just ran your test on the b5 beta on an M1 MBP 13 with 16G Ram. CPU overload on loop return but otherwise running at 38 - 40 % on Live's CPU meter with 175% in Activity Monitor.....I've also been running large projects (75 channels) with tons of instances of Diva and Serum and plenty of channel processing and it's been rock solid at 37% CPU on a 256 buffer. Same project loads 30% faster too compared to the current 11 release. In my experience, they're definitely squeezing more out of it with each beta. For the sort of stuff I do, I honestly can't see myself ever needing more audio processing power than this machine has under the hood. The M1 pro and Max chips will be ridiculous I'm sure.
That's dope! Glad it's getting better and better. And yeah, M1 is already such a powerhouse I feel like M1 Pro and Max are overkill unless you do heavy 3D animation or something
128 buffer size 400 tracks with operator playing one note cpu steady at 40% and bumps up 60+ when restarting. Asus Zephyrus M, i7-8750h, 32gb ram, gtx 1070 (Laptop) I wasn't expecting this since i used to own macbooks and they ran ableton amazingly.
Hello to all, my macbook pro m1pro and 16gb ram finally arrived and i installed beta 11.1b12 of ableton live. The problem is that when playing my sessions they are heard with jumps at certain times. I have my sounds on an external ssd sata3>usb3>usb C, but when i change my session to the internal ssd the error continues. I have modified the zice buffer from more to less and from less to more but still. My sessions are very simple, 5 or 6 or 7 midi tracks with drum racks, simpler, a bit of reverb, compressor, eq8, and a single external plug in, sessions that on my old macbook pro13" early 2011 with el capitan are reproduced without problems (with ableton live 10 suite). Is this something common in other users? Is it a bug because it is still a beta? I stay tuned for comments, thank you all
Weird. I haven't encountered this problem before. My guess is that it's a problem with the beta version. Ableton just released the official 11.1 update, so maybe try installing that and see if it fixes it.
Thanks for doing this! However, why won't you use Live's demo track for such test? Or your own project(s)? 400 tracks of Operator playing a sine wave is far from a usual scenario.
For sure mate! I def would've liked to use Live's demo track, but it actually wouldn't open in the beta unfortunately. So 400 tracks of operator it was! 😅
oh dang they're really backordered! I guess it makes sense cause they're the best computers they've ever made. I don't think you'll even remember what freezing a track is a year from now ;)
You can use the AU (audio unit) version of all plugins through their emulator, but so far only VSTs that have been updated to have M1 support will work.
Hey! I have a question for you. I have been using Ableton 11.0.10 on my MacBook pro m1 but whenever I'm loading Kontakt 6.6.1, the audio starts to glitch. I've tried previous versions of Kontakt also but the audio still glitches. The CPU spike of more than 100 whenever I play. what could be the problem here?
Are you running the latest version of Native Access? I know NI is still working on making all their plugins fully compatible, so might need a little time for them to update everything.
I actually have some disappointing and test results in terms of how Live performs on new M1 machines. Old machines seem to perform better. Test machines: • Late 2015 iMac with i7 CPU (with latest release version of Live) • 2021 M1 iMac (with the latest beta; the same as in this video) In a nutshell, if you have two machines, do this: Create a Live project - with the older, non-M1 machine - that has, for example, an instance of a Live synth (e.g., Wavetable with "Dark Swarm" preset). Leave ALL 3rd party processing out. Keep duplicating stupid amounts of that track till CPU starts to hit 100% so you know this is the maximum that the older machine can take. Save the project and load it with your new M1 machine and see how it performs. With several projects, Live on my M1 performs worse - irrespective of whether I use stable Live 11 or the latest alpha - and can handle less tracks than my 2016 iMac. When I load the project where my old iMac hit 100%, the M1 hits around 125-130%, depending on what I use. So the optimized performance isn't there yet. With other software etc., I can see and feel the performance.
Do you think this is just a “matter of time” kind of thing? Eventually they iron out all the kinks right? I just took the plunge and bought an M1 - perhaps in a few months as Live continues to be developed against silicon we will see the performance in line with expectations?
That is a bit disappointing. Their development seems slow for getting proper optimization. And you're right, other apps like DaVinci Resolve are insane on M1.
