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The fact EA was making shouldve told em something after the destroyed the best RTS series which was Command and Conquer EA is the same as activision all they care about is short term profits.
Possible new series where we cover the development, rise and fall of mmos that have shut down. Let me know what you think and if you have any requests or suggestions!
It hasn’t shut down, but I think you could do an unbelievable doc on Tibia. There is such a vast and interesting history behind the game; between players, developers and the game itself!
@@Ketiseb lets not pretend that its different from live or even most currently live MMOs where pvp modes are neglected (while game is raking in millions $$$) Its the same shit as everywhere else, just a bit more stale since the game is 16 years old without real major updates
I was a QA tester at EA when this game launched. Mythic offered any employee an account with a free lifetime sub, but our shady overlords said, "no not for you." One mad lad did what we were told never to do; he contacted the devs and they were kinda pissed. Gave us all our free accounts. Had a blast with all the folks for a solid few months or so.
That's messed up dude. We got free "lifetime" accounts for SWTOR for almost a decade, but with the switch to Broadsword, they've been taken away too. :( BTW, did you know Matt Shaw or Michael Manning? Was Michael the fella who worked on yall's patcher? I've been trying to remember that guys name...
This one of my biggest heartbreaks. I followed this since the beginning and was an active WoW player and ready to jump ship. And worse I was a huge DAoC fan too
NOthing bad about being a DAoC fan. I played it for years and was so ready for WH online to have an updated rvr engine. I could not take wow seriosuly because it was candy af. Baby pvp and Baby dungeons but int he end it was what the masses wanted and instancing was the right move. Leaving the games life up to the amount of players and how players chose to balance the realm, killed daoc and wh ol. Even wow was not free from all horde or all allie servers but there is no consequence to same side servers in wow as they have instanced pve and cross realm pvp.
@fuzzylumpkins6034 totally agree! I just mean that I was hoping the creators of DAOC would promise a great product, which they did, but modernized their game to feel more like WoW instead of their own property. Probably because EA didn't feel like Warhammer Online wouldn't appeal to audiences. Good reply!
Same here, except I did jump ship. Warhammer online was a great game. The way they did pvp in the open world was beautiful. Basically what DCUO copied from. This game was a fuckin masterpiece. The only thing that would have made it better was the daoc style of siege warfare. Out of all the mmos that have come out, I think this was my favorite. Closely followed by daoc. The only reason is because the gameplay was more modernized and pushed the envelope itself. It was basically dark age of Camelot, with more modern gameplay, but without the siege warfare.
@@alexhomer25 they’ve made some decent changes overall since 2019 on balancing, and events and player incentives. But in the last year some big guilds have taken breaks and have demands on balancing, so the community is a little fractured at the moment. Still very lively on most EU nights, and NA has a decent growing player base and representation compared to 2019 with the guild Tegridy. What’s nice is your chars are always there to play so I encourage you to check it out again
@@alexhomer25 its bleeding players and a boring zergfest where giant groups of players roam around in a zerg looking for something to fight - the bulk of the game is just running around in circles looking for fights. Almost all events reward you with items that decay over time so you can stay on that treadmill. It's a terrible gameplay loop.
The foundation on which PvP is built is SOOOO much better with healers using energy and having things they can cast while moving, and with tanks having an actual role. I feel like if WoW stole their ideas it would be considered revolutionary even today haha.
Me and my friend puts our lives and souls into this game. I still remember the sieges we fended off to protect our keep, how one of our dumbarse officers got a speed ticket because he wanted to catch the siege, how wonderful the overall vibe there was, and delightful the whole fantasy warhammer universe was. I still don't think any other game nailed the faction and group play like they did to this day. It was such a heartbreak to see the mismanagement and closure of it.
I still remember being on the Karak Norn server the moment it shut down. I walked into the orchard after that and just looked into the distance for half an hour not thinking anything. The grief hits very hard even to this day.
I was a GM for the german team - my time in Dublin with the boys, watching Charlie the unicorn during nightshifts, revealing our GM Avatars to drunk players or flying in GM Mode from public quest to public quest documenting what is happening in each PQ because nobody at our office knew what the fuck is going on - man these times were so great. I miss the boys.
Devs leaving players to determine how rvr went was always going to be its death, same as daoc. When everyone went hib in DAoC, long term players like myself quit. I did not want to start over in hib as I already had a RR12 cleric. That was millions of player kills. Had the servers instanced or capped players in realm wars, it would have been sustainable but made it as cheesy and carebear as WoW pvp
Top many low pop servers on launch killed the game early, very few servers actually experienced the game as was intended with enough players to make the content run as intended.
@@Electromash92because it had nearly a million players on release and they did what every new MMO does, added more servers to appease the angry people who couldn't get on. Problem is that back then server technology was very primitive to what it is now and they couldn't just easily and dynamically merge servers into each other as things died down. So you were left with dozens of ghost towns a month later when everyone's free sub ran out and 60% of the population didn't resub for a second month. Beyond that it was mostly screwed by developer incompetence and EA starting to cut staff just six months after release when it became clear the game wouldn't be the gold egg laying goose they had expected. People also expected the game to have the same level of content that Blizzard already offered with Wrath and that was never going to happen.
Great video. I had the pleasure of working on this game from 07 to 09. We where on top of the world at launch, and less than a year later over 100 of us got let go one cold morning. Incredible talent went into making this game, and I made lifelong friends at Mythic. Its a shame what happened to this project. Got me a bit misty and nostalgic watching this, thank you!
In 2010 or so, while working for EA/BioWare on the SWTOR project. We visited the Mythic offices to chat with one of the developers about using their launcher/patcher for SWTOR. There was room after unlit room of empty cubicles -- it was spooky as heck. I'll never forget that. I really did like their patcher tech though, and for a brief time we were not only using their patcher for SWTOR, but I integrated their asset storage file structure into the game client as well. Good times.
