quality infomercial. Cheers GCN for the great content.
I think one of the ways it is so obviously an ad is that Oli is talking about all the 3T processes like he's all fully across them because he works for 3T.
Obviously he doesn't work for 3T, so it just isn't authentic.
Also 3T have a shed load of reputation to make up after the alleged sponsorship and supply to Team Blue (was that what it was called) with their 'innovative 1x system' 3T Exploro debacle.
@@markzzzsmith what's all this fuss about three quarters of manufacturing companies make silly claims... even vaccine companies do... you like the frame, good you buy it. you don't like it, well don't buy it.
Really cool video and very impressive "layup" and manufacturing technique for carbon (my background is in motorsports) -- would love to see an analogous video of an S-Works Tarmac or analogous frame being manufactured.
Just carbon looks very pretty 😍
I love that Europe is starting to switch on the brains again instead of moving every production step to China. There is also an emerging carbon manufacturing industry in Portugal and Spain that is worth a visit. The top secret UV-glue is a clever thing, I guess they can save resin by doing so as well.
It's always been about maximizing profit as it is for any businesses. European labored product cost 8 times over than chinese-made carbon parts in some cases. And the quality difference between higher end chinese-made carbon parts and european made parts is almost unnoticeable. For an average Joe, it's hardly justifiable paying $10,000.00 for an euro carbon bike when you can build one for $4,000 with the same shimano parts & performance.
@@klaytonickinson The quality difference is exactly zero. What you get for the higher labour cost is insurance and human rights. What I still don‘t understand why even things that are 100% machine made still have to be made in China.
@@chrisridesbicycles you probably didn’t understand Chinese styles. Highly efficient auto machine AND human labor made their market competitive
@@chrisridesbicycles It's not just the short term human rights. It's that you aren't funding Xi's warchest and espionage fund.
The increasing cost of energy will
great video, thanks.
I used to get giddy with lust for guitars.. Still do but now I can add Italian bikes to my gear lust.
Adaptation of Time Bicycles process. Glad to see this kind of innovation.
Super, super rad!
Engineers assembling?...labor prices just went up.
this is uk wording, where engineer mean technician. TV engineer, air con engineer, maintenance engineer, service engineer etc. non of the is really engineer 😉
Almost 500K congrats
Great video, super interesting !
really fascinating....awesome technology .......
We need to crowd fund a 3T frame for Raoul to cut up and see if these bold claims are legit!
definitely 3t over German bikes
Wow impressive!!!
Wow! Italy. My fellow Italians have recovered their dominance in production tool technology; are once again on the cutting edge of innovative bike tech and design aesthetics. I wonder if Lombardy is a hot region for bikes? I just recently purchased a handsome, multi-color Ciöcc bike from Curno there but the company gets its tubes from Taiwan, the ownership openly admitted. I see 3Ts in my local bike shops in California.
Consider that Veneto Lombardia and Piemonte are regions in Italy that produce bike as Bianchi pinarello bottecchia 3t cinelli wilier scarpin colnago kuota etc etc better or not but the passion is hot
I thought I really wanted a 3T frame BEFORE I saw this video but now I really have to have one!
Reassuring to see such marvellous and significant developments being achieved back in Italy 🇮🇹 Fortza Italia! Well done!
amazing. bring back the industry.
It's just WOW :)
A round bottom bracket shell? Truly a manufacturing revolution.
Possible Hambini video?
@@allanfoster6965 if 3T is serious, they'll make it happen. He's the only reason this conversation is even happening.
@@404nobrakes Tru dat😉😁👍
@@404nobrakes For those of us who only get a new frame every 5 years and put 100,000 km on it, I'd pick their frame over competitors that have recently been given the Sunday Roast treatment from Hambini.
That's great I really enjoyed the video, Can 3T now have their bikes back in stock!
But they’re employing robots IN ITALY!
@@navicto They are slacking off and should be sacked.
Don't forget the UK has its own emerging carbon frame building industry too. Check out Lowe Cycles, Warrington, England. GCN give me a shout, kettle is always on!
Amazing 😮❤
Dr Bridgewood is a treasure. Love his presentations.