GPU is just about the UI. It's not used in VSTs or AUs for the music part. You can ignore it. It also depends on what it needs to draw (e.g. a VST display with lots of movement vs a more static one). The CPU being down also doesn't mean much. Glitches and overloads happen also when it can't feed the CPU fast enough for useful work (so the CPU is down but other pipelines are saturated). So you can have higher CPU but no glitches (like you had here with the Apple Silicon version) or lower CPU that is glitch hell because it can't even get to the part where it does useful work to produce the sounds (so cpu usage hovers lower).
@@freshlysunlit GPU is very useful in video and 3D, but in the audio world it's not used almost at all, because the kind of latencies involved and the kind it of processing it does don't make it worth it to use it for VSTs etc.
Great video, glad there is native support now, because I thought ableton would run mich better on m1. I use some soundtoys and Arturia plug-ins already on the x86 version and run perfectly, but is there gonna be a problem if i update to this native version?
Thanks bro! Right now it looks like Sound Toys and Arturia (along with many other plugins) don't have native M1 support, so it'd probably be more stable to stick to the x86 rosetta version of Live.
@@freshlysunlit Any chance you can test of functionality of these non-supported plug-ins in the updated native silicon Ableton? To my understanding they're able to run in native silicon DAWs through Rosetta inside of the DAW.
Mmhh... I'm not sure the optimisation is anywhere near being good. I just did the same test using Operator (and the same buffer size and sample rate) on a 2015 mpb i7, and I can play the 500 tracks. I have some crackles, but it can still handle it (Live shows 50% cpu and Activity monitor around 340%). So, I would expect an M1 machine to handle at least twice more compare to my "old" laptop.
Hey! Is any one else having issues with VST Plugins not showing up in the Beta (im on 11.1b7)? I just received my new M1 MacbookPro and after installing almost everything, i noticed that the ableton beta was only seeing a very small amount of my vsts, yet most of the AU's are there. On the non-beta version however, all my vsts show up. Is this because the beta is only showing vsts that are Apple Silicon compatible?
Yeah, same here. It's because only apple silicon compatible VSTs work. BUT, if you use AU it does some sort of emulation thing where you can still use non-compatible plugins, it just uses more CPU.
sorry but this is not fair as test. u should use different vst as comparison not 500 operators track only lol... se omnisphere, diva, serum , pigments. thise are all heavy plugins
yeah, the main reason I used operator is because most VSTs aren't natively compatible with the 11.1 update yet. but you're right, it'd make for a better test!
@@freshlysunlit is there any info out there, which VST already works with 11.1? second, is it possible to downgrade to 11.0 again after testing to get the existing VST works again? thx for your vid
@@user-er1xy3vn7c FabFilter, U-he, Waves (with their V13 update), some Spitfire Audio plugins, Klevgrand, and AAS are all natively compatible now. There might be a few more, but not many. We just gotta wait for the developers to update everything. In the meantime we can run non-native plugins through AU (audio unit) in the 11.1 update. Yes, I believe you can downgrade. I currently have 2 separate installs, one with the Live 11.1 Beta, and one with the stable release of Live 11. If you'd like to test out the beta it installs a separate app!
dude thanks for these tests. please keep them coming. looking for that sweet spot update that just sings
for sure man! yeah, same. hopefully that sweet spot update will be here soon!
This is awesome. I watched your first vid and was bummed there was no CPU gains. This makes me happy with butterflies in my stomach
Aw, right on Abbery!
just ran your test on the b5 beta on an M1 MBP 13 with 16G Ram. CPU overload on loop return but otherwise running at 38 - 40 % on Live's CPU meter with 175% in Activity Monitor.....I've also been running large projects (75 channels) with tons of instances of Diva and Serum and plenty of channel processing and it's been rock solid at 37% CPU on a 256 buffer. Same project loads 30% faster too compared to the current 11 release. In my experience, they're definitely squeezing more out of it with each beta. For the sort of stuff I do, I honestly can't see myself ever needing more audio processing power than this machine has under the hood. The M1 pro and Max chips will be ridiculous I'm sure.
That's dope! Glad it's getting better and better. And yeah, M1 is already such a powerhouse I feel like M1 Pro and Max are overkill unless you do heavy 3D animation or something
Hey how many tracks with serum can you run before cpu overload. My current laptop can only run about 5 the most
@@bombjelly5795 I actually don't have serum 😅
These are well made videos. Subscribed!
ty so much Dennis!
Dang these new macs are gonna allow for like 1000 tracks sheesh
Yeah, waaaay too many to be useful in a composition 😆
128 buffer size
400 tracks with operator playing one note
cpu steady at 40% and bumps up 60+ when restarting.
