So in terms of torque sensors. Almost all of them use both a strain or stress input in conjunction with a cadence sensor (The Photon may be strain only). The difference with this one is there is a software option that the user can access to enable and disable the torque part to just leave the cadence part running. The menu system I believe will be changing as right now there is motor breaking stuff that people can have access to. Changing the number of pole pairs on the motor is not something end users need access to for example.
I agree , from a reseller pespective, that for the average user they do not need to get into all the available parameters. They should have a avg user and a power user menu system.
Your website's top navigation header is too tall. It takes up nearly a third of the display area on my laptop and that leaves too little space for viewing the page's content.
I bought one of these straight from the factory when my tsdz2 shorted itself at just 1100 miles. Got the 750W version and I love it. It feels way more powerful than I need, torque sensing is super smooth and throttle is responsive. Have done about 200 miles on it so far.
@@steroberry FYI I bought two DM01S and I'm very happy with them. I don't have a ton of miles on them yet but they are powerful and very quiet. I'm definitely pleased that I chose a torque sensing motor.
I'd sure love to see cooling fins, especially. Right now, it doesn't look like they're putting them out. I hope it retro fits if they do start making a finned shell. Motor is heavier gauged+. Once I get their software mess figured out; I may be able to boot up a windows computer. If software was just a factory loaded chip one merely inserts, it would sure be easier for me.
I'm looking to build an ebike for use on the farm. The stretch of driveway I will use bike on is quite steep with 15 - 26% grade (100m altitude over 500m distance) and very rough off road. I walk this portion of the driveway two or three times a day to get to the stables. It's been great for getting fit, but not so great when I don't have time to shower after working up a sweat. A quiet, powerful and smooth ebike combined with night-vision googles would be a game changer for stalking poachers and stock thieves. I have to say that I have been a bit disappointed with the internals of some motors. Loose motor windings, with some bent and kinked apparently no resin used to secure them. Not sure how long some of them will last when subjected to vibrations.
This is the one I may use on a tandem with a dual 52v battery setup. I've done 2 tongsheng conversions using the open source firmware and I do like the torque sensing of the tongsheng but after 3 motors burning out due to erroneous default settings, I'd have been better off just running them standard out of the box since the motors are great now that I've dialed back the voltage/amps/etc to limit them in spec with what they should be running without open source firmware. video on that journey: th-cam.com/video/vBeK3coLCdE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=7D09stB_oDWdVfnY It is my understanding that the TOSEVEN was brought about by former tongsheng engineers and that they took a lot of key learnings from the tsdz and built them into the TOSEVEN. It even sounds like some of the parts are compatible. Should be really good especially if they did actually add provisions for heat sinks, etc...
Really well explained. As with the Photon which fell on its face like many other CYC offerings with reliability issues, the proof is in the pudding. Will take a while to see if this motor has what it takes. As you explain, initial impression is positive, in particular for the torque sensor fanboys. Competition is good and may the best man win. Life isn't Marx, its Darwin. China so far has been winning the Ebike motor race. I own two BBSHD bikes. Thing about the BBSHD is...it can take more than 30 stock amps with aftermarket controller, reliability and price and power are the BBSHD's strong suit. That covers a lot of ground and hard to beat for performance per dollar. Other motors haven't proven to be as reliabie...or 'cheap to fix'. For that reason, I would never consider a CYC motor. Hopefully curious about this new ToSeven offering. Johhny knows his stuff. Btw, I just bought my first battery from Johhny because he's the real deal and even advertises what cells he uses in his batteries. I bought his 52V 25 amp-hour jumbo shark with Samsung 21700 50G cells. It took 58.8 volts first charge as it balanced at max charge for a 52v battery right off the bat. I undercharge it now because don't need the capacity to maximize cell cycle life. Love it and perfect match with BBSHD. As Johhny says, powerful motor + strong battery wins the day.
Well there is certainly no evidence of a freaking god, and still plenty are killing each other in their names. My gods bettee than your god...number one killer of all time!. At least no one's starting wars over freaking Darwin!🤬
Good video!!! interesting motor. Kind of want it but will wait till you have tested. I like the Low step frame in this video. Looks like the pretty common one that cannondale specelized and univega are all using. Where did you get it and do you think it would accept frontend suspension. also if you have an idea for a full suspension low step frame. . . I like the one from reise and muller that has built in rack but that's not exactly in the budget would be great if there were a work around. Please and Thank you.
