13:40 was it the final straw that broke the camels back or all that came before it? 20:00 National Socialists and Communists worked together because they were both socialists. The conflict arises because Communists (Marxists) put the socialism first on a global mindset and National Socialists (Nazis) were about it but their country's supremacy is primary.
@@drywater5867 he debated Ana kasparian and cenk, I realize tyt is a bit more institutionalized than DGG but they are much closer to DGG than they are to a Andrew Neil or something
@@toby9364 also he doesn't wanna debate many people except for college students or media trained people Ana kasparian didn't go on offense as much and was extremely cordial unlike destiny and Ben will use the institution argument to avoid it if he gets confronted abt it
When you only listen to ‘Shapiro dunks’ videos where he’s being antagonized by far left wing college students, why would you expect to ever see this side of him? lmao.
We need to lock Ben Shapiro and Destiny in a basement and the only way to free themselves will be to scream at each other about politics for 5 straight hours.
@Libra Ben got destroyed by centre right Andrew Neil .I am indian and destiny would destroy Ben Shapiro but he shouldn't concede some points like he did in the Milo debate
@@VARMOT123 there is no chance that Destiny will just destroy Shapiro if he is prepared. If you saw this video, you'll see that they agree on almost everything and Shapiro lost bad against Neil because it was sold to him as a "book interview" but it was instead a grilling on Shapiro's pasr tweets, that he himself has made comments outlining how crazy he was for thiking that when he was young. You can see Destiny's comment on this on the video.
I like lex, I just don’t think he’d be a good moderator for Shapiro and destiny. These two will talk fast and aggressive, we would need a moderator equally as aggressive to keep the conversation productive
If Destiny and Ben ever have a conversation they'd probably say enough within twenty minutes that two normal speaking people would in a three hour podcast. You wouldn't know where one person stops talking and the other starts.
This makes no sense. I’ve been around the world 5x 3 licenses and mothers a Gyno, okdest sis a Veterinarian, middle sis a superintendent and youngest is director of dance dept at major uni in nyc. So loooonnggg list of doctors and educators. Intelligence oozes out of my family and this makes no sense to a highly educated person. Maybe reword this
Being an ex-fan and a kindof appreciator of Ben it's been nothing but amusing for me since I discovered a few years ago how different he could be when he's in public and when he's on his own youtube channel vs when he's normally having a conversation with someone from a neutral side. It's almost like he gets paid a ton to put on that uber conservative mask! What's also amusing is the fact that so few people seems to know it.
He knows where the money is. I think there are quite a few that are going where the money is. Once they talk to someone that doesn't attack them, you start to see the humanity and intelligence.
I think it's just more of the conversation aspect. When you are just giving a quick opinion, it can sound harsh or radical. When you have the opportunity to explain why and the path to the opinion you hold, it will automatically sound more reasonable. And also, the opinion itself can have layers to it. If, when, and but and the explanations that follow.
Its ironic to use "The republicans could totally become a totalitarian dictatorship" without realizing that the democrats could do exactly the same. The consolidation of power, regardless of political ideals, can create an authoritarianism. If you think your side of the isle is immune to authoritarianism, then you have already lost the argument.
I guess the difference is that the republicans are the ones who have been visibly taking steps towards fascism in a way the democrats haven't, if you don't see that truth then you've already lost cognition to the 'both-sides' grift.
So true. In the US, the Republicans and the Democrats are pushing for more authoritarianism, just with different paint jobs. People need to wake up to the left/right dichotomy scam!
Only one side of the political aisle in the US recent memory has been flaunting rule of law and calling for insurrections, denying popular vote, and has their elected president non-cooperating with central government institutions like the FBI.
Sometimes the truth isn’t moderate. You want to seem moderate so bad that when someone makes a very obvious statement about the fascist direction of the Republican Party all you can say is “iT cAn HApPeN 2 uR pArtY 2”. Sometimes a truthful opinion doesn’t cater to both sides. The Republican party is on its way towards far right authoritarianism, not the Democrat party. There is no moderate way to say that. Comments like yours merely protect dangerous political entities by causing confusion and gaslighting people into thinking “it’s both sides” rather than looking at who’s accountable. Democrats aren’t behaving like an authoritarian party, Republicans are. Destinys comment is not ironic at all, your comment just makes no sense.
@@REDDAWNproject he quite literally called into question destiny's ethical and moral stance about the word retarded. He said point blank that it makes him question his actual reason for debating and whether it's disqualifying.
@@Zren89 yeah, but the word retarded is functionally identical to the word stupid, dumb or idiot. In fact, retarded has more precedent because its still used in non-insulting contexts, both medically and technically. Lex caring about the word retarded is, in and of itself, retarded.
I feel like he was softer towards Ben than Destiny. He pushed back far harder on Destiny in their interview, perhaps because they have a pretty decent relationship.
@@gt1rso he asked destiny a question akin to “are you participating in evil?”, cmon man if you wanna say it’s a good question to ask I agree but acting like Ben Shapiro has ever said anything evil or largely provocative I feel is a bit out there
I’m a conservative and I gotta say i enjoy listening to you.. even though we disagree prob on most stuff but it’s refreshing to be able to tolerate, bit to actually enjoy it to get that different perspective so I don’t get myself in an Ecco chamber. So thanks for being a normal human lol
Two months ago I was Center-right. Now thanks to you I'm just Center. 😆 I know this doesn't sound like much, but two years ago I was a Trump supporter, I didn't believe that the election was stolen, but I didn't see anything wrong with his presidency or the insurrection, until people like you made me realize how bad it was. Never stop what you do
If you centralize power, you make a small group of people much more powerful. Small groups of people are easier to corrupt than large groups of people.
Destiny comes the closest to objective thought on the internet *I think*. I suppose a lot of people would object to that but I appreciate the way he breaks things down. He doesn't try to force a political opinion every time he can, but tends to just point out his thoughts or explain his reasoning based on whats in front of him. I also mega appreciate his willingness to talk with and listen to anyone, the same reason I like lex so much.
@@its_a_ducky3467 Yeah.. it's tough when you see these echo chambers on both side. This bias addition of political garbage, makes people act differently. When they are brought out of their "Brand" and made to talk reasonably... some actual discussion can get done. I like how Lex, brings out the good in people (oopps Kanye lol) and they want to talk. We all could learn more from this. The Lex Podcast is the way Joe Rogans podcast should be.
For the dude who called in around 28:00 mark... that's why you shouldn't debate with the goal of winning; you should debate with the goal of finding truth.
I am so confused, the timestamp says it was Lex Friedman who called in and yet he doesn't seem like Lex, nor are the people reacting to him like they would to Lex.
Hmm I feel Desiny should review the lead up to the Hitler taking power. The far right and left "working together" is way too oversimplified. They had the same enemy (government) but were against each other. It was more like a triangle of left, right and center all wresting for power and trying to use each other to bring down the faction that was the strongest at the particular time.
In fact the left parties were the only ones standing up to the NSDAP. The two left parties were the first to get banned and put into concentration camps for their opposition.
It's not oversimplified, it's just dead wrong. Communists and Nazis were murdering each other in the streets prior to the Nazis assuming power, Destiny is just trying to paint all non-liberals as "the same" for rhetorical purposes, they aren't the same at all.
Yeah, they both saw each other as ideological enemies and used each other whenever it was possible. The KPD worked with the Nazis against the SDP and the KPD would also work together with the SDP against the nazis. It was whatever floated their boat at the moment.
The reality is that, the far right and far left in the early 20th century was a false dialectic. They were by no means opposites. If you look back on the dozens of examples, it turns out, they both were pretty efficient wrecking balls for classical liberalism and conservatism, whether they are "correct" or not. They absolutely were allied early on. Just one example off the top of my head (among many others) would be socialized medicine. Fascists and communists are in complete agreement on the issue. They may have different names and titles, one man's "czar" is another man's "CEO of a cartelized/monopolized industry". If a democratic vote for state control of healthcare was on the table, the most enthusiastic communists would be in line with the fascists, against liberals and feudalistic classical conservatives.
@@jaymatthews9324 There was no "classical liberalism" you had the Christian Conservative wing the semi Royalist wing the Social Democratic Party the Communist party and the Nazis. " If a democratic vote for state control of healthcare was on the table, the most enthusiastic communists would be in line with the fascists, against liberals and feudalistic classical conservatives." Not really the Nazis were against a state controlled healthcare as the left parties wanted it, you are just wrong on that point, but even if they had voted on the same side on such issues that does not show that they were the same or didn't hate each other. Democrats and Republicans voted for pandemic aid but that does not mean that they are allied. And both voting together on socialized medicine would not make them allies in the atrocities that the Nazis are despised for. Those atrocities came about because of authoritarian nationalism. Pretty much non of what you wrote is factually correct or even follows from your argument.
@@jmadluck He was pretty wrong about the fascists and the communists “teaming up” in pre-Nazi Germany to topple liberalism. There may have been a handful of conspiring actors here and there, but in general the fascists and communists hated each other and were not in any way collaborating together.
@@jmadluck The part about extreme left and extreme right working together for the most part. I don't know how to say this, but Shapiro comes from a line of Jews that take their identity VERY SERIOUSLY (which explains his radical pro-israel bias). Stuff about Pre and Post Hitler Germany is usually studied and referenced in families like this in almost the same way the Torah is read on the Sabbath. If you know anyone like that, it's very very hard to win an argument against them about any of the time periods that led to and directly followed mass Jewish persecution.
@@jmadluck i don’t think there would be much debate… Destiny would concede that he doesn’t know nearly as much history and therefore wouldn’t make claims without a solid foundation. He wasn’t “wrong” or asserting anything illogical here, for far very same reason
Shapiro: here is a point to the question. Destiny: *pause* yes but there is also another side to that subject. *Play* Shapiro: and also the same point destiny talked about.
Honestly, the talking head culpability for violent acts absent calls to violence is a blind spot for Destiny. He says he's the only one saying this, but maybe there's a reason for that. No longer making Yasuo carry jokes is a bit different than discontinuing all speech about political issues simply because someone somewhere could take something you mean out of context or through an irrational lens.
he's ignoring the option of letting his enemies control him and his opinions someone can shoot a maga supporter while yelling subscribe to destiny and destiny would have to go soft on trump according to what he said in this video
Agree, it's a pretty ridiculous take. The "actual incitement to violence" take is probably too narrow too. I'd use more of a "natural consequences" analysis. January 6 is a good example. I'm a lifelong Republican who believes that the January 6th invasion of the Capitol Building was a natural consequence of Trump's behavior and rhetoric leading up to it. If you spend two months trying to convince your followers that the election is literally being stolen, how can you be surprised when they respond the way patriots would respond if an election was in fact being stolen? That crowd thought they were the heroes because they believed lies. If the lies were actually true, it's not hard to see their actions as justified. And despite the Democrats and the media alleging to the contrary, Trump never directly incited anyone to violence. I'd still say he gets most of the blame.
43:56 Ben's right though, for exactly THIS reason. The way we speak or joke with each other should NEVER be dictated by the actions of crazy people. End of story.
Yeah but what if they aren't crazy though? Like in 1930s Germany, millions of regular people were convinced to participate in some capacity in wars of conquest and genocide of Jews and Gypsies. Obviously I'm using the extreme example but the point is that rational people can be convinced to do think and do pretty awful things when they're given the right worldview.
@@krombopulos_michael The vast majority of that was self preservation or people "just doing their jobs." But even if that wasn't the case, I'd rather deal with the dangers and consequences of free speech than the dangers and consequences of having some authoritarian force dictate what we can or cannot say.
While it’s nice that Ben stated that here, he still runs a show and a network where that’s largely their bread and butter. When it’s a means to and end for his business and political motives… he’s willing to drop that from his value system.
@@wanded when did I say he did that? I said his programming does what he hypocritically (but correctly) stated - paraphrased by OP - that the way we perceive and treat each other should never be dictated by the actions of crazy people. Ben makes a living riling up his viewers about “the leftist agenda” that he concocts by searching out the craziest of takes, and by uncharitably and maliciously reframing normal actions or statements into insane positions that no one actually believes.