Seriously older MMORPG like Retail WoW, SWTOR should start making controller support for console players can DL the game , it would only up the player base
@@Dirtnose Yeah it's basically Kotor 3 with the amount of voice acting and story content. It's what Bioware was good at. Shame they had to chase the MMO dragon as EA overlords decreed.
@cattysplat Believe it or not, that was all BioWare, not EA. The Good Doctors entered into a partnership with LucasArts and put our tiny (for an MMO) office in Austin to producing the game. However, if EA had not bought us and thrown money at it, I kinda doubt it would have launched -- we just didn't have the resources, and some technology hail-marys we threw weren't working out. But EA got us from a hundred devs to over 400, and the game was finished.
You can still play it currently, as Warhammer Online Return of Reckoning. Adding to the video the ways in which the game could still be played would be a great boon to the small communities still pushing these classic.
Wholeheartedly back that. Most MMO's have pretty good communities still around after their "failure" that keep the games going, sometimes with additional development meaning new content continues. The endorsing of a specific City of Heroes (I believe) community with an actual official license and thus an approved way to play the game might be a sign of shifting tides towards "dead" games, though probably not.
@@Arenumberg Possibly, but out of all the CoH servers NCsoft picked the sketchiest one. That will come to bite all of us in the behind if NCsoft take a longer look at Homecoming's financials and the way they treat their "staff".
Nah, avoid this server like the plague, the glory days of 2020 and 2021 are long dead and the server has become extremely toxic with a community that rather cannibalize the game than help it improve.
@@marcjansson1039 Simple, community keeps making the game rather unplayable with exploitation of broken mechanics/classes, dev team maintaining a long routine of questionable balance changes listening to a top 0.01% of their favorite pet players... I assume you don't play RoR from your comment, because the game has been on a steady decline on player numbers since 2023 which there's no end in sight.
Funny thing is, back in the day Blizzard wanted to make Warhammer RTS, but Games Workshop did not agreed to give the IP. So Blizzard took what assets they already made for the game, and made the first Warcraft game, Orcs and Humans.
The private server is incredibly good and I would highly advise anyone watching this video to go play it, once you wrap your head around the game it's SO much fun
the game can be "fun" at times BUT the devs are ass hats Xrealmers decide what happens at all times in game and pretty much no matter what you are just canon fodder once you hit 40 until you can get much better gear
Man I was working for an MMO news website when this came out, and after covering it for a first-look, I really fell in love with it. I wound up playing it (and covering it) for the game's entire run. They did have problems with balancing and other game issues, but the two main reasons it failed was the lack of funding/support from Mythic, and then WoW's Wrath expansion came out and it never recovered from the hit in players that caused. It was an excellent MMO, though. PvP was so good. I played a Magus, which was also one of the most neglected classes, lol. Just a great time, though.
I’m so happy I found this video. I’ve thought about this game every now and then the last 15 years. Now I know there’s servers out there I can check out, thanks 🙏🏼
and see how games workshop mircomnanages i tto hell as develpers need run every decision by them if they agree or not and kets be honets eveyroen will paly some kind space marien or you arenallowed play as space marine not thta i would i would play as filthy xenos or heretic but yegh that kidna gme woul die in 5-6 motmnsh depending how stupid games workshop or they woud but pricing lie kthey od thei minsi whis woudl be astronomical soo no thnak you
this game had huge potential for me. I can’t describe it but it had that feel good cozy feeling that wow gave me. I really enjoyed my time playing this, I remember it vividly ❤
I still go back to the Return of Reckoning private server every now and again. The PvP was a genuinely good time, and I can only wonder what could've been if the original game wasn't mismanaged into the dirt. Makes me wonder if this next attempt at a Warhammer MMO will be any better.
I fell in love with this game back in the day man. Renown rank 100 Bright Wizard, who took down the Destruct Emperor, and got the Sovereign Robes. Damn, those were good times.
really liked it! can't wait for you to cover the conan MMO! i'll always remember it as on of the best "early game" experiences i had in an mmo, and the moment you left the tutorial island and got to "main game" everything was an unfinished barren boring wastelands. really interested what you could dig up on that one!
I've never been a MMO player but back in the day, I got roped in by friends to play it with them. I have very fond memories of my adventures as a marauder with a mutated arm.
ESO was developed by a lot of the guys and gals from Mythic and the PvP zone Cryodiil shows. It's incredible to see how far that sieging system has come and still holds up to this day.
Nice work on the video! Was nice to go down a trip on memory lane. Return of reckoning is still going strong for those that are interested in checking it out, the server has plenty of custom live events and content for those interested!
The Tome of Knowledge is still to this day one of my favourite Systems in a game, it had SO MUCH depth to it, just the fact that it had a Bestiary of everything you fought with some lore about it was great. Now no developers even bother with such a feature, such a waste.
Oh, super cool video idea. Haven't even watched it yet, but I'm excited. I played and enjoyed WAR at launch and for a few months. But like many people at the time, I was still in love with WoW and went back to that over time.
Loved this game. The oublic quests and pvp were awesome. Was young and my computer sucked eventually couldnt run it. Classes were so unique too even if they were mirrored. Shadow warrior and the goblin one were awesome. Would never even think of playing a goblin in any game but had to in this one to fight inside the squid
I played this game when it came out, I had a really fun time and thought it was really interesting, the PvP especially was a blast. I was quite young to be fair but honestly kind of sad it died so fast.
I arguably had more fun in this mmo than I did Wow, its lore and setting just appealed to me more, it was a sad day indeed when it closed, but the return of reckoning fortunately took its mantle.
