The whole story totally debunkes the committee meetings, repentance, probation , disfellowshiping and shunning. Another GREAT video. Thank you for your work!!
Mental quick sand...that's a great one ! When I left in 1985, they were telling that I no longer wanted to be a jw. I think that it was great. In my head at the time...I was 17, they didn't kick me out because I didn't do anything wrong// I kicked them out talking about the cult , not the people. I didn't have friends, but 1, I liked the lady who had the Bible study to get me baptized. I was surprised how she hugged me at my Mom's funeral at a kingdom hall ... she presented me her son that I was the only one who was allowed to babysitting him (me and her mom) he was taller than 6 feet high and I babysat him when he was a tiny baby ...
Really enjoyed today's pod cast. I remember a disfellowshipped couple when I was a pioneer who sat at the back of the hall in our C school. It was there room for people like this. And it was well over a year before they came back. And the rumour mill started yo when they were reinstated. Things that they were too worldly to ever be allowed back etc.... This poor couple who I was friends with and I have to be honest I never shunned them in private but did at the halls..... Ended up leaving completely after a few years as they were never really excepted back. They were never invited to stuff etc. So in the end they left completely and they are so much happier now. I am still friends with them. Infact I left a year after they left a 2nd time.
OH yes Sharon, many, many stories just like yours! I call it the 'silent shun' where after reinstatement, someone continues to be looked down upon in the congregation. It's VERY common and comes right from the top! I'm so glad you friends got out!
Also, if that son would be in the monkey court(aka committee) they would ask him WHEN did you repent, was it BEFORE or AFTER you were poor and hungry, because if it’s after, which was the case, they would say he is only sorry, because he suffers the consequences of his actions, and it’s “worldly sadness”, therefore he will get disfellowshiped, because it’s not TRUE repentance!
My judicial committee told me at our very first meeting that they needed to see "fruits of repentance" from me before they would even consider forgiving me. To this I demanded to know what "fruits of repentance" did the Prodigal Son show? I followed that with accusing them of knowing better than Christ and claiming to know better than he did. The angry silence I heard after saying these things was deafening.
I can't love this story enough!! LOL....three guys who showed up unprepared for a person who was actually thinking and well read. They were likely furious with you LOL
Attendance a judicial committee itself is humbling. do you think the prodigal Son should have had a judicial committee meeting with three elders? These days his father would have been shunned for not shunning his son lol. The elder's must know better than lJesus 😂
Exactly this! My mother was disfellowshipped for smoking ONE cigarette when my sister and I were kids. They would walk up and talk to us kids and just ignore her existence. I will never forgive an organization that teaches this, period.
Hearing you tell this story nearly brought me to tears with the part about the father running to his son and embracing him. It’s exactly what I would do as a parent whose child has returned. It’s so sick that the organization of JW does the opposite. More guilt and shame, guilt and shame, and it goes on and on……
Wow - I loved this & could relate so much! I've actually thought about that a lot over the years. If JW's supposedly follow the Bible, why do they make people jump through so many hoops to come back, when the prodigal son was welcomed back with open arms? That never sat right with me either. I was also giggling / crying inside listening to you talk about how the elders want to know the most intimate, disgusting details of what might have happened behind closed doors. I was a young woman in her 20's, and these middle aged / senior citizen crusty elders were asking me the most embarrassing, intrusive, disgusting questions to me & I felt so violated. I thought how does knowing all those details help you to "read hearts"? That committee experience completely grossed me out & made me feel super icky. Also, I had no idea that they kept files on people until in that committee they had brought up a sin, I had committed a few years prior & did the time for already (reproved). They said "our files show that you got drunk 3 years ago" - WTF? I asked my dad, who was an elder - why do they keep files on people if you've done the time & technically should have been forgiven? My Dad told me that they needed to keep files on people to see if there's a pattern in their behavior. I was like WTF - what about forgiving somebody 77 times? I guess that doesn't exist in the Borg.
It's truly insane what they make people do! Oh yes, the infamous files. I'm planning on covering the whole 'pervy' elder convos....they're something else and it's systemic throughout the system. The files exist, I can assure you!!
Your question is: "If JW's supposedly follow the Bible, why do they make people jump through so many hoops to come back, when the prodigal son was welcomed back with open arms?" The prodigal son was repentant and was cut to the heart for what he had done. The person who is disfellowshipped today is not repentant and refuses to accept counsel. Back in the 70s the brothers were especially hard on ones who made a mistake and out the door they went, and it took forever for them to be reinstated. That was not loving and today anyone being disfellowshipped is asking for it. Read about the Samaritan who took care of a Levite who was left for dead in the street. The Samaritans and the Levites were bitter enemies.
Been out since the early 1990s. I don’t even remember the date that I wrote my disassociation letter, but I do remember the huge weight lifted off my brain. I have since converted to my ancestral Jewish faith, but no longer believe in ghosts or gods. I definitely don’t believe in a devil. However, I hope that more people wake up the unscientific beliefs of the Tower! Thank you for your ongoing service!
Spot on as usual Stacey! 👌 Superb! For me a disfellowshiped brother a year ago, of 50 years, seen a lot, asked for mercy and received none! My disfellowshipped wife is convinced she has to be present in a Kingdom Hall convinced she has to touch the plate of bread, and the glass of red wine, and reject it, In order not to offend Jehovah, as outlined by the GB. For me I do not fall for that ritual that has no scriptutal basis at all, just something an arrogant self righteous imperfect human thought up to control the sheep! And of course if you observe at home how exactly will you contribute your hard earned money to pay for all the CSA Case Law Suites filed against the great 9? Or how will they continue to buy and build major movie studios to brainwash your child's 🧠? 🤔 So tomorrow I will make my unleavened bread as I usually have for many years, sit and look at the small bottle of red wine, listen to the Memorial talk I recorded on TH-cam, say my prayer asking again for mercy, letting Jehovah know I am not anointed, and I appreciate what has been done for imperfect me, knowing full well no mercy will be shown. And finish the night. Poor the wine into a glass mixed with Brandy, get my jar of Salsa out, melt some 🧀 over the unleavened bread, and 😉 enjoy as I dip my now homade crackers into the salsa, washing it down with red wine mixed with Brandy, thanking Jehovah I am not part of that cult-ure of shunning others ever again. By the way, how can they be sure it was red red 🍷 and not white 🥂? Or did they not have white grapes back then? Jesus only turned barrels of water into red wine? 😳 Did Jesus whisper into their ears telling them to only use red wine? Maybe it was fruity Pink wine? 🤔 I will then converse with my cats as they beg for a bite if cheese and thank Jehovah for friends that will not shun me because the evil 9 tells them to!
LOL LOL, I loved this so much that I read it twice!! I love how you 'celebrate' memorial.....and you're right, completely fabricated stuff! I'm more interested in your salsa and Brandy!! :)
@@survivingparadisepodcast In Africa where I live now, my retiremrnt money buys me expensive spirits Like 12 and 18 year old Scotch, but for this celebration since my Moms side is from the Richerts of Germany being twin Sisters one who is my great grandmother, immigrated to the US in 1914 I chose a bottle of German Brandy named Ausbach! For this special event. Which I will mix with a nice French Merlot that is left over from the Memorial. (Asbach Uralt is a German brandy produced by the company Asbach GmbH, a subsidiary of Underberg AG, which also makes other spirits and chocolate) so in 2005 and 2006 I was in Southern Germany licking my wounds from turning a drunkard Elder in for misconduct in the Congregation. Of course I was tried by no less than 7 Elders in a judicial setting where they used my wife of 25 years to convict me of apostasy and disfellowship me but after the CO of the Congregation was caught lying and fabricating evidence against me it just became a matter of mistaken principles according to the other Elder's in the room in order to protect their precious CO, 6 liar Elders in one room was a sight to behold. The 7th being a heavy drunkard. Then the Curcuit Overseer a one Brother Kuss disappeared from sight. Later I learned Kuss was in rehab from being an Alcoholic at Bethel in New York for a year! But I ran into him later in Washington State as he was unaware I was there, and called a meeting of all Brother's in the Congregation because the Elder arrangement was not bringing any new Brother's forward to be Elders or Servants in that hypocritical Congregation. Of course the look on his face when I greeted him saying you may fool them, but I am not fooled by you. I know who you really are Kuss! IT WAS PAYBACK A little bit. Of course he avoided me the rest of the week, the following year Kuss passed from alcohol related cancer which happens to heavy drinkers. RIP Kuss! I have a history in Jehovah's so called Organisation.
