WoW's biggest trick is that it taught all of us that it doesn't matter if you're having fun, it doesn't matter if what you're doing in the moment is enjoyable; all that matters is the promise of the potential of 0.5 seconds of dopamine if a BiS item or mount drops. That's not to say those moments aren't fun, but it's morphed and jaded players to be purely focus on the outcome at the expense of the moment. We've been trained to be like this, IMO. It's hard to break out of it, but I'm truly glad I did.
This comment is so real. You're right. I think those feelings are valid too, but when it becomes the sole/primary focus, it makes it all feel so hollow. I can still remember when Light's Justice dropped from Prince Malchezaar in Karazhan and I went CRAZY. And those moments are really important and memorable! But when it's all you're chasing...it becomes consuming and obsessive. You've summed this up perfectly. Really well written comment! Thank you for posting.
True a majority of ppl play like that. But if you ever just want someone that plays just to play let me know lol I’ve got 1k hours in ARR alone and just started Heavensward and I still replay dungeons just for fun and to share the experience with players as a social thing and also I really enjoy just running through and replaying stuff. :P I’m helping a friend finish ARR as we speak and it’s like he just finished ultimate weapon and I was just enjoying driving him around, chilling in low level dungeons, teaching him the mechanics and even rerunning dungeons with to just get him the gear he needs. No issues, we wipe I’m like it’s alright just do it again or we can do it again later after some golden saucer lol but let me know! I love making new friends
My bf had such a hard time “de-WoWifying” his brain to enjoy things in ffxiv. One such effect was feeling like once he picked a main job he had to stick with it and leveling other jobs or getting gear for them is “just a distraction” or some such. One of the steps he did to overcome this was to unlock ALL the jobs and try them out on striking dummy just enough to set up hotbars. And ended up falling in love with SGE when he was convinced he was a DPS-only kinda guy. Now he’s comfortable as sge in savage blind prog and flexing roles for whatever we need in other content. It’s so freeing to just do what feels fun without the expectations of long term commitment!
@@Cellybeans It's honestly like trying to break somebody's programming. WoW brain is such a real thing but once you're free of it, it's so incredibly liberating.
I had a party a couple months back. I was doing Roulettes and landed on my first run of the last Ivalice raid. I'll always remember it as the day everyone was scarily nice to me. I skipped the cutscene and immediately was told by the WHOLE GROUP that I shouldn't have done that, they would have waited. I just told them I didn't want to be a bother and would just check it out in the book at the inn, but they were adamant and even a bit scary about how "You should watch the cutscene, we're going to wait, it's how this game works". It was very funny to me that I was trying to be considerate of 23 other people, and yet they were all willing to wait for lil' ol' me. It's like we were competing to see who was the nicest person around or something. One guy was calling for my head for skipping the cutscene, which I thought was very funny.
Yeah stuff like that is really weird to me. Like the story is absolutely sacred to the majority of the player base I feel, but I think what you said is perfectly fine. I laughed reading this because I feel the same as you do, you were trying to be polite and understanding and respectful of their time and you still come off looking like the bad guy. I think there are a lot of stories like that in FFXIV. "It's like we were competing to see who was the nicest person around or something." is SO true. Honestly, I believe it. When I first started the game I cutscene skipped EVERYTHING because I just wanted to see how different the game was compared to WoW. I'm so glad I went back and did everything and learned it properly though! Thank you for watching and sharing your experiences!
I always tell sprouts to enjoy cutscenes, they’re there for story if they’re long and if they’re short it’s just to hype you up for the boss fight about to happen. In the first case, people want you to enjoy the story as it’s a shared experience you can only do for the first time once. In the latter case, it’s only like 10 seconds so you might as well watch it so you get the full experience the devs intended. Other players are already being compensated for their time by game design due to the first timer bonus. Socially, you can “compensate” people for their time by sharing a comment or feelings invoked by the story. A sprout being excited about a story moment can and will absolutely make a veteran player’s day just by appreciating the story. Not obligated to comment of course but knowing that watching the cutscenes is in fact not a burden has let a lot of WoW refugees I know really enjoy the moment for the moment instead of worrying about being an inconvenience to other people when we’re all here to play the same game. It isn’t healthy to think of yourself as a burden to others just by being in the same virtual room.
Story is something you can only experience once. You wont feel the wonder or utter confusion again a second time. I think most people in FF14 know this and learned their lesson - and yes, get a little pushy when imparting their gamer wisdom ;) Personlly, I heard many times from veterans that they wished they had payed more attention the first time around... So even if it weirds you out, just think that their sentiment comes from a good place... 90% of the time at least XD
@@markup6394 I have a different view on stories. I find they're only as good as the second or third experience. Surprise and confusion aren't emotions I really vibe with, so spoilers don't matter and I can always go back and re-read a part of something if it's good. I don't feel like I'm losing anything. I do appreciate the effort though.
One of my favorite things about ff14 is that i can completely take it at my own pace, i started playing around late stormblood i was very used to not only mmos but most games in general wanting me to play through 100s of hours of content as fast as possible, then i played ff14 and people were chill with me dying and learning the game, raids thats been in the game since the beginning are still there, they're people who still run them at minimum item level just because, it was there i realized that i can do whatever whenever i wanted, i had no reason to rush to the latest content cause itll always be there and ill always find people willing to do it with me, and now ove become that max level max item level player hopong into random raids ive done already just willing to lend a hand
It's SO good in that sense. I think the fact everything is still somewhat relevant when you can sync content is such a great idea and I implore Blizzard to introduce something like this for WoW. We have Timewalking but it's laughable by comparison and only really suited for one raid per expansion. I think playing at your own pace is honestly such a forgotten way of playing video games because we've just had this philosophy or mindset beaten out of us. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
How is that anything special in FF14? You can do that in every MMORPG, in others even more than in FF14. You only have to rush to end content if you want to do that end content, obviously. That's YOUR choice.
@@miriamweller812 Of course it's a choice, but it feels like most people's brains are trained to rush to the end game. Plus the levelling in WoW is a giant mess anyway so a story experience is essentially impossible. I wouldn't recommend rushing to end game in ANY game, but like you say it comes down to preference and what you want out of the game.
A few weeks ago I joined a DRK for a first clear of the final battle of the current raid tier, the DRK wanted it to be a first clear for all of the players, ppl who have cleared joined the PF for a moment and the DRK thought I would leave him and join the half party who had players who have cleared. I told him that I would clear eventually but did not care about when, and we stayed for about 2 hrs until the PF filled. We cleared in about the second to last pull of the lockdown. Before we disbanded the DRK did thank me for staying. At least, to me, a memorable moment needs to involve more than just me. I can enjoy myself playing solo, but with another that can be memorable.
That's a touching story, thank you for sharing. I think you're right too. As iconic and memorable video games can be, bonds and friendships are so impactful!
I wanted to clear a extreme trial for the first time, ramuh, and anyone who knows, knows. I had a random party and they stuck with me for two hours and eight tries before we cleared it.
@@rubyblooddemonking I had an experience like this once with Ramuh extreme too, and it was during my Mentor roulette. I was absolutely out of my depth, but I pulled up a guide on my second monitor and got a bunch of sprouts through it. It felt super fulfilling and rewarding!
All the content for casual players in FFXIV is what's kept me playing for so long. It's easy to chat with new people because, like you mentioned, stuff like greeting people in dungeons etc. is the norm. There are defo people who are OTT about how amazing FFXIV is and how nice its players are, but In general I've had a good experience. I haven't played much WoW, but one of my favourite online gaming moments is from it. When I was a kid my brother let me use his account, so I would run around exploring. I bumped into some RPers at Ironforge (had no clue what RP was at the time) and they chatted with me for a while and traded me stuff. It was one of my first online conversations with strangers, and thankfully it turned out to be a really positive one. I remember thinking how cool and nice they were, lol. Really good editing on this vid btw!
I attended a funeral in FFXIV. One of our guildmates died, cancer, we held a three hour long funeral for him ingame, and just talked about him, all the things he did for us and the late nights and fun times. The guild master handed out alcohol and we toasted him. Not to cheapen this but that was also the day i learned if more than 50 people are together in an area the background noise changes to include idle chatter. I bought a new player his first suit so he didnt have to show up in informal attire.
Cutscene etiquette used to be a big problem in ARR because of people skipping the cutscenes in the final dungeon, leaving first timers on their own while everyone else rushed on ahead. It even became a controversial topic as to whether the skippers were being inconsiderate, or whether the new player had no right to force their party mates to waste their time waiting because the new player could just watch cutscenes at the inn later on. The devs eventually ended up making the cutscenes unskippable in the end during 4.2 onwards.
I always heard about this! I know it's something that you obviously can't do now, and those dungeons have been redesigned (thank god!). I'm going to be working on a video soon in regards to why players quit ARR and this will definitely be a discussion! It was such a terrible 'finale' for players. Thank you for sharing!
@@edd_TV FYI those dungeons were only very recently redesigned in 6.1 (this reply was made during 7.0 for anyone reading in future), so there was this interim period from 4.2 till 6.1 where you basically had to play the old clunky version, without the option to go with AI party mates, and the cutscenes could not be skipped.
Those were dark times indeed. I still can't believe it took so long for Square Enix to fix that problem, let alone that they thought putting such long cutscenes in a dungeon was ever a smart idea. People absolutely quit the game over it.
I remember zoning into Praetorium and asking "Anything I need to know?" and the answer was "RUN". Later, I used to join partyfinders for Castrum and Praetorium, so that sprouts could have a good experience. How it's now done is certainly not the best way (had a prae run yesterdy with 4 lvl 90 characters and honestly, please let us skip cutscenes then), but it's better for new players.
Great video Edd! As someone who played wow previously and is now playing through the MSQ, i still cant get over how nice people are to sprouts. Ive caused a few wipes in dungeons as a new healer, and everytime people are like "dont worry about it, lets go again" rather than insta-abandons i would get in a wow dungeon.
Thanks El! Yeah it's genuinely very heart-warming and it's so much more humanising. Sometimes you do need an arm around the shoulder and a bit of help or guidance. I feel that once upon a time WoW was like this too, but it's tapered off and transformed into such an ugly place at times now. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
In regards to playing at your own pace. I currently have over 600 hours logged on FF14 and I'm still on the free trial. Between levelling alt jobs, farming MGP at the gold saucer, and helping my girlfriend work through the MSQ to catch up with me, I've gotten a ridiculous amount of entertainment without spending a penny! I haven't even started Stormblood yet so I've got hundreds more hours to milk out of the trial before I finally get round to paying a sub.
The free trial is such a godsend. That's amazing, great job! Get absolutely everything you can out of that free trial! It's so great that it now includes Stormblood too. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences, enjoy the story!
Great video, especially liked the mention of how people need to just sit back and enjoy these games not just rush through and miss out on actually having fun. Huge props for the editing and flow for this one. Keep them coming!
One of my favorite moments in FF14 was when i queued up for a old raid and when it finally pop a family friend at the last moment had to ring my door bell. I told everyone sorry i need to step away. When i got back as soon as i can, everyone waited and even dancing. I thank everyone and appreciate they waited Ff14 isnt perfect and i agree with this video on it but it does have those moments that makes me truly appreciate the community
It's amazing how something that comes across so simple sticks out in your mind and has so much weight and emotion to it. Kindness can go such a long way. That's a really sweet memory, thank you for sharing!
I mean nice anecdote but both communities have that. it really just depends on who youre with. I've had people wait and be understanding with me in wow and ive had people vote kick to grief in FF14 theres literally a sub on reddit about toxic weirdos in FF14. both games have their good players and bad.
@@xarbinchaoticneutral1785 100% right. People in WoW might be more upfront about being dicks but in FFXIV it's more passive aggressive and tip-toey, but they absolutely exist in both games.
The community in 14 is a lot nicer up to a certain point. Coming over from wow it was refreshing until trying to pug Savage for the first time. The toxicity of players in PF there is almost equal to WoW, it's just more passive aggressive vs straight insults. It wasn't an amazing experience from my point of view. 14 players in general are defensive over their game to an obsessive level that even if they don't like something about it themselves they will argue it until they're blue in the face just because they can't hear an negative opinion. It's a weird place sometimes.... Still prefer 14 over modern WoW tho.
Hard agree. The PF can be a dangerous and toxic place. I don't have a great deal of experience with Savage in the PF but I have done Extreme farming and such and I've seen how bad it can get, so I can't even imagine how bad Savage must get. I think you have described it perfectly; it feels more tip-toey rather than straight up horrible stuff in WoW. I'm in total agreement with you on all of this.
I suppose to many, “a certain section that is clearly equivalent to the toxicity in WoW” is fine for them, as raiding for MSQ stuff and other stuff that is not above MSQ can be ignored if they want to, and if they are that toxic person that wants to raid to feel superior and therefore would consequently put people down for it, they would gun for raiding and other stuff. It’s not necessarily a solution but rather a self-sorting. Thus, because no one has to care any further, it is far better than not just WoW but many other MMORPGs. It is not just a game, but blissful paradise where they know the story is good, the raids are good, the characters are good, etc. Thus the scattering from Dawntrail. Shadowalker (base Shadowbringers-base Endwalker) was a miracles and the reason the illusion did not break during the patches is that FFIV is still beloved and people do not rank the patches as their own things but things to tide them over until the next patch, so while there will be detractors from EW patch content, to most DT had to hit its mark, and it did not. Thus the typical reactions like misogyny/transphobia against a known trans woman, two main camps based off of two main appeal with a insurmountable divide only solvable by somehow stitching the two together, and other classic fandom behaviors. FFXIV playerbase is not a better playerbase, it is a playerbase who has had every expectation met and exceeded.
PF definitely is a shit place, but toxicity isnt the biggest reason I'd say to avoid it imo. The main reasons would more be that people don't read PF descriptions, so no matter how clearly you say (eg) OQ5 Q-Go at least two people are gonna come in doing hector and wipe you... The second is that a lot of the time people are just bad. I don't mean messing up the prog point, if you join a prog party and mess up the mechanic that is being progged that's understandable, I mean prog parties for the end of the fight where one guy can't do the second major mechanic. This is common and it's maddening and only gets worse in clear parties... The third and imo final nail in the coffin is it takes a long time for PF to fill, so once you deal with one of the problems above and people leave, you're stuck waiting 15-30 minutes for more people to join and be just as bad ... Moral of the story raid with a static if at all possible, you might not clear as early in the tier week wise but you will clear with so much more sanity (also holy shit I wrote a lot thank you for coming to my Ted talk)
@@Lucy-dg9en Agreed on all fronts! Really well written and explained. Thank you for taking the time to type this up and thank you for watching the video and coming to my EDD talk.
Yeah on the surface 14 definitely has a generally nicer player base but while WoW suffers from toxic negativity 14 suffers from toxic positivity. In WoW you’re definitely overly criticized but in 14 you can’t criticize at all even if someone deserves it.
Moment I remember. Was old Starcraft 1 multiplayer game i did with a friend where we both agree not to attack each other for like 20min and all I did was build nukes in the very back so when the 20min timer happen i got to use the Quote in game "You called down the thunder. Now reap the whirlwind." and level everything he had with my preset ghost since he lacked detection. Though if you want a more recent 1 several months ago i finally got around to playing Sekiro and beating that final boss felt great after so many failed attempts so so many and I still remember that fondly.
That's a great story with your Starcraft game! I've heard so many amazing things about Sekiro but I honestly don't think I'm good enough for those kinds of games. Thank you for sharing and watching!
I guess a memory of a better time I have is back when I started WoW in vanilla because of how fresh and unknown it was. Everything was a new discovery, there were no guides on how to do things, players didn't yell at you or leave the group if you didn't know how a dungeon worked. I had already played Warcraft 3 back then so getting to visit familiar and iconic places was incredible. I've always been a person who doesn't like to rush things. I play at my own pace experiencing and exploring all I want. I started the free trial of FF14 some time in the middle of Shadowbringers and was just playing casually solo for the best part of two years. During that time I did meet some really nice people and I actually subscribed so I can experience the msq and play alongside them. That is probably my best memory from FF14. Today all those people either don't play anymore or do their own thing in the game. So I am back being a solo player and it sucks. The thing you said about yourself in WoW and how you were left alone happened to me but in FF14. Now I just log in to do the msq and when that is over I level all the jobs to max and log out. Like you said, everyone is in a hurry to get things over with. No one really wants to speak during a duty. Everything has to be done as fast as possible because the end goal became more important than the journey. Guides became much more of a focus and you are not welcome if you haven't watched a guide. I understood that in WoW because it has far more of a focus on end game raiding and gearing and using addons. But in FF? I don't really care about gearing to the max. I enjoy the challenge of clearing a raid and if I think that the clear I got was good enough for me then I don't care about doing it over and over and getting gear. I can do it once in a while just for fun if I feel like it but not to the point that it becomes a grind fest of tedium. The only addons that I use are reshade, chat bubbles and a housing addon that makes placing furniture easier and I can do without all of those. I think FF is a much more friendlier game when it comes to clearing raids and doing rotations. What I mean by that is the game doesn't require top of the line gear or absolutely perfect rotations to clear anything. I am a person who still has that feeling of discovering stuff by myself back from vanilla WoW. I like to go in a raid without knowing anything and experimenting and learning from my mistakes and creating a strategy to clear. That feeling when your plan works if amazing and it's even more rewarding when you share it with like minded people. But FF has become part of that treadmill where you don't get to see a mechanic for the first time because you already saw it in a youtube video explaining how it works. And if you didn't then more than likely you are not welcome in the group. Even rotations aren't hard to figure out. They won't be perfect but if you use all your abilities and cooldowns then you'll probably do more than decently and get a clear. I've noticed that there are very few people with my playstyle, who want to discover things themselves. Maybe people who are playing on a console so they don't have access to addons and like to spend their time in game rather than watch a guide, but those are few and far between. I really wish FF had a casual blind raiding scene because it's lonely in my corner of the game. Cheers from Light-Twintania.
I still have really fond memories of both Elwynn Forest and Westfall. Every time I play a new character or even fly through the zones I'm hit by such a massive wave of nostalgia. It's very bittersweet. I know somebody who feels exactly the same as you in regards to blind and not wishing to use guides. It's very difficult due to patience levels I think and just a case of people wanting to get things done. I can sort of relate. With my old group we used to do a week or two blind and see how that went and then if we got stuck we would start looking into guides. I really appreciate you taking the time to watch the video and for typing this up. It was a good read! Don't give up on finding a blind prog group, they do exist! You are right, it's definitely a small corner of the game but keep a look out in the party finder and maybe reach out Reddit or Discord. I hope you can find something. All the best.
I enjoy not being called an idiot in dungeons in XIV, but honestly I came to think that the lengths it has to go to remove toxicity from casual gameplay is not worth it in the long run. XIV removes all mechanics that can cause friction between players. I play tank, and in WoW I can be flamed for having a sh1t build, gear, talents, not knowing my class, not knowing dungeon specific mechanics (kicks, cc, layout quirks etc.). In XIV I don't have a build, gear is pretty much nonexistent outside savage, all tanks are homogenised to the point that I have the same hotbar layout on all of them, all dungeons are a single corridor with strictly distributed mob packs. I can't even control the size of pulls anymore in DT because there are so many walls. Like yeah, one one hand I'm less stressed about underperforming or not knowing something, but on the other it's only because there's nothing to know and nothing to learn. I have near zero gameplay agency.
I think you're right to an extent. I personally think we should be able to call out anything and have a healthy discussion over it. I think there is still friction within content like savage and so on (the latest tier probably isn't the best example as it's easy by comparison to its predecessors imo), but I get what you're saying. I think if it encourages or forces low stakes gameplay then that's not going to be fun either. I'm with you on both the homogenisation of tanks and wall-pulling too. I think dungeons could really do with a new coat of paint. I'm not sure how exactly but wall-pulling is quite tiresome. And I'm the same as you, I have my hotbars set out exactly the same way for tanks; I only play DRK and GNB but they have a lot of abilities that are the same - Dark Missionary and Heart of Light, TBN and Heart of Stone etc. It's just way too similar at this point. I'm confident for a big revamp in the next expansion, but people said that about Dawntrail, so I don't want to get my hopes up too much. You have summed it up really well, and I think that is by design for SE. Like you can optimise and you can theory craft and everything else, but it's nowhere near as in depth as WoW is and whilst I think that's a good thing, there are always going to be players who want more or feel a bit demotivated and unmoved by it. I think the next expansion could be a huge transition period for FFXIV. I hope so. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings!
The greatest thing that Shadowlands did for WoW was breaking the final straw for its players and helping us see just how lost we'd gotten in our own BS. TY FF for opening my eyes and helping me find the fun again. ~Sincerely yours, A former WoW refugee~
Allow me to pull from the games in question in this video for another point in "how FFXIV hits different" -- The legacy of the players of 1.xx. There's a literally-and-hour-long piece of credits in 14, when one clears the 2.0 MSQ, called the "Meteor Survivor List"; those are players from 1.xx, who were there more-or-less when the curtains fell and Bahamut had his temper tantrum and blew apart parts of the world. The "Great Goobbue Wall" that some NPCs mention having happened during the Seventh Umbral Calamity (that is, the events right before ARR)? That too is the legacy of 1.xx, a horde of players on multiple servers mounting up on the goobbue mount one could get in 1.xx, forming a visual wall of those big beasts to get between the Garlaeans and Voidsent trying to get into Ul'dah from Thanalan. We were there when the BGM was a warbled version of the track "Answers" (now known as 'Answers (Reprise)') across the world, knowing the MMO we enjoyed was going to shutter and hopefully get relaunched in a better form, and instead of abandoning it... many of us stood our ground. Fought the mobs in the closing event with no rewards and possibly to us dying because we were woefully underlevel (like me, XD), because of that sense of community and "this is our game, our world" that showed that, even back then, 14 hit different than other MMOs.
This is such a great comment. I LOVE that survivor list too, I think that's so damn cool! I think XIV will always be set apart from anything else because of the way it was predicated. It's such a fascinating story and journey, and whilst I'm not an OG or even a veteran, I'm so glad to be a part of it now!
One of my best memories in gaming overall was playing Shadow of the Colossus for the first time, and meeting the first Colossus. It felt like I had to physically look up to see the top of the thing! As for in FFXIV, I was farming some demimateria for a friend by making rings and desynthing them. A sprout came up to me and explained that he had just unlocked AST and had no good gear, nor the gil to buy it. So could I make him some stuff? I leaped up and went on a crafting and gathering spree to get this baby AST what he needed, and was so happy to hand over a full set of HQ gear free of charge! I hope he's still having fun with the game!
That's a great choice for your memory! That's so nice of you to do that for a new player! It's really heart-warming to see stories like this. Thank you for sharing!
That's very kind of you! I'm glad we have such generous people in the FFXIV community. I myself have received a few random gifts from strangers I never even talked to before, like minions and things. It's a nice surprise, and a memorable moment for sure. I miss little things like being able to craft bags for people with new characters back in WoW. That said, I would never feel comfortable going up to a random stranger and just asking to be given things. Especially when it's not a matter of needing help or advice, it's just that they wanted something and didn't feel like waiting til they earned it like anybody else. I really don't like it when people beg for stuff in MMOs, like gil, items, or if they ask for a commendation in a dungeon. They aren't some poor soul in need -- they just want something, and would prefer somebody else get it for them. I had a guy ask if I could pass on the pants item in a dungeon once. Now, I don't mind that they asked, because 99% of the time I don't need the item and am just going to vendor it or turn in for GC seals anyway. So I would have said yes -- but in this instance, I hard queued for that particular dungeon, and waited in a DPS queue, specifically because I needed gear. It was the whole reason I was there, just like them, so I told them so. They could have left it at that, and let the rolls fall where they may, but no. They would not shut up about it, and kept bothering me to please pass on the pants, they were farming the dungeon for glam, blah blah blah. They even offered to craft me some pants with a better item level, an offer I didn't even bother acknowledging because frankly I have no cause to believe they'll make good on it after the fact (they didn't). Finally, I got so annoyed with their pestering that I caved and agreed to pass on the pants if they dropped. And guess what, they didn't even drop. All that harassment and selfishness, over nothing. They didn't even bother to toss me a comm on the way out, as a gesture of good faith. Not saying I was entitled to one, just that it would be a way of saying "Thanks! For what it's worth, even if the pants didn't end up dropping, I believe you would have passed and I appreciate it." Maybe because they didn't trust that I would actually pass on it, I dunno. Kind of says a lot about whether they would have actually crafted me anything in that event. If I were them, I think I would have still offered to craft the gear regardless of how luck turned out, but of course they didn't bother to contact me outside the dungeon because they didn't end up getting what they wanted.
@@0Fyrebrand0 Man, the little things like crafting bags for people in WoW is so lost on the game now sadly, and it was such a beautiful thing for its time. I can remember getting those feelings again when I played Classic. It's so exciting for something so simple. Your XIV story is very frustrating, I've seen similar situations like that!
I play both games but have a preference for FFXIV. What really sold me on it was just taking my time and slowing down. I even prefer the longer GCD personally. And being able to do old content, like expansions and even raids is great. I know the old raids arent what they used to be because patches tweak job balance and stuff but they are still fun to see and experience. Even if it isnt the way they were back in the day you can still do them and not just one shot a boss
I feel the same about the GCD these days. I haven't raided in WoW since Castle Nathria so I think getting back into raiding in WoW would be really difficult for me now. I'm totally with you that I think being able to sync/unsync content in XIV is one of its greatest strengths and WoW desperately needs something like it.
I didn't play a lot of video games growing up, but a moment that stuck out to me in FFXIV was a story an NPC tells your character in ARR. I won't repeat it because it's truly harrowing, but it solidified my love for side quests in the game. I love the struggle and plight on the common man in this game, and the NPCs are allowed to do and say things you might never see in the MSQ. In short, the NPCs and their stories feel way more real and affecting to me than anything in the MSQ.
You do see some real hardship in this game and it makes you think. You raise a great point too, it's not JUST the MSQ but it is just the common man and the NPCs; the side quests and even just chat bubbles with the NPCs. There is so much there if you look for it. Thank you for sharing your thoughts!
One of the best community moments for me were in Battlefield 3. TONS of machinimas, cartoons, memes, clips and music videos. Game was GREAT and community thrived! I miss it very much..
That's a great memory to have. I feel the same about Counter-Strike: Source. I used to play very competitively in leagues and such, but played on a casual 24/7 cs_italy server, they were such simple but great days.
This was a very good video. I wasn't sure what I was expecting when I hit play, but you made me think of many things I have experienced over the years. First, to answer the question you made, about a special moment in video games: I have 2 stories, the first time I saw the scepter open the hidden door in Uldaman. I ran that dungeon with guildies. I also remember the time we completed the jailbrake quest. The second, however, was the friends I made along the way. I remember meeting one of my best in game friends camping at Ashenvale and we became best pals over the following months. Just taking a step back from the hustle of questing to spend time with people. And here is the thing, I feel that was completely lost during my time playing. I left on early cataclism and I had already felt the sting of player indifference. Sorry for this following story, but allow me the time as a veteran. I was part of a great guild. We were not top raiders, we were probably mid at best, but we always strived to complete content at our own pace. I was it's GL for some time and we had a thriving community. We even met irl, some people travelling half a continent just to meet. And we also had a pretty interesting mix of people from US and Canada and people from Latin America. We ran raids with 2 voice chats so information was relayed in both languages. I had to step down from GL due to life commitments. I was still part of the officers but I couldn't dedicate as much time as before and the same my previous GL did, I passed in the position to a real life friend, who had been an amazing presence in the guild. Anyway, it took only a few months for things to go sour. It started with one raid leader saying to one of the Spanish speakers that it was not the responsibility of the guild to teach them the raid, that people should PUG to learn the raid and then attend the Guild raids only once they mastered the fights. That was complere opposite to what the guild had been so far. This was probably very close to the end of WOTLK. I spoke with the raid leader and he told me he would not change his mind. I spoke with the GL, who knew us both irl, and she supported the RL. I feel something broke inside of me. I said goodbye and left the guild that had been my home since early vanilla. Behind me, a lot of the latinos followed and the guild post their best tank and 3 of the best dps. After that, the game started to change. I took a long break from Cata until late Legion and found myself chasing the high end. I would go into mythic dungeons and would get frustrated and one time I even yelled a group of friends I was playing with. The next day I contacted each one to apologize. I realized at that moment that I had become a toxic player. But had allowed that mentality of always chasing the next shiny thing get to me and in turn, I had abandoned the player I was on those early expansions. I got afraid and even unistalled wow, as I didn't like what I had become. I returned some time later to rejoin my friends and then shadowlands happened and at that moment I realized I was chasing what I used to have in vanilla and TBC, and I realized it was never coming back. I did try to make new friends, tried to talk with people I met during dungeons. Except for a few nice conversations, no one really wanted a friend to do content with. I moved on. I had played FFXIV back in 2014, but having my friends playing wow, I didn't stay too long. Then some friends invited me to play it since asmongold was playing it and I resubbed for them. Waited a month and they never came into the game. I was about to leave the game when I met this person irl who was already an experienced player. With his help, I learned more of the game. I started to find what I didn't in wow, good friends. I have learned so much from them and I have even met some of them irl. It feels similar to what I felt in wow back then. FFXIV is not a perfect game. There are a lot of things other games do a lot better, wow does a lot of things better (pvp, transmogs, etc) but it offers the space to meet real nice people who want to know you and who don't measure you by the dps meter.