That wasn't Shapiro's argument. His argument was, because the power was centralized, any bad guy that got in would have all that power to do bad things. It was not that the centralized nature of the government allowed Hitler to get in, but it did make it easier. Essentially because the stakes for who controlled that seat was higher, this heightened tensions in part between the Reds and the Browns. It was not the only thing that heightened the tensions. You have essentially maximized a nuance point to argue against. This is called chasing windmills.
I wish destiny was as well read as Ben on topics so he didn’t have to be so speculative. I feel mislead as he makes so many arguments after establishing he may not know critical info on the topic. Example: govt wasn’t centralized in nazi germany until act that allowed Chancellory to disregard parliament. It’s fairly trivial that power had to be centralized before that in order for the act to be passed in the first place.
It's all the process of learning. You can't know everything about every topic. You can try to be well informed, but a good scientist is always updating as soon as new data comes in. Also it's important to be able to admit when you are wrong and correct it. He seems to try to do both.
@@spacepirat4028 said _"I agree. I just don't like how he chooses to disagree on topics after declaring he isn't well informed on them."_ Yeah haha me as well! It's annoying!! BUT it's sorta how you create a good way to figure something out. Let's say you don't know much about something. Make your declaration right now, say it in stone.... and when you make those claims, talk too and pull in as much alternate information as possible. You have to declare to everyone what your position is right away and then change it as people prove you wrong. So yeah, it's annoying because he could be very wrong about something, but he will definitely end up correcting it over time. It's a good way to do things at the highest level... Merry almost xmas man!!
Would love to see destiny debate a Japanese national. I feel that Japan being a collectivist society is something that would make for good entertainment and to see his perspective on how a different society lives juxtaposed to how we live in America as an individualist society.
I read that as Japanese nationalist and all I thought was "oh man, you do not want that, those dudes are like the political equivalent of football hooligans."
@@theprophet9428 we are an individualist society and they are a collectivist society. Japanese nationals are die hard all about Japan do that's what the debate would be about.
2:08:00 Lex about Ukraine "the only way to achieve peace is through like, honest human-to-human conversation" such a simplistic understanding of why countries go to war in the first place. If either country isn't ready to propose a peace, the 'only way to achieve peace' is to.. keep fighting until they are. literally. the 'honest human-to-human conversation' ended when Russia invaded.
Not really. The reason why Russia went into the war with Ukraine is because putin thought he will pull a quick ez bloodless Crimea stunt because Ukraine would fall apart like a piecec of wet paper and get an easy political victory for him. That west wouldn't care to support it, to put hard sanctions, that Ukrainian army incapable of effective defense, that there is enough political pro-Russian power in Ukraine to overthrow current government during the chaos of invasion etc. Now he needs to get the fuck out from his war. If he new how it will going to end up, he would never start the war. So, it's matter of the giving the opportunity to find a way out for both Ukrainian government by finding a scapegoat and for putin. And because most Russian actions currently controled singlehandedly by him, one on one talks can be Really influential. Kinda like with Saudi Arabia the whole alliance between US and SA started because president and a monarch had things to make bonds on.
@@rutvin8763 I Like that about him though. There are enough people not seeing the worth of interactions between people. Positive bias instead of negative is in this case good I think
@@tsjamas sounds nice in principle, but in practice, if Ukraine and Russia were to enter into a ceasefire to negotiate right now, it would only buy Russia time to resupply and regroup. Ukraine has the momentum and they shouldn't waste it
Destiny's characterization of Communists and Nazis being allies in Weimar Germany before the Nazis assumed power is a severe distortion. (I can't help but notice that it also suits his views of contemporary politics very well: liberals vs extremes from both sides.) The reality is a lot more complex than he presents it and I strongly encourage everybody to read some actual history and not trust the reductive views of a professional video game player.
@@gyytgy3330 I can't believe that after listening to him actually talk about literally anything lol. He's a lefty with fake conservative opinions on economics that he constantly contradicts
Thanks. I was hoping that someone said something about the complexity of post WWI Germany. I don't blame him for getting off point on the history. It is very confusing. His explanations are quite simplistic, but then Ben Shapiro is just as messed up in his history.
Does Destiny know anything about the actions the social-democratic government took during unrest in Weimar Germany at the time? Painting it as "liberalism (the social democrats)" against "illiberalism (nazis + communists together)" isn't accurate. Political opportunism during the Weimar period was prevalent among the social democrats, the communists, and the Nazis, there was no organized alliance of any kind whatsoever between the leaders of the KPD and NSDAP against the SPD. The Social Democrats initially took power and immediately hired the Freikorps (a far-right paramilitary, many members later joined the NSDAP) to violently crush socialist protests across the country. Police forces in SPD-run cities regularly, violently broke up communist protests and caused mass casualties. Why does the onus only fall on the KPD to ally with the SPD but there's no onus on the liberals in the SPD to extend any kind of olive branch to the communists? To just say "the KPD didn't want to work the SPD because they were libs" is so ahistorical and politically-motivated it's ridiculous. Obviously the KPD made mistakes, the "social fascists" line of the Communist International regarding social democrats was also ridiculous, but Destiny seems to have little-to-no knowledge about the SPD government or how it governed. He just says "they supported liberalism" and leaves it there. They supported maintaining their own position in power and many SPD politicians took pretty extreme actions to that end, like many politicians do unfortunately. The SPD and KPD both could have taken more constructive actions to prioritize forming a necessary electoral alliance against the NSDAP. Putting it on one party seems very dishonest.
He is an american carpet cleaner turned political streamer. That should answer you everything, right there. The "liberalism" lense is the american part, they love that category nowadays, while (no offense) the ([implied] not) _"know anything"_ part is the carpet cleaner turned streamer... I'd bet he never touched a textbook of any serious historian... or any textbook whatsoever. Most of his *"knowledge"* comes from other internet people and articles he finds online through a 2 minute google search. That said I still think: *_"Even a blind chicken finds a grain"_* ! Sometimes he got interesting viewpoints on social topics that I didn't consider and maybe want to further engage in. But to think Destiny got his facts and theories straight is very dangerous...... for anybody..
Destiny and Ben could have an extremely productive conversation. Or not. Depends on how they both approach it. If they approach it as a debate probably not. If they approach it as a conversation and allow eachother to flesh out idea's without trying to play the "gotcha" game it could be extremely positive. Hope to see that one day. I believe we need intelligent reasonable people on both sides having good faith discussions. It's the only way we ever find common ground. Especially on contentious issues.
@@xraceboyex Because Destiny can at least concede a point. Maybe not every time he should. But fundamentally disagreeing with Destiny on a lot didn't stop me from admitting some good points he made. Aswell as being pleasantly suprised with him checking himself whenever he got too snarky or made an assumption about Ben or Jordan Peterson he clarified he was wrong and shouldn't do that. It allows Destiny to challenge their true idea's or at least as fair of a representation as someone on the opposite side can give. That's a lot more than a LOT of people on both sides of any debate do. At least from what I have seen in recent times. If I was watching a summary from someone who hated Destiny I am sure they would exclude the parts where he corrects himself and only keep the criticism in. I hate that shit. I don't want to argue against ghosts. Both sides do that shit endlessly. Don't tell me the worst version of what you think someone's underlying agenda is.. tell me what they say their agenda is. Everyone is arguing against the Bogeyman. I just want to see honest, good faith conversations. Genuinely. I always have so much respect for it when I see it.
@@indianacones5815 Fair point, I've let the temptation of taking jabs at Destiny being a girl's name make me stray from objectivity. Touché, and Kudos.
@@xraceboyex Kudos to you brother. Destiny is a girls name. It's funny to laugh at. He may have the forearm density of dry pasta but the dude is at least somewhat fair in his criticisms and arguments. I can respect that. Even if I would rather have a well built 12 year old on my side over Destiny if the shit ever hit the fan. l
It’s just the loud ass red pill guys that talk like that about their wife and some right leaning ppl, but every republican I know and meet have a normal relationship with their spouse or the idea if they’re not married/dating. Both add very important value and both combine to be better or overcome obstacles. I dislike the whole “women stay in the kitchen and shut up” crap. It says how much they don’t know about relationships and coming together.
If Lex worked in AI he definitely has experience dealing with contractors. Anybody who works in IT works with contractors all the time and knows how they got hired. It's an industry based on trust a lot of times, and I've seen many people get burned on bad contractors because they sounded good on paper but couldn't deliver.
For someone who was born in Russia, Lex is quite soy about "slurs/hateful comments" I mean russian ppl I have played with are pretty toxic, so I kinda expect ppl coming from russia have lot more tolerance about general language due to their very straight forward culture? Am I wrong about this?
An individual should not be solely characterized by the country in which they are born in, and stereotypes associated with those descending from said country.
Hi, I'm a history graduate, and Ben Shapiro's understanding of Hitler's rise to power and the centralisation of power was almost entirely correct, except for the small misspeak in saying that power was centralised in the Chancellory, rather than the Presidency under Hindenburg.
Shapiro was saying that because of the fighting between the reds and browns it led to more and more extreme views on each side, so that when one of them eventually took power it was inevitable that they would be the most radical version of either side, something we could learn here in the US
One needs to ask in turn, though, whether the risk of a more extreme opponent down the line is worth caving to whatever current enemy exists now. I'd argue emphatically that the republicans under trump, desantis, etc, are already too far gone and too willing to just keep escalating to reach that miracle-middle ground you're hinting at.
@@sythersight congrats, you're engaging in dehumanizing language as a result, helping prove the claim true "Too far gone".. for what? Treating them like human beings w/ agency + autonomy instead of evil demons? Nah, I don't think so
I kind of agree when it comes to Destiny’s takes on the laptop stuff. I recommend watching that vid where Pisco came on to talk about censorship and the topic came up for more insight on his view of the whole thing.
@@testcase6997 It being his and having content politically harmful to his father, quite obvious really. I guess Destiny thinks CNN saying it bears all the signs of a Russian disinfo operation means there was no media blackout.
@@testcase6997 I don't have a conspiracy. I don't even understand what you are on about. There was a story that was bad for Biden and it was suppressed. Any attempt to deny that is cope.
One simply can't criticise Ye, while absolving onesself of any responsibility whatsoever, that's the problem here. By Shapiro's logic, there's nothing wrong with Ye's comments, since he isn't responsible for what people make of it, e.g. antisemiticly motivated crime.
@@matt_9112 What Shapiro (and many others) are conveying is that pinning motivated acts of violence on rhetoric that does not call for violence is misplaced blame. Shapiro disagrees with Ye’s comments because they are antisemitic, completely divorced from what sentiments they may or may not inspire. I do not necessarily agree with Destiny or Shapiro on this. Taking such a high degree of responsibility or taking no responsibility both seem wrong.
It’s not so complicated. People are only RESPONSIBLE for what they actually say. So if some lunatic takes what Shapiro or Bernie Sanders has said and decides to commit violence, that person is solely responsible. This assumes whatever was said wasn’t an explicit call for violence. But the speaker is responsible for examining whether or not what they said was well communicated. Whether they could’ve done a better job making sure the people that listen to them are not seeing the opposition as dehumanized. That is a personal responsibility that should be embraced. It’s not something we get to impose upon them.
A good rule is the larger the platform the less extreme your rhetoric should be. It’s very hard because the financial incentive is always to be more extreme. Destiny is running into this problem when he speaks to bigger and more extreme political content creators.
@@sheridan891 No, I disagree, everyone is responsible for the consequences of their actions. if someone participates in the spread of propaganda designed to dehumanize people in the eyes of their audience, to convince that audience to view those people as a real existential threat that must be stopped, dishonestly fear mongering for a political game, they absolutely do hold responsibility for members of their audience taking them seriously and acting drastically on that information. People find this inconvenient to acknowledge, and so they hand wave it by calling the perpetrators of the crimes mentally ill and solely responsible for their drastic actions, nobody wants to acknowledge the inflammatory media that preyed on their emotions and fears day after day for years, giving them an enemy to hate and stoking that feeling because that's the political media's hook for views, but shit adds up. This kind of behavior shouldn't be acceptable to anyone, dishonest use of propaganda to stoke animosity has serious consequences, and it should be ridiculed, even when your side is doing it. There is no worthwhile message that needs to be conveyed in such a way.
