First and foremost, I love how Kyle reacts every time Aymeric comes into frame. Second, can I point out how brave Nanamo is for proverbially standing up in her full 3ft to Varis who is I believe over 7ft?
I went into this scene hoping maybe we could convince Varis of SOMETHING given how clearly annoyed he is by the Ascians, but ... no, he's just the worst.
"You Eorzeans never fail to disappoint. Though I suppose I only have myself to blame, expecting more from savages." Yeah, we're savages. Says the man whose solution to every problem is wanton slaughter.
Varis is surprisingly quite deep in his philosophy. He was confronted by truths that destroyed everything he thought he knew, in the face of a godlike adversary. He chose to have a say in how the story ended, instead of being a footnote in it. The decision he made to use Black Rose, for isntance, is exactly the mindset Harry Truman had when he authorized the Atom Bombs over Hiroshima and Nagasaki. From a militaristic standpoint, his actions reinforce his philosophy, in which he is the savior of mankind. "No time to explain, get in my tank or I will run you over with it."
Varis isn't deep. He has the same weakness as most fascist leaders. He's completely lacking in empathy. He cannot understand the value in anything different for himself, which is why he utterly fails to comprehend the motives of those around him- ex: 'It was by design!?!?!?!?' . That should not have been a shock to him. He had all the information to know that Solus' motives were vastly different from his, but could not comprehend it. Same reason he made his batshit offer to the allied leaders. Spoiler: And his failure to understand his own son and his motives leads directly to his own death.
[ Can get somewhat spoilery - tried to kind of keep it split off ] I mostly agree here in the "I'm going to 'save' you at any cost. Even if you yourself don't want it." ..... In my opinion Varis' words fundamentally oppose the Empires deeds. He wasn't trying to 'join' with others for the betterment of man, he was pushing aside any that didn't see things as he did. Oppressing those he would "save," making them cogs in his greater war. Varis had a view that rejoining would make man whole and of one mind, but to get to that point he would make everyone hate him and no longer want to listen to what he says even when whole. Being whole isn't going to make what you did to get there disappear. [ Spoilery talk follows ] . . . . . . There's a *reason* the Asciens were going to sacrifice the entire Source after the last rejoining to bring back those they lost. The current people wouldn't be the same. Even the Asciens realized that after the last rejoining we wouldn't be the same people, the same society, as what they lost. They would need to bring back those that sacrificed themselves to realize that dream. Varis is missing the "we're still individuals" through the "but we're one people" forest. Just because we're one people doesn't mean there's not going to be fundamental differences if the society you have around you isn't designed to curtail those differences.
Yeah, I'm gonna take over your project eben though I don't know the full detail of what is needed nor do I have the resources to do so, is not a smart move. It's a child throwing a tantrum
@@Keira_Blackstone No, it wasn't because he didn't understand his son. It's because his son is a batshit nihilistic loon who lives only to get his battleboner going. He would've taken Varis out at some point.
@@Zakjuh It wasn't just a misunderstanding [spoiler for side story The Hunt Begins] . . . . . . . . Varis ignored his son throughout childhood, barely looked at him or talked to him except to ask whether Zenos did well in his studies, and knowingly used a vengeful prisoner-of-war that planned to kill the Galvuses to train his son in combat. And by "train" said trainer attempted to murder Zenos in every session. Unsurprising that Zenos turned into a monster.
I'm actually still baffled why Varis brought up race at all in this scene.. I mean, what does he think will happen with rejoinings? We've had 7 and my WoL is still a Lalafell.. Merlywb is still a Roe.. I can see wanting to .. have us fully power up to be on the same .. power level? as the Ascians, but what does race have to do with it? I'm not really sure what his level of understanding was when it game to Ascians/Rejoinings... Still I think this was a great scene, especially for Nanamo, best leader btw! :P
My interpretation of that scene has always been that Varis was.. a little less than well-informed of the exact nature of the rejoining. The way he talks, he seems to be interpreting it as "oh, everyone will end up being perfect like us Garleans" and that humanity as it stands on Hydaelyn will still be more or less composed of the same "people" who would then go on to fight the Ascians. Both of those are pretty large assumptions.
@@Karuvitomsk No, since he admitted that even garleans are weak, he probably thought that after full rejoining everyone will transform into a different form but everyone is same "race".
According to two different wikis those guards from the throne room are part of the Royal Family, but I haven't been able to find an official source confirming this, so take that claim with a grain of salt.
something that always bothered me about his "gotcha" with Aymeric is they sought peace with the dragons before killing nidhogg, both in heavensward proper and in the patch story, us with estinien and ysale tried to achieve peace without killing nidhogg until we were shown no other option and then we were even further along with peace talks with vidofnir when nidhogg attacked one of his own in order to prevent peace, and it's also not like nidhogg is the only leader of dragons, we were able to form a peaceful alliance with hraesvelgr which should count for something, like yes obviously if you have a violent actor that refuses to concede to peace at every opportunity and attempts to block even other factions from achieving peace then the only recourse is in fact violence like wow you're so insightful varis belligerent monsters of rage and hate constantly attacking people must be put down once all other options have been exhausted, what a revelation lol
The issue is, you have to remember why the Dragonsong War started in the first place. It's good to go back over the first time you meet Hraesvelgr in the Churning Mists. Also, think about the reason why Hraesvelgr changed his ways toward the end.