I really appreciate you bringing up DAoC and WH online. My wife and I played DAoC for 5 years and it was at its peak after the ToA xpac. We both had high RR toons (11.5 and 12.6.) and we were seriously excited for WH Online. It was such a let down. RvR made DAoC and it was a fluke that can never be repeated. There were a million players in DAoC over 20 or 30 servers. You would still get a lagfest in keep takes and today this would be much more stable but a company would have to cap the number of players in instanced rvr and that would be useless in an rvr game. It would mean you could not guarantee playing with your clan or zerg. WoW was easy, had rubbish pvp and instanced dungeons. To this day wow is still more player friendly than DAoc or WH OL could be even with more stable servers. Mythic games required a massive amount of players in 1 area where WoW can instance dungeons for 5 10 20 and 40 players (at the time.) Very different games, very different players. WoW was for anyone or any level of play (even the top play was questionably simple if you could learn a 5 move pattern with 3 button gameplay), DAoC and WH OL were for players that only cared to pvp/rvr all day. CoD on roids. When we left to play WoW, it was evident what type of gamer would prevail in wow and in which area. Our guild migrated in full from DAoC/WH to WoW during TBC and at the time we had no idea it was big deal to clear BT. We didnt understand legendaries at the time but we did have raid son farm very quickly. It was annoying they had lock out so we only lasted in WoW until the end of WotLK. 3 years was a long time to play a mild game that thought it was hard. Edit: I just noticed my yt tag is the name of my cleric from DAoC, Fuzzylumpkins. Lasting impact.
Loved playing my White Lion. Such fond memories of this game, playing with my younger brother. Enjoyed the lower level RvR, the skirmish maps and generally exploring the world. Great art design and feel. Good times.
This game was so good, leveling through pvp was super fun. You would level through scenarios (battlegrounds) which would also drop gear for your team to roll on when enemy players were defeated. I remember being sad when the servers announced to be going down. The game never got a real expansion.
This was great man! I started playing WoW Classic about 6 months ago, I’ve gotta 48 Dwarf Priest. First time ever playing WoW. My buddies been trying to get me into since launch when we were in HS and I finally dove in. Love your content man. Seriously some of the best wow content out there. I hate when I have to watch someone else’s stuff to get info actually. Speaking of that, I would suggest making guide videos for things like Pre BIS, how to play certain roles, how to do or prep for certain dungeons or Raids, just all the stuff you haven’t covered in WoW Classic or didn’t cover in great detail. If it ain’t mono tone I ain’t listening, ya herd? Just a suggestion, keep up the good work!
I’d watch more of this. My suggestion would be to try and give a little more detail on some of the balance issues/mechanics. Not a ton, but a little taste of the systems that were there
Great video! So glad to see you branching out from WoW! Small suggestion but towards the start of the video I felt like your voice was being overpowered by one of the songs. Just a friendly suggestion.
I joined RoR in 2020 Right in the pandemic and oh Boy let me Tell you. It was the Most fun i‘ve ever had in a mmorpg. I sadly rolled with a Withhunter (good bye City Sieges) but the best Memory was a Battle of 600 vs 600 Players. Almost the whole Server in one Zone was insanity.
the biggest problem with the population in the factions was that there were only two factions. having 3 factions in a free for all like dark age helped regulate this issue. i think WoW suffers greatly from not having three factions when it comes to PvP as well. had they made a third faction for warhammer that consisted of ogres, skaven and beastmen, i think it would of been much better. i know these races are a somewhat unlikely alliance, but for the context of the MMO i think these are the best ones that can be grouped together. no way EA would let them spend more time developing though. EA genuinely did more damage to warhammer than anything else. EA also did an excellent job running dark age into the ground. late 00's were when we really started to see the effects of corpos on our games
At least wow sorta balanced it out making pvp an optional mode later on that encourages player giving a bonus for exp and such. Definitely agree, I kinda wish there was a neutral/gray faction of sorts to balance out the main two. Planetside 2 does a decent job with the 3 way faction balance imho
@@midwestbox yeah i think warhammer online just came out at the wrong time and mythic had the worst company possible in EA buying them and breathing down their necks. mythic legit was not trying to be a wow killer they just wanted to bring the warhammer world to life and EA just wanted to cash in
A third faction was being worked on for the game's first expansion. It would have been Skaven, Vampire Counts and I think Ogre Kingdoms. There wasn't much work done on it before everything started to fall apart but what little there was got reused later when they added the playable Skaven in RvR. More came to light in some leaks and in bits that would later be found in the game files by the people who worked on the private server emulator.
Yes this! I wish more devs would realise that a 3 faction system is basically adding autobalance, because if one faction gets too strong the other 2 will band together to take the third faction down. This is what happens in DAoC still to this day on private servers.
Thank you for the blast from the past! I was there... 3000 years ago... playing a chaos marauder :D I remember to this day how I got stuck like 100 times just trying to walk past a root on the ground XD
Great video with a lot of things I had no idea even was in the game, and I played it back in the day lol. I would love to see you cover Wildstar at some point!
Warhammer was literally decades ahead of its competition, I have no idea how it could get this bad. If it released nowadays it would be absolutely massive.
They should really look into doing another Warhammer MMO with all the knowledge for mmos we got now. I had fun with it for a bit when it released but never stuck with it cus mainly my friends played WOW but I did the private server for this game and had a blast they improved it a bunch over Mythic.
Playing this game in pservers years after release is such a joy. It's a great MMO, sadly it didn't have too much content outside of the mass scale PvP, there is some yes, but it's hardly enough to keep people engaged for a long time. I would've loved to see expansions and big content patches for it. I HIGHLY recommend playing a character to max level, especially if you're even slightly into the Warhammer universe. I'm getting the itch to go play my Marauder right now, such a unique class.
Awesome video as usual. One of my favourite mmos of all times. Sad when they closed it, but thankfully I discovered Return of Reckoning in 2014 and have been playing there ever since. The work done by the devs and community is insane and they make the very special soul of this somewhat unusual mmo persist. Thanks Monotone man for talking about this great game :)
there is another private server other then return of reckoning. Works well, its just lacking population, it feels closer to live imo. server is called Flames of War. It has its own issues and bugs but last i played they fixed them pretty fast
Thanks for this cool video. I've always wondered what WH Online was like, but never tried it for various reasosns. It was good to get this insight. Very entertaining and informative as usual. Keep up the good work!!