Thanks Destiny, this is not at all a main point of covering this interview, but this is what my dumbass needed to hear to uninstall Reddit from my phone.
Isn't it interesting that Shapiro references sociological reasons for jews to be in Hollywood, law firms, etc but refuses to give that kind of analysis to systematic oppression of black people?
He will blame the welfare state for the destruction of the black family. But he won't call it systemic racism, and he also doesn't really talk about the drug war as a factor.
@jessie6600 First of all, Ben should be smart enough to know that laws don't have to be explicitly racist for the system to be racist, but he has an agenda, so he won't talk about that. Also, I'm pretty sure he believes that Johnson designed the Great Society to damage black families. At the very least he believes that was the effect of those programs. How he can believe systemic racism doesn't exist while simultaneously believing a system had racist results is beyond me. It's like he takes the concept personally.
@jessie6600 except we can prove current racism enshrined in legal and economic systems. There's massive discrepancies in the black population compared to other races and its objectively true that its a consequence of these systems. Also the idea that there would not be ripple effects from legal discrimination that existed in our grandparents lifetimes is extremely stupid
@jessie6600 well no, that's a stupid idea. The government fucked the black population, it's their job to fix it. And it's literally only been a generation since segregation, the idea that this is black people whinning is ridiculous. We can draw a direct line from those policies to the problems of today. This isn't speculation, it's objective fact. This isn't black people complaining about life just general being hard based on class struggle, we never solved the problems that resulted from segregation
@jessie6600 Lots of infrastructure investment. This idea that reversing the laws and doing nothing else is all the government is required to do is absolutely retarded
"Grilling" is definitely not the term I would use. I think Lex could have talked about his lack of empathy towards trans and LGBT people in general. Maybe his position on conversation therapy. This was just promo for Ben. I feel like Lex was a lot more investigative in his interview with Destiny.
Yeah, grilled my ass. He said nothing in response to Ben's disingenuous response to the question of whether or not he sympathizes with the plight of the Palestinians. "How do you cope with the all online hate?" Like really?
This is essentially just Destiny looking for things to disagree with Ben on even when Ben is being extremely moderate lol dawg quit being so contrarian for no reason
There’s no argument for Kanye being driven by Jew hatred. It’s hardly worth considering. I’d say mental health aside, and billionaire-ego aside, he’s driven by curiosity and rebellion. Even most Fuentes types are driven by some normy human force, like wanting to be part of a movement. And if having a common enemy in progressives or Jews or Neocons brings them solidarity and adds to the epic narrative in which they’re protagonists, then they will accept it and enjoy the serotonin boost frankly.
No argument? I can’t tell if I agree or disagree by your wording. “No argument “ as in it should be so obvious it’s undisputed? OR, what it seems like you’re actually saying is that the argument is bunk. I think there’s an argument. It comes from his lived experience in the record industry, a very juvenile processing of that experience by jumping from the corrupt record industry to Jews simply based on over representation, and the curiosity that you mentioned (initially him just “asking questions”) making him a perfect pawn for extreme and anti-semetic right wingers, and he’s fully bought into it. His current drive is literally targeting Jews. How he got there is part what you said, and part the additional aspects I mentioned.
You can’t put mental health aside. He thinks Jewish people are after him to steal his money. He thinks his personal trainer (who seems like a dick tbf) was trying to MKULTRA him. He’s got paranoid delusions behind his Jew hatred. Curiosity and rebellion isn’t even part of it, though he probably thinks he’s rebelling against his paranoid delusions.
there won't be a winner, they'll just autism around each others points and baits until the time runs out take their disagreement on bidens speech for example, there is no "fact" or logic that can decide that one, it's pure interpretation
Destiny’s position on slavery isn’t totally ridiculous. I recall Dylan Burns having a similar position. I think a point of contention would be how both groups were ultimately treated. Chattel slaves in antebellum had no history, no family structure and were forbade literacy. The Jews were at least given the opportunity to leave their country (though few were able to do so) and retain their heritage. Not to mention, an entire generation of people died just crossing over the Atlantic. So just talking death toll and human cost isn’t really the push here.
If this was his most dishonest self, then he must be the most honest person on the Internet/ politics. I think Him even giving this much airtime to his opponents cries out Honesty; dishonest ppl would rather use 30 sec clips to show their audiences, OR not engage at all.
I have a new found respect for Ben Shapiro after this conversation and review by Destiny. It’s absolutely hilarious that anyone publicly claims he is “far right” meaning “alt right” or “fascist”. Never been more glad to have abandoned Vaush content. Lessoned my intake around the Rittenhouse debate and completely stopped after he categorized Bush W was a “fascist”. I swear some of these mid twenty something online “philosophers” have never read anything other than queer theory and have not consumed anything visually outside of furry anime fan fiction. Have never existed outside the queer bars or indie coffee shops of Portland/ Seattle.
He is, the gist of fascist ideology is around the demonization of minorities and those who are vulnerable, subservience to figures of authority, and appeal to traditional values. Ben Shapiro in the year 2022 is against gay folks having the same right as heterosexual folks of being able to establish a civil union through the state, the fact that you're trying to whitewash this monster when gay folks are being gunned down because they're being dehumanized by this people is a clear lack of perspective. Imagine writing a comment criticizing Vaush for abusing categorizing his opponents to defend Ben Shappiro who calls everyone "communists" and blames everything on "liberals" "the left" "fascist left" etc, you're clearly being brainwashed and completely ignoring who ben shapiro ACTUALLY is. For god's sake, these are the ACTUAL title of his books: Porn Generation: How Social Liberalism Is Corrupting Our Future. Regnery (2005). ISBN 0-89526016-6. Primetime Propaganda: The True Hollywood Story of How the Left Took Over Your TV. HarperCollins (2011). Bullies: How the Left's Culture of Fear and Intimidation Silences America. Threshold Editions The Authoritarian Moment: How the Left Weaponized America's Institutions Against Dissent. Stop alienating yourself.
@@phanomtaxskibididoodoo "far-right" now is just adopting ONE evershifting talking point they don't like. Like abortion, guns, landlords, etc. Like one can be the biggest tree-hugging hippie, planting trees on the weekend, growing "trees" in their house. Trying to be vegan, is all about free love and living off the grid. Yet they're distrustful of the government and have guns out the ass. Boom they're a "fascist" to some idiots.
@@ExeErdna No its not and you'd have to either be delusional, a reactionary who's political knowledge consists of cringe feminists getting owned or an actual far righter trying to muddy the definition to actually say that.
I wish content creators would just shut up about history if they aren't willing to spend time to learn and present a somewhat complete and accurate picture and that goes very much so for everyone involved here.
you didn't finish your statement. you want people to spend time to learn and present a somewhat complete and accurate picture *to you*. stop pounding your historical virtue drums, and share how your takes on historical facts are different... although it is easier to just berate the things and people we don't like, isn't it?
@@grizzly311tr Not OP, and I only agree with his take in so far that especially Destiny should be a little more careful with his „facts“. Shapiro was honestly really impressive, the only major mistake was calling von Papen a democrat; he was a monarchist and wanted to abolish the republic. Destiny’s take on KPD and NSDAP working together was a way to simplistic. They did kinda work together occasionally (e.g. a strike in Berlin or voting for the dissolution an SPD-led government in Prussia), but they were still sworn enemies and were fighting and killing each other in the streets way before the Nazis came to power. The parallels to modern day politics are definitely there, however. In 1929, the KPD decided that social democrats were nothing but a different brand of fascists (Sozialfaschisten) - everyone is a fascist, does that ring a bell? Also, the establishment was not necessarily liberal; a ton of industrialists, landowners, and especially nobles and militarily leaders were monarchists. Edit: tbf, Destiny acknowledged that the occasionally fought each other but that they both had the goal to incite a revolution, obviously with diametrically opposed visions. I think he just overemphasized their collaboration and downplayed the constant clashes of their paramilitaristic troops.
Destiny has come off as seriously uninformed on some of these latest political videos. To act like the Trump middle east deals were not great accomplishments is absurd. Also, to a claim he made elsewhere (i think with nuancebro), the people pushing the vaccine were absolutely saying that they would stop the spread and saying otherwise is just the highest degree of gas lighting.
Alright name them. Heck I'll even start with a failure for you to counter. Killing the Iran deal, with Iran now trying to get nuclear weapons was a massive mistake
@@HucklePeel the Abraham accords You do realize the Iran deal only placed temporary limits on Iran developing nuclear weaponry. Significant clauses of the deal would sunset in 2025 and 2030.
It’s getting harder to criticize anyone as more protected classes of people emerge. Label all of these classes as victims of this or that …. Well, you can’t possibly ever blame victims for ANYTHING which in turn protects that protected class from any fundamental accountability about ANYTHING
Although it’s been about 20 years and we’re already joking about 9/11 so personally I think there shouldn’t be protected classes at all. It’s so silly.
@@theprophet9428 No, black tragedy is more recent because it's been more recently revisited, and black people have more incentive to victimize themselves as a means of protection. We are supposed to care about black people more than Jews because Jews have become successful in the last hundred years.
I think it is absolutely fascinating that Ben has absolutely no problem saying "Ye" instead of Kanye after Ye changed his name. It's almost like he knows how to respect when people change their names or something, interesting
Have you ever heard of his private stance and public stance on political issues? His private stance is to respect someone's wishes to be referred to by a different name. His public stance is he shouldn't be forced to. As far as trans in general, he definitely doesn't agree with the procedure, but I'm never heard him say a consenting adult can't do the surgery and hormone therapy.
Foolish. Whatever you think of the pronoun debate, those terms refer to categories of people. Ye is literally just a shortened version of Kanye’s name.
@@misantropology Nope. His legal name is Ye. I'm not talking about pronouns, we only use those in the 3rd person. I'm talking about changed named. Ye legally is his name, he had it legally changed it isn't Kanye anymore.
Conservatives screaming "corruption" about Hunter being hired as a counselor/board member despite not having any qualifications, but not speaking a word when Trump ONLY staffed people whose only qualifications were that they were well-connected donors (betsy devos, louis dejoy, his own children, scaramouchi, etc etc etc) who have little to no qualifications for the positions they were placed in have me shaking my head every damn day
well considering he campaigned as an outsider, and not as traditional politician, an easy explanation was that he filled those positions with people he thought he could trust to get the job done.
@@kurolap7882 and he failed to do even that. Everyone i mentioned had demonstrably negative and even destructive impacts on the fields in which they were in charge of. I'm so tired of people making excuses for that traitor's obvious nepotism/corruption
3:48:00 the love conversation: That is why we have 2 words in Dutch that both translate into love in English. 'Houden van', meaning the love for family and close friends and 'lief hebben' a more tame word used to refer to someone you like to be around/respect
Gotta disagree with Destiny's sentiment that Shapiro's views have "changed" for the better. His views have stayed relatively the same throughout his career from what i've seen, anyways good video.
@@broken_abi6973 His take on Palestinians...hasn't changed? The guy's a Jew himself what can you expect? Am I supposed to be upset at the Jewish communities take as a whole, as their sentiments on Palestine is pretty universal...not that I care regardless as I'm not hebrew...so moot point to begin with I guess?
2:30:00 To be fair I think Shapiro is just more naturally inclined to this type of life style (low neuroticism, high consciousness) so I don’t imagine his advice would be as valuable to someone who really struggles just to get out of bed, though that is very presumptuous.
Destiny: Does Poland even have an air force? No destiny. Poland definitely doesn't have an air force. They were useful enough to be accepted into NATO, but they jusy havent figured out how to fly planes, yet..