Also notice how Varis has no counter to Hien when he speaks up But yeah, Varis is acting in bad faith here Wants to criticize Gridania for invoking the Twelve nevermind that Gridania is an accord with the elementals and that the Twelve were used to save Eorzea from a calamity that _Garlemald_ themselves caused. The elementals have even given the okay for the Twin Adder to fight in important battles. Wants to talk crap about Ishgard and their history of war, and raise Thordan VII on a pedestal, nevermind that Thordan VII also wanted the Dragonsong War to last as long as it did so long as he had prayer to power his eventual transformation into a primal and how he conspired with an Ascian to learn it. Nevermind that as, as you pointed out, Nidhogg injured one of his own to quash any hopes of ending the war with a peace treaty Honestly my whole gripe with all this is, Varis is only clearly doing all of this because he's scared of Emet-Selch. "Hey dumbarse, let us kill your Ascian for you. We know how to kill Ascians"
guards from the throne room, color coded we're going to have to fight them...ummm i believe you already fought them. aren't they the end bosses of ghmlyt dark?
This part of the game annoyed me so much because there were so many arguments of his that could have been pulled apart. He acted like he was so above everyone when he's the biggest hypocrit in the room. The whole scene I was like screw peace delegations let my WoL rip him apart with words! But I guess the bs kinda runs in the family, as you will eventually see, Solus has many arguments that are similar to this, only the WoL is finally able to come back with one hell of an answer.
When he ask why don't we submit to them ruling, I REALLY wanted to shout back was how awful they we were to everyone. Even so called "honorary citizens"!
First and foremost, I love how Kyle reacts every time Aymeric comes into frame.
Second, can I point out how brave Nanamo is for proverbially standing up in her full 3ft to Varis who is I believe over 7ft?
Garleans are naturally tall, but Varis is a basketball player among them. The Irken in me sees why he is their Emperor. 🤣
Well, there goes Kyles theory on Varis being a potential ally.
I went into this scene hoping maybe we could convince Varis of SOMETHING given how clearly annoyed he is by the Ascians, but ... no, he's just the worst.
"You Eorzeans never fail to disappoint. Though I suppose I only have myself to blame, expecting more from savages."
Yeah, we're savages. Says the man whose solution to every problem is wanton slaughter.
Varis is surprisingly quite deep in his philosophy. He was confronted by truths that destroyed everything he thought he knew, in the face of a godlike adversary. He chose to have a say in how the story ended, instead of being a footnote in it. The decision he made to use Black Rose, for isntance, is exactly the mindset Harry Truman had when he authorized the Atom Bombs over Hiroshima and Nagasaki. From a militaristic standpoint, his actions reinforce his philosophy, in which he is the savior of mankind.
"No time to explain, get in my tank or I will run you over with it."
Varis isn't deep. He has the same weakness as most fascist leaders. He's completely lacking in empathy. He cannot understand the value in anything different for himself, which is why he utterly fails to comprehend the motives of those around him- ex: 'It was by design!?!?!?!?' . That should not have been a shock to him. He had all the information to know that Solus' motives were vastly different from his, but could not comprehend it. Same reason he made his batshit offer to the allied leaders.
Spoiler:
And his failure to understand his own son and his motives leads directly to his own death.
[ Can get somewhat spoilery - tried to kind of keep it split off ]
I mostly agree here in the "I'm going to 'save' you at any cost. Even if you yourself don't want it." ..... In my opinion Varis' words fundamentally oppose the Empires deeds. He wasn't trying to 'join' with others for the betterment of man, he was pushing aside any that didn't see things as he did. Oppressing those he would "save," making them cogs in his greater war.
Varis had a view that rejoining would make man whole and of one mind, but to get to that point he would make everyone hate him and no longer want to listen to what he says even when whole. Being whole isn't going to make what you did to get there disappear.
[ Spoilery talk follows ]
.
.
.
.
.
.
There's a *reason* the Asciens were going to sacrifice the entire Source after the last rejoining to bring back those they lost. The current people wouldn't be the same. Even the Asciens realized that after the last rejoining we wouldn't be the same people, the same society, as what they lost. They would need to bring back those that sacrificed themselves to realize that dream.
Varis is missing the "we're still individuals" through the "but we're one people" forest. Just because we're one people doesn't mean there's not going to be fundamental differences if the society you have around you isn't designed to curtail those differences.
Yeah, I'm gonna take over your project eben though I don't know the full detail of what is needed nor do I have the resources to do so, is not a smart move. It's a child throwing a tantrum
@@Keira_Blackstone
No, it wasn't because he didn't understand his son. It's because his son is a batshit nihilistic loon who lives only to get his battleboner going. He would've taken Varis out at some point.