@@universeworld1782 What a horrific story. There are so many alcoholics among JW's. I knew many elders that had massive problems with alcohol. What a tragedy
Oh boy, do I remember. When someone leaves the org, their character is immediately dragged through the mud. He/she will will end up a drug user, a drunkard or a fornicator. When in all honesty, said person just wants their life back. Free of watchtower chains. In the eyes of the Org, an unpardonable sin.
@Surviving Paradise It was during an elders meeting to "encourage" me. I brought this topic up. It wasn't anything to speak of. But I have about 4 hours of elders meetings recorded. I plan on posting them on TH-cam eventually with my rebuttal of what i wish i would have said. Just gotta get time to be able to set my channel up.
We would like to thank brother Stacy for giving us that outstanding talk. We have a couple of announcements. Don’t forget to turn your time in. 2nd don’t forget the memorial is this week, make sure you read the assigned scriptures. This is how watchtow$r’s minions always slapped us back to reality after such great talks
The son didn't have to sit in the back of the kingdom hall for a year or more. He didn't have to meet with the elder alone behind closed doors, he was recieved by his father right away. Away from the judgment of others who have nothing to tell you who you can talk to...etc...
Thank you Stacy for another great break down. I fine tooth combed this subject 20 years ago when our firstborn was about to hit his teens. I showed my wife and said if our son ever leaves and wants to come back, I'm following Jesus's advice and not the GB. She agreed with me. Thanks again!
i was taught this parable was about one returning back to the organization and elders providing the person the spiritual loving help they needed aka disfellowshipping
Great job 👏 I wish the JWs would really read this parable the way you explained it. I’ve had arguments with elders about this and they can’t accept it because the ORG told them something else 🤦🏻♂️
OH yes, so have I, many late night discussions about this...and frankly, the Apostle Peter's 'life'...subject for another day......basic story they don't comprehend
I must have been no, no, notorious, notorious. I tried going back three times. And was disappointed. It was one df. The last congregation had me wait 18 more months. The congregation was too interested in playing golf than meeting with me. I asked to meet with them after the Sunday meeting but they couldn’t meet with me. I was so discouraged that I. Bought a pack of cigarettes and smoked them in my back yard just when the PO and his wife walked by my backyard. They stared at me. I never went back. Thank God! Maybe because I was an ex wife of an elder/ pioneer?…
Stacey, again thank you for your clear and transparent look into their shunning policy. My jw daughter & son-in-law are unable to survive financially and will be moving back home, with me being disfellowshipped for 30 years. She's told me the won't be shunning me. That was a condition I set. Their congregation would not help them. So I get to welcome her back, a reverse of the prodigal son parable. This oughta be fun😅
WOW!!!! That is an amazing, loving story!!! So many younger people are struggling financially today, that is SO loving on your part Danette and I love that YOU set boundaries. Incredible, isn't it??? Their congregation won't help them......it's so insane!
I came forward with sexual sins, none of which happened with a sister, and were not known among the community I live in. I was df'd from 12/18-12/21. 3 long years, and I have family who are witnesses. Once reinstated, many didn't talk to me. When the public ministry started up last year, not one person offered to work with me. I did not receive a shepherding call, or even a phone call from being reinstated until I left the organization in February of this year, over a year. Listening to this incredibly well done podcast made me want to cry and to be honest, put a beating on at least 2 of the men on my committees (I switched congs due to moving after my df'ing so there were 6 men total). The things that were said to me in those judicial meetings were humiliating and degrading and the things they made me tell them in great detail were humiliating and degrading. For any current witnesses reading this and contemplating coming forward and confessing to the elders I highly recommend, DO NOT DO IT. You have no power in a judicial meeting. They have all of it, and all you can do is try to guess what they want you to say and how they want you to act in order to not be expelled. It's sickening and should be illegal. This channel has an episode about never confessing sins to elders, it should be standard viewing for all witnesses.
Thank you simplified....and I'm very sorry for what you've been through!! Your experience is VERY common, it's the norm in Jehovah's Witnesses. Precious people fall through the cracks daily, shepherding or just plain kindness are missing for millions....for those disciplined, most wear a letter of shame the rest of their lives as JW's. Reinstatement is ZERO guarantee of being treated with love. THANK YOU for mentioning the past episode on NEVER confessing to elders.....I can't emphasize that enough...NEVER go to an elder with anything!
Excellent breakdown of this parable by providing clear context. I used to hate hearing the Prodigal Son Parable reimagined by JWs. Still remember “The Prodigal Son” made for TV The GB provided a couple yrs ago, & I was like, I’m not sure this is the point of the story. One other thing, since I left a lot later than u my friend; based upon The GB reconsidering the parable of The Prodigal Son, they sent directions to the congregations that they are “allowed” to provide “spontaneous” reaction when one is announced as being reinstated. However, to ur point, even when one is reinstated, they are still treated different. Many have to re-start a Bible Study to re-establish their “love” for Jehovah. They are on a probation period where they can’t give comments, talks, carry mics, conduct bible studies, enter full time ministry, etc. They have to “earn” these privileges. Then again, there’s always a side eye on such individuals as they are deemed & classified as spiritually weak, so before “fully associating” w/ a reinstated one, they need to be observed for a period of time, & unfortunately, some always have those jackets placed upon them. This is b/c of the culture that’s been established at the top. Like u always say, 90% of JWs are unfamiliar w/ the Bible & especially their literature.
All fantastic points By George! I have been out since 2009, so there may be updates, thanks for sharing here! I love that you called out many then need another Bible Study, I had two people even question whether they should get rebaptized!
@@survivingparadisepodcast When I was an Elder I had one young man, who was born in to the religion, ask me after getting reinstated (since I was Chairman over his committee & COBE) was it necessary for him to go over The God’s Love book, again? He flat out said he wasn’t going to learn anything new, & he just made a mistake w/ young lady (who actually wound up being his wife). Being a “company man” I just encouraged him to follow along w/ instructions given to help his spirituality (lol), but I asked what areas did he think he could improve in. Once that was established, I told the person assigned to just go over those two chapters, ONLY, & we’ll check back. The person assigned to study w/ him was a M.S, & he took it upon himself to treat the young brother like a Bible Student. The young man left shortly thereafter, & explained to me how discouraging it was to be treated like he’s some babe in The Truth. I completely empathized w/ him, & made sure he had a nice, warm letter of introduction to his new hall. Come to think of it, Letters of Introduction r pretty lame, too. The fact a person is not allowed to see or know what 3 guys say about them is weird. Smh. Sorry; tangent. Lol.
@@bygeorgehemayberite8385 you jogged my own memory with this story! Many similar stories from my own time as an elder. As if wanting to have sex somehow meant you forgot everything you ever learned. The absurdity! Thanks for sharing this!
Bonjour je regarde régulièrement toutes les vidéos ,que je trouve très bien ! mais la dernière (comment le collège centrale rejette le fils prodigue , alors ça je l'attendais depuis longtemps ! Alors je parle pas anglais donc je pense que peut-être d'autres en anglais en en parler parce que je visite bien d'autres sites... Juste pour te dire que tu en parles extrêmement bien et je t'encourage à continué à continuer ce beau travail 💙❤️💗 merci beaucoup.
Thank you Stacey for a informative video once again. I here you it is so hypocritical what you are saying is so true. My cousin has a daughter that was raised in the truth but does not want anything to do with the organization she never got baptized but yet her mother hangs out with her while in the mean treat me like I was diseased because I got wet.. Pretty pathetic do not worry as I say that they are not loving there enemies.. thank you
GROSS hypocrisy for a JW to still associate with children that have openly rejected the religion and Jehovah himself by dodging the baptism pool. Good for the kids, they figured it out, but the baptized parents are acting shamefully by 'spiritual' standards.
Tw/cw: sewer slide Absolutely. As they’ve said before in the Watchtower magazine, they can’t literally kill apostates, but they sure can try to make them wish they were dead, or even self-end(I added in this last part but we all know Watchtower just uses s•ic•de in people who leave as an “example”).
The fact that in the "modern day Prodigal Son" film they produced a few years back the son faces a Judicial committee at the end and, let's face it, probably gets disfellowshipped (I'm giving that a 95% likelihood) shows how off the mark they are with the stories lesson. Unless of course that part was ommited from the Bible. "After the feast the son was sent to talk to the elders of the land. After brief deliberation they decided that it was not good for the son to be in their presence and cast him back into the world, informing all he was no longer part of their community and should be treated as dead until he returned to Jehovah. And the father of the son shunned him because he was a man of faith." Wait...that's not in there? Hmm...