The issue with the “responsibility as an influence” perspective destiny maintains is primarily the extent to which it can be applied and when it does get applied. For ex. If you were to consistently apply it you would force blame onto Islam for suicide bombers. The point is that I personally don’t want to take what is primarily intended otherwise to a domain of responsibility when that’s not the intent. If the intent isn’t to do such, then it’s fairly pointless to assign blame because an individual can misinterpret any perspective in a twisted way. I also question the extent to which an influence can change the individual given information readily available otherwise. Primarily that even if Ben Shapiro did not exist, if that individual wanted information to fuel an anti Muslim narrative, there are not only better, but more extreme sources to retrieve it from. Hell even the more objective sources, when incorrectly interpreted, can be used to fuel that perspective which is why I can’t really get on board with this method of influencer blaming
as someone who identifies as a democrat, I found myself agreeing with Shapiro on many items. I’ve got a lot more respect for him now, assuming he was being honest and genuine.
@@Loki_Leftist is there anything you agree with Shapiro on? i would bet his positive views on Biden or his criticisms of Trump resonates with most people
@@Cybertech134 it’s the truth why would I believe a person who lies thur his teeth for a living but I’m not surprised you conservatives love when people lie to y’all
To say that the Nazis and Communists ‘worked together’ is rather misleading. Destiny seems to imply that the brown shirts happened after the Nazis took power when he talks about the importance of the timeline. The Sturmabteilung (Brown shirts) actually pre-date the existence of the Nazi party (1919… although they were not called this until 21’). When the group was formalised and aligned with Hitler they started to call themselves the SA after a speech by Hitler erupted into a brawl between Nazis and communists in 21’ and the SA proceeded to thrash them. The SA and communists would continually engage in street brawls all the way until Hitler received full control of government. This was heavily intensified after Hitler left prison in December 25’ and the SA had to be re organised to circumvent a law in Bavaria that outright banned the Nazi party and all its organisations. Hitler would not take full control of the SA until 30’, following a whole decade of Zusammenstöße (collisions) with the KDP (communists). By January 1933 as the Nazis assumed power the SA had grown to some two million members, a number twenty times as large as the number of troops and officers in the Reichswehr. These troops were used to destroy the Communist opposition during the election. After the election the Nazis proceeded to gradually imprison all their political enemies and that some individual communists collaborated to protect themselves or their families is no surprise. But here’s the real kicker. By 34’ the violence of the SA had gotten so bad (it was reported in newspapers they had stockpiled mass weapons to attempt a coup) that president Hindenberg informed Hitler that if the SA were not disbanded he would declare martial law and dissolve the government. In June of the same year Hitler proceeded to use the SS to personally arrest Ernst Röhm (who leaded the SA at this point) and all the SA’s leadership. About 200 of them, including Röhm himself, were all killed. The fact that Röhm and a number of other leaders in the SA were homosexuals was also made public to make the whole event more shocking to the German public, although Hitler and other Nazi officials had been aware of this all along. To say that Nazis and Communists worked together on any systematic level is really rather incorrect and you would be very hard pressed to find any academic source that would claim as such. Even a quick google search returns very sparse evidence (not that a google search can necessarily be called evidence). Nonetheless, a great video, I just wanted to put that out there.
At 19:00 or so, Destiny is just plainly wrong. The communists in Germany absolutely did not cooperate with the NAZIs to overthrow the liberal order. In fact, liberals that tended towards the right cooperated with the NAZIs to stop a perceived threat from socialists and communists. I say perceived because their actual popularity, especially the communists, is questionable. Destiny just doesn't understand 1920-1930s Germany. I assume he's reffering to the KPD statements and actions against the Social Democrats in the 1920s? But that story is waaayyyy more complicated than NAZI/KPD collaboration. The NAZIs were a working class party, as were KPD. Very complicated dynamics result. If he's talking about the alliance between Germany and the Soviet Union to invade Poland, he doesn't understand geopolitics, as that is also way more complicated. Bad take.
I wish our reporters were a bit more similar to British ones though. And the problem with that interview wasn’t that Ben retracted those statements, he could have kept his cool and said he regrets those statements, it’s that he got emotional and accused a famous British conservative of being on the left looking to smear him. If liberals asked liberals hard questions more, and conservative journalists did the same for their “side,” American journalism would be much better imo, not saying British journalism is anything close to ideal (I know very little about it I just know subjects complain about it about as much as we do).
@@mhballa5866 he should have said that then instead of flipping his shit and accusing a lifelong conservative of being a leftist plant trying to smear him
I don’t think he’d do very well on a panel. He’s very good at making long videos carefully explaining a point, but man he can’t debate (he even admits it himself.)
Destiny - being from Poland - no one had to convince Poland of anything. I would say , we had to convince everyone else, to help Ukraine (well to be fair - not everyone, some were more willing then others of course). At one point we even wanted to give Ukrainian army almost all of our Soviet era fighter jets and US had to intervene and stop us LOL. But Germany and France, sure - Putin Shills all the way, at least the begining.
Tough debate. Holocaust vs US slavery. Lifetime of slavery for generations. Beating, rape, cruelty across the board, deletion of cultural identity. Hmm sounds pretty similar to holocaust. Time is the biggest difference. Jews over time probably had it worse, but during holocaust the length of WW2 avg 6m vs US slave trade lasting 200 years low end 6m- high end 15m. Depends when they died alone the trip after being captured for the slave market
i honestly don't see it as a dough debate. I would hands down, easily, as would you, choose to be a slave in America then be jewish in the Holocaust. once you survived the middle passage (which, fun fact; the death rate was almost identical for the crew of the ship 17-20%) an American slave had a death rate of 1.8%, only slightly higher than white citizens at 1.2%... remember that the slave was an investment and cost alot of money. It was in the plantation owners best financial interest to look after the health of his slave as best as he could. Compare that to the what...100% of people loaded on those trains? Yeah take me to the plantation please
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Lex Fridman's interview w/ Destiny ►th-cam.com/video/bqeuFiAUU4o/w-d-xo.html
More Lex Fridman interviews ►www.youtube.com/@lexfridman
🇦🇿🇫🇮🇦🇽
13:40 was it the final straw that broke the camels back or all that came before it?
20:00 National Socialists and Communists worked together because they were both socialists. The conflict arises because Communists (Marxists) put the socialism first on a global mindset and National Socialists (Nazis) were about it but their country's supremacy is primary.
@@asskick3105 he's smart, arrogant and swerves to avoid facing the actual points his opponents make.
i thought destiny and lex are friends? why is he calling lex, lex luthor 1:41
How do I become a destiny orbiter
A Shapiro destiny debate has never seemed more plausible…
Nah shapiro would only debate media people never an independent guy like destiny
@@drywater5867 he debated Ana kasparian and cenk, I realize tyt is a bit more institutionalized than DGG but they are much closer to DGG than they are to a Andrew Neil or something
I think it's very possible that it could happen within the next 6 months.
@@toby9364 yeah but it's trying to act like traditional news
@@toby9364 also he doesn't wanna debate many people except for college students or media trained people Ana kasparian didn't go on offense as much and was extremely cordial unlike destiny and Ben will use the institution argument to avoid it if he gets confronted abt it
The ben shapiro of the left reacts to the destiny of the right, we've come full circle.
hasan of the right
@@aSSGoblin1488no that’s steven crowder
The right doesn’t have a Destiny. Ben Shapiro is the closest thing they have and even he is a coward that will only debate 18 year old morons
@@paco1022 matt walsh is vaush
The difference is that Ben Shapiro doesn't have a Maury Povich sideshow.
It's shocking how much more nuanced and fair Shapiro can be when he's not in punditry mode.
Well he still probably got the problem making his wife wet! Lol
When you only listen to ‘Shapiro dunks’ videos where he’s being antagonized by far left wing college students, why would you expect to ever see this side of him? lmao.
@@Benbones99 when you assume people’s negative interpretation must be due to bad faith sound clips, why would we acknowledge your counterpoint?
@@Benbones99 “antagonized” lol, relax
I feel like destiny is the only guy that’s so intelligent to fall victim to skewed views of people especially on the right
We need to lock Ben Shapiro and Destiny in a basement and the only way to free themselves will be to scream at each other about politics for 5 straight hours.
what if the hours isn't straight but bi, or any other gay flavor?
Have you seen the Barbarian? I won’t spoil it. But the monster in that movie is what happens if we do that lmao.
@@Voornoek In that case it would actually be 6. Sorry for being vague.
@@Bai_Su_Zhen i was joking my dude, sorry if i didn't make it obvious enough.
@@Voornoek 5 straight hours is 4 gay hours or 6.6 bi hours. Might be different now due to inflation.
I hope we are getting closer to the Destiny x Shapiro debate...
Shapiro is too smart he would never commit career suicide.
I want to see Destiny destroy Shapiro on systemic racism and LGBT issues so bad lol. God he would stomp Shapiro.
10 million words per second
@Libra Ben got destroyed by centre right Andrew Neil .I am indian and destiny would destroy Ben Shapiro but he shouldn't concede some points like he did in the Milo debate
@@VARMOT123 there is no chance that Destiny will just destroy Shapiro if he is prepared. If you saw this video, you'll see that they agree on almost everything and Shapiro lost bad against Neil because it was sold to him as a "book interview" but it was instead a grilling on Shapiro's pasr tweets, that he himself has made comments outlining how crazy he was for thiking that when he was young. You can see Destiny's comment on this on the video.
Dude, I would pay money to see Destiny debate Ben Shapiro with Lex as moderator so MUCH.
Ben won't do it.
@@VannywiththeFanny He's smart enough not to.
@@hurkamur1 Yep. Ben should just stick with debating videos that can't talk back and kids that are still in school. That's where he shines.
I like lex, I just don’t think he’d be a good moderator for Shapiro and destiny. These two will talk fast and aggressive, we would need a moderator equally as aggressive to keep the conversation productive
@@AJ-tc5iu Ben? A productive conversation? Yeah, right. That'll definitely happen.
“Limit your phone to 30 minutes a day” -produces 5 hours of content to watch a day to stay up to date on Destiny lore
If Destiny and Ben ever have a conversation they'd probably say enough within twenty minutes that two normal speaking people would in a three hour podcast. You wouldn't know where one person stops talking and the other starts.
This makes no sense. I’ve been around the world 5x 3 licenses and mothers a Gyno, okdest sis a Veterinarian, middle sis a superintendent and youngest is director of dance dept at major uni in nyc. So loooonnggg list of doctors and educators. Intelligence oozes out of my family and this makes no sense to a highly educated person.
Maybe reword this
@@hoopslaa5235 they're both really fast talkers. Maybe you're not as intelligent as you think man :/
@@johnlonne7062 Now it’s “Alright babe, I love you.”
It'd be like Goku vs Frieza on Namek
@@hoopslaa5235 they talk fast. you're welcome.
Did Ben say "I think you are significantly younger than me"? Lex is 39, Ben is 38. Just found that funny.
Lex is 39?? He really does seem younger than that.
Yeah. I thought he was 30-31ish.
I literally thought lex was like 30
@@jakeoswald8017 True, he does look young
Very soft, boyish voice
Being an ex-fan and a kindof appreciator of Ben it's been nothing but amusing for me since I discovered a few years ago how different he could be when he's in public and when he's on his own youtube channel vs when he's normally having a conversation with someone from a neutral side. It's almost like he gets paid a ton to put on that uber conservative mask! What's also amusing is the fact that so few people seems to know it.
He knows where the money is. I think there are quite a few that are going where the money is. Once they talk to someone that doesn't attack them, you start to see the humanity and intelligence.
I think it's just more of the conversation aspect. When you are just giving a quick opinion, it can sound harsh or radical. When you have the opportunity to explain why and the path to the opinion you hold, it will automatically sound more reasonable. And also, the opinion itself can have layers to it. If, when, and but and the explanations that follow.
@@MRGoods89 you just explained the problem with twitter
Ben Shapiro is a zionist jew, of course he would put on a mask for monetary gain.
*ding* this is the right answer, he knows where his money is.
Its ironic to use "The republicans could totally become a totalitarian dictatorship" without realizing that the democrats could do exactly the same. The consolidation of power, regardless of political ideals, can create an authoritarianism. If you think your side of the isle is immune to authoritarianism, then you have already lost the argument.