@@Zakjuh It wasn't just a misunderstanding [spoiler for side story The Hunt Begins]
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
.
Varis ignored his son throughout childhood, barely looked at him or talked to him except to ask whether Zenos did well in his studies, and knowingly used a vengeful prisoner-of-war that planned to kill the Galvuses to train his son in combat. And by "train" said trainer attempted to murder Zenos in every session.
Unsurprising that Zenos turned into a monster.
I'm actually still baffled why Varis brought up race at all in this scene.. I mean, what does he think will happen with rejoinings? We've had 7 and my WoL is still a Lalafell.. Merlywb is still a Roe.. I can see wanting to .. have us fully power up to be on the same .. power level? as the Ascians, but what does race have to do with it? I'm not really sure what his level of understanding was when it game to Ascians/Rejoinings...
Still I think this was a great scene, especially for Nanamo, best leader btw! :P
My interpretation of that scene has always been that Varis was.. a little less than well-informed of the exact nature of the rejoining. The way he talks, he seems to be interpreting it as "oh, everyone will end up being perfect like us Garleans" and that humanity as it stands on Hydaelyn will still be more or less composed of the same "people" who would then go on to fight the Ascians. Both of those are pretty large assumptions.
a lalafell you say. Maybe we SHOULD go with Veris's plan hmmm xP
because he's a massive racist, and has difficulty understanding that other people are not massive racists as well.
@@Karuvitomsk No, since he admitted that even garleans are weak, he probably thought that after full rejoining everyone will transform into a different form but everyone is same "race".
@@rajabuta You will be one of the first to fall once the potato uprising begins.
Various reminds me of the emperor of man kind of 40k. Tall armored and scouly
You know things are going really poorly when it is Alisaie of all people who's stepping in as the voice of reason in a diplomatic meeting. ^^
According to two different wikis those guards from the throne room are part of the Royal Family, but I haven't been able to find an official source confirming this, so take that claim with a grain of salt.
something that always bothered me about his "gotcha" with Aymeric is they sought peace with the dragons before killing nidhogg, both in heavensward proper and in the patch story, us with estinien and ysale tried to achieve peace without killing nidhogg until we were shown no other option and then we were even further along with peace talks with vidofnir when nidhogg attacked one of his own in order to prevent peace, and it's also not like nidhogg is the only leader of dragons, we were able to form a peaceful alliance with hraesvelgr which should count for something, like yes obviously if you have a violent actor that refuses to concede to peace at every opportunity and attempts to block even other factions from achieving peace then the only recourse is in fact violence like wow you're so insightful varis belligerent monsters of rage and hate constantly attacking people must be put down once all other options have been exhausted, what a revelation lol
The issue is, you have to remember why the Dragonsong War started in the first place. It's good to go back over the first time you meet Hraesvelgr in the Churning Mists. Also, think about the reason why Hraesvelgr changed his ways toward the end.
Also notice how Varis has no counter to Hien when he speaks up
But yeah, Varis is acting in bad faith here
Wants to criticize Gridania for invoking the Twelve nevermind that Gridania is an accord with the elementals and that the Twelve were used to save Eorzea from a calamity that _Garlemald_ themselves caused. The elementals have even given the okay for the Twin Adder to fight in important battles.
Wants to talk crap about Ishgard and their history of war, and raise Thordan VII on a pedestal, nevermind that Thordan VII also wanted the Dragonsong War to last as long as it did so long as he had prayer to power his eventual transformation into a primal and how he conspired with an Ascian to learn it. Nevermind that as, as you pointed out, Nidhogg injured one of his own to quash any hopes of ending the war with a peace treaty
Honestly my whole gripe with all this is, Varis is only clearly doing all of this because he's scared of Emet-Selch. "Hey dumbarse, let us kill your Ascian for you. We know how to kill Ascians"
There's some desync going on later in the video.
It looks like maybe it's Kyle's game audio and Garrett's video. Happens about 3/4 the way through and goes to the end basically
I was also noticing that
guards from the throne room, color coded we're going to have to fight them...ummm i believe you already fought them. aren't they the end bosses of ghmlyt dark?
This cutscene happens before Ghimlyt Dark.
@@unstrungzero my mistake then
This part of the game annoyed me so much because there were so many arguments of his that could have been pulled apart. He acted like he was so above everyone when he's the biggest hypocrit in the room.
The whole scene I was like screw peace delegations let my WoL rip him apart with words!
But I guess the bs kinda runs in the family, as you will eventually see, Solus has many arguments that are similar to this, only the WoL is finally able to come back with one hell of an answer.
When he ask why don't we submit to them ruling, I REALLY wanted to shout back was how awful they we were to everyone. Even so called "honorary citizens"!
How much effort did the writers go through to avoid saying "Master Race" 🤣🤣🤣🤣
it was by... DESIGN?!!4357547