Wow, I don't think I've seen this film! Or I've forgotten.....I'll have to go searching for that one...but YES, basic story distorted so badly....they're defiant
@@survivingparadisepodcast It's called The Prodgical Returns. I believe it was the first cinematic drama made for the convention after they did away with the live action ones
Thank you for this. As a JW I absolutely HATED the story of the Prodigal Son. I thought it was SO unfair for the older brother, who had toiled away the years, while the younger son had been out partying. I was 100% #TeamOlderBrother. 😅 Not in small part due to the fact that whenever I'd be confronted with the story, in a KH, I felt like I WAS the older brother; being a good little JW, toiling away, drudging to the meetings, doing everything right, even though I HATED all of it, even though I WANTED to be elsewhere, doing such despicable things as enjoying a hot cocoa at home, on a Sunday morning. But no, I was at the KH. You said the JW's act like the older brother towards any coming back into the congregation and that is certainly true. It almost feels as if there is some deeper current of comparison---something I can't quite put my finger on---with that and with me VERY MUCH identifying with the older brother. I mean... they don't treat the story as being about forgiveness in general, they treat it about being about people leaving, sinning, and then returning to the congregation, specifically. With that emphasis, doesn't that MAKE all of us who obediently sat at the Kingdom Hall listening, the older brother?? So since the viewpoint is skewed, since we're thinking about how many hot cocoas (I was quite young when I first felt bitter about all the debauchery the younger brother got to do 😂) the prodigal sons get to have, while I have to sit at the KH, the entire teaching, the point of the story, goes right out the window. (Or through the wall maybe, due to the lack of windows.) Very much speculation, of course, but with decades of this... no WONDER these rules start popping up about how to treat those returning. No wonder there will be NO PARTY, no clapping. We were all the older brother, feeling bitter about the cocoas we missed.
You weren't alone!! We were all the older brother and we were conditioned to be that way! They have ZERO understanding of the story.....or....they have full understanding and they choose to be defiant in applying its spirit. This story fully proves to me that they KNOW what they're doing....
It is very interesting that you provided this topic on the week of memorial. Props and high fives! Food at the proper time. LOL. Jesus was all about love, and this religion is nasty. Like you said, so bizarre. After decades of being involved in this organization the lack of love and the story of the prodigal son is what woke me up. This organization is the total opposite of loving. I love your term of mental quicksand, it cracks me up. Grace and mercy is an over looked detail with this religion. I look forward to your podcasts as they are my weekly therapy. Love and mercy . Hugs and thank you.
Thank you Snookered!! ;) Seemed like a great week for this little story. Yes, it was always a conflict within me, especially after studying the Greatest Man book, remember that one? You get to the end of the book and it's clear this 'religion' doesn't remotely follow Jesus of the Gospels in matters of love.......
@@survivingparadisepodcast Yes, I remember the Greatest Man book. This organization is not based on the love Jesus talked about but rather the judgement of the Pharisees. It's alot to process when you finally allow yourself to realizae that.
After ten seconds my cognitive dissonance kicked in, when you mentioned the King, I thought we was going to hear about ELVIS PRESLEY. and wow first time I've been 2nd to comment. Hi from Perth Australia.
After 46 years as a jw, I can honestly say that they never stole my sense of humour, hence my pseudonym is just in time. Hi again from Perth Australia. 😇👋💕
Update my friend; as of about 3-4 years ago they made an announcement that the congregation could applaud a reinstatement. Thank God! We were now allowed to follow Jesus counsel thru the prodigal son parable! Good thing we had the Almighty wisdom of the governing body, otherwise Jesus wouldn't have gleaned the point of HIS OWN ILLUSTRATION!!
Hi Stacey...as usual I and I'm sure all enjoyed this podcast immensely.I also love that fact that your podcasts are lengthy just love it, always my Monday/ Tuesday highlight you could almost say it's my family worship night for me 😆,cheers
Good morning Stacey and great podcast,,, funny that's one of the things I was thinking of the other week on the process the JWS use on the former members returning process,,,, I don't know how can you put up with sitting on the back room in the meeting's tolerating mother's with their babies crying and the noise you can't raise your hand and answer questions and ofcourse no one greets you or speaks to you but,,,,,,,, like me who didn't take a dunk into the pool and left I remember when I went to the memorial they greeted me and treated almost like a celebrity not that I mind lol,,,, but hmmmmmm gee what is the catch here? hmmmmm lol, I say you must really be out of your rocker to put up with the shunning for so however long till the elders uh um uh errrr imperfect men decide you are worthy to comeback, lol, great podcast Stacey and till next week.
Thanks David! That entire experience and the process leave lasting scars on thousands of people. Many never recover or are looked down upon in the congregation. A basic story.....and I don't be they don't comprehend it, I believe they're defiant
My wife and I had tried to get reinstated for ten years, with 9 total collectively reinstatement letters. My mother inlaw ratted my wife out to the elders and kept her from reinstatement. My wife's crime? She said god isn't happy with the governing body.
Love this story. As one locked up in a room 😊 I have a thought for you on blood if we are to stay away from blood way dose jesus till us to drink his in remembering him
My thoughts are if this is a comment from jehovah witch we know is not but for the blind 9 then by doing so they are disobeying there man mad law I think
It's very funny to but I have to be careful my wife and family are still in the organization I love your very on this I am hoping one day they will wake up thanks for talking with me I hope you have a great day
51 min. If it was my daughter, I would have a great meal and tell her that she can stay here with me. She was not born jw and she wouldn't do that/ but if she does, she's the baby I had in my belly and I would happily give my life for her ❣️ This is just normal love ❤️
In this podcast you quote from an article in the watchtower about Brian Hewitt. He was in my congregation after he came back from his prodigal experience. I thought you might like to know that after he came back, his mother committed suicide.
RANDY! OMG!!! I am SO SORRY :( this made me physically sick!!!! That poor woman :( I have no words and it's a story told too many times in JW's. I can't imagine the grief the family must feel. He had two brothers according to the article as well.....I'm so sorry!!!!!
@@MrRabbitt60 I'm gutted just seeing this info....gutted. Her son's return should have brought ultimate happiness, but it doesn't cover the mountains of grief JW's experience
Thing is, they said from the stage that the governing body is neither inspired or infallible. But seem to get there policy from reading the scriptures in progressively hardcore fashions. Maybe they read it once upside down, then sideways. Maybe do some torture style Barny theme song playing over and over while reading in freezing temperatures. But none of this would make sense, because how can they just make stuff up that’s not in the Bible anywhere no matter how many times it’s read, if there not inspired and getting extra stuff from Jesus ?
You said it very well. Indeed, Jehovah's Witnesses are missing the point in Jesus Christ:s parable of the prodigal son, and the Watchtower Society's Governing Body is missing the point more. Thank you for this video of the prodigal son and pointing out how the Jehovah's Witnesses have seriously missed the point.
I’m a dirty stinkin’ flaming heathen, but I have this headcanon that the reason Jesus hasn’t returned is because he sees how far gone the people professing to be his followers here on earth are, and, being the kind, loving, patient guy those of us who have actually read and studied the Bible know he is, he’s just folding his arms across his chest, making a face like this 😐, and saying, “I’ll wait.” Like a teacher waiting for their noisy, obnoxious class to shut up. I think he’s gonna be waiting a while. 💀💀💀
LOL....I have a shot from WT literature (Greatest Man Book) of Jesus grabbing his head while the apostle all argue....it's a classic and I picture it every time!
Kings (Gods, Lords) sometimes had concubines. Women competed over which son should be first- become the King, inheritance. I am wondering if that struggle with the sons started over these issues. The lives or survival of some of these sons were at stake- some were murdered. Not sure if there is a connection there. Few years ago, there was a video about the prodigal son. Sounds like non-conformity was an issue. Seeking a career or moving away would take you down the wrong path. Most of us are not living in the same situation as he was. Logic tells us that we are all standing on that line to becoming a "nonconformist by the decisions or choices before us.
All very good points! The concubine 'thing' deserves an episode....they struggle with anything that falls in that bucket. The firstborn thing is fascinating!
@@survivingparadisepodcast Where would the ex jw community be without the Internet and social media ? Has it not enabled existence of a support network ..and tips to join activists in their efforts to slow and stop the government body ? But have you noticed whose tactics the governing body are using ? The wild beast, false prophet and the dragons...in gathering the opposing side to Armageddon (See rev 16:13&14)
Accompanying Gog in his final attack ! Like the raging torrent in which no man can stand..l have yet to hear anything that stops me. Rev 11:6 has huge implications.. Verse 10 adds an interesting point about Xmas gift exchanging l never noticed when we studied it in the 90,s.