Asus Zephyrus M, i7-8750h, 32gb ram, gtx 1070 (Laptop)
I wasn't expecting this since i used to own macbooks and they ran ableton amazingly.
501 tracks and it's steady at 52% jumps up to 60+ when restart
Ableton ain't using these macs right as yet
Solid info Boss!
Thanks mate!
This is great! Might pull the trigger for MacBook Pro 14inch m1 pro.
The new MacBook Pro's look pretty incredible! I don't think you'll regret it
thank you for these videos!!
For sure mate!
Hello to all, my macbook pro m1pro and 16gb ram finally arrived and i installed beta 11.1b12 of ableton live.
The problem is that when playing my sessions they are heard with jumps at certain times. I have my sounds on an external ssd sata3>usb3>usb C, but when i change my session to the internal ssd the error continues. I have modified the zice buffer from more to less and from less to more but still.
My sessions are very simple, 5 or 6 or 7 midi tracks with drum racks, simpler, a bit of reverb, compressor, eq8, and a single external plug in, sessions that on my old macbook pro13" early 2011 with el capitan are reproduced without problems (with ableton live 10 suite).
Is this something common in other users? Is it a bug because it is still a beta?
I stay tuned for comments, thank you all
Weird. I haven't encountered this problem before. My guess is that it's a problem with the beta version. Ableton just released the official 11.1 update, so maybe try installing that and see if it fixes it.
It would be nice if you would have tested the 501 channels with all the izotope ozone 9 plugins on each channel for a more realistic approach.
😆
Subscriber #80! I don't even have an M1 Mac, but I'm down to have a resource that understands what YOU do!
thank you so much Trey!
Thanks for doing this!
However, why won't you use Live's demo track for such test? Or your own project(s)?
400 tracks of Operator playing a sine wave is far from a usual scenario.
For sure mate!
I def would've liked to use Live's demo track, but it actually wouldn't open in the beta unfortunately. So 400 tracks of operator it was! 😅
i ordered the new macbook pro 16 but its says it will arrive end of december :( im hoping to never have to freeze tracks ever again🤣🤣
oh dang they're really backordered! I guess it makes sense cause they're the best computers they've ever made. I don't think you'll even remember what freezing a track is a year from now ;)
your locs look amazing!!!! low long have you had them 6 years?
thanks mate! really good guess-I've had em for 6 and a half years!
Thanks for the vid, can’t wait for the MacBook announcement Monday
Curious to see what they announce!
so old vsts x86 are defunct now with no comparability?
You can use the AU (audio unit) version of all plugins through their emulator, but so far only VSTs that have been updated to have M1 support will work.
@@freshlysunlit cheers, I don't have ah versions of all of them :( hopefully this improves 😅
Does only having 1 note of operator affect it? Will it be more intense if you had each of them running a melodic line? Thanks
Hey! I'm not sure-I imagine having something more complicated would use more CPU though. Maybe a more real world example would be better!
thx again :-)
for sure!
Hey! I have a question for you. I have been using Ableton 11.0.10 on my MacBook pro m1 but whenever I'm loading Kontakt 6.6.1, the audio starts to glitch. I've tried previous versions of Kontakt also but the audio still glitches. The CPU spike of more than 100 whenever I play. what could be the problem here?
Are you running the latest version of Native Access? I know NI is still working on making all their plugins fully compatible, so might need a little time for them to update everything.
Yes, I beleive 6.6.1 is the latest version. I just switched to kontakt 6.2.1 and it seems to be working fine. 😊
I actually have some disappointing and test results in terms of how Live performs on new M1 machines.
Old machines seem to perform better.
Test machines:
• Late 2015 iMac with i7 CPU (with latest release version of Live)
• 2021 M1 iMac (with the latest beta; the same as in this video)
In a nutshell, if you have two machines, do this:
Create a Live project - with the older, non-M1 machine - that has, for example, an instance of a Live synth (e.g., Wavetable with "Dark Swarm" preset).
Leave ALL 3rd party processing out.
Keep duplicating stupid amounts of that track till CPU starts to hit 100% so you know this is the maximum that the older machine can take.
Save the project and load it with your new M1 machine and see how it performs.
With several projects, Live on my M1 performs worse - irrespective of whether I use stable Live 11 or the latest alpha - and can handle less tracks than my 2016 iMac.