I guess the difference is that the republicans are the ones who have been visibly taking steps towards fascism in a way the democrats haven't, if you don't see that truth then you've already lost cognition to the 'both-sides' grift.
So true. In the US, the Republicans and the Democrats are pushing for more authoritarianism, just with different paint jobs. People need to wake up to the left/right dichotomy scam!
Only one side of the political aisle in the US recent memory has been flaunting rule of law and calling for insurrections, denying popular vote, and has their elected president non-cooperating with central government institutions like the FBI.
Sometimes the truth isn’t moderate. You want to seem moderate so bad that when someone makes a very obvious statement about the fascist direction of the Republican Party all you can say is “iT cAn HApPeN 2 uR pArtY 2”. Sometimes a truthful opinion doesn’t cater to both sides. The Republican party is on its way towards far right authoritarianism, not the Democrat party. There is no moderate way to say that. Comments like yours merely protect dangerous political entities by causing confusion and gaslighting people into thinking “it’s both sides” rather than looking at who’s accountable. Democrats aren’t behaving like an authoritarian party, Republicans are. Destinys comment is not ironic at all, your comment just makes no sense.
Republicans just have totalitarianism in their blood. It has to do with Christianity.
Lex to Ben "Are you participating in evil?" Lex to destiny "why arent you friends with Hassan & vaush anymore."
I love lex, but yeah, he can be biased in that regard.
@@REDDAWNproject he quite literally called into question destiny's ethical and moral stance about the word retarded. He said point blank that it makes him question his actual reason for debating and whether it's disqualifying.
@@Zren89 yeah, but the word retarded is functionally identical to the word stupid, dumb or idiot. In fact, retarded has more precedent because its still used in non-insulting contexts, both medically and technically.
Lex caring about the word retarded is, in and of itself, retarded.
I feel like he was softer towards Ben than Destiny. He pushed back far harder on Destiny in their interview, perhaps because they have a pretty decent relationship.
@@gt1rso he asked destiny a question akin to “are you participating in evil?”, cmon man if you wanna say it’s a good question to ask I agree but acting like Ben Shapiro has ever said anything evil or largely provocative I feel is a bit out there
The way that Destiny can insert a joke into a serious answer and do it 99% as dead pan as the serious comment is amazing.
One of the many powers of having a woman's name
@Ricky Smith not that deep
hes just high on xanax or something
@@superdupertyson prolly the tism
@Ricky Smith What is a NFT?
Destiny compliments Ben's perspective on his wife's active role in their relationship, meanwhile...
Oddly enough and destiny would contribute to this that his wife actually does help him a lot
@@nikolastiscareno4963 I think that was a cuck joke.
@@Thedamped yeah I know but I’m just making a comment because the joke is a good one and made me think of this
@@nikolastiscareno4963 Oh I see I guess I didn't get your comment, sorry.
I’m a conservative and I gotta say i enjoy listening to you.. even though we disagree prob on most stuff but it’s refreshing to be able to tolerate, bit to actually enjoy it to get that different perspective so I don’t get myself in an Ecco chamber. So thanks for being a normal human lol
The holocaust was a tragedy.
Same here! I’m very conservative and really enjoy listening to opposing viewpoints. It’s refreshing and a challenge!
Destiny is the only youtube person on the left I find worth listening to. Seriously. His thinking is sound, even if I disagree on some points.
What do you disagree with him on?
Couldn't have said it better.
Ben: mentions hunter biden story
Destiny: *has anxiety attack*
LOL!
Two months ago I was Center-right. Now thanks to you I'm just Center. 😆 I know this doesn't sound like much, but two years ago I was a Trump supporter, I didn't believe that the election was stolen, but I didn't see anything wrong with his presidency or the insurrection, until people like you made me realize how bad it was. Never stop what you do
Keep growing king
It wasn't a big deal and Destiny isn't gay so don't simp so hard beta
@@coopcoo he's pretty gay
How was Trumps presidency bad again?
Nice, rationality for the win
Jumping into someone’s discord to talk to them when they’re live reacting to something like this is WILD
The fact that you’re in discord in a non private channel where anyone can jump in and interrupt is wild.
If you centralize power, you make a small group of people much more powerful.
Small groups of people are easier to corrupt than large groups of people.
Are certain centralized forms of governance more or less pervious to corruption than others, say democratic vs. undemocratic for example?
@@benetekal1041 Democratic can be corrupted. Undemocratic is just working as intended
Remember when destiny said he wouldnt talk about history because he knows nothing about it? He forgot about that
My guess would be that now he's better read.
@@JCDGAMING01 clearly not
@@Shad0wack which part did he get wrong
😂
@@Totherphoenix he wont say
I’ve been loving all the content recently, it seems like Destiny is just getting better and better.
are you a bot
Destiny comes the closest to objective thought on the internet *I think*. I suppose a lot of people would object to that but I appreciate the way he breaks things down. He doesn't try to force a political opinion every time he can, but tends to just point out his thoughts or explain his reasoning based on whats in front of him.
I also mega appreciate his willingness to talk with and listen to anyone, the same reason I like lex so much.
@@its_a_ducky3467 Yeah.. it's tough when you see these echo chambers on both side. This bias addition of political garbage, makes people act differently. When they are brought out of their "Brand" and made to talk reasonably... some actual discussion can get done.
I like how Lex, brings out the good in people (oopps Kanye lol) and they want to talk. We all could learn more from this. The Lex Podcast is the way Joe Rogans podcast should be.
For the dude who called in around 28:00 mark... that's why you shouldn't debate with the goal of winning; you should debate with the goal of finding truth.
Exactly. Refusal to acknowledge the truth is never a good approach.
I am so confused, the timestamp says it was Lex Friedman who called in and yet he doesn't seem like Lex, nor are the people reacting to him like they would to Lex.
@@kubba007 the timestamp is referring to lex donating on stream to say that he's watching. The caller is some random dude
The caller is ShortFatOtaku
Well said
Is this as close as we are going to get to a Ben and destiny debate
maybe if lex moderates and its hosted in israel.
ben will enjoy the trip with his family.
steven and melina will enjoy the israelites
Shapiro will not debate anyone who would take apart his strawmen.
Hmm I feel Desiny should review the lead up to the Hitler taking power. The far right and left "working together" is way too oversimplified. They had the same enemy (government) but were against each other. It was more like a triangle of left, right and center all wresting for power and trying to use each other to bring down the faction that was the strongest at the particular time.
In fact the left parties were the only ones standing up to the NSDAP. The two left parties were the first to get banned and put into concentration camps for their opposition.
It's not oversimplified, it's just dead wrong. Communists and Nazis were murdering each other in the streets prior to the Nazis assuming power, Destiny is just trying to paint all non-liberals as "the same" for rhetorical purposes, they aren't the same at all.
Yeah, they both saw each other as ideological enemies and used each other whenever it was possible. The KPD worked with the Nazis against the SDP and the KPD would also work together with the SDP against the nazis. It was whatever floated their boat at the moment.
The reality is that, the far right and far left in the early 20th century was a false dialectic. They were by no means opposites. If you look back on the dozens of examples, it turns out, they both were pretty efficient wrecking balls for classical liberalism and conservatism, whether they are "correct" or not. They absolutely were allied early on. Just one example off the top of my head (among many others) would be socialized medicine. Fascists and communists are in complete agreement on the issue. They may have different names and titles, one man's "czar" is another man's "CEO of a cartelized/monopolized industry". If a democratic vote for state control of healthcare was on the table, the most enthusiastic communists would be in line with the fascists, against liberals and feudalistic classical conservatives.
@@jaymatthews9324 There was no "classical liberalism" you had the Christian Conservative wing the semi Royalist wing the Social Democratic Party the Communist party and the Nazis. " If a democratic vote for state control of healthcare was on the table, the most enthusiastic communists would be in line with the fascists, against liberals and feudalistic classical conservatives." Not really the Nazis were against a state controlled healthcare as the left parties wanted it, you are just wrong on that point, but even if they had voted on the same side on such issues that does not show that they were the same or didn't hate each other. Democrats and Republicans voted for pandemic aid but that does not mean that they are allied. And both voting together on socialized medicine would not make them allies in the atrocities that the Nazis are despised for. Those atrocities came about because of authoritarian nationalism. Pretty much non of what you wrote is factually correct or even follows from your argument.
What I have learned from this is that if Ben and Destiny ever have a debate about pre nazi germany, Destiny is fucked
What was destiny wrong about?
@@jmadluck He was pretty wrong about the fascists and the communists “teaming up” in pre-Nazi Germany to topple liberalism. There may have been a handful of conspiring actors here and there, but in general the fascists and communists hated each other and were not in any way collaborating together.
I feel like he would do his due diligence if that was the debate topic
@@jmadluck The part about extreme left and extreme right working together for the most part. I don't know how to say this, but Shapiro comes from a line of Jews that take their identity VERY SERIOUSLY (which explains his radical pro-israel bias). Stuff about Pre and Post Hitler Germany is usually studied and referenced in families like this in almost the same way the Torah is read on the Sabbath. If you know anyone like that, it's very very hard to win an argument against them about any of the time periods that led to and directly followed mass Jewish persecution.
@@jmadluck i don’t think there would be much debate… Destiny would concede that he doesn’t know nearly as much history and therefore wouldn’t make claims without a solid foundation. He wasn’t “wrong” or asserting anything illogical here, for far very same reason
I finally got it figured out. Destiny is the Jerry Springer of online politics
Is Destiny the father????
Shapiro: here is a point to the question.
Destiny: *pause* yes but there is also another side to that subject.
*Play* Shapiro: and also the same point destiny talked about.
Honestly, the talking head culpability for violent acts absent calls to violence is a blind spot for Destiny. He says he's the only one saying this, but maybe there's a reason for that. No longer making Yasuo carry jokes is a bit different than discontinuing all speech about political issues simply because someone somewhere could take something you mean out of context or through an irrational lens.
Holy strawman
@@insertname5057 Yea, not really. You're going to need to point to something to substantiate that.
he's ignoring the option of letting his enemies control him and his opinions
someone can shoot a maga supporter while yelling subscribe to destiny and destiny would have to go soft on trump according to what he said in this video
Agree, it's a pretty ridiculous take. The "actual incitement to violence" take is probably too narrow too. I'd use more of a "natural consequences" analysis.
January 6 is a good example. I'm a lifelong Republican who believes that the January 6th invasion of the Capitol Building was a natural consequence of Trump's behavior and rhetoric leading up to it. If you spend two months trying to convince your followers that the election is literally being stolen, how can you be surprised when they respond the way patriots would respond if an election was in fact being stolen? That crowd thought they were the heroes because they believed lies. If the lies were actually true, it's not hard to see their actions as justified. And despite the Democrats and the media alleging to the contrary, Trump never directly incited anyone to violence. I'd still say he gets most of the blame.
@@Zachary_Setzer jan 6 was a fiery but peaceful protest
“Books are really good to read I think… you should.” -Destiny
43:56 Ben's right though, for exactly THIS reason. The way we speak or joke with each other should NEVER be dictated by the actions of crazy people. End of story.
Yeah but what if they aren't crazy though? Like in 1930s Germany, millions of regular people were convinced to participate in some capacity in wars of conquest and genocide of Jews and Gypsies. Obviously I'm using the extreme example but the point is that rational people can be convinced to do think and do pretty awful things when they're given the right worldview.
@@krombopulos_michael The vast majority of that was self preservation or people "just doing their jobs."
But even if that wasn't the case, I'd rather deal with the dangers and consequences of free speech than the dangers and consequences of having some authoritarian force dictate what we can or cannot say.
While it’s nice that Ben stated that here, he still runs a show and a network where that’s largely their bread and butter. When it’s a means to and end for his business and political motives… he’s willing to drop that from his value system.
@@Michael-kp4bd what? when did ben call to cancel someone for a joke?
@@wanded when did I say he did that?
I said his programming does what he hypocritically (but correctly) stated - paraphrased by OP - that the way we perceive and treat each other should never be dictated by the actions of crazy people. Ben makes a living riling up his viewers about “the leftist agenda” that he concocts by searching out the craziest of takes, and by uncharitably and maliciously reframing normal actions or statements into insane positions that no one actually believes.