@@survivingparadisepodcast Who has the ability to foretell and control the weather ,flash floods including hail volcanic activity, Pestilence and foretell bloodshed for one particular period of time ? Was it the response to his people being isolated in prison that Jah arranged for lockdown isolation with SARS ? POSSIBLY. REV 19:17&18 Who are our allies ? Russia or those working alongside the Messiah..the two witnesses ?(Rev 11)
Stacy have you seen the awful Prodigal Son movie that they made? They take EVERYTHING you mention and unironically apply it. It's comical how unpleasant Disfellowshipping and Reinstatement is 😢
@@survivingparadisepodcast Because it was released in 2013. By your own account you had escaped. I watched it and yet I cannot recall it at all even though I have it!
I like the blind nine. 🤣 I don't really like the fine nine. There isn't anything fine about them. I like to call them the nine. The nine nazguls from lord of the rings. Imitating gandalfs voice. Mark Sanderson is the witch king of Angmar. Lol that's the nerd in me.
Love your delivery and content, except disappointed to hear 'blind nine'...one of my family is legally blind..he is a deep thinker with brilliant insight that often 'sees' more than others whose vision has not been affected. Please reconsider.
Thank you Sophi, I appreciate your kind words! I'm very sorry if that offended you or your family, certainly not meant to. It's a play on Jesus' words regarding the 'blind leading the blind' from the Bible....we never aim to hurt ANYONE'S feelings....my apologies!
JWs totally miss the point of this story, but on purpose. That's how the GB spins it. I was always impressed by how it was the father who ran out to meet his son. No protocols, no hoops, just forgiveness and compassion. I always wondered, if Jesus said there is rejoicing in Heaven for one sinner that returns, then why aren't we allowed to clap and hug the reinstated disfellowshipped one??
Don’t know his title but if an elder calls the branch, (inside number) Rocky may be who takes the call. He was our CO years ago. Of course if you call, you can’t indicate you know who it is and they will refuse to give you their name if you don’t know. And yet they are your brothers? 🙄
@@jeanette5820 Wow, great tidbit, I had no idea! Oh yes, calling HQ has changed dramatically in modern times....they won't talk to anyone, which only lends itself to a cult like feel.....aren't they supposed to talk to every human that inquires??
I think they will talk to them but won’t give their name. Though you give yours. When two elders call branch on a cong matter, (has to be two), they ID themselves, incl baptism date, but are not allowed to know the name of the person to whom they are talking. Some “brotherhood”.
All these comments from people who wanted to do just what they wanted to, without consequences. The story is one of humility. If you’ve done something wrong accept discipline like king David. Read his repentance in the psalms. King David would never have recorded this you tube video. Only how sorry he was. That’s the lesson. Cannot believe you said that God doesn’t want the preaching work. Your content is narrow minded
No, when King David was given a choice between running from his enemies for three months or allowing 72,000 of his people (including children) to die by plague....he chose the plague and went back to the palace without consequence. Sort of like what he did when he had a man murdered, slept with his wife that created an innocent child....then watched Jehovah kill the baby.....and put on some new clothes and drank some wine like nothing happened. Ian.....you're making quite the leap to speak about a bunch of strangers posting on a TH-cam page as if you know there motives. You, nor I, know everyone posting here, nor their motives....but we sure know a lot about King David.... Jehovah made a holy book and was sure to share his many 'deeds'..... whatever the lesson, is it possible you missed it? As for preaching, it's supported with many JW references, as well as the Bible. What JWs currently do does not remotely resemble their own holy book. Nothing narrow here.....factual. But I understand it makes you uncomfortable. Most of us that have left were very uncomfortable upon the discovery as well. Keep studying. And as for judging people that post here.... might I recommend Matthew 7:1-6...… it's Jesus, the King of Jehovah's Witnesses. Feel free to use the New World Translation and thank you for the dialogue.
@@survivingparadisepodcast No. david received many consequences for his error in his life. Including a bad conscience. This is the main lesson we learn that if we sin, does it make us humble like David and make us do anything we can to show our repentance. Jesus and Jehovah went through a lot of pain and sacrifice for us, the least we can do is show gratitude. Posting on social media shows we are not even remotely repentant and that disfellowshipping was indeed the right outcome. There are no organisations where you can do what you want without consequences. There’s no other group doing a worldwide preaching work about the Kingdom
Correct, there are no organizations where you can do whatever you want. But few created a shunning policy found NOWHERE in the Bible.....and as for the 'preaching' work....you're incredibly wrong. You've been indoctrinated to give such an answer. There are many religions that preach. Unfortunately, it looks like you've lived inside the JW bubble you're entire life. I encourage you to keep studying. @@iankelly6632
@@survivingparadisepodcast all organisations have there own “shunning policies “ it usually called excommunication or being sacked. 1st corthinians 5:13 remove the wicked man from amongst yourself and other’s scriptures. With other organisations there’s never any way back, with Jehovah there is. Show humility except responsibility. As for the preaching work no organisation is preaching the kingdom message on the scale that the witnesses are well known for. How many other organisations knock on your door and your neighbours door’s regular over many years? Get yourself back on track study the bible. I’m not indoctrinated or brainwashed. As an adult I’m comfortable with the concept of “ consequences” and realise that no amount of moaning can change that. Remember regardless of your individual situation the fact remains…. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth
Thanks for being here....very candid about my strengths and weaknesses....appreciate you listening, but if it doesn't help you in anyway, there is always the 'off' button :) Always improving, but never perfect
This is why I am so happy when a disfellowshiped person learns TTATT 🙂🙂
The whole story totally debunkes the committee meetings, repentance, probation , disfellowshiping and shunning. Another GREAT video. Thank you for your work!!
It sure does! Thank you Beauty!!
Mental quick sand...that's a great one ! When I left in 1985, they were telling that I no longer wanted to be a jw. I think that it was great. In my head at the time...I was 17, they didn't kick me out because I didn't do anything wrong// I kicked them out talking about the cult , not the people. I didn't have friends, but 1, I liked the lady who had the Bible study to get me baptized. I was surprised how she hugged me at my Mom's funeral at a kingdom hall ... she presented me her son that I was the only one who was allowed to babysitting him (me and her mom) he was taller than 6 feet high and I babysat him when he was a tiny baby ...
Really enjoyed today's pod cast. I remember a disfellowshipped couple when I was a pioneer who sat at the back of the hall in our C school. It was there room for people like this. And it was well over a year before they came back. And the rumour mill started yo when they were reinstated. Things that they were too worldly to ever be allowed back etc.... This poor couple who I was friends with and I have to be honest I never shunned them in private but did at the halls..... Ended up leaving completely after a few years as they were never really excepted back. They were never invited to stuff etc. So in the end they left completely and they are so much happier now. I am still friends with them. Infact I left a year after they left a 2nd time.
How fortunate we are to have these wonderful well thought out videos by such a excellent man.million thanks regards from England
@@gabrielkoncowski1403 Thank you so much Gabriel!!
OH yes Sharon, many, many stories just like yours! I call it the 'silent shun' where after reinstatement, someone continues to be looked down upon in the congregation. It's VERY common and comes right from the top! I'm so glad you friends got out!
Also, if that son would be in the monkey court(aka committee) they would ask him WHEN did you repent, was it BEFORE or AFTER you were poor and hungry, because if it’s after, which was the case, they would say he is only sorry, because he suffers the consequences of his actions, and it’s “worldly sadness”, therefore he will get disfellowshiped, because it’s not TRUE repentance!
@@beautyRest1 Very, very true!! A whole list of stipulations that are never mentioned in the story....because that would be absurd!
Well done, that was the deepest interpretation of the Prodigal Son I have ever heard.
Thank you Nicholson!
My judicial committee told me at our very first meeting that they needed to see "fruits of repentance" from me before they would even consider forgiving me. To this I demanded to know what "fruits of repentance" did the Prodigal Son show? I followed that with accusing them of knowing better than Christ and claiming to know better than he did. The angry silence I heard after saying these things was deafening.
I can't love this story enough!! LOL....three guys who showed up unprepared for a person who was actually thinking and well read. They were likely furious with you LOL
You just needed to be humble
Attendance a judicial committee itself is humbling. do you think the prodigal Son should have had a judicial committee meeting with three elders? These days his father would have been shunned for not shunning his son lol. The elder's must know better than lJesus 😂
Exactly this! My mother was disfellowshipped for smoking ONE cigarette when my sister and I were kids. They would walk up and talk to us kids and just ignore her existence. I will never forgive an organization that teaches this, period.
Unbelievable!! Adults setting the tone with children....embarrassing and cruel!
Wow, that really brings it all home and they completely miss the boat!
Thanks Planet....it's a great story.....and yep, they completely miss the point and try to apply it to something so bizarre....