It's still up and running and has been for many years return of reckoning, and the original devs were there for the release of the new version and we get so many balance updates huge game updates they also stream now and again on twitch
Hey MadSeason, this was a game I have such nostalgia for. Like you said, the game's private server Return of Reckoning is such a great/strong community. You should do a video about the private server to bring more attention to it, especially since the type of game it is, relies on more and more players.
I remember the hype my friends and myself got for this game. We get into the beta, we even buy the game on it's release day, which did offer 30 days trial w/out subscription fee. Noone of use continue playing after those very first 30 days. Not because the game was bad, but because it was a pain in the ass to play it: login queues, lag, continuous server dc'd .. And that was when there was not a RvR event going on.
Dog this is some incredible content, you amazing level of detail and story telling that usually comes from your wow content but now with other games, I am so for this. Incredible job as always and really excited to see what game comes next. Couple games I’d be curious to see you cover: ffxiv 1.0, toontown(weird one but curious to see your take on a video on it), meridian!!
This is the first MMO that ever played a healer, because my buddies & I got tired of losing matches. Healinstein was so much fun! Then we tried some squigs, played some black orcs and had fun kickin' 'em in the jibblies! My absolute favorite times were playing Lava Golf with my ranged knockback as a magus. Good times, man. Good times. Of course, those pesky bright mages would always show up and ruin the fun . . .
I wish more devs would realise that a 3 faction system is basically adding autobalance, because if one faction gets too strong the other 2 will band together to take the third faction down. This is what happens in DAoC still to this day on private servers.
I distinctly remember at WAR's launch, ability animations did not correctly sync when the castbar was pushed back due to the player being hit. Animations would proceed and finish before the castbar. It was a major issue that completely tore me out of the game.
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23:18 holy sh*t , no wonder they nuked that server , way way safer as a fanmade Private Server .
The fact EA was making shouldve told em something after the destroyed the best RTS series which was Command and Conquer EA is the same as activision all they care about is short term profits.
I like the idea of making videos about more games, not only wow. You have the expertise, you can make super INTERESTING videos about so many games !
EA Louse! Great Woman!
does this heretical youtuber plays the omnissiah credo music from the adeptus mecanicus even if they dont exist in the age of sigma....purge him?
Possible new series where we cover the development, rise and fall of mmos that have shut down. Let me know what you think and if you have any requests or suggestions!
Age of Conan.
It hasn’t shut down, but I think you could do an unbelievable doc on Tibia. There is such a vast and interesting history behind the game; between players, developers and the game itself!
Yes holy shit this is awesome! And I agree Age of Conan
Yes, great idea mad, plus I’d like to see a series on where you think they could take Warcraft as a new mmo
Collab with Josh Strife Hayes for an episode on it!
I honestly feel like Return of Reckoning should've gotten a larger segment in the video. What they've accomplished is astounding.
And they've been going for twice longer than official servers did lol
I agree. Keeping this game alive and even updating such a niche game is a huge effort.
too bad the devs are tools, but it is a great private server
No, the game's many issues persist and admins are clinically insane. Return of Reckoning is a terrible experience.
@@Ketiseb lets not pretend that its different from live or even most currently live MMOs where pvp modes are neglected (while game is raking in millions $$$)
Its the same shit as everywhere else, just a bit more stale since the game is 16 years old without real major updates
I was a QA tester at EA when this game launched. Mythic offered any employee an account with a free lifetime sub, but our shady overlords said, "no not for you." One mad lad did what we were told never to do; he contacted the devs and they were kinda pissed. Gave us all our free accounts. Had a blast with all the folks for a solid few months or so.
EA
Is just so evil lmao
EA Sports.
That's messed up dude. We got free "lifetime" accounts for SWTOR for almost a decade, but with the switch to Broadsword, they've been taken away too. :(
BTW, did you know Matt Shaw or Michael Manning? Was Michael the fella who worked on yall's patcher? I've been trying to remember that guys name...
@@Bandoolero it wasnt EAS decision to not allow emplyed get live tiem subscribtions it was Games Worksophs idea
This one of my biggest heartbreaks. I followed this since the beginning and was an active WoW player and ready to jump ship. And worse I was a huge DAoC fan too
NOthing bad about being a DAoC fan. I played it for years and was so ready for WH online to have an updated rvr engine. I could not take wow seriosuly because it was candy af. Baby pvp and Baby dungeons but int he end it was what the masses wanted and instancing was the right move. Leaving the games life up to the amount of players and how players chose to balance the realm, killed daoc and wh ol. Even wow was not free from all horde or all allie servers but there is no consequence to same side servers in wow as they have instanced pve and cross realm pvp.
@fuzzylumpkins6034 totally agree! I just mean that I was hoping the creators of DAOC would promise a great product, which they did, but modernized their game to feel more like WoW instead of their own property. Probably because EA didn't feel like Warhammer Online wouldn't appeal to audiences. Good reply!
You & me both, this story is very familiar to me.
Same here, except I did jump ship. Warhammer online was a great game. The way they did pvp in the open world was beautiful. Basically what DCUO copied from. This game was a fuckin masterpiece. The only thing that would have made it better was the daoc style of siege warfare.
Out of all the mmos that have come out, I think this was my favorite. Closely followed by daoc. The only reason is because the gameplay was more modernized and pushed the envelope itself. It was basically dark age of Camelot, with more modern gameplay, but without the siege warfare.
The return of reckoning free shard is pretty good if you want to re experience
Wow as someone who still plays on the private server project to this day, super excited for this one!!
How is the private server doing? Been a long time since i played. 2019 i think
@@alexhomer25 they’ve made some decent changes overall since 2019 on balancing, and events and player incentives. But in the last year some big guilds have taken breaks and have demands on balancing, so the community is a little fractured at the moment. Still very lively on most EU nights, and NA has a decent growing player base and representation compared to 2019 with the guild Tegridy. What’s nice is your chars are always there to play so I encourage you to check it out again
@@alexhomer25 It's the same. play order and auto win.