The sceptre in Uldaman is a great choice! That was such a cool moment! The Jailbreak quest is something that really sticks with me too. I can remember having conversations with my friends in school and then we all went home to do it. It was epic! I think the story you told is really important, and it's SO important you had the awareness to know what you were becoming and were able to take accountability of your behaviour. It really has become so normalised and I think a lot of players have twisted into something they know isn't really them, but it's kinda just 'how you play the game' now. It's really one of those 'you know the rules and so do I' things. I don't know how we got here with WoW. I think the rot has just set in and the game wasn't policed well enough and this is just how it is now. I can relate to parts of your story, for sure. I think letting go of WoW is an incredibly hard thing to do too, even if you don't enjoy it or feel it isn't good for you anymore. It's such a huge part of our lives and has impacted us like nothing else. Thank you for sharing that story. I hope people will read it! Thank you for taking the time to type it up and watching the video. I really appreciate it.
Thank you for making this video and highlighting some of the reasons why I too, as a former WoW player, don't find the game enjoyable anymore and have since moved on from it to FF14. I know you mentioned an impactful experience that I remember from my time playing games, but I'll just tell you about how community helped me be where I am now. In all games I've played in the past, I used to play a female character because I'm a woman and I preferred them over playing male characters. I started playing FF14 as a Miqo'te girl because I wanted to replicate a catgirl character I had drawn for 3 years prior to joining the game, unrelated to FF14 catgirls. My first character did not survive the free trials being weeded out during Endwalker's horrendous 3-4 week launch period where restrictions were put into place. So, since I had barely gotten to Titan in ARR, I remade my character, still catgirl, and went through all of ARR and by the end of it I really didn't like catgirl body & animations so I used my free fantasia to change into a catboy. It was a strange feeling playing as a male character for the actual first time (alt attempts in WoW not withstanding) Getting used to his voice, his movements, his mannerisms took a while and as I was doing that I was also exploring my interests in the game. I experimented with clubs/venues, roleplay, housing and glamour and from that time period years ago, I retain a love for glamming and a small inkling towards roleplay which just means I shower catboys, primarily, with dotes and pets (but Lalas and tiny Au Ra girls get pets as well). Whenever I'd need to world hop on Light to find items I need, I'd scour Limsa for cute catboys to look at their adventure plate and sometimes compliment them. I don't think I'd develop this fondness for catboys had I not been encouraged by the people I've met in the game. Aside from a handfull of people I've met, the community seems to really like Miqo'te boys, their adorable ear wiggles and cute animations. I used to play WoW with transmog in mind as well, going through content to get the pieces I wanted, but my eyes weren't focused on others. I didn't find the characters unique enough or having a discernible style from how they dressed and looked (WoW models aren't also particularly pretty to look at and I much prefer the environmental art of the game) And because I didn't focus on others, I didn't interact with others and didn't converse with them or compliment them. It's quite easy to just find friendly people in FF14 that just want to hang out and talk and do content together. And without the game's encouragement to be social, I'd had never met most of the people I consider my friends right now, which are mostly catboys too :3 P.S. I might have bumped into you a few times on Odin. ^-^ Your catboy is quite distinct with their red K-pop hairstyle.
This was a really nice read! Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences. I very much agree with you on how basic WoW characters can look by comparison. It's a bit better now but still nowhere near on the levels of XIVs character creation. I'm glad you have found a place in XIV and enjoy so many different aspects of it! It's very possible, feel free to say hello if you catch me again! Thanks again for taking the time to type this up and engaging with the channel. I really appreciate it!
A couple days ago I re-activated my WoW account. I wanted to see if I can truly give it a fresh start and just enjoy myself. One of the things WoW always did well was encouraging exploration and find easter eggs in the wild. I remember when I found Mogli from The Jungle Book and Whinni the Pooh in BfA, just small things that are fun. FF14 doesnt have that. When I logged back in and created a new character, leaving that starter island, I was like "ok, lets go exploring". And I ran from one end of the map to the other... Aaaaand my main gripe with WoW presented itself almost immediately: As you know, if youre a WoW player, the overworld is frozen in time as it was during Cataclysm. Which certainly is fine if you just want to do quests. But then I enterend Darkshore. Im a WoW veteran, I played that game for 14 years and my alliance main was a night elf druid. I knew what happened in Darkshore, what happened to Teldrassil... and everything was just there as it was at Cata times... Hell, even Malfurion was handing out his quests. And wouldnt you believe it: at Auberdeen (I think) there was a portal... To Amirdrassil!!!!!! Like... can you make it even more disconnected??!! Im a lore player. Always have been. I was a lore fanatic when playing WoW, I fell in love with this game BECAUSE of its rich lore!! I read all the quest, read all the books, never bothered watching Belular or Nobble because I knew they were talking bs (in my humble opinion ;) ). So seeing this, Teldrassil and Amirdrassil existing at the same time... I couldnt bear it. That and having Khadgar adressing my freshly created, two hours old character as "old friend". ... I tried. Let it be known, I tried. And it didnt work. I wanted to try The War Within, but couldnt even really start Dragonflight... WoW needs their world to make sense. The island tutorial was a good idea, but its unfinished. There needs to be more. They are now focussing on story telling, which is great (the WoW universe deserves no less), but they need their world to make sense. At least for me. I dont know about others. I thought about doing some dungeons, just to get a hang on group related gameplay again (I hadnt touched WoW for over four years) but with that new character, the only dungeon I could cue up in was a DF dungeon - even before I even got to the Island! I couldnt even cue up for Deadmines! Make it make sense, Blizz. Thats all I ask.
I always loved stuff like that too! They were always so clever with their easter eggs and referencing other media. If you have the time you should check out my 'Island of Irrelevancy' video, I think you would relate a lot and share the same frustrations and gripes I do. It's so incredibly frustrating and if it's like this for the veterans, how on earth are new players supposed to make sense of it!? It's crazy!
FF14 fixed my WoW tank anxiety. My first job in FF14 was Paladin, I would pick up one mob group at a time and no one complained. At the end of the dungeon, I would get commendations from everyone! The positive and patient community has allowed me to actually enjoy playing. Unlike WoW, where I would dread playing as a tank. Life's too short to play a game that's not enjoyable.
I LOVE tanking in FFXIV. Tanking in WoW scares the hell out of me, lol. I can't explain it. I have no problem just wall pulling a dungeon as Gunbreaker or Dark Knight but doing anything as a tank in WoW just sends my anxiety into overdrive, so I totally get you! Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
I’ve been playing FFXIV since ARR Beta, and have gotten to know a lot of people through the years. One thing I’d like to touch up on is the Mentor System, and how it isn’t what it should be. A good majority of people only become Mentors so that they would have the crown next to their name, and would hardly help people. If they got an Extreme Trial through Mentor Roulette they would leave as soon as they see it. I’m honestly one of the few Mentors that enjoys helping others, guiding them on their adventure, and even crafting anything that they may need.
That's a good point. I would go further on that and say some people only applied to me a mentor to try and go for the title/mount. I would admit that I'm definitely doing Mentor roulette for the mount but I do take great joy and pride in helping people and love helping people experience content for the first time. I had an experience once where my Mentor roulette was Ramuh Extreme, and I was totally out of my depth with it. I had to pull up a guide on my second monitor and walk them through it, and it felt really rewarding and fulfilling. You are very right though, some people do use the crown as a bit of an ego trip or whatever else.
I think a big difference that really kept me in XIV was the empathy other players showed during raids that are not going well. Back in my WoW days I had been yelled at, berated, kicked and mocked for not fully grasping raid mechanics and not playing optimally, where as in XIV I've been in raids that have fully broken down and players will rather help solve the problem someone is having than rage quit. The general etiquette is fundamentally different and I'm here for it
I agree. It's the biggest shining light for me. I would never advocate the community is perfect by any means, but compared to some terrible experiences in WoW it's an absolute joy. It's a shame too because once upon a time WoW was so much better in terms of teaching people, helping people and working together.
The difference between FF14 players and WoW players in dungeon is patience, you're right. In FF14 there is some unspoken rule or etiquette that veterans waits for new players to watch before going. In WoW I played during legion when I was a new player, people just ask you to shut up and go. All of the DPS will just zoom ahead leaving you behind. Even if you ask for tips for the dungeon people will just say "go".
It never used to be this way. I do wonder when this changed. WoW players used to be really nice and helpful and working together was a very common thing. I feel like it changed during Wrath-Cata. It's such a shame. WoW is a great game but people will have bad experiences and immediately put it down.
First off, Great video! It hits a lot of the things I've been feeling about WoW in ways I could have never articulated on my own! :D That was one of the biggest shocks going from WoW to FFXIV. being able to play at your own pace. I remember back in Legion, I finished all 4 allied races reps as fast as I could before they were released. the grind sucked, everyday I woke up and did 3ish hours just running zone to zone doing all the dailies and then shutting it off when I finished. never wanted to do that again.. then BFA came out and did the exact same thing, on two characters horde and alliance. I woke up, did every daily and every rep related quest I could. then i logged off, fed myself and waited for guild activities to sign on, do that for another four hours and then SLEEP every. SINGLE. DAY. for rough 3 months. I was ragged and so entirely done with the grind I never went back. no other game felt fun because I felt like I was wasting my game time by NOT grinding, WoW never respected my time. FFXIV? I've never felt like I have needed to death grind the game. unless I wanted too! and when I did those death grinds it was tons of fun since I was working towards something I felt I was going to use or enjoy having. I could play other games and not feel like I wasted two days of gametime in the wind by enjoying something else. the burnout has never hit me. I feel like it will respect my time always. Hell I've meet some people that are so confused when they've seen I've barely scratched the surface of anything in it. but they don't rush me they ask if I wanna try new content I haven't done and when I say not yet they respect it and if I say yes I get to go on a fun journey I wouldn't have done otherwise. I just found out about Wonderous tails, I've been playing for like... 5 years now! the other big shock was players being nice, the last two WoW experiences I ever had was, A tank kicking me for being "Unruly and a shit for brains" by asking why we weren't hitting all the mobs in the dungeon, A simple question where at the time we have 50% more exp gains and I asked about if it's the same difference as doing one or two dungeons of exp. that's it. They sided with the tank, and berated me for being stupid. I never wanted to go back. The other experience? I meet someone new, hit it off as friends and enjoyed some long conversations about game health and then Mental health. When they found out I suffered from mental health problems, they offered to do some acts I'd rather not mention here. and when I told him he went to far for my tastes as someone I JUST met, that I wasn't okay with this. HE doubled down. I blocked and moved on only to receive mail from his alts, tripling down and berating me for being "immature." "needing to grow up" "And not being a good enough person to tell him, he did wrong" In FFXIV I have rarely, rarely ever had any bad experiences. I had a healer be mad at me for my tanking in the first pull but we worked it out... something I've never seen in WoW dungeons. everyone I've met has been so understanding and helpful it was almost too good to be true. I wasn't trusting for the first year and a half.... but now I can't imagine playing in a different community. it still sucks in spots but no where near as soul crushing as WoW had been for me..
A lot of my favorite gamer moments come from the Legend of Zelda series. On Ocarina of Time, Not the pulling of the master sword, but the opening of the Door of Time. In Twilight Princess, Watching Midna go from this angry, manipulative and cruel little imp to being tender, kind, and even vulnerable. I got to really experience it all over again with the very excellent manga. TOTK has several, though that may be recency bias: The ascention to the Stormwind Ark, and the drop through the eye of the storm. Watching Riju charge into the fight against the Gibdos. And knowing she's going to win. The Final Tear, and the retrieval of the Master Sword. It's a VERY heavy punch to the feels, right up there with FFXIV's best. Tales of Symphonia: "Feel the pain of those inferior beings as you BURN IN HELL." It's even better when you fully understand the context. Skies of Arcadia. Just...Skies of Arcadia. Incidentally, the Void Ark story has MASSIVE Skies of Arcadia vibes. FFXIV itself has many, but the crowning jewel is this: "Take it. We fight as one." GOOSE. BUMPS. That, and seeing Y'shtola in a swimsuit. That's been pretty special.
I have a 'Song of Healing' Zelda tattoo. Opening the Door of Time is a goodie! I LOVE that you brought up Tales of Symphonia. I love that game! Thank you for sharing all of these!
One of my favorites moments n FFXIV so far was this roulette raid we were n w a bunch of randoms, and one dps stopped out of nowhere to say phone call. At first no one stopped n waited for them, then, they came back to say that their dog at the vet couldn't be saved and needed put down and every person n the entire raid stopped to offer their condolences and comforting words n I just thought it was really sweet
That's such a sad story :( but it shows how important compassion is! I think it's a really wonderful thing to be able to connect with people and share these moments. I think we forget how powerful we can be and how we can really imprint ourselves on experiences and moments.
Diablo 2: LoD will always hold a special place in my heart. It’s the game that truly shaped me as a gamer. Even now, my favorite character is still Diablo from Diablo 2, because of all the memories tied to him. I’ve also played WoW, ESO, and FFXIV, and I think each has its own strengths. In my experience, FFXIV’s combat design really stands out, feeling more refined compared to WoW and ESO. However, when it comes to the gear grind, I find FFXIV lacking. Not that it’s poorly done, but once I’ve finished gearing up my main for the expansion, I tend to log out and wait for the next patch. With WoW, there’s always more gear to chase, and in ESO, there’s usually a set that’s fun to experiment with or handy to collect. If FFXIV had a more engaging gear system, I think I’d enjoy it even more. For now, I’m there for the story and the social aspects, but the endgame just doesn’t feel as rewarding to me.
That's great about Diablo 2. I haven't played the Diablo games but I know how passionate the player base is and 2 is held in such a high regard. I think you're right and I think it does come down to what players want out of the game I suppose. Like I'll be bis this week in Dawntrail and then I'm kinda thinking 'Well what am I gonna do now?' whereas if this is WoW I could be maybe trying to push score in Mythic+ or maybe some things that could be considered a bit unhinged like trying to get something to war/titanforge or have tertiary stats on it. And I think you make a good point too. It's not just gear in WoW, there are talent trees, tier set bonuses and of course trinkets can really impact gameplay too. I wonder if they will try and reinvent the wheel with gearing going forward. I do feel that the game is in need of a real shake up in the next expansion, from class changes to maybe other drastic things! I think the story and social experiences are far greater than anything else the game can offer. I think in terms of combat/gear I think WoW is far superior and more satisfying. Thank you for taking the time to watch and typing this up!
I do agree that players play WoW badly and that leads to a lot of the problems. But… That’s kinda WoW’s fault (and Blizzards). From the moment something launches in WoW it has an expiration date. Every item, every dungeon, every raid. There is so little evergreen content that if you don’t play it as soon as you can you’ll never experience that way. Even as an expansion goes on Blizzard reduces difficulties and makes changes to the content, if you didn’t beat that boss in the first few weeks then you never will beat that iteration. The option is taken away from you. WoW plays more like a season based game where you have a narrow window to experience the content sat it’s best and once that’s passed there is no way to even come close to it. Even the closest thing WoW has, level synched dungeons, are trapped behind a system you can level out of. Add into that how wildly classes can change in WoW (even within a single expansion and its patches) and it’s all pushing you to do the content -now-. Plus if you want to play a different class you have to start all over again. Take ICC for example. That’s a raid people enjoyed for a lot of reasons. But before Classic Wrath you couldn’t really experience it. Even if you had a dedicated raid group of people limiting their level it still wouldn’t be even close. Not only are the classes different but entire player stats no longer exist in the game that did the. (examples being Armor Penetration and Spirit). WoW has taught its player base that if they don’t rush content then they’ll never get to experience it. That doesn’t leave a lot of time for exploration and just having fun. you said it yourself, WoW is the king of FOMO and it’s shaped how their players function
Yeah, you are absolutely right. It's their method and philosophy. The ethos of the game will likely always be whatever is coming next/is relevant at the time. You make a really good point with 'WoW has taught its player base that if they don’t rush content then they’ll never get to experience it. That doesn’t leave a lot of time for exploration and just having fun.'. It really does sum WoW up perfectly. I think it's something that is just normalised and accepted with the game now too. You kinda know what you're signing up for because the game has always been this way. Thank you for taking the time to type this up, it was a good read! And thank you for watching!
Nonsense, this is just delusional. FF14 is overall a far worse MMORPG, but where you got the hater crowd in WoW that just always whines about everything, you got the fanatic fanboys in FF14, who hate on everyone who does not eat the lies and praise the game Square milks since many years meanwhile as the new god. When the crybabies and the fanatics joined during Square's PR campaign to find replacemenrt for all us old players who didn't eat their shit anymore and left, this worked, because it was a perfect mixture, but of course lies never live long and while those lured in players had of course all the old garbage as "new stuff" for them, at some point they still hit the actual current conrent and had to realize how shitty and meager it is. That's why majority left again, but for Square it was a lot of money they made with no effort, so a big success. You now keep on lying, but whom do you want to lure in with it anymore? And you are talking a lot of shit. "Rushing content"? You talk about ICC, that is over a decade old content, you had endless time to do it, but of course they don't just keep everything important for all eternity coming. Neither does FF14. Hell, FF14 is so bad, they force you into old content, but don't adapt it, so it doesn't feel AT ALL, like it was when it was the actual current content. You simply got no clue what you are talking about. The fact alone that WoW is doing somethign like classic and that for free, is already 1000 times more than what you got from Square. And I don't even care for Classic, but I can admit that they put a lot of effort in to let peopel do it, just as in everything else. I wish that Square had put even 10% of the effort into FF14 than Blizzard into WoW, then the game wouldn't have become shit.
The saddest example I saw of someone getting mad about roleplaying in a Role Playing Game was someone getting mad at roleplaying in Dungeons and Dragons of all things, the game that freakin invented the genre.
That's crazy. I've never gotten into D&D personally, but I have many friends who love it and like you say, it's the precursor to all of this! I think the TL:DR is, people hate things they don't understand.
I've beaten multiple ultimates and cleared every raid tier on patch since the beginning of Shadowbringers. But I still fiddle with my house for hours, get immersed in expert crafting, do silly stuff in Gold Saucer and sit around chatting in game and in discord with my friends, from my static and FC. Yes, I do play for those moments between seconds, for the rush of victory and the challenge of a difficult fight - it's take me three months to get through DSR. But it's not the whole game for me. Not the whole reason for playing. All I need to do is cap my tomes every week, and that's the extent of the "job". Everything else is just done for my enjoyment.
Great job! I'm yet to do any ultimate's but it's absolutely something I want to sink my teeth into sooner rather than later! TEA and DSR look so appealing to me. You sound like you have a really healthy mindset with the game. It's refreshing to hear people who play the game at a really high level, but also do things very casually and take the time to relax and chill too. Thank you for sharing!
@@edd_TV I recommend that you do try it! The fights are extremely fun and will make you a much better player mechanically. But yes, I do try to not get caught up in the rat race. New patch and new tier are always fun but I also spend hours and hours doing side content (island, maps, housing etc etc etc) and it’s been an absolute pleasure. I hope more people can find the enjoyment in those simple, casual things. They make the game a home.
I want to give tanking and healing a try in WoW, but the pressure to know exactly what I’m doing by most of the community has me reconsider every time FFXIV? When in doubt, I got 5 words to determine what tank I play “I…would like…to…RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE!!!!!!” Absolutely love Warrior, and I never would have discovered that without knowing the community is very open and accepting of new players making mistakes
I've always been a healer in WoW, I kinda fell into it due to classes my friendship group were playing. That being said I did fall in love with healer all the same. I'm not a massive fan of healing in FFXIV, it just doesn't hit the same for me. However I'm totally with you on tanking. I would NEVER tank in WoW, there's just far too much pressure and responsibility there. I really love tanking in FFXIV though, mainly on Gunbreaker and Dark Knight. It just feels so much more chill and inviting, and honestly more fun! Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
I am starting to tank a bit more on the lower levels to be able to get to mentor one day and, at times, help out another friend with the leveling. I know my way around and do the pulls, but whenever I see someone in a cutscene, my brain goes to a complete halt and just wait XD I know what's like to missing out and didn't want to pull until everyone is ready. There were at times, also, where the healer is new and can't do big pulls, which I pulled at a slower pace. I'm really glad that I was able to turn my brain off from "trying hard" or "knowing how to play" coming from WoW (I started towards the endings of Shadowbringers). I was told constantly level 50 is where it starts to be fun or it'll take a while, but it's really good. I turned that off, cause uh.... I was already hating leveling thanks to WoW XD I started out new and took it a slow pace. I tried different jobs until one landed me right. Then I did some of the side content stuff. Heck, one stream night, I did nothing, but SIDE QUESTS to see what was it like on that expansion (I have went to Dawntrail on the quests). The game isn't perfect, but it is a pace I am really glad that I stuck around. Heck, I had mixed receptions with the latest, but then I hear these discussions, theories, and even connections that it really made me think of the expansion in a different light. Now I can't wait to see more and pay VERY close attention to the details XD Which I think brings up one point that I think FF14 excels at comparing to WoW: Story. I may have skipped a few of the raids, but when I did get into it (for me, it was the Bahamut series), I realized there was a connection that goes later in the story! I was like "Wait a minute" and connected the dots. It felt good! With WoW, even if I were to go back... there are some major retcons or the story that gets a bit of a drag (Shadowlands, for me), and it's hard to connect. What drives me is the connecting the dots and FF14 does that, which is what I get giddy about when I find that said connection XD
I think you make a great point with levelling when you take experiences from WoW. Levelling is kind of just...a means to an end in WoW, whereas in XIV it's SO much of the game. The dynamics are so different. You sound like you're having a great time with the game and playing it how you want to, and that's honestly what it's all about! You'll find yourself being so much happier. The story with WoW has been really disappointing in recent years. The lore generally is brilliant, but so much of it exists OUTSIDE of the game and has to be consumed via comics, novels and so on. It would be so much better if everything was in the game. Thank you for taking the time to type this up and for sharing your thoughts!
@@edd_TV no problem! And that’s the other thing I forgot to mention, yeah. Some of the big important lores that happened in WoW was mostly from outside media. That’s not a generally bad thing, but if you’re a player that focuses on the game only, you’ll miss out some of the deals FF14 has stories outside, too, but they’re generally stories that you can read in without missing much (one example being Pipin). It’ll help the concept overall, but you don’t really have to do much to get into the lore. Plus, the game, itself, has lore inside that can really make things interesting. Jesse Cox had a few pointers that happened in the previous expansion from a dungeon OUTSIDE the MSQ that helped establish a hint for Dawntrail. It’s honestly really good going back and finding these little bits and pieces :D
My favorite moment/memory in a video game comes from Gran Turismo 4. It was when I finally bought my first race car: the Toyota GT-One (TS020). I used it to try and win the World's Championship. And while I couldn't beat it at the time, it was my first proper race car and I'll never forget it.
I think what drove me away from FFXIV after a while was actually the Post-Endwalker MSQ. It felt like the writing took a massive nosedive compared to what the story was that captivated me from HW to shadowbringers. Besides that, I also got turned away from the community, which I found was surprisingly bigoted and hateful which took me by surprise (Mateus server). I would like to go back to xiv, but WoW has improved a lot since I returned and I'm not sure I have the time; yet I would like to at least go through the Dawntrail MSQ soon (despite it's mixed opinions). Great video though!
I really agree with you on this. I loved the base MSQ for Endwalker, but I found post extremely flat! I wasn't into it at all. Like I didn't hate it but it just didn't feel great. I'm really sorry to hear about your experience with the community, that's really unacceptable. it's definitely not a shining light like everybody says it is. It has its ups and downs like everywhere else and I don't think that's talked about enough! I hope you can get back into XIV eventually. Dawntrail is definitely a mixed bag but the gameplay is brilliant. I'm going to hold off judging it until the MSQ has concluded but yeah, definitely divisive! Glad to hear you're having a blast with WoW too. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and your kind words!
I think the biggest issue when it comes to player mentality is just how everything on the internet is solved and decoded. It’s hard to have an adventurer’s mindset when everything is already known. And I’m not sure if that can ever change and go back to the way it used to be. But I miss hearing lore from word of mouth; having that friend IRL that also played WoW and told you about a super cool wolf rare in Duskwood that only spawns at midnight, or something like that. The gossip might not even be true, but it made it so fun to run out and try to find it yourself. Now you can google the situation and be told everything there is to know about it. And to wrap that back around, I don’t think the onus should be put on players having the wrong mentality or being the problem, it’s just…not the same. It’s hard to be an explorer in an MMO now.
That's so true. I think that's why Classic couldn't ever capture the same. It was still really great to go back and remember the world as it was, but with all the knowledge we have these days with tools like Wowhead, guides on TH-cam and so on. We just have so much at our disposal. I do think we have probably just become too used to the game, certainly in WoW's sense. 20 years is a crazy lifespan for an MMO, it is really difficult. You're right.
Funnily enough I'm probably at my weakest in PvP, although I did main a healer in WoW! That being said, I played A LOT of Crystalline Conflict during the first season and ranked in Crystal. I main Ninja and I had so much fun with the Limit Break, it's just crazy! I never really played CC outside of its first season though. I do Frontline but that's mainly just to level alt jobs because the xp is so crazy.
I was on the server Asmon came to. His fanbase that followed along with him tanked the community on that server. There was so much poor behavior and toxic habits from WoW that took a lot of them a long time to unlearn. In the end, the server was never the same, but folks did start getting along with time. But Asmon's followers badgering him to play FFXIV? That's an issue with his followerbase - not with the FFXIV community. Background: WoW from Wrath - Pandaria (progression raider Cata-Panda), ESO tester and Raider, FFXIV Savage/Unreal/Ultimate raider
That's such a shame, I'm sorry to hear that! I think the followers of Asmon were FFXIV players who were keen on watching him progress through the story but his followers are also very unruly and temperamental, I hear what you're saying. It could be a mixture of both. I don't think Asmon's 'true' fanbase were ever interested in him playing FFXIV. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
Asmon confirmed himself that there were “wow andys” that pretended to be ffxiv players in order to harass him into not playing the game. There were forum posts even before he actually started on xiv, from people intent on sabotaging him trying other games who then carried through that plan in stream chats. I’m not sure how many of those people there actually were compared to real disgruntled ffxiv players, but they definitely existed and it was premeditated. Just makes me sad all around.
@@Cellybeans That is really disappointing to read. It's probably a bit of both, yeah. I think there is a lot of fear with WoW players and XIV. I think they know they will like it but their thought process and basis is just 'trash weeb game' and they dare not sway from that. I can remember watching a specific stream where he said he was getting fed up of his viewers asking him to play FFXIV. It makes sense to me that those people were likely FFXIV players interested in him progressing through the MSQ. I have to admit I was glued to his VODs and really interested in his journey and really looked forward to seeing his reactions at certain points in the MSQ. I sadly don't think he will ever come back.