Hearing you tell this story nearly brought me to tears with the part about the father running to his son and embracing him. It’s exactly what I would do as a parent whose child has returned. It’s so sick that the organization of JW does the opposite. More guilt and shame, guilt and shame, and it goes on and on……
One of the best stories ever written. So much to learn from this story....if only JWs understood it
The man with a plan , loving every topic you touch
Thank you so much Ashera! :)
Loving your humor on the fruit baskets and sundresses I lol I just woke up. Laughing heals!!❤
thank you!
Wow - I loved this & could relate so much! I've actually thought about that a lot over the years. If JW's supposedly follow the Bible, why do they make people jump through so many hoops to come back, when the prodigal son was welcomed back with open arms? That never sat right with me either. I was also giggling / crying inside listening to you talk about how the elders want to know the most intimate, disgusting details of what might have happened behind closed doors. I was a young woman in her 20's, and these middle aged / senior citizen crusty elders were asking me the most embarrassing, intrusive, disgusting questions to me & I felt so violated. I thought how does knowing all those details help you to "read hearts"? That committee experience completely grossed me out & made me feel super icky. Also, I had no idea that they kept files on people until in that committee they had brought up a sin, I had committed a few years prior & did the time for already (reproved). They said "our files show that you got drunk 3 years ago" - WTF? I asked my dad, who was an elder - why do they keep files on people if you've done the time & technically should have been forgiven? My Dad told me that they needed to keep files on people to see if there's a pattern in their behavior. I was like WTF - what about forgiving somebody 77 times? I guess that doesn't exist in the Borg.
It's truly insane what they make people do! Oh yes, the infamous files. I'm planning on covering the whole 'pervy' elder convos....they're something else and it's systemic throughout the system. The files exist, I can assure you!!
Your question is: "If JW's supposedly follow the Bible, why do they make people jump through so many hoops to come back, when the prodigal son was welcomed back with open arms?" The prodigal son was repentant and was cut to the heart for what he had done. The person who is disfellowshipped today is not repentant and refuses to accept counsel. Back in the 70s the brothers were especially hard on ones who made a mistake and out the door they went, and it took forever for them to be reinstated. That was not loving and today anyone being disfellowshipped is asking for it. Read about the Samaritan who took care of a Levite who was left for dead in the street. The Samaritans and the Levites were bitter enemies.
@@ronhansen8471 LOL - you're hilarious!
Been out since the early 1990s. I don’t even remember the date that I wrote my disassociation letter, but I do remember the huge weight lifted off my brain. I have since converted to my ancestral Jewish faith, but no longer believe in ghosts or gods. I definitely don’t believe in a devil. However, I hope that more people wake up the unscientific beliefs of the Tower! Thank you for your ongoing service!
I'm so glad to read stories where people broke free! Thank you for listening!
Good riddance
Spot on as usual Stacey! 👌 Superb!
For me a disfellowshiped brother a year ago, of 50 years, seen a lot, asked for mercy and received none!
My disfellowshipped wife is convinced she has to be present in a Kingdom Hall convinced she has to touch the plate of bread, and the glass of red wine, and reject it, In order not to offend Jehovah, as outlined by the GB. For me I do not fall for that ritual that has no scriptutal basis at all, just something an arrogant self righteous imperfect human thought up to control the sheep! And of course if you observe at home how exactly will you contribute your hard earned money to pay for all the CSA Case Law Suites filed against the great 9? Or how will they continue to buy and build major movie studios to brainwash your child's 🧠? 🤔 So tomorrow I will make my unleavened bread as I usually have for many years, sit and look at the small bottle of red wine, listen to the Memorial talk I recorded on TH-cam, say my prayer asking again for mercy, letting Jehovah know I am not anointed, and I appreciate what has been done for imperfect me, knowing full well no mercy will be shown. And finish the night. Poor the wine into a glass mixed with Brandy, get my jar of Salsa out, melt some 🧀 over the unleavened bread, and 😉 enjoy as I dip my now homade crackers into the salsa, washing it down with red wine mixed with Brandy, thanking Jehovah I am not part of that cult-ure of shunning others ever again. By the way, how can they be sure it was red red 🍷 and not white 🥂? Or did they not have white grapes back then? Jesus only turned barrels of water into red wine? 😳 Did Jesus whisper into their ears telling them to only use red wine? Maybe it was fruity Pink wine? 🤔 I will then converse with my cats as they beg for a bite if cheese and thank Jehovah for friends that will not shun me because the evil 9 tells them to!
LOL LOL, I loved this so much that I read it twice!! I love how you 'celebrate' memorial.....and you're right, completely fabricated stuff! I'm more interested in your salsa and Brandy!! :)
@@survivingparadisepodcast In Africa where I live now, my retiremrnt money buys me expensive spirits
Like 12 and 18 year old Scotch, but for this celebration since my Moms side is from the Richerts of Germany being twin Sisters one who is my great grandmother, immigrated to the US in 1914 I chose a bottle of German Brandy named Ausbach! For this special event. Which I will mix with a nice French Merlot that is left over from the Memorial. (Asbach Uralt is a German brandy produced by the company Asbach GmbH, a subsidiary of Underberg AG, which also makes other spirits and chocolate) so in 2005 and 2006 I was in Southern Germany licking my wounds from turning a drunkard Elder in for misconduct in the Congregation. Of course I was tried by no less than 7 Elders in a judicial setting where they used my wife of 25 years to convict me of apostasy and disfellowship me but after the CO of the Congregation was caught lying and fabricating evidence against me it just became a matter of mistaken principles according to the other Elder's in the room in order to protect their precious CO, 6 liar Elders in one room was a sight to behold. The 7th being a heavy drunkard. Then the Curcuit Overseer a one Brother Kuss disappeared from sight. Later I learned Kuss was in rehab from being an Alcoholic at Bethel in New York for a year! But I ran into him later in Washington State as he was unaware I was there, and called a meeting of all Brother's in the Congregation because the Elder arrangement was not bringing any new Brother's forward to be Elders or Servants in that hypocritical Congregation. Of course the look on his face when I greeted him saying you may fool them, but I am not fooled by you. I know who you really are Kuss! IT WAS PAYBACK A little bit. Of course he avoided me the rest of the week, the following year Kuss passed from alcohol related cancer which happens to heavy drinkers. RIP Kuss! I have a history in Jehovah's so called Organisation.
@@universeworld1782 What a horrific story. There are so many alcoholics among JW's. I knew many elders that had massive problems with alcohol. What a tragedy
Excellent lesson , thank you. I so much agree with your view.❤
Thank you!
Oh boy, do I remember. When someone leaves the org, their character is immediately dragged through the mud. He/she will will end up a drug user, a drunkard or a fornicator. When in all honesty, said person just wants their life back.
Free of watchtower chains.
In the eyes of the Org, an unpardonable sin.
Are you German?
@@joachimgoethe7864 ok, ich verstehe, hasst aber auch einen deutschen Namen. Ich bin Deutsche, lebe in USA.
Yep....it's a slope into the gutter FOR JUST LEAVING LOL.....every, single talk....
Another great epp Stacy! I have a recording of me discussing this topic with my Elders.
Wow! How did that conversation go??
@Surviving Paradise It was during an elders meeting to "encourage" me. I brought this topic up. It wasn't anything to speak of. But I have about 4 hours of elders meetings recorded. I plan on posting them on TH-cam eventually with my rebuttal of what i wish i would have said. Just gotta get time to be able to set my channel up.
@@codydowns8251 Can't wait to listen to those!
Excellent job sir...your efforts are definitely appreciated. Looking forward to the next one.
Thank you Deo!!
I spent my whole Sunday binging some of your content from the beginning, so I'm glad to see another upload!
You're too kind, thanks for listening!!!
@@survivingparadisepodcast my pleasure!
We would like to thank brother Stacy for giving us that outstanding talk. We have a couple of announcements. Don’t forget to turn your time in. 2nd don’t forget the memorial is this week, make sure you read the assigned scriptures.
This is how watchtow$r’s minions always slapped us back to reality after such great talks
LOL LOL, this made my day and made me laugh so loud.....I miss those stupid comments at the end of a meeting.....so hilarious
The son didn't have to sit in the back of the kingdom hall for a year or more. He didn't have to meet with the elder alone behind closed doors, he was recieved by his father right away. Away from the judgment of others who have nothing to tell you who you can talk to...etc...
Thank you Stacy for another great break down. I fine tooth combed this subject 20 years ago when our firstborn was about to hit his teens. I showed my wife and said if our son ever leaves and wants to come back, I'm following Jesus's advice and not the GB. She agreed with me. Thanks again!
I can't love this post enough!!! If only every JW would take such a stance!! Thanks Stanley!
The hypocrisy × billions. It's making me physically sick. And they're liking the hypocrites ... Fact!
yes!