That wasn't Shapiro's argument. His argument was, because the power was centralized, any bad guy that got in would have all that power to do bad things. It was not that the centralized nature of the government allowed Hitler to get in, but it did make it easier. Essentially because the stakes for who controlled that seat was higher, this heightened tensions in part between the Reds and the Browns.
It was not the only thing that heightened the tensions.
You have essentially maximized a nuance point to argue against. This is called chasing windmills.
To me, it sounds like Destiny and Ben agree much more than they disagree.
Lol the two Jewish Mossad operatives suggesting content and donating tons of money.
Yeah no seems legit not questionable at all.
I wish destiny was as well read as Ben on topics so he didn’t have to be so speculative. I feel mislead as he makes so many arguments after establishing he may not know critical info on the topic. Example: govt wasn’t centralized in nazi germany until act that allowed Chancellory to disregard parliament. It’s fairly trivial that power had to be centralized before that in order for the act to be passed in the first place.
It's all the process of learning. You can't know everything about every topic. You can try to be well informed, but a good scientist is always updating as soon as new data comes in.
Also it's important to be able to admit when you are wrong and correct it. He seems to try to do both.
@@rcchristian2 I agree. I just don't like how he chooses to disagree on topics after declaring he isn't well informed on them.
@@spacepirat4028 said _"I agree. I just don't like how he chooses to disagree on topics after declaring he isn't well informed on them."_
Yeah haha me as well! It's annoying!! BUT it's sorta how you create a good way to figure something out.
Let's say you don't know much about something. Make your declaration right now, say it in stone.... and when you make those claims, talk too and pull in as much alternate information as possible.
You have to declare to everyone what your position is right away and then change it as people prove you wrong.
So yeah, it's annoying because he could be very wrong about something, but he will definitely end up correcting it over time.
It's a good way to do things at the highest level...
Merry almost xmas man!!
Would love to see destiny debate a Japanese national. I feel that Japan being a collectivist society is something that would make for good entertainment and to see his perspective on how a different society lives juxtaposed to how we live in America as an individualist society.
Debate about what. A homogenous country has one less problem to deal with.
I read that as Japanese nationalist and all I thought was "oh man, you do not want that, those dudes are like the political equivalent of football hooligans."
@@theprophet9428 we are an individualist society and they are a collectivist society. Japanese nationals are die hard all about Japan do that's what the debate would be about.
2:08:00 Lex about Ukraine "the only way to achieve peace is through like, honest human-to-human conversation"
such a simplistic understanding of why countries go to war in the first place. If either country isn't ready to propose a peace, the 'only way to achieve peace' is to.. keep fighting until they are. literally. the 'honest human-to-human conversation' ended when Russia invaded.
Lex thinks these interviews are far more profound and impactful than they actually are
Not really. The reason why Russia went into the war with Ukraine is because putin thought he will pull a quick ez bloodless Crimea stunt because Ukraine would fall apart like a piecec of wet paper and get an easy political victory for him. That west wouldn't care to support it, to put hard sanctions, that Ukrainian army incapable of effective defense, that there is enough political pro-Russian power in Ukraine to overthrow current government during the chaos of invasion etc.
Now he needs to get the fuck out from his war. If he new how it will going to end up, he would never start the war. So, it's matter of the giving the opportunity to find a way out for both Ukrainian government by finding a scapegoat and for putin.
And because most Russian actions currently controled singlehandedly by him, one on one talks can be Really influential. Kinda like with Saudi Arabia the whole alliance between US and SA started because president and a monarch had things to make bonds on.
@@rutvin8763 I Like that about him though. There are enough people not seeing the worth of interactions between people. Positive bias instead of negative is in this case good I think
@@tsjamas sounds nice in principle, but in practice, if Ukraine and Russia were to enter into a ceasefire to negotiate right now, it would only buy Russia time to resupply and regroup. Ukraine has the momentum and they shouldn't waste it
Destiny's characterization of Communists and Nazis being allies in Weimar Germany before the Nazis assumed power is a severe distortion. (I can't help but notice that it also suits his views of contemporary politics very well: liberals vs extremes from both sides.) The reality is a lot more complex than he presents it and I strongly encourage everybody to read some actual history and not trust the reductive views of a professional video game player.
He can’t reason though because he’s super left partisan.
@@Izthefaithful he’s centre partisan if anything, destiny is completely against leftism
@@Izthefaithful Destiny attacks the left all the time. He had a period where the left believed he switched sides.
@@gyytgy3330 I can't believe that after listening to him actually talk about literally anything lol. He's a lefty with fake conservative opinions on economics that he constantly contradicts
Thanks. I was hoping that someone said something about the complexity of post WWI Germany. I don't blame him for getting off point on the history. It is very confusing. His explanations are quite simplistic, but then Ben Shapiro is just as messed up in his history.
Does Destiny know anything about the actions the social-democratic government took during unrest in Weimar Germany at the time? Painting it as "liberalism (the social democrats)" against "illiberalism (nazis + communists together)" isn't accurate. Political opportunism during the Weimar period was prevalent among the social democrats, the communists, and the Nazis, there was no organized alliance of any kind whatsoever between the leaders of the KPD and NSDAP against the SPD. The Social Democrats initially took power and immediately hired the Freikorps (a far-right paramilitary, many members later joined the NSDAP) to violently crush socialist protests across the country. Police forces in SPD-run cities regularly, violently broke up communist protests and caused mass casualties. Why does the onus only fall on the KPD to ally with the SPD but there's no onus on the liberals in the SPD to extend any kind of olive branch to the communists? To just say "the KPD didn't want to work the SPD because they were libs" is so ahistorical and politically-motivated it's ridiculous.
Obviously the KPD made mistakes, the "social fascists" line of the Communist International regarding social democrats was also ridiculous, but Destiny seems to have little-to-no knowledge about the SPD government or how it governed. He just says "they supported liberalism" and leaves it there. They supported maintaining their own position in power and many SPD politicians took pretty extreme actions to that end, like many politicians do unfortunately. The SPD and KPD both could have taken more constructive actions to prioritize forming a necessary electoral alliance against the NSDAP. Putting it on one party seems very dishonest.
He is an american carpet cleaner turned political streamer. That should answer you everything, right there.
The "liberalism" lense is the american part, they love that category nowadays, while (no offense) the ([implied] not) _"know anything"_ part is the carpet cleaner turned streamer...
I'd bet he never touched a textbook of any serious historian... or any textbook whatsoever. Most of his *"knowledge"* comes from other internet people
and articles he finds online through a 2 minute google search.
That said I still think: *_"Even a blind chicken finds a grain"_* !
Sometimes he got interesting viewpoints on social topics that I didn't consider and maybe want to further engage in.
But to think Destiny got his facts and theories straight is very dangerous...... for anybody..
Destiny and Ben could have an extremely productive conversation.
Or not. Depends on how they both approach it.
If they approach it as a debate probably not.
If they approach it as a conversation and allow eachother to flesh out idea's without trying to play the "gotcha" game it could be extremely positive.
Hope to see that one day.
I believe we need intelligent reasonable people on both sides having good faith discussions. It's the only way we ever find common ground. Especially on contentious issues.
If you believe we need intelligent reasonable people, then why are you watching Destiny? lol
@@xraceboyex Because Destiny can at least concede a point. Maybe not every time he should. But fundamentally disagreeing with Destiny on a lot didn't stop me from admitting some good points he made. Aswell as being pleasantly suprised with him checking himself whenever he got too snarky or made an assumption about Ben or Jordan Peterson he clarified he was wrong and shouldn't do that.
It allows Destiny to challenge their true idea's or at least as fair of a representation as someone on the opposite side can give.
That's a lot more than a LOT of people on both sides of any debate do.
At least from what I have seen in recent times.
If I was watching a summary from someone who hated Destiny I am sure they would exclude the parts where he corrects himself and only keep the criticism in.
I hate that shit.
I don't want to argue against ghosts.
Both sides do that shit endlessly.
Don't tell me the worst version of what you think someone's underlying agenda is.. tell me what they say their agenda is.
Everyone is arguing against the Bogeyman.
I just want to see honest, good faith conversations.
Genuinely.
I always have so much respect for it when I see it.
@@indianacones5815 Fair point, I've let the temptation of taking jabs at Destiny being a girl's name make me stray from objectivity. Touché, and Kudos.
@@xraceboyex Kudos to you brother. Destiny is a girls name.
It's funny to laugh at.
He may have the forearm density of dry pasta but the dude is at least somewhat fair in his criticisms and arguments.
I can respect that. Even if I would rather have a well built 12 year old on my side over Destiny if the shit ever hit the fan. l
It’s just the loud ass red pill guys that talk like that about their wife and some right leaning ppl, but every republican I know and meet have a normal relationship with their spouse or the idea if they’re not married/dating. Both add very important value and both combine to be better or overcome obstacles. I dislike the whole “women stay in the kitchen and shut up” crap. It says how much they don’t know about relationships and coming together.
If Lex worked in AI he definitely has experience dealing with contractors. Anybody who works in IT works with contractors all the time and knows how they got hired. It's an industry based on trust a lot of times, and I've seen many people get burned on bad contractors because they sounded good on paper but couldn't deliver.
Nepotism is the cousin of corruption
For someone who was born in Russia, Lex is quite soy about "slurs/hateful comments" I mean russian ppl I have played with are pretty toxic, so I kinda expect ppl coming from russia have lot more tolerance about general language due to their very straight forward culture? Am I wrong about this?
The dude has an American accent. What Russian culture?
An individual should not be solely characterized by the country in which they are born in, and stereotypes associated with those descending from said country.
@@gt1r Sure
Controlling other people's speech gives you power. So people like Lex would adopt any tool that gives them power.
@@andriy_tato Correct
Hi, I'm a history graduate, and Ben Shapiro's understanding of Hitler's rise to power and the centralisation of power was almost entirely correct, except for the small misspeak in saying that power was centralised in the Chancellory, rather than the Presidency under Hindenburg.
Shapiro was saying that because of the fighting between the reds and browns it led to more and more extreme views on each side, so that when one of them eventually took power it was inevitable that they would be the most radical version of either side, something we could learn here in the US
One needs to ask in turn, though, whether the risk of a more extreme opponent down the line is worth caving to whatever current enemy exists now.
I'd argue emphatically that the republicans under trump, desantis, etc, are already too far gone and too willing to just keep escalating to reach that miracle-middle ground you're hinting at.
@@sythersight congrats, you're engaging in dehumanizing language as a result, helping prove the claim true
"Too far gone".. for what? Treating them like human beings w/ agency + autonomy instead of evil demons? Nah, I don't think so
@@sythersight Heeb.
I'm starting to feel like I can't trust Destiny. He has such a selective memory. There was a media blackout about the Hunter laptop.
I kind of agree when it comes to Destiny’s takes on the laptop stuff. I recommend watching that vid where Pisco came on to talk about censorship and the topic came up for more insight on his view of the whole thing.
You can't trust anyone then, because everyone has selective memory
Kyle Kulinky has some pretty honest takes on HBs laptop story
@@testcase6997 It being his and having content politically harmful to his father, quite obvious really. I guess Destiny thinks CNN saying it bears all the signs of a Russian disinfo operation means there was no media blackout.
@@testcase6997 I don't have a conspiracy. I don't even understand what you are on about. There was a story that was bad for Biden and it was suppressed. Any attempt to deny that is cope.
If everyone with a public platform has to be responsible for people who misuse their message. A lot won't be able to be said publicly anymore.
One simply can't criticise Ye, while absolving onesself of any responsibility whatsoever, that's the problem here.
By Shapiro's logic, there's nothing wrong with Ye's comments, since he isn't responsible for what people make of it, e.g. antisemiticly motivated crime.
@@matt_9112 What Shapiro (and many others) are conveying is that pinning motivated acts of violence on rhetoric that does not call for violence is misplaced blame. Shapiro disagrees with Ye’s comments because they are antisemitic, completely divorced from what sentiments they may or may not inspire.