@@edd_TVyeah it’s unfortunate. I imagine the number of saboteurs were pretty small but they get blended in with xiv players just asking when he was gonna do msq since that’s what they’re looking to watch, and the xiv players who either do or do not want him playing “their game” and very vocal about it. It all blends together and with an audience his size it doesn’t matter the intent, it has the same effect of making him just not want to deal with it. The saboteur he showed the ban log of had the same person heckling him to hurry up and play ffxiv already, alternating with trash talking stupid weeb game, and earliest messages were kind of implicit threats if he went to play weeb game they’d start shit, and the username matched old reddit posts of similar vitriol. It was frankly disturbing.
@@edd_TV Yeah honestly and truly I have little issue with Asmon himself, he just wanted to have a good time and I deeply respect him for that and for how he got engaged with XIV. It really was just his followers that got the XIV crowd riled - because I have absolutely seen players embrace many others whose followerbase is more mature - like Jessie Cox and Dan Jones.
I had wanted to play wow, when it first was announced when I was school. However, between a poor computer for games and just how strict things were, I was unable to do so. I played 14 in beta on my sister’s account and played it when I was able to get it on ps3, and later to ps4, and I enjoy every moment being able to do what I feel like. The community is nice when it comes to new people and also doesn’t really fault when it comes to someone being new to an instance (I find the best thing you can say in chat is “hi I’m new to this” and you will get some people that will explain or put a hat on and ask you follow them). Some of the much harder content (unless you are running the new savage or aiming for world first) people would presume that you watch a video of the battle and get a feel for it. I do wonder at times how WoW is like, it’s places and stories but I also get off put at the idea because of what I hear about the state of the game. Maybe one day I will look and see it for myself, but I think I will explore more of the other games I play for now. As for a favorite memory? Falling by accident down Witchdrop because I did not notice there was a hole and I died instantly.
I think WoW is great but it's one of those 'You just had to be there' things. It's not an impossible job to get into it today but it is very, very difficult. I think the majority of people who still play WoW today are there because of sunk cost fallacy. No doubt they are still having fun but at this stage it's just a commitment. And I kinda relate too, I've been playing it for almost 20 years so I definitely still feel bound to it, but after playing so much XIV it made me realise "How on earth could any new player come into WoW and make sense of it all?". It's just an impossible ask, and then the players get upset, confused, potentially have bad experiences with players and then ultimately withdraw. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings! I also had no idea there was a hole in Witchdrop, lol!
That is kinda disheartening. I’ve heard of all sorts of stories about the raids and the sillies (due to my aunts who played the game) so I was always curious by what they meant. The fact that the state of WoW is like that is… sad? It’s not a good word to describe it, but it’s a game I feel has so much history and love but it’s been tarnished irreparably by something I feel like I don’t comprehend. As for the Witchdrop hilarity: this was when HW was released that I had gotten myself into the MSQ to be in Dragonhead. This is before flight, and if you weren’t paying attention when you go north from the camp, you just… plummet right off and die. I did it when I got there, and was about to return when I saw some random player… also fall off and die. You could get yourself to stay alive if you fell, but not move or press a button, but the voidsent in the drop will hone in on your barely living body and go to town. I sadly don’t see such a thing anymore, maybe because people are aware of the yawning pit or have flight to get around it, but it is something that stayed in my head. I have so many memories with games, but I find the ones I look back on fondly are ones where consequences have been made and I flubbed up in some random way and trying to fix it always leads to some creative liberties.
Suppose I'll throw my hat into the ring. My favorite thing to do in games is to do silly stuff, and solving puzzles. Let me tell you how that made be better at FFXIV. A little backstory: I got into FFXIV like a month before Shadowbringers, and FFXIV was my first MMO. Even now, while caught up on MSQ and in the process of leveling all the jobs to max, I'm not the best, and I acknowledge this. I don't gear the best and I just have fun. I did, however, solo all the Normal Omega raids in Endwalker. As my first experience with the raid series. No, this wasn’t reclears, it was first-time clear. SGE for most, RDM for O9, BLU for O11 and O12 (O12 actually got me to use materia in my gear for the first time). Why did I do this? I found out my one friend, who got into the game after I did and said that we should do the Omega raids together, did the Omega raids with other friends. So this was my silly act of spite in response. The most playful of jabs (while I get throttled by Omega). I then proceeded to have the bright idea to try and solo the Savage Omega raids. It wasn’t a good idea (some fights have mechanics that require multiple people or I die an unavoidable death). But I did complete O4S and O8S in about a collective total of 5 hours. Keep in mind, I'm going into the fights blind, with my only prior experience being my solos on the Normal tier to guide me, so I had to puzzle solve new mechanics on my own (one mech in O4S was a shove that happens if I don't stand in the right color, and as my abilities were timed, I was stuck in Diamondback [90% damage reduction for 10 seconds, but become unactionable and cannot move] when it happened, meaning I had to hope I won a coin flip; I later realized "why don't I cast it earlier so I can move when it happens, rather than relying on a coin flip?" I won the second attempt after that little change) After Dawntrail, I would join parties doing Extremes to get mounts, and one group did The Dying Gasp. And nobody here knew mechanics. So it ended up with me, having the Solo BLU experience, learning the mechanics as they happen and then telling the group what to do. We eventually got it, and on the last pull before people had to leave to sleep (this was at like 3AM EST; my sleep schedule was wack back then); no mount dropped, but triumph was just as sweet. And this opened me up to being willing to try raid content for the current expansion, which is the line (in my mind, at least) one must cross to become considered an experienced player. Because I had the realization that it's solving puzzles, and I like solving puzzles. So yea, that's the story on how I've grown confidence in my abilities as a still fairly inexperienced MMORPG player, and it was all because I like puzzles and being a silly goober. Oh, and if you couldn't guess already, BLU is my favorite job in FFXIV. I love the silly little monster spell guy.
This was such an interesting read. I did not expect to read anything like this, but thank you so much for throwing your hat in the ring! I LOVE that you talked about solving puzzles, because that's an example I had to use recently with somebody talking about parsing and bosses. Boss mechanics are puzzles and are there to be resolved, and that's what the fight should be about! Not the parse. If people want to aim high for parses or whatever else then that's fine but it shouldn't take precedence over anything else. This was a really fun read. Thank you for taking the time to type this up!
@edd_TV Of course. I'll also add that, even though me going solo makes some of the mechanics easier, it does make some mechanics harder. There's multiple times where things would target multiple players, but since it's only me, it only happens once and not 4 times. There's also multiple times where, since it's only me, all 4 of the attacks all hit me at the same time and I just have to deal with it (and no, Diamondback is not always the solution). Either way, it's a puzzle, because the solution for one doesn't apply for the other. And sometimes, it's not possible solo, and sometimes it's just on the edge of possibility if you leverage everything. Case in point, O12S. There's a mechanic where the bosses rush at two different players three times in a row. Getting hit results in a Vuln that causes you to take 10x magic damage (these attacks deal magic damage). And I couldn't survive Solo, cause the net total damage is somewhere about 260k (with Diamondback active, which, again, is a 90% reduction), and I only have about 50k HP. Searching the internet, it is indeed possible. But for my abilities and gear presently, I cannot win. Maybe I will once BLU gets Lv. 90 access, maybe I will still need to improve beyond that. But it's an impossible fight for me to solo due to that one mechanic, despite it being very possible (and not that hard in the grand scheme of things) with other players. But, I am holding myself to complete O12S Solo, as a matter of pride, and because I did the other two solo and I want the trifecta.
I've played both. Honestly, I just cant with WoW anymore. I did the dragonflight thing, and enjoyed the leveling, and going through the zones, but got to the end game, and went nuts to this. FFXIV's end game loot system has made it impossible for me to do Wow's ever again. I have run the mythics, or raids for months an not seen a drop, where in 14 once i get the fights on farm, i can get a guaranteed loot item. WoW just doesn't do it for me anymore. I might be tempted for a classic run or two at some point, but honestly, will stick to FFXIV, and continue to use GW2 as my main side mmo, with a toe dipped here or there into something like EQ TLP's, and Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen when EA comes out later this year. I have great WoW memories, but I just cant anymore. I wont get into the Bull donkey that is the mythic dungeon system, and how hard if you are new to it breaking into actually getting grps for it. My greatest MMO memory goes back to Everquest, 2004, Planes of Power raid on Plane of Water and Coirnav. We were had taken a few cracks already, but we felt we had it this time. So, we pull, the fight is going good, we got through the adds, and were working on Coirnav, his hp was disappearing. I was getting excited as his hp bar was barely visable, like serious less than 1% hp, and my screen froze, and I found myself in the Plane of Tranquility. The guild chat flooded with swearing, and the roster online went from like 70 ppl to 12. Reason, well, Coirnav is the first enrage fight, sorta. You had 15 minutes to complete the fight, and if you didnt, you were banished from the zone, and the boss despawned. Oh, and since this is an open world boss, and stuff, he doesnt respawn for like 5 days or something. I will never forget that night.
I think Dragonflight levelling was really good! The dragonriding was such a nice new coat of paint for flying. The story was extremely mid, I wasn't feeling it at all. I absolutely hear you in regards to gear! WoW felt so much simpler when it was badges of justice or emblems of triumph. It's so convoluted now. I think Classic fresh will be massive when the time inevitably comes for that, and there is something so very charming and tempting about it. It's difficult to resist. That's a really great memory, so interesting to hear a story about Everquest too as I have no knowledge of it whatsoever! Thank you for taking the time to type this up and sharing your thoughts and feelings!
As someone who's played both FF14 and WoW since their launches, (Done mythic and savage, ultimate coils, feast competitively back in heavensward, and have gotten gladiator in WoW 3 times) what I've learned, is playing both when one is on a good ride and the other bad is the best way to be. Shadowlands, which is when i assume most WoW players discovered FF14, was everything wrong with modern wow. Alt unfriendliness, endless grind, boring chores. Dawntrail, which so far, has been one of the most polarizing releases for FF14 aside from maybe parts of heavensward and stormblood, showcased everything wrong with FF14. Repetitive design structure, uninspired and slow (YES SLOW) combat, and poor story delivery (ppl didnt mind exposition dump after exposition dump with 0 gameplay when the story was 'good' but Dawntrail just took that agency away by 100x. Both games can learn from each other.
That's impressive, great job! That's a great way to look at it. Tribalism generally is ridiculous and I think we should be able to enjoy both games but it just comes down to how they function, playstyle and such. You're absolutely right. It would be fun to explore a video about how FFXIV could learn from WoW. My brain will definitely cook something up regarding that. Thank you for posting!
@@edd_TV yes i love both of em. It was so surreal when the streamers came to my server cactuar since i was a bit out of the loop after Castle Nathria and I took my mandatory wow break to prep for Endwalker. It was fun for a bit to see people discovering FF14 and it was great for my wow guildmaster to finally get a chance to try that weird FF game i skipped a few raid nights to play back in WoD.
@@xarbinchaoticneutral1785 I can imagine! That must have been nice if you got some guildies from WoW along for the ride. I think some people do feel that it's WoW or nothing, and it doesn't need to be that way!
for me the pf experience in ff14 kinda killed all partyfinders in other games. Two clicks and your in compared to applying to dozens of parties over an extended timeframe.
Yeah, there was something super disheartening when it came to Mythic+ in WoW and repeatedly getting declined for groups. Even if your raider.io score is great, maybe they don't want you because you're not the right class etc. I main Holy Paladin and I honestly think that's why they gave us a battle rez, just so we would be more viable/sought after in Mythic+. There's a lot of gatekeeping and it sadly comes with the territory when it comes to high level play but It's a huge problem when it seeps into casual play.
I only played WoW for a week, but I still recall my friend noticing me online at an odd hour, and upon finding out I was upset about something at the time he took the time to bring me an in game bouquet and do a dungeon or something with me. Once he was hacked later that week though I stopped as I wasn't going to pay a sub to a game I probably couldn't really afford at the time simply to solo. These days I mostly bounce between GW2 and FF14 as I liked what they had to offer me and enjoy the worlds, but I do think WoW has some pretty environments so it'd be a shame if people don't give themselves the time to enjoy them.
That's a cute story. I've heard GW2 is really good and the latest patch with housing looks a lot of fun! Oh yeah, the art team with WoW are spectacular; the zones and music are just so brilliant. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
@@Violent_Wolfen Yep! They released it earlier in the year on Steam and then recently had an expac release with the first part currently available, next update in less than two months from what I recall. I still very much love the world and curious to see where they keep going with their new release style (though I wish/hope they stop changing that style and we can settle with the current one >.>;; ). It's allowing them more open opportunities to address some interesting story points and history questions. I also still love the Fashion Wars aspect of it ngl =P
One memory that stays with me is when a friend let me use her wow account, i made a human paladin and in Northshire *somebody waved at me*. Another human player!
The emotes were such a cool thing in WoW when playing for the first time! They could definitely use a new coat of paint, I think we should be able to see full face animations when people /smile etc, but there was something so magical about seeing those emotes back in the day. People waving at people and drive-by buffing people in the open world. Great memories.
@@edd_TV i had forgotten about the buffing! As a Frost Mage gnome, i spent hours in Ironforge just "to make people smart" by giving them arcane brilliance.
@@dharusiokay9426 It was always so nice to get Fortitude from a priest when you were knee deep in a cave! I always felt so bad offering only a 5 minute blessing in return.
I've had a few but nothing even close to WoW. I suppose I am comparing several years of XIV to almost 20 years of WoW. I could probably count on one hand how many bad experiences I've had in FFXIV!
as both a WoW player (who only played DragonFlight) and FFXIV (for over 3 years) it is quite scary that players can be toxic enough that it warps their thoughts and make assumptions that is very illogical and even selfish but as a FFXIV and the way you brought up how there are some players that are Toxic Positivity well......I must confess I never had seen anyone like that but that does bring worry, but also glad that at least there are still players who not only still help newcomers out of the kindness but also still take the time to let you dip your feet in plus given how WoW is still quite a popular MMO, I do wish they would be better and I was hoping that Dragonflight would make that difference, which honestly it was a very good attempt it got me more invested into how I see the world and even more so at what's happening but by the time I got to the end, it became the usual thing as you stated "everybody just wants it done, that's it" and that's maybe why I stick more to FFXIV even if I go on and off here and there, but at least overall the game is cared enough show that even bad things can sometimes have a bit of good moments that may change one's opinion and I wanna speak more about WoW for this part, if at some point WoW does improve on both Their Story and even try's make it more appealing to newcomers instead of just worrying about endgame stuff then I would reconsider trying to join back in since I did play the new Dracthyr and its class and honestly I like the idea, but I see alot of things that could be better in fact more so for its viability, but aside from that I like the design of Dracthyr and its own Flying/Gliding ability, since I can finally play as a Dragon Race like I was in FFXIV (Au'ra) and honestly I was having.......fun, yes I can't believe I would say that since no joke I was a bit......eh with WoW but after Dragonflight, it made me look back and think........ya know maybe I judge too personal with it and yea it was thanks to FFXIV for that, but I now wish that WoW would soon try to change its way and hope, oh sweet lord HOPE that players in WoW would at least stop being so stingy and just open up a bit and even more so, if I do go back to WoW maybe when I play my Character again it would be adjust with buffs or nerfs, and I can start playing with my brother again (who's been playing WoW for over 8 years) but overall on this topic very well put together statement and even amazing in depth comparison from both sides
The toxic side of FFXIV does exist but it's a lot more tongue-in-cheek or tip-toey I find, as opposed to how open and aggressive it can be in WoW. I feel similarly to you. I can count on one hand how many bad experiences I've had in FFXIV but they do exist. I've read stories rather than had the experiences directly myself, but overall I can say I've barely ever had bad experiences. I haven't tried The War Within yet but everybody is saying the story is VERY good compared to what has come before it, which honestly isn't difficult. The bar is quite low with BFA, Shadowlands and Dragonflight in my opinion but it's getting a lot of praise all the same. In time I'm going to make a video documenting my story/levelling experience in The War Within and hopefully I'll have some really positive things to say too. Thank you for your kind words and taking the time to watch and type this up. I really appreciate it!
You mentioned there isn't datamining in 14. There is, you just have to go out of your way to find it because Square Enix actively does what they can to stop it so they've been driven to be less public about what they do. That and you have to wait for a patch to become downloadable to be able to datamine. With the exception of outfits, very little will be added ahead of time.
That is true! It does exist but not on the levels of like Wowhead, the PTR and the like. I think WoW would be so much more fun if we aren't privy to this sort of stuff, but the players are the testers at the end of the day and that's what makes the games so very different. I think it also generates a lot of hype for WoW players. It's exciting to see everything that's coming, but also a bit of a shame that everything gets spoiled ahead of time. You are correct though, I do recall seeing datamined weapon skins for the Pictomancer prior to Dawntrail.
I still prefer PLAYING WoW overall since I just think it has the superior combat and gameplay, however I prefer BEING in 14 since it just feels far more comfortable. There’s not the constant little advancement of your power to pursue, you don’t have nearly as much micromanaging upkeep of your character, and while talent trees with different builds are definitely fun it’s also nice knowing everyone playing that job is using the exact same toolkit you are. There just always feels like there’s far more pressure while paying WoW, pressure from the game itself and pressure from the other players. 14 feels way more relaxed and dare I say “casual” (lol dirty word I know). I like tanking in theory but I wouldn’t dare try anything other than DPS in WoW, partly because Fury and Arms are my passion, but mainly because there’s so much more outside pressure with tanking. You have to constantly worry about positioning and swaps in raids, you have to know the exact perfect route and mobs to pull in dungeons, it’s just not fun for me. But in 14 I’m tank only. It just feels so much easier and relaxed, the rotation is more simple than DPS, wall to wall dungeon pulls are surprisingly simple once you know what your mitigation tools do, and in raids (at least for normal) it’s almost braindead. Overall 14 is so nice because there’s just so much less hassle compared to WoW in pretty much every aspect. Not even getting into story stuff, I’ll just say that I still prefer WoW story and lore since I’m far more invested in that universe but 14 delivers its narrative in the vastly superior way for sure.
I do think WoW's combat is just so brilliant. I think casual is the best word to sum it up, yeah. I feel a lot more free in XIV and less anxious about experimenting with things. I would tank in XIV but never in WoW for example, so I share your feelings! I always healed in WoW, I wouldn't dare try anything else. I got good with Holy Paladin and knew it was where I belonged. I LOVE healing in WoW but it doesn't do it for me at all in XIV. I relate to you with WoW's lore and story too, despite how messy things became with Shadowlands and maybe even how flat Dragonflight was, I've been invested since I was about 13 so there is no way I'm ever truly checking out. I'm actually watching a WoW lore video as I type this up to you, lol. I'll always be very interested in the lore of WoW but I'm just very grateful I was able to fall in love and appreciate a new narrative and world too. Thank you for watching and taking the time to type this up. I really appreciate it.
The thing that made me eventually pry myself away from WoW was the community. During the great exodus in 2021, I went to Guild Wars 2 instead of FFXIV. The community in that game is also incredible. It took me 7 months of all day, every day play to have my first genuine toxic experience. In WoW, it was at least 50/50 whether a Mythic+ or raid would have toxic people, ninja looters, or overall toxicity from mechanics. Present day I play FFXIV with a handful of players that I played WoW with. None of us feel that draw to go back.
I've never played GW2 but I did see the latest patch and it looks pretty good! From my understanding I think Blizzard were inspired by GW2's flying and that's where they got dragonriding from? That's pretty good going timewise to have your first negative experience. It's bittersweet to know that you've found a place in XIV with your WoW friends but so sad to know that some people have just let WoW go with no desire to return. I think we will always love it and read about it but for some people it just feels like an old friend you've either had to cut off or lost contact with. It's a weird sense of heartbreak.
Welcome to Eorzea for one. For two, my most enjoyable moment was getting a minion called Salt & Pepper Seal. It's so cute and it wanders around you. I do enjoy all the other stuff in FFXIV. My WoW experience was quitting in 2016 during Legion. Because of playing Warlords of Draenor first. It was boring and annoying. Got the Flying in WoD and I couldn't stand WoW anymore. I didn't have the nostalgia for the game as all the people who played Vanilla. Edit: Another thing, World of Warcraft had minion battle thingy that I enjoyed but you don't have access to it if you are too low level, which is dumb. And there's a lot of powercreep for that game mode in WoW. I enjoyed my time in Wrath of the Lich King. But I can't really stand World of Warcraft anymore. It's slowly changing back to Vanilla where community matters but it's a long time coming until it can reach that level of commitment. Edit 2: I enjoyed every single Expansion in FFXIV. A Realm Reborn, Heavensward, Stormblood, Shadowbringers, Endwalker, and Dawntrail. It's mostly because I enjoy a story that feels nice. Dawntrail is a desive expansion, but it had some good dungeons, and etc. Though, the only dungeon I didn't like was the Turtle at the end of the Lv99 Dungeon. Because it uses enormous Aoes. lol
Thank you! I'm familiar with that minion but I think I got it from one of the Moogle Events! I have the Golden Beaver that I take around everywhere with me, haha. WoD into Legion was really weird for a lot of people. It was almost a trial by fire because we went from having zero content to constantly doing world quests or mythic+. Trying to get our best legendaries and unlocking the artifact tree. The contrast between WoD and Legion is crazy. I loved it personally but some really didn't like how much was being demanded of their time. Nostalgia is a huge part of WoW and I think Blizzard know it. I think that's why they are too afraid to launch a WoW 2. I think there is so much attachment with the sunk cost fallacy with players characters and that's what always draws players back. If they pull the plug on this and do a WoW 2 and it fails, why would players stick around? It's interesting. Thank you for the kind welcome, watching the video and your comment!
@@edd_TV I never got the Salt and Pepper Seal from it's dungeon, the 4.1 dungeon the Scalla one. Warlords of Draenor was one of the worst expansions because it lacked content, they even cut the middle tier Raid, specifically Shattarth or something to that effect. Legion had way too much stuff in it and it didn't really pull me into the game. And I quit before Mythic+ was added. I did like the start of the story I suppose. Though, World of Warcraft does have a problem of timegating its story massively, week 1 (Here's the first bit of the story), week 2 (Here's more of the story), etc. etc. It would be nice if it was released all at once like FFXIV. Since you get the entire expansion on launch.
@@ArmageddonEvil Yeah, there was supposed to be a Shatrath raid! I was so sad we never got that. I think it was 'Assault on Shattrath City' or something along those lines. I have done a video on Legion if you're interested in watching that! Legion has so much good, but definitely has some bad and it was a precursor for a lot of bad stuff that happened in WoW for 4-5 years. I would love them to release the story all in one go. I think if they could adopt the format that XIV has with the MSQ and then do some post story it would be so much better. I think they WILL eventually do this but they are still trying to figure out what works and what the players like I think. It's going to be an interesting but unfamiliar process for them.
@@edd_TV The Worst thing that was in Legion was that the Legionaries were supposed to be easier to get on launch but, the higher ups waited until the End of the Expansion to release it. It's quite sad, I definitely didn't want to go through the Legionaries grind to get the BIS only for it to be nerfed and needed anew Legionary. Gear in FFXIV is good enough, it reminds me of Wrath content. The Free Trial for WoW kinda sucks, and I didn't know you could transfer levels to another character, that's odd and strange no offense. I'll watch that video after World of Warcraft: Why Some Players Aren't Having Fun Anymore. Always good to get some insight in the other mmorpg that actually played that content than I who quit *before* it was released. On a different note, I've played ARR 2.0, a total of 4 times before it was Revamped in 5.3. I decided to only play one character instead of my multiple alt characters I have on the NA Data Centers.
@@ArmageddonEvil I think the way XIV gearing works is perfect. I definitely get the same vibes as you in regards to like badges of justice and so on. It was just so simple and easy to do. I appreciate you engaging and checking out the channel! I've also played ARR four times too! I played it first for my initial playthrough (which I shamefully story skipped), I did it once again to do the MSQ properly and two other times to make sure I could get my friends through it because I knew they'd never get through ARR unless I dragged them through it kicking and screaming. I'm planning on a video at some point in regards to why players quit and throw in the towel with ARR.
I left WoW after an abusive 15 year relationship with Blizzard from 2004. I started playing FF14 and was blown away by the story. On my main I have finished all the role quests for Dawntrail but started an alt character and am slow rolling it through the MSQ. I am leveling all crafters and jobs at the same time and it is so awesome. I don't feel like I'm missing out on things and it makes me realize I am missing nothing from my WoW days. WoW became such a toxic community and it felt like a job logging in. It's a constant Epeen measuring contest with DPS charts and gear scores that is sucked the joy out of the game.
It makes me sad when people describe WoW as an abusive relationship but for some people that is exactly what it is/was. Either that or the equivalent of drugs right? An addiction. For me, watching World of Warcraft fall further and further from what it is was is almost like losing a friend to drugs and they just refuse to get clean. They sink and they sink and they sink and there's nothing you can do except watch. It has definitely gotten better since Shadowlands but it seems unimaginable to me that WoW will find its way back to its glory days. And maybe that's a problem with us, I'm not sure. I definitely miss it and I still love it, but similarly to you I feel free now. The fact that I didn't play the pre-patch or even buy The War Within was very surprising and liberating to me. I'm totally with you on it feeling like a job, and I think both us and Blizzard are guilty of that. We didn't have to do it but we felt compelled to. I think you have hit the nail on the head too in regards to the whole 'e-peen' measuring stuff. It begs the question should MMOs even be competitive? I think the answer is yes on some level, but maybe only in spaces like PvP. I think when the game is clearly competitive on all fronts is when we see gatekeeping at its absolute worst. Thanks for taking the time to watch and sharing your thoughts. I really appreciate it!
Answering your question I can make a summary such as: fiting graft in xenogears, or bhal in grandia with low level. Finishing warioland 4 with all endings, or the end of Devil may cry 1 that make cry. In wow would be doing thing with friends: arenas for example killing a druid when it seems that i loose but I reverted the situation (and resently talking with a friend in a bar in the game as old times), seeing my wife getting new mounts and pets, and transmogs. In ff14 was the end of shadowbringers rolling when some important charactar ask me who I am (I am personally answer " the one who's gonna brake your legs). Or doing all nier quest that came in a very hard moment in my adult life, and so on like getting my first rare mount from a trial. My problems with wow is the layer sistem and part of the comunity website (r.i.p). I hate playing wow and not being abel to see my wife just because i am in a different layer. In valdraken i was looking for her but when we made party i see her, and it is horrible because you kill the comunity feeling and frienship of seeing a friend doing shit around, and forget the about the pvp war or doing invations that now means nothing. as an aliance player was epic to wake up at 5 or 6 am just to kill the warchief when the other city leaders where little bit more easy to kill. I would prefer they change into other sistem of player distribution sistem or tons of lag than that, it pains me. And the second thing was the community. The website used to be more open friendly with players. Did you made a fan art, screenshot or another stuff, go and upload it there. I remember trying almost every weak trying to be in the screenshot day, but with wod they change the look of the page and also other things that i not sure if it still there as the art of the expansion that only people can see of they got the collector edition with the art book. Ff14 dont have that aspect, but at least they made competitions to see the best art to implement in the game. Thanks for reading and I hope you did not have such trouble reading my long comment.
It's not quite the same since it's only on instagram, but the official FFXIV account does feature fan art there every Monday. I didn't play WoW so no idea how their site was but featuring community content regularly does sound wonderful, wish we would have something similar because otherwise it's only in big bulks along competitions and FanFests. Lodestone does have a blog feature but just like the community finder or fellowships in-game, those seem to be only actively used by Japanese players and they never took off with the western audience.
Some really great memories there! I'm very much with you with the ending for Shadowbringers, in terms of a recent memory that one sticks out for me so much. It was epic. Layering is really frustrating, I agree. It feels so weird and sad tome just watching people fade in and out when you join a group or whatever. Thank you for taking the time to type this up, and don't apologise! One of the reasons I started making content in the first place was because I'm really curious to what people have to say and love to hear peoples thoughts and experiences. Thanks again for sharing yours!