Excellent presentation ❤❤❤❤
Thank you Dawn!
i was taught this parable was about one returning back to the organization and elders providing the person the spiritual loving help they needed aka disfellowshipping
your expanatian come to think of it makes way more sense
@@johnnycroat Once read just from the Bible, it's incredible how they misapply this parable
Excellent presentation Stacy, perhaps one of your finest
Thank you NV, much appreciated!
Great job 👏
I wish the JWs would really read this parable the way you explained it. I’ve had arguments with elders about this and they can’t accept it because the ORG told them something else 🤦🏻♂️
OH yes, so have I, many late night discussions about this...and frankly, the Apostle Peter's 'life'...subject for another day......basic story they don't comprehend
I love your long podcasts. If all of us had your inquisitive and curios mind, we would have left much sooner. How could we have missed all this??
Thanks Reiner! It's all cognitive dissonance....we were all under a mental 'spell'.....we just sat there nodding our heads :(
Another excellent episode Stacey, man what a really great episode!
Thank you 96!!~
I must have been no, no, notorious, notorious. I tried going back three times. And was disappointed. It was one df. The last congregation had me wait 18 more months. The congregation was too interested in playing golf than meeting with me. I asked to meet with them after the Sunday meeting but they couldn’t meet with me. I was so discouraged that I. Bought a pack of cigarettes and smoked them in my back yard just when the PO and his wife walked by my backyard. They stared at me. I never went back. Thank God! Maybe because I was an ex wife of an elder/ pioneer?…
I'm so sorry, that is VERY common....they can't be bothered to actually help people. I'm glad you never went back!!!
It is not natural to kick your children when they are down. Hate this organization that removes natural affection from parents.
It's deeply disturbing, emotional abuse...and the list goes on. It should be the BIGGEST indicator of this religion's cult status
Stacey, again thank you for your clear and transparent look into their shunning policy. My jw daughter & son-in-law are unable to survive financially and will be moving back home, with me being disfellowshipped for 30 years. She's told me the won't be shunning me. That was a condition I set. Their congregation would not help them. So I get to welcome her back, a reverse of the prodigal son parable. This oughta be fun😅
WOW!!!! That is an amazing, loving story!!! So many younger people are struggling financially today, that is SO loving on your part Danette and I love that YOU set boundaries. Incredible, isn't it??? Their congregation won't help them......it's so insane!
Love the "Sin chart timetable" at 59: 30 min.!!! That's what they applied in my case!! For the first time ever, I broke out laughing!😂🤣😅
I believe that along with the “blind nine” you could also go with the “super-fine nine.”
That’s a deep cut reference
I like it!!
I came forward with sexual sins, none of which happened with a sister, and were not known among the community I live in. I was df'd from 12/18-12/21. 3 long years, and I have family who are witnesses. Once reinstated, many didn't talk to me. When the public ministry started up last year, not one person offered to work with me. I did not receive a shepherding call, or even a phone call from being reinstated until I left the organization in February of this year, over a year.
Listening to this incredibly well done podcast made me want to cry and to be honest, put a beating on at least 2 of the men on my committees (I switched congs due to moving after my df'ing so there were 6 men total). The things that were said to me in those judicial meetings were humiliating and degrading and the things they made me tell them in great detail were humiliating and degrading. For any current witnesses reading this and contemplating coming forward and confessing to the elders I highly recommend, DO NOT DO IT. You have no power in a judicial meeting. They have all of it, and all you can do is try to guess what they want you to say and how they want you to act in order to not be expelled. It's sickening and should be illegal. This channel has an episode about never confessing sins to elders, it should be standard viewing for all witnesses.
Thank you simplified....and I'm very sorry for what you've been through!! Your experience is VERY common, it's the norm in Jehovah's Witnesses. Precious people fall through the cracks daily, shepherding or just plain kindness are missing for millions....for those disciplined, most wear a letter of shame the rest of their lives as JW's. Reinstatement is ZERO guarantee of being treated with love. THANK YOU for mentioning the past episode on NEVER confessing to elders.....I can't emphasize that enough...NEVER go to an elder with anything!
Excellent breakdown of this parable by providing clear context.
I used to hate hearing the Prodigal Son Parable reimagined by JWs. Still remember “The Prodigal Son” made for TV The GB provided a couple yrs ago, & I was like, I’m not sure this is the point of the story.
One other thing, since I left a lot later than u my friend; based upon The GB reconsidering the parable of The Prodigal Son, they sent directions to the congregations that they are “allowed” to provide “spontaneous” reaction when one is announced as being reinstated.
However, to ur point, even when one is reinstated, they are still treated different. Many have to re-start a Bible Study to re-establish their “love” for Jehovah. They are on a probation period where they can’t give comments, talks, carry mics, conduct bible studies, enter full time ministry, etc. They have to “earn” these privileges.
Then again, there’s always a side eye on such individuals as they are deemed & classified as spiritually weak, so before “fully associating” w/ a reinstated one, they need to be observed for a period of time, & unfortunately, some always have those jackets placed upon them.
This is b/c of the culture that’s been established at the top. Like u always say, 90% of JWs are unfamiliar w/ the Bible & especially their literature.
All fantastic points By George! I have been out since 2009, so there may be updates, thanks for sharing here! I love that you called out many then need another Bible Study, I had two people even question whether they should get rebaptized!
@@survivingparadisepodcast When I was an Elder I had one young man, who was born in to the religion, ask me after getting reinstated (since I was Chairman over his committee & COBE) was it necessary for him to go over The God’s Love book, again? He flat out said he wasn’t going to learn anything new, & he just made a mistake w/ young lady (who actually wound up being his wife). Being a “company man” I just encouraged him to follow along w/ instructions given to help his spirituality (lol), but I asked what areas did he think he could improve in. Once that was established, I told the person assigned to just go over those two chapters, ONLY, & we’ll check back.
The person assigned to study w/ him was a M.S, & he took it upon himself to treat the young brother like a Bible Student. The young man left shortly thereafter, & explained to me how discouraging it was to be treated like he’s some babe in The Truth. I completely empathized w/ him, & made sure he had a nice, warm letter of introduction to his new hall.
Come to think of it, Letters of Introduction r pretty lame, too. The fact a person is not allowed to see or know what 3 guys say about them is weird. Smh. Sorry; tangent. Lol.
@@bygeorgehemayberite8385 you jogged my own memory with this story! Many similar stories from my own time as an elder. As if wanting to have sex somehow meant you forgot everything you ever learned. The absurdity! Thanks for sharing this!
Hello 👋
Bonjour je regarde régulièrement toutes les vidéos ,que je trouve très bien ! mais la dernière (comment le collège centrale rejette le fils prodigue , alors ça je l'attendais depuis longtemps ! Alors je parle pas anglais donc je pense que peut-être d'autres en anglais en en parler parce que je visite bien d'autres sites... Juste pour te dire que tu en parles extrêmement bien et je t'encourage à continué à continuer ce beau travail 💙❤️💗 merci beaucoup.
Thank you Stacey for a informative video once again. I here you it is so hypocritical what you are saying is so true. My cousin has a daughter that was raised in the truth but does not want anything to do with the organization she never got baptized but yet her mother hangs out with her while in the mean treat me like I was diseased because I got wet.. Pretty pathetic do not worry as I say that they are not loving there enemies.. thank you
GROSS hypocrisy for a JW to still associate with children that have openly rejected the religion and Jehovah himself by dodging the baptism pool. Good for the kids, they figured it out, but the baptized parents are acting shamefully by 'spiritual' standards.
Shunning kills
Tw/cw: sewer slide
Absolutely. As they’ve said before in the Watchtower magazine, they can’t literally kill apostates, but they sure can try to make them wish they were dead, or even self-end(I added in this last part but we all know Watchtower just uses s•ic•de in people who leave as an “example”).
Yes it does! It's as serious as it gets!!
@@BlackFlagHeathen If only stoning people were legal...... many think that is the answer :(
The fact that in the "modern day Prodigal Son" film they produced a few years back the son faces a Judicial committee at the end and, let's face it, probably gets disfellowshipped (I'm giving that a 95% likelihood) shows how off the mark they are with the stories lesson.
Unless of course that part was ommited from the Bible. "After the feast the son was sent to talk to the elders of the land. After brief deliberation they decided that it was not good for the son to be in their presence and cast him back into the world, informing all he was no longer part of their community and should be treated as dead until he returned to Jehovah. And the father of the son shunned him because he was a man of faith."
Wait...that's not in there? Hmm...
Wow, I don't think I've seen this film! Or I've forgotten.....I'll have to go searching for that one...but YES, basic story distorted so badly....they're defiant
@@survivingparadisepodcast It's called The Prodgical Returns. I believe it was the first cinematic drama made for the convention after they did away with the live action ones
@@soundthealarm83 Thank you! I may have seen this, but it's not jumping to mind. I need to go watch this!