Yes, if you like kindergarten science mixed with paid ads. Guys whom a proper cyclist should watch are Peak Torque, Hambini, Luetcher Teknik, Oz cycling, Shane Miller - GP Llama, Durian rider, etc. They are the ones who are not paid for advertisments. I think even Ollie is sometimes ashamed for having to jump hoops like a trained dog, instead of being proper reviewer and scientist (as he calls himself).
Gorgeous and very impressive technology. I wonder if the other Italian bike makers will start having their frames made by 3T instead of going to Taiwan for that work? Would 3T even entertain this idea or keep the benefits of their unique frame building technology to themselves, at least for some years to come?
Wow very nice bike
That is a kick ass bike!
So cool to see how my Strada Due was made!
Excellent Presentation Gents! Not university level but not grade school either. Good length. Excellent camera work and production values as well. Good job all! Best Regards and Best Wishes!
And a campag Cork Screw! Oh YESSSSS
Very interesting.
huge!!!
They can archive tube shape but weight/compliance is a lot harder this way compared to manual layup where you can play with fiber orientation/thickness.
Thank you for saying this. Filament winding has significant drawbacks to the this type of manufacturing. Specifically, it doesn't allow for optimized fiber orientation. And it has a minimum thickness in order to close out the winding pattern. With prepreg layup, you can optimize the layup in areas that need it and remove material in areas that don't need it. In this way you can create stiffer and lighter frames. And the use of M55J fiber (ultra high modulus fiber) is not necessarily a good thing in a bike frame. It is some of the stiffest fiber available, but it is also very brittle and will fracture much easier than Intermediate modulus fiber. IM fiber is very stiff and has super high tensile strength which makes it stronger in higher loads. And way more comfortable to ride.
great vid
9:44 that oldschool 3ttt logo!
I found the legend here
I am absolutely obsessed with my 3T Exploro with Ekar and Shamal wheels! The best bike I’ve ever owned 💯🥂
Lucky you, Ollie, that you got to test-ride this fab bike! :-) I wish Bianchi would use 3T-manufactured frames for their road bikes!
Interesting video. Apologies were made on a number of occasions for the noisy machines, doing their job. They were very quiet compared to the "music" which was not necessary at all.
I didn't know GCN was belgian like me, cool, I want that shirt please
Very interesting visit.Will be megabucks of course.Now needs to be sent to Hambini &Peak Torque for assessment
GCN 🇧🇪😍😍
Everyone Should Have One!
I think the mandrel is made out of silicon and then pressurised with a fluid so it's hard enough to hold a shape but can be "deflated".
If 3T makes a bottom bracket shell that's precise by 0.001mm does that mean it also has to make its own bottom brackets? Because surely mass produced BBs won't fit to such a precise space?
It means your bottom bracket won’t creak, which is usually a fault of the frame. Like when cannonade event a standard that they that themselves cannot manufacture to.
@@likemarksee But won't there now be more clearance, or more chances at least for ill-fitting mass produced BBs? Because mass produced BBs are manufactured with less precise measurements
@@TheSamwhytecombination of both the BB and the shell could cause a poor it. Usually it’s the frame that causes a problem. Tolerance of the BB does not need to be any higher, just because the frame is more accurate. The BB tolerance would need to be within a suitable/specified range. If the frame is accurate, that’s one less variable that could cause a poor fit. I would think most good BB’s are within a suitable tolerance, as that’s much easier to achieve than high tolerance on the frame.
Time have been making the best carbon frames for years, everybody else is catching up. Can 3T make a round bottom bracket shell?
watch the vid! it’s in there!
Yes.
Now they can !!
You can if you use a mandrel!
@@oliverbridgewood3929 just watched your orbea doc on gcn+ Great work that was. Impressive bike. Whats your views on it now?
Excellent Infomercial, for a minute I almost thought I could afford a 3T haha then a trip to the website to get the pricing on the 60th year edition Europe: €19,610, USA $19,610 + $750 transatlantic fee (all shipping & duties incl).
It's a special edition. Only weirdos would buy that.
@@mitchellsteindler Weirdos with tons and tons of money.
Less Labour intensive, less time intensive but still the price goes up. Cycling industry is a joke.
RnD costs go up, marginal costs go down.