I'm very excited by this new motor, bafang needs a dose of reality with moving away from making easy conversion motors, this new motor has what I wanted the bbshd to have, torque sensor!! hopefully this motor will have options to help with chain alignments for higher ratio/speed cassettes, ofc pricing will be the biggest factor for me.
I wish my bafang showed the temperature like it showed before i bought it and has the options for it on my display but yet always just shows 0 on everything along with a option to show outside temperature would he awwsome to have too
I see that they offer a 38T chainring for it. I wonder what the offset is compared to say a 42T on the BBSHD. If it has a good chainline with the 38T it will be a winner for serious trail use.
I have installed it on my Boardman 10 speed full suspension bike and cannot access my top 3 gears - the chain just slips back down. I see they do a chainring that is offset to 9mm, the teeth on it dont come up far, really could do with a Leckie or some sort.
As of now suggested MSRP DM-01 $850USD Dm-o2, $500USD.+ But that will probably change later once they really get shipping them earnestly to dealers in 2024.
i'm using the dm 01 since the beginning of july this year, got 2800km on it so far, lots of trailer pulling (heaviest trailer load so far 250kg). the motor has held up well, except for a weird noise that sometimes appears at extended use of high assist (20+ amps). sounds a bit like a turkey, possibly some sprag clutch slippage. no idea. never had this on a bafang. i will open it up again when I find some time to inspect it. what's really missing at the moment is a 42t chainring, 46t is way too big imo for any situation that requires control over the power delivery
the noise has not appeared for quite a while now. maybe it was related to the crazy moisture we had, though the motor has proven to be very waterproof...
Ibhave used that display on a stock TSDZ2 from Eunorau. Lots of programming capability without a separate cable or computer. Have not been reliable, unfortunately.
I had a Befang 1,000 w and had to take off the brake and gear sensors because every time I went over a bump it thought I was shifting or braking and the motor would turn off briefly. I also didn't like the delay between stopping peddling and and motor shutting off. Maybe all those issues were the controller. I don't know for sure.
Since it affected both your brakes and the shift sensor, sounds like a controller glitch. I've never had a bump trigger either my brake or shift sensors.
That sounds like a connection issue either inside the controller or the battery to motor connection, I had a similar issue, check if you are using Anderson power pole connectors, if so, dump them and upgrade to xt90, inside the motor there is a multi pin connector that is notorious for coming lose so i would also open it up and give them a once over to make sure they are solid, your brake cut off and gear sensor should never cause those issues, i've been running mine for 5years now and zero issues with them and only power loss and cut outs due to my mention problems.
I got my MagicShine MJ-902s for direct ebike connect hooked up.. it is bright...! It connects +/- to the red and black light wires off the Bafang controller.. I can now turn off my light using my thumb near display.. :) it almost has too many modes.. And i can unplug from the motor, and connect it to a battery instead.. So Bright..! Let me know if you want to see it in action..
@Alex-uh1mj so that means us users could potentially be paying twice the amount that dealers pay for? Not good for us Diy'ers, better if the company has a online shop we end users can buy directly from like that of cyc
@@Alex-uh1mj that means we're potentially paying more than the 700 California ebikes already charges for them. Yeah I think imma say bafang might keep their crown, considering they can be had with a 1 year warranty for 550, along with parts being readily and cheaply available.
So in terms of torque sensors. Almost all of them use both a strain or stress input in conjunction with a cadence sensor (The Photon may be strain only). The difference with this one is there is a software option that the user can access to enable and disable the torque part to just leave the cadence part running. The menu system I believe will be changing as right now there is motor breaking stuff that people can have access to. Changing the number of pole pairs on the motor is not something end users need access to for example.
JohnnyNerdOut needs to get his hands on one of your kits once the tuning is all good and they go on sale!
Could be fun, should get the 72 volts ready to try early next week@@Bengy22 be interesting to see what he thinks.
I agree , from a reseller pespective, that for the average user they do not need to get into all the available parameters. They should have a avg user and a power user menu system.
Your website's top navigation header is too tall. It takes up nearly a third of the display area on my laptop and that leaves too little space for viewing the page's content.
Thanks for the sneak peek Johnny! Very interesting 😮
the stock controller can handle 60V @35 Amps.. so 2500W. Not bad, not bad. I'll wait for the final version with heat sink and build a new bike with it
I bought one of these straight from the factory when my tsdz2 shorted itself at just 1100 miles. Got the 750W version and I love it. It feels way more powerful than I need, torque sensing is super smooth and throttle is responsive. Have done about 200 miles on it so far.