Thank you for this.
As a JW I absolutely HATED the story of the Prodigal Son. I thought it was SO unfair for the older brother, who had toiled away the years, while the younger son had been out partying. I was 100% #TeamOlderBrother. 😅 Not in small part due to the fact that whenever I'd be confronted with the story, in a KH, I felt like I WAS the older brother; being a good little JW, toiling away, drudging to the meetings, doing everything right, even though I HATED all of it, even though I WANTED to be elsewhere, doing such despicable things as enjoying a hot cocoa at home, on a Sunday morning. But no, I was at the KH.
You said the JW's act like the older brother towards any coming back into the congregation and that is certainly true. It almost feels as if there is some deeper current of comparison---something I can't quite put my finger on---with that and with me VERY MUCH identifying with the older brother. I mean... they don't treat the story as being about forgiveness in general, they treat it about being about people leaving, sinning, and then returning to the congregation, specifically. With that emphasis, doesn't that MAKE all of us who obediently sat at the Kingdom Hall listening, the older brother?? So since the viewpoint is skewed, since we're thinking about how many hot cocoas (I was quite young when I first felt bitter about all the debauchery the younger brother got to do 😂) the prodigal sons get to have, while I have to sit at the KH, the entire teaching, the point of the story, goes right out the window. (Or through the wall maybe, due to the lack of windows.)
Very much speculation, of course, but with decades of this... no WONDER these rules start popping up about how to treat those returning. No wonder there will be NO PARTY, no clapping. We were all the older brother, feeling bitter about the cocoas we missed.
You weren't alone!! We were all the older brother and we were conditioned to be that way! They have ZERO understanding of the story.....or....they have full understanding and they choose to be defiant in applying its spirit. This story fully proves to me that they KNOW what they're doing....
It is very interesting that you provided this topic on the week of memorial. Props and high fives! Food at the proper time. LOL. Jesus was all about love, and this religion is nasty. Like you said, so bizarre. After decades of being involved in this organization the lack of love and the story of the prodigal son is what woke me up. This organization is the total opposite of loving. I love your term of mental quicksand, it cracks me up. Grace and mercy is an over looked detail with this religion. I look forward to your podcasts as they are my weekly therapy. Love and mercy . Hugs and thank you.
Thank you Snookered!! ;) Seemed like a great week for this little story. Yes, it was always a conflict within me, especially after studying the Greatest Man book, remember that one? You get to the end of the book and it's clear this 'religion' doesn't remotely follow Jesus of the Gospels in matters of love.......
@@survivingparadisepodcast Yes, I remember the Greatest Man book. This organization is not based on the love Jesus talked about but rather the judgement of the Pharisees. It's alot to process when you finally allow yourself to realizae that.
@@snookered3gen781 YES! And it's so easy to see!
@@snookered3gen781 So true.....a past episode on the Pharisees and Governing Body was a favorite. It's so obvious
After ten seconds my cognitive dissonance kicked in, when you mentioned the King, I thought we was going to hear about ELVIS PRESLEY. and wow first time I've been 2nd to comment. Hi from Perth Australia.
The Revelation book has baby Jesus coming down from heaven. My young son drew sideburns & Elvis’ hair on the king 🤭
@@TallKulWmn1 LOL LOL
LOL, I love it!!! I think it's important to mention that Jesus Christ of the Bible is King of the JW's.....allegedly!
Justin I was just in Australia WA Busselton a few weeks ago lol… small world
After 46 years as a jw, I can honestly say that they never stole my sense of humour, hence my pseudonym is just in time. Hi again from Perth Australia. 😇👋💕
Update my friend; as of about 3-4 years ago they made an announcement that the congregation could applaud a reinstatement. Thank God! We were now allowed to follow Jesus counsel thru the prodigal son parable! Good thing we had the Almighty wisdom of the governing body, otherwise Jesus wouldn't have gleaned the point of HIS OWN ILLUSTRATION!!
Hi Stacey...as usual I and I'm sure all enjoyed this podcast immensely.I also love that fact that your podcasts are lengthy just love it, always my Monday/ Tuesday highlight you could almost say it's my family worship night for me 😆,cheers
Thanks Tony! Really appreciate you listening...and VERY glad you're not spending a night in a 192 page book from a certain publishing company LOL ;)
Good morning Stacey and great podcast,,, funny that's one of the things I was thinking of the other week on the process the JWS use on the former members returning process,,,, I don't know how can you put up with sitting on the back room in the meeting's tolerating mother's with their babies crying and the noise you can't raise your hand and answer questions and ofcourse no one greets you or speaks to you but,,,,,,,, like me who didn't take a dunk into the pool and left I remember when I went to the memorial they greeted me and treated almost like a celebrity not that I mind lol,,,, but hmmmmmm gee what is the catch here? hmmmmm lol, I say you must really be out of your rocker to put up with the shunning for so however long till the elders uh um uh errrr imperfect men decide you are worthy to comeback, lol, great podcast Stacey and till next week.
Thanks David! That entire experience and the process leave lasting scars on thousands of people. Many never recover or are looked down upon in the congregation. A basic story.....and I don't be they don't comprehend it, I believe they're defiant
My wife and I had tried to get reinstated for ten years, with 9 total collectively reinstatement letters.
My mother inlaw ratted my wife out to the elders and kept her from reinstatement.
My wife's crime? She said god isn't happy with the governing body.
WOW, so sorry I'm just seeing this....but there you go, it's about them!
Love this story. As one locked up in a room 😊 I have a thought for you on blood if we are to stay away from blood way dose jesus till us to drink his in remembering him
Me too Shawn! Would love to see your thought! An appropriate week for this subject
My thoughts are if this is a comment from jehovah witch we know is not but for the blind 9 then by doing so they are disobeying there man mad law I think
Sorry forgot to say if they drink the blood of jesus (simbalik) they are going against there own law right
@@shawnkoehn3235 Bingo! It's overt disobedience. They defy the guy that told the story and the guy they claim runs their organization from heaven
It's very funny to but I have to be careful my wife and family are still in the organization I love your very on this I am hoping one day they will wake up thanks for talking with me I hope you have a great day
But in the gb Bible wherever the word mercy is use they remove it and put loyalty so loyalty to the gb
Yep...they change a lot of things to fit their narrative
51 min. If it was my daughter, I would have a great meal and tell her that she can stay here with me. She was not born jw and she wouldn't do that/ but if she does, she's the baby I had in my belly and I would happily give my life for her ❣️ This is just normal love ❤️
You're a great mom Natasha!
In this podcast you quote from an article in the watchtower about Brian Hewitt. He was in my congregation after he came back from his prodigal experience. I thought you might like to know that after he came back, his mother committed suicide.
A number of years later
RANDY! OMG!!! I am SO SORRY :( this made me physically sick!!!! That poor woman :( I have no words and it's a story told too many times in JW's. I can't imagine the grief the family must feel. He had two brothers according to the article as well.....I'm so sorry!!!!!
@@MrRabbitt60 I'm gutted just seeing this info....gutted. Her son's return should have brought ultimate happiness, but it doesn't cover the mountains of grief JW's experience
Applying the filter of rev 11:6 the view of negative things we see and experience looks very different.
You’re an AMAZING storyteller… Thanks for the masterful way the JW cognitive dissonance and craziness is disseminated. 👍🏼👍🏼👍🏼
Thank you DY!! You're too kind!!!
There are the teachings of Jesus Christ and then there is the false religion of JW’s. I’ll take Christ’s teachings every time 😎❤️🍹✝️
Thing is, they said from the stage that the governing body is neither inspired or infallible. But seem to get there policy from reading the scriptures in progressively hardcore fashions. Maybe they read it once upside down, then sideways. Maybe do some torture style Barny theme song playing over and over while reading in freezing temperatures. But none of this would make sense, because how can they just make stuff up that’s not in the Bible anywhere no matter how many times it’s read, if there not inspired and getting extra stuff from Jesus ?
LOL.... even then, only THEY understand it!
😂😂😂I lose my shit every time you say Hookers and Blow😂😂😂😂😂😂
LOL LOL....I got a little excited there
You said it very well. Indeed, Jehovah's Witnesses are missing the point in Jesus Christ:s parable of the prodigal son, and the Watchtower Society's Governing Body is missing the point more. Thank you for this video of the prodigal son and pointing out how the Jehovah's Witnesses have seriously missed the point.