"Content preservation" is what admire the most about FF14. The MSQ, all content, all trials and raids are preserved (at least in one way or another), and being "forced" to go through it all is actually an amazing thing. When I see people complain about the MSQ I just want to slap them, they're actively hating on the single best aspect of the game. I believe gameplay, class design, fight design, raids, are all MUCH BETTER in WoW, all actual gameplay aspects are better, so to me if you are playing FF14 and treating it like it's WoW, you are missing the best aspects of the game and doing yourself a huge disservice, to put it as politely as I possibly can. I'm curently loving War Within, and on a long break from FF14. Why? Endwalker felt like the end to me, it was an incredible time to play the game from 2014 to 2022, and I love that new players can experience the entire story beginning to end, I think that's wonderful and recommend everyone to give it a try. WoW might be the better MMO but FF14 is by far the better RPG.
So very true. I would love to see WoW attempt this in some fashion but I feel like it might be a bit awkward with the level squishes and such; you can go into Molten Core at level 10 or 20 now etc. I think a complete redesign where you could 'sync' things to a certain level would be really great for WoW. I can already imagine guilds setting up events to go and run old raids to show people what things were like back then. It seems the perfect opportunity for a timewalking revamp, but as a permanent feature. I 100% agree with you that if you go into FFXIV with what I'll call 'WoW brain', you really are cheating yourself. Whether that's skipping the story or being uninterested in any content that is not current. I would say the same could be said about boosting jobs. It's not the end of the world but you are missing out on a story being told there. I can understand people who boost in WoW if they have seen it all before etc. I'm glad to hear you're having a blast with The War Within, everybody seems to say so! It's very encouraging for me as I plan to give it a stab in the next month or two. I can relate with Endwalker feeling like the end, and I think that was handled deliberately and intentionally, and now we have to begin anew with Dawntrail. And whilst that hasn't had the best start narratively, I'm hopeful they have some big things planned! Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts and feelings. I enjoyed reading this!
WoW is a job. FF14 on the other hand, is a hobby. WoW was built to be a competitive obligation. Where the journey didn't matter anymore, only the destination. Everything is funneled to the endpoint, the specific goal set by those at the top. There's the unspoken rule of 'be the best'. Old content was (unsure about now, haven't played since early Shadowlands) for the most part only seen by people rushing through it to reach the endpoint where all the other people are, if at all. To try new things, one must put in massive effort to make another character and have it reach that point too. For the most part, all people see is the same endgame content, over and over. The only split in 'style' is pve or pvp. Everything is mandatory because everything is tied to upgrades or some form of vendor/system that gives upgrades or mandatory items, which is all needed to even be considered in endgame parties. And on top of that the community created exclusionary rules to optimize things further. You must be a specific build that's optimal, you must have specific scores on arbitrary websites that track effort, you must have specific third-party resources, like addons, installed. Everything is a MUST. Everything is a competition and so everyone must compete or face open hostility. This is fine for people who love to compete, who like the pressure and prestige of being 'the best'. Who want to run on the eternal treadmill to see numbers increase. People who want to spend their free time under pressure to earn and keep a status. FF14 is built to be an inclusive experience. It's all about the journey one chooses to take. (if not a bit on rails for the main scenario) It has and currently is actively outlawing all forms of competitive mindset. It's still there, but hidden. Not allowed to be broadcast. Barely tolerated. Its focus is on the story and individual experiences, building things slowly and carefully with zero pressure to complete them because apart from specific timed events, nothing stops being available. It is a leisure activity. The only pressure it has is fleeting and downplayed; skill challenges that are often kept optional and often are available to anyone who has done the 'tutorial' part and is allowed to travel further than their starting zone. All of its content, from the lowest-level instance to the highest, is still replay-able by every player at every level. Every character can be every role. There is no need for alt characters. No need to compete so no need to be derogatory and exclusionary so long as everyone puts in the effort needed to fulfill their chosen role. There are crazy timed grinds still, but those too have communities that are encouraged to uplift and include as much as they can because they do not lose out on anything if they do. Most rewards are cosmetic. There are nearly an equal amount of gameplay experiences that require NO combat whatsoever compared to that that are combat-focused. This means that the actual competitive aspects (pvp, raids) are considered a bit lackluster compared to WoW more involved system. But it is the better game for those who dislike competition. Who want little or nothing to do with pressure when they gain their fulfillment. Each game has their merits that appeal to different people. Each game has their flaws that turn off certain people. Both are still games though, which are made for entertainment. So long as you are entertained, keep playing the game you love.
That's funny, I literally just watched AnnieFuchsia's video of her playing the last bit of vanilla Endwalker MSQ last night. It went up 3 days ago I think. Man, she does NOT like Zenos at all, lol. I wonder if that's one of the things her viewers were annoyed about..? Honestly, I can relate -- I never liked Zenos as a character either. How they used him at the end of Endwalker was good, though.
He was always very controversial though, right? He was quite established by the time I joined. When I originally finished the MSQ I think 'The Burn' was the final dungeon. I've had friends tell me how much they were pushing him as a character when Stormblood was announced. There was lots of posters, artwork and I think even a statue of him with the collectors edition or something? I don't HATE him but he was quite...samey I suppose? and his motive wasn't exactly enthralling. I agree with you though, the ending for Endwalker was fantastic.
I think so too but it's extremely tip-toey. Almost like when somebody is passive aggressively using ':)' or '^^'. Some are basically playing a game where they are trying to be nice, but it's so very easy to see through. I think the TL:DR is WoW players are upfront about bad behaviour because they so rarely get punished and in XIV they have to dance around it because they KNOW they will get punished.
I feel like the era of XIV players being hyper defensive of the MSQ may be starting to come to an end with Dawntrail. There has been a lot of criticism of it and while there is still pushback when you do, theres enough people criticizing it that the defenders dont really feel like a mob. Ive definitely been called a few things like when I said I didn't like one of the characters voice acting, but in those same replies there were 3 people agreeing with me.
I think you're right. I think we should be able to point out strengths and weaknesses without a war of words. At the end of the day we all want the game to be better, right? I also think if we all agree on the same things then everything is just a bit boring. We need controversy, debate, opinions and such. I think Dawntrail is a good example because it's very mixed. I think most would praise the gameplay; the combat, raids dungeons and whatnot but narratively it was disappointing for a lot of people. It will be a lot healthier if people don't feel silenced or afraid to speak up because they don't want to go against the grain etc. I do agree with you that I feel it's calmed down a bit and maybe this is a turning point going forward. I think it's important for the devs to actually hear some potentially harsh truths at times too because they would want to know. Thanks for taking the time to watch and leaving a comment!
@@edd_TV It was a good video, with good opinions. Sorry to mess with watch time a bit though had to watch at 1.5 to fit in my schedule. One small disagreement with the dungeons also, I have not been a fan of the expert dungeons, tender valley is bearable but I dislike the other 2.
@@MrImjustaminorthreat Oh that's totally fine, I appreciate you taking the time to watch all the same and thank you for sharing your thoughts! I was surprised how hard the dungeons were initially. They seemed a lot harder than things we had seen in the past. I'm the opposite I think, haha. I really don't like Tender Valley but I think Deadwalk is cool! Thanks again for engaging with the video. I really appreciate it!
It's weird because it used to be if you had something negative to say about the MSQ people would flame you. Now, if you have something NICE to say about Dawntrail.......people will flame you. 😂
@@LobsterFusion That is so true. There are definitely elements of Dawntrail I did like but I'm sure I share the same gripes as everybody else. At the end of the day it's all subjective and people can enjoy whatever they want. It is funny like you say though how people expect everybody to unite and march in one direction. We need debates and opinion, otherwise everything is just bland!
@@edd_TV It was a good idea at best, it was a bad implementation since it's just one boss. It would be nice to remove LFR, make story the entire raid and let players go up to 5 with limits, and fill the rest with NPCs. Limits being one tank, so the NPC tank will taunt swap correctly, and maybe put some big warning for the player tank to taunt back so they can learn. Half the healers would be NPCs at least for the same reasons, in case the players are bad at least the group won't wipe and so on. Story should be for players who want to raid, not just be carried, but are not good enough to raid, but also setup so if players are just sitting there or purposely dying then the boss won't be killed so they have to put in effort. LFR should never have been. 25 randoms who sit around playing dead hoping to join a group just to be carried, and worse when you run into a group where you see a DPS taunt the boss on purpose, or 3 seconds after pull turn around and jump off the edge. Yet they mostly get rewarded for that and that sets a bad precedent.
@@akaraven66 I agree with everything you've said. Having one boss seems so underwhelming! I feel these are both really great ideas with the story mode and the follower dungeons but they haven't been implemented or had enough care go into them at all.
There's a few of them. They are Korean commercials and can be found on the official Korean page. I'll leave some links here for you :- th-cam.com/video/efl-IvXAoGw/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/hf3cCkM9M84/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/abdLWmMgCpc/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/-1r3-znGzks/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/lwmQgulEUY4/w-d-xo.html Hope this helps!
You are right in most of it, but you are very wrong on the data mining xD There are several discord servers for that, its a lot more "exclusive" as its not to well known unless you "know people" but it is a thing xD Sometimes I know what Ultimate Weapons look like way before its released. But yeah its not exactly common knowledge thats true.
Oh it obviously exists on some level but it's not as in your face is what I'm trying to say. Maybe I should have been more clear on it! We don't have like cutscenes on TH-cam or a dedicated Wowhead website etc. You are absolutely right! I recall seeing some datamined Pictomancer weapons before Dawntrail released etc.
@@edd_TV Ohh well I never played WoW so not sure how the dataming looks there. But yeah thank god that doesnt exist for FF14 as it probably would take away some fun if its pushed into your face before the actual release :/
@@YvaiatheDemon Yeah the cutscenes will usually wind up on TH-cam immediately. The story isn't remotely as sacred in WoW as it is in FFXIV though, but it's still huge spoilers for some people!
@@edd_TV oh yeah I heard that in order to understand the WoW story (if there is one) you'd have to buy books etc XD Not sure if its true but that sounds so complicated
@@YvaiatheDemon Very much so yeah! There are novels, short stories, all sorts. I talk about a new player experience in WoW in my 'Island of Irrelevancy' video if you're interested in checking that out.
I experienced what I guess people call toxic positivity, but to me it just felt like normal internet rudeness shaped by a cultish obsession with the game. The idea of "FFXIV is part of my personality, so if you insult the game, your insulting me". I like critiquing games, I like critiquing any media, because I feel the point of adding a social facet to media is to talk about it. Do not critique FFXIV in front of its player base. Even something as simple as "I wish this game had chat bubbles like other MMOs" got me flamed in Novice Network. I cannot understand the meme that the FFXIV fanbase is so nice compared to WoW's fanbase. I'm not going to pretend WoW doesn't have plenty of jerks, but my experience with FFXIV was far worse. After giving FFXIV over 4 completely separate "tries" since 1.0, I've resigned that the game just isn't for me. I want it to be, I like Final Fantasy, but I just don't think it's a good game in any aspect. I find WoW's story to be better, and on the subject of WoW copying FFXIV in being story-driven; WoW has always been story-driven. People may not remember vanilla very well but it had some fantastic story quests. Personally, I don't value story as much as I value immersion and exploration. This is probably why I don't like FFXIV, which is the antithesis of these two features. In FFXIV, you are the WoL, you go where the story says the WoL goes and you do what the story says the WoL does. There is zero immersion, it doesn't matter what race/class you are, or the background you imagined for yourself, and your actions are all predetermined. There is no exploration when the game's story has to give you a reason to go places. It's a shame because I've always wanted an MMORPG where I can exist in the world as a white mage. But I wasn't a white mage in FFXIV, I was the WoL.
Oh and for my most memorable moment, that's hard to choose. The one that comes to mind was in Ultima Online, I joined an RPPvP guild that was a religious order that followed a phoenix type god. The guild hall was a church, and would invite the entire server to come to our sermons. Usually only about 20-30 people came, which was enough to fill up the church, it wasn't giant or anything. Three days after I joined, I went to my first sermon and the guild leader was like "Aight, you're gonna come up to the altar and lead us. Hope you prepared something." My heart started racing but I decided to just wing it. I had a very cool start, the guild members were cheering me on in a private chat, and then a GM showed up! I assumed we needed to stop for some reason, but then the GM just sat down in a pew and said "Continue :)" As someone who dreads public speaking, no raid or M+ or other kind of content came close to giving me as much panic-inducing adrenaline as that moment.
@@Tokorai I've never heard "FFXIV is part of my personality, so if you insult the game, your insulting me" but that sounds very bizarre and a weird hill to die on. I think we absolutely should be able to critique games, most of the time it's because we want a game to be better. It's also good to hear people's opinions as we will never all agree on the same things. It should be a normalised and healthy discussion. I appreciate you giving the game an honest try and I'm sorry your experiences weren't as good as they could have been. I hope you can give it another try someday and have better ones but after four tries? I wouldn't blame you for calling it a day there. I'm totally with you on Vanilla. I think one of the best parts about Vanilla too is that it was so contained and the game felt like OUR story. My experiences might have been totally different to yours, and I think that's so cool. You are right with the WoL but I do fear that WoW has been attempting to go down this route in recent years with the amount of titles we seem to be collecting; the highlord, champion, maw-walker etc. It's jarring and I don't think it suits WoW at all. Players just want to be adventurers! It's great to hear a memory from Ultima Online. I don't have any experience or even know anything about the game but people have always said good things. That's a really cool story! Thank you for sharing!
After playing WoW for 13 years straight, I disengaged permanently when the BFA trailer dropped in the final Legion patch. The whole situations was so completely ABSURD (the very PLANET was just STABBED with a GIANT SWORD and we're going to BASH EACH OTHER's SKULLS IN?!). It only made "sense" after I did the BFA pre-event, but I was already long gone and permanently entrenched in FFXIV by then. Modern day WoW is also completely and utterly pointless. If you want to be the strongest, then make a level 1 character, deck it in heirlooms and lock the experience gain. Congratulations, you're now the strongest you'll ever be. It's no longer a grind for power; it's a grind to stay relevant. And I can think of no mechanic that disengages me from a game faster than that.
That was so utterly bizarre, agreed. It seemed impossible to just go back to Alliance vs Horde after what just happened with the Burning Legion. It felt like a pure nostalgia grab. I have done videos on both Legion and BFA if you're interested in checking those out (but the BFA one is very long!). Honestly getting out after Legion is probably the best thing you could have done as I don't think the game has been the same since, and Legion is responsible for it in a lot of ways. Legion was peak WoW for me but what came afterwards could never compare. I haven't checked out The War Within yet, and I definitely will, but I don't feel a burning rush for it right now. You have described modern WoW perfectly, and I think this is why Classic has had so much success. It shows where WoW really went off track and became 'WoW 2' essentially. Thank you for sharing your thoughts!
@@edd_TV I'll be sure to check out those videos! And looking back, disengaging after Legion was probably for the best, for sure. At its very start, I just intuitively knew that how they handled artifacts AFTER Legion was going to be decisive in how the game would continue. Sadly, they handled it very poorly in my view. Let me see if I can find your take in those videos you mentioned.
Think with WoW I always had this mentality that if I was subscribing I had to make the most of every minute to make it worth it. Which I think also impacts how you play. You're squeezing the lemon essentially. Community is a big part of it for me as well I think - Faggios in GTA always used to be a laugh, and doing the RTS's. Even FIFA even though I was pwp and trying to do it on keyboard. 😂 Communities are a huge part of any game though. Modding communities keeping games alive long after the devs have stopped bothering - or even in some cases gone out of business. I think of No Mans Sky and the expectation of this huge open universe and one of the things that impacted how people received the product was that there wasn't enough player to player interaction within it. You could play with you mates, the hub station was busy but there was nothing to draw people out into the universe together which made it a very lonely place. Hopefully their new game will offer that though... but again I think hopes are being raised. You are right about WoW though. I used to think Guild achievements was such a cool idea and used to go out of our way to do them but it felt they were just always an after thought by the devs after the initial launch when it felt it could have been much more. Do wonder at this point if all games go through this though. The emotional attachment is scraped away by the hardcore gamers and corporate types trying to make easy money. With Final Fantasy having slower combat; if WoW is your main game then it sets the benchmark for what you expect. So when you start a new game you've got that anxiety around a new world, new game mechanics and you're probably still trying to zip through content. It's probably like coming off an addictive drug to be honest.
I miss guild achievements too! I can remember so many of us did fishing in Cataclysm to get the recipe for raiding. I think you're probably right, yeah. I don't think we can point a finger at WoW and say it only happens there because I think if something can be optimised or taken seriously then it will be; whether that's an MMO, an FPS or even something like Stardew Valley. If it can be done, it WILL be done. And that isn't a bad thing! But when it becomes normalised or expected of the average player, THEN we have a problem. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and feelings, as always!
That would be a good idea. I sadly think with WoW's direction now (especially with the Worldsoul Saga) it only makes sense for them to do it for Dragonflight onwards, as that's where new players will be starting and the only thing that is considered 'relevant' now sadly, and that's a real shame. I think if they could introduce the way FFXIV sync content and the Trust system for WoW, some players would really love that!
@@edd_TV Agreed. Sometimes it’s nice to play through an old expansion, especially like me when I fell out during Pandaria. If I go to one of the old expansions there’s no one to dungeon with so NPCs would be nice.
@@continuallyblessed44 I feel the same. I feel like if I made a brand new character I'd love to go and do places like Outland and Northrend and even Pandaria. So many great quests and memories there. It feels way too random in that respect now, both in terms of experience gains, no real conclusions with the zones anymore and like you said, no themed dungeon experiences from those expansions. It feels like all of this stuff is just fading into obscurity and I don't think they know what to do about it. The game is just TOO big now.
@@edd_TV Yeah they almost need some kind of revamp where they somehow fix the story and make it flow from one expansion to the next like FF. Probably no way to do that now. Just have to wait for WOW 2 😂.
@@continuallyblessed44 I talk about his in another video of mine titled 'The Island of Irrelevancy' if you're interested in checking that out! I very much agree with you. I talk about some ideas I have on how they could make it work but honestly you might be right. I don't think WoW 2 should be the silver bullet for this fix but it would be so much work for them to try and make it flow in the MSQ fashion like you're suggesting. It just feels like such a waste to let everything in the past just rust. I feel really passionate on players being able to see EVERYTHING the game has to offer. It drives me mad that some stories are contained via novels/books and then just thrust into the MMORPG and players are just like 'Wait what?'. It's so frustrating to me.
How tf did the Azeroth map expand from the middle, spreading the 2 great continent more and more apart with more undiscovered islands on ship path that were already used between the 2 continents
They were always there, we just didn't know about them! ....apparently haha. I think Pandaria and the Dragon Isles get a free pass as they explained this, but the others? I honestly couldn't say. When you look at it like that, it's very odd. I think these places were always talked about when they get just lumped into the middle of a map we've been looking at for 10 or nearly 20 years it's kinda like '...well hang on a minute!'
It feels very hollow and soulless too. Nobody is really chatting to one another, and if they are it's usually rude. There isn't much going on there mechanically and it just doesn't feel even close to what a raid experience should be.
It's also expensive for a lot of people to be playing two at the same time. I think if I'm playing one then I probably would take a break from the other. I don't think there's anything wrong with putting X amount of hours and only being in Shadowbringers though. I think that's a great thing! It shows how interested in the game you are but you don't feel the need to rush/blast through it.
I kinda deliberately don't do new content for a few weeks or even months and then don't bother rushing, only doing a bit at a time if I feel like it. I miss out on the awesome early rush into brand new content and end up in an environment where i'm expected to just know the content already, but at least I am free to wander. I've found Europeans to just often not talk at all, and they're fairly apathetic, while Americans are real yappers who can be very positive but also pretty awful
I think there might be a lot of luck involved with experiences. I've been in both situations where players can talk your ear off and sometimes they are more polite but ready to buckle down and get on with things; I suppose that could depend on the content you're participating in. For example a levelling roulette might be great for conversations and then a trial people might just want to focus up. I get where you're coming from though. I like your stance on waiting and I think within FFXIV that can be both good and bad. I think it's really fun to get in there quickly before guides and tactics come out. I did this for the first time in Dawntrail with both extremes and had so much fun trying to figure out mechanics rather than watching the guides, but we're all different! Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
If players are rushing to the end because that's where all the content is that is not a player problem. That is a pacing problem and based on decisions the devs have made.
That is correct! I never said that was a player problem. That's clearly by design and has been Blizzard's design since TBC. What I described as being a 'player problem' was players not being captivated by the world anymore. That isn't a fault of the game.
I loved ff14 till i was forced to play with other people to progress the story. with the only alternative being farming hundreds of hours to be able to solo the raids. Queing for an hour per mission is just piss poor
@@Gam1ngSyzygy This is so noticeable as a DPS when you’re queuing for a trial and have to wait 30 mins or so, it feels awful! They have introduced things like the Trust system now which I think you can play almost the entire MSQ with AI now, but I think trials may still be with other players. I'm not 100% sure on that. I completely agree though. I find that so fascinating too because it's an MMORPG but it offers so much solo-play. It's interesting how they have made that work, but I think it can always be better. The game is so story focused I don't think it's good to force them to engage with people if they just want to play it like a standalone game like 7, 15 or 16 for example. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
@@edd_TV Figured I would fill in info since you said you weren't 100% trusts will cover all 4-person msq content but will not cover the majority of the trials (yet, though it may be updated in the future that is a long time down the line) and of course also won't cover the CT raid series also msq required, which is unfortunate for those who want to avoid people. Though the dev team has made significant strides in making it as soloable as possible, I doubt they will ever make msq 100% soloable with trusts, at least not til the game is on its death bed, bc at the end of the day whether you call it an MMORPG or an RPGMMO it is still an MMO.
@@nigenstormbringer3528 Thank you for the clarity! That's very true and I think you're right. I think it's important that it maintains what an MMO should be but it feels so different to any other with how focused it is narratively. You are probably right, I think if they feel that the game is dwindling then they can make it even more accessible for things like this.
@edd_TV i still love the game only instead of the 1000 hours most people put in i only have 97 racked up because of this reason. (Main is lvl62 barbarian currently) And i dont want to pay for a character boost to solo content either i like leveling naturally otherwise i feel out of touch with my character and their skills. At least if i get bored i can still go fishing or log in for event rewards
I should note that while it is true that you would prefer to enter as a healer or tank for quicker MSQ times, in alliance raid content it can be preferable to be a DPS role simply because in alliance raids you have 15 slots of DPS as opposed to 2 or 4 slots of DPS. This is not always true, but when you see DPS preference in alliance raids that is why.
FF14 was always about the story. Wow has shit story and never was about it. If it suddenly is about the story, then I dont care as I dont have the context from previous expansions as it was not story driven.
I think in recent years I would agree with you. I think WoW's story has drastically underperformed but I think if we look a bit deeper, maybe the origins of the RTS games and expansions like Wrath and Legion, I think they are very capable of telling stories. You are right though. The story was always secondary or background noise for a lot of players and only NOW are Blizzard thrusting it into the limelight and I find that interesting because like you say, the majority of the player base were never playing for the story.
@@edd_TV But compared to story driven game like FF14, I lack the attachments, I lack the cool stuff we did with the characters, something I actually care about. Just this thing, it just makes WoW's sudden "story is important now" just worthless. So thats the reason I skipped everything in Wow War Within. And I dont really care.
@@RaskaTheFurry Agreed. It always bugged me how certain characters would get shoehorned into the spotlight when the moment suited or they decided they wanted to push certain agendas; khadgar in WoD, Jaina in BFA etc. I kinda wish all the characters were just involved full time, similarly to how the Scions work in FFXIV. It also drives me mad to no end how some stuff is told through books and then inserted into the MMO and they expect players to have that knowledge. It's super frustrating to me. It makes me wonder if WoW would be pushing a narrative agenda if FFXIV didn't have the success it has. I would say probably not. Either way I think it comes down to what you enjoy and value. If you don't think the story is worth it or it's not important to you, then I think it makes sense to skip it and focus on the things you do like. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
playing wow since I was 3yo in 2004 with my dad, playing ff14 is just... so much better. WoW is full of toxic players and isn't worth your time, FF14 you can get muted/banned for being rude lol
That's so great that you got to play WoW with your dad! I think toxicity absolutely exists in XIV too but it's so much more controlled. I would describe some people in WoW as 'upfront dicks' whereas in XIV some people might be horrible, but it has to come across more passive aggressive. That being said, I can count on one hand how many bad experiences I've had in FFXIV compared to the hundreds (or thousands) I've had in WoW. I do think WoW needs to be policed so much better.
This topic is pure clickbait. Players moving from World of Warcraft to Final Fantasy. Then, the fakes were exposed after Final Fantasy 14 players moved to World of Warcraft. This video has no intellectual value. The children will click on it. As for me as an eighteen year veteran of this website. I will not bother to watch. Not giving you a view. Deleted from my watch history.
How is it clickbait? It discusses experiences I've had in one game and how that has made me view another game differently from doing so. I didn't 'move' from WoW to XIV like players did in the exodus either. I started in Stormblood. I'm not sure how you came to this conclusion and I think judging or writing it off before even watching it is naive and ignorant. There is actually a lot of emotional and intellectual value here. I'm not really sure how your 'veteran status' of TH-cam has any relevancy here either, but go off king.
@@edd_TV Got to the point of the video where you pointed it out just after I posted this comment, but I guess that goes to show your point about FFXIV's way of handling cross-realm. For those in the know, that wasn't just Limsa, it was specifically Limsa on Odin, and that's a wonderful sense of familiarity. Kooloo limpah indeed!
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WoW's biggest trick is that it taught all of us that it doesn't matter if you're having fun, it doesn't matter if what you're doing in the moment is enjoyable; all that matters is the promise of the potential of 0.5 seconds of dopamine if a BiS item or mount drops.
That's not to say those moments aren't fun, but it's morphed and jaded players to be purely focus on the outcome at the expense of the moment. We've been trained to be like this, IMO. It's hard to break out of it, but I'm truly glad I did.
This comment is so real. You're right. I think those feelings are valid too, but when it becomes the sole/primary focus, it makes it all feel so hollow. I can still remember when Light's Justice dropped from Prince Malchezaar in Karazhan and I went CRAZY. And those moments are really important and memorable! But when it's all you're chasing...it becomes consuming and obsessive. You've summed this up perfectly. Really well written comment! Thank you for posting.
True a majority of ppl play like that. But if you ever just want someone that plays just to play let me know lol I’ve got 1k hours in ARR alone and just started Heavensward and I still replay dungeons just for fun and to share the experience with players as a social thing and also I really enjoy just running through and replaying stuff. :P I’m helping a friend finish ARR as we speak and it’s like he just finished ultimate weapon and I was just enjoying driving him around, chilling in low level dungeons, teaching him the mechanics and even rerunning dungeons with to just get him the gear he needs. No issues, we wipe I’m like it’s alright just do it again or we can do it again later after some golden saucer lol but let me know! I love making new friends
nah. what wow taught us is fun isnt allowed if you cant parse.
My bf had such a hard time “de-WoWifying” his brain to enjoy things in ffxiv. One such effect was feeling like once he picked a main job he had to stick with it and leveling other jobs or getting gear for them is “just a distraction” or some such.
One of the steps he did to overcome this was to unlock ALL the jobs and try them out on striking dummy just enough to set up hotbars. And ended up falling in love with SGE when he was convinced he was a DPS-only kinda guy. Now he’s comfortable as sge in savage blind prog and flexing roles for whatever we need in other content.
It’s so freeing to just do what feels fun without the expectations of long term commitment!
@@Cellybeans It's honestly like trying to break somebody's programming. WoW brain is such a real thing but once you're free of it, it's so incredibly liberating.
I had a party a couple months back. I was doing Roulettes and landed on my first run of the last Ivalice raid. I'll always remember it as the day everyone was scarily nice to me.
I skipped the cutscene and immediately was told by the WHOLE GROUP that I shouldn't have done that, they would have waited. I just told them I didn't want to be a bother and would just check it out in the book at the inn, but they were adamant and even a bit scary about how "You should watch the cutscene, we're going to wait, it's how this game works". It was very funny to me that I was trying to be considerate of 23 other people, and yet they were all willing to wait for lil' ol' me. It's like we were competing to see who was the nicest person around or something.