I do not necessarily agree with Destiny or Shapiro on this. Taking such a high degree of responsibility or taking no responsibility both seem wrong.
It’s not so complicated. People are only RESPONSIBLE for what they actually say. So if some lunatic takes what Shapiro or Bernie Sanders has said and decides to commit violence, that person is solely responsible. This assumes whatever was said wasn’t an explicit call for violence.
But the speaker is responsible for examining whether or not what they said was well communicated. Whether they could’ve done a better job making sure the people that listen to them are not seeing the opposition as dehumanized. That is a personal responsibility that should be embraced. It’s not something we get to impose upon them.
A good rule is the larger the platform the less extreme your rhetoric should be. It’s very hard because the financial incentive is always to be more extreme. Destiny is running into this problem when he speaks to bigger and more extreme political content creators.
@@sheridan891 No, I disagree, everyone is responsible for the consequences of their actions. if someone participates in the spread of propaganda designed to dehumanize people in the eyes of their audience, to convince that audience to view those people as a real existential threat that must be stopped, dishonestly fear mongering for a political game, they absolutely do hold responsibility for members of their audience taking them seriously and acting drastically on that information.
People find this inconvenient to acknowledge, and so they hand wave it by calling the perpetrators of the crimes mentally ill and solely responsible for their drastic actions, nobody wants to acknowledge the inflammatory media that preyed on their emotions and fears day after day for years, giving them an enemy to hate and stoking that feeling because that's the political media's hook for views, but shit adds up.
This kind of behavior shouldn't be acceptable to anyone, dishonest use of propaganda to stoke animosity has serious consequences, and it should be ridiculed, even when your side is doing it. There is no worthwhile message that needs to be conveyed in such a way.
Damn, destiny reading the biden transcript makes it sound very hitleresque
Ok coward
Thanks Destiny, this is not at all a main point of covering this interview, but this is what my dumbass needed to hear to uninstall Reddit from my phone.
now read 5 books a week instead
@@wanded I'll start with a goal of 12 books a year first 😅
I can see destiny visibly frustrated that he can't think of many bad things to say about Ben in this one and its hilarious.
I was thinking the same thing
Huh??? Sounds like you’re just seeing what you wanna see, buddy.
@@papaofthejohns5882 cultist
@@dannydiamonds8682 I’m a cultist because I was confused by someone being nonsensical? Ok buddy
@@papaofthejohns5882 nonsensical buddy!!!! LOOOL OMEGALUUL
Isn't it interesting that Shapiro references sociological reasons for jews to be in Hollywood, law firms, etc but refuses to give that kind of analysis to systematic oppression of black people?
He will blame the welfare state for the destruction of the black family. But he won't call it systemic racism, and he also doesn't really talk about the drug war as a factor.
@jessie6600 First of all, Ben should be smart enough to know that laws don't have to be explicitly racist for the system to be racist, but he has an agenda, so he won't talk about that.
Also, I'm pretty sure he believes that Johnson designed the Great Society to damage black families. At the very least he believes that was the effect of those programs. How he can believe systemic racism doesn't exist while simultaneously believing a system had racist results is beyond me. It's like he takes the concept personally.
@jessie6600 except we can prove current racism enshrined in legal and economic systems. There's massive discrepancies in the black population compared to other races and its objectively true that its a consequence of these systems. Also the idea that there would not be ripple effects from legal discrimination that existed in our grandparents lifetimes is extremely stupid
@jessie6600 well no, that's a stupid idea. The government fucked the black population, it's their job to fix it. And it's literally only been a generation since segregation, the idea that this is black people whinning is ridiculous. We can draw a direct line from those policies to the problems of today. This isn't speculation, it's objective fact. This isn't black people complaining about life just general being hard based on class struggle, we never solved the problems that resulted from segregation
@jessie6600 Lots of infrastructure investment. This idea that reversing the laws and doing nothing else is all the government is required to do is absolutely retarded
Never thought I’d see Destiny apologize for shitting on Jordan Peterson because he was inspired by Ben Shapiro’s humility.
About Peterson's self help. The other stuff however..
"Grilling" is definitely not the term I would use.
I think Lex could have talked about his lack of empathy towards trans and LGBT people in general. Maybe his position on conversation therapy. This was just promo for Ben. I feel like Lex was a lot more investigative in his interview with Destiny.
Yeah, grilled my ass. He said nothing in response to Ben's disingenuous response to the question of whether or not he sympathizes with the plight of the Palestinians. "How do you cope with the all online hate?" Like really?
This is essentially just Destiny looking for things to disagree with Ben on even when Ben is being extremely moderate lol dawg quit being so contrarian for no reason
There’s no argument for Kanye being driven by Jew hatred. It’s hardly worth considering. I’d say mental health aside, and billionaire-ego aside, he’s driven by curiosity and rebellion. Even most Fuentes types are driven by some normy human force, like wanting to be part of a movement. And if having a common enemy in progressives or Jews or Neocons brings them solidarity and adds to the epic narrative in which they’re protagonists, then they will accept it and enjoy the serotonin boost frankly.
That's a reasonable take, but you conveniently forgot that destiny is a girls name.
@@LunarLocust fuck so I’m wrong
@captain radio you're not just wrong, you a BEYTUH!
No argument? I can’t tell if I agree or disagree by your wording. “No argument “ as in it should be so obvious it’s undisputed? OR, what it seems like you’re actually saying is that the argument is bunk. I think there’s an argument. It comes from his lived experience in the record industry, a very juvenile processing of that experience by jumping from the corrupt record industry to Jews simply based on over representation, and the curiosity that you mentioned (initially him just “asking questions”) making him a perfect pawn for extreme and anti-semetic right wingers, and he’s fully bought into it. His current drive is literally targeting Jews. How he got there is part what you said, and part the additional aspects I mentioned.
You can’t put mental health aside. He thinks Jewish people are after him to steal his money. He thinks his personal trainer (who seems like a dick tbf) was trying to MKULTRA him. He’s got paranoid delusions behind his Jew hatred. Curiosity and rebellion isn’t even part of it, though he probably thinks he’s rebelling against his paranoid delusions.
Wait, they donate to you a lot of money but it's not a big deal? :D
Economics in One Lesson is a great book.
I could feel Destiny regretting calling Shapiro "not deep" as the interview went on.
I like destiny as a debater but I really do believe he would get destroyed by Ben in a debate. Hope the will have a debate in the future.
He’s his own best fan
Maybe not destroyed, I think he would “lose” but also think he could get Ben on a few points
Ben doesn't even join proper moderated debates. He curates who he debates with at this point.
there won't be a winner, they'll just autism around each others points and baits until the time runs out
take their disagreement on bidens speech for example, there is no "fact" or logic that can decide that one, it's pure interpretation
@@broken_abi6973 so does everyone who debates lol
Destiny’s position on slavery isn’t totally ridiculous. I recall Dylan Burns having a similar position. I think a point of contention would be how both groups were ultimately treated. Chattel slaves in antebellum had no history, no family structure and were forbade literacy. The Jews were at least given the opportunity to leave their country (though few were able to do so) and retain their heritage. Not to mention, an entire generation of people died just crossing over the Atlantic. So just talking death toll and human cost isn’t really the push here.
Destiny is always his most dishonest when watching Shapiro, I never understood why. I started as a Destiny fan and ended up a Shapiro fan.
If this was his most dishonest self, then he must be the most honest person on the Internet/ politics.
I think Him even giving this much airtime to his opponents cries out Honesty; dishonest ppl would rather use 30 sec clips to show their audiences, OR not engage at all.
I'm a bigger Shapiro fan than I am a Destiny fan, not sure I've ever seen Destiny paint Shapiro in a bad faith context.
Thank you for uploading something that isn't salacious streamer drama. I don't know any of the people that those last few videos were about.
“[war and conflict] that’s just not what we do.” What a profound misunderstanding of all humanity for all time.
I have a new found respect for Ben Shapiro after this conversation and review by Destiny. It’s absolutely hilarious that anyone publicly claims he is “far right” meaning “alt right” or “fascist”.
Never been more glad to have abandoned Vaush content. Lessoned my intake around the Rittenhouse debate and completely stopped after he categorized Bush W was a “fascist”. I swear some of these mid twenty something online “philosophers” have never read anything other than queer theory and have not consumed anything visually outside of furry anime fan fiction. Have never existed outside the queer bars or indie coffee shops of Portland/ Seattle.
You sound just as terminally online as the people you're complaining about.
Or maybe the political spectrum has widened so much in the last couple of decades, diluting what was once considered far right.
He is, the gist of fascist ideology is around the demonization of minorities and those who are vulnerable, subservience to figures of authority, and appeal to traditional values. Ben Shapiro in the year 2022 is against gay folks having the same right as heterosexual folks of being able to establish a civil union through the state, the fact that you're trying to whitewash this monster when gay folks are being gunned down because they're being dehumanized by this people is a clear lack of perspective. Imagine writing a comment criticizing Vaush for abusing categorizing his opponents to defend Ben Shappiro who calls everyone "communists" and blames everything on "liberals" "the left" "fascist left" etc, you're clearly being brainwashed and completely ignoring who ben shapiro ACTUALLY is.
For god's sake, these are the ACTUAL title of his books:
Porn Generation: How Social Liberalism Is Corrupting Our Future. Regnery (2005). ISBN 0-89526016-6.
Primetime Propaganda: The True Hollywood Story of How the Left Took Over Your TV. HarperCollins (2011).
Bullies: How the Left's Culture of Fear and Intimidation Silences America. Threshold Editions
The Authoritarian Moment: How the Left Weaponized America's Institutions Against Dissent.
Stop alienating yourself.
@@phanomtaxskibididoodoo "far-right" now is just adopting ONE evershifting talking point they don't like. Like abortion, guns, landlords, etc.
Like one can be the biggest tree-hugging hippie, planting trees on the weekend, growing "trees" in their house. Trying to be vegan, is all about free love and living off the grid. Yet they're distrustful of the government and have guns out the ass. Boom they're a "fascist" to some idiots.
@@ExeErdna No its not and you'd have to either be delusional, a reactionary who's political knowledge consists of cringe feminists getting owned or an actual far righter trying to muddy the definition to actually say that.
I wish content creators would just shut up about history if they aren't willing to spend time to learn and present a somewhat complete and accurate picture and that goes very much so for everyone involved here.
B-But then they wouldn’t be able to pick and choose situations that fit their narrative?
Preach!
you didn't finish your statement. you want people to spend time to learn and present a somewhat complete and accurate picture *to you*. stop pounding your historical virtue drums, and share how your takes on historical facts are different... although it is easier to just berate the things and people we don't like, isn't it?
@@grizzly311tr Not OP, and I only agree with his take in so far that especially Destiny should be a little more careful with his „facts“.
Shapiro was honestly really impressive, the only major mistake was calling von Papen a democrat; he was a monarchist and wanted to abolish the republic.
Destiny’s take on KPD and NSDAP working together was a way to simplistic. They did kinda work together occasionally (e.g. a strike in Berlin or voting for the dissolution an SPD-led government in Prussia), but they were still sworn enemies and were fighting and killing each other in the streets way before the Nazis came to power.
The parallels to modern day politics are definitely there, however. In 1929, the KPD decided that social democrats were nothing but a different brand of fascists (Sozialfaschisten) - everyone is a fascist, does that ring a bell?
Also, the establishment was not necessarily liberal; a ton of industrialists, landowners, and especially nobles and militarily leaders were monarchists.
Edit: tbf, Destiny acknowledged that the occasionally fought each other but that they both had the goal to incite a revolution, obviously with diametrically opposed visions. I think he just overemphasized their collaboration and downplayed the constant clashes of their paramilitaristic troops.
@@grizzly311tr based
Does Lex have a normal voice that isn’t whispering?
I have no idea how Shapiro's words would drive someone to violence.
If we don't get a Destiny vs Shapiro debate, we are truly in the dark timeline.
We won't. Shapiro knows it won't go well for him.