When I load the project where my old iMac hit 100%, the M1 hits around 125-130%, depending on what I use.
So the optimized performance isn't there yet.
With other software etc., I can see and feel the performance.
Do you think this is just a “matter of time” kind of thing? Eventually they iron out all the kinks right? I just took the plunge and bought an M1 - perhaps in a few months as Live continues to be developed against silicon we will see the performance in line with expectations?
@@saysthetedd Yes I'm sure they'll work on it: they did admit the issue.
That is a bit disappointing. Their development seems slow for getting proper optimization. And you're right, other apps like DaVinci Resolve are insane on M1.
@@freshlysunlit they need to get on it, imagine how amazing Logic is running on the new M1s bro
Minimal usable bugfer size is what really matters not cpu usage.
GPU is just about the UI. It's not used in VSTs or AUs for the music part. You can ignore it. It also depends on what it needs to draw (e.g. a VST display with lots of movement vs a more static one).
The CPU being down also doesn't mean much. Glitches and overloads happen also when it can't feed the CPU fast enough for useful work (so the CPU is down but other pipelines are saturated). So you can have higher CPU but no glitches (like you had here with the Apple Silicon version) or lower CPU that is glitch hell because it can't even get to the part where it does useful work to produce the sounds (so cpu usage hovers lower).
Interesting. That makes sense.
@@freshlysunlit GPU is very useful in video and 3D, but in the audio world it's not used almost at all, because the kind of latencies involved and the kind it of processing it does don't make it worth it to use it for VSTs etc.
It’s sounding like I’m gonna be screwed using most of my old plug ins untill they all catch up 🙄
yeah, unfortunately... but using the AU version will still work!
Great video, glad there is native support now, because I thought ableton would run mich better on m1.
I use some soundtoys and Arturia plug-ins already on the x86 version and run perfectly, but is there gonna be a problem if i update to this native version?
Thanks bro! Right now it looks like Sound Toys and Arturia (along with many other plugins) don't have native M1 support, so it'd probably be more stable to stick to the x86 rosetta version of Live.
@@freshlysunlit Any chance you can test of functionality of these non-supported plug-ins in the updated native silicon Ableton? To my understanding they're able to run in native silicon DAWs through Rosetta inside of the DAW.
Mmhh... I'm not sure the optimisation is anywhere near being good.
I just did the same test using Operator (and the same buffer size and sample rate) on a 2015 mpb i7, and I can play the 500 tracks. I have some crackles, but it can still handle it (Live shows 50% cpu and Activity monitor around 340%).
So, I would expect an M1 machine to handle at least twice more compare to my "old" laptop.
Yeah, they have a long ways to go. Hopefully they improve it soon! Otherwise Logic is looking awfully tempting..
Hey! Is any one else having issues with VST Plugins not showing up in the Beta (im on 11.1b7)? I just received my new M1 MacbookPro and after installing almost everything, i noticed that the ableton beta was only seeing a very small amount of my vsts, yet most of the AU's are there. On the non-beta version however, all my vsts show up. Is this because the beta is only showing vsts that are Apple Silicon compatible?
Yeah, same here. It's because only apple silicon compatible VSTs work. BUT, if you use AU it does some sort of emulation thing where you can still use non-compatible plugins, it just uses more CPU.
@@freshlysunlit Okay cool thats what i thought! Thanks for replying
@@itsluistorres For sure mate!
sorry but this is not fair as test. u should use different vst as comparison not 500 operators track only lol... se omnisphere, diva, serum , pigments. thise are all heavy plugins
yeah, the main reason I used operator is because most VSTs aren't natively compatible with the 11.1 update yet. but you're right, it'd make for a better test!
@@freshlysunlit is there any info out there, which VST already works with 11.1? second, is it possible to downgrade to 11.0 again after testing to get the existing VST works again? thx for your vid
@@user-er1xy3vn7c FabFilter, U-he, Waves (with their V13 update), some Spitfire Audio plugins, Klevgrand, and AAS are all natively compatible now. There might be a few more, but not many. We just gotta wait for the developers to update everything. In the meantime we can run non-native plugins through AU (audio unit) in the 11.1 update.
Yes, I believe you can downgrade. I currently have 2 separate installs, one with the Live 11.1 Beta, and one with the stable release of Live 11. If you'd like to test out the beta it installs a separate app!
Nice fn' Hair 🤣🤣🤣
thx bro