Its been like that for ever, someones making a fortune
It’s called capitalism.
Not fun also not secret fact; retail costs are almost never related to production. Marketing sets a target retail and then determines desired profit window. Engineers then design to fit the window. Not the other way around.
@@hectorchavez1807 and China got really good in it apparently. Chinese frames are made better by the day and are also cheaper than ones made by fancy brands. No overhead costs, no marketing BS, less labour costs.
the "secret ingredient" is UV epoxy resin, same type they use for sewage liners.
Might even be the similar to what I use to coat my printing too.
This helped make my decision to purchase a 3T Exploro Max.
Fantastic to see a carbon frame made in Italy 🇮🇹 I think I may just get myself one!
Looks great, but with all this trouble, why not mold along the rear triangle? Seems doable with two extra parts in the mold. It seems there now are glued weak spots in key heavy-pressure structural areas?
beauty
loved the joke about BB dimension accuracy lol nice one olli
Big ❤️
i'm missing how they joined the tubes together. the ends of the tubes all had frayed carbon fiber strands. how did they join them together???
cut and glue
Nice presentation ! It would be nice to have a guided visit of Basso manufacture, another brand made in Italy ....
Love 💕 😍
One of the BEST episodes !
Thanks for doing a GRAND job in explaining the new technologies being implemented in bicycle manufacturing. 👌🏼
I want to see more about filement wound wheels like Venn makes.
“Greater consistency, voids and gaps/ensuring resin adhesion” all these concerns are the farthest thing from my mind when I blasting down a hill at 45-50+ miles on my Litespeed T1SL Titanium frame. Absolute peace of mind, and at 17.5lbs with pedals I’ll absolutely line up next to any of these ultralight Carbo/plastic/composite bikes.
Impressive manufacturing all around and glad Italian made vs Asian frames
It’s funny people try and make fun of carbon composites when modern aircraft like the Dreamliner is flying millions of people around the world and it’s made of carbon composite. A clear example of a lack of knowledge and feelings taking over. A well made carbon frame will blast down any hill without worry for decades. Colnago is a good example. Their C40, C50, EPS and C59 still blast down any hill and command high resale prices. Titanium is not a superior material to carbon. They are just both materials with different characteristics. There is sound reason it’s not used in bike racing except for chainrings and cassettes whereas carbon composite is preferred for the frame and everything else. When well made, it’s very light, very strong and no other material can currently come close. Goes to say it’s the preferred material for planes, race cars and high performance machines. Titanium used to be that exotic material 30 years ago and as good as it is, it never caught on even then due to the poor cost to performance ratio.
Truly impressive. It's awesome to hear they have come up with a method to eliminate voids and get the tolerances in the BB area perfect. The sad thing would be what does it cost. Italian bikes cost so much more than bikes made anywhere else in the World. That said this is probably not a bike to be had by the common cyclist. So I'll be happy to stay with my US made custom Ti bike and forget everything you showed us here.
When people think of Italian products, they think high priced luxury brands like Gucci and Prada and Ferrari. In my opinion, Italian bicycle industry and workers view themselves as craftsman first and that mindset sets the cost of their labor which ultimately determines the price of finalized product.
Their products just happen to be look good and classy despite the age. That's all. One reason why bicycle collectors still dig old-school steel Bianchi because of that classy look and feel.
I like certain American made products (tools and household items) for their durability and toughness, but they tend to overlook refinement and precision which foreign brands are excel at. Depending on how the bicycle is used, Italian bikes are for weekend leisure ride while US made bikes are designed to take beatings and get dirty. LOL
@@Reanimator999 US made bikes are designed to be passed by this crap when buying a bike.
Итальянцы меня поражают, какие крутые вещи они делают! Авто, мото, вело.🤯🔥🔥🔥🔥👍💪
Coool
The whole point of carbon fibre is the the material has directional characteristics- you can orient the fibre in the direction of the load. Weave the fibre fails to take advantage of the full potential of the material.
I also thought about this. Surprisingly (or not), no mention of this issue in the video. Seems to me however that fibre angle can be changed in the weaving process up to a point.
Sometimes one right comment!👍🏻👍🏻
My Time VXRS Ulteam used this RTM process 15 years ago