@@alexhomer25Wargrimnir is still a cunt, and still very much at the helm of the ship. Not much else to be said really 💀
@@alexhomer25 its bleeding players and a boring zergfest where giant groups of players roam around in a zerg looking for something to fight - the bulk of the game is just running around in circles looking for fights. Almost all events reward you with items that decay over time so you can stay on that treadmill. It's a terrible gameplay loop.
Warhammer Online is one of my favourite MMOs. It had the best low-leveled PvP I have ever played.
The foundation on which PvP is built is SOOOO much better with healers using energy and having things they can cast while moving, and with tanks having an actual role. I feel like if WoW stole their ideas it would be considered revolutionary even today haha.
You do know there is a private server for Warhammer online
Me and my friend puts our lives and souls into this game. I still remember the sieges we fended off to protect our keep, how one of our dumbarse officers got a speed ticket because he wanted to catch the siege, how wonderful the overall vibe there was, and delightful the whole fantasy warhammer universe was. I still don't think any other game nailed the faction and group play like they did to this day.
It was such a heartbreak to see the mismanagement and closure of it.
Ashes of Creation will be the best!
I still remember being on the Karak Norn server the moment it shut down. I walked into the orchard after that and just looked into the distance for half an hour not thinking anything.
The grief hits very hard even to this day.
Karak Norn ❤
was also on Karak Norn for all 5 years of the games lifespan. squig herder named Dagskar. will never forget
I was also on Karak Norn.
As was I
Karak Norn as well and there at the closure, was a very sad day.
I was a GM for the german team - my time in Dublin with the boys, watching Charlie the unicorn during nightshifts, revealing our GM Avatars to drunk players or flying in GM Mode from public quest to public quest documenting what is happening in each PQ because nobody at our office knew what the fuck is going on - man these times were so great. I miss the boys.
Come to candy mountain Charlie! Shun the non believer, shun! Charliiiiiiie. Ah they took my freakin kidney!
This was an amazing game.
People didn't give it enough time to grow into its own.
I was a WoW addict at the time and I hated this game. Played for about 8 hours and never touched it again.
Devs leaving players to determine how rvr went was always going to be its death, same as daoc. When everyone went hib in DAoC, long term players like myself quit. I did not want to start over in hib as I already had a RR12 cleric. That was millions of player kills. Had the servers instanced or capped players in realm wars, it would have been sustainable but made it as cheesy and carebear as WoW pvp
Top many low pop servers on launch killed the game early, very few servers actually experienced the game as was intended with enough players to make the content run as intended.
@@Electromash92 Yeah, I couldn't do any of those public quests. There was nobody else helping.
@@Electromash92because it had nearly a million players on release and they did what every new MMO does, added more servers to appease the angry people who couldn't get on. Problem is that back then server technology was very primitive to what it is now and they couldn't just easily and dynamically merge servers into each other as things died down. So you were left with dozens of ghost towns a month later when everyone's free sub ran out and 60% of the population didn't resub for a second month.
Beyond that it was mostly screwed by developer incompetence and EA starting to cut staff just six months after release when it became clear the game wouldn't be the gold egg laying goose they had expected. People also expected the game to have the same level of content that Blizzard already offered with Wrath and that was never going to happen.
Great video. I had the pleasure of working on this game from 07 to 09. We where on top of the world at launch, and less than a year later over 100 of us got let go one cold morning. Incredible talent went into making this game, and I made lifelong friends at Mythic. Its a shame what happened to this project. Got me a bit misty and nostalgic watching this, thank you!
In 2010 or so, while working for EA/BioWare on the SWTOR project. We visited the Mythic offices to chat with one of the developers about using their launcher/patcher for SWTOR. There was room after unlit room of empty cubicles -- it was spooky as heck. I'll never forget that.
I really did like their patcher tech though, and for a brief time we were not only using their patcher for SWTOR, but I integrated their asset storage file structure into the game client as well. Good times.
Seriously older MMORPG like Retail WoW, SWTOR should start making controller support for console players can DL the game , it would only up the player base
that was a great read, thank you. can you share anything else you know about Mythic while there?
@@Dirtnoseswtor sucks
@@Dirtnose Yeah it's basically Kotor 3 with the amount of voice acting and story content. It's what Bioware was good at. Shame they had to chase the MMO dragon as EA overlords decreed.
@cattysplat Believe it or not, that was all BioWare, not EA. The Good Doctors entered into a partnership with LucasArts and put our tiny (for an MMO) office in Austin to producing the game. However, if EA had not bought us and thrown money at it, I kinda doubt it would have launched -- we just didn't have the resources, and some technology hail-marys we threw weren't working out. But EA got us from a hundred devs to over 400, and the game was finished.
CONTINUE THIS SHOW PLEASE I LOVED IT! And dudes, I played Return of Reckoning for the past 2 months and i absolutely love it. Try it out!
Down with the Order. Chaos reigns! Lol
You can still play it currently, as Warhammer Online Return of Reckoning.
Adding to the video the ways in which the game could still be played would be a great boon to the small communities still pushing these classic.
Wholeheartedly back that. Most MMO's have pretty good communities still around after their "failure" that keep the games going, sometimes with additional development meaning new content continues.
The endorsing of a specific City of Heroes (I believe) community with an actual official license and thus an approved way to play the game might be a sign of shifting tides towards "dead" games, though probably not.
@@Arenumberg Possibly, but out of all the CoH servers NCsoft picked the sketchiest one. That will come to bite all of us in the behind if NCsoft take a longer look at Homecoming's financials and the way they treat their "staff".
Nah, avoid this server like the plague, the glory days of 2020 and 2021 are long dead and the server has become extremely toxic with a community that rather cannibalize the game than help it improve.
@@GonarchPlaysHow so?