How much did it cost?
@@johndempsey99 just under $600 including shipping when I emailed and ordered directly from factory in China.
Does it have 750w stamped on it?
Hey, how is it handling? I was gonna buy the tongsheng but I heard it's a little underpowered
@@steroberry FYI I bought two DM01S and I'm very happy with them. I don't have a ton of miles on them yet but they are powerful and very quiet. I'm definitely pleased that I chose a torque sensing motor.
I'd sure love to see cooling fins, especially. Right now, it doesn't look like they're putting them out. I hope it retro fits if they do start making a finned shell. Motor is heavier gauged+. Once I get their software mess figured out; I may be able to boot up a windows computer. If software was just a factory loaded chip one merely inserts, it would sure be easier for me.
I'm looking to build an ebike for use on the farm. The stretch of driveway I will use bike on is quite steep with 15 - 26% grade (100m altitude over 500m distance) and very rough off road. I walk this portion of the driveway two or three times a day to get to the stables. It's been great for getting fit, but not so great when I don't have time to shower after working up a sweat. A quiet, powerful and smooth ebike combined with night-vision googles would be a game changer for stalking poachers and stock thieves.
I have to say that I have been a bit disappointed with the internals of some motors. Loose motor windings, with some bent and kinked apparently no resin used to secure them. Not sure how long some of them will last when subjected to vibrations.
Thanks Johnny. Interesting stuff for sure.
Tickle me very interested. 😀 I like the cadence/torque switching. I am converting my fat tire this winter and this may be the motor for it.
Mighty interesting motor.
This is the one I may use on a tandem with a dual 52v battery setup.
I've done 2 tongsheng conversions using the open source firmware and I do like the torque sensing of the tongsheng but after 3 motors burning out due to erroneous default settings, I'd have been better off just running them standard out of the box since the motors are great now that I've dialed back the voltage/amps/etc to limit them in spec with what they should be running without open source firmware. video on that journey: th-cam.com/video/vBeK3coLCdE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=7D09stB_oDWdVfnY
It is my understanding that the TOSEVEN was brought about by former tongsheng engineers and that they took a lot of key learnings from the tsdz and built them into the TOSEVEN. It even sounds like some of the parts are compatible. Should be really good especially if they did actually add provisions for heat sinks, etc...
I run 2 mini max 52v 10ah on my cyc x1 pro. It's a nice option to have one or 2 batteries depending on what I'm doing.
Interesting to see it compared to bafang torque sensing. Anymore news on bafang torque sensing motor delivery?
Really well explained. As with the Photon which fell on its face like many other CYC offerings with reliability issues, the proof is in the pudding. Will take a while to see if this motor has what it takes. As you explain, initial impression is positive, in particular for the torque sensor fanboys.
Competition is good and may the best man win. Life isn't Marx, its Darwin. China so far has been winning the Ebike motor race. I own two BBSHD bikes. Thing about the BBSHD is...it can take more than 30 stock amps with aftermarket controller, reliability and price and power are the BBSHD's strong suit. That covers a lot of ground and hard to beat for performance per dollar. Other motors haven't proven to be as reliabie...or 'cheap to fix'. For that reason, I would never consider a CYC motor.
Hopefully curious about this new ToSeven offering. Johhny knows his stuff.
Btw, I just bought my first battery from Johhny because he's the real deal and even advertises what cells he uses in his batteries. I bought his 52V 25 amp-hour jumbo shark with Samsung 21700 50G cells. It took 58.8 volts first charge as it balanced at max charge for a 52v battery right off the bat. I undercharge it now because don't need the capacity to maximize cell cycle life. Love it and perfect match with BBSHD. As Johhny says, powerful motor + strong battery wins the day.
There is no physical evidence for Darwinism. Only drawn lines and opinions.
Well there is certainly no evidence of a freaking god, and still plenty are killing each other in their names. My gods bettee than your god...number one killer of all time!. At least no one's starting wars over freaking Darwin!🤬
Good video!!! interesting motor. Kind of want it but will wait till you have tested. I like the Low step frame in this video. Looks like the pretty common one that cannondale specelized and univega are all using. Where did you get it and do you think it would accept frontend suspension. also if you have an idea for a full suspension low step frame. . . I like the one from reise and muller that has built in rack but that's not exactly in the budget would be great if there were a work around. Please and Thank you.
The major test will be if this can keep up with bafangs reliably.