Destiny has come off as seriously uninformed on some of these latest political videos. To act like the Trump middle east deals were not great accomplishments is absurd. Also, to a claim he made elsewhere (i think with nuancebro), the people pushing the vaccine were absolutely saying that they would stop the spread and saying otherwise is just the highest degree of gas lighting.
Alright name them. Heck I'll even start with a failure for you to counter.
Killing the Iran deal, with Iran now trying to get nuclear weapons was a massive mistake
@@testcase6997 The Abraham accords
@@HucklePeel the Abraham accords
You do realize the Iran deal only placed temporary limits on Iran developing nuclear weaponry. Significant clauses of the deal would sunset in 2025 and 2030.
It’s getting harder to criticize anyone as more protected classes of people emerge. Label all of these classes as victims of this or that …. Well, you can’t possibly ever blame victims for ANYTHING which in turn protects that protected class from any fundamental accountability about ANYTHING
Jews are more protected obviously. Their tragedy is more recent so we have to care about it more.
Although it’s been about 20 years and we’re already joking about 9/11 so personally I think there shouldn’t be protected classes at all. It’s so silly.
@@theprophet9428 No, black tragedy is more recent because it's been more recently revisited, and black people have more incentive to victimize themselves as a means of protection. We are supposed to care about black people more than Jews because Jews have become successful in the last hundred years.
Replace Ben’s comment on Ye’s anti-semitism with any minority he’s currently attacking and his hypocrisy is evident
„Wait does Poland have planes?!“
Dude that has to be the most american thing to say, especially by a strong independent woman of color
I think it is absolutely fascinating that Ben has absolutely no problem saying "Ye" instead of Kanye after Ye changed his name. It's almost like he knows how to respect when people change their names or something, interesting
Big brain
Have you ever heard of his private stance and public stance on political issues? His private stance is to respect someone's wishes to be referred to by a different name. His public stance is he shouldn't be forced to.
As far as trans in general, he definitely doesn't agree with the procedure, but I'm never heard him say a consenting adult can't do the surgery and hormone therapy.
Foolish. Whatever you think of the pronoun debate, those terms refer to categories of people. Ye is literally just a shortened version of Kanye’s name.
@@misantropology Nope. His legal name is Ye. I'm not talking about pronouns, we only use those in the 3rd person. I'm talking about changed named. Ye legally is his name, he had it legally changed it isn't Kanye anymore.
When did Ben ever deadname a trans person??
Conservatives screaming "corruption" about Hunter being hired as a counselor/board member despite not having any qualifications, but not speaking a word when Trump ONLY staffed people whose only qualifications were that they were well-connected donors (betsy devos, louis dejoy, his own children, scaramouchi, etc etc etc) who have little to no qualifications for the positions they were placed in have me shaking my head every damn day
well considering he campaigned as an outsider, and not as traditional politician, an easy explanation was that he filled those positions with people he thought he could trust to get the job done.
@@kurolap7882 and he failed to do even that. Everyone i mentioned had demonstrably negative and even destructive impacts on the fields in which they were in charge of. I'm so tired of people making excuses for that traitor's obvious nepotism/corruption
I think the epitome of that British disposition is tuning into their soccer team fan channels after a 0-0 tie to the USMNT in the world cup.
3:48:00 the love conversation: That is why we have 2 words in Dutch that both translate into love in English. 'Houden van', meaning the love for family and close friends and 'lief hebben' a more tame word used to refer to someone you like to be around/respect
Gotta disagree with Destiny's sentiment that Shapiro's views have "changed" for the better. His views have stayed relatively the same throughout his career from what i've seen, anyways good video.
Ben has stayed relatively the same. Destiny is the one who has changed quite a bit over time.
Well if your job pays ALOT to hold particular views, I would too. The dude is surely making bank, but I also still think Ben is a decent man.
His takes on Palestinians were horrible at the beginning of his career.
@@broken_abi6973 His take on Palestinians...hasn't changed? The guy's a Jew himself what can you expect? Am I supposed to be upset at the Jewish communities take as a whole, as their sentiments on Palestine is pretty universal...not that I care regardless as I'm not hebrew...so moot point to begin with I guess?
Destiny you sound like a Trumper when you try to hold water for Biden on the laptop drama, it’s like two sides of a coin.
Destiny quibbling with the media's coordinated effort to downplay (and yes, blackout) the Hunter Laptop story is asinine. Otherwise, great video.
1:07:00 - not saying the laptop story was a golden bullet or anything, but the Democratic staffers had direct line into twitter communication bans
2:30:00 To be fair I think Shapiro is just more naturally inclined to this type of life style (low neuroticism, high consciousness) so I don’t imagine his advice would be as valuable to someone who really struggles just to get out of bed, though that is very presumptuous.
Accurate observation.
Shapiro is a pretty likeable guy though, it was interesting listening to his opinions here
Are you interested in being a guest on a podcast?
@@CarsonHughes85 Why you have no idea any of my view points.
@@Jaryism We know you love Israel and would donate billions to keep them killing off Palestinian children
Destiny: Does Poland even have an air force?
No destiny. Poland definitely doesn't have an air force. They were useful enough to be accepted into NATO, but they jusy havent figured out how to fly planes, yet..
Hearing destiny talk about history is so embarassing.
The issue with the “responsibility as an influence” perspective destiny maintains is primarily the extent to which it can be applied and when it does get applied. For ex. If you were to consistently apply it you would force blame onto Islam for suicide bombers. The point is that I personally don’t want to take what is primarily intended otherwise to a domain of responsibility when that’s not the intent. If the intent isn’t to do such, then it’s fairly pointless to assign blame because an individual can misinterpret any perspective in a twisted way.
I also question the extent to which an influence can change the individual given information readily available otherwise. Primarily that even if Ben Shapiro did not exist, if that individual wanted information to fuel an anti Muslim narrative, there are not only better, but more extreme sources to retrieve it from. Hell even the more objective sources, when incorrectly interpreted, can be used to fuel that perspective which is why I can’t really get on board with this method of influencer blaming
as someone who identifies as a democrat, I found myself agreeing with Shapiro on many items. I’ve got a lot more respect for him now, assuming he was being honest and genuine.
Such as ?
@@Loki_Leftist is there anything you agree with Shapiro on? i would bet his positive views on Biden or his criticisms of Trump resonates with most people
@@bobchu82 zero issues I don’t see myself ever agreeing with Ben ever even if he said the shy is blue I’ll press X for doubt
@@Loki_Leftist Imagine unironically saying this and not thinking people like you are the problem.
@@Cybertech134 it’s the truth why would I believe a person who lies thur his teeth for a living but I’m not surprised you conservatives love when people lie to y’all
To say that the Nazis and Communists ‘worked together’ is rather misleading. Destiny seems to imply that the brown shirts happened after the Nazis took power when he talks about the importance of the timeline. The Sturmabteilung (Brown shirts) actually pre-date the existence of the Nazi party (1919… although they were not called this until 21’). When the group was formalised and aligned with Hitler they started to call themselves the SA after a speech by Hitler erupted into a brawl between Nazis and communists in 21’ and the SA proceeded to thrash them. The SA and communists would continually engage in street brawls all the way until Hitler received full control of government. This was heavily intensified after Hitler left prison in December 25’ and the SA had to be re organised to circumvent a law in Bavaria that outright banned the Nazi party and all its organisations. Hitler would not take full control of the SA until 30’, following a whole decade of Zusammenstöße (collisions) with the KDP (communists). By January 1933 as the Nazis assumed power the SA had grown to some two million members, a number twenty times as large as the number of troops and officers in the Reichswehr. These troops were used to destroy the Communist opposition during the election. After the election the Nazis proceeded to gradually imprison all their political enemies and that some individual communists collaborated to protect themselves or their families is no surprise. But here’s the real kicker. By 34’ the violence of the SA had gotten so bad (it was reported in newspapers they had stockpiled mass weapons to attempt a coup) that president Hindenberg informed Hitler that if the SA were not disbanded he would declare martial law and dissolve the government. In June of the same year Hitler proceeded to use the SS to personally arrest Ernst Röhm (who leaded the SA at this point) and all the SA’s leadership. About 200 of them, including Röhm himself, were all killed. The fact that Röhm and a number of other leaders in the SA were homosexuals was also made public to make the whole event more shocking to the German public, although Hitler and other Nazi officials had been aware of this all along. To say that Nazis and Communists worked together on any systematic level is really rather incorrect and you would be very hard pressed to find any academic source that would claim as such. Even a quick google search returns very sparse evidence (not that a google search can necessarily be called evidence). Nonetheless, a great video, I just wanted to put that out there.
At 19:00 or so, Destiny is just plainly wrong. The communists in Germany absolutely did not cooperate with the NAZIs to overthrow the liberal order. In fact, liberals that tended towards the right cooperated with the NAZIs to stop a perceived threat from socialists and communists. I say perceived because their actual popularity, especially the communists, is questionable.
Destiny just doesn't understand 1920-1930s Germany. I assume he's reffering to the KPD statements and actions against the Social Democrats in the 1920s? But that story is waaayyyy more complicated than NAZI/KPD collaboration. The NAZIs were a working class party, as were KPD. Very complicated dynamics result.
If he's talking about the alliance between Germany and the Soviet Union to invade Poland, he doesn't understand geopolitics, as that is also way more complicated.
Bad take.
That bbc interview was about bens book. The interviewer read the tweets because those tweets conflicted with the message of the book.
yes, an old tweets which ben have retracted as he said.
I wish our reporters were a bit more similar to British ones though. And the problem with that interview wasn’t that Ben retracted those statements, he could have kept his cool and said he regrets those statements, it’s that he got emotional and accused a famous British conservative of being on the left looking to smear him. If liberals asked liberals hard questions more, and conservative journalists did the same for their “side,” American journalism would be much better imo, not saying British journalism is anything close to ideal (I know very little about it I just know subjects complain about it about as much as we do).
@@mhballa5866 he should have said that then instead of flipping his shit and accusing a lifelong conservative of being a leftist plant trying to smear him
Hey is that SFO? I think he'd be a fun person to talk to or get into a panel thing.
I don’t think he’d do very well on a panel. He’s very good at making long videos carefully explaining a point, but man he can’t debate (he even admits it himself.)
One can tell the inner conflict in Destiny. "I want to debate this dude and own him." vs "I kind of like this dude."
Its kind of crazy how you just reuploaded the entire podcast with a few mins of interjection.
"Lex Frimdan" lmao
This was an amazing interview by Shapiro though
ben shapiro's mouth doesnt move this entire interview if you watch at 360p
I know it sounds like splitting hairs, but I don't want a Destiny v Shapiro debate, I want a Destiny and Shapiro discussion.
nah i want blood
Destiny - being from Poland - no one had to convince Poland of anything. I would say , we had to convince everyone else, to help Ukraine (well to be fair - not everyone, some were more willing then others of course). At one point we even wanted to give Ukrainian army almost all of our Soviet era fighter jets and US had to intervene and stop us LOL. But Germany and France, sure - Putin Shills all the way, at least the begining.
Destiny sounds like jamie from jre
Jamie is monotone
I really can't tell if he's meming or he doesn't realize they share a lot of takes because they're both lukewarm.
Being contacted by mossad is something weird.
Tough debate. Holocaust vs US slavery. Lifetime of slavery for generations. Beating, rape, cruelty across the board, deletion of cultural identity. Hmm sounds pretty similar to holocaust. Time is the biggest difference. Jews over time probably had it worse, but during holocaust the length of WW2 avg 6m vs US slave trade lasting 200 years low end 6m- high end 15m. Depends when they died alone the trip after being captured for the slave market
i honestly don't see it as a dough debate. I would hands down, easily, as would you, choose to be a slave in America then be jewish in the Holocaust.
once you survived the middle passage (which, fun fact; the death rate was almost identical for the crew of the ship 17-20%) an American slave had a death rate of 1.8%, only slightly higher than white citizens at 1.2%... remember that the slave was an investment and cost alot of money. It was in the plantation owners best financial interest to look after the health of his slave as best as he could.
Compare that to the what...100% of people loaded on those trains? Yeah take me to the plantation please