@@marcjansson1039 Simple, community keeps making the game rather unplayable with exploitation of broken mechanics/classes, dev team maintaining a long routine of questionable balance changes listening to a top 0.01% of their favorite pet players... I assume you don't play RoR from your comment, because the game has been on a steady decline on player numbers since 2023 which there's no end in sight.
If ya wanna know how much warhammer online change how you play games, it was the first MMO with public quests and an achievement system.
Could you imagine if shit turned out differently we could be playing world of warhammer
The private server is actually really well done and is fairly active. I play it every so often
@@kingbeeYTreturn of reckoning, or is there a wow pserv modded to resemble warhammer fantasy?
@gordo6908 return of reckoning
@@kingbeeYT When I started a character there all mobs in leveling starter zone stood still with no animation. Kinda ruined the immersion for me
@Amel-vp9he when was that? Some Mobs sit still but most people pvp all the way to 40. You can start at level 1
Funny thing is, back in the day Blizzard wanted to make Warhammer RTS, but Games Workshop did not agreed to give the IP. So Blizzard took what assets they already made for the game, and made the first Warcraft game, Orcs and Humans.
The private server is incredibly good and I would highly advise anyone watching this video to go play it, once you wrap your head around the game it's SO much fun
Name of the server?
@@fonfi97 Return of Reckoning.
the game can be "fun" at times BUT the devs are ass hats Xrealmers decide what happens at all times in game and pretty much no matter what you are just canon fodder once you hit 40 until you can get much better gear
No it's not. lol
Man I was working for an MMO news website when this came out, and after covering it for a first-look, I really fell in love with it. I wound up playing it (and covering it) for the game's entire run.
They did have problems with balancing and other game issues, but the two main reasons it failed was the lack of funding/support from Mythic, and then WoW's Wrath expansion came out and it never recovered from the hit in players that caused.
It was an excellent MMO, though. PvP was so good. I played a Magus, which was also one of the most neglected classes, lol. Just a great time, though.
I still cry about this in the heart of night, sometimes
hell, I'm 8 minutes in and the feelings are too much
time to reinstall return of reckoning
goddamn you, Madseason
@@snowblack90 Save yourself some time the game is boring. RoR is dead as fuck
@@McMTG sadge
I’m so happy I found this video. I’ve thought about this game every now and then the last 15 years. Now I know there’s servers out there I can check out, thanks 🙏🏼
Warhammer Online was ahead of it's time. I bet a Warhammer MMO now would pop off now... Or at least 40k is as big as it ever was
and see how games workshop mircomnanages i tto hell as develpers need run every decision by them if they agree or not and kets be honets eveyroen will paly some kind space marien or you arenallowed play as space marine not thta i would i would play as filthy xenos or heretic but yegh that kidna gme woul die in 5-6 motmnsh depending how stupid games workshop or they woud but pricing lie kthey od thei minsi whis woudl be astronomical soo no thnak you
@@no-nonseplayer6612 lol wtf
I say no because one look at other games shows how minor imbalances in PVP will instantly snowball in modern games
this game had huge potential for me. I can’t describe it but it had that feel good cozy feeling that wow gave me. I really enjoyed my time playing this, I remember it vividly ❤
I remember playing this on release for a few months and loved it. I liked the gritty aesthetic
I just started playing on the Return of Reckoning server, this video couldn't have come out at a better time !
I still go back to the Return of Reckoning private server every now and again. The PvP was a genuinely good time, and I can only wonder what could've been if the original game wasn't mismanaged into the dirt. Makes me wonder if this next attempt at a Warhammer MMO will be any better.
Next attempt?
@@sarmelionbloodweaver4789 A new Warhammer MMO was announced to be in the works sometime last year, IIRC.
Stll the best mmo imo. You faction actually felt like a team
I fell in love with this game back in the day man. Renown rank 100 Bright Wizard, who took down the Destruct Emperor, and got the Sovereign Robes. Damn, those were good times.
really liked it! can't wait for you to cover the conan MMO!
i'll always remember it as on of the best "early game" experiences i had in an mmo, and the moment you left the tutorial island and got to "main game" everything was an unfinished barren boring wastelands.
really interested what you could dig up on that one!
I have the huge collectors edition on my book case next to me to this day
I have mine on the floor next to the book shelf
It's been 16 years guys, that's a lot of dust.
I've never been a MMO player but back in the day, I got roped in by friends to play it with them. I have very fond memories of my adventures as a marauder with a mutated arm.
ESO was developed by a lot of the guys and gals from Mythic and the PvP zone Cryodiil shows.
It's incredible to see how far that sieging system has come and still holds up to this day.
Nice work on the video! Was nice to go down a trip on memory lane.
Return of reckoning is still going strong for those that are interested in checking it out, the server has plenty of custom live events and content for those interested!
Yea... Return of Reckoning is still running very strong playerbase aswell.
The Tome of Knowledge is still to this day one of my favourite Systems in a game, it had SO MUCH depth to it, just the fact that it had a Bestiary of everything you fought with some lore about it was great. Now no developers even bother with such a feature, such a waste.
I agree. Though, as a long time table top player, I will admit that I probably enjoy the lore more than most.
Oh, super cool video idea. Haven't even watched it yet, but I'm excited.
I played and enjoyed WAR at launch and for a few months. But like many people at the time, I was still in love with WoW and went back to that over time.
holy shit hearing the menu music almost made me tear up i loved this game so much man
Played this on launch. The race cinematics were SO GOOD
EVE Online. Thanks for bringing back memories of me playing WHO. I was there on the release. HAD so much fun! True hardcore PVP game.
Fun Fact, this game has a series of novels attached to it that are pretty comfy gritty Warhammer reads.
I played the private server few months back , only for the
Witch Hunter class , they remind me of a Rogue & Pally hybrid class
Seeing a Griffin Mcelroy article from way back was a trip. Downloading Return of Reckoning right now, though.