I'm very excited by this new motor, bafang needs a dose of reality with moving away from making easy conversion motors, this new motor has what I wanted the bbshd to have, torque sensor!! hopefully this motor will have options to help with chain alignments for higher ratio/speed cassettes, ofc pricing will be the biggest factor for me.
I wish my bafang showed the temperature like it showed before i bought it and has the options for it on my display but yet always just shows 0 on everything along with a option to show outside temperature would he awwsome to have too
I see that they offer a 38T chainring for it. I wonder what the offset is compared to say a 42T on the BBSHD. If it has a good chainline with the 38T it will be a winner for serious trail use.
I have installed it on my Boardman 10 speed full suspension bike and cannot access my top 3 gears - the chain just slips back down. I see they do a chainring that is offset to 9mm, the teeth on it dont come up far, really could do with a Leckie or some sort.
1,2,3,4??? I have the same combination on my luggage!
Looks real interesting. What are the expected prices of the 750 and 1000 watt units? thanks
As of now suggested MSRP DM-01 $850USD Dm-o2, $500USD.+ But that will probably change later once they really get shipping them earnestly to dealers in 2024.
i'm using the dm 01 since the beginning of july this year, got 2800km on it so far, lots of trailer pulling (heaviest trailer load so far 250kg).
the motor has held up well, except for a weird noise that sometimes appears at extended use of high assist (20+ amps). sounds a bit like a turkey, possibly some sprag clutch slippage. no idea. never had this on a bafang.
i will open it up again when I find some time to inspect it.
what's really missing at the moment is a 42t chainring, 46t is way too big imo for any situation that requires control over the power delivery
the noise has not appeared for quite a while now. maybe it was related to the crazy moisture we had, though the motor has proven to be very waterproof...
We will have a 42T soon
This motor support 60v battery indeed!
67v fully charged
Ibhave used that display on a stock TSDZ2 from Eunorau. Lots of programming capability without a separate cable or computer. Have not been reliable, unfortunately.
Any new updates on the bbshd,I heard u mention something ,if u can say.
I had a Befang 1,000 w and had to take off the brake and gear sensors because every time I went over a bump it thought I was shifting or braking and the motor would turn off briefly. I also didn't like the delay between stopping peddling and and motor shutting off. Maybe all those issues were the controller. I don't know for sure.
Since it affected both your brakes and the shift sensor, sounds like a controller glitch. I've never had a bump trigger either my brake or shift sensors.
That sounds like a connection issue either inside the controller or the battery to motor connection, I had a similar issue, check if you are using Anderson power pole connectors, if so, dump them and upgrade to xt90, inside the motor there is a multi pin connector that is notorious for coming lose so i would also open it up and give them a once over to make sure they are solid, your brake cut off and gear sensor should never cause those issues, i've been running mine for 5years now and zero issues with them and only power loss and cut outs due to my mention problems.
@@bjnslc same here, in most cases its a connection issue, lose wire, bad battery connections from cheap Anderson poles
umm wow im sold
It looks like a bafang.... I'm still liking cyc stuff. X1 pro is bad ass.
Do any of the dual hub bikes measure up to the mid drives?
Not really. I guess it depends on what metrics are important to you though 🤷♂️
Do your specs mean that the 750W motor can't be used with a fat-tire bike?
Yes both have fat bike versions, but the price is so close that you may just get the 1000w at once
When can we get display options? Will you be getting the T154?
I’m getting every available display option in this next batch 😊I believe the t154 is on it
@@JohnnyNerdOutyou rock!
I got my MagicShine MJ-902s for direct ebike connect hooked up.. it is bright...! It connects +/- to the red and black light wires off the Bafang controller.. I can now turn off my light using my thumb near display.. :) it almost has too many modes.. And i can unplug from the motor, and connect it to a battery instead.. So Bright..! Let me know if you want to see it in action..
Just wait till it hits aliexpress, then it might be great competition...
Toseven plan to sell their motors through dealers to properly support their products, offer service and warranty
@Alex-uh1mj so that means us users could potentially be paying twice the amount that dealers pay for? Not good for us Diy'ers, better if the company has a online shop we end users can buy directly from like that of cyc
@@Alex-uh1mj that means we're potentially paying more than the 700 California ebikes already charges for them. Yeah I think imma say bafang might keep their crown, considering they can be had with a 1 year warranty for 550, along with parts being readily and cheaply available.
@@robw5735 a photon is 950 direct how much do you think a dealer is paying
@@rydoggo where is that warranty? Photon already captured half of the market from bafang, so it seems price is not everything