I’m a dirty stinkin’ flaming heathen, but I have this headcanon that the reason Jesus hasn’t returned is because he sees how far gone the people professing to be his followers here on earth are, and, being the kind, loving, patient guy those of us who have actually read and studied the Bible know he is, he’s just folding his arms across his chest, making a face like this 😐, and saying, “I’ll wait.” Like a teacher waiting for their noisy, obnoxious class to shut up. I think he’s gonna be waiting a while. 💀💀💀
LOL....I have a shot from WT literature (Greatest Man Book) of Jesus grabbing his head while the apostle all argue....it's a classic and I picture it every time!
Kings (Gods, Lords) sometimes had concubines. Women competed over which son should be first- become the King, inheritance. I am wondering if that struggle with the sons started over these issues. The lives or survival of some of these sons were at stake- some were murdered. Not sure if there is a connection there. Few years ago, there was a video about the prodigal son. Sounds like non-conformity was an issue. Seeking a career or moving away would take you down the wrong path. Most of us are not living in the same situation as he was. Logic tells us that we are all standing on that line to becoming a "nonconformist by the decisions or choices before us.
All very good points! The concubine 'thing' deserves an episode....they struggle with anything that falls in that bucket. The firstborn thing is fascinating!
Ezek 38:20-22
What's the weather like over there where Gog is ?
Magog...it's bad! Especially after reading about violence between brothers and sulphur showers!
@@survivingparadisepodcast
Where would the ex jw community be without the Internet and social media ?
Has it not enabled existence of a support network ..and tips to join activists in their efforts to slow and stop the government body ?
But have you noticed whose tactics the governing body are using ?
The wild beast, false prophet and the dragons...in gathering the opposing side to Armageddon
(See rev 16:13&14)
Accompanying Gog in his final attack !
Like the raging torrent in which no man can stand..l have yet to hear anything that stops me.
Rev 11:6 has huge implications..
Verse 10 adds an interesting point about Xmas gift exchanging l never noticed when we studied it in the 90,s.
@@compositioncompilation Interesting angles on this Vernell
@@survivingparadisepodcast
Who has the ability to foretell and control the weather ,flash floods including hail
volcanic activity,
Pestilence and foretell bloodshed for one particular period of time ?
Was it the response to his people being isolated in prison that Jah arranged for lockdown isolation with SARS ?
POSSIBLY.
REV 19:17&18
Who are our allies ?
Russia or those working alongside the Messiah..the two witnesses ?(Rev 11)
❤
Stacy have you seen the awful Prodigal Son movie that they made? They take EVERYTHING you mention and unironically apply it. It's comical how unpleasant Disfellowshipping and Reinstatement is 😢
Wow, how did I miss this movie?? Someone else mentioned it and I'm not sure I've seen this thing.....I'm going to need to go look!
@@survivingparadisepodcast Because it was released in 2013. By your own account you had escaped. I watched it and yet I cannot recall it at all even though I have it!
@@broncosbest6441 I definitely don't remember this, I'm going to have to watch this....I wish I had remembered before this episode
🥓🥓🥓🍖🍖🍖Yummy in my tummy 🥓🥓🥓🍖🍖🍖
🤣🤣
I like the blind nine. 🤣
I don't really like the fine nine. There isn't anything fine about them.
I like to call them the nine. The nine nazguls from lord of the rings.
Imitating gandalfs voice. Mark Sanderson is the witch king of Angmar. Lol that's the nerd in me.
How about the Swine Nine!!
@@justinthyme5382 lol
Yeah, I'm not a big fan of the fine nine either......gives them too much credit ;)
Love your delivery and content, except disappointed to hear 'blind nine'...one of my family is legally blind..he is a deep thinker with brilliant insight that often 'sees' more than others whose vision has not been affected. Please reconsider.
I’m sure he didn’t mean to hurt or offend anyone. And we all know what he meant in this context
Thank you Sophi, I appreciate your kind words! I'm very sorry if that offended you or your family, certainly not meant to. It's a play on Jesus' words regarding the 'blind leading the blind' from the Bible....we never aim to hurt ANYONE'S feelings....my apologies!
@@survivingparadisepodcast thankyou!
JWs totally miss the point of this story, but on purpose. That's how the GB spins it. I was always impressed by how it was the father who ran out to meet his son. No protocols, no hoops, just forgiveness and compassion. I always wondered, if Jesus said there is rejoicing in Heaven for one sinner that returns, then why aren't we allowed to clap and hug the reinstated disfellowshipped one??
Yes, KEY to the whole story....he ran out TO HIM.....hopefully we covered that well....but a powerful story that condemns JW's
@@survivingparadisepodcast Right on! I love your podcast and subbed! You remind me so much of an uncle of mine.
@@TheC.O.-VISIT Thanks so much CO! I appreciate you!
Fundamentalism is the problem, including JW’s. I love Bible teachings but I don’t love Watch Tower doctrine 🤔
BEST parts of the Bible are the simple stories of love and kindness.....no doctrines needed :)
You have a speaking style like Rocky Hyatt. Intentional?
Hi Jeanette, sorry I have no clue who that is! I'll google him/her?
Don’t know his title but if an elder calls the branch, (inside number) Rocky may be who takes the call. He was our CO years ago. Of course if you call, you can’t indicate you know who it is and they will refuse to give you their name if you don’t know. And yet they are your brothers? 🙄
And Rocky is a favorite among many as a speaker btw.
@@jeanette5820 Wow, great tidbit, I had no idea! Oh yes, calling HQ has changed dramatically in modern times....they won't talk to anyone, which only lends itself to a cult like feel.....aren't they supposed to talk to every human that inquires??
I think they will talk to them but won’t give their name. Though you give yours. When two elders call branch on a cong matter, (has to be two), they ID themselves, incl baptism date, but are not allowed to know the name of the person to whom they are talking. Some “brotherhood”.
All these comments from people who wanted to do just what they wanted to, without consequences. The story is one of humility. If you’ve done something wrong accept discipline like king David. Read his repentance in the psalms. King David would never have recorded this you tube video. Only how sorry he was. That’s the lesson. Cannot believe you said that God doesn’t want the preaching work. Your content is narrow minded
No, when King David was given a choice between running from his enemies for three months or allowing 72,000 of his people (including children) to die by plague....he chose the plague and went back to the palace without consequence. Sort of like what he did when he had a man murdered, slept with his wife that created an innocent child....then watched Jehovah kill the baby.....and put on some new clothes and drank some wine like nothing happened. Ian.....you're making quite the leap to speak about a bunch of strangers posting on a TH-cam page as if you know there motives. You, nor I, know everyone posting here, nor their motives....but we sure know a lot about King David.... Jehovah made a holy book and was sure to share his many 'deeds'..... whatever the lesson, is it possible you missed it? As for preaching, it's supported with many JW references, as well as the Bible. What JWs currently do does not remotely resemble their own holy book. Nothing narrow here.....factual. But I understand it makes you uncomfortable. Most of us that have left were very uncomfortable upon the discovery as well. Keep studying. And as for judging people that post here.... might I recommend Matthew 7:1-6...… it's Jesus, the King of Jehovah's Witnesses. Feel free to use the New World Translation and thank you for the dialogue.
@@survivingparadisepodcast No. david received many consequences for his error in his life. Including a bad conscience. This is the main lesson we learn that if we sin, does it make us humble like David and make us do anything we can to show our repentance. Jesus and Jehovah went through a lot of pain and sacrifice for us, the least we can do is show gratitude. Posting on social media shows we are not even remotely repentant and that disfellowshipping was indeed the right outcome. There are no organisations where you can do what you want without consequences. There’s no other group doing a worldwide preaching work about the Kingdom
Correct, there are no organizations where you can do whatever you want. But few created a shunning policy found NOWHERE in the Bible.....and as for the 'preaching' work....you're incredibly wrong. You've been indoctrinated to give such an answer. There are many religions that preach. Unfortunately, it looks like you've lived inside the JW bubble you're entire life. I encourage you to keep studying. @@iankelly6632
@@survivingparadisepodcast all organisations have there own “shunning policies “ it usually called excommunication or being sacked. 1st corthinians 5:13 remove the wicked man from amongst yourself and other’s scriptures.
With other organisations there’s never any way back, with Jehovah there is. Show humility except responsibility. As for the preaching work no organisation is preaching the kingdom message on the scale that the witnesses are well known for. How many other organisations knock on your door and your neighbours door’s regular over many years? Get yourself back on track study the bible. I’m not indoctrinated or brainwashed. As an adult I’m comfortable with the concept of “ consequences” and realise that no amount of moaning can change that.
Remember regardless of your individual situation the fact remains…. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth
Again please cut the amateur into please GET TO THE POINT ❤
Thanks for being here....very candid about my strengths and weaknesses....appreciate you listening, but if it doesn't help you in anyway, there is always the 'off' button :) Always improving, but never perfect