Loved this game. The oublic quests and pvp were awesome. Was young and my computer sucked eventually couldnt run it. Classes were so unique too even if they were mirrored. Shadow warrior and the goblin one were awesome. Would never even think of playing a goblin in any game but had to in this one to fight inside the squid
Fun Fact: Warcraft was originally going to be a Warhammer game and Starcraft was going to be a 40k game until Blizzard lost the license
Only Warcraft, and they never had the license, GW turned them down in the concept stage.
I played this game when it came out, I had a really fun time and thought it was really interesting, the PvP especially was a blast. I was quite young to be fair but honestly kind of sad it died so fast.
One of the most fun MMO’s I played back in the day. Still have fond memories of the PvP.
I am STILL mad about EA pushing this out the door WAY too soon. The game had amazing promise... now we have a watered down warhammer MMO in wow
Warhammer is still the only MMO that I've found to have genuinely fun pvp
I arguably had more fun in this mmo than I did Wow, its lore and setting just appealed to me more, it was a sad day indeed when it closed, but the return of reckoning fortunately took its mantle.
If someone had told me of this game back then, I think I would've really enjoyed it. Watching this makes me feel like I missed out on a gem.
The private server is very alive, I missed out on it back in the day too but it's still around :)
I really appreciate you bringing up DAoC and WH online. My wife and I played DAoC for 5 years and it was at its peak after the ToA xpac. We both had high RR toons (11.5 and 12.6.) and we were seriously excited for WH Online. It was such a let down. RvR made DAoC and it was a fluke that can never be repeated. There were a million players in DAoC over 20 or 30 servers. You would still get a lagfest in keep takes and today this would be much more stable but a company would have to cap the number of players in instanced rvr and that would be useless in an rvr game. It would mean you could not guarantee playing with your clan or zerg.
WoW was easy, had rubbish pvp and instanced dungeons. To this day wow is still more player friendly than DAoc or WH OL could be even with more stable servers. Mythic games required a massive amount of players in 1 area where WoW can instance dungeons for 5 10 20 and 40 players (at the time.) Very different games, very different players.
WoW was for anyone or any level of play (even the top play was questionably simple if you could learn a 5 move pattern with 3 button gameplay), DAoC and WH OL were for players that only cared to pvp/rvr all day. CoD on roids.
When we left to play WoW, it was evident what type of gamer would prevail in wow and in which area. Our guild migrated in full from DAoC/WH to WoW during TBC and at the time we had no idea it was big deal to clear BT. We didnt understand legendaries at the time but we did have raid son farm very quickly. It was annoying they had lock out so we only lasted in WoW until the end of WotLK. 3 years was a long time to play a mild game that thought it was hard.
Edit: I just noticed my yt tag is the name of my cleric from DAoC, Fuzzylumpkins. Lasting impact.
Yes it's honestly hilarious how people think wow is hard in any way at all 😂
@@vainkaiju wow was always the poor players "hardmode" but it sold very well for the every casual player to be a pretender
Loved playing my White Lion. Such fond memories of this game, playing with my younger brother. Enjoyed the lower level RvR, the skirmish maps and generally exploring the world. Great art design and feel.
Good times.
This game was so good, leveling through pvp was super fun. You would level through scenarios (battlegrounds) which would also drop gear for your team to roll on when enemy players were defeated. I remember being sad when the servers announced to be going down. The game never got a real expansion.
This was great man!
I started playing WoW Classic about 6 months ago, I’ve gotta 48 Dwarf Priest. First time ever playing WoW. My buddies been trying to get me into since launch when we were in HS and I finally dove in.
Love your content man. Seriously some of the best wow content out there. I hate when I have to watch someone else’s stuff to get info actually.
Speaking of that, I would suggest making guide videos for things like Pre BIS, how to play certain roles, how to do or prep for certain dungeons or Raids, just all the stuff you haven’t covered in WoW Classic or didn’t cover in great detail. If it ain’t mono tone I ain’t listening, ya herd? Just a suggestion, keep up the good work!
I’d watch more of this. My suggestion would be to try and give a little more detail on some of the balance issues/mechanics. Not a ton, but a little taste of the systems that were there
wildstar next.
Yeah, would love that.
Great video! So glad to see you branching out from WoW! Small suggestion but towards the start of the video I felt like your voice was being overpowered by one of the songs. Just a friendly suggestion.
I joined RoR in 2020 Right in the pandemic and oh Boy let me Tell you. It was the Most fun i‘ve ever had in a mmorpg. I sadly rolled with a Withhunter (good bye City Sieges) but the best Memory was a Battle of 600 vs 600 Players. Almost the whole Server in one Zone was insanity.
i still play warhammer online from time to time, it has some of the most unique systems that still havent been used anywhere else
the biggest problem with the population in the factions was that there were only two factions. having 3 factions in a free for all like dark age helped regulate this issue. i think WoW suffers greatly from not having three factions when it comes to PvP as well.
had they made a third faction for warhammer that consisted of ogres, skaven and beastmen, i think it would of been much better. i know these races are a somewhat unlikely alliance, but for the context of the MMO i think these are the best ones that can be grouped together. no way EA would let them spend more time developing though.
EA genuinely did more damage to warhammer than anything else. EA also did an excellent job running dark age into the ground. late 00's were when we really started to see the effects of corpos on our games
At least wow sorta balanced it out making pvp an optional mode later on that encourages player giving a bonus for exp and such. Definitely agree, I kinda wish there was a neutral/gray faction of sorts to balance out the main two. Planetside 2 does a decent job with the 3 way faction balance imho
@@midwestbox yeah i think warhammer online just came out at the wrong time and mythic had the worst company possible in EA buying them and breathing down their necks. mythic legit was not trying to be a wow killer they just wanted to bring the warhammer world to life and EA just wanted to cash in
beastmen should be chaos, and put orcs with ogres and skaven, and you got a deal
A third faction was being worked on for the game's first expansion. It would have been Skaven, Vampire Counts and I think Ogre Kingdoms. There wasn't much work done on it before everything started to fall apart but what little there was got reused later when they added the playable Skaven in RvR. More came to light in some leaks and in bits that would later be found in the game files by the people who worked on the private server emulator.