One guy was calling for my head for skipping the cutscene, which I thought was very funny.
Yeah stuff like that is really weird to me. Like the story is absolutely sacred to the majority of the player base I feel, but I think what you said is perfectly fine. I laughed reading this because I feel the same as you do, you were trying to be polite and understanding and respectful of their time and you still come off looking like the bad guy. I think there are a lot of stories like that in FFXIV. "It's like we were competing to see who was the nicest person around or something." is SO true.
Honestly, I believe it. When I first started the game I cutscene skipped EVERYTHING because I just wanted to see how different the game was compared to WoW. I'm so glad I went back and did everything and learned it properly though! Thank you for watching and sharing your experiences!
I always tell sprouts to enjoy cutscenes, they’re there for story if they’re long and if they’re short it’s just to hype you up for the boss fight about to happen. In the first case, people want you to enjoy the story as it’s a shared experience you can only do for the first time once. In the latter case, it’s only like 10 seconds so you might as well watch it so you get the full experience the devs intended.
Other players are already being compensated for their time by game design due to the first timer bonus. Socially, you can “compensate” people for their time by sharing a comment or feelings invoked by the story. A sprout being excited about a story moment can and will absolutely make a veteran player’s day just by appreciating the story.
Not obligated to comment of course but knowing that watching the cutscenes is in fact not a burden has let a lot of WoW refugees I know really enjoy the moment for the moment instead of worrying about being an inconvenience to other people when we’re all here to play the same game. It isn’t healthy to think of yourself as a burden to others just by being in the same virtual room.
Story is something you can only experience once. You wont feel the wonder or utter confusion again a second time. I think most people in FF14 know this and learned their lesson - and yes, get a little pushy when imparting their gamer wisdom ;) Personlly, I heard many times from veterans that they wished they had payed more attention the first time around... So even if it weirds you out, just think that their sentiment comes from a good place... 90% of the time at least XD
To be fair tho it IS the ivalice raid scene.
@@markup6394 I have a different view on stories. I find they're only as good as the second or third experience. Surprise and confusion aren't emotions I really vibe with, so spoilers don't matter and I can always go back and re-read a part of something if it's good. I don't feel like I'm losing anything. I do appreciate the effort though.
One of my favorite things about ff14 is that i can completely take it at my own pace, i started playing around late stormblood i was very used to not only mmos but most games in general wanting me to play through 100s of hours of content as fast as possible, then i played ff14 and people were chill with me dying and learning the game, raids thats been in the game since the beginning are still there, they're people who still run them at minimum item level just because, it was there i realized that i can do whatever whenever i wanted, i had no reason to rush to the latest content cause itll always be there and ill always find people willing to do it with me, and now ove become that max level max item level player hopong into random raids ive done already just willing to lend a hand
It's SO good in that sense. I think the fact everything is still somewhat relevant when you can sync content is such a great idea and I implore Blizzard to introduce something like this for WoW. We have Timewalking but it's laughable by comparison and only really suited for one raid per expansion. I think playing at your own pace is honestly such a forgotten way of playing video games because we've just had this philosophy or mindset beaten out of us. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
How is that anything special in FF14? You can do that in every MMORPG, in others even more than in FF14.
You only have to rush to end content if you want to do that end content, obviously. That's YOUR choice.
@@miriamweller812 Of course it's a choice, but it feels like most people's brains are trained to rush to the end game. Plus the levelling in WoW is a giant mess anyway so a story experience is essentially impossible. I wouldn't recommend rushing to end game in ANY game, but like you say it comes down to preference and what you want out of the game.
A few weeks ago I joined a DRK for a first clear of the final battle of the current raid tier, the DRK wanted it to be a first clear for all of the players, ppl who have cleared joined the PF for a moment and the DRK thought I would leave him and join the half party who had players who have cleared. I told him that I would clear eventually but did not care about when, and we stayed for about 2 hrs until the PF filled. We cleared in about the second to last pull of the lockdown.
Before we disbanded the DRK did thank me for staying. At least, to me, a memorable moment needs to involve more than just me. I can enjoy myself playing solo, but with another that can be memorable.
That's a touching story, thank you for sharing. I think you're right too. As iconic and memorable video games can be, bonds and friendships are so impactful!
I wanted to clear a extreme trial for the first time, ramuh, and anyone who knows, knows.
I had a random party and they stuck with me for two hours and eight tries before we cleared it.
@@rubyblooddemonking I had an experience like this once with Ramuh extreme too, and it was during my Mentor roulette. I was absolutely out of my depth, but I pulled up a guide on my second monitor and got a bunch of sprouts through it. It felt super fulfilling and rewarding!
All the content for casual players in FFXIV is what's kept me playing for so long. It's easy to chat with new people because, like you mentioned, stuff like greeting people in dungeons etc. is the norm. There are defo people who are OTT about how amazing FFXIV is and how nice its players are, but In general I've had a good experience. I haven't played much WoW, but one of my favourite online gaming moments is from it. When I was a kid my brother let me use his account, so I would run around exploring. I bumped into some RPers at Ironforge (had no clue what RP was at the time) and they chatted with me for a while and traded me stuff. It was one of my first online conversations with strangers, and thankfully it turned out to be a really positive one. I remember thinking how cool and nice they were, lol. Really good editing on this vid btw!
Thank you for your kind words and thank you for sharing your experiences!
Yeah i cant believe they just have one of the actual best computerized mahjong games in the world just right there for no reason but to play it
I attended a funeral in FFXIV. One of our guildmates died, cancer, we held a three hour long funeral for him ingame, and just talked about him, all the things he did for us and the late nights and fun times. The guild master handed out alcohol and we toasted him.
Not to cheapen this but that was also the day i learned if more than 50 people are together in an area the background noise changes to include idle chatter.
I bought a new player his first suit so he didnt have to show up in informal attire.
I'm so sorry about your friend :( Thank you for being able to share this 💜
Cutscene etiquette used to be a big problem in ARR because of people skipping the cutscenes in the final dungeon, leaving first timers on their own while everyone else rushed on ahead. It even became a controversial topic as to whether the skippers were being inconsiderate, or whether the new player had no right to force their party mates to waste their time waiting because the new player could just watch cutscenes at the inn later on.
The devs eventually ended up making the cutscenes unskippable in the end during 4.2 onwards.
I always heard about this! I know it's something that you obviously can't do now, and those dungeons have been redesigned (thank god!). I'm going to be working on a video soon in regards to why players quit ARR and this will definitely be a discussion! It was such a terrible 'finale' for players. Thank you for sharing!
@@edd_TV FYI those dungeons were only very recently redesigned in 6.1 (this reply was made during 7.0 for anyone reading in future), so there was this interim period from 4.2 till 6.1 where you basically had to play the old clunky version, without the option to go with AI party mates, and the cutscenes could not be skipped.
Those were dark times indeed. I still can't believe it took so long for Square Enix to fix that problem, let alone that they thought putting such long cutscenes in a dungeon was ever a smart idea. People absolutely quit the game over it.
I remember zoning into Praetorium and asking "Anything I need to know?" and the answer was "RUN". Later, I used to join partyfinders for Castrum and Praetorium, so that sprouts could have a good experience.
How it's now done is certainly not the best way (had a prae run yesterdy with 4 lvl 90 characters and honestly, please let us skip cutscenes then), but it's better for new players.
Fantastic video. Always lovely to see perspectives from outside the Eorzean bubble.
Hey, thank you so much! I love your work too! Thank you for taking the time to watch. I really appreciate it!
@@edd_TV Awesome! I’m planning on doing some interviews with ffxiv players/content creators coming up, let’s get in touch if you are interested.
@@TheEorzeanArchives I look forward to seeing that! Absolutely, that sounds great. I have given you a follow on Twitter!
Great video Edd! As someone who played wow previously and is now playing through the MSQ, i still cant get over how nice people are to sprouts. Ive caused a few wipes in dungeons as a new healer, and everytime people are like "dont worry about it, lets go again" rather than insta-abandons i would get in a wow dungeon.
Thanks El! Yeah it's genuinely very heart-warming and it's so much more humanising. Sometimes you do need an arm around the shoulder and a bit of help or guidance. I feel that once upon a time WoW was like this too, but it's tapered off and transformed into such an ugly place at times now. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
In regards to playing at your own pace. I currently have over 600 hours logged on FF14 and I'm still on the free trial.
Between levelling alt jobs, farming MGP at the gold saucer, and helping my girlfriend work through the MSQ to catch up with me, I've gotten a ridiculous amount of entertainment without spending a penny! I haven't even started Stormblood yet so I've got hundreds more hours to milk out of the trial before I finally get round to paying a sub.
The free trial is such a godsend. That's amazing, great job! Get absolutely everything you can out of that free trial! It's so great that it now includes Stormblood too. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences, enjoy the story!
Great video, especially liked the mention of how people need to just sit back and enjoy these games not just rush through and miss out on actually having fun. Huge props for the editing and flow for this one. Keep them coming!
Thanks Mark! Glad you enjoyed it!
One of my favorite moments in FF14 was when i queued up for a old raid and when it finally pop a family friend at the last moment had to ring my door bell. I told everyone sorry i need to step away. When i got back as soon as i can, everyone waited and even dancing. I thank everyone and appreciate they waited
Ff14 isnt perfect and i agree with this video on it but it does have those moments that makes me truly appreciate the community
It's amazing how something that comes across so simple sticks out in your mind and has so much weight and emotion to it. Kindness can go such a long way. That's a really sweet memory, thank you for sharing!
I mean nice anecdote but both communities have that. it really just depends on who youre with. I've had people wait and be understanding with me in wow and ive had people vote kick to grief in FF14 theres literally a sub on reddit about toxic weirdos in FF14. both games have their good players and bad.
@@xarbinchaoticneutral1785 100% right. People in WoW might be more upfront about being dicks but in FFXIV it's more passive aggressive and tip-toey, but they absolutely exist in both games.
@@xarbinchaoticneutral1785 i never played wow
The community in 14 is a lot nicer up to a certain point. Coming over from wow it was refreshing until trying to pug Savage for the first time. The toxicity of players in PF there is almost equal to WoW, it's just more passive aggressive vs straight insults. It wasn't an amazing experience from my point of view. 14 players in general are defensive over their game to an obsessive level that even if they don't like something about it themselves they will argue it until they're blue in the face just because they can't hear an negative opinion. It's a weird place sometimes.... Still prefer 14 over modern WoW tho.
Hard agree. The PF can be a dangerous and toxic place. I don't have a great deal of experience with Savage in the PF but I have done Extreme farming and such and I've seen how bad it can get, so I can't even imagine how bad Savage must get. I think you have described it perfectly; it feels more tip-toey rather than straight up horrible stuff in WoW. I'm in total agreement with you on all of this.
I suppose to many, “a certain section that is clearly equivalent to the toxicity in WoW” is fine for them, as raiding for MSQ stuff and other stuff that is not above MSQ can be ignored if they want to, and if they are that toxic person that wants to raid to feel superior and therefore would consequently put people down for it, they would gun for raiding and other stuff. It’s not necessarily a solution but rather a self-sorting. Thus, because no one has to care any further, it is far better than not just WoW but many other MMORPGs. It is not just a game, but blissful paradise where they know the story is good, the raids are good, the characters are good, etc.
Thus the scattering from Dawntrail. Shadowalker (base Shadowbringers-base Endwalker) was a miracles and the reason the illusion did not break during the patches is that FFIV is still beloved and people do not rank the patches as their own things but things to tide them over until the next patch, so while there will be detractors from EW patch content, to most DT had to hit its mark, and it did not. Thus the typical reactions like misogyny/transphobia against a known trans woman, two main camps based off of two main appeal with a insurmountable divide only solvable by somehow stitching the two together, and other classic fandom behaviors. FFXIV playerbase is not a better playerbase, it is a playerbase who has had every expectation met and exceeded.
PF definitely is a shit place, but toxicity isnt the biggest reason I'd say to avoid it imo.
The main reasons would more be that people don't read PF descriptions, so no matter how clearly you say (eg) OQ5 Q-Go at least two people are gonna come in doing hector and wipe you...
The second is that a lot of the time people are just bad. I don't mean messing up the prog point, if you join a prog party and mess up the mechanic that is being progged that's understandable, I mean prog parties for the end of the fight where one guy can't do the second major mechanic. This is common and it's maddening and only gets worse in clear parties...
The third and imo final nail in the coffin is it takes a long time for PF to fill, so once you deal with one of the problems above and people leave, you're stuck waiting 15-30 minutes for more people to join and be just as bad ...
Moral of the story raid with a static if at all possible, you might not clear as early in the tier week wise but you will clear with so much more sanity (also holy shit I wrote a lot thank you for coming to my Ted talk)
@@Lucy-dg9en Agreed on all fronts! Really well written and explained. Thank you for taking the time to type this up and thank you for watching the video and coming to my EDD talk.
Yeah on the surface 14 definitely has a generally nicer player base but while WoW suffers from toxic negativity 14 suffers from toxic positivity. In WoW you’re definitely overly criticized but in 14 you can’t criticize at all even if someone deserves it.
Moment I remember. Was old Starcraft 1 multiplayer game i did with a friend where we both agree not to attack each other for like 20min and all I did was build nukes in the very back so when the 20min timer happen i got to use the Quote in game "You called down the thunder. Now reap the whirlwind." and level everything he had with my preset ghost since he lacked detection. Though if you want a more recent 1 several months ago i finally got around to playing Sekiro and beating that final boss felt great after so many failed attempts so so many and I still remember that fondly.
That's a great story with your Starcraft game! I've heard so many amazing things about Sekiro but I honestly don't think I'm good enough for those kinds of games. Thank you for sharing and watching!
I guess a memory of a better time I have is back when I started WoW in vanilla because of how fresh and unknown it was. Everything was a new discovery, there were no guides on how to do things, players didn't yell at you or leave the group if you didn't know how a dungeon worked. I had already played Warcraft 3 back then so getting to visit familiar and iconic places was incredible. I've always been a person who doesn't like to rush things. I play at my own pace experiencing and exploring all I want. I started the free trial of FF14 some time in the middle of Shadowbringers and was just playing casually solo for the best part of two years. During that time I did meet some really nice people and I actually subscribed so I can experience the msq and play alongside them. That is probably my best memory from FF14. Today all those people either don't play anymore or do their own thing in the game. So I am back being a solo player and it sucks. The thing you said about yourself in WoW and how you were left alone happened to me but in FF14. Now I just log in to do the msq and when that is over I level all the jobs to max and log out. Like you said, everyone is in a hurry to get things over with. No one really wants to speak during a duty. Everything has to be done as fast as possible because the end goal became more important than the journey. Guides became much more of a focus and you are not welcome if you haven't watched a guide. I understood that in WoW because it has far more of a focus on end game raiding and gearing and using addons. But in FF? I don't really care about gearing to the max. I enjoy the challenge of clearing a raid and if I think that the clear I got was good enough for me then I don't care about doing it over and over and getting gear. I can do it once in a while just for fun if I feel like it but not to the point that it becomes a grind fest of tedium. The only addons that I use are reshade, chat bubbles and a housing addon that makes placing furniture easier and I can do without all of those. I think FF is a much more friendlier game when it comes to clearing raids and doing rotations. What I mean by that is the game doesn't require top of the line gear or absolutely perfect rotations to clear anything. I am a person who still has that feeling of discovering stuff by myself back from vanilla WoW. I like to go in a raid without knowing anything and experimenting and learning from my mistakes and creating a strategy to clear. That feeling when your plan works if amazing and it's even more rewarding when you share it with like minded people. But FF has become part of that treadmill where you don't get to see a mechanic for the first time because you already saw it in a youtube video explaining how it works. And if you didn't then more than likely you are not welcome in the group. Even rotations aren't hard to figure out. They won't be perfect but if you use all your abilities and cooldowns then you'll probably do more than decently and get a clear. I've noticed that there are very few people with my playstyle, who want to discover things themselves. Maybe people who are playing on a console so they don't have access to addons and like to spend their time in game rather than watch a guide, but those are few and far between. I really wish FF had a casual blind raiding scene because it's lonely in my corner of the game. Cheers from Light-Twintania.
I still have really fond memories of both Elwynn Forest and Westfall. Every time I play a new character or even fly through the zones I'm hit by such a massive wave of nostalgia. It's very bittersweet. I know somebody who feels exactly the same as you in regards to blind and not wishing to use guides. It's very difficult due to patience levels I think and just a case of people wanting to get things done. I can sort of relate. With my old group we used to do a week or two blind and see how that went and then if we got stuck we would start looking into guides. I really appreciate you taking the time to watch the video and for typing this up. It was a good read! Don't give up on finding a blind prog group, they do exist! You are right, it's definitely a small corner of the game but keep a look out in the party finder and maybe reach out Reddit or Discord. I hope you can find something. All the best.
I enjoy not being called an idiot in dungeons in XIV, but honestly I came to think that the lengths it has to go to remove toxicity from casual gameplay is not worth it in the long run.
XIV removes all mechanics that can cause friction between players. I play tank, and in WoW I can be flamed for having a sh1t build, gear, talents, not knowing my class, not knowing dungeon specific mechanics (kicks, cc, layout quirks etc.). In XIV I don't have a build, gear is pretty much nonexistent outside savage, all tanks are homogenised to the point that I have the same hotbar layout on all of them, all dungeons are a single corridor with strictly distributed mob packs. I can't even control the size of pulls anymore in DT because there are so many walls.
Like yeah, one one hand I'm less stressed about underperforming or not knowing something, but on the other it's only because there's nothing to know and nothing to learn. I have near zero gameplay agency.
I think you're right to an extent. I personally think we should be able to call out anything and have a healthy discussion over it. I think there is still friction within content like savage and so on (the latest tier probably isn't the best example as it's easy by comparison to its predecessors imo), but I get what you're saying. I think if it encourages or forces low stakes gameplay then that's not going to be fun either.
I'm with you on both the homogenisation of tanks and wall-pulling too. I think dungeons could really do with a new coat of paint. I'm not sure how exactly but wall-pulling is quite tiresome. And I'm the same as you, I have my hotbars set out exactly the same way for tanks; I only play DRK and GNB but they have a lot of abilities that are the same - Dark Missionary and Heart of Light, TBN and Heart of Stone etc. It's just way too similar at this point. I'm confident for a big revamp in the next expansion, but people said that about Dawntrail, so I don't want to get my hopes up too much.
You have summed it up really well, and I think that is by design for SE. Like you can optimise and you can theory craft and everything else, but it's nowhere near as in depth as WoW is and whilst I think that's a good thing, there are always going to be players who want more or feel a bit demotivated and unmoved by it. I think the next expansion could be a huge transition period for FFXIV. I hope so.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings!
The greatest thing that Shadowlands did for WoW was breaking the final straw for its players and helping us see just how lost we'd gotten in our own BS.
TY FF for opening my eyes and helping me find the fun again.
~Sincerely yours,
A former WoW refugee~
It's so true. I'm glad this video resonated with you well! Thanks for watching.
Allow me to pull from the games in question in this video for another point in "how FFXIV hits different" -- The legacy of the players of 1.xx. There's a literally-and-hour-long piece of credits in 14, when one clears the 2.0 MSQ, called the "Meteor Survivor List"; those are players from 1.xx, who were there more-or-less when the curtains fell and Bahamut had his temper tantrum and blew apart parts of the world. The "Great Goobbue Wall" that some NPCs mention having happened during the Seventh Umbral Calamity (that is, the events right before ARR)? That too is the legacy of 1.xx, a horde of players on multiple servers mounting up on the goobbue mount one could get in 1.xx, forming a visual wall of those big beasts to get between the Garlaeans and Voidsent trying to get into Ul'dah from Thanalan. We were there when the BGM was a warbled version of the track "Answers" (now known as 'Answers (Reprise)') across the world, knowing the MMO we enjoyed was going to shutter and hopefully get relaunched in a better form, and instead of abandoning it... many of us stood our ground. Fought the mobs in the closing event with no rewards and possibly to us dying because we were woefully underlevel (like me, XD), because of that sense of community and "this is our game, our world" that showed that, even back then, 14 hit different than other MMOs.
This is such a great comment. I LOVE that survivor list too, I think that's so damn cool! I think XIV will always be set apart from anything else because of the way it was predicated. It's such a fascinating story and journey, and whilst I'm not an OG or even a veteran, I'm so glad to be a part of it now!
One of my best memories in gaming overall was playing Shadow of the Colossus for the first time, and meeting the first Colossus. It felt like I had to physically look up to see the top of the thing!
As for in FFXIV, I was farming some demimateria for a friend by making rings and desynthing them. A sprout came up to me and explained that he had just unlocked AST and had no good gear, nor the gil to buy it. So could I make him some stuff? I leaped up and went on a crafting and gathering spree to get this baby AST what he needed, and was so happy to hand over a full set of HQ gear free of charge! I hope he's still having fun with the game!
That's a great choice for your memory!
That's so nice of you to do that for a new player! It's really heart-warming to see stories like this. Thank you for sharing!
That's very kind of you! I'm glad we have such generous people in the FFXIV community. I myself have received a few random gifts from strangers I never even talked to before, like minions and things. It's a nice surprise, and a memorable moment for sure. I miss little things like being able to craft bags for people with new characters back in WoW.
That said, I would never feel comfortable going up to a random stranger and just asking to be given things. Especially when it's not a matter of needing help or advice, it's just that they wanted something and didn't feel like waiting til they earned it like anybody else. I really don't like it when people beg for stuff in MMOs, like gil, items, or if they ask for a commendation in a dungeon. They aren't some poor soul in need -- they just want something, and would prefer somebody else get it for them.
I had a guy ask if I could pass on the pants item in a dungeon once. Now, I don't mind that they asked, because 99% of the time I don't need the item and am just going to vendor it or turn in for GC seals anyway. So I would have said yes -- but in this instance, I hard queued for that particular dungeon, and waited in a DPS queue, specifically because I needed gear. It was the whole reason I was there, just like them, so I told them so. They could have left it at that, and let the rolls fall where they may, but no. They would not shut up about it, and kept bothering me to please pass on the pants, they were farming the dungeon for glam, blah blah blah. They even offered to craft me some pants with a better item level, an offer I didn't even bother acknowledging because frankly I have no cause to believe they'll make good on it after the fact (they didn't). Finally, I got so annoyed with their pestering that I caved and agreed to pass on the pants if they dropped. And guess what, they didn't even drop. All that harassment and selfishness, over nothing.
They didn't even bother to toss me a comm on the way out, as a gesture of good faith. Not saying I was entitled to one, just that it would be a way of saying "Thanks! For what it's worth, even if the pants didn't end up dropping, I believe you would have passed and I appreciate it." Maybe because they didn't trust that I would actually pass on it, I dunno. Kind of says a lot about whether they would have actually crafted me anything in that event. If I were them, I think I would have still offered to craft the gear regardless of how luck turned out, but of course they didn't bother to contact me outside the dungeon because they didn't end up getting what they wanted.
@@0Fyrebrand0 Man, the little things like crafting bags for people in WoW is so lost on the game now sadly, and it was such a beautiful thing for its time. I can remember getting those feelings again when I played Classic. It's so exciting for something so simple. Your XIV story is very frustrating, I've seen similar situations like that!
I play both games but have a preference for FFXIV. What really sold me on it was just taking my time and slowing down. I even prefer the longer GCD personally. And being able to do old content, like expansions and even raids is great. I know the old raids arent what they used to be because patches tweak job balance and stuff but they are still fun to see and experience. Even if it isnt the way they were back in the day you can still do them and not just one shot a boss
I feel the same about the GCD these days. I haven't raided in WoW since Castle Nathria so I think getting back into raiding in WoW would be really difficult for me now. I'm totally with you that I think being able to sync/unsync content in XIV is one of its greatest strengths and WoW desperately needs something like it.
I didn't play a lot of video games growing up, but a moment that stuck out to me in FFXIV was a story an NPC tells your character in ARR. I won't repeat it because it's truly harrowing, but it solidified my love for side quests in the game. I love the struggle and plight on the common man in this game, and the NPCs are allowed to do and say things you might never see in the MSQ. In short, the NPCs and their stories feel way more real and affecting to me than anything in the MSQ.
You do see some real hardship in this game and it makes you think. You raise a great point too, it's not JUST the MSQ but it is just the common man and the NPCs; the side quests and even just chat bubbles with the NPCs. There is so much there if you look for it. Thank you for sharing your thoughts!
One of the best community moments for me were in Battlefield 3.
TONS of machinimas, cartoons, memes, clips and music videos. Game was GREAT and community thrived! I miss it very much..
That's a great memory to have. I feel the same about Counter-Strike: Source. I used to play very competitively in leagues and such, but played on a casual 24/7 cs_italy server, they were such simple but great days.
This was a very good video. I wasn't sure what I was expecting when I hit play, but you made me think of many things I have experienced over the years.
First, to answer the question you made, about a special moment in video games: I have 2 stories, the first time I saw the scepter open the hidden door in Uldaman. I ran that dungeon with guildies. I also remember the time we completed the jailbrake quest. The second, however, was the friends I made along the way. I remember meeting one of my best in game friends camping at Ashenvale and we became best pals over the following months. Just taking a step back from the hustle of questing to spend time with people.
And here is the thing, I feel that was completely lost during my time playing. I left on early cataclism and I had already felt the sting of player indifference. Sorry for this following story, but allow me the time as a veteran.
I was part of a great guild. We were not top raiders, we were probably mid at best, but we always strived to complete content at our own pace. I was it's GL for some time and we had a thriving community. We even met irl, some people travelling half a continent just to meet. And we also had a pretty interesting mix of people from US and Canada and people from Latin America. We ran raids with 2 voice chats so information was relayed in both languages.
I had to step down from GL due to life commitments. I was still part of the officers but I couldn't dedicate as much time as before and the same my previous GL did, I passed in the position to a real life friend, who had been an amazing presence in the guild.
Anyway, it took only a few months for things to go sour. It started with one raid leader saying to one of the Spanish speakers that it was not the responsibility of the guild to teach them the raid, that people should PUG to learn the raid and then attend the Guild raids only once they mastered the fights. That was complere opposite to what the guild had been so far. This was probably very close to the end of WOTLK.
I spoke with the raid leader and he told me he would not change his mind. I spoke with the GL, who knew us both irl, and she supported the RL. I feel something broke inside of me. I said goodbye and left the guild that had been my home since early vanilla. Behind me, a lot of the latinos followed and the guild post their best tank and 3 of the best dps.
After that, the game started to change. I took a long break from Cata until late Legion and found myself chasing the high end. I would go into mythic dungeons and would get frustrated and one time I even yelled a group of friends I was playing with. The next day I contacted each one to apologize. I realized at that moment that I had become a toxic player. But had allowed that mentality of always chasing the next shiny thing get to me and in turn, I had abandoned the player I was on those early expansions. I got afraid and even unistalled wow, as I didn't like what I had become.
I returned some time later to rejoin my friends and then shadowlands happened and at that moment I realized I was chasing what I used to have in vanilla and TBC, and I realized it was never coming back. I did try to make new friends, tried to talk with people I met during dungeons. Except for a few nice conversations, no one really wanted a friend to do content with. I moved on.
I had played FFXIV back in 2014, but having my friends playing wow, I didn't stay too long. Then some friends invited me to play it since asmongold was playing it and I resubbed for them.
Waited a month and they never came into the game. I was about to leave the game when I met this person irl who was already an experienced player. With his help, I learned more of the game. I started to find what I didn't in wow, good friends. I have learned so much from them and I have even met some of them irl. It feels similar to what I felt in wow back then.
FFXIV is not a perfect game. There are a lot of things other games do a lot better, wow does a lot of things better (pvp, transmogs, etc) but it offers the space to meet real nice people who want to know you and who don't measure you by the dps meter.
The sceptre in Uldaman is a great choice! That was such a cool moment! The Jailbreak quest is something that really sticks with me too. I can remember having conversations with my friends in school and then we all went home to do it. It was epic!
I think the story you told is really important, and it's SO important you had the awareness to know what you were becoming and were able to take accountability of your behaviour. It really has become so normalised and I think a lot of players have twisted into something they know isn't really them, but it's kinda just 'how you play the game' now. It's really one of those 'you know the rules and so do I' things. I don't know how we got here with WoW. I think the rot has just set in and the game wasn't policed well enough and this is just how it is now. I can relate to parts of your story, for sure.
I think letting go of WoW is an incredibly hard thing to do too, even if you don't enjoy it or feel it isn't good for you anymore. It's such a huge part of our lives and has impacted us like nothing else. Thank you for sharing that story. I hope people will read it! Thank you for taking the time to type it up and watching the video. I really appreciate it.
Thank you for making this video and highlighting some of the reasons why I too, as a former WoW player, don't find the game enjoyable anymore and have since moved on from it to FF14.
I know you mentioned an impactful experience that I remember from my time playing games, but I'll just tell you about how community helped me be where I am now.
In all games I've played in the past, I used to play a female character because I'm a woman and I preferred them over playing male characters. I started playing FF14 as a Miqo'te girl because I wanted to replicate a catgirl character I had drawn for 3 years prior to joining the game, unrelated to FF14 catgirls.
My first character did not survive the free trials being weeded out during Endwalker's horrendous 3-4 week launch period where restrictions were put into place. So, since I had barely gotten to Titan in ARR, I remade my character, still catgirl, and went through all of ARR and by the end of it I really didn't like catgirl body & animations so I used my free fantasia to change into a catboy.
It was a strange feeling playing as a male character for the actual first time (alt attempts in WoW not withstanding) Getting used to his voice, his movements, his mannerisms took a while and as I was doing that I was also exploring my interests in the game. I experimented with clubs/venues, roleplay, housing and glamour and from that time period years ago, I retain a love for glamming and a small inkling towards roleplay which just means I shower catboys, primarily, with dotes and pets (but Lalas and tiny Au Ra girls get pets as well). Whenever I'd need to world hop on Light to find items I need, I'd scour Limsa for cute catboys to look at their adventure plate and sometimes compliment them.
I don't think I'd develop this fondness for catboys had I not been encouraged by the people I've met in the game. Aside from a handfull of people I've met, the community seems to really like Miqo'te boys, their adorable ear wiggles and cute animations. I used to play WoW with transmog in mind as well, going through content to get the pieces I wanted, but my eyes weren't focused on others. I didn't find the characters unique enough or having a discernible style from how they dressed and looked (WoW models aren't also particularly pretty to look at and I much prefer the environmental art of the game) And because I didn't focus on others, I didn't interact with others and didn't converse with them or compliment them.
It's quite easy to just find friendly people in FF14 that just want to hang out and talk and do content together.
And without the game's encouragement to be social, I'd had never met most of the people I consider my friends right now, which are mostly catboys too :3
P.S. I might have bumped into you a few times on Odin. ^-^ Your catboy is quite distinct with their red K-pop hairstyle.
This was a really nice read! Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences. I very much agree with you on how basic WoW characters can look by comparison. It's a bit better now but still nowhere near on the levels of XIVs character creation. I'm glad you have found a place in XIV and enjoy so many different aspects of it!
It's very possible, feel free to say hello if you catch me again! Thanks again for taking the time to type this up and engaging with the channel. I really appreciate it!
A couple days ago I re-activated my WoW account. I wanted to see if I can truly give it a fresh start and just enjoy myself. One of the things WoW always did well was encouraging exploration and find easter eggs in the wild. I remember when I found Mogli from The Jungle Book and Whinni the Pooh in BfA, just small things that are fun. FF14 doesnt have that. When I logged back in and created a new character, leaving that starter island, I was like "ok, lets go exploring". And I ran from one end of the map to the other... Aaaaand my main gripe with WoW presented itself almost immediately: As you know, if youre a WoW player, the overworld is frozen in time as it was during Cataclysm. Which certainly is fine if you just want to do quests. But then I enterend Darkshore. Im a WoW veteran, I played that game for 14 years and my alliance main was a night elf druid. I knew what happened in Darkshore, what happened to Teldrassil... and everything was just there as it was at Cata times... Hell, even Malfurion was handing out his quests. And wouldnt you believe it: at Auberdeen (I think) there was a portal...
To Amirdrassil!!!!!!
Like... can you make it even more disconnected??!! Im a lore player. Always have been. I was a lore fanatic when playing WoW, I fell in love with this game BECAUSE of its rich lore!! I read all the quest, read all the books, never bothered watching Belular or Nobble because I knew they were talking bs (in my humble opinion ;) ). So seeing this, Teldrassil and Amirdrassil existing at the same time... I couldnt bear it. That and having Khadgar adressing my freshly created, two hours old character as "old friend".
... I tried. Let it be known, I tried. And it didnt work. I wanted to try The War Within, but couldnt even really start Dragonflight... WoW needs their world to make sense. The island tutorial was a good idea, but its unfinished. There needs to be more. They are now focussing on story telling, which is great (the WoW universe deserves no less), but they need their world to make sense.
At least for me. I dont know about others. I thought about doing some dungeons, just to get a hang on group related gameplay again (I hadnt touched WoW for over four years) but with that new character, the only dungeon I could cue up in was a DF dungeon - even before I even got to the Island! I couldnt even cue up for Deadmines!
Make it make sense, Blizz. Thats all I ask.
I always loved stuff like that too! They were always so clever with their easter eggs and referencing other media. If you have the time you should check out my 'Island of Irrelevancy' video, I think you would relate a lot and share the same frustrations and gripes I do. It's so incredibly frustrating and if it's like this for the veterans, how on earth are new players supposed to make sense of it!? It's crazy!
FF14 fixed my WoW tank anxiety. My first job in FF14 was Paladin, I would pick up one mob group at a time and no one complained. At the end of the dungeon, I would get commendations from everyone! The positive and patient community has allowed me to actually enjoy playing. Unlike WoW, where I would dread playing as a tank. Life's too short to play a game that's not enjoyable.
I LOVE tanking in FFXIV. Tanking in WoW scares the hell out of me, lol. I can't explain it. I have no problem just wall pulling a dungeon as Gunbreaker or Dark Knight but doing anything as a tank in WoW just sends my anxiety into overdrive, so I totally get you! Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
I’ve been playing FFXIV since ARR Beta, and have gotten to know a lot of people through the years. One thing I’d like to touch up on is the Mentor System, and how it isn’t what it should be. A good majority of people only become Mentors so that they would have the crown next to their name, and would hardly help people. If they got an Extreme Trial through Mentor Roulette they would leave as soon as they see it. I’m honestly one of the few Mentors that enjoys helping others, guiding them on their adventure, and even crafting anything that they may need.
That's a good point. I would go further on that and say some people only applied to me a mentor to try and go for the title/mount. I would admit that I'm definitely doing Mentor roulette for the mount but I do take great joy and pride in helping people and love helping people experience content for the first time. I had an experience once where my Mentor roulette was Ramuh Extreme, and I was totally out of my depth with it. I had to pull up a guide on my second monitor and walk them through it, and it felt really rewarding and fulfilling. You are very right though, some people do use the crown as a bit of an ego trip or whatever else.
I think a big difference that really kept me in XIV was the empathy other players showed during raids that are not going well. Back in my WoW days I had been yelled at, berated, kicked and mocked for not fully grasping raid mechanics and not playing optimally, where as in XIV I've been in raids that have fully broken down and players will rather help solve the problem someone is having than rage quit. The general etiquette is fundamentally different and I'm here for it
I agree. It's the biggest shining light for me. I would never advocate the community is perfect by any means, but compared to some terrible experiences in WoW it's an absolute joy. It's a shame too because once upon a time WoW was so much better in terms of teaching people, helping people and working together.
The difference between FF14 players and WoW players in dungeon is patience, you're right. In FF14 there is some unspoken rule or etiquette that veterans waits for new players to watch before going. In WoW I played during legion when I was a new player, people just ask you to shut up and go. All of the DPS will just zoom ahead leaving you behind. Even if you ask for tips for the dungeon people will just say "go".
It never used to be this way. I do wonder when this changed. WoW players used to be really nice and helpful and working together was a very common thing. I feel like it changed during Wrath-Cata. It's such a shame. WoW is a great game but people will have bad experiences and immediately put it down.
Great video I’m glad i watched it. My experiences were similar.
Thank you! Glad it resonated well with you. Thanks for watching!
I did in fact enjoyed the video! tysm for such lovely content!
And thank you for such lovely words! I'm glad to hear you enjoyed it!
First off, Great video! It hits a lot of the things I've been feeling about WoW in ways I could have never articulated on my own! :D
That was one of the biggest shocks going from WoW to FFXIV. being able to play at your own pace. I remember back in Legion, I finished all 4 allied races reps as fast as I could before they were released. the grind sucked, everyday I woke up and did 3ish hours just running zone to zone doing all the dailies and then shutting it off when I finished. never wanted to do that again.. then BFA came out and did the exact same thing, on two characters horde and alliance. I woke up, did every daily and every rep related quest I could. then i logged off, fed myself and waited for guild activities to sign on, do that for another four hours and then SLEEP every. SINGLE. DAY. for rough 3 months. I was ragged and so entirely done with the grind I never went back. no other game felt fun because I felt like I was wasting my game time by NOT grinding, WoW never respected my time.
FFXIV? I've never felt like I have needed to death grind the game. unless I wanted too! and when I did those death grinds it was tons of fun since I was working towards something I felt I was going to use or enjoy having. I could play other games and not feel like I wasted two days of gametime in the wind by enjoying something else. the burnout has never hit me. I feel like it will respect my time always. Hell I've meet some people that are so confused when they've seen I've barely scratched the surface of anything in it. but they don't rush me they ask if I wanna try new content I haven't done and when I say not yet they respect it and if I say yes I get to go on a fun journey I wouldn't have done otherwise. I just found out about Wonderous tails, I've been playing for like... 5 years now!
the other big shock was players being nice, the last two WoW experiences I ever had was, A tank kicking me for being "Unruly and a shit for brains" by asking why we weren't hitting all the mobs in the dungeon, A simple question where at the time we have 50% more exp gains and I asked about if it's the same difference as doing one or two dungeons of exp. that's it. They sided with the tank, and berated me for being stupid. I never wanted to go back.
The other experience? I meet someone new, hit it off as friends and enjoyed some long conversations about game health and then Mental health. When they found out I suffered from mental health problems, they offered to do some acts I'd rather not mention here. and when I told him he went to far for my tastes as someone I JUST met, that I wasn't okay with this. HE doubled down. I blocked and moved on only to receive mail from his alts, tripling down and berating me for being "immature." "needing to grow up" "And not being a good enough person to tell him, he did wrong"
In FFXIV I have rarely, rarely ever had any bad experiences. I had a healer be mad at me for my tanking in the first pull but we worked it out... something I've never seen in WoW dungeons.
everyone I've met has been so understanding and helpful it was almost too good to be true. I wasn't trusting for the first year and a half.... but now I can't imagine playing in a different community. it still sucks in spots but no where near as soul crushing as WoW had been for me..
Thank you for your kind words, taking the time to type this up and sharing your experiences!
ohh the RO soundtrack, that triggered my nostalgia hard
Glad you recognised it! Thanks for watching!
A lot of my favorite gamer moments come from the Legend of Zelda series.
On Ocarina of Time, Not the pulling of the master sword, but the opening of the Door of Time.
In Twilight Princess, Watching Midna go from this angry, manipulative and cruel little imp to being tender, kind, and even vulnerable. I got to really experience it all over again with the very excellent manga.
TOTK has several, though that may be recency bias:
The ascention to the Stormwind Ark, and the drop through the eye of the storm.
Watching Riju charge into the fight against the Gibdos. And knowing she's going to win.
The Final Tear, and the retrieval of the Master Sword. It's a VERY heavy punch to the feels, right up there with FFXIV's best.
Tales of Symphonia: "Feel the pain of those inferior beings as you BURN IN HELL." It's even better when you fully understand the context.
Skies of Arcadia. Just...Skies of Arcadia. Incidentally, the Void Ark story has MASSIVE Skies of Arcadia vibes.
FFXIV itself has many, but the crowning jewel is this: "Take it. We fight as one." GOOSE. BUMPS. That, and seeing Y'shtola in a swimsuit. That's been pretty special.
I have a 'Song of Healing' Zelda tattoo. Opening the Door of Time is a goodie! I LOVE that you brought up Tales of Symphonia. I love that game! Thank you for sharing all of these!
One of my favorites moments n FFXIV so far was this roulette raid we were n w a bunch of randoms, and one dps stopped out of nowhere to say phone call. At first no one stopped n waited for them, then, they came back to say that their dog at the vet couldn't be saved and needed put down and every person n the entire raid stopped to offer their condolences and comforting words n I just thought it was really sweet
That's such a sad story :( but it shows how important compassion is! I think it's a really wonderful thing to be able to connect with people and share these moments. I think we forget how powerful we can be and how we can really imprint ourselves on experiences and moments.
@@edd_TV I agree! 💯 ❤️
Diablo 2: LoD will always hold a special place in my heart. It’s the game that truly shaped me as a gamer. Even now, my favorite character is still Diablo from Diablo 2, because of all the memories tied to him.
I’ve also played WoW, ESO, and FFXIV, and I think each has its own strengths. In my experience, FFXIV’s combat design really stands out, feeling more refined compared to WoW and ESO. However, when it comes to the gear grind, I find FFXIV lacking. Not that it’s poorly done, but once I’ve finished gearing up my main for the expansion, I tend to log out and wait for the next patch. With WoW, there’s always more gear to chase, and in ESO, there’s usually a set that’s fun to experiment with or handy to collect.
If FFXIV had a more engaging gear system, I think I’d enjoy it even more. For now, I’m there for the story and the social aspects, but the endgame just doesn’t feel as rewarding to me.
That's great about Diablo 2. I haven't played the Diablo games but I know how passionate the player base is and 2 is held in such a high regard. I think you're right and I think it does come down to what players want out of the game I suppose. Like I'll be bis this week in Dawntrail and then I'm kinda thinking 'Well what am I gonna do now?' whereas if this is WoW I could be maybe trying to push score in Mythic+ or maybe some things that could be considered a bit unhinged like trying to get something to war/titanforge or have tertiary stats on it. And I think you make a good point too. It's not just gear in WoW, there are talent trees, tier set bonuses and of course trinkets can really impact gameplay too.
I wonder if they will try and reinvent the wheel with gearing going forward. I do feel that the game is in need of a real shake up in the next expansion, from class changes to maybe other drastic things! I think the story and social experiences are far greater than anything else the game can offer. I think in terms of combat/gear I think WoW is far superior and more satisfying.
Thank you for taking the time to watch and typing this up!
I do agree that players play WoW badly and that leads to a lot of the problems.
But…
That’s kinda WoW’s fault (and Blizzards). From the moment something launches in WoW it has an expiration date. Every item, every dungeon, every raid. There is so little evergreen content that if you don’t play it as soon as you can you’ll never experience that way. Even as an expansion goes on Blizzard reduces difficulties and makes changes to the content, if you didn’t beat that boss in the first few weeks then you never will beat that iteration. The option is taken away from you.
WoW plays more like a season based game where you have a narrow window to experience the content sat it’s best and once that’s passed there is no way to even come close to it. Even the closest thing WoW has, level synched dungeons, are trapped behind a system you can level out of. Add into that how wildly classes can change in WoW (even within a single expansion and its patches) and it’s all pushing you to do the content -now-. Plus if you want to play a different class you have to start all over again.
Take ICC for example. That’s a raid people enjoyed for a lot of reasons. But before Classic Wrath you couldn’t really experience it. Even if you had a dedicated raid group of people limiting their level it still wouldn’t be even close. Not only are the classes different but entire player stats no longer exist in the game that did the. (examples being Armor Penetration and Spirit).
WoW has taught its player base that if they don’t rush content then they’ll never get to experience it. That doesn’t leave a lot of time for exploration and just having fun.
you said it yourself, WoW is the king of FOMO and it’s shaped how their players function
Yeah, you are absolutely right. It's their method and philosophy. The ethos of the game will likely always be whatever is coming next/is relevant at the time. You make a really good point with 'WoW has taught its player base that if they don’t rush content then they’ll never get to experience it. That doesn’t leave a lot of time for exploration and just having fun.'. It really does sum WoW up perfectly. I think it's something that is just normalised and accepted with the game now too. You kinda know what you're signing up for because the game has always been this way.
Thank you for taking the time to type this up, it was a good read! And thank you for watching!
Nonsense, this is just delusional. FF14 is overall a far worse MMORPG, but where you got the hater crowd in WoW that just always whines about everything, you got the fanatic fanboys in FF14, who hate on everyone who does not eat the lies and praise the game Square milks since many years meanwhile as the new god.
When the crybabies and the fanatics joined during Square's PR campaign to find replacemenrt for all us old players who didn't eat their shit anymore and left, this worked, because it was a perfect mixture, but of course lies never live long and while those lured in players had of course all the old garbage as "new stuff" for them, at some point they still hit the actual current conrent and had to realize how shitty and meager it is.
That's why majority left again, but for Square it was a lot of money they made with no effort, so a big success.
You now keep on lying, but whom do you want to lure in with it anymore?
And you are talking a lot of shit. "Rushing content"? You talk about ICC, that is over a decade old content, you had endless time to do it, but of course they don't just keep everything important for all eternity coming.
Neither does FF14. Hell, FF14 is so bad, they force you into old content, but don't adapt it, so it doesn't feel AT ALL, like it was when it was the actual current content.
You simply got no clue what you are talking about.
The fact alone that WoW is doing somethign like classic and that for free, is already 1000 times more than what you got from Square. And I don't even care for Classic, but I can admit that they put a lot of effort in to let peopel do it, just as in everything else.
I wish that Square had put even 10% of the effort into FF14 than Blizzard into WoW, then the game wouldn't have become shit.
The saddest example I saw of someone getting mad about roleplaying in a Role Playing Game was someone getting mad at roleplaying in Dungeons and Dragons of all things, the game that freakin invented the genre.
That's crazy. I've never gotten into D&D personally, but I have many friends who love it and like you say, it's the precursor to all of this! I think the TL:DR is, people hate things they don't understand.
I've beaten multiple ultimates and cleared every raid tier on patch since the beginning of Shadowbringers. But I still fiddle with my house for hours, get immersed in expert crafting, do silly stuff in Gold Saucer and sit around chatting in game and in discord with my friends, from my static and FC. Yes, I do play for those moments between seconds, for the rush of victory and the challenge of a difficult fight - it's take me three months to get through DSR. But it's not the whole game for me. Not the whole reason for playing. All I need to do is cap my tomes every week, and that's the extent of the "job". Everything else is just done for my enjoyment.
Great job! I'm yet to do any ultimate's but it's absolutely something I want to sink my teeth into sooner rather than later! TEA and DSR look so appealing to me. You sound like you have a really healthy mindset with the game. It's refreshing to hear people who play the game at a really high level, but also do things very casually and take the time to relax and chill too. Thank you for sharing!
@@edd_TV I recommend that you do try it! The fights are extremely fun and will make you a much better player mechanically. But yes, I do try to not get caught up in the rat race. New patch and new tier are always fun but I also spend hours and hours doing side content (island, maps, housing etc etc etc) and it’s been an absolute pleasure. I hope more people can find the enjoyment in those simple, casual things. They make the game a home.
I want to give tanking and healing a try in WoW, but the pressure to know exactly what I’m doing by most of the community has me reconsider every time
FFXIV?
When in doubt, I got 5 words to determine what tank I play
“I…would like…to…RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGE!!!!!!”
Absolutely love Warrior, and I never would have discovered that without knowing the community is very open and accepting of new players making mistakes
I've always been a healer in WoW, I kinda fell into it due to classes my friendship group were playing. That being said I did fall in love with healer all the same. I'm not a massive fan of healing in FFXIV, it just doesn't hit the same for me. However I'm totally with you on tanking. I would NEVER tank in WoW, there's just far too much pressure and responsibility there. I really love tanking in FFXIV though, mainly on Gunbreaker and Dark Knight. It just feels so much more chill and inviting, and honestly more fun! Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
I am starting to tank a bit more on the lower levels to be able to get to mentor one day and, at times, help out another friend with the leveling. I know my way around and do the pulls, but whenever I see someone in a cutscene, my brain goes to a complete halt and just wait XD I know what's like to missing out and didn't want to pull until everyone is ready. There were at times, also, where the healer is new and can't do big pulls, which I pulled at a slower pace.
I'm really glad that I was able to turn my brain off from "trying hard" or "knowing how to play" coming from WoW (I started towards the endings of Shadowbringers). I was told constantly level 50 is where it starts to be fun or it'll take a while, but it's really good. I turned that off, cause uh.... I was already hating leveling thanks to WoW XD I started out new and took it a slow pace. I tried different jobs until one landed me right. Then I did some of the side content stuff. Heck, one stream night, I did nothing, but SIDE QUESTS to see what was it like on that expansion (I have went to Dawntrail on the quests).
The game isn't perfect, but it is a pace I am really glad that I stuck around. Heck, I had mixed receptions with the latest, but then I hear these discussions, theories, and even connections that it really made me think of the expansion in a different light. Now I can't wait to see more and pay VERY close attention to the details XD
Which I think brings up one point that I think FF14 excels at comparing to WoW: Story. I may have skipped a few of the raids, but when I did get into it (for me, it was the Bahamut series), I realized there was a connection that goes later in the story! I was like "Wait a minute" and connected the dots. It felt good! With WoW, even if I were to go back... there are some major retcons or the story that gets a bit of a drag (Shadowlands, for me), and it's hard to connect. What drives me is the connecting the dots and FF14 does that, which is what I get giddy about when I find that said connection XD
I think you make a great point with levelling when you take experiences from WoW. Levelling is kind of just...a means to an end in WoW, whereas in XIV it's SO much of the game. The dynamics are so different. You sound like you're having a great time with the game and playing it how you want to, and that's honestly what it's all about! You'll find yourself being so much happier. The story with WoW has been really disappointing in recent years. The lore generally is brilliant, but so much of it exists OUTSIDE of the game and has to be consumed via comics, novels and so on. It would be so much better if everything was in the game.
Thank you for taking the time to type this up and for sharing your thoughts!
@@edd_TV no problem! And that’s the other thing I forgot to mention, yeah. Some of the big important lores that happened in WoW was mostly from outside media. That’s not a generally bad thing, but if you’re a player that focuses on the game only, you’ll miss out some of the deals
FF14 has stories outside, too, but they’re generally stories that you can read in without missing much (one example being Pipin). It’ll help the concept overall, but you don’t really have to do much to get into the lore. Plus, the game, itself, has lore inside that can really make things interesting. Jesse Cox had a few pointers that happened in the previous expansion from a dungeon OUTSIDE the MSQ that helped establish a hint for Dawntrail. It’s honestly really good going back and finding these little bits and pieces :D
My favorite moment/memory in a video game comes from Gran Turismo 4.
It was when I finally bought my first race car: the Toyota GT-One (TS020).
I used it to try and win the World's Championship. And while I couldn't beat it at the time, it was my first proper race car and I'll never forget it.
That's a great one! Thank you for sharing!
I think what drove me away from FFXIV after a while was actually the Post-Endwalker MSQ. It felt like the writing took a massive nosedive compared to what the story was that captivated me from HW to shadowbringers. Besides that, I also got turned away from the community, which I found was surprisingly bigoted and hateful which took me by surprise (Mateus server). I would like to go back to xiv, but WoW has improved a lot since I returned and I'm not sure I have the time; yet I would like to at least go through the Dawntrail MSQ soon (despite it's mixed opinions). Great video though!
I really agree with you on this. I loved the base MSQ for Endwalker, but I found post extremely flat! I wasn't into it at all. Like I didn't hate it but it just didn't feel great. I'm really sorry to hear about your experience with the community, that's really unacceptable. it's definitely not a shining light like everybody says it is. It has its ups and downs like everywhere else and I don't think that's talked about enough! I hope you can get back into XIV eventually. Dawntrail is definitely a mixed bag but the gameplay is brilliant. I'm going to hold off judging it until the MSQ has concluded but yeah, definitely divisive! Glad to hear you're having a blast with WoW too. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and your kind words!
I think the biggest issue when it comes to player mentality is just how everything on the internet is solved and decoded. It’s hard to have an adventurer’s mindset when everything is already known.
And I’m not sure if that can ever change and go back to the way it used to be. But I miss hearing lore from word of mouth; having that friend IRL that also played WoW and told you about a super cool wolf rare in Duskwood that only spawns at midnight, or something like that.
The gossip might not even be true, but it made it so fun to run out and try to find it yourself. Now you can google the situation and be told everything there is to know about it.
And to wrap that back around, I don’t think the onus should be put on players having the wrong mentality or being the problem, it’s just…not the same. It’s hard to be an explorer in an MMO now.
That's so true. I think that's why Classic couldn't ever capture the same. It was still really great to go back and remember the world as it was, but with all the knowledge we have these days with tools like Wowhead, guides on TH-cam and so on. We just have so much at our disposal. I do think we have probably just become too used to the game, certainly in WoW's sense. 20 years is a crazy lifespan for an MMO, it is really difficult. You're right.
i reached Rank 20 on My Island Sacturay in FF14 i had so much fun doing it
@@ccpljager424 Congrats! I enjoyed Island Sanctuary a lot too!
If you're from wow, I'd recommend the PvP. Everyone from WOW who I've recommended if to has loved it
Funnily enough I'm probably at my weakest in PvP, although I did main a healer in WoW! That being said, I played A LOT of Crystalline Conflict during the first season and ranked in Crystal. I main Ninja and I had so much fun with the Limit Break, it's just crazy! I never really played CC outside of its first season though. I do Frontline but that's mainly just to level alt jobs because the xp is so crazy.
Great video my lil 🌱
Thank you Taya! I learned from the best.
I was on the server Asmon came to. His fanbase that followed along with him tanked the community on that server. There was so much poor behavior and toxic habits from WoW that took a lot of them a long time to unlearn. In the end, the server was never the same, but folks did start getting along with time. But Asmon's followers badgering him to play FFXIV? That's an issue with his followerbase - not with the FFXIV community.
Background:
WoW from Wrath - Pandaria (progression raider Cata-Panda),
ESO tester and Raider,
FFXIV Savage/Unreal/Ultimate raider
That's such a shame, I'm sorry to hear that! I think the followers of Asmon were FFXIV players who were keen on watching him progress through the story but his followers are also very unruly and temperamental, I hear what you're saying. It could be a mixture of both. I don't think Asmon's 'true' fanbase were ever interested in him playing FFXIV.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
Asmon confirmed himself that there were “wow andys” that pretended to be ffxiv players in order to harass him into not playing the game. There were forum posts even before he actually started on xiv, from people intent on sabotaging him trying other games who then carried through that plan in stream chats. I’m not sure how many of those people there actually were compared to real disgruntled ffxiv players, but they definitely existed and it was premeditated. Just makes me sad all around.
@@Cellybeans That is really disappointing to read. It's probably a bit of both, yeah. I think there is a lot of fear with WoW players and XIV. I think they know they will like it but their thought process and basis is just 'trash weeb game' and they dare not sway from that. I can remember watching a specific stream where he said he was getting fed up of his viewers asking him to play FFXIV. It makes sense to me that those people were likely FFXIV players interested in him progressing through the MSQ. I have to admit I was glued to his VODs and really interested in his journey and really looked forward to seeing his reactions at certain points in the MSQ. I sadly don't think he will ever come back.
@@edd_TVyeah it’s unfortunate. I imagine the number of saboteurs were pretty small but they get blended in with xiv players just asking when he was gonna do msq since that’s what they’re looking to watch, and the xiv players who either do or do not want him playing “their game” and very vocal about it. It all blends together and with an audience his size it doesn’t matter the intent, it has the same effect of making him just not want to deal with it.