Yes this! I wish more devs would realise that a 3 faction system is basically adding autobalance, because if one faction gets too strong the other 2 will band together to take the third faction down. This is what happens in DAoC still to this day on private servers.
That transition tonthe boot dot dev advert was flawless! You sly dog you 🍻
Ah I loved this game
My little goblin heala was named Greenstik ;D
The roleplay between greenskins was so funny
Funny how I had a bit of nostalgia about this game a couple days ago that I watched some old and new reviews on this gem, then you upload one.
I had years of fun thanks to this game and made many friends. It will always hold a place in my heart.
Thank you for the blast from the past! I was there... 3000 years ago... playing a chaos marauder :D I remember to this day how I got stuck like 100 times just trying to walk past a root on the ground XD
This game will always have a special place in my heart.
You could make content about any game and its going to be enjoyable. Glad to see you make another video like this.
Cool video! I didn't even know there was a warhammer MMO! As always you put out great polished content Madseason thx!
Great video with a lot of things I had no idea even was in the game, and I played it back in the day lol.
I would love to see you cover Wildstar at some point!
Warhammer was literally decades ahead of its competition, I have no idea how it could get this bad. If it released nowadays it would be absolutely massive.
They should really look into doing another Warhammer MMO with all the knowledge for mmos we got now. I had fun with it for a bit when it released but never stuck with it cus mainly my friends played WOW but I did the private server for this game and had a blast they improved it a bunch over Mythic.
Playing this game in pservers years after release is such a joy. It's a great MMO, sadly it didn't have too much content outside of the mass scale PvP, there is some yes, but it's hardly enough to keep people engaged for a long time. I would've loved to see expansions and big content patches for it.
I HIGHLY recommend playing a character to max level, especially if you're even slightly into the Warhammer universe. I'm getting the itch to go play my Marauder right now, such a unique class.
But no witchhunter though xd you wont get taken in the City Sieges :(
Are there any pservers other than Return of Reckoning?
Oh, that intro music! Now I have to listen to Mechanicus' soundtrack again!
First song: Children of the Omnissiah. Absolute masterpiece. Great choice!
Awesome video as usual. One of my favourite mmos of all times. Sad when they closed it, but thankfully I discovered Return of Reckoning in 2014 and have been playing there ever since. The work done by the devs and community is insane and they make the very special soul of this somewhat unusual mmo persist. Thanks Monotone man for talking about this great game :)
there is another private server other then return of reckoning. Works well, its just lacking population, it feels closer to live imo. server is called Flames of War. It has its own issues and bugs but last i played they fixed them pretty fast
Thanks for this cool video. I've always wondered what WH Online was like, but never tried it for various reasosns. It was good to get this insight. Very entertaining and informative as usual. Keep up the good work!!
What do you mean fall? It's still running well. In my heart I mean not on servers. God I love this game
It's still up and running and has been for many years return of reckoning, and the original devs were there for the release of the new version and we get so many balance updates huge game updates they also stream now and again on twitch
You only bring us the best of content. I look forward to your future projects. MMORPGs or otherwise.
And rise again.
Return of reckoning is a beast.
Hey MadSeason, this was a game I have such nostalgia for. Like you said, the game's private server Return of Reckoning is such a great/strong community. You should do a video about the private server to bring more attention to it, especially since the type of game it is, relies on more and more players.
Awesome video, really interesting! I love this format and it's got some serious legs if you continue with it!
The mechanicus music at the beginning, chef's kiss
I remember the hype my friends and myself got for this game.
We get into the beta, we even buy the game on it's release day, which did offer 30 days trial w/out subscription fee.
Noone of use continue playing after those very first 30 days.
Not because the game was bad, but because it was a pain in the ass to play it: login queues, lag, continuous server dc'd ..
And that was when there was not a RvR event going on.
I actually play on this every few days. Still has plenty of people imo
Dog this is some incredible content, you amazing level of detail and story telling that usually comes from your wow content but now with other games, I am so for this. Incredible job as always and really excited to see what game comes next. Couple games I’d be curious to see you cover: ffxiv 1.0, toontown(weird one but curious to see your take on a video on it), meridian!!
my lil mads plushie finally arrived! looks as nice as in the picture and its so cute! such a nice way to support you and even get something in return!
Great video. I never played warhammer online, and therefore never knew what happened or why
I remember this being touted as a wow killer. A couple of guys at work were trying to get me to jump ship from wow and play.
One of my favorite mmos next to Asherons call, DAoC, and Eve online . I still have a sealed collectors edition of this game
Would love to see one of these about Rift. I’m sure I’m one of a few, but I loved that game.
great vid, do wildstar next
This is the first MMO that ever played a healer, because my buddies & I got tired of losing matches. Healinstein was so much fun! Then we tried some squigs, played some black orcs and had fun kickin' 'em in the jibblies! My absolute favorite times were playing Lava Golf with my ranged knockback as a magus. Good times, man. Good times.
Of course, those pesky bright mages would always show up and ruin the fun . . .
I wish more devs would realise that a 3 faction system is basically adding autobalance, because if one faction gets too strong the other 2 will band together to take the third faction down. This is what happens in DAoC still to this day on private servers.
Legend has it that the WAR collector's edition still lingers somewhere deep inside my closet to this very day...
Wildstar, Tera and SW:tor were three of my favourites. Would love to see videos on them
I distinctly remember at WAR's launch, ability animations did not correctly sync when the castbar was pushed back due to the player being hit. Animations would proceed and finish before the castbar. It was a major issue that completely tore me out of the game.
Solid video as always man, only improvement I'd say is the inclusion of more information about return of reckoning tbh.
This game deserved to be way more popular. I occasionally still check in on Return of Reckoning.