The saboteur he showed the ban log of had the same person heckling him to hurry up and play ffxiv already, alternating with trash talking stupid weeb game, and earliest messages were kind of implicit threats if he went to play weeb game they’d start shit, and the username matched old reddit posts of similar vitriol. It was frankly disturbing.
@@edd_TV Yeah honestly and truly I have little issue with Asmon himself, he just wanted to have a good time and I deeply respect him for that and for how he got engaged with XIV. It really was just his followers that got the XIV crowd riled - because I have absolutely seen players embrace many others whose followerbase is more mature - like Jessie Cox and Dan Jones.
I had wanted to play wow, when it first was announced when I was school. However, between a poor computer for games and just how strict things were, I was unable to do so. I played 14 in beta on my sister’s account and played it when I was able to get it on ps3, and later to ps4, and I enjoy every moment being able to do what I feel like. The community is nice when it comes to new people and also doesn’t really fault when it comes to someone being new to an instance (I find the best thing you can say in chat is “hi I’m new to this” and you will get some people that will explain or put a hat on and ask you follow them). Some of the much harder content (unless you are running the new savage or aiming for world first) people would presume that you watch a video of the battle and get a feel for it.
I do wonder at times how WoW is like, it’s places and stories but I also get off put at the idea because of what I hear about the state of the game. Maybe one day I will look and see it for myself, but I think I will explore more of the other games I play for now.
As for a favorite memory? Falling by accident down Witchdrop because I did not notice there was a hole and I died instantly.
I think WoW is great but it's one of those 'You just had to be there' things. It's not an impossible job to get into it today but it is very, very difficult. I think the majority of people who still play WoW today are there because of sunk cost fallacy. No doubt they are still having fun but at this stage it's just a commitment. And I kinda relate too, I've been playing it for almost 20 years so I definitely still feel bound to it, but after playing so much XIV it made me realise "How on earth could any new player come into WoW and make sense of it all?". It's just an impossible ask, and then the players get upset, confused, potentially have bad experiences with players and then ultimately withdraw.
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings! I also had no idea there was a hole in Witchdrop, lol!
That is kinda disheartening. I’ve heard of all sorts of stories about the raids and the sillies (due to my aunts who played the game) so I was always curious by what they meant. The fact that the state of WoW is like that is… sad? It’s not a good word to describe it, but it’s a game I feel has so much history and love but it’s been tarnished irreparably by something I feel like I don’t comprehend.
As for the Witchdrop hilarity: this was when HW was released that I had gotten myself into the MSQ to be in Dragonhead. This is before flight, and if you weren’t paying attention when you go north from the camp, you just… plummet right off and die. I did it when I got there, and was about to return when I saw some random player… also fall off and die. You could get yourself to stay alive if you fell, but not move or press a button, but the voidsent in the drop will hone in on your barely living body and go to town. I sadly don’t see such a thing anymore, maybe because people are aware of the yawning pit or have flight to get around it, but it is something that stayed in my head. I have so many memories with games, but I find the ones I look back on fondly are ones where consequences have been made and I flubbed up in some random way and trying to fix it always leads to some creative liberties.
Suppose I'll throw my hat into the ring.
My favorite thing to do in games is to do silly stuff, and solving puzzles. Let me tell you how that made be better at FFXIV.
A little backstory: I got into FFXIV like a month before Shadowbringers, and FFXIV was my first MMO. Even now, while caught up on MSQ and in the process of leveling all the jobs to max, I'm not the best, and I acknowledge this. I don't gear the best and I just have fun.
I did, however, solo all the Normal Omega raids in Endwalker. As my first experience with the raid series. No, this wasn’t reclears, it was first-time clear. SGE for most, RDM for O9, BLU for O11 and O12 (O12 actually got me to use materia in my gear for the first time).
Why did I do this? I found out my one friend, who got into the game after I did and said that we should do the Omega raids together, did the Omega raids with other friends. So this was my silly act of spite in response. The most playful of jabs (while I get throttled by Omega).
I then proceeded to have the bright idea to try and solo the Savage Omega raids. It wasn’t a good idea (some fights have mechanics that require multiple people or I die an unavoidable death).
But I did complete O4S and O8S in about a collective total of 5 hours. Keep in mind, I'm going into the fights blind, with my only prior experience being my solos on the Normal tier to guide me, so I had to puzzle solve new mechanics on my own (one mech in O4S was a shove that happens if I don't stand in the right color, and as my abilities were timed, I was stuck in Diamondback [90% damage reduction for 10 seconds, but become unactionable and cannot move] when it happened, meaning I had to hope I won a coin flip; I later realized "why don't I cast it earlier so I can move when it happens, rather than relying on a coin flip?" I won the second attempt after that little change)
After Dawntrail, I would join parties doing Extremes to get mounts, and one group did The Dying Gasp. And nobody here knew mechanics. So it ended up with me, having the Solo BLU experience, learning the mechanics as they happen and then telling the group what to do. We eventually got it, and on the last pull before people had to leave to sleep (this was at like 3AM EST; my sleep schedule was wack back then); no mount dropped, but triumph was just as sweet.
And this opened me up to being willing to try raid content for the current expansion, which is the line (in my mind, at least) one must cross to become considered an experienced player. Because I had the realization that it's solving puzzles, and I like solving puzzles.
So yea, that's the story on how I've grown confidence in my abilities as a still fairly inexperienced MMORPG player, and it was all because I like puzzles and being a silly goober.
Oh, and if you couldn't guess already, BLU is my favorite job in FFXIV. I love the silly little monster spell guy.
This was such an interesting read. I did not expect to read anything like this, but thank you so much for throwing your hat in the ring! I LOVE that you talked about solving puzzles, because that's an example I had to use recently with somebody talking about parsing and bosses. Boss mechanics are puzzles and are there to be resolved, and that's what the fight should be about! Not the parse. If people want to aim high for parses or whatever else then that's fine but it shouldn't take precedence over anything else. This was a really fun read. Thank you for taking the time to type this up!
@edd_TV Of course. I'll also add that, even though me going solo makes some of the mechanics easier, it does make some mechanics harder. There's multiple times where things would target multiple players, but since it's only me, it only happens once and not 4 times. There's also multiple times where, since it's only me, all 4 of the attacks all hit me at the same time and I just have to deal with it (and no, Diamondback is not always the solution).
Either way, it's a puzzle, because the solution for one doesn't apply for the other. And sometimes, it's not possible solo, and sometimes it's just on the edge of possibility if you leverage everything.
Case in point, O12S. There's a mechanic where the bosses rush at two different players three times in a row. Getting hit results in a Vuln that causes you to take 10x magic damage (these attacks deal magic damage). And I couldn't survive Solo, cause the net total damage is somewhere about 260k (with Diamondback active, which, again, is a 90% reduction), and I only have about 50k HP.
Searching the internet, it is indeed possible. But for my abilities and gear presently, I cannot win. Maybe I will once BLU gets Lv. 90 access, maybe I will still need to improve beyond that. But it's an impossible fight for me to solo due to that one mechanic, despite it being very possible (and not that hard in the grand scheme of things) with other players.
But, I am holding myself to complete O12S Solo, as a matter of pride, and because I did the other two solo and I want the trifecta.
@@p2jnyoom You should make this into a video series. It's so wacky but so very compelling! You got this!
I've played both. Honestly, I just cant with WoW anymore. I did the dragonflight thing, and enjoyed the leveling, and going through the zones, but got to the end game, and went nuts to this. FFXIV's end game loot system has made it impossible for me to do Wow's ever again. I have run the mythics, or raids for months an not seen a drop, where in 14 once i get the fights on farm, i can get a guaranteed loot item. WoW just doesn't do it for me anymore. I might be tempted for a classic run or two at some point, but honestly, will stick to FFXIV, and continue to use GW2 as my main side mmo, with a toe dipped here or there into something like EQ TLP's, and Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen when EA comes out later this year. I have great WoW memories, but I just cant anymore. I wont get into the Bull donkey that is the mythic dungeon system, and how hard if you are new to it breaking into actually getting grps for it.
My greatest MMO memory goes back to Everquest, 2004, Planes of Power raid on Plane of Water and Coirnav. We were had taken a few cracks already, but we felt we had it this time. So, we pull, the fight is going good, we got through the adds, and were working on Coirnav, his hp was disappearing. I was getting excited as his hp bar was barely visable, like serious less than 1% hp, and my screen froze, and I found myself in the Plane of Tranquility. The guild chat flooded with swearing, and the roster online went from like 70 ppl to 12. Reason, well, Coirnav is the first enrage fight, sorta. You had 15 minutes to complete the fight, and if you didnt, you were banished from the zone, and the boss despawned. Oh, and since this is an open world boss, and stuff, he doesnt respawn for like 5 days or something. I will never forget that night.
I think Dragonflight levelling was really good! The dragonriding was such a nice new coat of paint for flying. The story was extremely mid, I wasn't feeling it at all. I absolutely hear you in regards to gear! WoW felt so much simpler when it was badges of justice or emblems of triumph. It's so convoluted now. I think Classic fresh will be massive when the time inevitably comes for that, and there is something so very charming and tempting about it. It's difficult to resist.
That's a really great memory, so interesting to hear a story about Everquest too as I have no knowledge of it whatsoever! Thank you for taking the time to type this up and sharing your thoughts and feelings!
As someone who's played both FF14 and WoW since their launches, (Done mythic and savage, ultimate coils, feast competitively back in heavensward, and have gotten gladiator in WoW 3 times) what I've learned, is playing both when one is on a good ride and the other bad is the best way to be.
Shadowlands, which is when i assume most WoW players discovered FF14, was everything wrong with modern wow. Alt unfriendliness, endless grind, boring chores.
Dawntrail, which so far, has been one of the most polarizing releases for FF14 aside from maybe parts of heavensward and stormblood, showcased everything wrong with FF14. Repetitive design structure, uninspired and slow (YES SLOW) combat, and poor story delivery (ppl didnt mind exposition dump after exposition dump with 0 gameplay when the story was 'good' but Dawntrail just took that agency away by 100x.
Both games can learn from each other.
That's impressive, great job! That's a great way to look at it. Tribalism generally is ridiculous and I think we should be able to enjoy both games but it just comes down to how they function, playstyle and such. You're absolutely right. It would be fun to explore a video about how FFXIV could learn from WoW. My brain will definitely cook something up regarding that. Thank you for posting!
@@edd_TV yes i love both of em. It was so surreal when the streamers came to my server cactuar since i was a bit out of the loop after Castle Nathria and I took my mandatory wow break to prep for Endwalker. It was fun for a bit to see people discovering FF14 and it was great for my wow guildmaster to finally get a chance to try that weird FF game i skipped a few raid nights to play back in WoD.
@@xarbinchaoticneutral1785 I can imagine! That must have been nice if you got some guildies from WoW along for the ride. I think some people do feel that it's WoW or nothing, and it doesn't need to be that way!
for me the pf experience in ff14 kinda killed all partyfinders in other games.
Two clicks and your in compared to applying to dozens of parties over an extended timeframe.
Yeah, there was something super disheartening when it came to Mythic+ in WoW and repeatedly getting declined for groups. Even if your raider.io score is great, maybe they don't want you because you're not the right class etc. I main Holy Paladin and I honestly think that's why they gave us a battle rez, just so we would be more viable/sought after in Mythic+. There's a lot of gatekeeping and it sadly comes with the territory when it comes to high level play but It's a huge problem when it seeps into casual play.
I only played WoW for a week, but I still recall my friend noticing me online at an odd hour, and upon finding out I was upset about something at the time he took the time to bring me an in game bouquet and do a dungeon or something with me. Once he was hacked later that week though I stopped as I wasn't going to pay a sub to a game I probably couldn't really afford at the time simply to solo. These days I mostly bounce between GW2 and FF14 as I liked what they had to offer me and enjoy the worlds, but I do think WoW has some pretty environments so it'd be a shame if people don't give themselves the time to enjoy them.
That's a cute story. I've heard GW2 is really good and the latest patch with housing looks a lot of fun! Oh yeah, the art team with WoW are spectacular; the zones and music are just so brilliant. Thank you for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
GW2 is still going?
@@Violent_Wolfen It just released its latest patch on August 20, 2024!
@@Violent_Wolfen Yep! They released it earlier in the year on Steam and then recently had an expac release with the first part currently available, next update in less than two months from what I recall. I still very much love the world and curious to see where they keep going with their new release style (though I wish/hope they stop changing that style and we can settle with the current one >.>;; ). It's allowing them more open opportunities to address some interesting story points and history questions. I also still love the Fashion Wars aspect of it ngl =P
One memory that stays with me is when a friend let me use her wow account, i made a human paladin and in Northshire *somebody waved at me*. Another human player!
The emotes were such a cool thing in WoW when playing for the first time! They could definitely use a new coat of paint, I think we should be able to see full face animations when people /smile etc, but there was something so magical about seeing those emotes back in the day. People waving at people and drive-by buffing people in the open world. Great memories.
@@edd_TV i had forgotten about the buffing! As a Frost Mage gnome, i spent hours in Ironforge just "to make people smart" by giving them arcane brilliance.
@@dharusiokay9426 It was always so nice to get Fortitude from a priest when you were knee deep in a cave! I always felt so bad offering only a 5 minute blessing in return.
In my 3 years with this game, I've genuinely never had a bad experience there.
I've had a few but nothing even close to WoW. I suppose I am comparing several years of XIV to almost 20 years of WoW. I could probably count on one hand how many bad experiences I've had in FFXIV!
as both a WoW player (who only played DragonFlight) and FFXIV (for over 3 years)
it is quite scary that players can be toxic enough that it warps their thoughts and make assumptions that is very illogical and even selfish
but as a FFXIV and the way you brought up how there are some players that are Toxic Positivity well......I must confess I never had seen anyone like that but that does bring worry, but also glad that at least there are still players who not only still help newcomers out of the kindness
but also still take the time to let you dip your feet in
plus given how WoW is still quite a popular MMO, I do wish they would be better and I was hoping that Dragonflight would make that difference, which honestly it was a very good attempt
it got me more invested into how I see the world and even more so at what's happening
but by the time I got to the end, it became the usual thing as you stated "everybody just wants it done, that's it"
and that's maybe why I stick more to FFXIV even if I go on and off here and there, but at least overall the game is cared enough show that even bad things can sometimes have a bit of good moments that may change one's opinion
and I wanna speak more about WoW for this part, if at some point WoW does improve on both Their Story and even try's make it more appealing to newcomers instead of just worrying about endgame stuff then I would reconsider trying to join back in since I did play the new Dracthyr and its class
and honestly I like the idea, but I see alot of things that could be better
in fact more so for its viability, but aside from that I like the design of Dracthyr and its own Flying/Gliding ability, since I can finally play as a Dragon Race like I was in FFXIV (Au'ra) and honestly I was having.......fun, yes I can't believe I would say that since no joke I was a bit......eh with WoW but after Dragonflight, it made me look back and think........ya know maybe I judge too personal with it
and yea it was thanks to FFXIV for that, but I now wish that WoW would soon try to change its way and hope, oh sweet lord HOPE that players in WoW would at least stop being so stingy and just open up a bit
and even more so, if I do go back to WoW maybe when I play my Character again it would be adjust with buffs or nerfs, and I can start playing with my brother again (who's been playing WoW for over 8 years)
but overall on this topic
very well put together statement and even amazing in depth comparison from both sides
The toxic side of FFXIV does exist but it's a lot more tongue-in-cheek or tip-toey I find, as opposed to how open and aggressive it can be in WoW. I feel similarly to you. I can count on one hand how many bad experiences I've had in FFXIV but they do exist. I've read stories rather than had the experiences directly myself, but overall I can say I've barely ever had bad experiences.
I haven't tried The War Within yet but everybody is saying the story is VERY good compared to what has come before it, which honestly isn't difficult. The bar is quite low with BFA, Shadowlands and Dragonflight in my opinion but it's getting a lot of praise all the same. In time I'm going to make a video documenting my story/levelling experience in The War Within and hopefully I'll have some really positive things to say too.
Thank you for your kind words and taking the time to watch and type this up. I really appreciate it!
@@edd_TV glad to hear and I'll keep an eye out for that video
😉
@@MarioandSonic345 I appreciate your support. Thank you!
You mentioned there isn't datamining in 14. There is, you just have to go out of your way to find it because Square Enix actively does what they can to stop it so they've been driven to be less public about what they do. That and you have to wait for a patch to become downloadable to be able to datamine. With the exception of outfits, very little will be added ahead of time.
That is true! It does exist but not on the levels of like Wowhead, the PTR and the like. I think WoW would be so much more fun if we aren't privy to this sort of stuff, but the players are the testers at the end of the day and that's what makes the games so very different. I think it also generates a lot of hype for WoW players. It's exciting to see everything that's coming, but also a bit of a shame that everything gets spoiled ahead of time. You are correct though, I do recall seeing datamined weapon skins for the Pictomancer prior to Dawntrail.
I still prefer PLAYING WoW overall since I just think it has the superior combat and gameplay, however I prefer BEING in 14 since it just feels far more comfortable. There’s not the constant little advancement of your power to pursue, you don’t have nearly as much micromanaging upkeep of your character, and while talent trees with different builds are definitely fun it’s also nice knowing everyone playing that job is using the exact same toolkit you are. There just always feels like there’s far more pressure while paying WoW, pressure from the game itself and pressure from the other players. 14 feels way more relaxed and dare I say “casual” (lol dirty word I know). I like tanking in theory but I wouldn’t dare try anything other than DPS in WoW, partly because Fury and Arms are my passion, but mainly because there’s so much more outside pressure with tanking. You have to constantly worry about positioning and swaps in raids, you have to know the exact perfect route and mobs to pull in dungeons, it’s just not fun for me. But in 14 I’m tank only. It just feels so much easier and relaxed, the rotation is more simple than DPS, wall to wall dungeon pulls are surprisingly simple once you know what your mitigation tools do, and in raids (at least for normal) it’s almost braindead. Overall 14 is so nice because there’s just so much less hassle compared to WoW in pretty much every aspect. Not even getting into story stuff, I’ll just say that I still prefer WoW story and lore since I’m far more invested in that universe but 14 delivers its narrative in the vastly superior way for sure.
I do think WoW's combat is just so brilliant. I think casual is the best word to sum it up, yeah. I feel a lot more free in XIV and less anxious about experimenting with things. I would tank in XIV but never in WoW for example, so I share your feelings! I always healed in WoW, I wouldn't dare try anything else. I got good with Holy Paladin and knew it was where I belonged. I LOVE healing in WoW but it doesn't do it for me at all in XIV.
I relate to you with WoW's lore and story too, despite how messy things became with Shadowlands and maybe even how flat Dragonflight was, I've been invested since I was about 13 so there is no way I'm ever truly checking out. I'm actually watching a WoW lore video as I type this up to you, lol. I'll always be very interested in the lore of WoW but I'm just very grateful I was able to fall in love and appreciate a new narrative and world too.
Thank you for watching and taking the time to type this up. I really appreciate it.
@@edd_TV my perfect mmo would be WoW that tells its story like 14 with the open world exploration and meta events of GW2
@@ProphetOfTruth_ Never say never! Who knows what could happen down the line.
The thing that made me eventually pry myself away from WoW was the community. During the great exodus in 2021, I went to Guild Wars 2 instead of FFXIV. The community in that game is also incredible. It took me 7 months of all day, every day play to have my first genuine toxic experience. In WoW, it was at least 50/50 whether a Mythic+ or raid would have toxic people, ninja looters, or overall toxicity from mechanics. Present day I play FFXIV with a handful of players that I played WoW with. None of us feel that draw to go back.
I've never played GW2 but I did see the latest patch and it looks pretty good! From my understanding I think Blizzard were inspired by GW2's flying and that's where they got dragonriding from? That's pretty good going timewise to have your first negative experience. It's bittersweet to know that you've found a place in XIV with your WoW friends but so sad to know that some people have just let WoW go with no desire to return. I think we will always love it and read about it but for some people it just feels like an old friend you've either had to cut off or lost contact with. It's a weird sense of heartbreak.
Welcome to Eorzea for one.
For two, my most enjoyable moment was getting a minion called Salt & Pepper Seal. It's so cute and it wanders around you. I do enjoy all the other stuff in FFXIV.
My WoW experience was quitting in 2016 during Legion. Because of playing Warlords of Draenor first. It was boring and annoying. Got the Flying in WoD and I couldn't stand WoW anymore. I didn't have the nostalgia for the game as all the people who played Vanilla.
Edit: Another thing, World of Warcraft had minion battle thingy that I enjoyed but you don't have access to it if you are too low level, which is dumb. And there's a lot of powercreep for that game mode in WoW. I enjoyed my time in Wrath of the Lich King. But I can't really stand World of Warcraft anymore. It's slowly changing back to Vanilla where community matters but it's a long time coming until it can reach that level of commitment.
Edit 2: I enjoyed every single Expansion in FFXIV. A Realm Reborn, Heavensward, Stormblood, Shadowbringers, Endwalker, and Dawntrail. It's mostly because I enjoy a story that feels nice. Dawntrail is a desive expansion, but it had some good dungeons, and etc. Though, the only dungeon I didn't like was the Turtle at the end of the Lv99 Dungeon. Because it uses enormous Aoes. lol
Thank you! I'm familiar with that minion but I think I got it from one of the Moogle Events! I have the Golden Beaver that I take around everywhere with me, haha. WoD into Legion was really weird for a lot of people. It was almost a trial by fire because we went from having zero content to constantly doing world quests or mythic+. Trying to get our best legendaries and unlocking the artifact tree. The contrast between WoD and Legion is crazy. I loved it personally but some really didn't like how much was being demanded of their time. Nostalgia is a huge part of WoW and I think Blizzard know it. I think that's why they are too afraid to launch a WoW 2. I think there is so much attachment with the sunk cost fallacy with players characters and that's what always draws players back. If they pull the plug on this and do a WoW 2 and it fails, why would players stick around? It's interesting.
Thank you for the kind welcome, watching the video and your comment!
@@edd_TV I never got the Salt and Pepper Seal from it's dungeon, the 4.1 dungeon the Scalla one.
Warlords of Draenor was one of the worst expansions because it lacked content, they even cut the middle tier Raid, specifically Shattarth or something to that effect.
Legion had way too much stuff in it and it didn't really pull me into the game. And I quit before Mythic+ was added. I did like the start of the story I suppose.
Though, World of Warcraft does have a problem of timegating its story massively, week 1 (Here's the first bit of the story), week 2 (Here's more of the story), etc. etc.
It would be nice if it was released all at once like FFXIV. Since you get the entire expansion on launch.
@@ArmageddonEvil Yeah, there was supposed to be a Shatrath raid! I was so sad we never got that. I think it was 'Assault on Shattrath City' or something along those lines.
I have done a video on Legion if you're interested in watching that! Legion has so much good, but definitely has some bad and it was a precursor for a lot of bad stuff that happened in WoW for 4-5 years.
I would love them to release the story all in one go. I think if they could adopt the format that XIV has with the MSQ and then do some post story it would be so much better. I think they WILL eventually do this but they are still trying to figure out what works and what the players like I think. It's going to be an interesting but unfamiliar process for them.
@@edd_TV The Worst thing that was in Legion was that the Legionaries were supposed to be easier to get on launch but, the higher ups waited until the End of the Expansion to release it. It's quite sad, I definitely didn't want to go through the Legionaries grind to get the BIS only for it to be nerfed and needed anew Legionary.
Gear in FFXIV is good enough, it reminds me of Wrath content. The Free Trial for WoW kinda sucks, and I didn't know you could transfer levels to another character, that's odd and strange no offense.
I'll watch that video after World of Warcraft: Why Some Players Aren't Having Fun Anymore. Always good to get some insight in the other mmorpg that actually played that content than I who quit *before* it was released.
On a different note, I've played ARR 2.0, a total of 4 times before it was Revamped in 5.3. I decided to only play one character instead of my multiple alt characters I have on the NA Data Centers.
@@ArmageddonEvil I think the way XIV gearing works is perfect. I definitely get the same vibes as you in regards to like badges of justice and so on. It was just so simple and easy to do. I appreciate you engaging and checking out the channel! I've also played ARR four times too! I played it first for my initial playthrough (which I shamefully story skipped), I did it once again to do the MSQ properly and two other times to make sure I could get my friends through it because I knew they'd never get through ARR unless I dragged them through it kicking and screaming. I'm planning on a video at some point in regards to why players quit and throw in the towel with ARR.
I left WoW after an abusive 15 year relationship with Blizzard from 2004. I started playing FF14 and was blown away by the story. On my main I have finished all the role quests for Dawntrail but started an alt character and am slow rolling it through the MSQ. I am leveling all crafters and jobs at the same time and it is so awesome. I don't feel like I'm missing out on things and it makes me realize I am missing nothing from my WoW days. WoW became such a toxic community and it felt like a job logging in. It's a constant Epeen measuring contest with DPS charts and gear scores that is sucked the joy out of the game.
It makes me sad when people describe WoW as an abusive relationship but for some people that is exactly what it is/was. Either that or the equivalent of drugs right? An addiction. For me, watching World of Warcraft fall further and further from what it is was is almost like losing a friend to drugs and they just refuse to get clean. They sink and they sink and they sink and there's nothing you can do except watch. It has definitely gotten better since Shadowlands but it seems unimaginable to me that WoW will find its way back to its glory days. And maybe that's a problem with us, I'm not sure. I definitely miss it and I still love it, but similarly to you I feel free now. The fact that I didn't play the pre-patch or even buy The War Within was very surprising and liberating to me. I'm totally with you on it feeling like a job, and I think both us and Blizzard are guilty of that. We didn't have to do it but we felt compelled to.
I think you have hit the nail on the head too in regards to the whole 'e-peen' measuring stuff. It begs the question should MMOs even be competitive? I think the answer is yes on some level, but maybe only in spaces like PvP. I think when the game is clearly competitive on all fronts is when we see gatekeeping at its absolute worst.
Thanks for taking the time to watch and sharing your thoughts. I really appreciate it!
Answering your question I can make a summary such as: fiting graft in xenogears, or bhal in grandia with low level. Finishing warioland 4 with all endings, or the end of Devil may cry 1 that make cry. In wow would be doing thing with friends: arenas for example killing a druid when it seems that i loose but I reverted the situation (and resently talking with a friend in a bar in the game as old times), seeing my wife getting new mounts and pets, and transmogs. In ff14 was the end of shadowbringers rolling when some important charactar ask me who I am (I am personally answer " the one who's gonna brake your legs). Or doing all nier quest that came in a very hard moment in my adult life, and so on like getting my first rare mount from a trial.
My problems with wow is the layer sistem and part of the comunity website (r.i.p). I hate playing wow and not being abel to see my wife just because i am in a different layer. In valdraken i was looking for her but when we made party i see her, and it is horrible because you kill the comunity feeling and frienship of seeing a friend doing shit around, and forget the about the pvp war or doing invations that now means nothing. as an aliance player was epic to wake up at 5 or 6 am just to kill the warchief when the other city leaders where little bit more easy to kill. I would prefer they change into other sistem of player distribution sistem or tons of lag than that, it pains me.
And the second thing was the community. The website used to be more open friendly with players. Did you made a fan art, screenshot or another stuff, go and upload it there. I remember trying almost every weak trying to be in the screenshot day, but with wod they change the look of the page and also other things that i not sure if it still there as the art of the expansion that only people can see of they got the collector edition with the art book. Ff14 dont have that aspect, but at least they made competitions to see the best art to implement in the game.
Thanks for reading and I hope you did not have such trouble reading my long comment.
It's not quite the same since it's only on instagram, but the official FFXIV account does feature fan art there every Monday. I didn't play WoW so no idea how their site was but featuring community content regularly does sound wonderful, wish we would have something similar because otherwise it's only in big bulks along competitions and FanFests. Lodestone does have a blog feature but just like the community finder or fellowships in-game, those seem to be only actively used by Japanese players and they never took off with the western audience.
Some really great memories there! I'm very much with you with the ending for Shadowbringers, in terms of a recent memory that one sticks out for me so much. It was epic. Layering is really frustrating, I agree. It feels so weird and sad tome just watching people fade in and out when you join a group or whatever. Thank you for taking the time to type this up, and don't apologise! One of the reasons I started making content in the first place was because I'm really curious to what people have to say and love to hear peoples thoughts and experiences. Thanks again for sharing yours!
Shout out to Dekuchild-Shiva! Alway lay dead on the ground body :D
"Content preservation" is what admire the most about FF14. The MSQ, all content, all trials and raids are preserved (at least in one way or another), and being "forced" to go through it all is actually an amazing thing. When I see people complain about the MSQ I just want to slap them, they're actively hating on the single best aspect of the game. I believe gameplay, class design, fight design, raids, are all MUCH BETTER in WoW, all actual gameplay aspects are better, so to me if you are playing FF14 and treating it like it's WoW, you are missing the best aspects of the game and doing yourself a huge disservice, to put it as politely as I possibly can.
I'm curently loving War Within, and on a long break from FF14. Why? Endwalker felt like the end to me, it was an incredible time to play the game from 2014 to 2022, and I love that new players can experience the entire story beginning to end, I think that's wonderful and recommend everyone to give it a try. WoW might be the better MMO but FF14 is by far the better RPG.
So very true. I would love to see WoW attempt this in some fashion but I feel like it might be a bit awkward with the level squishes and such; you can go into Molten Core at level 10 or 20 now etc. I think a complete redesign where you could 'sync' things to a certain level would be really great for WoW. I can already imagine guilds setting up events to go and run old raids to show people what things were like back then. It seems the perfect opportunity for a timewalking revamp, but as a permanent feature.
I 100% agree with you that if you go into FFXIV with what I'll call 'WoW brain', you really are cheating yourself. Whether that's skipping the story or being uninterested in any content that is not current. I would say the same could be said about boosting jobs. It's not the end of the world but you are missing out on a story being told there. I can understand people who boost in WoW if they have seen it all before etc.
I'm glad to hear you're having a blast with The War Within, everybody seems to say so! It's very encouraging for me as I plan to give it a stab in the next month or two. I can relate with Endwalker feeling like the end, and I think that was handled deliberately and intentionally, and now we have to begin anew with Dawntrail. And whilst that hasn't had the best start narratively, I'm hopeful they have some big things planned!
Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts and feelings. I enjoyed reading this!
WoW is a job. FF14 on the other hand, is a hobby.
WoW was built to be a competitive obligation. Where the journey didn't matter anymore, only the destination. Everything is funneled to the endpoint, the specific goal set by those at the top. There's the unspoken rule of 'be the best'. Old content was (unsure about now, haven't played since early Shadowlands) for the most part only seen by people rushing through it to reach the endpoint where all the other people are, if at all. To try new things, one must put in massive effort to make another character and have it reach that point too. For the most part, all people see is the same endgame content, over and over. The only split in 'style' is pve or pvp. Everything is mandatory because everything is tied to upgrades or some form of vendor/system that gives upgrades or mandatory items, which is all needed to even be considered in endgame parties. And on top of that the community created exclusionary rules to optimize things further. You must be a specific build that's optimal, you must have specific scores on arbitrary websites that track effort, you must have specific third-party resources, like addons, installed. Everything is a MUST. Everything is a competition and so everyone must compete or face open hostility. This is fine for people who love to compete, who like the pressure and prestige of being 'the best'. Who want to run on the eternal treadmill to see numbers increase. People who want to spend their free time under pressure to earn and keep a status.
FF14 is built to be an inclusive experience. It's all about the journey one chooses to take. (if not a bit on rails for the main scenario) It has and currently is actively outlawing all forms of competitive mindset. It's still there, but hidden. Not allowed to be broadcast. Barely tolerated. Its focus is on the story and individual experiences, building things slowly and carefully with zero pressure to complete them because apart from specific timed events, nothing stops being available. It is a leisure activity. The only pressure it has is fleeting and downplayed; skill challenges that are often kept optional and often are available to anyone who has done the 'tutorial' part and is allowed to travel further than their starting zone. All of its content, from the lowest-level instance to the highest, is still replay-able by every player at every level. Every character can be every role. There is no need for alt characters. No need to compete so no need to be derogatory and exclusionary so long as everyone puts in the effort needed to fulfill their chosen role. There are crazy timed grinds still, but those too have communities that are encouraged to uplift and include as much as they can because they do not lose out on anything if they do. Most rewards are cosmetic. There are nearly an equal amount of gameplay experiences that require NO combat whatsoever compared to that that are combat-focused.
This means that the actual competitive aspects (pvp, raids) are considered a bit lackluster compared to WoW more involved system.
But it is the better game for those who dislike competition. Who want little or nothing to do with pressure when they gain their fulfillment.
Each game has their merits that appeal to different people. Each game has their flaws that turn off certain people.
Both are still games though, which are made for entertainment. So long as you are entertained, keep playing the game you love.
Very well written, you've summed both up really well. This was a good read! Thank you for taking the time to type this up!
GG!!!!
GG!
That's funny, I literally just watched AnnieFuchsia's video of her playing the last bit of vanilla Endwalker MSQ last night. It went up 3 days ago I think. Man, she does NOT like Zenos at all, lol. I wonder if that's one of the things her viewers were annoyed about..? Honestly, I can relate -- I never liked Zenos as a character either. How they used him at the end of Endwalker was good, though.
He was always very controversial though, right? He was quite established by the time I joined. When I originally finished the MSQ I think 'The Burn' was the final dungeon. I've had friends tell me how much they were pushing him as a character when Stormblood was announced. There was lots of posters, artwork and I think even a statue of him with the collectors edition or something? I don't HATE him but he was quite...samey I suppose? and his motive wasn't exactly enthralling. I agree with you though, the ending for Endwalker was fantastic.
Having played both in general the FFXIV is friendlier to a point, they can still be smug and fill with denial on certain issues
I think so too but it's extremely tip-toey. Almost like when somebody is passive aggressively using ':)' or '^^'. Some are basically playing a game where they are trying to be nice, but it's so very easy to see through. I think the TL:DR is WoW players are upfront about bad behaviour because they so rarely get punished and in XIV they have to dance around it because they KNOW they will get punished.
I feel like the era of XIV players being hyper defensive of the MSQ may be starting to come to an end with Dawntrail. There has been a lot of criticism of it and while there is still pushback when you do, theres enough people criticizing it that the defenders dont really feel like a mob. Ive definitely been called a few things like when I said I didn't like one of the characters voice acting, but in those same replies there were 3 people agreeing with me.
I think you're right. I think we should be able to point out strengths and weaknesses without a war of words. At the end of the day we all want the game to be better, right? I also think if we all agree on the same things then everything is just a bit boring. We need controversy, debate, opinions and such. I think Dawntrail is a good example because it's very mixed. I think most would praise the gameplay; the combat, raids dungeons and whatnot but narratively it was disappointing for a lot of people. It will be a lot healthier if people don't feel silenced or afraid to speak up because they don't want to go against the grain etc. I do agree with you that I feel it's calmed down a bit and maybe this is a turning point going forward. I think it's important for the devs to actually hear some potentially harsh truths at times too because they would want to know. Thanks for taking the time to watch and leaving a comment!
@@edd_TV It was a good video, with good opinions. Sorry to mess with watch time a bit though had to watch at 1.5 to fit in my schedule. One small disagreement with the dungeons also, I have not been a fan of the expert dungeons, tender valley is bearable but I dislike the other 2.
@@MrImjustaminorthreat Oh that's totally fine, I appreciate you taking the time to watch all the same and thank you for sharing your thoughts! I was surprised how hard the dungeons were initially. They seemed a lot harder than things we had seen in the past. I'm the opposite I think, haha. I really don't like Tender Valley but I think Deadwalk is cool! Thanks again for engaging with the video. I really appreciate it!
It's weird because it used to be if you had something negative to say about the MSQ people would flame you. Now, if you have something NICE to say about Dawntrail.......people will flame you. 😂
@@LobsterFusion That is so true. There are definitely elements of Dawntrail I did like but I'm sure I share the same gripes as everybody else. At the end of the day it's all subjective and people can enjoy whatever they want. It is funny like you say though how people expect everybody to unite and march in one direction. We need debates and opinion, otherwise everything is just bland!
Ragnarok online mentioned lets goooooooooo
Hell yeah. If you're still watching, you'll hear two tracks along the way. Enjoy!
Correction, five raid difficulties. LFR, normal, heroic, mythic and story. Yeh it's a bit insane.
@@akaraven66 Yeah, the added story mode is a really great idea, but it’s getting out of hand now!
@@edd_TV It was a good idea at best, it was a bad implementation since it's just one boss.
It would be nice to remove LFR, make story the entire raid and let players go up to 5 with limits, and fill the rest with NPCs.
Limits being one tank, so the NPC tank will taunt swap correctly, and maybe put some big warning for the player tank to taunt back so they can learn. Half the healers would be NPCs at least for the same reasons, in case the players are bad at least the group won't wipe and so on.
Story should be for players who want to raid, not just be carried, but are not good enough to raid, but also setup so if players are just sitting there or purposely dying then the boss won't be killed so they have to put in effort.
LFR should never have been. 25 randoms who sit around playing dead hoping to join a group just to be carried, and worse when you run into a group where you see a DPS taunt the boss on purpose, or 3 seconds after pull turn around and jump off the edge.
Yet they mostly get rewarded for that and that sets a bad precedent.
@@akaraven66 I agree with everything you've said. Having one boss seems so underwhelming! I feel these are both really great ideas with the story mode and the follower dungeons but they haven't been implemented or had enough care go into them at all.
What is that ff14 anime in the background some times ??
There's a few of them. They are Korean commercials and can be found on the official Korean page. I'll leave some links here for you :-
th-cam.com/video/efl-IvXAoGw/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/hf3cCkM9M84/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/abdLWmMgCpc/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/-1r3-znGzks/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/lwmQgulEUY4/w-d-xo.html
Hope this helps!
You are right in most of it, but you are very wrong on the data mining xD There are several discord servers for that, its a lot more "exclusive" as its not to well known unless you "know people" but it is a thing xD Sometimes I know what Ultimate Weapons look like way before its released. But yeah its not exactly common knowledge thats true.
Oh it obviously exists on some level but it's not as in your face is what I'm trying to say. Maybe I should have been more clear on it! We don't have like cutscenes on TH-cam or a dedicated Wowhead website etc. You are absolutely right! I recall seeing some datamined Pictomancer weapons before Dawntrail released etc.
@@edd_TV Ohh well I never played WoW so not sure how the dataming looks there. But yeah thank god that doesnt exist for FF14 as it probably would take away some fun if its pushed into your face before the actual release :/
@@YvaiatheDemon Yeah the cutscenes will usually wind up on TH-cam immediately. The story isn't remotely as sacred in WoW as it is in FFXIV though, but it's still huge spoilers for some people!
@@edd_TV oh yeah I heard that in order to understand the WoW story (if there is one) you'd have to buy books etc XD Not sure if its true but that sounds so complicated
@@YvaiatheDemon Very much so yeah! There are novels, short stories, all sorts. I talk about a new player experience in WoW in my 'Island of Irrelevancy' video if you're interested in checking that out.
20:07 it is always funny to see myself in the background in some random great videos recommend to me, that said ALL HAIL THE CUBE WALL! \O/
Haha! I turned my camera and noticed it and thought 'This will be good footage'. Thanks for being a part of it! \o/ and thank you for watching!
I like the part at 15:28
I experienced what I guess people call toxic positivity, but to me it just felt like normal internet rudeness shaped by a cultish obsession with the game. The idea of "FFXIV is part of my personality, so if you insult the game, your insulting me". I like critiquing games, I like critiquing any media, because I feel the point of adding a social facet to media is to talk about it. Do not critique FFXIV in front of its player base. Even something as simple as "I wish this game had chat bubbles like other MMOs" got me flamed in Novice Network. I cannot understand the meme that the FFXIV fanbase is so nice compared to WoW's fanbase. I'm not going to pretend WoW doesn't have plenty of jerks, but my experience with FFXIV was far worse.
After giving FFXIV over 4 completely separate "tries" since 1.0, I've resigned that the game just isn't for me. I want it to be, I like Final Fantasy, but I just don't think it's a good game in any aspect. I find WoW's story to be better, and on the subject of WoW copying FFXIV in being story-driven; WoW has always been story-driven. People may not remember vanilla very well but it had some fantastic story quests. Personally, I don't value story as much as I value immersion and exploration. This is probably why I don't like FFXIV, which is the antithesis of these two features. In FFXIV, you are the WoL, you go where the story says the WoL goes and you do what the story says the WoL does. There is zero immersion, it doesn't matter what race/class you are, or the background you imagined for yourself, and your actions are all predetermined. There is no exploration when the game's story has to give you a reason to go places. It's a shame because I've always wanted an MMORPG where I can exist in the world as a white mage. But I wasn't a white mage in FFXIV, I was the WoL.
Oh and for my most memorable moment, that's hard to choose. The one that comes to mind was in Ultima Online, I joined an RPPvP guild that was a religious order that followed a phoenix type god. The guild hall was a church, and would invite the entire server to come to our sermons. Usually only about 20-30 people came, which was enough to fill up the church, it wasn't giant or anything. Three days after I joined, I went to my first sermon and the guild leader was like "Aight, you're gonna come up to the altar and lead us. Hope you prepared something." My heart started racing but I decided to just wing it. I had a very cool start, the guild members were cheering me on in a private chat, and then a GM showed up! I assumed we needed to stop for some reason, but then the GM just sat down in a pew and said "Continue :)"
As someone who dreads public speaking, no raid or M+ or other kind of content came close to giving me as much panic-inducing adrenaline as that moment.
@@Tokorai I've never heard "FFXIV is part of my personality, so if you insult the game, your insulting me" but that sounds very bizarre and a weird hill to die on. I think we absolutely should be able to critique games, most of the time it's because we want a game to be better. It's also good to hear people's opinions as we will never all agree on the same things. It should be a normalised and healthy discussion. I appreciate you giving the game an honest try and I'm sorry your experiences weren't as good as they could have been. I hope you can give it another try someday and have better ones but after four tries? I wouldn't blame you for calling it a day there.
I'm totally with you on Vanilla. I think one of the best parts about Vanilla too is that it was so contained and the game felt like OUR story. My experiences might have been totally different to yours, and I think that's so cool. You are right with the WoL but I do fear that WoW has been attempting to go down this route in recent years with the amount of titles we seem to be collecting; the highlord, champion, maw-walker etc. It's jarring and I don't think it suits WoW at all. Players just want to be adventurers!
It's great to hear a memory from Ultima Online. I don't have any experience or even know anything about the game but people have always said good things. That's a really cool story! Thank you for sharing!
After playing WoW for 13 years straight, I disengaged permanently when the BFA trailer dropped in the final Legion patch. The whole situations was so completely ABSURD (the very PLANET was just STABBED with a GIANT SWORD and we're going to BASH EACH OTHER's SKULLS IN?!). It only made "sense" after I did the BFA pre-event, but I was already long gone and permanently entrenched in FFXIV by then.
Modern day WoW is also completely and utterly pointless. If you want to be the strongest, then make a level 1 character, deck it in heirlooms and lock the experience gain. Congratulations, you're now the strongest you'll ever be. It's no longer a grind for power; it's a grind to stay relevant. And I can think of no mechanic that disengages me from a game faster than that.
That was so utterly bizarre, agreed. It seemed impossible to just go back to Alliance vs Horde after what just happened with the Burning Legion. It felt like a pure nostalgia grab. I have done videos on both Legion and BFA if you're interested in checking those out (but the BFA one is very long!). Honestly getting out after Legion is probably the best thing you could have done as I don't think the game has been the same since, and Legion is responsible for it in a lot of ways. Legion was peak WoW for me but what came afterwards could never compare. I haven't checked out The War Within yet, and I definitely will, but I don't feel a burning rush for it right now.
You have described modern WoW perfectly, and I think this is why Classic has had so much success. It shows where WoW really went off track and became 'WoW 2' essentially. Thank you for sharing your thoughts!
@@edd_TV I'll be sure to check out those videos! And looking back, disengaging after Legion was probably for the best, for sure.
At its very start, I just intuitively knew that how they handled artifacts AFTER Legion was going to be decisive in how the game would continue. Sadly, they handled it very poorly in my view.
Let me see if I can find your take in those videos you mentioned.
@@Celis.C I think I'm fair with both Legion and BFA but I'd be very interested to hearing your thoughts and feelings! I hope you will enjoy!
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Think with WoW I always had this mentality that if I was subscribing I had to make the most of every minute to make it worth it. Which I think also impacts how you play. You're squeezing the lemon essentially. Community is a big part of it for me as well I think - Faggios in GTA always used to be a laugh, and doing the RTS's. Even FIFA even though I was pwp and trying to do it on keyboard. 😂
Communities are a huge part of any game though. Modding communities keeping games alive long after the devs have stopped bothering - or even in some cases gone out of business. I think of No Mans Sky and the expectation of this huge open universe and one of the things that impacted how people received the product was that there wasn't enough player to player interaction within it. You could play with you mates, the hub station was busy but there was nothing to draw people out into the universe together which made it a very lonely place. Hopefully their new game will offer that though... but again I think hopes are being raised.
You are right about WoW though. I used to think Guild achievements was such a cool idea and used to go out of our way to do them but it felt they were just always an after thought by the devs after the initial launch when it felt it could have been much more. Do wonder at this point if all games go through this though. The emotional attachment is scraped away by the hardcore gamers and corporate types trying to make easy money.
With Final Fantasy having slower combat; if WoW is your main game then it sets the benchmark for what you expect. So when you start a new game you've got that anxiety around a new world, new game mechanics and you're probably still trying to zip through content. It's probably like coming off an addictive drug to be honest.
I miss guild achievements too! I can remember so many of us did fishing in Cataclysm to get the recipe for raiding. I think you're probably right, yeah. I don't think we can point a finger at WoW and say it only happens there because I think if something can be optimised or taken seriously then it will be; whether that's an MMO, an FPS or even something like Stardew Valley. If it can be done, it WILL be done. And that isn't a bad thing! But when it becomes normalised or expected of the average player, THEN we have a problem.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and feelings, as always!
I wish WOW would go back and make every dungeon playable with NPCs.
That would be a good idea. I sadly think with WoW's direction now (especially with the Worldsoul Saga) it only makes sense for them to do it for Dragonflight onwards, as that's where new players will be starting and the only thing that is considered 'relevant' now sadly, and that's a real shame. I think if they could introduce the way FFXIV sync content and the Trust system for WoW, some players would really love that!
@@edd_TV Agreed. Sometimes it’s nice to play through an old expansion, especially like me when I fell out during Pandaria. If I go to one of the old expansions there’s no one to dungeon with so NPCs would be nice.
@@continuallyblessed44 I feel the same. I feel like if I made a brand new character I'd love to go and do places like Outland and Northrend and even Pandaria. So many great quests and memories there. It feels way too random in that respect now, both in terms of experience gains, no real conclusions with the zones anymore and like you said, no themed dungeon experiences from those expansions. It feels like all of this stuff is just fading into obscurity and I don't think they know what to do about it. The game is just TOO big now.
@@edd_TV Yeah they almost need some kind of revamp where they somehow fix the story and make it flow from one expansion to the next like FF. Probably no way to do that now. Just have to wait for WOW 2 😂.
@@continuallyblessed44 I talk about his in another video of mine titled 'The Island of Irrelevancy' if you're interested in checking that out! I very much agree with you. I talk about some ideas I have on how they could make it work but honestly you might be right. I don't think WoW 2 should be the silver bullet for this fix but it would be so much work for them to try and make it flow in the MSQ fashion like you're suggesting. It just feels like such a waste to let everything in the past just rust. I feel really passionate on players being able to see EVERYTHING the game has to offer. It drives me mad that some stories are contained via novels/books and then just thrust into the MMORPG and players are just like 'Wait what?'. It's so frustrating to me.
Based and real
How tf did the Azeroth map expand from the middle, spreading the 2 great continent more and more apart with more undiscovered islands on ship path that were already used between the 2 continents
They were always there, we just didn't know about them! ....apparently haha. I think Pandaria and the Dragon Isles get a free pass as they explained this, but the others? I honestly couldn't say. When you look at it like that, it's very odd. I think these places were always talked about when they get just lumped into the middle of a map we've been looking at for 10 or nearly 20 years it's kinda like '...well hang on a minute!'
that haircut looks cute on your catboy..certainly havent seen that combination ^^
It's the new hairstyle from Dawntrail. It's from maps I believe. It's called 'It Takes Two'!
Lfr is hard because its like herding cats who hate you.
It feels very hollow and soulless too. Nobody is really chatting to one another, and if they are it's usually rude. There isn't much going on there mechanically and it just doesn't feel even close to what a raid experience should be.
How does anyone have time for TWO MMOs? Ive put 1000+ hours into FFXIV and I'm only in Shaddowbringers
It's also expensive for a lot of people to be playing two at the same time. I think if I'm playing one then I probably would take a break from the other. I don't think there's anything wrong with putting X amount of hours and only being in Shadowbringers though. I think that's a great thing! It shows how interested in the game you are but you don't feel the need to rush/blast through it.
I kinda deliberately don't do new content for a few weeks or even months and then don't bother rushing, only doing a bit at a time if I feel like it. I miss out on the awesome early rush into brand new content and end up in an environment where i'm expected to just know the content already, but at least I am free to wander.
I've found Europeans to just often not talk at all, and they're fairly apathetic, while Americans are real yappers who can be very positive but also pretty awful
I think there might be a lot of luck involved with experiences. I've been in both situations where players can talk your ear off and sometimes they are more polite but ready to buckle down and get on with things; I suppose that could depend on the content you're participating in. For example a levelling roulette might be great for conversations and then a trial people might just want to focus up. I get where you're coming from though. I like your stance on waiting and I think within FFXIV that can be both good and bad. I think it's really fun to get in there quickly before guides and tactics come out. I did this for the first time in Dawntrail with both extremes and had so much fun trying to figure out mechanics rather than watching the guides, but we're all different! Thanks for sharing your thoughts and experiences!
I think I've seen you at hunts quite a bit
@@mosley3485 Very likely! What's your characters name? (if you don't mind sharing!)
@@edd_TV Cheez Whiz from Twin
@@mosley3485 I recognise the name!
If players are rushing to the end because that's where all the content is that is not a player problem. That is a pacing problem and based on decisions the devs have made.
That is correct! I never said that was a player problem. That's clearly by design and has been Blizzard's design since TBC. What I described as being a 'player problem' was players not being captivated by the world anymore. That isn't a fault of the game.
I loved ff14 till i was forced to play with other people to progress the story. with the only alternative being farming hundreds of hours to be able to solo the raids. Queing for an hour per mission is just piss poor
@@Gam1ngSyzygy This is so noticeable as a DPS when you’re queuing for a trial and have to wait 30 mins or so, it feels awful! They have introduced things like the Trust system now which I think you can play almost the entire MSQ with AI now, but I think trials may still be with other players. I'm not 100% sure on that. I completely agree though. I find that so fascinating too because it's an MMORPG but it offers so much solo-play. It's interesting how they have made that work, but I think it can always be better. The game is so story focused I don't think it's good to force them to engage with people if they just want to play it like a standalone game like 7, 15 or 16 for example. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
@@edd_TV Figured I would fill in info since you said you weren't 100% trusts will cover all 4-person msq content but will not cover the majority of the trials (yet, though it may be updated in the future that is a long time down the line) and of course also won't cover the CT raid series also msq required, which is unfortunate for those who want to avoid people. Though the dev team has made significant strides in making it as soloable as possible, I doubt they will ever make msq 100% soloable with trusts, at least not til the game is on its death bed, bc at the end of the day whether you call it an MMORPG or an RPGMMO it is still an MMO.
@@nigenstormbringer3528 Thank you for the clarity! That's very true and I think you're right. I think it's important that it maintains what an MMO should be but it feels so different to any other with how focused it is narratively. You are probably right, I think if they feel that the game is dwindling then they can make it even more accessible for things like this.
@edd_TV i still love the game only instead of the 1000 hours most people put in i only have 97 racked up because of this reason. (Main is lvl62 barbarian currently) And i dont want to pay for a character boost to solo content either i like leveling naturally otherwise i feel out of touch with my character and their skills. At least if i get bored i can still go fishing or log in for event rewards
I should note that while it is true that you would prefer to enter as a healer or tank for quicker MSQ times, in alliance raid content it can be preferable to be a DPS role simply because in alliance raids you have 15 slots of DPS as opposed to 2 or 4 slots of DPS. This is not always true, but when you see DPS preference in alliance raids that is why.
FF14 was always about the story. Wow has shit story and never was about it. If it suddenly is about the story, then I dont care as I dont have the context from previous expansions as it was not story driven.
I think in recent years I would agree with you. I think WoW's story has drastically underperformed but I think if we look a bit deeper, maybe the origins of the RTS games and expansions like Wrath and Legion, I think they are very capable of telling stories. You are right though. The story was always secondary or background noise for a lot of players and only NOW are Blizzard thrusting it into the limelight and I find that interesting because like you say, the majority of the player base were never playing for the story.
@@edd_TV But compared to story driven game like FF14, I lack the attachments, I lack the cool stuff we did with the characters, something I actually care about. Just this thing, it just makes WoW's sudden "story is important now" just worthless. So thats the reason I skipped everything in Wow War Within. And I dont really care.
@@RaskaTheFurry Agreed. It always bugged me how certain characters would get shoehorned into the spotlight when the moment suited or they decided they wanted to push certain agendas; khadgar in WoD, Jaina in BFA etc. I kinda wish all the characters were just involved full time, similarly to how the Scions work in FFXIV. It also drives me mad to no end how some stuff is told through books and then inserted into the MMO and they expect players to have that knowledge. It's super frustrating to me.
It makes me wonder if WoW would be pushing a narrative agenda if FFXIV didn't have the success it has. I would say probably not. Either way I think it comes down to what you enjoy and value. If you don't think the story is worth it or it's not important to you, then I think it makes sense to skip it and focus on the things you do like. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
Buy a FF14 story skip, then new game plus through the MSQ
I feel like most people who do story skip do often end up regretting it! I was definitely one of them, lol.
playing wow since I was 3yo in 2004 with my dad, playing ff14 is just... so much better. WoW is full of toxic players and isn't worth your time, FF14 you can get muted/banned for being rude lol
That's so great that you got to play WoW with your dad! I think toxicity absolutely exists in XIV too but it's so much more controlled. I would describe some people in WoW as 'upfront dicks' whereas in XIV some people might be horrible, but it has to come across more passive aggressive. That being said, I can count on one hand how many bad experiences I've had in FFXIV compared to the hundreds (or thousands) I've had in WoW. I do think WoW needs to be policed so much better.
I mean hey, all Blizzard needs to do if it wants to win fans back is say three words.
Free Hong Kong.
This topic is pure clickbait. Players moving from World of Warcraft to Final Fantasy. Then, the fakes were exposed after Final Fantasy 14 players moved to World of Warcraft. This video has no intellectual value. The children will click on it. As for me as an eighteen year veteran of this website. I will not bother to watch. Not giving you a view. Deleted from my watch history.
How is it clickbait? It discusses experiences I've had in one game and how that has made me view another game differently from doing so. I didn't 'move' from WoW to XIV like players did in the exodus either. I started in Stormblood. I'm not sure how you came to this conclusion and I think judging or writing it off before even watching it is naive and ignorant. There is actually a lot of emotional and intellectual value here. I'm not really sure how your 'veteran status' of TH-cam has any relevancy here either, but go off king.
As a 18 year old veteran I would have thought you'd know you can tell youtube you're not interested in a video without actually clicking it! 😮
19:25 Hey, I see some familiar faces! That's on Odin!
A good eye! It sure is! (kooloo limpah)
@@edd_TV Got to the point of the video where you pointed it out just after I posted this comment, but I guess that goes to show your point about FFXIV's way of handling cross-realm.
For those in the know, that wasn't just Limsa, it was specifically Limsa on Odin, and that's a wonderful sense of familiarity. Kooloo limpah indeed!
@@Tingle457 I'm glad that you recognised it was Odin! I hope others will make that connection too!